NATO ambassadors to Turkey: Why didn’t you just escort that Russian plane out of your airspace?

posted at 4:01 pm on November 24, 2015 by Allahpundit

If you’re worried that Turkey’s going to use Article 5 of NATO to drag the U.S. and other western nations into a hot war with Russia, don’t be. Sounds from this response like NATO will fall apart before anyone goes to the mat for the Turks.

NATO ambassadors called on Ankara to show “cool-headedness” on Tuesday following an emergency meeting in Brussels, after Turkey shot down a Russian warplane near the Syrian border, diplomats said.

Diplomats present at the meeting told Reuters that while none of the 28 NATO envoys defended Russia’s actions, many expressed concern that Turkey did not escort the Russian warplane out of its airspace.

On the one hand, this wasn’t the first violation of Turkish airspace lately by a Russian jet. Erdogan’s complained about it to NATO before; NATO’s secretary-general said last month that the frequency and duration of the intrusions made it hard to believe Russia isn’t doing it purposefully. Turkey got tired of asking Russia nicely to stay out — and asking, and asking, as they reportedly warned the pilots of the jet that was brought down today 10 times in five minutes to scram ASAP. (Did Russia actually violate their airspace today, though? Moscow denies it.) On the other hand, the point of Article 5 obviously isn’t to trigger a regional war because a Russian jet en route to a target in Syria strayed a mile into Turkish territory or whatever it was. The paradigm case for Article 5 is hundreds of Russian tanks rolling towards Warsaw or Berlin, not one jet being a little too cute about Russia’s new hegemony in western Syria. Show of hands: Who thinks Europe’s militaries are going to spring into action after a long hiatus from major wars to enforce the integrity of Turkish airspace to the last inch?

Putin called the shootdown a “stab in the back” by western allies who are supposed to be fighting ISIS with him and warned of “very serious consequences,” but he might be willing to endure one embarrassment without retaliating in the name of avoiding escalation. Would he be willing to endure two, though?

Turkmen forces in Syria shot dead the two pilots of a Russian jet downed by Turkish warplanes near the border with Turkey on Tuesday as they descended with parachutes, a deputy commander of a Turkmen brigade told reporters.

“Both of the pilots were retrieved dead. Our comrades opened fire into the air and they died in the air,” Alpaslan Celik, a deputy commander in a Syrian Turkmen brigade said near the Syrian village of Yamadi as he held what he said was a piece of a pilot’s parachute.

Turkmen are ethnic Turks in Syria who have no association with the state of Turkey, but that’s not the point. The point is that killing the pilots, while they were defenseless on their way to the ground, will make the affront of the jet being shot down sting even more in Russia. And there’s actually yet another incident in Syria today that the Kremlin can use for anti-western propaganda if it wants, and this one’s on video too. Watch the clip below of Syrian rebels using a TOW missile, presumably supplied by Uncle Sam, to take out a Russian-made helicopter being operated by Assad’s army. RT, a Russian house organ, has already picked it up and claimed that not only was the helicopter on a search-and-rescue mission for the downed jet pilots but a Russian marine was killed in the TOW strike. Why this is circulating so widely online, apart from the gee whiz factor, I don’t know; Russia’s been bombing U.S.-allied rebels since they began flying sorties in Syria so it’s not as if America’s allies attacking Russia’s allies is some strange new escalation of the reality on the ground. The proxy war has been raging for weeks. But between the jet blowing up, the pilots being machine-gunned as they fell to earth, and now U.S. weapons being used to undermine the Russian/Syrian “counterterrorist” effort, there’s ample reason to think things will get worse before they get better. I’m just grateful we’ve got Cool Hand Luke in the White House, laying down “red lines” he doesn’t intend to enforce and issuing warnings that Assad must go which he has no means to follow through on, at the helm of this ship at it enters choppy waters.


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a few? they are the clear majority here. the angry response to any mean word said about dear leader vlad here is hilarious.

everdiso on November 24, 2015 at 6:19 PM

The lefts sudden desire to support actions abroad over all politics is hilarious. People like you, killed people I considered brothers and sisters in arms. Now, now you’re disgusted people aren’t playing your game of just wars?

obama has started three wars. Forget all of your teeth gnashing about him inheriting Iraq and Afghanistan. He egged on or directly started armed up-rising in three Middle Eastern countries. All with miserable results. I have as much right as anyone to say we don’t need to be there for his reasons and especially if he’s unwilling to commit in a manner which would see a speedy end to whatever the fv<k he was trying to accomplish.

He is an abysmal failure and this needs to stop before we find ourselves at war with another superpower.

hawkdriver on November 24, 2015 at 9:18 PM

Always with The Bush. When are you going to put it on Huey Long or Gunga Din?

Limerick on November 24, 2015 at 4:17 PM

Did they praise Islam like it was the most wonderful thing ever?

VorDaj on November 24, 2015 at 9:27 PM

No. I’m serious about this. I can see an alliance developing between Putin and Trump.

The DC establishment has an irrational (and antiquated) fear of Putin and Russia. It’s time for our leadership to enter the 21st century and recognize global realities.

davidk on November 24, 2015 at 6:22 PM

CoDominium

Who is John Galt on November 24, 2015 at 9:29 PM

D.L.Mc on November 24, 2015 at 9:06 PM

Savages.

Then again events like MH17’s shootdown and Russia’s reaction are reminders that the Russians don’t fight like gentlemen either. They’re almost as brutal. Just ask the Chechens.

TheGrouch on November 24, 2015 at 9:39 PM

And yet Marco Rubio is demanding a hot war with Russia. He’s completely insane.

TBSchemer on November 24, 2015 at 9:50 PM

@ TheGrouch

Good point.

D.L.Mc on November 24, 2015 at 9:59 PM

They DID escort it out of Turkish airspace.
And into the Syrian ground.
With a missile.

Then, the pilots were senselessly killed while parachuting to the ground.
I’ve little issue with the shoot-down.
But only savages kill a pilot in a parachute.
Must have happened over some Muslim country, I imagine…

orangemtl on November 24, 2015 at 10:16 PM

I dunno. I shot down a bunch of defenseless parachutists the last time I played an arcade video game at Nathan’s. War is war. So I gotta go with the Turkmen guys on this one.

Seth Halpern on November 24, 2015 at 10:18 PM

please.

we were holding fricken military exercises with Russia for a few years until Ukraine elected a pro-NATO president and vladdy freaked.

everdiso on November 24, 2015 at 7:44 PM

As usual you don’t have your facts straight at all. The US and Russia were still holding joint military exercises as late as May 2012 (possibly later)-long after pro-Russian Viktor Yanukovych was elected to lead Ukraine back in 2010.

As I said earlier Yanukovych was pro-Russian, and a fairly elected leader of Ukraine. It was the Obama administration (along with elements of the EU, and quite probably George Soros) who “freaked” and started to back the Euromaidan coup/overthrow of the democratically elected government once Yanukovych rejected the EU association agreement.

Your ahistorical statement above makes no sense, but then again when do you ever make sense, Everdiso?

Dreadnought on November 24, 2015 at 10:18 PM

When has HotAir become home to deluded pro-Putin white nationalists? The great Greek-Russian alliance? Invading Istanbul? Go back to 4chan and Alex Jones.

joana on November 24, 2015 at 5:45 PM

White nationalists? That is a foolishly offensive way to talk.

What exactly did Putin do that I should be wanting to start World War 3 (or is it World War G?)over?

Back in the day trolls were banned for using your kind of rhetoric, but obviously standards here have slipped mightily over the years.

Dreadnought on November 24, 2015 at 10:20 PM

NATO is an anachronism. The idea of defending Turkey against Russia is ridiculous. NATO should have been dismantled years ago.

cimbri on November 24, 2015 at 10:22 PM

https://youtu.be/ZzHme4zIkPQ

Seth Halpern on November 24, 2015 at 10:29 PM

few? they are the clear majority here. the angry response to any mean word said about dear leader vlad here is hilarious.

everdiso on November 24, 2015 at 6:19 PM

The lefts sudden desire to support actions abroad over all politics is hilarious. People like you, killed people I considered brothers and sisters in arms. Now, now you’re disgusted people aren’t playing your game of just wars?

obama has started three wars. Forget all of your teeth gnashing about him inheriting Iraq and Afghanistan. He egged on or directly started armed up-rising in three Middle Eastern countries. All with miserable results. I have as much right as anyone to say we don’t need to be there for his reasons and especially if he’s unwilling to commit in a manner which would see a speedy end to whatever the fv<k he was trying to accomplish.

He is an abysmal failure and this needs to stop before we find ourselves at war with another superpower.

hawkdriver on November 24, 2015 at 9:18 PM

The left is always in favor of wars that go against the best interest of the West. It is one reason there is less and less of the “West” as a cultural/political entity left to defend, although there are certainly many other reasons (the left’s assault on Christianity, and the “progressives'” war against free speech are two more that come to mind).

Dreadnought on November 24, 2015 at 10:30 PM

I have a feeling Russia will celebrate thanksgiving with us this year. they’ll be having a turkey this year.

phatfawzi on November 24, 2015 at 10:32 PM

Wow, these idiots shot them as they parachuted down!?

ebrawer on November 24, 2015 at 10:47 PM

Yes, “bad form” but not unexpected, especially if you’ve been on the business end of some Russian air to surface munitions…

Khun Joe on November 24, 2015 at 10:58 PM

Dreadnought on November 24, 2015 at 10:30 PM

The left uses war for politics and politics only.

hawkdriver on November 24, 2015 at 10:59 PM

ebrawer on November 24, 2015 at 10:47 PM

So the rumor goes right now. If so Hillary’s reset with Russia has been put back about, oh, say 99 years?

I don’t care if you are Mao or Teddy Roosevelt, that is going to go over about as well as chocolate sauce on lobster.

Limerick on November 24, 2015 at 11:01 PM

From the video, it seems that the control box, at least, is of German origin. The German military flag is clearly visible.

OldEnglish on November 24, 2015 at 11:14 PM

Hopefully the Russians drive the Turks out of Constantinople.

K. Hobbit on November 25, 2015 at 12:43 AM

Hopefully the Russians drive the Turks out of Constantinople.

K. Hobbit on November 25, 2015 at 12:43 AM

Please, No, they will be resettled in Detroit on executive order.

V7_Sport on November 25, 2015 at 1:02 AM

I’m just impressed that the Turks managed to shoot anything down.

Dr. ZhivBlago on November 25, 2015 at 3:44 AM

NATO is an anachronism. The idea of defending Turkey against Russia is ridiculous. NATO should have been dismantled years ago.

cimbri on November 24, 2015 at 10:22 PM

Along with the UN.

Old eagle on November 25, 2015 at 5:36 AM

Photo shows Obama and Erdogan doing the secret Muslim Brotherhood handshake…

albill on November 25, 2015 at 6:09 AM

Russian defense minister said the 2nd pilot was rescued and returned to his airbase in Syria but a soldier involved in the search was killed.

Limerick on November 25, 2015 at 6:52 AM

Just as background, most Turks hate Russia. They’ve been on the receiving end of Russia’s efforts to gain a warm-water port since Ivan the Terrible & Catherine the Great.
And they have long memories.

IcePilot on November 25, 2015 at 7:37 AM

Wow, these idiots shot them as they parachuted down!?

ebrawer on November 24, 2015 at 10:47 PM

It’s what the Nazis and Japanese did. You expect less from camelhumpers?

Younggod on November 25, 2015 at 7:38 AM

When has HotAir become home to deluded pro-Putin white nationalists? The great Greek-Russian alliance? Invading Istanbul? Go back to 4chan and Alex Jones.

joana on November 24, 2015 at 5:45 PM

DNS issue?

corona79 on November 25, 2015 at 8:51 AM

These two Russians probably just came back from a missions that killed a bunch of “these idiots”. Wake up and smell the coffee!! We killed thousands of military/civilians during WWII in horrific instances. It’s called war! OMG, do you have a clue? Ignorance abounds on this post. LOL

whsiii on November 25, 2015 at 9:06 AM

As usual you don’t have your facts straight at all. The US and Russia were still holding joint military exercises as late as May 2012 (possibly later)-long after pro-Russian Viktor Yanukovych was elected to lead Ukraine back in 2010.

As I said earlier Yanukovych was pro-Russian, and a fairly elected leader of Ukraine. It was the Obama administration (along with elements of the EU, and quite probably George Soros) who “freaked” and started to back the Euromaidan coup/overthrow of the democratically elected government once Yanukovych rejected the EU association agreement.

Your ahistorical statement above makes no sense, but then again when do you ever make sense, Everdiso?

Dreadnought on November 24, 2015 at 10:18 PM

hilarious.

now we’re getting plain spoken russian propaganda right here in hot air threads. are you part of vladdy’s internet message board force?

amazing.

Yanukovich the putin patsy won a fake election (for the 2nd time), imprisoned the opposition party, and reneged on his election promises and tried to stop the ukraine-nato agreement….and was duly impeached for it. Putin freaked and invaded and STILL wasn’t able to stop the will of the people.

and that’s when the joint military exercises stopped.

everdiso on November 25, 2015 at 11:19 AM

NATO is an anachronism. The idea of defending Turkey against Russia is ridiculous. NATO should have been dismantled years ago.

cimbri on November 24, 2015 at 10:22 PM

Mighty putin just backed down from that anachronism like a good little kitten.

everdiso on November 25, 2015 at 11:21 AM

Time to trade Turkey for Russia in NATO

When Turkey joined NATO in February 1952, there seemed to be a purpose to the expansion into traditionally Islamic territory. Proponents of Turkey’s membership argued that the West needed this country as an ally to prevent Soviet expansion in the region. But this was a deal with the devil.

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2015/11/time_to_trade_turkey_for_russia_in_nato.html

davidk on November 25, 2015 at 11:31 AM

NATO survived Cold War, but downed Russian fighter provides biggest threat

Putin has been trying to undermine the unity of NATO for years. Whether it’s been Russian planes flying in Baltic airspace, aging bombers buzzing the coast of Britain, the destabilization of Ukraine and the annexation of Crimea, he has needled NATO, testing its resolve and probing for division.

http://tinyurl.com/ndpen5z

davidk on November 25, 2015 at 11:34 AM

I wonder what Everdso thought of all the civilian deaths during WW2 caused y the Army air force in Europe and Japan? Unfortunately during wars people get killed and things get broken. I just thought it was bizarre that just because civilians get killed than you are branded a war criminal. Everdisco never and the president as well never seem to mind all the Christians and others being crucified, drowned, beheaded by these extreme muslims. They never mention it and yes I call them muslims because I believe it when they say that they are muslims themselves.

garydt on November 25, 2015 at 11:38 AM

Putin sends air-defense missiles to Syria to deter Turkey

Putin has dismissed Turkey’s claim that the Russian warplane intruded its airspace, voicing particular annoyance about Ankara turning to NATO instead of speaking to Russia, as if it were us who shot down a Turkish plane. 

http://www.jsonline.com/news/usandworld/national/russian-pilot-rescued-by-syrian-commando-unit-mjsurnpublicidaporg8b8a115a3b124dc7b7bedc51d31a63e3-353534131.html

davidk on November 25, 2015 at 11:38 AM

It’s not smart to poke a bear with a stick.

davidk on November 25, 2015 at 11:39 AM

Russia bombards Syrian rebels near site of downed Russian jet

Reuters – 3 hours ago

Russian forces launched a heavy bombardment against insurgent-held areas in Syria’s Latakia province on Wednesday, near where a Russian warplane had been shot down by Turkey the day before, rebels and a monitoring group said.

At least 12 air strikes hit Latakia’s northern countryside as pro-government forces clashed with fighters from al Qaeda’s Nusra Front and Turkmen insurgents in the Jabal Akrad and Jabal Turkman areas, the British-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said.

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/russia-bombards-syrian-rebels-near-downed-russian-jet-122428258.html

davidk on November 25, 2015 at 11:40 AM

NATO is an anachronism. The idea of defending Turkey against Russia is ridiculous. NATO should have been dismantled years ago.

cimbri on November 24, 2015 at 10:22 PM

Along with the UN.

Old eagle on November 25, 2015 at 5:36 AM

Agreed. Turkey, Russia, Syria, Iraq, ISIS… let them fight amongst themselves. We have no friends there, and none of these forces pose an existential threat to us.

TBSchemer on November 25, 2015 at 11:48 AM

If obama is so tuff why did he dismantle all the defensive missiles in Eastern Europe at Putin’s request? They should have stayed there for their protection against the Russian bear. They were only for defensive purpose anyway. Was Obama chicken to stand up to Putin?

garydt on November 25, 2015 at 11:50 AM

I wonder what Everdso thought of all the civilian deaths during WW2 caused y the Army air force in Europe and Japan? Unfortunately during wars people get killed and things get broken. I just thought it was bizarre that just because civilians get killed than you are branded a war criminal. Everdisco never and the president as well never seem to mind all the Christians and others being crucified, drowned, beheaded by these extreme muslims. They never mention it and yes I call them muslims because I believe it when they say that they are muslims themselves.

garydt on November 25, 2015 at 11:38 AM

This is why our military forces should never be deployed without a clear declaration of war. If the threat is truly existential, then we can get a real declaration of war, and we will do whatever it takes to win. But anything short of that, and we run into these moral ambiguities about killing civilians.

TBSchemer on November 25, 2015 at 11:58 AM

True Schemer, but obama still never is bothered by Jews and Christians are being killed by these muzzie extremists. Hell he never mentioned that poor woman who was beheaded in Oklahoma last year. He only worries about the muzzie deaths here and over there.

garydt on November 25, 2015 at 12:02 PM

CoDominium

Who is John Galt on November 24, 2015 at 9:29 PM

Interesting. Thanks.

davidk on November 25, 2015 at 12:24 PM

As usual you don’t have your facts straight at all. The US and Russia were still holding joint military exercises as late as May 2012 (possibly later)-long after pro-Russian Viktor Yanukovych was elected to lead Ukraine back in 2010.

As I said earlier Yanukovych was pro-Russian, and a fairly elected leader of Ukraine. It was the Obama administration (along with elements of the EU, and quite probably George Soros) who “freaked” and started to back the Euromaidan coup/overthrow of the democratically elected government once Yanukovych rejected the EU association agreement.

Your ahistorical statement above makes no sense, but then again when do you ever make sense, Everdiso?

Dreadnought on November 24, 2015 at 10:18 PM

hilarious.

now we’re getting plain spoken russian propaganda right here in hot air threads. are you part of vladdy’s internet message board force?

amazing.

Yanukovich the putin patsy won a fake election (for the 2nd time), imprisoned the opposition party, and reneged on his election promises and tried to stop the ukraine-nato agreement….and was duly impeached for it. Putin freaked and invaded and STILL wasn’t able to stop the will of the people.

and that’s when the joint military exercises stopped.

everdiso on November 25, 2015 at 11:19 AM

This is your second try and you still don’t have your facts straight-if your not familiar with the material-you really ought to do some research

Yanukovich the putin patsy won a fake election (for the 2nd time)

Yanukovych only was elected President once (2010). There were never any creditable accusations that the election was “fake”, rigged or otherwise unfair, and was in fact certified by the Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/feb/08/viktor-yanukovych-ukraine-president-election

Is the UK paper the Guardian and the OSCE also “part of vladdy’s internet message board force?”

tried to stop the ukraine-nato agreement

There was no “ukraine-nato” agreement to stop-there was the EU Association Agreement, a possible early/first step toward Ukraine joining the EU-but it had nothing to do with NATO, and was basically a trade agreement which Yanukovych refused to sign, which was fully within his rights as President.

and was duly impeached for it.

Yanukovych was never impeached-he fled once the violence of the coup caused him to fear for his life.

Putin freaked and invaded and STILL wasn’t able to stop the will of the people.

Will of the people? 6 1/2 million people in the Donbass and other regions were excluded from the vote. How many civilians has the Ukrainian government and paramilitaries killed in the Donbass, Odessa, and other regions of the Ukraine?

And if the governent of Ukraine is executing the will of the people, why are they have such a hard time finding recruits for their military forces?

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/ukraine/personnel.htm
http://europe.newsweek.com/ukraine-armed-forces-set-call-female-citizens-aged-20-50-new-recruitment-cycle-304276

You still don’t have your facts straight, Everdiso. No surprise.

Dreadnought on November 25, 2015 at 4:23 PM

Turkey got tired of asking Russia nicely to stay out — and asking, and asking, as they reportedly warned the pilots of the jet that was brought down today 10 times in five minutes to scram ASAP

Turkey alleges that, but the Russian pilot said they got no warning

mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/russian-jet-pilot-says-were-6898879

Further, the US normally requires a country get the OK from us, to use one of our US supplied F-16’s to attack

“Some members of the coalition, including those providing their combat planes for strikes against Iraq and Syria have confided to us the planes involved were of US manufacture and the Americans normally request US permission for such operations,” Lavrov said. “As far as I understand, our plane was downed by a US-made F-16. It remains to be seen whether the US requirement is applicable to Turkey, and if it is, I would like to know if Turkey had asked the United States for permission to send its planes on a combat mission and to shoot down a plane, albeit probably an identified one, over Syrian territory. – Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov

tass.ru/en/politics/839164

Related to such requests, our military maintains satellite coverage of hot spots, and normally such permission would be contingent on a verification from US intelligence

He [Lavrov] pointed out that Turkish planes violate Greece’s airspace some 1,500 times a year.

Meanwhile, Obama attends a meeting on trivia, and acts cool and unsurprised by the news from Syria.

“Yesterday’s attack by the Turkish Air Force against a Russian aircraft shows the situation with illegal oil trade and the underground oil industry which the IS has created in its territory in a new light. Yesterday’s incident happened after Russian warplanes had started delivering quite effective and targeted strikes against those tank trucks and oil fields,” Lavrov said.

The son of the leader of Turkey is profiting from the oil transports from ISIS, giving Turkey incentive to protect the oil depots which were the targets of the RU attacks.

I wouldnt be surprised oif this profiteering was encouraged by Obama, to protect and preserve ISIS

This smells like the same setup in the shootdown of Malaysian Flight 17 in Ukraine, which was blamed on Russia, despite the fact the plane was re routed by western Ukrainian air traffic control 100 miles off course into the Eastern Ukraine shoot down war zone that was being avoided by commercial aircraft, and the analysis of the wreckage was buried by the MSM

IMHO the US is trying to instigate at least a war mood against Russia with the American public to cover it’s own political nation building and to shift any oil balance of power off Russia

entagor on November 25, 2015 at 4:28 PM

Yup .. Pooty’s paid trolls have started barfing here.

corona79 on November 25, 2015 at 5:03 PM

Yup .. Pooty’s paid trolls have started barfing here.

corona79 on November 25, 2015 at 5:03 PM

Yeah that must be it. Putin planted me on Hotair 8 years ago. The man is brilliant.

Keep drinking that Soros Kool-Aid. Transnational flavor! Yum.

Dreadnought on November 25, 2015 at 11:34 PM

none of these forces pose an existential threat to us

TBSchemer on November 25, 2015 at 11:48 AM

The only existential threat to you is the Orkin man.

Younggod on November 26, 2015 at 5:15 AM

The question of escorting intruder aircraft out is ridiculous. That’s the way Euros and their wanna-bees Obama and Kerry react.

The Turks did warn them the first dozen (?) times the provocation occurred. Why are they then obliged to lead them back to the border by the hand?! They had to draw the line somewhere, or in effect acquiesce to repeated violation of their airspace – exactly what the Russians wanted to establish as a fait accompli, and then move on to the next level of intimidation. It’s what they do.

If you let bullies get away with their bullying, you simply get more of it. True, if you hit them back, you may also get more of it, but at least you get the satisfaction of bloodying their nose for something that was going happen anyway no matter what you did – except surrender.

I’d like to think Obama is taking note of this, but somehow I think if he was an adept learner, his college records would be in a glass case in the Smithsonian, instead of in a vault.

Ray Van Dune on November 26, 2015 at 2:13 PM

10-05-14 Harvard, Biden spoke of Turkey pouring hundreds of millions into Syria that went to al Nusra and al qaeda. Biden had to retract and apologize
thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/10/05/vp-biden-apologizes-for-telling-truth-about-turkey-saudi-and-isis.html

Russia is cutting off the head of the chicken

zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-25/meet-man-who-funds-isis-bilal-erdogan-son-turkeys-president

Bilal Erdogan owns several maritime companies. He has allegedly signed contracts with European operating companies to carry Iraqi stolen oil to different Asian countries. The Turkish government buys Iraqi plundered oil which is being produced from the Iraqi seized oil wells. Bilal Erdogan’s maritime companies own special wharfs in Beirut and Ceyhan ports that are transporting ISIS’ smuggled crude oil in Japan-bound oil tankers.

In addition to son Bilal’s illegal and lucrative oil trading for ISIS, Sümeyye Erdogan, the daughter of the Turkish President apparently runs a secret hospital camp inside Turkey just over the Syrian border where Turkish army trucks daily being in scores of wounded ISIS Jihadists to be patched up and sent back to wage the bloody Jihad in Syria, according to the testimony of a nurse who was recruited to work there until it was discovered she was a member of the Alawite branch of Islam, the same as Syrian President Bashar al-Assad who Erdogan seems hell-bent on toppling

According to French geopolitical analyst, Thierry Meyssan, Recep Erdogan “organised the pillage of Syria, dismantled all the factories in Aleppo, the economic capital, and stole the machine-tools. Similarly, he organised the theft of archeological treasures and set up an international market in Antioch…with the help of General Benoît Puga, Chief of Staff for the Elysée, he organised a false-flag operation intended to provoke the launching of a war by the Atlantic Alliance – the chemical bombing of la Ghoutta in Damascus, in August 2013. “

Meyssan claims that the Syria strategy of Erdo?an was initially secretly developed in coordination with former French Foreign Minister Alain Juppé and Erdogan’s then Foreign Minister Ahmet Davuto?lu, in 2011, after Juppe won a hesitant Erdogan to the idea of supporting the attack on traditional Turkish ally Syria in return for a promise of French support for Turkish membership in the EU. France later backed out, leaving Erdogan to continue the Syrian bloodbath largely on his own using ISIS.

The Russian jet was shot down over Syrian territory:

Gen. John R. Allen, an opponent of Obama’s Iran peace strategy, now US diplomatic envoy coordinating the coalition against the Islamic State, exceeded his authorized role after meeting with Erdogan and “promised to create a “no-fly zone” ninety miles wide, over Syrian territory, along the whole border with Turkey, supposedly intended to help Syrian refugees fleeing from their government, but in reality to apply the “Juppé-Wright plan”
zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-25/meet-man-who-funds-isis-bilal-erdogan-son-turkeys-president

The Russians were attacking oil transfer depots in Syria within the ‘no fly zone’ that protects Turkish profiteering and is the launching zone for ISIS attacks

Obama has acted consistently to protect ISIS. I would not put it past that he approved or gave coordinates for this attack based on his strange public lack of interest in the operation.

entagor on November 26, 2015 at 3:55 PM

Putin must learn that after his forceful “annexation” of his neighbors’ territory, the rest of the world is much less likely to give Russia the benefit of doubt or look the other way when his forces make intrusions into their national territory.

RJL on November 26, 2015 at 4:07 PM

Putin must learn that after his forceful “annexation” of his neighbors’ territory, the rest of the world is much less likely to give Russia the benefit of doubt or look the other way when his forces make intrusions into their national territory.

RJL on November 26, 2015 at 4:07 PM

Ayeah; the Ukrainian intrusion showed the world what a sad state the Bear’s conventional military was in.

Now Pooty knows that NATO, especially economically weakened by the money-draining disaster that is the EU, is almost entirely a paper tiger short of the USA and we don’t have the will or a reason to take him head-on. But even so he physically CANNOT stage an all-out conflict with Turkey even if no NATO member provided any support whatsoever – the supply lines are too long and the running costs too high for his Communist-ravaged economy.

I’m intrigued by all the support for Russia kicking Turkey’s arse, and I have to say I’d cheer them evicting the savages from Constantinople after so many centuries, but let’s both be careful what we wish for and keep in mind how likely it is to happen.

LawfulGood on November 27, 2015 at 10:06 PM

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