Ebola: First case coming to America

posted at 10:01 pm on July 31, 2014 by Mary Katharine Ham

The largest outbreak in history continues unabated in West Africa. Three Americans have been infected, one of whom was the man who died upon his arrival in Nigerian megacity Lagos last week. Now, Emory University hospital in Atlanta will be taking the transfer of an Ebola patient, reportedly an American aid worker:

Emory University Hospital has been told a patient with the Ebola virus will be transferred to its hospital in Atlanta.

According to the Associated Press, the patient is an American aid worker, although the individual’s identity was not released due to privacy laws.

Emory says it has a special isolation unit to treat patients who are exposed to serious infectious diseases which is physically separate from other patient areas at the hospital.

Emory’s isolation unit is one of only four such units in the country, according to the hospital, which also said its staff are highly trained in the procedures necessary to care for the patient.

CNN reports indicate the patient coming to Atlanta is likely missionary Nancy Whitebol, but her arrival day is unknown. Both she and Dr. Kent Brantly, affiliated with Samaritan’s Purse, are still alive:

While U.S. officials have remained mum on the issue, a source told CNN that a medical charter flight left from Cartersville, Georgia, on Thursday evening.

A CNN crew saw the plane depart shortly after 5 p.m. ET. The plane matched the description provided by the source, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

It was not immediately known when the two Americans — identified by the source as Dr. Kent Brantly and Nancy Writebol — would arrive in the United States, or where the plane would land.

At least one of the two will be taken to a hospital at Emory University, near the headquarters of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in Atlanta, hospital officials told CNN’s Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

The patient will be cared for in an isolation unit at the hospital that is separate from patient areas, Gupta said.

With the return of Brantly and Writebol to the United States, it will be the first time that patients diagnosed with Ebola will be known to be in the country.

Brantly and Writebol are described as being in stable-but-grave conditions, with both reportedly taking a turn for the worse overnight, according to statements released Thursday by the faith-based charity Samaritan’s Purse.

Emphasis mine. Is this something the president is reading about in the papers or is someone—anyone—making sure there’s a protocol for containing this kind of thing that’s a little more rock solid than the one that left smallpox hanging out in a minifridge for 50 years? Sure, the CDC is in Atlanta, but the CDC and the other federal agencies in charge of super-deadly infectious diseases have lost control of several deadly diseases in the past several months. I’m not a big fearmonger when it comes to public health—most of those articles about buttchugging and the cinnamon dare are nonsense—but this is a rather more serious threat and there’s plenty of recent evidence that the federal agencies in charge of such things aren’t great at being in charge of such things. Here’s hoping Emory will play point on this. It sounds as if they will, which sounds safer to me.


The Peace Corps is peacing out:

The Peace Corps said Wednesday that it was temporarily removing 340 volunteers working in Liberia, Sierra Leone and Guinea because of the virus’s spread. Two corps volunteers were placed in isolation and under observation—though they aren’t symptomatic—after coming in contact with an individual who later died of Ebola, a spokeswoman said.

Two U.S. faith-based organizations that are helping to treat Ebola patients in Liberia and have had American staff infected said they were evacuating nonessential personnel due to the spread of the virus, as well as security issues. Another U.S. citizen and a top doctor from Sierra Leone have died.

The developments highlight the risks for foreigners as well as for health staff treating Ebola patients. And they underscore the gravity of the evolving crisis in a poor corner of West Africa where government authorities and international health workers have struggled to bring the deadly outbreak under control.

Pray for Whitebol and Brantly (or send good vibes or whatever your thing is). They’re both brave people trying to serve others in the worst of conditions, and they’re clearly wonderful servants. Christlike, even, as this story shows:

An American doctor being treated for Ebola in Liberia has “taken a slight turn for the worse overnight,” according to Samaritan’s Purse, an evangelical Christian Charity based in North Carolina.

An “experimental serum” to treat the virus arrived for the two infected Americans, but there was only enough for one person, according to Samaritan’s Purse.

Dr. Kent Brantly, who noticed his Ebola symptoms and quarantined himself last week, offered the dose to the other infected American, missionary Nancy Writebol.

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He ignored a great deal of plain facts not requiring credentials to recognize, gryphon. I am as alarmed as alarmed can get, but I will stick by my pledge and not bother with the twit in future. I will also avoid hospitals as much as possible. I wonder if Doctor Demento can process that.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:37 AM

I’m in Boone where Samaritan’s Purse is, and I’ve heard them speak about their work. They’re one of the only groups that has been allowed in North Korea, and then only once. They’ve been maligned over the years because of their Christian outreach (Christian groups tend to be filled with Christians, right?) but when the chips were down they were one of the few groups to help Ebola patients, as ostracized a group as there can be.

They went in with their eyes open, fully realizing the danger they were in, but felt they had a mission to bring hope to the needy. Doctor Brantly’s giving the serum to Nancy Writebol is not the exception but the rule with them. They’re exceptional people.

itsspideyman on August 1, 2014 at 1:38 AM

He ignored a great deal of plain facts not requiring credentials to recognize, gryphon. I am as alarmed as alarmed can get, but I will stick by my pledge and not bother with the twit in future. I will also avoid hospitals as much as possible. I wonder if Doctor Demento can process that.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:37 AM

Hospitals are extremely dangerous. A lot of people die there, so it must be the cause of a lot of deaths!

/ROFLMAO

/First-OrderFallacy

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 1:39 AM

I’m in Boone where Samaritan’s Purse is, and I’ve heard them speak about their work. They’re one of the only groups that has been allowed in North Korea, and then only once. They’ve been maligned over the years because of their Christian outreach (Christian groups tend to be filled with Christians, right?) but when the chips were down they were one of the few groups to help Ebola patients, as ostracized a group as there can be.

They went in with their eyes open, fully realizing the danger they were in, but felt they had a mission to bring hope to the needy. Doctor Brantly’s giving the serum to Nancy Writebol is not the exception but the rule with them. They’re exceptional people.

itsspideyman on August 1, 2014 at 1:38 AM

I’m all for the freedom to engage in that kind of work, regardless of what I would personally do. My chief and #1 concern about bringing this virus to America is possibly exposing it to people who have no choice in the matter.

And before you MD/PhD goobers start going all “there is no cause for alarm” on me, I got two words for you:

Reston

1989

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 1:41 AM

‘Post hoc ergo propter hoc’. True gryphon. But I still have to have my pacemaker checked and see a cardiologist on a regular basis. I think that’s scary. Do you think Dr. Nigeria understands that?

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:44 AM

itsspideyman on August 1, 2014 at 1:38 AM

They’re exceptional people and I applaud their good work. They knew the risk.
Me and mine, we didn’t sign up for such risk.

HornetSting on August 1, 2014 at 1:44 AM

‘Post hoc ergo propter hoc’. True gryphon. But I still have to have my pacemaker checked and see a cardiologist on a regular basis. I think that’s scary. Do you think Dr. Nigeria understands that?

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:44 AM

It’s scary, yes. My dad has an implanted pacemaker, too. Had it put in a couple of years ago, and he fought it for as long as he could. But what was really scary was that we almost lost him to a massive sudden coronary blockage at the age of 56 in 2006. If not for a major medical intervention that included a 72 hour induced coma and a quadruple bypass procedure some six months later, he wouldn’t be alive. Almost eight years it’s been…all borrowed time. I think there’s a special place in heaven for the healers.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 1:46 AM

Let me put it to you all this way:

Lvl 4 containment protocols may or may not render the threat of Ebola infection moot within the confines of the united states. The evidence that it is sufficient is the word of a doctor whom we have no ability to check credentials for. The evidence that it may not be sufficient is the Reston incident of 1989 and the recent discovery of smallpox vials that went unaccounted-for, for nearly 40 years.

Submitted for your approval.

/RodSerling

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 1:49 AM

Couldn’t agree more, gryphon. And it ain’t Dr. ‘nothing to see here’.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:49 AM

And before you MD/PhD goobers start going all “there is no cause for alarm” on me, I got two words for you:

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 1:41 AM

In the same vein. These are the same the PhD’s that gave us global warming by consensus. You can not trust the skill of the modern scientist. They are all not Newton, Pasteur, or Salk.

Oil Can on August 1, 2014 at 1:51 AM

And I’m the same age as your dad, gryphon. It’s hard not to fall to my knees and scream ‘please, not now’. Know what I mean?

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:53 AM

Oil Can: I think I pointed out to Dr. ‘I’m smarter than you’ that doctors are not gods, and he got flustered.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:55 AM

And I’m the same age as your dad, gryphon. It’s hard not to fall to my knees and scream ‘please, not now’. Know what I mean?

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:53 AM

I think Dad has made his peace. At least it sure seems like it, but it’s hard to know what a person is thinking when they don’t tell you much.

Doctors are people too. We should all be responsible for our own health in the end, with the informed advice and aid of medical professionals. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve gotten prescriptions from my GP only to not even bother filling them.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 1:56 AM

This may be presumptious,gryphon, but we aren’t going to tell what we are thinking. Bet you do the same thiung now and then, neh? Scream, that is.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:59 AM

This may be presumptious,gryphon, but we aren’t going to tell what we are thinking. Bet you do the same thiung now and then, neh? Scream, that is.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 1:59 AM

I scream over mostly politics. Romance (lack thereof, more to the point) is a distant second in the list of things I scream about. I think as I approach 40, it’s just now starting to dawn on me that I can’t treat my body like I did at the age of 18 forever.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 2:01 AM

40! Puppy. We are counting on you. Don’t drop the ball. I’ll say a prayer for you. I’m out.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 2:06 AM

40! Puppy. We are counting on you. Don’t drop the ball. I’ll say a prayer for you. I’m out.

DemetriusPhalerum on August 1, 2014 at 2:06 AM

Just turned 36 about a month ago, actually. have a few years left to 40, but I’m closer to 40 than I am to 30 now. That shouldn’t surprise you, given that you said you’re my dad’s age, and just turned 64. ;)

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 2:07 AM

So what do we need for a full blown epidemic in the US.

Massive influx of humans from the 3rd world and parts unknown.
Check
Held in close quarters where the disease can cross contaminate.
Check
Infected people moved by planes, trains and automobiles to the far quarters of our country to mix in with the general population.
Check

Couldn’t create a more ideal situation if you planned it that way. (!)

If I can try and put some rosy aspect to this, it is reports that female illegal immigrants can pretty much guarantee that they will be raped by the coyotes and drug cartels that smuggle them across the border, so those guys would be among the first to go hemorrhagic and bleed out. I guess that will be some justice.

kurtzz3 on August 1, 2014 at 2:25 AM

kurtzz3 on August 1, 2014 at 2:25 AM

Then spread these individuals to urban centers amongst various States. Check.

Ebola usually burns itself out leaving few survivors, although there is some variation by strain of the bacteria on that score, usually it gets to the care givers and once they are taken down then you are at the second string of personnel who aren’t so hot at giving care or containing diseases.

Also we stripped out the charitable hospital system in the name of enhancing cronies via ‘health insurance’ so that there aren’t enough beds available to contain an outbreak of any major disease. Check.

When the first actual disease hits that we have no ready way to combat or even contain all that well, then we are in for a world of hurt and death. Our advanced system is rickety as it depends upon an entire class of people as middleman in government and industry to help pay for care… and those people will also be taken under the disease and their jobs go undone, people unpaid, and economy suddenly finding the light sand in the lubrication system now has something a bit coarser that begins a process of coagulating the grit and stopping the lubricant from flowing. This system is a house of cards financially and medically.

Because we have those pushing ever so much more government.

Time runs short.

I suggest some good personal barrier systems in your survival kit, as you may be the ones having to tend to the sick on your street or in your building… if you haven’t already taken for the hills, that is.

ajacksonian on August 1, 2014 at 7:02 AM

If you know the things that happen every single day in your local hospital or medical center, I think you will probably move to an isolated island then. Do you know the number of times we have had to call people at home and tell them, they have infectious diseases like TB? Do you know how many people in that hospital you visit everyday are in isolation. If you start freaking out about everything, then you will go crazy.

There is no cause for alarm.

Chudi on August 1, 2014 at 12:04 AM

nosocomial infections are not something many like to talk about so many are not even aware of it.

its been years since I read up on ebola but one of its strengths (high kill rate) MAY also be its achilles heel. In isolated environment it burns out and has no hosts left.

And its almost impossible to weaponize too iirc, never seen anything making me think its at all possible really.

I’d be more worried about the a/c decom than a lab issue with this.
theres an airframe that should be destroyed in place..

dmacleo on August 1, 2014 at 7:53 AM

As terrible as Ebola is, it is not airborne. I’m more afraid of the next big flu bug.

guinneach on August 1, 2014 at 8:36 AM

Has Alex Jones checked in on this thread yet?

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 8:39 AM

Praying for them.

And it is beyond foolish to bring them here.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 8:57 AM

I had to stop watching virus movies after seeing the movie “Outbreak.” Yeah, I’m afraid of everything (and I work in public health in Texas)

Hat Trick on August 1, 2014 at 8:58 AM

No, no, no and no! Do not bring that disease here!

I feel sorry for the people that contracted it. They knew the risk they were taking.

sadatoni on August 1, 2014 at 9:02 AM

Like I said before, It’s ok to be worried, but there is no cause for alarm.

Chudi on August 1, 2014 at 1:19 AM

Thank you, Dr. Diller.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 9:06 AM

I had to stop watching virus movies after seeing the movie “Outbreak.” Yeah, I’m afraid of everything (and I work in public health in Texas)

Hat Trick on August 1, 2014 at 8:58 AM

Don’t worry – I’m sure there’s a fuel-air bomb solution in place, just in case.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 9:07 AM

“The most terrifying words in the English language are: I’m from the government and I’m here to help.” – Ronald Reagan

Wade on August 1, 2014 at 9:10 AM

I think that the best place for these individuals is in the US at this time. Ebola causes hemorrhagic fever, which basically means that you bleed out. The most important things they need is replacement of fluids – including blood, and other blood products. These things are not easy to get in the middle of Liberia, especially in the middle of an epidemic.

I know that people are worried, but it’s ok to be worried about the unknown. However, US hospitals handle worse situations than this everyday and any 3rd yr medical student in the US, is already very well trained in basic infection control protocols.

Chudi on July 31, 2014 at 11:31 PM

Thank you – we were all going to die from SARS, we were all going to die from swine flu,Hong Kong flu, mad cow, and now H1N1 for several years. We were all going to die from terrorist anthrax, dirty bombs, the Yellowstone Caldera blowing up, and global warming. I’ll quibble about the pathophysiology, though, as the capillary leak syndrome and coagulopathy are generally more significant in mortality than frank haemorrhage.

They are not being brought over just to receive the same supportive care here. This is about experimental treatment.

No; there is, as Chudi pointed out, much better supportive care, especially in blood and blood products needed to deal with the coagulopathy, here than Liberia, Guinea, or Sierra Leone.

You don’t suppose our government is trying to get samples of bodily fluids from these patients, for the purpose of “weaponizing” this virus, do you ?

No, considering that in the past it was reported the Japanese cult Aum Shinrikyo had gone to Zaire to collect blood for such a purpose, do you not think that the govenment, given all the outbreaks in the last 38 years, had they wanted to do that, couldn’t ?

Follow up question. Does deserving everything we can do for Dr. Brantly include introducing a level four pathogen into the United States within a patient for the first time and possibly losing control of those infectious controls you tout, infecting American citizens?

Yes, here we have far better means and facilities to study the disease as well as to treat. There are plenty of level four (and three, many of which can also be lethal) pathogens in labs in the states already.

…either he is choosing to ignore the Reston incident or he is remaining willfully ignorant of it despite it being brought up on this thread several times.

Interestingly enough, one of the things they were working on in Reston was a vaccine for Ebola. Ther were also EBO-R outbreaks in the Philippines, and in Texas. The number of people infected in all of these, despite contact with infected monkeys, is zero.

I remain puzzled why people who are normally quite able rationally to look at the science and reject the scare-mongering of the warmist cult and their “jounalist” enablers, are unwilling to step back and look at this objectively. According to an ISID update, as of yeaterday, there have been 1323 cases out of a potential population at risk of over 20,000,000.

If you want something to worry about, worry about all the known (i.e., drug resistant TB) and unknown infectious and vector borne diseases coming across the souther border unchecked.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 9:13 AM

obama’s plan coming to fruition.

Pork-Chop on August 1, 2014 at 9:15 AM

Bringing a couple of US citizens back to the USA for treatment for the disease doesn’t worry me.

The real concern is that we are not restricting travel or requiring some sort of quarantine on travelers to the US from one of the West African countries experiencing the Ebola outbreak. That poses a much greater danger than the two missionaries.

Nomas on August 1, 2014 at 9:15 AM

The disease is not air-borne as long as they are quarantined/isolated.

It reduces the risk.

weedisgood on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

Almost funny…my son was playing a game yesterday that the goal is to design and spread a disease and try to wipe out the world. He said the hard part was getting it to spread. Countries with strict protocols or limited access made infecting them very difficult. It seems keeping these diseases out of your country prevents them from ever spreading in your country.

Now this disease may not be what brings us down but the unchecked ones coming across the boarder to areas where those have chosen not vaccinate may very well cause the type of effect my son is trying to create in his game. Death and lots of it.

flahockey on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

Risk of ebola outbreak if we keep it out of the country: zero.

Risk of ebola outbreak if we bring known infected people into the country: higher than zero.

Some folks keep talking about this protocol and that protocol – you do realize the infected doctor was *using* protection and protocols to prevent spread and to prevent from contracting the disease himself, yes? But he got it anyway, yes?

Kindly stfu about ‘protocols’, thanks.

And as to contrasting this with people who guffaw at the non-science of ‘global warmists’, well… there is no evidence to support the ‘warmist’ perspective, and ample evidence against it. Similarly, there is evidence that ‘protocols’ fail, and guess what – unlike ‘warming’, ebola actually is a threat, so again… stfu, thanks.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 9:39 AM

The disease is not air-borne as long as they are quarantined/isolated.

It reduces the risk.

weedisgood on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

A quarantined disease bomb in the middle of a vastly more densely-populated place is less dangerous than one out in some rinky-dink armpit of the Earth? Sorry, not buying it.

I feel for those bringing the holy light to dark lands but they knew the risks when they signed on and this is not justifiable.

LawfulGood on August 1, 2014 at 9:42 AM

After reading this thread, it’s no wonder liberals are always making fun of conservatives and their vague grasp of science.

If I didn’t know better, I would think I was reading a thread on Alex Jones’ website.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 9:46 AM

Just asking an honest question… but would it make a diffrence if the folks comeing to America had been returning soldiers who got infected during a war operation as opposed to volunteer civilians?

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 9:49 AM

my son was playing a game yesterday that the goal is to design and spread a disease and try to wipe out the world. He said the hard part was getting it to spread.
flahockey on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

Our folks just got us an “Etch A Sketch”.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 9:54 AM

Just asking an honest question… but would it make a diffrence if the folks comeing to America had been returning soldiers who got infected during a war operation as opposed to volunteer civilians?

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 9:49 AM

To me? No. In either case you knew when you signed on for the job: “RISK OF DEATH” spelled out in 10-foot

Germs or guns will kill you just as dead either one…but I’ve never heard of a case of infectious bullets wiping out thousands of people before a vaccine could be made, if it was even possible to do so.

If I didn’t know better, I would think I was reading a thread on Alex Jones’ website.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 9:46 AM

Really? You haven’t disproved anything and you sound like you don’t know anything.

you do realize the infected doctor was *using* protection and protocols to prevent spread and to prevent from contracting the disease himself, yes? But he got it anyway, yes?

^ This alone is a legitimate argument, and a worrying one, not to mention the one regarding the competence of people who lost live smallpox samples for four decades.

LawfulGood on August 1, 2014 at 10:00 AM

Really? You haven’t disproved anything and you sound like you don’t know anything.

LawfulGood on August 1, 2014 at 10:00 AM

But there has been numerous comments on this thread that has given you the hard science, yet you whimper like a scared puppy.

This disease is spread similar to HIV. Have you become HIV positive in the last 20 years? I didn’t think so. Just keep doing the same thing that you have been doing to prevent yourself from coming down with AIDS.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 10:05 AM

Oops, ferkata formatting…

ebola actually is a threat, so again… stfu, thanks
So is being hit by a meteorite

Just not a huge one; as mentioned, there are bigger known disease risks to get the shpikles over if that is what you want.

A quarantined disease bomb in the middle of a vastly more densely-populated place is less dangerous than one out in some rinky-dink armpit of the Earth? Sorry, not buying it.

Conarky, Guinea, one of the outbreak locations (un-quarantined disease) has about the same population density as Miami, not exactly rinky-dink, and only about 100 cases.

This is what I am getting at, Midas, ordinarily calm and rational people are making assumptions and not bothering to stop and look up easily accessible facts that bear on the situation, and help give perspective.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:06 AM

How would you like to be the next patient aboard that aircraft?

BobMbx on August 1, 2014 at 10:09 AM

To me? No. In either case you knew when you signed on for the job: “RISK OF DEATH” spelled out in 10-foot LawfulGood on August 1, 2014 at 10:00 AM

Just so I’m clear…if a Soldier goes overseas and is infected with an infectiouse desease then it is your opinion that the soldier is simply left in country to die on their own, because risk of death was written on a wall someplace on some military installation in 10 foot high letters… please correct me if I’ve mis intrepreted your response …

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 10:11 AM

This is what I am getting at, Midas, ordinarily calm and rational people are making assumptions and not bothering to stop and look up easily accessible facts that bear on the situation, and help give perspective.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:06 AM

Why take the risk at all? This is like an employer only paying for 16 of the 20 approved birth control pills. Devastating. Epic. End of the world kind of stuff.

BobMbx on August 1, 2014 at 10:12 AM

Conarky, Guinea, one of the outbreak locations (un-quarantined disease) has about the same population density as Miami, not exactly rinky-dink, and only about 100 cases.
F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:06 AM

I suspect that if 100 Miami citizens started bleeding out of every bodily orifice as they died a horrific death, that might – for some odd reason – cause a wee bit of concern in the nation.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 10:13 AM

$10 says “The Andromeda Strain” shows up on cable this weekend.

BobMbx on August 1, 2014 at 10:14 AM

$10 says “The Andromeda Strain” shows up on cable this weekend.

BobMbx on August 1, 2014 at 10:14 AM

I’d bet on “The Stand”.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 10:17 AM

This is what I am getting at, Midas, ordinarily calm and rational people are making assumptions and not bothering to stop and look up easily accessible facts that bear on the situation, and help give perspective.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:06 AM

Was the doctor in question using protective gear and protocols to prevent spread of the contagion, both to himself and others?

Did that work, yes or no?

These are “easily accessible facts that bear on the situation, and help give perspective”. Perhaps you should look them up? No one is wild-eyed making-stuff-up, here. Some folks seem to want to ignore the fact that protocols and procedures they insist will prevent any possible spread of the disease here, in a more populous environment… failed in the first place, and are the reason we’re having this discussion to begin with.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 10:20 AM

How would you like to be the next patient aboard that aircraft?

Do you think they just strapped him in and took off ?

He traveled in a biocontainment unit like this, and it was likely a dedicated medical transport aircraft, so it would have been cleaned and decontaminated afterwards regardless.

As ordinary bleach and detergents will inactivate the virus, it wouldn’t bother me in the least to be the next patient.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:21 AM

my son was playing a game yesterday that the goal is to design and spread a disease and try to wipe out the world. He said the hard part was getting it to spread.
flahockey on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

Our folks just got us an “Etch A Sketch”.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 9:54 AM

LOL…I love those things!!

Yeah, things have changed. Mine program new games or make “mods” that they share with friend…whatever happened to riding bikes in and out of traffic all day.

flahockey on August 1, 2014 at 10:21 AM

Yeah, things have changed. Mine program new games or make “mods” that they share with friend…whatever happened to riding bikes in and out of traffic all day.

flahockey on August 1, 2014 at 10:21 AM

… and… WE LIKED IT!

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 10:22 AM

Conarky, Guinea, one of the outbreak locations (un-quarantined disease) has about the same population density as Miami, not exactly rinky-dink, and only about 100 cases.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:06 AM

So we shouldn’t be concerned?

BobMbx on August 1, 2014 at 10:25 AM

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 9:13 AM

Do not reply to me if you are going to lump me in with the others. My comment was not a fearful one. I know what I’m talking about regarding experimental treatment. Now kindly, GFY.

DisneyFan on August 1, 2014 at 10:26 AM

DemetriusPhalerum on July 31, 2014 at 10:39 PM

I still have that book, one of the scariest I have ever read. The Kindle edition is quite affordable and it seems to have been updated in 2012.

The lab was in Reston VA, not very far away from DC. That particular strain of disease was apparently spread through airborne transmission. Fortunately it didn’t jump species. But virii are known for their ability to mutate.

The thing that struck me about the current outbreak of ebola is that it has hung on for so long – it’s usually too aggressive to do that and usually burns itself out in weeks. I think the difference is that it’s not in a rural area this time.

Shay on August 1, 2014 at 10:27 AM

Yeah, things have changed. Mine program new games or make “mods” that they share with friend…whatever happened to riding bikes in and out of traffic all day.

flahockey on August 1, 2014 at 10:21 AM

There woulda been no way we kids could have stayed inside playing all day, except maybe in winter, even if we wanted to. It would be outside until it was time to eat and at nightfall. Great times.

Whatever happened to being able to leave your bike just about anywhere without a lock and it not bring gone when you came back to it? Of course, we did more walking than we did biking then – not as many fat kids back in the day!

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 10:31 AM

Calm down people. The CDC knows exactly what it’s doing. Not a smidgeon of incompetence.

Xavier on August 1, 2014 at 10:32 AM

I suspect that if 100 Miami citizens started bleeding out of every bodily orifice as they died a horrific death, that might – for some odd reason – cause a wee bit of concern in the nation.

You miss the point, LawfulGood was assuming these outbreaks are ocurring in the middle of nowhere, whereas they are in dense population centers as well.

Was the doctor in question using protective gear and protocols to prevent spread of the contagion, both to himself and others?

At the point he became infected, neither you or I know. We can assume that they were using PPE and protocols to the extent they were able, but extent in Liberia is not the same as extent in Atlanta. For all you or I know, they could have run out of gloves, for example, but he went on treating regardless; given his obvious character to be there in the first place, I doubt that he would have stopped.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:35 AM

Pray for Whitebol and Brantly (or send good vibes or whatever your thing is). They’re both brave people trying to serve others in the worst of conditions, and they’re clearly wonderful servants.

They should not have been allowed back in. Whoever made the decision to let these two in should be tried and sent to prison for life because they have put society in danger at a level beyond comprehension. And for no good reason.

If the two patients did not demand to NOT come back then they are both selfish sacksOS with little care for anyone or anything. Brave? It doesn’t sound like it. Wonderful servants? Tell me about it if anyone here catches Ebola from them.

This whole situation is insane from every side. You don’t import people with Ebola. No one. Ever. And decent people with Ebola demand not to come back, so as not to put their countrymen at risk.

WTFFFF?

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on August 1, 2014 at 10:37 AM

Do not reply to me if you are going to lump me in with the others. My comment was not a fearful one. I know what I’m talking about regarding experimental treatment.

So enlighten us, are you talking about something like this or this ? Maybe something that hasn’t gotten beyond primate tests ?

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:44 AM

The disease is not air-borne as long as they are quarantined/isolated.

It reduces the risk.

weedisgood on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

I guess the science is settled then, right?

Oil Can on August 1, 2014 at 10:46 AM

WTFFFF?

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on August 1, 2014 at 10:37 AM

And the earth is flat!!!

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 10:47 AM

Fellas, there’s something you’re forgetting: Ebola is a virus. If it “burned itself out,” it would not have existed for the last 38 years in the wild. Viruses don’t live and die like bacteria do, and there is every reason to believe that filoviruses are much heartier than HIV.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:47 AM

After reading this thread, it’s no wonder liberals are always making fun of conservatives and their vague grasp of science.

If I didn’t know better, I would think I was reading a thread on Alex Jones’ website.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 9:46 AM

This is a dumb comment. There are a lot of people in this thread who are worrying over nothing, but to tie that into the “conservatives don’t know science” BS is just stupid. Go on a left wing site and you’ll see people freaking out about GMOs, vaccines, or some other thing. In fact, there are several threads over at DU about this very freaking topic. And guess what, many of them are worried just like some here are. You are helping the Left when you make a comment like the quoted.

DisneyFan on August 1, 2014 at 10:48 AM

The disease is not air-borne as long as they are quarantined/isolated.

It reduces the risk.

weedisgood on August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

And yet, as the Reston incident of 1989 proved beyond a reasonable doubt, the risk is non-zero. Would you explain to me why you feel comfortable letting our federal government handle this in such a manner?

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:48 AM

After reading this thread, it’s no wonder liberals are always making fun of conservatives and their vague grasp of science.

If I didn’t know better, I would think I was reading a thread on Alex Jones’ website.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 9:46 AM

Does it not bother you that four crab eating macaques escaped in 1989 and could have caused the death of tens of thousands of people unchecked in the greater DC area? It is because of my solid grasp of science and my ability to understand history that this frightens me. You may find the risk of having our government deal with known fatal filoviruses acceptable, but I do not.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:51 AM

If it “burned itself out,” it would not have existed for the last 38 years in the wild. Viruses don’t live and die like bacteria do, and there is every reason to believe that filoviruses are much heartier than HIV.

I believe he meant the outbreak “burned itself out”, not the virus, and as viral infections also generally conform to Koch’s postulates, it is not an inaccurate statement.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:53 AM

Please pray for Dr. Brantley and Ms. Whitebol. They are two incredibly selfless individuals.

Ward Cleaver on August 1, 2014 at 10:53 AM

I suspect that if 100 Miami citizens started bleeding out of every bodily orifice as they died a horrific death, that might – for some odd reason – cause a wee bit of concern in the nation.

You miss the point, LawfulGood was assuming these outbreaks are ocurring in the middle of nowhere, whereas they are in dense population centers as well.
F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:35 AM

I think you missed mine. “Ordinarily calm and rational people” would likely take note of such a thing. They might even suspect it’s could be cause for concern seeing 100 citizens in one city die from a particularly dreadful contagious disease that was brought here for no reason.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 10:54 AM

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on August 1, 2014 at 10:37 AM

Guess we should hold the life flight pilots responsible also? I used to fly life flight missions (fixed wing) and would have taken this flight, thus I must not be a decent decent person. Hey, you already knew that…Chuckle!

HonestLib on August 1, 2014 at 10:54 AM

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 10:47 AM

Fear is THE most powerful emotion a person can feel. You see how it turns rational folks into slobbering hatefilled animals who would gladly leave Americans to die in far away places… sad really.

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 10:56 AM

You may find the risk of having our government deal with known fatal filoviruses acceptable, but I do not.

Yet they have been for decades. The unacceptable risk is not screening
the hordes at the border.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:56 AM

I believe he meant the outbreak “burned itself out”, not the virus, and as viral infections also generally conform to Koch’s postulates, it is not an inaccurate statement.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:53 AM

That doesn’t mean that everyone outside of that outbreak is safe. The outbreak of 1976, in which the existence of filoviruses and sapient hemorrhagic fever were discovered, wiped out entire villages along a wide swath of the Zaire river valley. And here we are fighting it again, facing the non-zero chance that the virus could enter a major urban population center right here on American soil.

You think polio was bad? You think measles is bad? Boy-howdy, you ain’t seen nothing yet.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:57 AM

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:51 AM

I agree with you. How many victims will it take until a local health system is overloaded? And at that point we are really screwed.

Why is that such a hard concept for people to understand. One mistake and we a screwed. How is one person worth that? At least to pick on isolated located that can be locked down. It’s is beyond common sense.

Ugh…I’m guess I’m one of those people Obama says that clutches my bible and my guns out of fear.

Oil Can on August 1, 2014 at 10:58 AM

Yet they have been for decades. The unacceptable risk is not screening
the hordes at the border.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:56 AM

And over the course of decades, they let monkeys with hemorrhagic fever into the DC beltway, and lost vials of smallpox. Does this not bother you? Not one bit?

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:59 AM

Was the doctor in question using protective gear and protocols to prevent spread of the contagion, both to himself and others?

At the point he became infected, neither you or I know. We can assume that they were using PPE and protocols to the extent they were able, but extent in Liberia is not the same as extent in Atlanta. For all you or I know, they could have run out of gloves, for example, but he went on treating regardless; given his obvious character to be there in the first place, I doubt that he would have stopped.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:35 AM

Ah, well look who is uninformed and unwilling to look things up.

As of last night, the information indicated that they were using isolation suits and protocols, and were exhausted, and somehow mistakes were apparently made.

So yes, we do know, based on information that’s available (sorry if that’s inconvenient). To your point – for all we know they ran out of gloves – and yet, for all we know, they didn’t, correct? You seem eager to go out of your way to fabricate scenarios that contradict what *is* known – why is that? Seriously, why are you doing that?

And as to exhaustion, I’m sure that never happens to medical staff under extreme conditions in Atlanta either, right?

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 11:00 AM

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 10:51 AM
Are you suggesting that we close down the CDC? How about Mauntok (sp?) island? How do you propose we ( the U.S.) goes about studying the effects and cures for the many deadly ‘critters’ that are out there? If that is your position how does that differ from the gun grabbers cailming that 1 person shot up a school out of the millions of gun owners in America…therfore all guns should be banned crowed?

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 11:01 AM

Oh I just love it when people who tell me I have nothing to fear use language like “…neither you or I know.” and “We can assume…”

Keep it up, CDC apologists!

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:02 AM

You are helping the Left when you make a comment like the quoted.

DisneyFan on August 1, 2014 at 10:48 AM

No. Comments like the ones I was referencing help the left. Don’t put the responsibility on me for fear-filled-uninformed-alex-jones-like comments.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:03 AM

Are you suggesting that we close down the CDC? How about Mauntok (sp?) island? How do you propose we ( the U.S.) goes about studying the effects and cures for the many deadly ‘critters’ that are out there? If that is your position how does that differ from the gun grabbers cailming that 1 person shot up a school out of the millions of gun owners in America…therfore all guns should be banned crowed?

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 11:01 AM

I’m suggesting that given the CDC’s track record of handling potentially fatal diseases, they should not so much as entertain the thought of allowing a known 60-90% fatal vector on American soil. What I think of the CDC’s existence as an arm of the federal government, you can about guess. America survived just fine without it before 1946.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:04 AM

No. Comments like the ones I was referencing help the left. Don’t put the responsibility on me for fear-filled-uninformed-alex-jones-like comments.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:03 AM

GFY. I’m not the one using language like “We can assume…” in this thread in reference to a fatal disease vector.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:05 AM

Fear is THE most powerful emotion a person can feel. You see how it turns rational folks into slobbering hatefilled animals who would gladly leave Americans to die in far away places… sad really.

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 10:56 AM

LOL, says the hypocrite that castigates folks for being emotional in the first sentence, then looses some weapons-grade emotion-ridden douchebaggery in the second.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 11:05 AM

And as to exhaustion, I’m sure that never happens to medical staff under extreme conditions in Atlanta either, right?

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 11:00 AM

It won’t since there are hundreds of local docs and technicians nearby trained in this sort of isolation based care.

We’re not talking about some field hospital in the wilderness where the nearest back up is in some hut 60 miles away.

Make some sense man!

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:05 AM

Fear is THE most powerful emotion a person can feel. You see how it turns rational folks into slobbering hatefilled animals who would gladly leave Americans to die in far away places… sad really.

Von Kleist on August 1, 2014 at 10:56 AM

Just out of curiosity, you have any relatives who fought in WWI or WWII? Douchebag.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:06 AM

Oh I just love it when people who tell me I have nothing to fear use language like “…neither you or I know.” and “We can assume…”

Keep it up, CDC apologists!

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:02 AM

I would agree that “Who knows?” isn’t nearly as persuasive as some folks believe it to be.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 11:06 AM

If you really think this is the first case, you’re extremely naive.

SirGawain on August 1, 2014 at 11:06 AM

GFY. I’m not the one using language like “We can assume…” in this thread in reference to a fatal disease vector.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:05 AM

And where did I use “we can assume…?” I’ve already won the debate when you have to resort to cursing. Lowest common denominator tactics are not good enough to shut me up. Try some common sense.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:08 AM

I believe he meant the outbreak “burned itself out”, not the virus, and as viral infections also generally conform to Koch’s postulates, it is not an inaccurate statement.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:53 AM

Correct. Sorry I was unclear.

Shay on August 1, 2014 at 11:09 AM

The risks involved in bringing these two back to the U.S. are vanishingly small in terms of spreading infection to their health care workers (who will be taking appropriate precautions) and nil in terms of causing an outbreak in the population.

If you want to worry about Ebola or Marburg, worry about them eventually being used in a bioterrorism attack.

justltl on August 1, 2014 at 11:10 AM

And where did I use “we can assume…?” I’ve already won the debate when you have to resort to cursing. Lowest common denominator tactics are not good enough to shut me up. Try some common sense.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:08 AM

You didn’t. FX Muldoon did. And he agrees with you.

At the point he became infected, neither you or I know. We can assume that they were using PPE and protocols to the extent they were able, but extent in Liberia is not the same as extent in Atlanta. For all you or I know, they could have run out of gloves, for example, but he went on treating regardless; given his obvious character to be there in the first place, I doubt that he would have stopped.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 10:35 AM

[emphasis mine]

So yeah. There’s that. I assume nothing. I know beyond a reasonable doubt that the Reston, VA isolation lab avoided killing numerous thousands of people in DC and the surrounding area for the sole reason that they got stupid-lucky. If that doesn’t bother you, maybe you need to think about why it doesn’t.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:12 AM

The risks involved in bringing these two back to the U.S. are vanishingly small in terms of spreading infection to their health care workers (who will be taking appropriate precautions) and nil in terms of causing an outbreak in the population.

If you want to worry about Ebola or Marburg, worry about them eventually being used in a bioterrorism attack.

justltl on August 1, 2014 at 11:10 AM

What about the risk of studying crab eating macaques? “Vanishingly small” = non-zero.

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:13 AM

It won’t since there are hundreds of local docs and technicians nearby trained in this sort of isolation based care.
Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:05 AM

Sierra Leone’s top Ebola doctor is dead from Ebola

“Even with the full protective clothing you put on, you are at risk.”

A papercut thin slice gone unnoticed in such gear and all the “docs and technicians” in the world can’t help you – that’s even if they know of it in time.

whatcat on August 1, 2014 at 11:14 AM

Guess we should hold the life flight pilots responsible also? I used to fly life flight missions (fixed wing) and would have taken this flight, thus I must not be a decent decent person. Hey, you already knew that…Chuckle!

HonestLib on August 1, 2014 at 10:54 AM

I don’t know what you’re talking about. Did you actually HAVE any known, dangerous communicable disease that didn’t exist on our soil prior?

I didn’t say that people who had been in the area shouldn’t be allowed back in, only those who are actually infected. Why do you have a problem with that? You think that the logistics of transporting Ebola infected people to isolation (where even a small traffic accident on the way could prove fatal to many and to society) to being a new virus to our shores (not in test tubes but in people) is a good idea??

Those who have been in contact should have to wait in quarantine until it’s known that they aren’t infected before they are allowed back in – which should be obvious and clear to all. But those who are infected should NOT be allowed back in. Period. If the CDC wants to study them they can go abroad or bring those patients to Gitmo or something. Otherwise, the CDC can get samples of the virus, itself, to study (though the CDC is enough of a threat being trusted to just keep dangerous viral samples secure).

Yes, I think these two Ebola-infected people are selfish PiecesOS for even wanting to come back (assuming they had the choice). Anyone who came into contact with them should have to go through quarantine, themselves, to make sure they are clean.

You don’t mess around with something like Ebola.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on August 1, 2014 at 11:15 AM

Try some common sense.

Walter L. Newton on August 1, 2014 at 11:08 AM

Says the pompous fellow who claims medical staff don’t ever experience exhaustion.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 11:16 AM

The risks involved in bringing these two back to the U.S. are vanishingly small in terms of spreading infection to their health care workers (who will be taking appropriate precautions) and nil in terms of causing an outbreak in the population.

If you want to worry about Ebola or Marburg, worry about them eventually being used in a bioterrorism attack.

justltl on August 1, 2014 at 11:10 AM

The risks just from the logistics of transporting them are not vanishingly small. One traffic accident on the way from the airport could be disastrous.

You don’t bring live Ebola-infected patients into the land just because you think that there’s no chance of any problems. You just don’t. It’s a risk/reward calculation and there’s no reward, at all, for bringing them back so there’s nothing but risk in that assessment – and the risk is most certainly much greater than “vanishingly small”.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on August 1, 2014 at 11:18 AM

That doesn’t mean that everyone outside of that outbreak is safe. The outbreak of 1976, in which the existence of filoviruses and sapient hemorrhagic fever were discovered, wiped out entire villages along a wide swath of the Zaire river valley.

There were actually two distinct outbreaks, one in DR of Congo, one in Sudan. The case fatality rate for Congo was 88% when no one knew what the going on or how to treat even if treatment had been available, the Sudan outbreak, 53%. Whole villages were wiped out is scary sounding, but you have to consider the “village” is an aggregation of huts in this instance, and that there was near zero medical help available, and that in both outbreaks, the total dead was 431 of 602 cases.

You think polio was bad? You think measles is bad? Boy-howdy, you ain’t seen nothing yet.

OK, let us do a little basic epidemiology, what is the attack rate for the current outbreak ? So far, even in Conarky, the most densely populated area of the outbreak, it is about 6/100,000 if you want to compare it to measles in an unprotected population.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 11:19 AM

I hope Whitebol and Brantly survive and recover quickly.

How many infected with Ebola have crossed our southern border?

Has AQ collected samples?

dogsoldier on August 1, 2014 at 11:20 AM

The risks involved in bringing these two back to the U.S. are vanishingly small in terms of spreading infection to their health care workers (who will be taking appropriate precautions) and nil in terms of causing an outbreak in the population.

If you want to worry about Ebola or Marburg, worry about them eventually being used in a bioterrorism attack.

justltl on August 1, 2014 at 11:10 AM

You missed the part of the story where the two people in question were ‘taking appropriate precautions’ (yes, based on the facts as they are known now) and were infected anyway, I take it.

Vanishingly small, indeed.

Midas on August 1, 2014 at 11:22 AM

OK, let us do a little basic epidemiology, what is the attack rate for the current outbreak ? So far, even in Conarky, the most densely populated area of the outbreak, it is about 6/100,000 if you want to compare it to measles in an unprotected population.

F X Muldoon on August 1, 2014 at 11:19 AM

And growing. The outbreak shows no signs of abating yet, and though it has followed predictable epidemiological patterns so far, it is wholly unknown how long it will take to subside. It’s bad, but what makes it particularly bad is that there’s no way to know just how bad it’s going to get. And you’re apparently okay with the non-zero chance of this happening on American soil.

/Facepalm

gryphon202 on August 1, 2014 at 11:22 AM

These posts could have been about HIV twenty years ago…amazing how similar people fear of the unknown is…

right2bright on August 1, 2014 at 11:22 AM

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