Hmmm: Quinnipiac puts national Dem primary at dead heat?

posted at 12:01 pm on February 5, 2016 by Ed Morrissey

Normally at this stage of a primary, national polling means nothing, and this new poll from Quinnipiac isn’t exactly determinative. It does, however, portend a very bad outcome for Hillary Clinton in what has been her biggest argument in the Democratic primary — her inevitability. Sure, Bernie Sanders might steal a march in Iowa and New Hampshire, where populism and nimble organization can produce outliers, but Hillary’s dominance in the rest of the country would eventually prevail.

Or … not:

In the Democratic race nationwide, former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton has 44 percent, with Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont at 42 percent, and 11 percent undecided. This compares to a 61 – 30 percent Clinton lead in a December 22 survey by the independent Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pe-ack) University Poll. …

“Democrats nationwide are feeling the Bern as Sen. Bernie Sanders closes a 31-point gap to tie Secretary Hillary Clinton,” said Tim Malloy, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Poll.

That’s a highly dramatic fall from dominance in just six weeks — twenty-seven points in the gap, in fact. Sanders’ support appears to be at least as solid as Hillary’s, 63% and 67% respectively, although both still seem a little low for this stage of the race. The gender gap is completely neutral, with Sanders up ten among men (48/38) and Hillary getting the same exact numbers among women.

The fact that Hillary can’t get a majority of Democratic women to back her in a primary against Sanders should have eyes popping at the DNC. Hillary has made explicit appeals to gender for months — including in last night’s debates, where she claimed her gender exempted her from the “establishment” label despite having spent the last quarter-century in Washington. So far, those appeals have done nothing, and arguably have made the situation worse in the short run; Obama won women by a fairly wide margin in both of his successful presidential general elections.

On top of that, the Q-poll shows Sanders slightly more electable than Hillary in general-election match-ups:

  • Clinton tops Trump 46 – 41 percent;
  • Clinton ties Cruz 45 – 45 percent;
  • Clinton trails Rubio 48 – 41 percent;
  • Sanders thumps Trump 49 – 39 percent;
  • Sanders edges Cruz 46 – 42 percent;
  • Sanders and Rubio are tied 43 – 43 percent.

One reason for this is that Sanders has a +9 favorability rating, while Hillary’s is -17, only beating Donald Trump’s -25 in the current field. Marco Rubio actually has the best rating at +14, while Ted Cruz has a -6.

Assuming that other national polling shows this same shift in the Democratic race, it matters because it undermines Hillary’s arguments for inevitability and electability. That could have voters in other states, especially South Carolina, wonder whether it’s worth it to revert back to a corrupt, scandal-plagued clan for yet another round of failure, or better to redefine the party as an activist, progressive movement with a cleaner figurehead at the forefront. This poll means nothing in predictive terms of a specific primary vote, but it might mean plenty in voter psychology.


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Comments

…against Bernie…what has this country come too?

JugEarsButtHurt on February 5, 2016 at 12:03 PM

Clinton tops Trump 46 – 41 percent;
Clinton ties Cruz 45 – 45 percent;
Clinton trails Rubio 48 – 41 percent;
Sanders thumps Trump 49 – 39 percent;
Sanders edges Cruz 46 – 42 percent;
Sanders and Rubio are tied 43 – 43 percent.

…proof!…that JugEar’s has ‘transformed’ America!

JugEarsButtHurt on February 5, 2016 at 12:05 PM

JugEarsButtHurt on February 5, 2016 at 12:03 PM

I say that a lot lately too.

CoffeeLover on February 5, 2016 at 12:06 PM

The problem with Hillary is her most recent scandals are just too easy to understand and her ancient scandals (like her own, personal “war on women accusing Bill of rape”) would never be tolerated in today’s popular culture.

Mord on February 5, 2016 at 12:07 PM

Bernie should focus on SC, especially black voters.

forest on February 5, 2016 at 12:08 PM

Shillary walking humming Loser by Beck to her herself.

“I’m a loser baby, so why don’t you kill me?”

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:11 PM

The problem with Hillary is her most recent scandals are just too easy to understand and her ancient scandals (like her own, personal “war on women accusing Bill of rape”) would never be tolerated in today’s popular culture.

Mord on February 5, 2016 at 12:07 PM

Exactly. Almost all the old-time political experts thought all that was dead and buried after the Republicans were successfully smeared as “overreaching” with the impeachment.

But anyone under the age of 35-40 doesn’t even remember that crap. They’re hearing about Hillary’s enabling of sexual assaults for the first time. The way she shamed the victims goes over like a lead balloon with ppl who haven’t been conditioned to dismiss it as “old news”. Donald Trump was the only one to recognize how powerful it would be.

forest on February 5, 2016 at 12:12 PM

The Democrat party has gone off the rails. And the media acts like it’s no big deal because the ideas Sanders espouses are the same liberal academic constructs they all fantasize about.

MidAtlantic Moderate on February 5, 2016 at 12:16 PM

After years of teaching socialism and anti-Americanism in our public schools, why should this be a surprise? The radicals have succeeded in introducing their philosophy into our schools. They’ve been working at it for decades.

grumpyank on February 5, 2016 at 12:17 PM

…against Bernie…what has this country come too?

JugEarsButtHurt on February 5, 2016 at 12:03 PM

People are tired of the rigged system and corrupt politicians who answer to big business, Wall Street, and lobbyists. Bernie explains its because of the money in politics and people are finally starting understand and believe it. Since he has no Super PAC, doesn’t take money from billionaires, and his campaign is funded almost entirely from small individual contributions from the American people, people trust he is going to answer to them unlike all the rest of the establishment and corporate funded politicians.

People also are tired of the redistribution of wealth the corporate class has been doing to the middle class over the last half century and are saying enough is enough.

People everywhere are starting to Feel the Bern!

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:18 PM

Meh- I dunno. The kooky part of me believes this is a scam to make the coronation look like it was somewhat competitive.

But then- the disingenuous, patronizing, mendacious, untalented and underwhelming, unlikable Hillary might just be losing to a nutty old socialist.

Marcus Traianus on February 5, 2016 at 12:19 PM

Even tho this tickles me…
It is also scary that we have that many people wanting to vote
for a known radical socialist.

bazil9 on February 5, 2016 at 12:21 PM

It’s baffling that anyone ever thought let alone still thinks that Hillary is a political juggernaught who would steamroll any Republican. She’s a complete, utter joke as a candidate and a Republican’s dream opponent. She not only will lose the election, but probably will ensure the GOP keeps the Senate.

HidetheDecline on February 5, 2016 at 12:21 PM

This is about right. In 2008 polling Hillary was stomping all over obama until about the middle of February. In some polls she was +25 over him in December 2007.

Johnnyreb on February 5, 2016 at 12:21 PM

Bernie, buy a stick mirror and run it under your car before every instance of driving it. Don’t argue, just do it, seriously.

Bishop on February 5, 2016 at 12:23 PM

People everywhere are starting to Feel the Bern!

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:18 PM

That, or Shillary is awful at campaigning.

Any Republican should welcome The Bern (sounds like a venereal disease, doesn’t it?) as their opponent. I know I would love it if he were my opponent. I would spend every waking moment reminding everyone he is a self declared socialist, then we can have a debate about the awfulness of socialism.

Trust me, The Bern (when he pees?) is not doing well because he is The Bern, but because his opponent is Shillary.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:24 PM

Meh. This is nothing a few coin flips in a back room can’t take care of.

Agent Cooper on February 5, 2016 at 12:25 PM

Clinton tops Trump 46 – 41 percent;
Clinton ties Cruz 45 – 45 percent;
Clinton trails Rubio 48 – 41 percent;
Sanders thumps Trump 49 – 39 percent;
Sanders edges Cruz 46 – 42 percent;
Sanders and Rubio are tied 43 – 43 percent.

Any of the howlers want to weigh in on how Trump is the only electable candidate on the GOP side? The polling at this point suggests otherwise.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2016 at 12:29 PM

The Democrat party has gone off the rails. And the media acts like it’s no big deal because the ideas Sanders espouses are the same liberal academic constructs they all fantasize about.

MidAtlantic Moderate on February 5, 2016 at 12:16 PM

The Democrat party mirrors the values of average Americans.

This is no longer a “center-right” country.

If the Republicans had been a opposition party during Obama maybe that wouldn’t be the case.

tetriskid on February 5, 2016 at 12:30 PM

Bernie should focus on SC, especially black voters.

forest on February 5, 2016 at 12:08 PM

There is a reason why Blue is going to SC by way of Flint, MI. She’s supposedly going to be “briefed” about the water situation (by whom is unclear). The reality is that she wants to be seen surrounded by black people as the SC election looms.

Blue has already ceded NH to Bernie. She’s striking national issues for the upcoming primaries. It is the same reason that the drooling Gabbie Giffords is stumping for Blue right now. She’s setting herself up as the more dedicated gun grabber.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2016 at 12:33 PM

Bernie, buy a stick mirror and run it under your car before every instance of driving it. Don’t argue, just do it, seriously.

Bishop on February 5, 2016 at 12:23 PM

Don’t forget the remote starter.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2016 at 12:36 PM

The Democrat party mirrors the values of average Americans.

This is no longer a “center-right” country.

If the Republicans had been a opposition party during Obama maybe that wouldn’t be the case.

tetriskid on February 5, 2016 at 12:30 PM

The Democrats have been absolutely decimated under Obama and now are a clear minority party, and with all the anti-union and voter identification laws that have been passed they’re in an even tougher position than ever. A Republican could easily beat either Hillary or Sanders, at which point the GOP would control every level of government.

HidetheDecline on February 5, 2016 at 12:37 PM

That, or Shillary is awful at campaigning.

Any Republican should welcome The Bern (sounds like a venereal disease, doesn’t it?) as their opponent. I know I would love it if he were my opponent. I would spend every waking moment reminding everyone he is a self declared socialist, then we can have a debate about the awfulness of socialism.

Trust me, The Bern (when he pees?) is not doing well because he is The Bern, but because his opponent is Shillary.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:24 PM

I think Bernie can’t wait to have a debate about things like social security, public schools, and Medicare. Likewise, he can’t wait to talk about Wall Street led economic collapses, low wages, jobs shipped overseas, and all the ills of unchecked capitalism. I’m sure he welcomes that debate.

You do understand Republicans have thrown all they can at him in Vermont and he is absolutely loved there and in neighboring New Hampshire. So he can’t wait until his policies have a light shined on them in the rest of the country as well. Republicans fear Bernie and would love for Democrats to nominate another DINO like Hillary.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:39 PM

People everywhere are starting to Feel the Bern!

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:18 PM

Hardly….only people such as yourself…..and Civil Disorder…

And every kid in college expecting FREE COLLEGE!!!!!!!!!

Hey that reminds me. Can you pay for MY kid’s College???

Pretty Please?

ToddPA on February 5, 2016 at 12:39 PM

Sanders was supposed to be token opposition, so radical that she looked sane next to him.

Instead he’s pulling her even more insanely left and looks like he might beat her.

ConstantineXI on February 5, 2016 at 12:41 PM

I think Bernie can’t wait to have a debate about things like social security, public schools, and Medicare. Likewise, he can’t wait to talk about Wall Street led economic collapses, low wages, jobs shipped overseas, and all the ills of unchecked capitalism. I’m sure he welcomes that debate.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:39 PM

Lol. Where is this unchecked capitalism you speak of? And this recession that has never ended was a government created recession. So yes, let’s have that debate about the wonders of socialism. I welcome it.

You do understand Republicans have thrown all they can at him in Vermont and he is absolutely loved there and in neighboring New Hampshire. So he can’t wait until his policies have a light shined on them in the rest of the country as well. Republicans fear Bernie and would love for Democrats to nominate another DINO like Hillary.

The country is much larger than the NE.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:43 PM

The more you see of Hillary, the less you want to see of Hillary.

PackerBronco on February 5, 2016 at 12:45 PM

The more you see of Hillary, the less you want to see of Hillary.

PackerBronco on February 5, 2016 at 12:45 PM

So much so that the Dems are willing to nominate George McGovern II.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:47 PM

When a 74 YO socialist/communist MAN can tie the most popular ever President’s dutiful, smart, wonderful, and LOYAL wife, well … something MUST be wrong with those polls.

Wimminz’ heads exploding across America in all the coastal enclaves of liberals.

fred5678 on February 5, 2016 at 12:47 PM

You do understand Republicans have thrown all they can at him in Vermont and he is absolutely loved there and in neighboring New Hampshire. So he can’t wait until his policies have a light shined on them in the rest of the country as well. Republicans fear Bernie and would love for Democrats to nominate another DINO like Hillary.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:39 PM

If Sanders can’t wait for the rest of the nation to see his deep plan to raise taxes by a few trillion or so to make everything “free” then he really is insane and so are you.

Bishop on February 5, 2016 at 12:48 PM

You do understand Republicans have thrown all they can at him in Vermont and he is absolutely loved there and in neighboring New Hampshire. So he can’t wait until his policies have a light shined on them in the rest of the country as well. Republicans fear Bernie and would love for Democrats to nominate another DINO like Hillary

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 12:39 PM

LMAO!!

Hey, anyone seen rogerb?? We got a live one here!!

ToddPA on February 5, 2016 at 12:48 PM

wth, 3 NH polls have Sanders up big over Clinton, but this one outlier pro-Clinton Q poll has her up by 2. makes no sense, except to believe the consistent majority polls.

New Hampshire 2016 Democratic Primary WBUR/MassINC Sanders 54, Clinton 39, O’Malley

Sanders +15

New Hampshire 2016 Democratic Primary Boston Globe/Suffolk Sanders 50, Clinton 41, O’Malley

Sanders +9

New Hampshire 2016 Democratic Primary ARG (Tracking) Sanders 54, Clinton 38, O’Malley

Sanders +16

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 12:51 PM

If Sanders can’t wait for the rest of the nation to see his deep plan to raise taxes by a few trillion or so to make everything “free” then he really is insane and so are you.

Bishop on February 5, 2016 at 12:48 PM

The upside? When he taxes the earners and creators into oblivion they can all get free stuff on the public dole, too! Who pays for everything after that is just semantics.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:54 PM

proverbs. F-. People are only feeling the bern because they realize cankles is a total disaster thats only getting worse. In a month or so, youll be clamoring “everyone is just biden their time now”…..lol!!!

Indiana Jim on February 5, 2016 at 1:01 PM

Those folks have a tough decision- Hillary or a socialist. Even as an R I thought it’d be easier to beat a socialist but am being proven wrong.

tej on February 5, 2016 at 1:02 PM

Trust me, The Bern (when he pees?) is not doing well because he is The Bern, but because his opponent is Shillary.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:24 PM

When she slips below 50% among Dems, and Obama’s approval rating nationwide is below 50%, and she’s not capable of changing, and she is actually well known with a 30 year track record…
How in heck can she possibly rise?? She is trending down (shades of 2008) and nothing can change to help her.

DublOh7 on February 5, 2016 at 1:04 PM

6 polls today in NH, and Trump is up an avg of 15 points, ranging from +9 to +21

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 1:05 PM

Citi: World economy seems trapped in ‘death spiral’

The global economy seems trapped in a “death spiral” that could lead to further weakness in oil prices, recession and a serious equity bear market, Citi strategists have warned.

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 1:08 PM

The two might as well team up and become “one”. I just hope they don’t become another “The One”, if you know what I mean.

Cherokee on February 5, 2016 at 1:09 PM

She’s a felon. The fact she hasn’t’ collapsed completely is due to her followers being so icky and stupid.

AprilApple on February 5, 2016 at 1:10 PM

There is a reason why Blue is going to SC by way of Flint, MI. She’s supposedly going to be “briefed” about the water situation (by whom is unclear). The reality is that she wants to be seen surrounded by black people as the SC election looms.

Blue has already ceded NH to Bernie. She’s striking national issues for the upcoming primaries. It is the same reason that the drooling Gabbie Giffords is stumping for Blue right now. She’s setting herself up as the more dedicated gun grabber.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2016 at 12:33 PM

Hillary is praising Obama these days to get those voters but at least here in Ga blacks are very christian folks and only supported Obama for the skin and not for his beliefs. Hillary just doesn’t have what she needs to take the black vote in the south. Bernie doesn’t either but at this point there is no candidate in striking range that does. That turn-out won’t be there in the general.

tej on February 5, 2016 at 1:13 PM

Senator. Saw that report too. Wonder if proverbs is smart enough to realize that the world is in its “death spiral” because of policies thay are exactly the same as “the berns” policies????? LOfingL!!! Cant…..stop…..laughing….at…you…..idiots!!!

Indiana Jim on February 5, 2016 at 1:14 PM

The only thing keeping her up actually (besides the icky morally degenerate losers with blind faith “first women” issues) is the hack press.

AprilApple on February 5, 2016 at 1:14 PM

Sanders was supposed to be token opposition, so radical that she looked sane next to him.

Instead he’s pulling her even more insanely left and looks like he might beat her.

ConstantineXI on February 5, 2016 at 12:41 PM

She’s toast.

The question now is do they go into the General with an elderly socialist or do they run out Biden or Kerry at the Convention.

Bottom line, I think everybody knows that whoever gets the Republican nomination will be the next president……unless we manage to destroy ourselves and nominate a terminally damaged person.

The only way we do that is to stop discussing the issues and start destroying each other’s character with a constant rain of bullshat.

.
.

ReaganCajun on February 5, 2016 at 1:16 PM

The two might as well team up and become “one”. I just hope they don’t become another “The One”, if you know what I mean.

Cherokee on February 5, 2016 at 1:09 PM

Maybe that is the result and they are playing this out to see who is P and who is VP. Clinton/Sanders? or Sanders/Clinton?

tej on February 5, 2016 at 1:17 PM

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 12:51 PM

This poll where Hillary is up 2 is a nationwide poll. You’re confusing it with the NH polls where she has never lead in any of them.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:18 PM

Hmmm: Quinnipiac puts national Dem primary at dead heat?

Hmmm, paying attention to a single poll instead of the polling average.

Oh look:
http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/2016-new-hampshire-presidential-democratic-primary

Bernie Sanders 56.6%
Hillary Clinton 37.8%

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 1:22 PM

After Hillary loses New Hampshire she’ll be 0-1-1 in the first two contests. By that time, this “Bernie’s not so bad” polling will have taken hold everywhere, and whatever veneer of inevitability she had will be gone. Then the Dems need to figure how to install Biden as nominee without a total backlash from the Sanders voters. Facing an impending indictment, Hillary bows out for health reasons, avoiding jail time.

HornHiAceDeuce on February 5, 2016 at 1:22 PM

This is a registered voters poll rather than a Likely Voters poll. Bernie does very well among the young who are less likely to turn out. This clearly gives a better appearing result against Hillary who does better with the older voters who are more reliable than a Likely Voter poll would show. Similarly, the GOP does better with likely voters polls than registered voter polls so it may be that Sanders actual results in November may not be as good as this poll suggests they would be.

My thinking is that both Hill and Bernie are vulnerable and it is hard to choose which one is the easier target. It is rather like choosing for dessert between cherry pie and chocolate cake alamode– Can I have both? A Clinton/Sanders or Sanders/Clinton ticket sounds like a target rich environment.

KW64 on February 5, 2016 at 1:24 PM

Senator, Tlaloc—you’re comparing national primary polls to NH polls.

CivilDiscourse on February 5, 2016 at 1:25 PM

ToddPA on February 5, 2016 at 12:48 PM

Wow you are clueless. In Vermont and neighboring New Hampshire where people know Senator Sanders best, they absolutely love him. And when he campaigned in Iowa and voters there got to know him, he quickly caught up with Hillary. So yes, Bernie does best where people know him and his policies the most.

It’s not hard to see that people want a politician that’s not bought and paid for by Wall Street and big business like the usual Democrats and Republicans.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:25 PM

My apologies, you said national polling. I was thinking you meant the outlier ARG poll in NH that showed Hillary and Sanders separated by just 5 points.

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 1:27 PM

I like the cut of proverbs jib. Welcome, fellow Bernie Bro!

libfreeordie on February 5, 2016 at 1:33 PM

I like the cut of proverbs jib. Welcome, fellow Bernie Bro!

libfreeordie on February 5, 2016 at 1:33 PM

I’m pretty sure proverb isn’t into The Bern because he resembles John C. Calhoun.

Here’s a simple question for you. Which of the founding fathers did not subscribe to the communitarian ethos Calhoun deploys to rationalize slavery? *sets sundial*

libfreeordie on August 21, 2013 at 9:30 AM

None. They weren’t nascent Commies like John C. Calhoun, and full blown Commies like you. Don’t you think you need to provide some proof for such a ridiculous smear there Mr. Calhoun? You’re a history perfesser, right?

NotCoach on August 21, 2013 at 9:36 AM

Oh dear God….hold on, give me 10 minutes.

libfreeordie on August 21, 2013 at 9:45 AM

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 1:35 PM

If Sanders can’t wait for the rest of the nation to see his deep plan to raise taxes by a few trillion or so to make everything “free” then he really is insane and so are you.

Bishop on February 5, 2016 at 12:48 PM

Nothing is free but you should try arithmetic. Simple math says if my taxes are raised $5,000 and I stop having to pay insurance premiums of $9,000 then I am better off. The only insane person is you if you don’t know how to add and subtract.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:36 PM

“People also are tired of the redistribution of wealth the corporate class has been doing to the middle class over the last half century and are saying enough is enough.”

You are an odd person- something about the government redistributing wealth- from the progressive tax rate to obamacide to everything else- that just eluded you?

Delusion is apparently not just a river in Egypt.

GrassMudHorsey on February 5, 2016 at 1:38 PM

Indeed, despite having an employee based plan, I pay 4200 annually for insurance. Given that I make under 100,000 a year (like most Americans) it seems unlikely Bernie will raise my taxes enough to overtake those savings.

libfreeordie on February 5, 2016 at 1:39 PM

The more you see of Hillary, the less you want to see of Hillary.

Just so, Packerbronco.

We are in all ways tahrd of this shrewish, brain damaged harpy.

And she’s old. Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooold. Ooooooooooooldie old old. Like she went to kindergarten with Noah old. Like shaking dinosaur dung off her boots old. Like dating Bernie Sanders in high school old.

GrassMudHorsey on February 5, 2016 at 1:41 PM

Nothing is free but you should try arithmetic. Simple math says if my taxes are raised $5,000 and I stop having to pay insurance premiums of $9,000 then I am better off. The only insane person is you if you don’t know how to add and subtract.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:36 PM

And why are your premiums currently $9,000? Forget it, we already know you don’t get it.

http://fiscalfactcheck.crfb.org/analysis-of-the-sanders-single-payer-offsets/

http://taxfoundation.org/article/details-and-analysis-senator-bernie-sanders-s-tax-plan

If The Bern got his way the result would be an even bigger disaster than ObamaCare, and you loons would still call for more government intervention to “fix” the problem.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 1:48 PM

Indeed, despite having an employee based plan, I pay 4200 annually for insurance. Given that I make under 100,000 a year (like most Americans) it seems unlikely Bernie will raise my taxes enough to overtake those savings.

libfreeordie on February 5, 2016 at 1:39 PM

Well in any case, you will lobby for a tuition increase to bilk the students out of more of their money to pay for any offset from new tax proposals.

NWConservative on February 5, 2016 at 1:53 PM

Nothing is free but you should try arithmetic. Simple math says if my taxes are raised $5,000 and I stop having to pay insurance premiums of $9,000 then I am better off. The only insane person is you if you don’t know how to add and subtract.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:36 PM

and when was the last time the federal government took over an industry that service was improved and saved money to the end user without using tax payer money to subsidize losses? I’m stilling looking for the $2500 annual savings the government said I’d get for their last endeavor. I’m sure this is me, my insanity and having learned old math.

IDIOT!!!!

tej on February 5, 2016 at 1:55 PM

The more you see of Hillary, the less you want to see of Hillary.

PackerBronco on February 5, 2016 at 12:45 PM

Was just looking at some Google archival photos of Hillario! taken on April 12, 2015, the day she announced she was running.

Her face has aged at least 20 years since then.

Of course all of the cameras that day studiously only showed her from the waist up (were the photographers under orders to do that? LOL) but I’m willing to hazard a guess that since April of 2015 she’s packed on at least 30 pounds. I saw a recent interview she did with WBZ TV in Boston that did show her from the waist down, and she’s now huge.

In fact, if she were a Republican, the Democrats would call her “Christine Christie”.

But her major failing is pretty much completely the result of what’s come out of her mouth whenever she opens it. Especially when she insists on shouting her speeches instead of simply speaking them. Even Democrat Media kneepad Bob Woodward blasted her for that earlier this week.

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2016 at 1:56 PM

And this recession that has never ended was a government created recession.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:43 PM

That lie has been disproven many many times, NC.

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:02 PM

My apologies, you said national polling. I was thinking you meant the outlier ARG poll in NH that showed Hillary and Sanders separated by just 5 points.

Kenny Bania on February 5, 2016 at 1:27 PM

Take it from a NH resident-ARG “polls” aren’t very good. They never have been. BTW they are based in NH too (Manchester). But that’s never helped them in their “accuracy”.

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2016 at 2:02 PM

Gotta love it!

Bernie’s people chanting:

She’s a liar!

She’s a liar!

She’s a liar!

Neitherleftorright on February 5, 2016 at 2:01 PM

Neitherleftorright on February 5, 2016 at 2:02 PM

Indeed, despite having an employee based plan, I pay 4200 annually for insurance. Given that I make under 100,000 a year (like most Americans) it seems unlikely Bernie will raise my taxes enough to overtake those savings.

libfreeordie on February 5, 2016 at 1:39 PM

You know how they say a sucker is born every minute? Well, you’re a sucker every minute.

When premiums decline y’all are going to be pissed!

libfreeordie on May 7, 2014 at 10:18 AM

You’ll never stop falling for it, will you?

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 2:03 PM

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:36 PM

I think you meant simpleton math.

Neitherleftorright on February 5, 2016 at 2:04 PM

And this recession that has never ended was a government created recession.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:43 PM

That lie has been disproven many many times, NC.

Kenny Bania on February 5, 2016 at 2:02 PM

I’ve been in the real estate mortgage sector for almost 40 years now, and NC is not lying. And your simply jumping up and down and saying that NC is lying-without any proof-is Comedy Gold, but nothing more.

F-

Now, please prove both of us are lying, with credible and multi-sourced cites, and we’ll be willing to listen. Are you going to quote Pauline Krugman?

(Starts 20 acre field of Snowdials)

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2016 at 2:06 PM

And this recession that has never ended was a government created recession.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 12:43 PM

That lie has been disproven many many times, NC.

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:02 PM

I’ll link the following, but we already know you’re too stupid to understand. The obvious escapes you at every turn.

Government Created the Housing Bubble and Financial Crisis — and Could Be Doing So Again

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 2:06 PM

Bishop on February 5, 2016 at 12:48 PM

Pay no attention to pro verbs. A recent college graduate and victim of higher education indoctrination.

Neitherleftorright on February 5, 2016 at 2:07 PM

Everone together…

SHE’S – A – LI – AR!

Deafdog on February 5, 2016 at 2:08 PM

yep, my bad, the Q poll was a national poll, so Bernie is still way ahead in NH

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 2:09 PM

yep, my bad, the Q poll was a national poll, so Bernie is still way ahead in NH

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 2:09 PM

Did you notice that Trump is up 3 points since their last poll? :)

But the PPP one is the one we are all supposed to believe apparently by those who suddenly now believe the polls are correct.

NWConservative on February 5, 2016 at 2:17 PM

Take it from a NH resident-ARG “polls” aren’t very good. They never have been. BTW they are based in NH too (Manchester). But that’s never helped them in their “accuracy”.

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2016 at 2:02 PM

Even if they were a stellar pollster if you have one poll that is 20 points off from 4-6 polls conducted at about the same time period you know which one is most likely wrong. Outlier results don’t mean the pollster is bad, statistically they should happen occasionally.

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:21 PM

NWConservative on February 5, 2016 at 2:17 PM

I just hope Trump realizes that he has to spend money on a ground game to get full results.

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 2:24 PM

I just hope Trump realizes that he has to spend money on a ground game to get full results.

Senator Philip Bluster on February 5, 2016 at 2:24 PM

+1000

NWConservative on February 5, 2016 at 2:25 PM

I’ll link the following, but we already know you’re too stupid to understand. The obvious escapes you at every turn.

Government Created the Housing Bubble and Financial Crisis — and Could Be Doing So Again

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 2:06 PM

Again- your argument has been disproven many many times.

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:34 PM

Now, please prove both of us are lying, with credible and multi-sourced cites, and we’ll be willing to listen. Are you going to quote Pauline Krugman?

(Starts 20 acre field of Snowdials)

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2016 at 2:06 PM

Sure let’s go with krugman, we have many choices but since that will annoy you the most-

http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2015/12/paul-krugman-the-big-short-housing-bubbles-and-retold-lies.html

and one non-krugman:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2013/02/13/no-marco-rubio-government-did-not-cause-the-housing-crisis/

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:38 PM

Bernie just has to make Hillary start yelling and cackling a lot – that will lose Hillary 30 points.

albill on February 5, 2016 at 2:45 PM

Again- your argument has been disproven many many times.

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:34 PM

Sure let’s go with krugman…

Tlaloc on February 5, 2016 at 2:38 PM

When an idiot talks nothing is ever proven or disproven.

https://mises.org/library/krugmans-intellectual-waterloo

Also, yeah, movie review. Excellent rebuttal.

http://cafehayek.com/2015/12/who-said-it-2.html

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 2:52 PM

Also, yeah, movie review. Excellent rebuttal.

http://cafehayek.com/2015/12/who-said-it-2.html

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 2:52 PM

Yeah, it’s not the first time The Krug said the complete opposite of something he had previously opined. Won’t be the last, either, sad to say.

The Schaef on February 5, 2016 at 3:07 PM

Yeah, it’s not the first time The Krug said the complete opposite of something he had previously opined. Won’t be the last, either, sad to say.

The Schaef on February 5, 2016 at 3:07 PM

Mensaloc loves him some party-line hacks.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 3:09 PM

Mensaloc loves him some party-line hacks.

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 3:09 PM

Well, the good news is, in saying that the government did not create the housing crisis, it undermines every notion of an “inherited” economy to be blamed on Booooooooosh.

The Schaef on February 5, 2016 at 3:12 PM

I’ve enjoyed the studies that say that the govt induced property crises wasn’t their fault because the mortgage and banking industries went well beyond what the govt desired in the CRA and it’s subsequent updates.

They ignore the activities of Fannie and Freddie, and they ignore the perverse incentives the govt created, initially by both parties, to push home ownership. When you make it law to ignore basic underwriting principles for a certain subset of the population, its going to spread.

No one has disproved that – because it cannot be disproved.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:36 PM

All I can say is that I’ll give it to your side – when you want to believe something on faith, you keep believing it even when you know it really won’t happen – because you watched it not happen in the past and decided to ignore that.

Bern’s plan will do one of two things – raise premiums again, or reduce services. Those are the only options. No others. The rich will, as today, get whatever they choose because they can afford it. The rest of us will be screwed.

I really love the idea that the democrats are working for the working man. Lol! And feel bad that the working man until recently bought it. But of course that is changing.

Now you vote democrat if you aren’t working, or if you are a single mother needing to make sure your sugar daddy (the govt) will take care of you. And then of course the crony capitalist group who will support either, but love the dems stance on social issues that they themselves never believed, but need to feel validated because their kids will think they are square otherwise.

The democrat coalition is shrinking which is why they are getting their clock cleaned in everything except the presidency. I am sure it will change at some point – it ebbs and flows. (Recently conventional wisdom was that the GOP was going to disappear.) But to think they have nominated two people who are ancient white folks – a woman who is a crook, and a self proclaimed socialist who has no way to pay for his plan – and that this is the best they have.

I don’t think either one of them would have a prayer in an unbiased media environment, so we will see. Sanders at least has enthused followers. And therefore more likely to vote. But the minority groups don’t love him very much – and Hillary is a terrible campaigner. Either Biden or Warren would have been better.

Zomcon JEM on February 5, 2016 at 3:17 PM

Via Ace: An Awful Candidate

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 3:32 PM

https://vine.co/v/iJVrLtmE79H

NotCoach on February 5, 2016 at 3:44 PM

I’ll give Tlaloc a little history lesson here.

There has, in fact, been a top-down, governmental command economy that did work… sorta, and for a brief time, in US history.

It was the Utah territory when the Mormon Church ran it as a theocracy. They provided the courts, the executive, and the legislature was practically filled and 100% LDS. Put bluntly, they were the living nightmare for your “Evil Christians among us, ruling everything!” fevered dreams.

Yet they were astonishingly successful, building a civilization out of wilderness, directed by one man-Brigham Young. They did it on a voluntary 10% tithing to the Church in lieu of taxes too.

But even they failed when it came time to implement a communal utopia. And they were the best of the best, the most committed, hardworking, skilled, etc citizens– handpicked for the experiment. Yet they couldn’t pull it off.

Now Tlaloc, you and your side promises that you will succeed where everywhere else it has failed. You posit no solution for human nature; indeed leftists cannot. When they face reality once they achieve power, it always, without fail, leads to the gulags and guillotines.

The only possible hope for a socialist system to work is to fundamentally change human nature. And only Christianity offers any hope of that.

Of course, you reject that… but have no solution. Other than “More brutal government, the better!”

Vanceone on February 5, 2016 at 4:27 PM

According to Special Report, the Draft Biden movement is strring. LOL

Philly on February 5, 2016 at 6:04 PM

Simple math says if my taxes are raised $5,000 and I stop having to pay insurance premiums of $9,000 then I am better off. The only insane person is you if you don’t know how to add and subtract.

proverbs427 on February 5, 2016 at 1:36 PM

Your thesis, then, is:
a) You will receive $4,000 of medical care that nobody has to pay for
b) You are obtaining $4,000 of medical care that you don’t really need
c) Medical costs will be reduced by 45% under single payer
d) Insurance companies are operating on an 80% profit margin

I’m curious how you expect this to work out.

ss396 on February 5, 2016 at 8:38 PM