“I think if the primary were held today, there is no doubt,” the Never Trumper Carpenter conceded. “Who would oppose Donald Trump in this environment? But it gets to the point about the strategic silence of Mike Pence. I do think Mike Pence would like to be president. Realistically, he probably never will, but what he does know is that if he keeps his mouth shut, the mob that came after him on January 6th won’t come after him again.”

“He will have a safe, comfortable life in the warm bath of the conservative movement at think tanks and conservative media, where they will never ask him a tough question about the events that he witnessed that led up to the insurrection and what it felt like to become a victim of it.” Carpenter continued. “He has a safe, comfortable life, if he just keeps his mouth shut and waves the flag for Trump. That’s what he’s angling for.”

“That’s something,” a sober Berman replied.