Family friend tells WaPo: Yes, Darren Wilson did suffer an eye socket fracture

posted at 2:01 pm on August 22, 2014 by Allahpundit

Jim Hoft and Fox News say he did, CNN says he didn’t, and now here’s WaPo saying yep, he did.

Your move, New York Times.

The signs of easing tensions came as a family friend of the officer who fatally shot Brown came forward to offer a version of the incident with new details, saying that the officer suffered a fracture to his eye socket in a scuffle with the unarmed teenager before opening fire.

Hospital X-rays of the injury have been taken and will be shared with a grand jury that is weighing evidence to determine whether Officer Darren Wilson should be charged in the shooting, said the friend, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of fear of threats. The friend has been in contact with Wilson’s family members…

In his account to close confidants, Wilson has repeatedly said he thought Brown was acting erratically when they had an altercation on a street in a garden apartment complex in Ferguson. He said that Brown was coming at him when he fired the fatal shots.

“Darren was adamant that he believed Michael Brown had some drugs in his system,” the friend said.

The DA’s office says Wilson will be invited to appear before the grand jury but they admit that they haven’t interviewed him. Whether that’s because Wilson doesn’t want to talk to them (yet) or because they feel they don’t need to talk to him before seeking an indictment is unclear.

Over at NRO, Charles Cooke wonders: What if we’ve already seen all of the relevant prosecution evidence in the Brown shooting? Is there any way that the D.A. gets a conviction here? According to the Times, “many” witnesses agree that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson while Wilson was still in his squad car. They also agree that Wilson’s gun discharged before he got out, that Brown started running, that Wilson fired at him while Brown’s back was to him, and that Brown finally stopped and turned to face him. They disagree on what happened after that. Some say Brown advanced towards Wilson, others say he stayed put. Maybe the state can do something with forensics to show whether Brown was moving forward when he was hit, but if not, it’ll be a test of credibility between the prosecution’s witnesses and the defense’s. And it’s a heavy lift to get from there to “beyond a reasonable doubt,” especially if Wilson has medical records showing that Brown had already hit him hard enough to break bone. Once you produce some evidence to show justifiable homicide, the burden falls on the prosecution to disprove it. Unless the jury decides that there’s simply no plausible scenario in which an armed man reasonably needs to use lethal force to repel an attack from a man who’s unarmed, the D.A. will have trouble.

Makes me wonder if maybe the state will zero in on Wilson shooting at Brown’s back while he was fleeing and try to get some sort of conviction out of that. That would be awfully tricky — it would be bizarre for Wilson to be acquitted of murder on self-defense grounds but convicted on attempted murder or negligence grounds for the shots he fired just moments before the fatal shots. If the first shots at Brown’s back were criminal, didn’t Brown then have a self-defense right of his own to try to disarm Wilson? If he was acting in his own self-defense, how can Wilson claim self-defense on the shots that ended up killing Brown?


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Please, would someone at the police department clear this up?

SC.Charlie on August 22, 2014 at 2:04 PM

Put his eye on trial…

right2bright on August 22, 2014 at 2:04 PM

Is there any way that the D.A. gets a conviction here?

Sure, by choosing people for the jury similar to the makeup of the grand jury which indicted Governor Perry.

Bishop on August 22, 2014 at 2:06 PM

Um,…is there any images, to confirm this,
jus say’n!!

canopfor on August 22, 2014 at 2:06 PM

CNN says he didn’t,

Who are you going to believe, CNN or your lying eyes?

Unless the jury decides that there’s simply no plausible scenario in which an armed man reasonably needs to use lethal force to repel an attack from a man who’s unarmed, the D.A. will have trouble.

A gun is not a magic force field which blocks all punches. If Wilson wasn’t going to fire, all Brown needed to do was walk up and grab the gun. That’s been known to happen.

rbj on August 22, 2014 at 2:07 PM

Just a random thought re: Ferguson …

How about we wait for FACTS and STOP this “many witnesses agree” and “a friend said” which are only serving to keep fanning the flames?

Hmmmmmmmmmm?

Whatcha think?

PolAgnostic on August 22, 2014 at 2:08 PM

Put his eye on trial…

right2bright on August 22, 2014 at 2:04 PM

You only think you’re joking.

gryphon202 on August 22, 2014 at 2:10 PM

Looks like CNN is using this as an opportunity to get MSNBC’s moonbat viewers.

sentinelrules on August 22, 2014 at 2:10 PM

Just a random thought re: Ferguson …

How about we wait for FACTS and STOP this “many witnesses agree” and “a friend said” which are only serving to keep fanning the flames?

Hmmmmmmmmmm?

Whatcha think?

PolAgnostic on August 22, 2014 at 2:08 PM

I’m all for it. But as things now stand, if I were serving on a jury with the evidence at-hand, the conflicting stories would certainly constitute reasonable doubt to me as to whether Wilson is guilty of a crime at all.

gryphon202 on August 22, 2014 at 2:11 PM

From what I’ve read, I don’t think it’s at all clear that Wilson shot at Brown while he was running away, but maybe I missed something. Someone saw Brown running, and heard a shot, but it’s not clear whether he heard the shot before Brown came into view, whether the shot was the one fired in the car, or if Wilson fired a warning shot into the air. Is that something police do? I don’t know if that’s standard procedure. Granted, all I know is what I read in the papers, and we know how accurate that is, but I haven’t seen a witness account that actually saw Wilson shooting at Brown’s back while he was running. Unless you count Johnson, which I don’t, I don’t believe he’s credible. Most of what he said has been disproven by the autopsy results and other witnesses.

mbs on August 22, 2014 at 2:11 PM

Man, you’re reaching AP.

Vince on August 22, 2014 at 2:12 PM

The riots will be similar to the Rodney King and Watts Riots when the grand jury elects to not indict this officer for acting fully within the scope and parameters of his sworn duty.

The gangstas in Ferguson won’t care. They’ll be stoked by Rev. Al, Jesse, Holder, the Dog Eater and every other race hustling African American malcontent.

I wouldn’t want to be a business owner anywhere near that shell of a town, that’s for certain…

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:13 PM

If Wilson wasn’t going to fire, all Brown needed to do was walk up and grab the gun. That’s been known to happen.

rbj on August 22, 2014 at 2:07 PM

Considering the possibility that Brown had already tried to take the officers weapon in the car scuffle, Wilson probably wasn’t going to give him another chance.

BacaDog on August 22, 2014 at 2:13 PM

And it’s a heavy lift to get from there to “beyond a reasonable doubt,” especially if Wilson has medical records showing that Brown had already hit him hard enough to break bone.

So stop with all the he said/she said garbage and wait for the facts to be dispersed. I know, I know. All you media types can’t help yourselves.

conservative pilgrim on August 22, 2014 at 2:13 PM

Americans die every single day. Is Obama supposed to only mourn the ones killed by ISIS? What you want is for Obama to show solemnity to the hurt Foley’s death has on our national power. That they felt confident publicly executing an American is something the hawks want to prevent, not because they care about James Foley, but because they care about how big the rest of the nation believes our fly pole is. Be nice if folks could admit that instead of making themselves look dumb by acting like Obama’s supposed to grieve for every single American who dies. Screw Brown, Trayvon and the kid in UT.

libfreeordie on August 22, 2014 at 12:14 PM

Schadenfreude on August 22, 2014 at 2:14 PM

Makes me wonder if maybe the state will zero in on Wilson shooting at Brown’s back while he was fleeing and try to get some sort of conviction out of that. That would be awfully tricky — it would be bizarre for Wilson to be acquitted of murder on self-defense grounds but convicted on attempted murder or negligence grounds for the shots he fired just moments before the fatal shots. If the first shots at Brown’s back were criminal, didn’t Brown then have a self-defense right of his own to try to disarm Wilson? If he was acting in his own self-defense, how can Wilson claim self-defense on the shots that ended up killing Brown?

*facepalm*

Sweet merciful Moses.

Is there any way that the D.A. gets a conviction here?

Sure, by choosing people for the jury similar to the makeup of the grand jury which indicted Governor Perry.

Bishop on August 22, 2014 at 2:06 PM

Or similar to the makeup of bloggers who seem to wish they were writing incredibly clever crime fiction novels instead.

Midas on August 22, 2014 at 2:14 PM

Sure, by choosing people for the jury similar to the makeup of the grand jury which indicted Governor Perry.

Bishop on August 22, 2014 at 2:06 PM

It’s a big long honkin’ way between indictment, and conviction.

Especially when any defense attorney worth his salt is going to get a change of venue as far away from STL as possible…

JohnGalt23 on August 22, 2014 at 2:14 PM

But that CNN reporter was so excited to report that the story was false. He even went so far as to say a rumor about an X-ray proves there was no bruising! Journalism.

forest on August 22, 2014 at 2:15 PM

Where is that off camera conversation where the guy says that Brown was running at the cop. He says that the cop was missing not realizing, I guess, that the officer was hitting him in the arm.

Vince on August 22, 2014 at 2:15 PM

Americans die every single day. Is Obama supposed to only mourn the ones killed by ISIS? What you want is for Obama to show solemnity to the hurt Foley’s death has on our national power. That they felt confident publicly executing an American is something the hawks want to prevent, not because they care about James Foley, but because they care about how big the rest of the nation believes our fly pole is. Be nice if folks could admit that instead of making themselves look dumb by acting like Obama’s supposed to grieve for every single American who dies.

libfreeordie on August 22, 2014 at 12:14 PM

Screw Brown, Trayvon and the kid in UT.

Schadenfreude on August 22, 2014 at 2:15 PM

Also, I actually think the police have a good point about not releasing evidence to the press before the grand jury. One, they should wait until the investigation is complete. Two, it’s always better from a legal standpoint not to reveal your case until you get in front of the jury. May not be the best idea from a public relations standpoint, and you have to consider whether releasing information might influence the jury pool to your advantage, but not releasing the info is still a sound strategy, imo.

mbs on August 22, 2014 at 2:15 PM

So you can assault a cop, try to wrestle away his gun then attempt to charge at him when he tells you to stop and he can’t shoot you in self defense as long as you don’t give him an eye socket fracture?

iceman1960 on August 22, 2014 at 2:15 PM

I’m just wondering which scenario will fire up the natives the worst in Ferguson. A celebratory guilty verdict for Wilson or a “We ain’t got no justice!” not guilty verdict. I say the difference isn’t the thickness of a sheet of NYT paper.

Deano1952 on August 22, 2014 at 2:16 PM

Maybe the state can do something with forensics to show whether Brown was moving forward when he was hit,

You’d think that would be easy…blood trail…

But maybe not.

BigWyo on August 22, 2014 at 2:16 PM

Game Changer III

portlandon on August 22, 2014 at 2:17 PM

I think Dorian Johnson’s accounting of this incident was the best…..

Realdemocrat1 on August 22, 2014 at 2:19 PM

Irrelevant . . . . . Michael Brown struck Officer Wilson through the car window, then turned to walk away.

When Officer Wilson exited the vehicle, while calling for Michael Brown to STOP/HALT/(something), did Michael Brown turn and come back at Officer Wilson, determined to continue the assault ?

Michael Brown’s status being ‘unarmed’ is IRRELEVANT . . . . . IF … he was determined to continue a ‘bare-knuckled’ assault on Officer Wilson, then he (Michael Brown) had effectively FORFEITED his right to exist, live, and breathe, on the-face-of-the-earth.
BUT … was he “determined to continue a ‘bare-knuckled’ assault on Officer Wilson”?

Okay trolls … have at it.

listens2glenn on August 22, 2014 at 2:19 PM

We need to get a DNA test on that eye, make sure it’s really his.

Oxymoron on August 22, 2014 at 2:19 PM

If the first shots at Brown’s back were criminal, didn’t Brown then have a self-defense right of his own to try to disarm Wilson? If he was acting in his own self-defense, how can Wilson claim self-defense on the shots that ended up killing Brown?

Since we now are engaging in wild and nonsensical speculation perhaps the first shot while Brown was fleeing was a warning shot to get him to stop running?

And would it make sense for an officer to allow an individual to getaway who had just had an altercation inside the officer’s car where the officer suffered a possible fractured eye socket, swollen face and the gun was discharged presumably from a struggle for control of the gun?

crazywater on August 22, 2014 at 2:20 PM

I think Dorian Johnson’s accounting of this incident was the best…..

Realdemocrat1 on August 22, 2014 at 2:19 PM

.
His first account, or the second account ?

listens2glenn on August 22, 2014 at 2:21 PM

I wouldn’t want to be a business owner anywhere near that shell of a town, that’s for certain…

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:13 PM

I wonder why there are any businesses in that neighborhood to start with, unless Quick-Trip incorporates robbery and shoplifting into their business model.

“And hey, all you shoplifters….c’mon down to our new MLK parkway location, where we have a wide range of goods to satisfy your every need, and don’t forget to rough up the store manager, Nimrahi, on your way out!”

BobMbx on August 22, 2014 at 2:21 PM

They also agree that Wilson’s gun discharged before he got out, that Brown started running, that Wilson fired at him while Brown’s back was to him, and that Brown finally stopped and turned to face him. They disagree on what happened after that.

Just which “witnesses” agree to that version of events?
Just who said that Wilson fired AT Brown while Brown’s back was to him? The impeccable Johnson?
Is it possible Wilson fired a WARNING shot? That’s a lot different that shooting AT someone as they’re retreating.

AP has really been dropping the ball an awful lot on this whole thing.

Saverio on August 22, 2014 at 2:21 PM

…a scuffle with the unarmed teenager…

When a broken face is involved, I don’t think “scuffle”.

“unarmed” – The fists of a berserking 300lb man are pretty good weapons.

“teenager” – he was an 18 year old man. Stop implying he was a “boy” you racists.

forest on August 22, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Can someone please help me answer a question that I am unable to resolve myself?

We are led to believe that Officer Wilson was firing repeatedly at the back of Brown, although we all know that no wounds were suffered in the man’s back.

How many rounds in total did Officer Wilson discharge? I know of the one in the car and the 6 that hit Brown. That makes 7. Anyone know how many misses? What was the mag capacity and how many, if any, remained in the magazine?

Seems like this could shed some light upon when the officer began shooting and how accurate he was with his eye injury, and whether or not he actually DID shoot at the guy as he ran away.

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM

I’m still trying to untwist that last paragraph….be back later.

d1carter on August 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM

OT, but no where else to ask:

Judge Emmet Sullivan of U.S. District Court in Washington is seeking answers on four different fronts, including what efforts the IRS made to recover Lerner’s lost emails from alternate sources like an iPhone or Blackberry.

Sullivan gave the IRS just over a week – until Aug. 22 – to supply those answers, as part of a lawsuit filed by a conservative watchdog, Judicial Watch, seeking Lerner’s emails through a freedom of information lawsuit.

– The Hill

I believe that response was due today – Aug 22. Anyone heard anything about this, or is it just going to go down the memory hole, like so much else?

bofh on August 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM

Unless the jury decides that there’s simply no plausible scenario in which an armed man reasonably needs to use lethal force to repel an attack from a man who’s unarmed

How did Wilson know if Brown was armed or not?

RUexperienced on August 22, 2014 at 2:23 PM

bofh on August 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM

SSSSHHHH. You’re not supposed to be asking questions about that!! :-)

Deano1952 on August 22, 2014 at 2:24 PM

I’m wondering what happened to the little old ladies that Brown was helping across the street when this whole thing happened.

TarheelBen on August 22, 2014 at 2:25 PM

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM

If I remember correctly that “inadvertent” witness on the video said he heard five or six. If he fired seven times (the first being the shot inside the car) then that was some good shooting. He fired six times and hit him six times. Under pressure no less.

But don’t quote me.

Judge_Dredd on August 22, 2014 at 2:26 PM

Since we now are engaging in wild and nonsensical speculation

crazywater on August 22, 2014 at 2:20 PM

Just now engaging in wild and nonsensical speculation? That ship has sailed long long ago.

It’s up to the point that Wilson was really a “Man in Black” working undercover and Brown was escaped alien threatening to steal the magma at the center of the Earth.

Happy Nomad on August 22, 2014 at 2:26 PM

We won’t know for awhile.Stock up on popcorn and ammo.Be prepared to drink heavily.

docflash on August 22, 2014 at 2:27 PM

I’m more than willing to wait until all the facts are in.

I doubt Eric Holder would waste his time and that of 50 agents without an agenda, though.

That makes me nervous for Officer Wilson.

WhirledPeas on August 22, 2014 at 2:27 PM

I believe that response was due today – Aug 22. Anyone heard anything about this, or is it just going to go down the memory hole, like so much else?

bofh on August 22, 2014 at 2:22 PM

I believe you might have stumbled on the news dump for this week.

Happy Nomad on August 22, 2014 at 2:28 PM

How many bullets were left in Wilson’s firearm? If only 6 shots were fired and there were six frontal entries, that leaves no bullets to be fired while he was running away. Unless forensics can’t tell about the arm/hand positions that were hit during the event, I would suppose the the lower spots were shot first and the firearm rose from the recoil for the subsequent shots. If the lowest entries were from the front, again that would suggest nothing hit him from the rear.

Of course, if the officer says he fired a shot high to get him to stop while he was running away, that may explain the eyewitness report that a shot was fired from behind even though all the entries were from the front if there were more than six shots fired.

Those sorts of questions are why we have grand juries instead of us pundits.

KW64 on August 22, 2014 at 2:28 PM

Wilson joined the police to lay in wait for years because all he really wanted was to execute a black person.

John the Libertarian on August 22, 2014 at 2:29 PM

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:13 PM

They’ll be bouncing their own rubble, there’s nothing left.

What will happen is the geniuses who riot will burn down their own hovels while screaming “Take that, muthaflucka!” Only later will they realize maybe it wasn’t such a great idea.

Bishop on August 22, 2014 at 2:29 PM

And al our genteel 18 year old had to do was pay the $1 for a crap cigar he could legally purchase and none of this would’ve happened.

rogerb on August 22, 2014 at 2:30 PM

If no one is around to see AP’s wild speculation machine in action is it really wildly speculating?

NotCoach on August 22, 2014 at 2:30 PM

I’m wondering what happened to the little old ladies that Brown was helping across the street when this whole thing happened.

TarheelBen on August 22, 2014 at 2:25 PM

Why, Officer Wilson ate her, to eliminate evidence of Micheal Browns innocence of course…

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:31 PM

How many bullets shells/cartridges/rounds were left in Wilson’s firearm? If only 6 shots were fired and there were six frontal entries, that leaves no bullets to be fired while he was running away.

KW64 on August 22, 2014 at 2:28 PM

.
Don’t forget the discharge inside the Police cruiser, during the struggle. That was the first shot fired.

listens2glenn on August 22, 2014 at 2:31 PM

AP’s posts get more ridiculous everyday…must be hoping for a Huffpo position.

Doomsday on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

Honest questions. What kind of gun was it and how many rounds did it hold?

Walter L. Newton on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

Allah is apparently a moron, but then again I’ve known that for a long time. The Missouri statute says that deadly force is authorized if a felony suspect is fleeing regardless of if he had just punched an officer in the face or not. And of course the goal posts move again, now that it’s been proven that Brown did in fact punch Wilson in the face, CNN is trying to say “Well he didn’t really have a fractured eye socket”. Not only is that a big fat lie (again coming from someone here on the ground), but does it really matter how “severe” his injury was? The fact that he committed a felony prior to even being in contact with the officer makes the entire “did the officer shoot at him while he was fleeing?” argument absolutely moot.

MobileVideoEngineer on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

I’m off to play some golf, but that doesn’t reflect the depth of my grief over that Brown guy’s pro-choice death.

rogerb on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

And al our genteel 18 year old had to do was pay the $1 for a crap cigar he could legally purchase and none of this would’ve happened.

rogerb on August 22, 2014 at 2:30 PM

A caring nation would supply free condoms AND free cigars.

Why do you hate freedom?

Bishop on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

Is the attack on Wilson in the car a felony offense?

goatweed on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

It’s up to the point that Wilson was really a “Man in Black” working undercover and Brown was escaped alien threatening to steal the magma at the center of the Earth.

Happy Nomad on August 22, 2014 at 2:26 PM

What the hell, sounds reasonable to me…

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:33 PM

Just which “witnesses” agree to that version of events?
Just who said that Wilson fired AT Brown while Brown’s back was to him? The impeccable Johnson?

No, not just Johnson. The neighbor who live-tweeted the shooting as it happened claimed two shots were fired while Brown was running away. He’ll end up on the witness stand for the DA, rest assured.

Before you sneer at me for “dropping the ball,” Saverio, just because I really am trying to deal with the various claims in the case and not pronounce Wilson innocent simply because he’s a cop, make sure you’re not dropping any balls yourself. Some people are awfully quick to transition from “wait for all the facts to come in” to “WILSON EXONERATED!”

Allahpundit on August 22, 2014 at 2:33 PM

KW64 on August 22, 2014 at 2:28 PM

It looks like 7 shots in total were fired at this point in time. I haven’t seen any evidence that shots fired by Wilson missed Brown, so six gunshot wounds, and one accidental discharge inside his cruiser. What kind of weapon was Wilson carrying? Was it a revolver? If it was it must have been a 7 shot revolver.

NotCoach on August 22, 2014 at 2:33 PM

Where is that off camera conversation where the guy says that Brown was running at the cop. He says that the cop was missing not realizing, I guess, that the officer was hitting him in the arm.

Vince on August 22, 2014 at 2:15 PM

No one knows how many rounds were fired. One witness, a young girl named Crenshaw, said during an interview that at least one bullet broke a window, meaning Wilson missed at least once. Which is ok.

I wish the press would stop saying Brown was shot 6 times. He wasn’t shot six times. He has several entry, exit and re-entry wounds. At least one round entered his right eye, exited under his chin and re-entered his upper right chest. One round, 3 holes. This is gruesome, but its important. All of his wounds are from the front, at least 2 (the eye shot and the top of the head shot) prove he was at least bent or bending over when struck. This could be from an attempt to surrender, or while he was falling after being shot in the arm, which doesn’t make a lot of sense, or from tripping, or because he was charging towards the officer with his down.

Somebody knows. Somebody saw it. That somebody isn’t going to talk. Ever. I find it surprising that no one has a video of the whole incident. I’d be willing to bet if the events occurred as the locals say it did (hands up, executed), the internet would be flooded with those videos and we wouldn’t be having this fascinating discussion in our post-racial Omerica.

BobMbx on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

If I remember correctly that “inadvertent” witness on the video said he heard five or six. If he fired seven times (the first being the shot inside the car) then that was some good shooting. He fired six times and hit him six times. Under pressure no less.

But don’t quote me.

Judge_Dredd on August 22, 2014 at 2:26 PM

Well, if those are all the shots he took, then those that claim he opened fire on Brown as he was running away are incorrect. In addition, if he had rounds left over, it indicates that, rather than attempting to slaughter Brown, his goal was simply to put him on the ground where he would no longer be a threat. If he were out of control, he would have squeezed until the mag was empty, right?

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

Honest questions. What kind of gun was it and how many rounds did it hold?

Walter L. Newton on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

It was a 200 caliber assault pistol and held 10,000 rounds.

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

A criminal never has the right to claim self defense against a pursuing police officer especially after assaulting him. Since Brown has already been identified as the man in the surveillance video by his family he has lost his right to self defense.

Like George Zimmerman Wilson cannot be convicted given the evidence we already know and I don’t the feds could get him convicted on civil rights charges for the reason. Their only hope is that jury could find guilty of something like manslaughter.

jerryofva on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

that Wilson fired at him while Brown’s back was to him

Damnit, will you quit repeating this lie? Even Coroner-to-the-Stars Michael Baden says all the wounds are in the front, except for one in the arm that could not be determined. Why is that so hard to comprehend???

n0doz on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

And al our genteel 18 year old had to do was pay the $1 for a crap cigar he could legally purchase and none of this would’ve happened.

rogerb on August 22, 2014 at 2:30 PM

Didn’t even have to do that. If he’d hurried home with his booty and not made himself stand out by walking in the middle of the street it may not have happened. This punk strong armed people in the past. Bet on it. He got braver as time went on. He thought no white cop is going to be dumb enough to shoot a black in a project and while Obama was in president, you know?

Judge_Dredd on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Sure, by choosing people for the jury similar to the makeup of the grand jury which indicted Governor Perry.

Bishop on August 22, 2014 at 2:06 PM

You’d also have to conduct the trial in the same way a grand jury by allowing ONLY the prosecution’s case to be heard by the jury. IE: no affirmative defense presented, no cross examination of witnesses, it’d have to be a Soviet (or Angela Corey) style trial.

ConstantineXI on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Totally reliable source…

libfreeordie on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Makes me wonder if maybe the state will zero in on Wilson shooting at Brown’s back while he was fleeing and try to get some sort of conviction out of that. That would be awfully tricky — it would be bizarre for Wilson to be acquitted of murder on self-defense grounds but convicted on attempted murder or negligence grounds for the shots he fired just moments before the fatal shots.

Here we go again with the speculation circus. “Well, if it was that, then it wasn’t the other thing, unless it was the other thing, in which case it might not have been the first thing….”

How about another scenario: Man has just committed a crime (not stealing Swisher Sweets to roll some J’s – we’re talking about assaulting a police officer), officer yells to the fleeing suspect to halt/freeze and fires a “warning shot” to stop him. Which apparently worked. He stops.

Why the presumption, with no evidence (such as an actual bullet wound in the back of the man’s torso or limbs) that a shot fired while the man was running was “intended” to hit him and was not, instead, intended to stop him from running?

This idle speculation with embedded, untested, presumptions is simply not helpful. Other than to drive blog traffic.

IndieDogg on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Just a random thought re: Ferguson …

How about we wait for FACTS and STOP this “many witnesses agree” and “a friend said” which are only serving to keep fanning the flames?

Hmmmmmmmmmm?

Whatcha think?

PolAgnostic on August 22, 2014 at 2:08 PM

HotAir wouldn’t make any money if it waited for facts. ;-)

reddevil on August 22, 2014 at 2:36 PM

What’s troubling is all those who want the DA to recuse himself because his dad was killed in the line of duty by a black man 50 years ago. Who is it that they want to take his place? Is there a black DA somewhere waiting in the wings to make this more fair and provide justice to the gentle giant?

Kissmygrits on August 22, 2014 at 2:36 PM

BobMbx on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

So that leaves how many rounds were fired entirely unknown at this time. I assumed Brown was struck by six rounds because no one has contradicted that officially. At least not that I am aware of. I haven’t read any of the autopsies.

NotCoach on August 22, 2014 at 2:36 PM

Allahpundit on August 22, 2014 at 2:33 PM

Bla bla bla… the Anti-Iron Fist rule is in effect… Only blog when drunk…

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:37 PM

Do we even know how many shots were fired in total?

I think witnesses probably heard the first shot from the car, then saw Brown running away, and connected the first shot to Wilson shooting Brown in the back. However, it was actually shot during the attack, accidental or justified.

If Brown ran away, turned around, and was surrendering when he was shot again, I don’t know. But it’s going to be hard to prove.

El_Terrible on August 22, 2014 at 2:37 PM

Officer Wilson will most certainly be tried, but it may only be for Federal Civil Rights violations. If the locals don’t indict him, Holder and the Feds most certainly will. Count on it.

mdavt on August 22, 2014 at 2:37 PM

Totally reliable source…

libfreeordie on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH……………………….

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Once you produce some evidence to show justifiable homicide, the burden falls on the prosecution to disprove it.[/quote]

Nope. The burden doesn’t “fall” on the prosecution because the prosecution ALREADY HAS the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that Wilson committed a crime. If they do their jobs correctly, the justifiable homicide argument won’t hold up anyway.

mrsknightley on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Did the world wonder speak, yet?

Schadenfreude on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Don’t forget the discharge inside the Police cruiser, during the struggle. That was the first shot fired.

listens2glenn on August 22, 2014 at 2:31 PM

And a crucial piece of evidence. If there’s a bullet hole in the floorboard or dash of the cruiser, that all but proves Wilson’s claim that Brown went after the gun, which pretty well establishes Brown’s intent to murder Wilson.

If it’s higher, like through the windshield or top of the car, that’s less conclusive, but could imply that Wilson pulled his gun and Brown, not wanting to get shot, went to grab it before it could be leveled at him. That, imo, would basically neutralize that evidence, as Wilson could say yeah he pulled his gun, after Brown punched him, and Brown’s witnesses could say Brown only punched Wilson after he drew his gun. Unless Brown was shot at point blank range (all evidence says he wasn’t) I don’t see how the shot from inside the car can help the side trying to convict Wilson.

LukeinNE on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Does anyone know if the autopsies performed on Mr. Brown show any abrasions on his hands or knuckles consistent with punching someone? That might help shed a little light on what happened that day.

fortcoins on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

It was a 200 caliber assault pistol and held 10,000 rounds.

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

Wow! I wonder how much one of those weighs, and if I could handle the recoil! Would probably take my HAND off just for trying to hold it.

ConstantineXI on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Don’t forget the discharge inside the Police cruiser, during the struggle. That was the first shot fired.

listens2glenn on August 22, 2014 at 2:31 PM

You are quite right. We also arejust assuming that that shot did not hit anything.

KW64 on August 22, 2014 at 2:39 PM

Totally reliable source…

libfreeordie on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Happy Anniversary, Shiite for Brains!!

Here’s a simple question for you. Which of the founding fathers did not subscribe to the communitarian ethos Calhoun deploys to rationalize slavery? *sets sundial*

libfreeordie on August 21, 2013 at 9:30 AM

None. They weren’t nascent Commies like John C. Calhoun, and full blown Commies like you. Don’t you think you need to provide some proof for such a ridiculous smear there Mr. Calhoun? You’re a history perfesser, right?

NotCoach on August 21, 2013 at 9:36 AM

Oh dear God….hold on, give me 10 minutes.

libfreeordie on August 21, 2013 at 9:45 AM

We should sell commemorative sundials, don’t you think?

NotCoach on August 22, 2014 at 2:39 PM

If he were out of control, he would have squeezed until the mag was empty, right?

bimmcorp on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

If I were bent on executing a lad I’d have walked over and pumped several into his melon just to be certain. You don’t want a zombie lad getting up.

Judge_Dredd on August 22, 2014 at 2:39 PM

It was a 200 caliber assault pistol and held 10,000 rounds.

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:34 PM

Wow! I wonder how much one of those weighs, and if I could handle the recoil! Would probably take my HAND off just for trying to hold it.

ConstantineXI on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Don’t be silly, that sucker would fit in your watch pocket, and you could fire it in fully automatic mode while sipping a latte without spilling a drop. Just ask any libtard…

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:41 PM

Totally reliable source…

libfreeordie on August 22, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Remember how there was 100% proof that Michael Brown was on his knees pleading for his life when the police officer shot him in the head.

Dude, that was six days ago.

sentinelrules on August 22, 2014 at 2:41 PM

Quote fail.

Once you produce some evidence to show justifiable homicide, the burden falls on the prosecution to disprove it.

Nope. The burden doesn’t “fall” on the prosecution because the prosecution ALREADY HAS the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that Wilson committed a crime. If they do their jobs correctly, the justifiable homicide argument won’t hold up anyway.

mrsknightley on August 22, 2014 at 2:42 PM

AP’s posts get more ridiculous everyday…must be hoping for a Huffpo position.

Doomsday on August 22, 2014 at 2:32 PM

Gotta follow the big bucks. He can be HuffPo’s David Frum.

El_Terrible on August 22, 2014 at 2:43 PM

And of course the goal posts move again, now that it’s been proven that Brown did in fact punch Wilson in the face, CNN is trying to say “Well he didn’t really have a fractured eye socket”. Not only is that a big fat lie (again coming from someone here on the ground), but does it really matter how “severe” his injury was?

Yeah, but see, it hasn’t been “proved” that he punched Wilson in the face. Wilson had a facial injury. Maybe that was because Brown punched him, maybe it was because Wilson grabbed Brown, as Johnson claimed, and then as Brown struggled to pull away Wilson got hit in the eye. I don’t know. Neither do you. I wonder if there’s even one person in all of this who means it when he says “wait for all the facts.”

I made the same point yesterday that you did about the severity of the injury not mattering *that* much, but yeah, of course it matters a little if Wilson’s eye socket was busted. That would be evidence that Brown was willing and able to do him seriously bodily harm. And I’ve posted that Missouri self-defense statute you mention before. It’s true, that’s going to be a high burden for the prosecution given that Brown was wanted for robbery, but on the other hand, good luck convincing a jury that a cop should be able to shoot a man in the back for strong-arming his way out of a store with $50 in cigars. (See Mark Steyn’s column on Ferguson for more on that.) It may take a directed verdict by the court to get Wilson off under that statute. We’ll see.

Allahpundit on August 22, 2014 at 2:43 PM

Did the world wonder speak, yet?

Schadenfreude on August 22, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Rat-eared or otherwise?

Purpa drank and now blunts. And we have to place locking caps over A/C refrigerant lines to keep the lads from getting high and wasting refrigerant. What kind of mentality thinks this crap up? Never mind. I already know the answer. Don’t I libslave.

Judge_Dredd on August 22, 2014 at 2:43 PM

So that leaves how many rounds were fired entirely unknown at this time. I assumed Brown was struck by six rounds because no one has contradicted that officially. At least not that I am aware of. I haven’t read any of the autopsies.

NotCoach on August 22, 2014 at 2:36 PM

Thats right. One thing that is certain is the PD will account for every round fired, at least the total number. That should be easy enough. Where they went is can be important too.

I think the faux-topsy shows 9 wounds, not all of them entry wounds. Some are exit, and others are re-entry wounds.

BobMbx on August 22, 2014 at 2:44 PM

I’m sure a group of citizens like the O.J. Simpson jury would have no trouble convicting on First Degree Murder… after all, the community deserves its “justice”, facts be damned…

Khun Joe on August 22, 2014 at 2:44 PM

Allahpundit on August 22, 2014 at 2:43 PM

<— Passes AP a Newcastles….

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:44 PM

All of this really doesn’t matter. The police officer should have never been assaulted under any circumstance and Mike Brown needed not to die.

Tater Salad on August 22, 2014 at 2:45 PM

All of this really doesn’t matter. The police officer should have never been assaulted under any circumstance and Mike Brown needed not to die.

Tater Salad on August 22, 2014 at 2:45 PM

Don’t be silly…Everybody and their Great Aunt Gertrud knows that a White Cop can’t go to Heaven unless he assassinates a Black man…

oscarwilde on August 22, 2014 at 2:47 PM

Wilson could have been temporarily unconscious and not even realized it.

rik on August 22, 2014 at 2:48 PM

Ferguson grand jury members should be required to watch Rashomon before reviewing the evidence.

Tyrone Slothrop on August 22, 2014 at 2:49 PM

Gunman dead, police officer in critical condition in San Bernardino.

MichaelGabriel on August 22, 2014 at 2:50 PM

Funny how cnn is trying to deflect ftom Johnson’s criminal record….it has no bearing to the case but oh how they used Zimmerman’s past to denigrate and ensure his credibility should be in question

HYPOCRITES! !!!!!

cmsinaz on August 22, 2014 at 2:50 PM

But Juan Williams tells us you can clearly see he has no face injuries in the video.

The Notorious G.O.P on August 22, 2014 at 2:50 PM

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