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David Cole

Mr. President, did you or didn’t you kill Anwar al-Awlaki?

Killing is not like torture. Torture is never justified, even in wartime. But killing is an integral, if unfortunate, aspect of war. Targeted killing is therefore not inherently illegal; after all, it beats the tragically untargeted killing used in the World War II bombings of Dresden, London and Hiroshima.

Nor is it always forbidden to kill an American. If a U.S. citizen were fighting alongside al-Qaeda on an Afghan battlefield, would anyone question the right of U.S. troops to shoot and kill him? And President Abraham Lincoln violated no constitutional guarantee by authorizing Union troops to fire on American citizens fighting for the Confederacy.

The government can also legally kill Americans in some non-wartime circumstances. The Supreme Court has held, for example, that the Fourth Amendment permits a police officer to use deadly force against a fleeing felon if the felon poses “a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others.” The FBI team that on Monday killed an Alabama man who had held a 5-year-old boy hostage for nearly a week certainly did not act unconstitutionally.

But since when is it constitutional for the president to deliberately kill an American while refusing to admit that he has done so? Due process forbids the taking of life or liberty without fair procedures and prohibits any official action that “shocks the conscience,” as the Supreme Court has stated. If secret killing does not shock the conscience, then nothing does.

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The bigger question now is :

“Is Dr. Benjamin Carson now at the top of 0bama’s drone kill list?”

LegendHasIt on February 9, 2013 at 1:46 PM

bho, ‘did you or didn’t you’ have a hand in the deaths of the four in benghazi also? Afterall they were all American citizens!
L

letget on February 9, 2013 at 1:52 PM

The bigger question now is :

“Is Dr. Benjamin Carson now at the top of 0bama’s drone kill list?”

LegendHasIt on February 9, 2013 at 1:46 PM

Winner. Close the thread.

The Rogue Tomato on February 9, 2013 at 1:53 PM

bho, ‘did you or didn’t you’ have a hand in the death of Terry in the F&F issue? Terry was an American citizen also!
L

letget on February 9, 2013 at 1:54 PM

The upside of this debate is at the end Awlaki remains only remains.

BL@KBIRD on February 9, 2013 at 1:55 PM

I should hope he is dead.

Bmore on February 9, 2013 at 2:00 PM

Due process forbids the taking of life or liberty without fair procedures and prohibits any official action that “shocks the conscience,” as the Supreme Court has stated. If secret killing does not shock the conscience, then nothing does.

thanks, Hollywood!
/Democrats

ted c on February 9, 2013 at 2:01 PM

Killing is not like torture. Torture is never justified, even in wartime.

Define “torture” for us, and I’ll continue reading the article.

David Cole teaches constitutional law at Georgetown University and is the legal affairs correspondent for the Nation.

Then again, maybe I won’t continue reading.

Instead, I’ll amuse myself with the WaPo “reader” comments:

It is infuriating that Obama, the better choice, is the same cowardly killer as the last president.

I personally support the Drone program if operated by an ethical government. I trust Obama administration to be ethical; unlike the GWB.

This Low IQ Democrat Voter continues:

It’s my understanding the folks who are raising legitiment concerns realize that administrations come and go every four years, thus without proper checks-n-balances an unethical administration like GWB could come into office and start using their powers to takeout political enimies.

Obama’s pride (and I voted for him twice, what other choice did I have?) is leading to folly.

The truth of the matter is that the US has been killing people without declaring war at least since Nixon’s secret bombing of Cambodia. Where was the “right” on that undeclared war?

Nixon carpet bombing Laos and Cambodia were war crimes. He should have been impeached for them. The Vietnam War itself was a travesty and totally unnecessary.

Drones create more terrorists. Period.

We can thank cheney/bush for the new laws which they bestowed upon themselves and every succeeding president.

Yes, Kids, you heard it hear first. This too is Bush and Cheney’s Fault!

Mr. Obama. Kill alll the terrorists you want. You have our permission.

G.W. was an idiot and Obama is intelligent.

All terrorists could do during Obama’s firt term is hit a remote outpost in Bengazi. Considering how much these terrorists hate us, that’s a great record.

Are we out the hole cheney/bush dug for America yet?

the same people who worked for Bush W. also work for Obama

Wow, the Stupid is strong in WaPo Land today!

Del Dolemonte on February 9, 2013 at 2:03 PM

Torture is never justified, even in wartime.

Stopped reading after this.

WisCon on February 9, 2013 at 2:09 PM

Define “torture” for us, and I’ll continue reading the article.

Del Dolemonte on February 9, 2013 at 2:03 PM

Torture

Not Torture

The Rogue Tomato on February 9, 2013 at 2:10 PM

Another comparison.

Torture

Not Torture

The Rogue Tomato on February 9, 2013 at 2:13 PM

I don’t have a problem with killing terrorist. I have a problem with the hypocrisy of the left and the media on the issue.

ButterflyDragon on February 9, 2013 at 2:16 PM

What difference does it make?, Killary ’16

trs on February 9, 2013 at 2:40 PM

I can’t be bothered to read the trip of Jack Cole if he represents the “thinking” of the commie-symp Leftist rag The Nation.

A genuinely thoughtful piece by Andy McCarthy explores the issue of targeted killings of enemies in assymmetrical warfare and the flaws (and hypocrisy) in the WH “White Paper,” papering over its decisions. McCarthy concludes with a sensible solution in our open-ended state of seige with jihadists and Islamists.

A commenter after the piece, Jack Jolis, describes the difficulties of getting worthy intelligence from captured combatants because of the current “rules of war.”

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/340225/problems-white-paper-andrew-c-mccarthy

onlineanalyst on February 9, 2013 at 2:41 PM

LegendHasIt on February 9, 2013 at 1:46 PM

Winner. Close the thread.

The Rogue Tomato on February 9, 2013 at 1:53 PM

Legend nailed it, out of the gate.

Schadenfreude on February 9, 2013 at 2:43 PM

Define “torture” for us, and I’ll continue reading the article.

Forget waterboarding … how about REAL genuine barbaric torture?

Not that we did ourselves mind you but …

When I was in Afghanistan and Iraq – we’d often hand over insurgents to local police / military for “safe keeping”. Usually, when we did it – the locals were able to get information out of the insurgents that we just couldn’t extract from them.

How did they get that information? Wink … Wink …

They tortured them. We’re guilty as accessories because we often turn terrorists over to our more barbaric allies for “interrogation”. Then we get information from those barbaric interrogators and wash our hands and say … “Ah … we didn’t torture them!”

Technically no … legally – oh hell yes.

Now – I don’t mind torturing terrorists – FU*K TERRORISTS we are still orders of magnitude more civilized and respectful of human rights than they are.

But please, let’s get off this line about how the United States doesn’t torture – we damn sure do.

Now – the question in my mind is that, right now, we’re only “torturing” islamic insurgents. But what happens if Ogabe and the Dims simply declare the Constitution null and void one day? What happens to those who fight for liberty and oppose that? Will good Americans eventually be “tortured”?

Slippery Slope – and slippery slope arguments are ALWAYS relevant when it comes to governmental power.

HondaV65 on February 9, 2013 at 2:55 PM

Slippery Slope – and slippery slope arguments are ALWAYS relevant when it comes to governmental power.

HondaV65 on February 9, 2013 at 2:55 PM

+1

Why the hypocrisy on the left is so damning. The ACLU is absent – were this GWB or Nixon they’d have hyperfits.

Schadenfreude on February 9, 2013 at 3:12 PM

Don’t miss what you pay for, with your hard earned taxes.

Schadenfreude on February 9, 2013 at 3:14 PM

Wow, the Stupid is strong in WaPo Land today!
Del Dolemonte on February 9, 2013 at 2:03 PM

Can you imagine reading that crap in January 1942? I’ll wager there were moonbats back then too, but far fewer.

ALERT! THE HOTAIR BITMAP IS BACK COVERING THE SUBMIT BUTTON AFTER BEING GONE A FEW DAYS

dogsoldier on February 9, 2013 at 3:41 PM

I don’t have a problem with killing terrorist. I have a problem with the hypocrisy of the left and the media on the issue.

ButterflyDragon on February 9, 2013 at 2:16 PM

The problem I have with it is they aren’t calling those folks terrorists. They are calling them militants, meanwhile Incompetano is defining us as possible terrorists.

You see where they are going with that, right?

dogsoldier on February 9, 2013 at 3:45 PM