He said even just being outside on a street corner — as he was doing in that moment, with Clark nearby — makes him nervous because it exposes him to the police who patrol the area. You never know when an officer might come up and “make an issue out of it,” Baldwin said.

“The only time we can enjoy ourselves, or meet other people, is going into stores,” Clark said. Now, she is afraid to go, worried that a shooter might once again target her community.

“The devil was really, really busy in that man,” she said.

Baldwin quickly replied: “That’s not the devil. That’s America. They made him, they brought him up, they put him there.”