Cut to the reaction from Joe Scarborough, who noted that Trump consistently reminds his rally goers of his pro-Charlottesville “heritage” protestor stance.

Brezizinski followed by revealing an off-camera conversation with then-candidate Trump, in which they pressed him on why he played the “birther” card so hard in challenging President Barrack Obama to show that he was in fact born in the United States (and not in Kenya.) The allegation that Obama was not a true American was viewed by many as a shameless racist play to “otherize” the first African-American president.

According to Brzezinski, Trump privately admitted that he knew it was wrong, but he did it because, “in his mind, it works.”