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“She also never thought he’d intentionally hurt someone trying to make history and change the lives of so many people.”
How exactly is he going to change these lives? These people are dreamers, on a different planet.
Entelechy on May 5, 2008 at 12:14 AM
Bringing in the Oprah angle, in Newsweek, for the week of May 12, should let team Obama know that, despite their best efforts, this story is not going to go away. And I don’t think Obama has anywhere else to run on this. He may, much to the chagrin of Chrissy M., just have to take it on the chin, and see where the electoral chips fall.
Weight of Glory on May 5, 2008 at 12:17 AM
The first paragraph is quite damaging. It sets the table by listing a series of motivations for Oprah’s interest and involvement in the black community in Chicago:
She was eager to bond with the movers and shakers in her new hometown’s black community. But she also admired Trinity United’s ambitious outreach work with the poor, and she took pride in upholding her Southern grandmother’s legacy of involvement with traditional African-American houses of worship.
This runs parallel to many of the reasons Obama has given for being, and remaining, a member of Wright’s church. By doing this it places both Oprah and Obama at the same laudable beginning. What is so damaging (or at least should be damaging – never know how things will play out) is that a daytime talk show host exhibited better judgment and instinct than a state senator, who is now a top contender for the Oval Office. The same woman, who is in love with Tom “I freakishly jump on couches” Cruise, was nevertheless uncomfortable with Rev. Wright, yet Obama was not.
Weight of Glory on May 5, 2008 at 12:27 AM
This part isn’t particularly helpful either (emphasis mine):
“[His] reasons for attending Trinity were totally different,” said one campaign adviser, who declined to be named discussing the Illinois senator’s sentiments. “Early on, he was in search of his identity as an African-American and, more importantly, as an African-American man. Reverend Wright and other male members of the church were instrumental in helping him understand the black experience in America. Winfrey wasn’t going for that. She’s secure in her blackness, so that didn’t have a hold on her.”
Weight of Glory on May 5, 2008 at 12:32 AM
Oprah doing self-damage control?
Connie on May 5, 2008 at 12:46 AM
What are we to believe. That black is black and white is white and never the twain shall meet? I’m as willing to entertain racist theories about differences between blacks and whites as the next guy, but isn’t there good evidence, both subjective and objective, that one’s whiteness or blackness, or in MM’s case, her yellowness, if I can say that without making some racial faux pas, that race and skin color don’t make a whit of difference? That they don’t matter in the least?
said one campaign adviser, who declined to be named discussing the Illinois senator’s sentiments:
“Early on, he was in search of his identity as an African-American and, more importantly, as an African-American man. Reverend Wright and other male members of the church were instrumental in helping him understand the black experience in America.
The “black experience”? Aren’t we all sick of this racial crap yet?
Paul-Cincy on May 5, 2008 at 1:15 AM
And while Winfrey, who has endorsed Obama and campaigned on his behalf, had long understood the perils of a close association with Wright, friends say she was blindsided by the pastor’s personal assault on Obama. “She felt that Wright would never do anything to hurt a man who looked up to him as a father figure,” said her close friend.
Hmmm, not just a crazy uncle, a father figure. The psycho analysis of Obama is a many faceted ordeal.
JustTruth101 on May 5, 2008 at 1:59 AM
I think I speak for everybody here when I express my confusion: how does this Wright stuff have anything to do with Obama? Haven’t all the questions been settled? Again?
So we either believe an anonymous campaign advisor or Obama himself for the reasons why he joined the church. He’s said numerous times that he admired Trinity’s outreach towards the poor and that was a large factor in joining up.
Nonfactor on May 5, 2008 at 3:58 AM
I think I speak for everybody here when I express my confusion: how does this Wright stuff have anything to do with Obama? Haven’t all the questions been settled? Again?
omriceren on May 5, 2008 at 3:02 AM
Ordinarily I would say that it is something of a tired –if not dead — horse.
Except that Obama is hanging his hat on the idea that his superior judgement outweighs his almost complete lack of experience in politics at the federal level, despite the fact that what experience he does have falls well-left of the American mainstream. As such, his questionable judgement must be called into account based on the people he chooses to associate with. In this particular case, he’s chosen in the past 23 years to be a member of a church congregation whose leader has taught and advised his congregation on a very anti-American ideology, including statements that are policy issues. As an example, to say that the CIA engineered AIDS to kill black people just makes you a nut. But to call Zionism (the belief in the soverign state of Israel and its right to exist) evil is a policy decision, and one that the American government has supported since 1948.
The fact that Barack Obama has spent half of his life attending this church and hearing those sermons that have been shown to be very much anti-American (and, IMO, anti-Christian occaisionally) calls into question his supposedly superir judgement. He’s spent nearly his entire adult life listening to a man who a talk show host (Oprah) discovered to be bad news for anyone trying to maintain a mainstream image. That relationship, combined with others, are enough to make his supposedly superior judgement a very shaky platform, and it shows that his “new, post-racial politics” is looking very much like the spiel of any other old school crooked politician.
It makes perfect sense that Oprah deeped her association with Wright years ago. She is one smart lady, hense her being richer than just about every politician in the country……..combined.
She understands her audience. Too bad the three idiots running for President don’t.
Jim708 on May 5, 2008 at 5:21 AM
So we either believe an anonymous campaign advisor or Obama himself for the reasons why he joined the church. He’s said numerous times that he admired Trinity’s outreach towards the poor and that was a large factor in joining up.
Nonfactor on May 5, 2008 at 3:58 AM
Many thousands of churches, my own inner-city one included, have a very active “outreach towards the poor.” We also don’t have a pastor who’s a racist and an attention whore. So, there are some easy choices in life. ‘Nuff said.
inviolet on May 5, 2008 at 5:42 AM
I figured Oprah’s biggest problem with any church is that there she’d have to worship someone…. else.
viking01 on May 5, 2008 at 6:28 AM
Winfrey was a member of Trinity United from 1984 to 1986
It took Obama 20 years to figure out what Oprah did in 2.
TheBigOldDog on May 5, 2008 at 7:11 AM
Oprah has said that she is spiritual, not religious. That way she can feel good about herself without having to acknowledge any of that nasty old sin stuff.
Ellen on May 5, 2008 at 7:49 AM
I think I speak for everybody here when I … omriceren on May 5, 2008 at 3:02 AM
Nope.
wise_man on May 5, 2008 at 8:42 AM
“Early on, he was in search of his identity as an African-American and, more importantly, as an African-American man.
I see we pass a law that anybody “in search” of themselves not be allowed to be POTUS.
EJDolbow on May 5, 2008 at 8:42 AM
Oprah is intuitive and wise.
I do not believe that she left the church because of her Audience.
She left because she actually is a seeker of truth. She is a seeker of a deeper spiritual journey. period.
And I think she has grown and matured through the years in that area.
Wright was wrong for her and it’s so easy to see why.
Wright was right for Obama because he wasn’t on a spiritual journey…he was on an opportunistic journey…the masses followed wright..obama wants the masses to follow him. Surprise! He is learning that mainstream america is not the masses that follow Rev.Wright.
bridgetown on May 5, 2008 at 9:05 AM
She understands her audience. Too bad the three idiots running for President don’t.
Jim708 on May 5, 2008 at 5:21 AM
Exactly. What I found most interesting about Oprah’s reasoning is that she recognized that Wright was offensive to a large portion of the general population. Obama, up until recently, had no idea that Wright was offensive, and he still doesn’t seem to grasp why.
Why must it be a calculated decision by Oprah to be aware of the toxic rantings of Wright’s church?
Why can it not be a decision she made for her own self, her own journey?
Why must it be about her audience?
I just don’t buy that. And I think people are missing the point when they do think that.
bridgetown on May 5, 2008 at 9:46 AM
Pack it in Obama, you have no chance. Oh, wait, I mean, stay in the race Obama, surely you can pull this off.
*snicker*
Geronimo on May 5, 2008 at 9:48 AM
I think I speak for everybody here when I express my confusion: how does this Wright stuff have anything to do with Obama? Haven’t all the questions been settled? Again?
–omriceren on May 5, 2008 at 3:02 AM
You don’t speak for me, thank-you very much.
My bet is, you’d be a lot less confused, if the headline read:
McCain had close ties with Timothy McViegh and Richard Butler.
franksalterego on May 5, 2008 at 10:05 AM
omriceren said:
I think I speak for everybody here when I express my confusion: how does this Wright stuff have anything to do with Obama? Haven’t all the questions been settled? Again?
To me the lingering question is Obama’s visceral reaction to Wright’s sermons. Obama says he wasn’t in church for the most extreme of them. That’s not credible. Omri, what if I invited you to dinner and regaled you with offensive nonsense such as “n!ggers smell, and the blacker they are, the dumber they are”. Wouldn’t you have a negative visceral reaction to that? Or would you say, “please pass the mashed potatoes”? When I asked you to come the next week, would you reply “Can I bring the kids?”. Later when asked about your association with me, would you say “we don’t agree on everything”. Duh! How about “Paul sickens me”. Wouldn’t that be closer to the truth? That’s why many of your typical white persons won’t vote for Obama. Because his sitting there and listening to Wright for years without getting sick tells you something about him, and it’s not good. He might be able to explain it, but he’s changed his narrative on it so often I don’t know if I’d believe him regardless of what he said.
Blowback
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How exactly is he going to change these lives? These people are dreamers, on a different planet.
Entelechy on May 5, 2008 at 12:14 AM
Bringing in the Oprah angle, in Newsweek, for the week of May 12, should let team Obama know that, despite their best efforts, this story is not going to go away. And I don’t think Obama has anywhere else to run on this. He may, much to the chagrin of Chrissy M., just have to take it on the chin, and see where the electoral chips fall.
Weight of Glory on May 5, 2008 at 12:17 AM
The first paragraph is quite damaging. It sets the table by listing a series of motivations for Oprah’s interest and involvement in the black community in Chicago:
This runs parallel to many of the reasons Obama has given for being, and remaining, a member of Wright’s church. By doing this it places both Oprah and Obama at the same laudable beginning. What is so damaging (or at least should be damaging – never know how things will play out) is that a daytime talk show host exhibited better judgment and instinct than a state senator, who is now a top contender for the Oval Office. The same woman, who is in love with Tom “I freakishly jump on couches” Cruise, was nevertheless uncomfortable with Rev. Wright, yet Obama was not.
Weight of Glory on May 5, 2008 at 12:27 AM
This part isn’t particularly helpful either (emphasis mine):
Weight of Glory on May 5, 2008 at 12:32 AM
Oprah doing self-damage control?
Connie on May 5, 2008 at 12:46 AM
What are we to believe. That black is black and white is white and never the twain shall meet? I’m as willing to entertain racist theories about differences between blacks and whites as the next guy, but isn’t there good evidence, both subjective and objective, that one’s whiteness or blackness, or in MM’s case, her yellowness, if I can say that without making some racial faux pas, that race and skin color don’t make a whit of difference? That they don’t matter in the least?
The “black experience”? Aren’t we all sick of this racial crap yet?
Paul-Cincy on May 5, 2008 at 1:15 AM
Hmmm, not just a crazy uncle, a father figure. The psycho analysis of Obama is a many faceted ordeal.
JustTruth101 on May 5, 2008 at 1:59 AM
I think I speak for everybody here when I express my confusion: how does this Wright stuff have anything to do with Obama? Haven’t all the questions been settled? Again?
omriceren on May 5, 2008 at 3:02 AM
So we either believe an anonymous campaign advisor or Obama himself for the reasons why he joined the church. He’s said numerous times that he admired Trinity’s outreach towards the poor and that was a large factor in joining up.
Nonfactor on May 5, 2008 at 3:58 AM
Ordinarily I would say that it is something of a tired –if not dead — horse.
Except that Obama is hanging his hat on the idea that his superior judgement outweighs his almost complete lack of experience in politics at the federal level, despite the fact that what experience he does have falls well-left of the American mainstream. As such, his questionable judgement must be called into account based on the people he chooses to associate with. In this particular case, he’s chosen in the past 23 years to be a member of a church congregation whose leader has taught and advised his congregation on a very anti-American ideology, including statements that are policy issues. As an example, to say that the CIA engineered AIDS to kill black people just makes you a nut. But to call Zionism (the belief in the soverign state of Israel and its right to exist) evil is a policy decision, and one that the American government has supported since 1948.
The fact that Barack Obama has spent half of his life attending this church and hearing those sermons that have been shown to be very much anti-American (and, IMO, anti-Christian occaisionally) calls into question his supposedly superir judgement. He’s spent nearly his entire adult life listening to a man who a talk show host (Oprah) discovered to be bad news for anyone trying to maintain a mainstream image. That relationship, combined with others, are enough to make his supposedly superior judgement a very shaky platform, and it shows that his “new, post-racial politics” is looking very much like the spiel of any other old school crooked politician.
Spc Steve on May 5, 2008 at 4:57 AM
It makes perfect sense that Oprah deeped her association with Wright years ago. She is one smart lady, hense her being richer than just about every politician in the country……..combined.
She understands her audience. Too bad the three idiots running for President don’t.
Jim708 on May 5, 2008 at 5:21 AM
Many thousands of churches, my own inner-city one included, have a very active “outreach towards the poor.” We also don’t have a pastor who’s a racist and an attention whore. So, there are some easy choices in life. ‘Nuff said.
inviolet on May 5, 2008 at 5:42 AM
I figured Oprah’s biggest problem with any church is that there she’d have to worship someone…. else.
viking01 on May 5, 2008 at 6:28 AM
It took Obama 20 years to figure out what Oprah did in 2.
TheBigOldDog on May 5, 2008 at 7:11 AM
Oprah has said that she is spiritual, not religious. That way she can feel good about herself without having to acknowledge any of that nasty old sin stuff.
Ellen on May 5, 2008 at 7:49 AM
Nope.
wise_man on May 5, 2008 at 8:42 AM
“Early on, he was in search of his identity as an African-American and, more importantly, as an African-American man.I see we pass a law that anybody “in search” of themselves not be allowed to be POTUS.
EJDolbow on May 5, 2008 at 8:42 AM
Oprah is intuitive and wise.
I do not believe that she left the church because of her Audience.
She left because she actually is a seeker of truth. She is a seeker of a deeper spiritual journey. period.
And I think she has grown and matured through the years in that area.
Wright was wrong for her and it’s so easy to see why.
Wright was right for Obama because he wasn’t on a spiritual journey…he was on an opportunistic journey…the masses followed wright..obama wants the masses to follow him. Surprise! He is learning that mainstream america is not the masses that follow Rev.Wright.
bridgetown on May 5, 2008 at 9:05 AM
Exactly. What I found most interesting about Oprah’s reasoning is that she recognized that Wright was offensive to a large portion of the general population. Obama, up until recently, had no idea that Wright was offensive, and he still doesn’t seem to grasp why.
The Democrats really should have run Oprah.
Lehosh on May 5, 2008 at 9:38 AM
Why must it be a calculated decision by Oprah to be aware of the toxic rantings of Wright’s church?
Why can it not be a decision she made for her own self, her own journey?
Why must it be about her audience?
I just don’t buy that. And I think people are missing the point when they do think that.
bridgetown on May 5, 2008 at 9:46 AM
Pack it in Obama, you have no chance. Oh, wait, I mean, stay in the race Obama, surely you can pull this off.
*snicker*
Geronimo on May 5, 2008 at 9:48 AM
You don’t speak for me, thank-you very much.
My bet is, you’d be a lot less confused, if the headline read:
McCain had close ties with Timothy McViegh and Richard Butler.
franksalterego on May 5, 2008 at 10:05 AM
To me the lingering question is Obama’s visceral reaction to Wright’s sermons. Obama says he wasn’t in church for the most extreme of them. That’s not credible. Omri, what if I invited you to dinner and regaled you with offensive nonsense such as “n!ggers smell, and the blacker they are, the dumber they are”. Wouldn’t you have a negative visceral reaction to that? Or would you say, “please pass the mashed potatoes”? When I asked you to come the next week, would you reply “Can I bring the kids?”. Later when asked about your association with me, would you say “we don’t agree on everything”. Duh! How about “Paul sickens me”. Wouldn’t that be closer to the truth? That’s why many of your typical white persons won’t vote for Obama. Because his sitting there and listening to Wright for years without getting sick tells you something about him, and it’s not good. He might be able to explain it, but he’s changed his narrative on it so often I don’t know if I’d believe him regardless of what he said.
Paul-Cincy on May 5, 2008 at 10:36 AM