The racial divide on gun deaths in America
posted at 9:01 pm on December 21, 2015 by Jazz Shaw
Christopher Ingraham at the Washington Post has an interesting factoid to toss out this week regarding gun violence in America. It’s particularly salient in the current political climate since Hillary Clinton keeps slinging around that “30,000 deaths to gun violence” line in her efforts to promote gun grabbing. We’ve already exploded those numbers here, but today we look at a slightly different subset which likely reveals some new factors to consider. What Ingraham is talking about about is the difference in “how different populations experience gun violence.” (Which is really a nicer way of saying how people of different races are being shot.)
The Brookings Institution’s Richard Reeves highlighted one stunning example of this in a recent blog post: Among whites, 77 percent of gun deaths are suicides. But among black Americans, 82 percent of gun deaths are homicides.
This is an important distinction because the growing suicide rate has effectively canceled out the nation’s declining rate of gun-related homicides, resulting in a national gun fatality rate that has been stubbornly stagnant since the late 1990s.
Those are some staggering numbers, but the differences raise a lot of questions. Of all the white people dying by “gun violence” more than three quarters of them are suicides. But among black citizens an even large percentage are homicides. And as we’ve already documented here before, those homicides aren’t evenly divided along racial lines either when it comes to the perpetrators. With the 2014 FBI numbers having been released, we can see that of the 3,021 whites who were killed by guns, 2,488 were killed by other white people. Similarly, among the 2,451 black victims of gun homicides, 2,205 were committed by other black people. (As you’ll note from the graph above, the number killed by “legal intervention” is a barely measurable sliver.)
Perhaps that helps explain this tidbit from the data:
Those different experiences partly explain their divergent views: Whites (61 percent) are nearly twice as likely as blacks (34 percent) to say it’s more important to protect gun rights than to control gun ownership, according to the Pew Research Center.
Across the cultural divide, black citizens are only half as likely to say that it’s important to protect gun rights. Perhaps that’s because their experience has been uniformly worse in that regard. They’re far more likely to be murdered with a gun, and generally it’s by a criminal (not a cop) and disproportionately a black suspect. Unfortunately, we also learned previously that roughly 90% of those guns were either stolen or purchased illegally, not through the legal channels where background checks and others precautions apply.
Just some food for thought this evening.
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#BlackGunpowderMatters
Rix on December 21, 2015 at 9:06 PM
What we have here is too little black control.
VorDaj on December 21, 2015 at 9:07 PM
#BlackShotsMatter
VorDaj on December 21, 2015 at 9:08 PM
#BlackDriversMatter
VorDaj on December 21, 2015 at 9:09 PM
What is wrong with all of you clearly this is a Global Warming issue
Goodie on December 21, 2015 at 9:09 PM
You need to talk to NASA.
RickB on December 21, 2015 at 9:17 PM
Damn. Unusually powerful bars.
Axe on December 21, 2015 at 9:18 PM
Is it important that people who commit suicide do it in one particular way;. i.e. with a gun rather than throwing themselves off a building?
I would assume that people who are desperate enough to put a gun in their mouths wouldn’t be deterred from suicide by the absence of a gun. I recall being told after a friend’s dad suicided that you cannot keep someone from killing themselves, which is why the guilt of the survivors is misplaced.
I would be in favor of breaking these numbers out for clarity’s sake. I don’t know how significant the tool used to commit suicide is, since the gun doesn’t compel one to kill oneself. I suspect that an available gun might be chosen rather than a different way the person sees as less certain or more painful, but it doesn’t really figure in the basic decision to die.
Dolce Far Niente on December 21, 2015 at 9:19 PM
So! We don’t have a gun problem, we have a minority problem.
Old eagle on December 21, 2015 at 9:20 PM
NASA is too busy making sure that Muslims have the opportunity to participate in space exploration.
talkingpoints on December 21, 2015 at 9:22 PM
I’m more than willing to allocate a budget for that, on condition that they all go exploring the universe without the benefit of a space suit.
Rix on December 21, 2015 at 9:25 PM
Boy is NASA stupid, there isn’t even anything up there to blow up, what Muslim in his crazy mind would go there???
oscarwilde on December 21, 2015 at 9:25 PM
Getting rid of guns hasn’t seemed to lower suicide rates in Japan. It’s pure substitution.
There does seem to be an externalization of violence aspect to the racial disparity. A failure in the white community seems to blame himself for his plight and off himself.
A black community member seems to engage in self destructive associations that get them killed. These associations are no doubt varied. Being engaged in the drug trade.For example, having friends or family with sketchy connections or simply living in a depressed neighborhood full of the former.
It would be interesting to see an economical status corrected racial breakdown to see how much of this disparity is a racial construct or a class construct.
nemo on December 21, 2015 at 9:26 PM
What do you know. The same demographic that doesn’t value family units or education.
byepartisan on December 21, 2015 at 9:26 PM
Black criminals have not and will not give up guns because of gun control laws. The only thing they fear is a potential victim with a gun – as they should.
grumpyank on December 21, 2015 at 9:27 PM
Pelosi Schmelosi on December 21, 2015 at 9:28 PM
White America’s problem is Barack Obama.
Black America’s problem is Barack Obama.
The same problem manifests itself in different ways.
JEM on December 21, 2015 at 9:29 PM
Taking suicides (a separate issue) out of the picture… 5400 people died at the hands of guns last year. Some of those homicides were undoubtedly justified, as well.
So how many people are really dying from “gun violence”?
And if you take out the black on black gang crime (largely also unrelated to “gun violence” — violent gang turf wars don’t need guns to be violent), we’re talking about 3,000-4,000 homicides (some justified) a year.
Roughly 31,000 die a year in the US from automobile accidents.
610,000 from heart disease.
580,000 from cancer
etc. etc.
Remind me again why we need to ban guns?
Timin203 on December 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM
America’s problem is not Barack Obama, but 65 million douchenozzles who voted for him.
Rix on December 21, 2015 at 9:35 PM
…and before the availability of Saturday Night Specials the urban culture used cutlery.
So, the obvious solution so as to not offend protected classes is all must now eat caveman style.
viking01 on December 21, 2015 at 9:37 PM
Looks like roughly half of all suicides in the US are committed with a gun.
And yet, the US is in the lower 1/2 of suicide rates per 100,000 in the developed world. We have about 10.1 per 100,000 people. South Korea has 24.7 per 100,000. And yet South Korea has very restrictive gun laws, and very few suicides by gun. Looks like the leading cause of suicide death in South Korea is poisoning by pesticide (!!) which accounts for almost 60% of suicides.
So it seems rate of suicide has no correlation with levels of gun ownership.
Timin203 on December 21, 2015 at 9:38 PM
Now see, that would have been more appetizing than most of the other offerings yesterday. HeII, it could have been chewed on all day. And been quite filling.
Okay, I am too dang tired, and lazy, to look up what percentages blacks and whites are of the population these days, but man, the raw numbers are only 500, or so, more for whites, who I am pretty sure still outnumber blacks by a fair margin.
As I was saying to a gay friend of mine just this weekend who was whining about the current rash of muggings in the main gay section of town; “quit bi*ching about protection, arm yourselves, and take care of the problem yourselves”. I added in some more colorful language, but didn’t think it necessary to repeat here.
It works for any sub group of the population. Make the bad guys fearful instead of fearless.
cozmo on December 21, 2015 at 9:40 PM
And while the numbers and reporting are sketchier, if you take out suicides and just look at homicide to homicide comparisons (with all methods of homicide, not just guns), the US is a little higher then most European countries. Take out black on black gang crime (estimating, say, 1500 deaths a year), and we’re right in the middle of Europe.
Even gun to gun comparisons per 100,000 without suicides and without gang violence puts us “in the pack” with Europe. Despite having much less restrictive gun laws.
I really think there is little correlation between gun ownership and homicide. It all depends on how you message the numbers.
Timin203 on December 21, 2015 at 9:42 PM
Dude, you’re makin’ my head hurt.
cozmo on December 21, 2015 at 9:43 PM
…speaking of guns, anyone read how Doug Gottlieb made a total moron of himself yesterday…??
*facepalm*
Pelosi Schmelosi on December 21, 2015 at 9:48 PM
Wow, I came over to see nonpartisan do his interpretive race dance.
I’ll be back later, I guess.
HornetSting on December 21, 2015 at 9:49 PM
As either Netanyahu or Gutfeld said (snickers), Muslims will be interested in space travel when the Jews colonise the Moon.
Bishbop on December 21, 2015 at 9:53 PM
Since most gun crimes are committed by blacks and since most blacks are Democrats the real solution is to ban gun sales to Democrats. That’s why Democrats are always pushing for gun control – they don’t trust themselves.
FPR on December 21, 2015 at 9:58 PM
Meh, I first heard that back in the 80’s. Could have been Bibi, but I don’t think it was Gutfeld. Might have been Dean Ing.
cozmo on December 21, 2015 at 10:00 PM
RE: Jazz
I think it’s important to point out that most (if not all?) Government housing units , the project’s , do not allow residents to have guns of any kind on their premises. This is what I think is a major driver for minorities in terms of wanting more gun controls put in place, at least in major cities.
What I’d like to see happen is for the NRA to get back to their roots and go into these communities and fight for those law abiding citizens to be able to protect themselves. How can a government agency so blatantly deny 2A rights ?
Von Kleist on December 21, 2015 at 10:01 PM
all that little fairy knows how to do is the pee pee dance, and spout drivel.
arnold ziffel on December 21, 2015 at 10:02 PM
“Racial divide over gun deaths”?
.
How many guns died … and why would there be any racial division over it, anyway?
listens2glenn on December 21, 2015 at 10:27 PM
Speer Gold Dot … always Speer Gold Dot.
And I don’t give a flying fist-f*ck about who’s dying which way by guns anymore. Unless of course, you manage to make me nervous.
M240H on December 21, 2015 at 10:36 PM
.
Oh! … hmmm, … I guess in that case, the homicides never really happened.
Nuttin’ to see here, move along…
listens2glenn on December 21, 2015 at 10:39 PM
Snob.
I still have some Winchester Black Talons stashed. And some Glaser safety slugs.
cozmo on December 21, 2015 at 10:42 PM
Guns show up more often than other types of suicides because with a gun, the outcome is almost always fatal.
Other types that fail are then not classified not even as suicide attempts or anything if possible because the attemptee changes their mind or just doesn’t want the hassle until they can finally get a gun. :)
Buildings can be good too but it’s so hard to get to the top of them these days with the increased terror security.
And believe it or not, anything under 2-3 stories is iffy. Injurious but not a guarantee. As with other methods too. It has to be done right and quickly as too many times the attemptee chickens out and bungles the result.
Guns? You’re flooded with choices that all will work. Gun to temple, gun in mouth, gun to under chin, gun to left breast. Pretty much all work and are fool proof with no changing your mind part way through and calling the EMT’s. Well except for the temple shooters. For some reason people actually miss and wind up losing their hearing and part of their head but no death.
jake1246 on December 21, 2015 at 10:57 PM
Snob? Moi?
M240H on December 21, 2015 at 11:37 PM
Contrary to conventional wisdom suicide by gun does not have the highest probability of success. Hanging does. Once you take that big step you will die 100% of the time versus about 90% of the time for guns. I note that the UK and the US have similar suicide rates. We grab a gun; they grab a rope.
jerryofva on December 21, 2015 at 11:50 PM
If you remove the homicide stats of just 4 cities – Detroit, Chicago, New Orleans and St. Louis – from the homicide states of the US overall, that also puts us down in the pack with Europe and other gun restrictive countries.
And gee, what do those 4 cities have in common?
Anyone?
Anyone?
Bueller?
climbnjump on December 22, 2015 at 12:23 AM
blacklivesdestroymatter
Mr Soames on December 22, 2015 at 12:41 AM
Makes sense I guess. We’ve been reducing the country’s “carbon footprint” over the years and now we’ve got a 70 degree Christmas eve in PA.
We should get those coal mines rolling again, if we ever want to see another white Christmas in PA.
Oxymoron on December 22, 2015 at 12:58 AM
Bumper sticker of the thread.
Self-defense is racially neutral.
you will like this video:
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/12/13/burglars-for-gun-control-humorous-news-video-mocks-second-amendment-haters/
AesopFan on December 22, 2015 at 1:55 AM
.
I’ll second that motion.
Is there some way we can do it retroactively?
listens2glenn on December 22, 2015 at 1:58 AM
I am very interested in this subject, so much so that I wrote this script
http://esnap.net/murder_rate_estimator.htm
esnap on December 22, 2015 at 3:06 AM
Take home message:
Black people hate each other, white people hate themselves.
erewenguy on December 22, 2015 at 6:56 AM
Next time a leftist says “Well *insert-whiter-than-white-country’s-name* only had one shooting since blah-blah-blah”, be sure to whip out this article.
DethMetalCookieMonst on December 22, 2015 at 7:56 AM
This article has 2 errors in the interpretation of the FBI tables.
First, there were not 2,451 black homicide victims, there were 6,095 black homicide victims in 2014.
The 2451 number comes from Table 6 which is only for “single victim/single offender”
The 6095 number comes from Table 1 which includes all circumstances.
Second, even for the 2451 single victim/single offender homicides, not all of these were from firearms.
4thQTR on December 22, 2015 at 8:27 AM
I’d like a little additional information about the statistics. Of the total number of homicides of blacks, how many were committed by whites? And the inverse, how many white homicides were committed by blacks? Since we know the black-on-black homicide rate, that information should be available.
mnixxon on December 22, 2015 at 8:51 AM
Any discussion of gun laws/homicide rates that don’t involve race are useless.
Libs like to compare the USA to homogeneous white nations, for a variety of matters (violence, education, health care). But when you make them face the truth, that the USA, with its millions of gun owners – is a safe place… well, outside of minority areas. White America is about as safe as Belgium.
The DOJ and FBI even list Mezito (Amerindian) crime stats as being “white” to try and lower the gap. At the margins, guns make mass killings more effective, but they still happen in nations like France and Norway at a higher rate per capita.
So actually, what you and I would consider “white” America, is probably safer than Belgium.
Don’t be afraid of some soft, weak lib calling you a raaaacist for pointing this out. It totally destroys their failed narrative.
spec_ops_mateo on December 22, 2015 at 9:47 AM
Sooooo….white people shoot themselves and black people shoot each other……?
nonstopca1 on December 22, 2015 at 10:22 AM
The suicide rate concerns me not.
Fact is, some people are better off dead.
JackM on December 22, 2015 at 10:44 AM
It’s always nice to hear when a liberal, like Robin Williams, checks himself out.
JackM on December 22, 2015 at 10:49 AM
#blackmarketgunskillblacklives…matter
JackM on December 22, 2015 at 10:51 AM
If Blacks are being killed overwhelmingly by other Blacks using guns acquired illegally, how is “gun-control” going to put any dent in those numbers?
Another Drew on December 22, 2015 at 11:56 AM
Von Kleist on December 21, 2015 at 10:01 PM
Lawyers affiliated with the NRA take these cases all the time, and have won.
Another Drew on December 22, 2015 at 12:04 PM
Hey you – stop looking behind the curtain!!!
dentarthurdent on December 22, 2015 at 4:47 PM
That’s it More white people need to be murdered so there will be racial parity in murder victims…
Kuffar on December 23, 2015 at 12:18 PM
The bit of the graph that intrigued me is the darkest block at the bottom: apparently ‘white’ people are notably more careless than ‘black’ people.
YiZhangZhe on December 29, 2015 at 1:33 PM