Gov. Andrew Cuomo (D., N.Y.) called the National Rifle Association the “bad guys” during an interview Monday morning.

“Look, I think these guys are bad guys,” Cuomo said during a discussion on MSBC’s “Morning Joe” about a feud the state of New York and the NRA are engaged in.

The discussion focused on disagreement over the NRA-backed insurance policy Carry Guard, which is intended to provide legal protection during potential criminal and civil proceedings for gun owners who legally use a firearm for self-defense. The NRA Carry Guard website points out that “without insurance, lawful self-defense can cost you a fortune.”

The insurance is no longer available in New York, and host Mika Brzezinski asked if New York is “blacklisting the NRA,” an argument critics have made.