IRS IT officials testify in court that Lois Lerner’s emails may still exist

posted at 9:21 am on July 25, 2014 by Noah Rothman

On Wednesday, House Republicans revealed that at least one Internal Revenue Service official believes that it is possible that the agency did not “recycle” all of the hardware and backup tapes on which were stored former IRS executive Lois Lerner’s missing emails. This development may contradict testimony from IRS Commissioner John Koskinen who told members of Congress that none of Lerner’s emails could be recovered.

The claim came from Stephen Manning, an IRS IT official, and Todd Egaas, director of technology operations and investigative services for the tax collection agency. Both testified in the U.S. District Court in Washington D.C. last week about the IRS’s efforts to collect and recover data from Lerner’s hard drive.

According to Washington Post reporter Josh Hicks, both officials’ testimony suggests that Lerner’s emails may still be out there.

The IRS apparently created a help-desk ticket for Lerner on June 13, 2011, when her hard drive crashed. According to that ticket, a “mid-level specialist” attempted to recover the data that was damaged on Lerner’s hard drive, but it was unrecoverable.

The following months, the hard drive was sent to the IRS’s forensics division where, according to Egaas’ testimony, “all of the analyst’s attempts” to recover Lerner’s lost data were unsuccessful.

Manning added that, once it had been determined that the data on Lerner’s hard drive was unrecoverable, it was magnetically erased and subjected to IRS disposal and recycling procedures.

However, the officials’ testimony left open the possibility that Lerner’s emails may still exist on other hard drives that were not scrubbed.

* The hard-drive crash occurred with Lerner’s laptop. This may or may not be significant, as it leaves open the possibility that she may have stored e-mails on two hard drives — one from the laptop that crashed, and perhaps another from a desktop computer.

* Manning said Lerner’s laptop hard drive did not have a tracking code. He said the IRS does not place such codes on internal components. Nonetheless, the company that supplied the laptop recently provided the IRS with a serial number for the part. This is important because investigators could use the number to track down the device if it has not been destroyed.

Politico’s take on these revelations is instructive.

“Meanwhile, some tech professionals have suggested that the IRS, or the disposal company it worked with, should have an invoice or ‘certificate of destruction’ proving that Lerner’s email is really gone. Koskinen isn’t sure they have one,” the Beltway political publication reported on Thursday. “Although Koskinen said he’s interested to learn how the Treasury inspector general discovered tapes that “we were advised … were recycled,” he has not inquired further because TIGTA asked the IRS to leave the lost emails matter alone while it completes its probe.”

Koskinen told congressional investigators that he is not “not talking to any potential witnesses about what happened three years ago.”

That’s an important detail, but much of the story about the testimony of these two IRS officials was devoted to the politics of the IRS scandal. How can Republicans capitalize on the “optics” that they have going for them? How can Democrats deflect, obscure, and shield the White House from being linked to this controversy? It is clear that Washington still views the IRS scandal as a political imbroglio and not a pressing allegation of corruption and malfeasance.


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Nothing to see here
-lsm

cmsinaz on July 25, 2014 at 9:24 AM

Who wants to go to jail for that witch? Anyone? Any takers?

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 9:25 AM

It still drives me nuts that people keep talking about her hard drive in reference to emails.

I find it incomprehensible her emails only existed on a local pst file.

ButterflyDragon on July 25, 2014 at 9:26 AM

Why do I still feel as if we’re ultimately going to find out that the stewards actually finished off the strawberries?

Find the damned emails and let’s start stringing some bureaucrats up by the short and curlies.

BuckeyeSam on July 25, 2014 at 9:27 AM

Well, more hard drives to destr… er… lose and er “recycle”.

WannabeAnglican on July 25, 2014 at 9:27 AM

Any IT person knew soon as they made the claims they were making they were lying.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 9:27 AM

On Wednesday, House Republicans revealed that at least on one Internal Revenue Service official believes

Fixed that for you. Do you EVER proof read you’re posts?

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:28 AM

Listened to two IT specialists on Rush yesterday, and they debunked the whole crashed hard drive charade. Work e-mails are almost certainly stored on servers, which also have back-up servers, so that if someone’s hard drive crashes, their data is recoverable. Does anyone, for one minute, think that the IRS doesn’t have massive server capacity and reliable back-up systems? When was the last time they had a “hard drive crash” and lost taxpayer information? Yeah, that’s what I thought.

College Prof on July 25, 2014 at 9:31 AM

It took getting them under oath to admit the truth…bringing them up before congress to answer questions is a waste of time…bring them under oath, in court, under the threat of prosecution, jail time, and you will get the truth much faster.

Lying to congress is no big deal, that has been shown time and again…

That arrogant Koskinen, needs to be sworn under oath, with a judge in a court room, and let’s see how “honest” he is with the threat of jail time…

right2bright on July 25, 2014 at 9:36 AM

Walt, Walt, Walt. Shall I fix yours?

Brat on July 25, 2014 at 9:37 AM

I’m sorry, but all the focus on her personal hard drive is irrelevant.
No large organization allows it’s employees to hold all their email solely on their personal computer, whether laptop or desktop, for precisely this reason.
There will be a local copy but the authoritative copy is on the mail server itself, which of course is routinely backed up. Those backups will be held for as long as law or policy dictate before being overwritten or deleted.
When her hard drive failed, she would have lost nothing, as the local copy would have been restored from the server when the new PC was put into service.e.
All the talk about crashed drives, etc., is just a red herring designed to confuse the issue in the mind of non-techie politicians and voters.
In the last 7 months I have had three laptops blue screen and die on me. (Thank you Dell.) I have never lost a single email as a result.

Curmudgeon on July 25, 2014 at 9:37 AM

Who wants to go to jail for that witch? Anyone? Any takers?

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 9:25 AM

Exactly…but there is no threat going before Issa, drag them into court and make them answer under oath…

right2bright on July 25, 2014 at 9:37 AM

That arrogant Koskinen, needs to be sworn under oath, with a judge in a court room, and let’s see how “honest” he is with the threat of jail time…

right2bright on July 25, 2014 at 9:36 AM

The whole reason why the IRS has changed it’s tune is BECAUSE a federal judge has dragged them before him and demanded they answer those questions under oath.

Koskinen knows that he can lie to Congress without consequence. But if he lies to a Federal Judge he’s going to prison. Hence the fact that all of a sudden they seem pretty sure they can retrieve those e-mails…

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 9:40 AM

That’s an important detail, but much of the story about the testimony of these two IRS officials was devoted to the politics of the IRS scandal. How can Republicans capitalize on the “optics” that they have going for them? How can Democrats deflect, obscure, and shield the White House from being linked to this controversy? It is clear that Washington still views the IRS scandal as a political imbroglio and not a pressing allegation of corruption and malfeasance.

Indeed it seems both Repubs and Dems are only concerned about the politics and/or optics. However it is media such as Politico who only like to report it as political instead of focusing on the crimes committed against us, the American public. And I think both sides are only concerned about getting past the November election and then this will either heat up, or fizzle out. I’m thinking the latter.

Brat on July 25, 2014 at 9:41 AM

In the last 7 months I have had three laptops blue screen and die on me. (Thank you Dell.) I have never lost a single email as a result.

Curmudgeon on July 25, 2014 at 9:37 AM

Dell sucks. Shitty hardware, even worse support.

My department only deploys HP and Apple.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 9:42 AM

Fixed that for you. Do you EVER proof read you’re posts?

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:28 AM

Someone left the irony on.

Throat Wobbler Mangrove on July 25, 2014 at 9:43 AM

My company is not the IRS. WE do not lose email.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 9:45 AM

When Dem O got elected, an atty friend of mine voiced concern that the “rule of law” would break down. And, if so, our nation.

Well, the “Rule of Law” has been ignored by dems in the highest places. So, why not cause a crash over hard drives that should be backed up in multiple places. I don’t know about readers here but every company and public unit I worked with while in the private sector, had required backups that eventually went off site. I refuse to believe there are no copies of LL’s emails as well as the other convenient crashes.

As for the “Rule of Law” – why bother when it is not enforced.

MN J on July 25, 2014 at 9:46 AM

Throat Wobbler Mangrove on July 25, 2014 at 9:43 AM

Beat me to it.. you’re and your are confusing.

TooTall on July 25, 2014 at 9:47 AM

Uh-oh. Obama’s gonna be FURIOUS when he reads about this in the paper. Oh wait, this won’t be in the paper so maybe he’ll never know.

Paperclips on July 25, 2014 at 9:47 AM

They won’t exist for long.

I’ll let the gentle readers figure out what (or who) I meant by “they”.

Steve Eggleston on July 25, 2014 at 9:47 AM

They won’t exist for long.

I’ll let the gentle readers figure out what (or who) I meant by “they”.

Steve Eggleston on July 25, 2014 at 9:47 AM

I’m guessing… but here goes!

The Hearsay Experts for You?

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 9:49 AM

My company is not the IRS. WE do not lose email.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 9:45 AM

We don’t either, and my IT budget per employee isn’t even .1% of what the IRS spends.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 9:50 AM

It is clear that Washington still views the IRS scandal as a political imbroglio and not a pressing allegation of corruption and malfeasance.

Really, Noah?? Don’t think so….and you know so. This goes straight to the WH and at least as high as the President’s chief counsel.

I think MSNBC is calling….

gracie on July 25, 2014 at 9:50 AM

If you don’t like this week’s IRS ‘story’, wait until next week for a new one.

GarandFan on July 25, 2014 at 9:51 AM

Anybody know which tropical Island Lois Lerner is living on these days?

ctmom on July 25, 2014 at 9:51 AM

Someone left the irony on.

Throat Wobbler Mangrove on July 25, 2014 at 9:43 AM

It was meant as an sarcastic example. I am a reporter for a newspaper. But at the same time, I don’t consider my blog comments to be an example of my ability to write good copy.

But Noah is probably getting paid a great deal more than I am for posting here.

Just trying to make a point. It seems that he constantly has copy riddled with mistakes.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:51 AM

I’ll let the gentle readers figure out what (or who) I meant by “they”.

Steve Eggleston on July 25, 2014 at 9:47 AM

“They” = whatever remains of the hard drive or any record of those emails

Close?

lineholder on July 25, 2014 at 9:52 AM

The IRS needs a reminder that Pitchforks and Torches>PenNPhone.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 9:53 AM

Fixed that for you. Do you EVER proof read you’re posts?

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:28 AM

It was meant as an sarcastic example.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:51 AM

ROFL

Bet you wish there was an edit function.

Bishop on July 25, 2014 at 9:56 AM

Oh please. Republicans are just taking the crumbs Democrats choose to dole out.

Dongemaharu on July 25, 2014 at 9:56 AM

It still drives me nuts that people keep talking about her hard drive in reference to emails.

I find it incomprehensible her emails only existed on a local pst file.

ButterflyDragon on July 25, 2014 at 9:26 AM

Back in the early days of NMCI, that is exactly were all emails were stored. I am not sure if that is still the case, but it was when I retired from the Navy a few years ago.

You only had a limited amount of space and once that was full you had to start deleting your local .pst files to be able to use your email. It was a pain too. If you really wanted to save something long term you had to print it out, scan it and save it on your H drive.

Most users I know got about 90 days or so of normal use before they started getting error messages.

Johnnyreb on July 25, 2014 at 9:57 AM

“may” being the key word here.
Where were these IT officials 2 months ago? Why weren’t they brought in to testify before this doofus Koskinen?
I think this is yet another stall tactic, designed to further confuse and/or obfuscate the original crime Lerner, et.al. committed. You know, that whole free speech thing?
They are trying to restore some credibility, hopefully before November, so that Obama can say that the “witchhunt” has been going on for months and months, and STILL not a smidgeon of evidence corruption anything.

leftamark on July 25, 2014 at 9:59 AM

“Here’s the serial number for Lerners’ hard drive. Send me a letter confirming that it has been destroyed.”

I said it months ago. Get the IT weenies into the hearing room, and put them under oath. That’s how you’ll find out what happened. Sometimes, the pawns get in the way of queen, and she gets zapped by a knight.

BobMbx on July 25, 2014 at 9:59 AM

Fixed that for you. Do you EVER proof read you’re posts? Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:28 AM

Someone left the irony on. Throat Wobbler Mangrove on July 25, 2014 at 9:43 AM

I’m a proofreader, and I’m cheap. Akzed on July 14, 2014 at 11:03 AM

And I’m Russian, so what’s you point? Walter L. Newton on July 14, 2014 at 11:06 AM

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 9:59 AM

ROFL

Bet you wish there was an edit function.

Bishop on July 25, 2014 at 9:56 AM

I do sometimes.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:00 AM

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 9:59 AM

So what’s your point Assheed?

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:01 AM

So far, the IRS episode has panned out pretty close to what our IT gurus have predicted. The dialogue shifts accordingly as the facts gradually worm their way to the surface.

“We lost all the emails in a hard drive crash.”

Like that was going to last long. You didn’t need a spy satellite to see the cracks in that dam.

“We recycle our backups.”

Uh huh.

“We may or may not have copies of those emails.”

Nice try, but I think some people are still in the “denial” stage.

As I posted once before, you can’t escape email. Once you send an email, you may as well say you weren’t in Las Vegas when your DNA is all over the VIP suite in the Bellagio. Same is true for receiving email.

Again, it is not a matter of “if” those emails surface – but when.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 10:02 AM

The odds that this court will order an outside forensics company to locate her emails just went up exponentially. The IRS has known all along the emails were available but didn’t want to cough them up. This is what the plantiffs have been arguing all along and the IRS IT people just stated it.

Mormaer on July 25, 2014 at 10:02 AM

So what’s your point Assheed? Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:01 AM

It’s just funny, someone who pretends not to be a native English speaker has the balls to correct the writing of those who are, and he makes grammatical errors. It’s fraud wrapped in hubris inside stupidity.

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 10:06 AM

The odds that this court will order an outside forensics company to locate her emails just went up exponentially. The IRS has known all along the emails were available but didn’t want to cough them up. This is what the plantiffs have been arguing all along and the IRS IT people just stated it.

Mormaer on July 25, 2014 at 10:02 AM

As I said, the reason for this sudden change of tone is because they are in front of courts now, and Koskinen takes the courts more seriously than he does Congress. Part of this is Congress’s fault, the first thing Issa should have done when the claim of lost mail was made was to drag the IT people in. And he never did.

The court did what Issa wouldn’t.

No federal IT flunky is going to lie to a judge and go to prison to protect Lerner.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:06 AM

Lawsuits and impeachment, ptuiii!

This administration is a Criminal Organization and should be fully prosecuted under the RICO laws.

ExZek on July 25, 2014 at 10:06 AM

The odds that this court will order an outside forensics company to locate her emails just went up exponentially. The IRS has known all along the emails were available but didn’t want to cough them up. This is what the plantiffs have been arguing all along and the IRS IT people just stated it.

Mormaer on July 25, 2014 at 10:02 AM

No one is ever going to find, ever going to see any emails that implicate Lerner or the White House in anything. That is a given.

It’s wishful thinking that this administration is going to do anything lawful. They have been, and will continue to tell the American public to f’k off. And they will get away with it.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:06 AM

Listened to two IT specialists on Rush yesterday, and they debunked the whole crashed hard drive charade. Work e-mails are almost certainly stored on servers, which also have back-up servers, so that if someone’s hard drive crashes, their data is recoverable. Does anyone, for one minute, think that the IRS doesn’t have massive server capacity and reliable back-up systems? When was the last time they had a “hard drive crash” and lost taxpayer information? Yeah, that’s what I thought.

College Prof on July 25, 2014 at 9:31 AM

Only the IRS is claiming they do their back-ups on TAPE drives*, and recycle the tapes after 6 months. I’d love to use that excuse during an audit – when we’re all supposed to keep our records for 7 YEARS.

*Hey Obama! The 80′s called and they want their tape drives back.

Hill60 on July 25, 2014 at 10:08 AM

It’s just funny, someone who pretends not to be a native English speaker has the balls to correct the writing of those who are, and he makes grammatical errors. It’s fraud wrapped in hubris inside stupidity.

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 10:06 AM

It funny that someone is stupid enough not to realize when I was f’king around (as is done by a lot of people here) and when I was being serious.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:08 AM

Lawsuits and impeachment, ptuiii!

This administration is a Criminal Organization and should be fully prosecuted under the RICO laws.

ExZek on July 25, 2014 at 10:06 AM

As a part of the Article V process, an amendment needs to be added giving the States the power to remove the President, judges, and other Federal officials when Congress refuses to do it’s duty. 2/3rds of the States should be sufficient to do this.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:08 AM

No one is ever going to find, ever going to see any emails that implicate Lerner or the White House in anything. That is a given.

I wouldn’t bet my life on that.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 10:09 AM

So what’s your point Assheed? Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:01 AM

That would be Asshead, wouldn’t it tovarish?

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 10:09 AM

Only the IRS is claiming they do their back-ups on TAPE drives*, and recycle the tapes after 6 months. I’d love to use that excuse during an audit – when we’re all supposed to keep our records for 7 YEARS.

*Hey Obama! The 80′s called and they want their tape drives back.

Hill60 on July 25, 2014 at 10:08 AM

We use a hardware based deduplication system (HP D2D) to store our backups, then back that up to tapes.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:10 AM

..EVENTAULLY, back in the 70s, they even got around to the fact that Nixon had tapes, too.

The e-mails will see the light of day some time in 2017, I’m guesing.

The War Planner on July 25, 2014 at 10:12 AM

she may have stored e-mails on two hard drives — one from the laptop that crashed, and perhaps another from a desktop computer

Are they to have us believe that that was the only way that emails are archived at the IRS? Are you f@cking kidding me?!

In this day and age of technological advances the IRS relied on their workers to save emails to their computers if the worker believed that they fell under archiving is just something I can’t see being done. There is no way in H3LL that the government would leave that up to their individual workers. Especially at the IRS. FOIA would be impossible.

When are we going to find out where their archive service was? Or who was responsible for servicing it.

Patriot Vet on July 25, 2014 at 10:15 AM

The e-mails will see the light of day some time in 2017, I’m guesing.

The War Planner on July 25, 2014 at 10:12 AM

Nah. I’m guessing sooner. But perhaps I haven’t factored in “government inefficiency” in my IT gut-formulas.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 10:15 AM

My company is not the IRS. WE do not lose email.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 9:45 AM

.
The NSA is ‘backing-up’ all of our (private citizens and business) emails … but I doubt they’re doing that for the IRS.

listens2glenn on July 25, 2014 at 10:18 AM

It funny that someone is stupid enough not to realize when I was f’king around (as is done by a lot of people here) and when I was being serious. Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:08 AM

You said on another thread that you were tryi8ng to understand Americans. Going along with your little game, I would advise that the “I was only joking” apologia doesn’t fly with them.

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 10:19 AM

I guess it’s one thing to lie under oath to Congress, but an altogether different thing to lie under oath in court. Could it be jail time? We need more honorable people and fewer politicians in our government.

savage24 on July 25, 2014 at 10:21 AM

The NSA is ‘backing-up’ all of our (private citizens and business) emails … but I doubt they’re doing that for the IRS.
listens2glenn on July 25, 2014 at 10:18 AM

Megyn Kelly got the opportunity to speak with former CIA and NSA head Michael Hayden tonight, and so she couldn’t resist asking him if the NSA would be able to retrieve the IRS emails that apparently got lost after Lois Lerner‘s hard drive crashed.

Hayden, of course, didn’t bite, telling Kelly that the NSA does not look at people’s emails.
~

Bill Binney, of course, disagrees.http://www.businessinsider.com/nsa-whistleblower-william-binney-was-right-2013-6

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 10:22 AM

..as a reformed grammar Nazi, I do agree with Walt Newton holding Noah’s feet to the fire – if done politely. The guy is PAID for his posts and should proofread them. Also, commenting using a tablet device is a beyotch. But I am sure Noah is using a QWERTY keyboard.

The War Planner on July 25, 2014 at 10:22 AM

The NSA is ‘backing-up’ all of our (private citizens and business) emails … but I doubt they’re doing that for the IRS.

listens2glenn on July 25, 2014 at 10:18 AM

Maybe I’m being cynical, but I doubt the NSA is that selective when it comes to “gathering data.”

Besides, since CARNIVORE in the ’80′s, they’ve shown no sign in relenting in constituting what DOESN’T qualify as relevant in their intelligence gathering methodology.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 10:23 AM

I am totally mystified as to why her laptop hard drive plays any role in this at all. In our company a copy of all of our emails stay on the server, as well as on the personal machine (s) of the user. IRS policy requires the same and, also, as I understood from the testimony I watched that the IRS takes one step further and are required to keep a physical (paper) copy of emails as well. So these emails exist, regardless of the state of her laptop, on the hard drives of her correspondents, on the hard drives of any other computers she regularly used, on the server and in paper form. This should be true, even if (as they say) the data on that one single laptop drive was unrecoverable. This should be true even if they assembled a big group of people to try to cover this stuff up.

What am I missing? I’m looking forward to the court testimony of the IT staff that was recently ordered. That’ll get more information than Congress has so far been able to extract, I’ll bet.

MTF on July 25, 2014 at 10:23 AM

Seriously, Noah, proofreading is your friend.
This self – admitted grammar Nazi has about had enough.

/rant off

LtGenRob on July 25, 2014 at 10:24 AM

Do you EVER proof read proofread you’re your posts?

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:28 AM

Do you? :)

Mark Boabaca on July 25, 2014 at 10:29 AM

This whole thing makes me want to pull my hair out!

I’m an IT Technician for a state government agency, so let’s get that important part out of the way.

Emails are not saved on the indiviual workstations!!!!! They are saved on a server. Outlook is likely used to it’s most likely on an Exchange server. They are also very, VERY likely backed up AT LEAST once a week.

The IRS is lying about this like crazy!!!!!

DethMetalCookieMonst on July 25, 2014 at 10:29 AM

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:10 AM

But do you recycle your tapes after 6 months? Do you threaten citizens with jail time for failure to produce documents going back 7 years – but expect us all to believe and accept that you have no reliable back up system beyond a six month window?

I understand that tape drives are still regularly employed – I just couldn’t resist taking a stab at the 80′s comment.

Hill60 on July 25, 2014 at 10:31 AM

As a part of the Article V process, an amendment needs to be added giving the States the power to remove the President, judges, and other Federal officials when Congress refuses to do it’s duty. 2/3rds of the States should be sufficient to do this.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:08 AM

Do you think, if this president leaves office, that Congress will try to pass such an amendment?
I know they limited the presidential terms to 2 after FDR, as “popular” as he was, but I’m just curious if, in this day and age, Congress or the public would have the smarts or the stones to do something to assure this kind of stuff doesn’t happen again.

leftamark on July 25, 2014 at 10:32 AM

“on Internal Revenue Service official”?

Ever hear of a word processor?

wdkeller on July 25, 2014 at 10:33 AM

Do you think, if this president leaves office, that Congress will try to pass such an amendment?
I know they limited the presidential terms to 2 after FDR, as “popular” as he was, but I’m just curious if, in this day and age, Congress or the public would have the smarts or the stones to do something to assure this kind of stuff doesn’t happen again.

leftamark on July 25, 2014 at 10:32 AM

The Article V amendment process doesn’t involve Congress.

It is the second method defined in the Constitution for amendments to be proposed, in this case, by the States themselves.

Reform of DC will NEVER come from within. It has to be forced on it from the outside.

There are two ways to do this defined by the Constitution: The Article V process and the Second Amendment…

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:35 AM

Do you? :)

Mark Boabaca on July 25, 2014 at 10:29 AM

Nope. And I’m not getting paid to worry about it.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 10:35 AM

I understand that tape drives are still regularly employed – I just couldn’t resist taking a stab at the 80′s comment.

Hill60 on July 25, 2014 at 10:31 AM

Just to add to the relevancy of the ’80′s – I might as well throw a plug for some “light” reading – from 1982:

The Puzzle Palace – James Bamford

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 10:35 AM

But do you recycle your tapes after 6 months? Do you threaten citizens with jail time for failure to produce documents going back 7 years – but expect us all to believe and accept that you have no reliable back up system beyond a six month window?

I understand that tape drives are still regularly employed – I just couldn’t resist taking a stab at the 80′s comment.

Hill60 on July 25, 2014 at 10:31 AM

No, I get threatened with my job if it doesn’t work.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:36 AM

Remember the summer of ’74 and Wawagate?

Same thing.

Any IT person knew soon as they made the claims they were making they were lying.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 9:27 AM

That’s why they couldn’t get away with it.

formwiz on July 25, 2014 at 10:38 AM

Soon missed the Walt Newton messages. Sorry for the rehash. However, it seriously is getting tedious. It’s getting to a point where I can’t/won’t click on a Noah piece.

LtGenRob on July 25, 2014 at 10:38 AM

Gah!”Sooo missed”
Bleh.

LtGenRob on July 25, 2014 at 10:39 AM

No, I get threatened with my job if it doesn’t work.

ConstantineXI on July 25, 2014 at 10:36 AM

Yup. My daily tapes are recycled by the day of the week – however, the monthly and yearly backups are permanent.

Turtle317 on July 25, 2014 at 10:39 AM

I find it incomprehensible her emails only existed on a local pst file.

ButterflyDragon on July 25, 2014 at 9:26 AM

They didn’t. The offsite company they used to back up IRS data has full and differential backups. They also backup all their backups to insure they can retrieve customers data.

The offsite company has no interest in going to jail for Lois or Koskinen, both of whom need orange jump suits ASAP.

dogsoldier on July 25, 2014 at 10:42 AM

All that aside, I work for a data management company. Every time I see the words “Lois Lerner’s hard drive” I want to punch a kitten.

LtGenRob on July 25, 2014 at 10:42 AM

LtGenRob on July 25, 2014 at 10:42 AM

Geez, “Backup tapes” must drive you into fits of apoplexy!

dogsoldier on July 25, 2014 at 10:43 AM

That’s why they couldn’t get away with it. formwiz on July 25, 2014 at 10:38 AM

Judge Napolitano has a great piece about the fiasco that is our current govt here.

“What if the late progressive Edmund S. Morgan was right when he said that government depends on make believe?”

Akzed on July 25, 2014 at 10:43 AM

But Noah is probably getting paid a great deal more than I am for posting here.

Just trying to make a point. It seems that he constantly has copy riddled with mistakes.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:51 AM

amen to that, brother!

ThisIsYourBrainOnKoch on July 25, 2014 at 10:44 AM

Sounds as if someone is trying to put some pressure on Lerner to be more forthcoming. I’m sure she has been assured that the hard drives were crashed on her behalf and she has nothing to worry about.
Go Trey!

Kissmygrits on July 25, 2014 at 10:47 AM

Oh please. Republicans are just taking the crumbs Democrats choose to dole out.

Dongemaharu on July 25, 2014 at 9:56 AM

Yes, all the IRS/Dem zig-zags are strawman diversions.

And the GOPe munch the crumbs, awaiting the end of the news cycle.

Tsar of Earth on July 25, 2014 at 10:53 AM

Geez, “Backup tapes” must drive you into fits of apoplexy!
dogsoldier on July 25, 2014 at 10:43 AM

That I can accept. It’s the idea that a single hard drive is going to matter. I can even almost guarantee, that someone of her rank, had her pc backed up. At minimum her documents folder.
Even if not, almost certainly she had a BlackBerry… which retrieved her mail from, wait for it… a server.

LtGenRob on July 25, 2014 at 10:55 AM

all this crap about hard drive is to mask that they are (possibly) not following the law regarding email (server level) retention and backup.

dmacleo on July 25, 2014 at 10:55 AM

Fixed that for you. Do you EVER proof read you’re posts?

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:28 AM

It was meant as an sarcastic example.

Walter L. Newton on July 25, 2014 at 9:51 AM

I never knew Walter was Pee Wee Herman (“I meant to do that.”).

Mitoch55 on July 25, 2014 at 11:09 AM

“A new wrinkle.”
I get it. Good one, Dad!

jbspry on July 25, 2014 at 11:11 AM

I feel pessimistic about the recovery of the e-mails. I full well believe they are recoverable. I know the IRS officials and Dems have a vested interest in their disappearance. My real fear is that the Rs do not want them to surface either. The ruling class wants a weaponized IRS at their disposal.

kpguru on July 25, 2014 at 11:12 AM

No doubt we’ll soon learn that those tapes were recorded over during a singalong at an office Christmas party. Darn the luck!

jbspry on July 25, 2014 at 11:12 AM

I’m just guessing, but I’ll bet from this point forward all subpenaed witnesses will demand closed door hearings.

partsnlabor on July 25, 2014 at 11:17 AM

I feel pessimistic about the recovery of the e-mails. I full well believe they are recoverable. I know the IRS officials and Dems have a vested interest in their disappearance. My real fear is that the Rs do not want them to surface either. The ruling class wants a weaponized IRS at their disposal.

kpguru on July 25, 2014 at 11:12 AM

As of now, IRS honchos do the partisan legwork for fun and kicks, but they will stick to the tiniest letter of the law with a Republican in the White House. The GOP will need to replace the entire IRS brass to weaponize it, so they are forced to get the ball rolling to justufy the oncoming mass firings.

Rix on July 25, 2014 at 11:19 AM

I just took a look at my Yahoo mail account. I still have old emails sitting around from June 2003. That’s 11 years ago and I can get to them in about 10 seconds. It only takes that long to get to them because they have to load from the server. The account is free to use. These IRS guys have god knows how much money to spend on IT and there saying all this crap?

They’re liars.

trigon on July 25, 2014 at 11:20 AM

there = they’re

Yep. I still can’t type.

IRS is going to find Jimmy Hoffa’s e-mails before we get an edit function.

trigon on July 25, 2014 at 11:23 AM

It’s now officially a race between those assigned to destroy the last copies of the e-mails and any whistleblower who doesn’t fear Ft. Marcy Park.

Steve Eggleston on July 25, 2014 at 11:23 AM

As a retired detective, this case drives me crazy. They are lying. I would demand to interview the actual techs who worked on the drive. In a depo with a supporting documents. It would be in depth and detail.

When did you get it. What was the damage. How did it occur. Was it similar to the damage on the other six computers?

If Lerner lost emails. And you had six months of them on tape. Did you reinstall those six months and where are they? On which computer? Further, who told you not to attempt to recover the data- please provide email chain.

Congress should not talk to anymore department heads. They are lying and aren’t worried about jail. Get “Fred the tech guy” in.

He will puke it up!

archer52 on July 25, 2014 at 12:03 PM

Get “Fred the tech guy” in.

He will puke it up!

archer52 on July 25, 2014 at 12:03 PM

Especially when lying will get him sent to federal “pound-you-in-the-@$$” prison.

CurtZHP on July 25, 2014 at 12:20 PM

O/T but funny in a sad & geo-strategically unhealthy way.

Reporter to Obama: “Hey Mr. President, how’s your relationship with Stephen Harper going?”

Obama: “Who??”

Sacramento on July 25, 2014 at 12:32 PM

It is clear that Washington still views the IRS scandal as a political imbroglio and not a pressing allegation of corruption and malfeasance.

Really? Is that fact or an opinion. It appears the jurists hearing the litigation launched by True the Vote and Judicial Watch are looking at this as a ‘pressing allegation of corruption and malfeasance’ not to mention possible criminality.

Even the House investigations are beginning to push harder as they get more evidence that the IRS testimony was deliberate evasive and an effort to derail those investigations.

Just about the only one’s seeing this as primarily a political imbroglio are the biased, corrupt mainstream media, the biased, corrupt Democrat members of the House Committees investigating, the biased and corrupt AG who is doing nothing to either investigate the IRS / Administration’s targeting of conservative organizations or prosecute Lerner for the contempt of Congress charge, and the WH which still claims ‘not one smidgen of corruption’ is present.

It’s now officially a race between those assigned to destroy the last copies of the e-mails and any whistleblower who doesn’t fear Ft. Marcy Park.

Steve Eggleston on July 25, 2014 at 11:23 AM

Steve is right, except this is really a three leg race… because the IRS is going to do all it can to prevent the jurists hearing those 2 cases from authorizing their IT forensic experts to investigate the missing emails, the crashed hard drives, and who is behind the IRS’s incredibly poor IT best practices – and if this was ordered from someone (Flax?) or SOP. An outside expert might be as good as any inside whistleblower.

Athos on July 25, 2014 at 12:46 PM

This reminded me of the scene in Princess Bride:

Gate Warden: What key? I haven’t got any key.
Inigo: Fezig, tear his arms off.
Gate Warden: Oh, you mean this key.

GWB on July 25, 2014 at 12:55 PM

Both myself and my colleagues in my department worked with the feds, some of us for awhile.

One thing about them that is rock solid is they never do anything without instructions and never end the activity without an after action report up the chain. There is a huge paper trail they are hiding.

That is why Congress is frustrated. It is IMPOSSIBLE for them to day they don’t know what happened, when, or who did it. Impossible.

archer52 on July 25, 2014 at 1:02 PM

You only had a limited amount of space and once that was full you had to start deleting your local .pst files to be able to use your email. It was a pain too. If you really wanted to save something long term you had to print it out, scan it and save it on your H drive.

Most users I know got about 90 days or so of normal use before they started getting error messages.

Johnnyreb on July 25, 2014 at 9:57 AM

Why not just copy the .pst file to your H drive?

Kaffa on July 25, 2014 at 1:29 PM

there = they’re
Yep. I still can’t type.

trigon on July 25, 2014 at 11:23 AM

Duckin’ auto-correct… ;-)

Newtie and the Beauty on July 25, 2014 at 4:58 PM

Miss Lamar

Schadenfreude on July 25, 2014 at 6:20 PM

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