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I think that if Edwards and Clinton run a vicious negative campaign and tear him down off his pedestal, costing him the nomination, it would seriously damage the Democratic party. A viable, well-liked black candidate being on the business end of a character assassination would look very bad for whoever ended up with the nomination.
Don’t tell them I said that. We’ll see what happens.
joewm315 on January 4, 2008 at 9:54 PM
I’m beginning to get this feeling that maybe the best we can do this round is just…nominate McCain to be Obama’s Dole.
Typhoon on January 4, 2008 at 10:15 PM
The looting of New Orleans in 2005 is a fresh example of the ruin that comes from the softness of the mayor and the police of a city. If those looters had been driven out or cut down, they would have served as an example for everyone in the decades to follow. As it is, the Americans will go on living fearfully, in Jonah Goldberg’s way, until the rulers of the Americans’ cities discard their cruel pity and determine to maintain a decent order, without any respect.
Oh, I want to add I don’t just get that feeling with Obama. I think the Democrats are just pumped up period, if Hillary gets the they would probably get 100% behind her too. They just want to win.
Actually, I think Rudy or Fred or even McCain (but not the Huckster or the Yacht Salesman) could mop up the floor with Hillary. I know a lot of people–mostly young–who wouldn’t even thinking of voting for her who would vote for Obama–maybe also without really thinking.
I’m almost to the point of just looking for silver linings.
Typhoon on January 4, 2008 at 10:56 PM
I’m almost to the point of just looking for silver linings.
There is a silver lining:
The Dems have been saying for the past six years how bad Republicans run things and how bad President Bush is. Fine, they’ll get the wheel and the American people will see how they drive. I guarantee to you the American people are going to be so disappointed by Democratic leadership.
Sounds about right to me. The government and media have told blacks that the only reason we don’t have a black President is racism, and that violence is a perfectly appropriate and forgivable reaction to racism.
But we’re several steps ahead of ourselves, here.
Jaibones on January 5, 2008 at 12:16 AM
Interesting how everyone thinks that Jonah is talking about black people. He could be talking about crazy white BDS sufferers/Republican haters. (Been to Kos/DU/HuffPo lately?) After all, you don’t see black people disrupting Congressional sessions–not unless they’re a member at any rate.
Indeed. Actually, much to be feared, no matter who’d be the leftie nominee, if s/he loses.
2000 was the onset of insanity, 2004 was very hopeful for them, faux exit polls, then the huge letdown, full-fledged insanity. 2008, with a loss, w/b beyond psychotic – it would throw them into uncontrollable actions. Democracy is only when they win. This “first woman/first Black” is just their excuse then. It would make no difference if Edwards loses in Nov.
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 1:28 AM
baldilocks on January 5, 2008 at 12:51 AM
An excellent point, Baldilocks. Certainly no group has caused more disruption than the BDS coalition. However, the conventional wisdom seems to be that most of the Kos/DU/HuffPo types don’t like Barack Obama because he doesn’t hate Republicans enough. They accuse him of “conservative framing”.
joewm315 on January 5, 2008 at 1:30 AM
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 1:28 AM
I agree almost entirely, except for what you said about Edwards at the end. Whoever the Dem nominee is, if they lose again, the far left weirdos and their troofer fellow travelers are going to go nuts.
I also agree with baldilocks that Jonah isn’t talking specifically about black people, though I’m sure some of them would join in with the nutters.
Sean M., we agree – that’s what I tried to say – whoever losed on their side, the reaction will be the same. I could have said “if Edwards is the one who loses in Nov.”
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 2:15 AM
Blech, s/b “whoever loses on their side”
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 2:16 AM
I read what Jonah wrote not thinking black folk at all. Just the BDS nutroots– think about the group blogger picture with Billy Jeff, mostly white kids.
But I have to part company with y’all about there being no difference between the Dem big 3 possible nominations. Each one would get the usual pile of MSM chits accorded to any Dem nominee. But I think what Jonah was imagining was the emotional bonfire of the vanities that would accompany an Obama nomination. His whole point was, in the event of a GOP victory, the preceding media outpouring, while somewhat historically justified, would be especially inflammatory to BDS syndrome.
silverfox on January 5, 2008 at 3:45 AM
Or maybe it should be:
BDS syndrome = y2k stolen election syndrome
silverfox on January 5, 2008 at 3:48 AM
But I think what Jonah was imagining was the emotional bonfire of the vanities that would accompany an Obama nomination.
While I agree that the MSM will probably swoon more over Obama should he get the nomination (hope! first viable black candidate! son of an immigrant! everything Ezra Klein had to say!) than Silky or the Glacier, do you really think they won’t do their best to build a narrative about how either of them represent a “change for America” or an “opportunity to mend relations with the rest of the world” or some such bull*@#+?
Sure, they’ll spin harder for Obama, if for no other reason that there’s a novelty factor, but they’re going to do their damnedest to make sure that whichever Dem gets the nod smells like roses. With Hillary!, we’ll be told over and over that she has the foreign policy experience and that gee, won’t it be nice to finally have a woman President? And with Edwards, they’d finesse his class warfare rhetoric into “standing up for the middle class and the working poor against Big-(fill in the blank).”
The bottom line is, if anybody with an R after their name wins, the fringe left is going to scream bloody murder and another stolen election, and the MSM will likely have abetted that.
Like Mr. Burns would say to Smithers, I’ll bet you a Coke.
That’s a great point, baldilocks. Except that he is talking about black people, and I suppose the anarchists who take advantage of every situation of unrest.
…Obama as the first serious mainstream black contender for the White House…
Jaibones on January 5, 2008 at 8:41 AM
He could be talking about crazy white BDS sufferers/Republican haters.– baldilocks on January 5, 2008 at 12:51 AM
The way I read it, baldilocks, that’s precisely who he’s talking about.
But I’d say to Jonah, ‘Didn’t you notice, Jonah, that element of society is already unhinged? Are we being asked to cower to their intolerance?’
If they want to take their PC bigotry into the streets, I say, ‘Bring it on.’ Their cultural Marxism is a cancer on our society. Sometimes a festering conflict needs to be brought to a head before you can engage it properly.
When we compromise our best judgment for fear of illegal repercussions, we compound the eventual misery.This is a bridge that our country must inevitably cross, if ever we’re to outgrow completely the racial divide. I say, the sooner we cross it the better. And if the PC bigots want to stir the pot and erupt in the streets, then so be it.
I’ve been long convinced that Y2KSES is where it all started.
flipflop on January 5, 2008 at 6:12 AM
I wondered at length about this. I believe you’re correct that Y2KSES was the first large fruit from a poisonous tree cultivated by McCauliffe and even more so now by Howard Dean… using personal hatred to drive an ideology of victimhood, resentment and class warfare.
BTW, call me unrealistic, but I’m hoping Obama can rescue the Democrat Party and restore it to its former decent self, a la Barnett’s Nutroots Waterloo?
That’s most definitely one of those silver linings I was talking about. The guy’s so inspirational but so untested. I feel a tsunami developing and I guess at base I either a:) hope I’m wrong; or b:) hope he’s up to the job.
Typhoon on January 5, 2008 at 11:00 AM
Tell ya the truth, Typhoon, I’d feel one helluva lot more comfortable with Obama as Prez than I would with Billary. Even though he’s probably farther left than she, still I think he’s an honorable person. I trust Obama to play by the rules of our democracy. I trust Hillary, on the other hand, to ruthlessly transform this country in such a way as to make her legacy irreversible.
Blowback
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If he turns into “the Black candidate” and I don’t see why he wouldn’t. Yes, you could see race riots if he loses.
bnelson44 on January 4, 2008 at 9:34 PM
I don’t think so, since many black people still think–for whatever reason–that he can’t win anyway
baldilocks on January 4, 2008 at 9:51 PM
I think that if Edwards and Clinton run a vicious negative campaign and tear him down off his pedestal, costing him the nomination, it would seriously damage the Democratic party. A viable, well-liked black candidate being on the business end of a character assassination would look very bad for whoever ended up with the nomination.
Don’t tell them I said that. We’ll see what happens.
joewm315 on January 4, 2008 at 9:54 PM
I’m beginning to get this feeling that maybe the best we can do this round is just…nominate McCain to be Obama’s Dole.
Typhoon on January 4, 2008 at 10:15 PM
The looting of New Orleans in 2005 is a fresh example of the ruin that comes from the softness of the mayor and the police of a city. If those looters had been driven out or cut down, they would have served as an example for everyone in the decades to follow. As it is, the Americans will go on living fearfully, in Jonah Goldberg’s way, until the rulers of the Americans’ cities discard their cruel pity and determine to maintain a decent order, without any respect.
Kralizec on January 4, 2008 at 10:27 PM
I’m starting get that feeling too.
terryannonline on January 4, 2008 at 10:31 PM
Oh, I want to add I don’t just get that feeling with Obama. I think the Democrats are just pumped up period, if Hillary gets the they would probably get 100% behind her too. They just want to win.
terryannonline on January 4, 2008 at 10:35 PM
Actually, I think Rudy or Fred or even McCain (but not the Huckster or the Yacht Salesman) could mop up the floor with Hillary. I know a lot of people–mostly young–who wouldn’t even thinking of voting for her who would vote for Obama–maybe also without really thinking.
I’m almost to the point of just looking for silver linings.
Typhoon on January 4, 2008 at 10:56 PM
There is a silver lining:
The Dems have been saying for the past six years how bad Republicans run things and how bad President Bush is. Fine, they’ll get the wheel and the American people will see how they drive. I guarantee to you the American people are going to be so disappointed by Democratic leadership.
terryannonline on January 4, 2008 at 11:45 PM
Sounds about right to me. The government and media have told blacks that the only reason we don’t have a black President is racism, and that violence is a perfectly appropriate and forgivable reaction to racism.
But we’re several steps ahead of ourselves, here.
Jaibones on January 5, 2008 at 12:16 AM
Interesting how everyone thinks that Jonah is talking about black people. He could be talking about crazy white BDS sufferers/Republican haters. (Been to Kos/DU/HuffPo lately?) After all, you don’t see black people disrupting Congressional sessions–not unless they’re a member at any rate.
baldilocks on January 5, 2008 at 12:51 AM
baldilocks on January 5, 2008 at 12:51 AM
Indeed. Actually, much to be feared, no matter who’d be the leftie nominee, if s/he loses.
2000 was the onset of insanity, 2004 was very hopeful for them, faux exit polls, then the huge letdown, full-fledged insanity. 2008, with a loss, w/b beyond psychotic – it would throw them into uncontrollable actions. Democracy is only when they win. This “first woman/first Black” is just their excuse then. It would make no difference if Edwards loses in Nov.
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 1:28 AM
An excellent point, Baldilocks. Certainly no group has caused more disruption than the BDS coalition. However, the conventional wisdom seems to be that most of the Kos/DU/HuffPo types don’t like Barack Obama because he doesn’t hate Republicans enough. They accuse him of “conservative framing”.
joewm315 on January 5, 2008 at 1:30 AM
I agree almost entirely, except for what you said about Edwards at the end. Whoever the Dem nominee is, if they lose again, the far left weirdos and their troofer fellow travelers are going to go nuts.
I also agree with baldilocks that Jonah isn’t talking specifically about black people, though I’m sure some of them would join in with the nutters.
Sean M. on January 5, 2008 at 1:56 AM
Sean M., we agree – that’s what I tried to say – whoever losed on their side, the reaction will be the same. I could have said “if Edwards is the one who loses in Nov.”
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 2:15 AM
Blech, s/b “whoever loses on their side”
Entelechy on January 5, 2008 at 2:16 AM
I read what Jonah wrote not thinking black folk at all. Just the BDS nutroots– think about the group blogger picture with Billy Jeff, mostly white kids.
But I have to part company with y’all about there being no difference between the Dem big 3 possible nominations. Each one would get the usual pile of MSM chits accorded to any Dem nominee. But I think what Jonah was imagining was the emotional bonfire of the vanities that would accompany an Obama nomination. His whole point was, in the event of a GOP victory, the preceding media outpouring, while somewhat historically justified, would be especially inflammatory to BDS syndrome.
silverfox on January 5, 2008 at 3:45 AM
Or maybe it should be:
BDS syndrome = y2k stolen election syndrome
silverfox on January 5, 2008 at 3:48 AM
While I agree that the MSM will probably swoon more over Obama should he get the nomination (hope! first viable black candidate! son of an immigrant! everything Ezra Klein had to say!) than Silky or the Glacier, do you really think they won’t do their best to build a narrative about how either of them represent a “change for America” or an “opportunity to mend relations with the rest of the world” or some such bull*@#+?
Sure, they’ll spin harder for Obama, if for no other reason that there’s a novelty factor, but they’re going to do their damnedest to make sure that whichever Dem gets the nod smells like roses. With Hillary!, we’ll be told over and over that she has the foreign policy experience and that gee, won’t it be nice to finally have a woman President? And with Edwards, they’d finesse his class warfare rhetoric into “standing up for the middle class and the working poor against Big-(fill in the blank).”
The bottom line is, if anybody with an R after their name wins, the fringe left is going to scream bloody murder and another stolen election, and the MSM will likely have abetted that.
Like Mr. Burns would say to Smithers, I’ll bet you a Coke.
Sean M. on January 5, 2008 at 5:10 AM
They’re one and the same. Without Y2KSES there’d be very little (maybe even NO) BDS. I’ve been long convinced that Y2KSES is where it all started.
flipflop on January 5, 2008 at 6:12 AM
That’s a great point, baldilocks. Except that he is talking about black people, and I suppose the anarchists who take advantage of every situation of unrest.
Jaibones on January 5, 2008 at 8:41 AM
The way I read it, baldilocks, that’s precisely who he’s talking about.
But I’d say to Jonah, ‘Didn’t you notice, Jonah, that element of society is already unhinged? Are we being asked to cower to their intolerance?’
If they want to take their PC bigotry into the streets, I say, ‘Bring it on.’ Their cultural Marxism is a cancer on our society. Sometimes a festering conflict needs to be brought to a head before you can engage it properly.
When we compromise our best judgment for fear of illegal repercussions, we compound the eventual misery.This is a bridge that our country must inevitably cross, if ever we’re to outgrow completely the racial divide. I say, the sooner we cross it the better. And if the PC bigots want to stir the pot and erupt in the streets, then so be it.
petefrt on January 5, 2008 at 10:39 AM
I wondered at length about this. I believe you’re correct that Y2KSES was the first large fruit from a poisonous tree cultivated by McCauliffe and even more so now by Howard Dean… using personal hatred to drive an ideology of victimhood, resentment and class warfare.
petefrt on January 5, 2008 at 10:47 AM
BTW, call me unrealistic, but I’m hoping Obama can rescue the Democrat Party and restore it to its former decent self, a la Barnett’s Nutroots Waterloo?
petefrt on January 5, 2008 at 10:52 AM
That’s most definitely one of those silver linings I was talking about. The guy’s so inspirational but so untested. I feel a tsunami developing and I guess at base I either a:) hope I’m wrong; or b:) hope he’s up to the job.
Typhoon on January 5, 2008 at 11:00 AM
Tell ya the truth, Typhoon, I’d feel one helluva lot more comfortable with Obama as Prez than I would with Billary. Even though he’s probably farther left than she, still I think he’s an honorable person. I trust Obama to play by the rules of our democracy. I trust Hillary, on the other hand, to ruthlessly transform this country in such a way as to make her legacy irreversible.
petefrt on January 5, 2008 at 11:31 AM
I hope he’s up for the job too.
terryannonline on January 5, 2008 at 11:45 AM
If Obama loses, I’ll be more than hapy to comfort Obama Girl.
Mazztek on January 5, 2008 at 1:03 PM
And the choir sang out, “Amen!”
Typhoon on January 5, 2008 at 1:06 PM