Pelosi’s office retreats on Hobby Lobby “ban” claim

posted at 11:31 am on July 12, 2014 by Ed Morrissey

Earlier in the week, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi aptly captured the uninformed hysteria on the Left prompted by the Supreme Court’s Hobby Lobby decision. In a press conference on Thursday, Pelosi told reporters that the decision meant “[t]hat five guys should start determining what contraceptions are legal or not … [t]that five men should get down to the specifics of whether a woman should use a diaphragm[.]” Megyn Kelly shredded this claim on Fox News later that night in a memorable segment.

That caught the attention of Politifact, but also Pelosi’s office, which rushed to walk back the boss’ remarks with the fact-checkers. The site assigned Pelosi a “false” rating anyway, but they should have taken a closer look at the walkback, too (via Twitchy):

We can eliminate any reader suspense by sharing the response Pelosi’s office sent PolitiFact after we inquired: “She misspoke,” spokesman Drew Hammill acknowledged. “Obviously the impact of the court’s decision is not to make these four contraceptive methods illegal – i.e. no longer allowed to be sold.”

Hammill went on to explain that Pelosi’s “overriding point” was that the decision “does in fact limit access … which is the key point Pelosi made.” He pointed to portions of Associate Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg’s dissent in which Ginsburg notes that IUDs are expensive and that removing company support for them could leave some female employees without the “most effective” medical option for their needs.

No, that was not the “overriding point” — and even if it was, it’s still nonsense. The Hobby Lobby decision does not limit access, and access to birth control hasn’t been an issue since Griswold. Anyone who wants it can buy it, and any employer who desires to provide it as part of health insurance coverage is still free to do so. Eighty-five percent of employer-provided health insurance already did that before the HHS contraception mandate was imposed on businesses, while almost every plaintiff against the mandate did not. Moreover, the CDC’s 26-year study of unplanned pregnancies found no evidence of a lack of access to birth control as a contributing cause to the issue from 1982-2008.

The walkback itself perpetuated another lie, but Politifact skips it in favor of a regurgitation of the “ban” argument:

Indeed, one of Pelosi’s later comments from the news conference — when she focused on the issue of who pays for contraceptives, rather than whether they remain legal — seems to be on firmer ground. She expressed concern “that five men could get down to specifics of whether a woman should use a diaphragm and (whether) she should pay for it herself, or her boss. It’s not her boss’ business. The business is whatever his business is, but it’s not what contraception she uses.”

Is this really “on firmer ground”? It’s the same argument under another pretext — that by not paying for a woman’s contraception, it’s a de facto ban, this time by bosses rather than the courts. It again assumes that something is “banned” and inaccessible because you can’t get someone else to buy it for you. That’s absurd on its face, but oddly Politifact never really gets around to addressing this “firmer ground.” They just note that the courts aren’t going to ban contraception as a result of Hobby Lobby, and that women (and men) can still buy it on their own.

You know what that does? It makes it their own private business, and not that of their bosses the way it would if the employees demanded that the bosses pay for it. This should have gotten a “pants on fire” rating, and Politifact should have been more circumspect with their own claims within this fact check.

By the way, those aren’t the only claims needing a fact check these days. Remember when the Obama administration argued that contraception coverage would be cost-free to employers and insurers because of the savings it produces? The New York Times took a close look at that claim this week, and discovered that it’s also false:

Studies the departments cited are suggestive, but far from definitive. A fuller review of the literature on the cost and cost offsets of contraceptive coverage by Daniel Liebman, a colleague, finds that the evidence is thin that, from an insurer’s perspective, contraceptive coverage pays for itself in the long term. Moreover, it almost certainly does not in the short. The cost of contraceptive coverage is immediate, and the possible offsets (reduced pregnancies) are downstream, often years in the future. …

According to the IMS Institute for Healthcare Informatics, though the proportion of Americans with no cost-sharing for contraceptives rose in 2013 to 50 percent from 20 percent, prescriptions written for contraceptive medications increased only 4.6 percent.

But when they begin to fully cover contraception, insurers take on its full cost, “crowding out” the willingness of individuals to self-insure for it. Therefore, the government’s accommodation of religious organizations’ objections to covering contraception (obliging insurance companies to pick up the cost of the coverage, with no offsetting premiums or cost-sharing from either employees or employers) may impose a cost on insurers, even though contraception is cost-effective for society as a whole.

To be sure, insurers’ upfront costs may be low, a small fraction of overall premiums. However, just because it’s proportionally small doesn’t necessarily make it easy for insurers to handle. For this reason, the administration’s accommodation has already been met with some resistance. (A variant of the government’s accommodation includes a reimbursement by the government of contraceptive costs to some, but not all, insurers.)

The majority of the Supreme Court is correct in saying that the government has other means to ensure that women receive contraceptive coverage. But it is far less clear that that that coverage would be without cost, and it almost certainly would not be in the short term.

This does play a role in Obama administration’s argument in the so-called “accommodation,” as mentioned above. The idea is that by enabling the insurer to bypass the employer, the employer would have no burden on religious expression in part because premiums would remain stable, so they would not have to pay more for that coverage. There are other issues with the accommodation, but the core argument also fails. And if the government wants to cover those costs, they don’t have to force employers to act as their agents to do so.


Related Posts:

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

She said this in front of a throng of “journalists”……no one questioned her.

d1carter on July 12, 2014 at 11:38 AM

Boy, look at those two pictures side by side. Night and day.

Dongemaharu on July 12, 2014 at 11:40 AM

She said this in front of a throng of “journalists”……no one questioned her.

d1carter on July 12, 2014 at 11:38 AM

Yep. And the women “journalists” in the audience all shook their pointy heads and nodded in agreement. Thankfully the women of FOX news can still be heard.

VegasRick on July 12, 2014 at 11:42 AM

I would tell Nanzi to go suck a lemon, but it appears she already has.

Flange on July 12, 2014 at 11:42 AM

She said this in front of a throng of “journalists”……no one questioned her.

d1carter on July 12, 2014 at 11:38 AM

“journolist” today are nothing more than stenographers for the democrat party.

There is no fact-finding, no truth telling, no truth to power, no integrity and no ethics among modern “journolists”

HumpBot Salvation on July 12, 2014 at 11:42 AM

Boy, look at those two pictures side by side. Night and day.

Dongemaharu on July 12, 2014 at 11:40 AM

Nightmare – Daydream……………….

VegasRick on July 12, 2014 at 11:43 AM

In that picture, Nancy is saying,”NOOOOO, no more Botox!”

Doc Holliday on July 12, 2014 at 11:45 AM

God, she’s one ugly broad.

lostmotherland on February 26, 2014 at 4:09 PM

Imagine her without those layers and layers of makeup.

slickwillie2001 on July 12, 2014 at 11:46 AM

Contraception is the key issue of our time.
Remember–okay they were lying but still–when the Clintons were in office and all they talked about was having “a life of the mind”. They used to have Mandarin meet-ups at some swanky island resort. Renaissance Weekend or something. Now it’s all about having a life of the genitals. And the Obamas don’t have a thought in their heads along with everyone who voted for them.

vityas on July 12, 2014 at 11:49 AM

HumpBot Salvation on July 12, 2014 at 11:42 AM

EXACTLY!!!

____

Pelosi is really showing her age these days.

CoffeeLover on July 12, 2014 at 11:50 AM

She said this in front of a throng of “journalists”……no one questioned her.

d1carter on July 12, 2014 at 11:38 AM

Yup, and others including Luke Russert tweeted her comments with no mention of their falsity.

rockmom on July 12, 2014 at 11:51 AM

I think all that Botox done got in her widdle brain.

Conservative Mischief on July 12, 2014 at 11:51 AM

I despise that effing hag.

BallisticBob on July 12, 2014 at 11:54 AM

The fact that Nancy won’t pay for my Lamborghini is limiting my access to my desired sports car.

Doc Holliday on July 12, 2014 at 11:54 AM

Once again, you have to pass it to see what’s in it.

In that picture, Nancy is saying,”NOOOOO, no more Botox!”

Doc Holliday on July 12, 2014 at 11:45 AM

Actually, she’s saying,”NOOOOO, no more questions where I have to think!”

Pelosi is really showing her age these days.

CoffeeLover on July 12, 2014 at 11:50 AM

Yep, the neurons are just flaking off.

formwiz on July 12, 2014 at 11:54 AM

Megan is a rockstar

John the Libertarian on July 12, 2014 at 11:54 AM

In that picture, Nancy is saying,”NOOOOO, no more Botox!”

Doc Holliday on July 12, 2014 at 11:45 AM

God, she’s one ugly broad.

lostmotherland on February 26, 2014 at 4:09 PM

Imagine her without those layers and layers of makeup.

slickwillie2001 on July 12, 2014 at 11:46 AM

Guys, give her a break. That picture was taken right as she was being told about a house falling on her sister………..

VegasRick on July 12, 2014 at 11:55 AM

Megyn!!! Stop the autocorrect!,

John the Libertarian on July 12, 2014 at 11:55 AM

She does look like a carp or some other bottom feeder.

Flange on July 12, 2014 at 11:58 AM

PolitiFact. Interesting concept.

I remember when journalists were supposed to always report facts.

faraway on July 12, 2014 at 12:09 PM

Pelosi is really showing her age these days.

CoffeeLover on July 12, 2014 at 11:50 AM

I’ve heard she’s taken over as head wine-taster at the family’s three Northern California wineries.

slickwillie2001 on July 12, 2014 at 12:09 PM

Megyn did an update last night after Nanzi’s minion claimed she “misspoke”. Can’t find a link, but it was very entertaining television!

Naturally Curly on July 12, 2014 at 12:12 PM

I notice that even though Politifact rates it as false- they do their darndest to try to dig her out of that hole.

melle1228 on July 12, 2014 at 12:14 PM

So many falsehoods, so little accountability.

Mason on July 12, 2014 at 12:15 PM

She said this in front of a throng of “journalists”……no one questioned her.

d1carter on July 12, 2014 at 11:38 AM

Boom.

And, it’s like genetic flaw. What. Botox? Oh, nevermind.

Fallon on July 12, 2014 at 12:16 PM

When will Harry Reid retreat on “the five white men in robes”?

Schadenfreude on July 12, 2014 at 12:18 PM

Fifteen EBT credits to the first (D) who can correctly identify the three primary individuals responsible for passing the law she’s referencing which limits womens access to medical options.

rogerb on July 12, 2014 at 12:27 PM

Of course the contraception mandate isn’t cost-fee!

Otherwise, those evil insurance corporations would have given it away for free to save some more for their bottom lines.

blammm on July 12, 2014 at 12:31 PM

Even this hotair post, by a Catholic no less, gets it wrong. Hobby Lobby does in fact provide contraception coverage. They object to providing abortions.

Fenris on July 12, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Off topic

Since Hotair is pretending nothing is going on in Mississippi, here’s video of a press conference held yesterday that outlines the election fraud that took place in the Cochran race.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvK5inzIjVM#t=20

xblade on July 12, 2014 at 12:32 PM

access to birth control hasn’t been an issue since Griswold.

Pretty sure that some PP activist had to jump through hoops to get standing b/c he was trying to challenge a law that wasn’t enforced — i.e. access wasn’t really an issue in Griswold.

blockchords on July 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM

It again assumes that something is “banned” and inaccessible because you can’t get someone else to buy it for you.

You owe me free “recreational” drugs because, I want them free. BC is for recreational purposes for almost all women other than, those expecting to be raped sometime.

Jeff2161 on July 12, 2014 at 12:39 PM

“I have a birth canal so you gotta pay.” Where have I seen that logic before? No, dear, put the frying pan away please, it must have been in the book…

Rix on July 12, 2014 at 12:40 PM

Just to clarify my point, hormone therapy using BC was already covered and, is NOT what I’m referring to.

Jeff2161 on July 12, 2014 at 12:43 PM

A Democrat Lied? It’s getting to the point where you’re surprised when a Democrat tells the truth. The “All Politics, All the Time” party has really gotten worse since Obama was elected, and they’re doubling down since his re-election. We may never know how that happened, but we do know how seriously Democrats take their power and what they’re willing to do to retain it.

bflat879 on July 12, 2014 at 12:46 PM

Pelosi is really showing her age these days.

CoffeeLover on July 12, 2014 at 11:50 AM

What do you mean “these days”?

My theory is the day she hatched, 65 million years ago, the dinosaurs all took one look at her/it and became instantly petrified, including their poop!

That’s my theory, and I’m sticking to it.

ZeusGoose on July 12, 2014 at 12:53 PM

When are they going to catch on that all this birth control, abortion, etc. stuff is not to help them but to keep them from having babies. The marxists think there are too many people in the world.

crankyoldlady on July 12, 2014 at 12:53 PM

Nancy and Harry Reid are beyond delusional. One said 5 white men while the other makes no sense at all…of course Harry Reid is a white man talking about 5 white men minus the one black man who also voted for it….

sorrowen on July 12, 2014 at 12:54 PM

The requirement that employers pay for this is all of 12 months old for some plans, 3 months for others. Until then no major plan paid for any of these 20 items added in by the Obama administration, although you could get some public assistance for an IUD if you qualified. Talk about a parade of hysteria over nothing. Again we have distraction from real Obama failures.

pat on July 12, 2014 at 12:58 PM

When are they going to catch on that all this birth control, abortion, etc. stuff is not to help them but to keep them from having babies. The marxists think there are too many people in the world.

crankyoldlady on July 12, 2014 at 12:53 PM

The Dimocraps don’t need no steenkin’ U.S. babies to add to their voter rolls. They just import them from Central America!

ZeusGoose on July 12, 2014 at 12:59 PM

…the Obama administration argued that contraception coverage would be cost-free to employers and insurers because of the savings it produces…Period!

Oops.

Another Drew on July 12, 2014 at 1:04 PM

They should pass out pelosis picture, use it for birth control.

crosshugger on July 12, 2014 at 1:04 PM

TINSTAAFL

Resist We Much on July 12, 2014 at 1:04 PM

She said this in front of a throng of “journalists”……no one questioned her.

You forget, Pelosi’s handlers always insure that the Minority Idiot always speaks to a ‘friendly’ audience.

GarandFan on July 12, 2014 at 1:05 PM

The government, federal and state, limits when it will pay, through Medicaid, contraception for poor women.

If a woman doesn’t meet the income/eligibility requirements, she doesn’t get free contraception.

I guess that means the Obama Administration is banning contraception?

Silliness on top of silliness.

SteveMG on July 12, 2014 at 1:05 PM

On one hand we have Maryland Gov, O’Malley insisting we cannot send illegal immigrate children way to certain death, and on the other we have Nazi Pelosi insisting that we can’t murder our own children fast enough… Yes, this is the insanity we face today.

oscarwilde on July 12, 2014 at 1:16 PM

This specious idea that insurance or employers covering the cost of contraception for dem po’ he’pless wymynzez reduces unwanted pregnancies needs to be squashed like vermin.

When women of all ages, races and economic status want to avoid becoming pregnant, they a) avoid sexual activity, or b) use some method of contraception, be it chemicals, barriers or NFP.

Who pays and how its paid is factually not an issue, because when surveyed, fewer than 1% of women wishing to avoid pregnancy rely on the patented Hopey method (and they probably misunderstood the question in the survey anyway).

All the pregnancies which could be prevented by BC are already being prevented by BC; a third party payment will not effect these numbers, and whether the woman uses any contraception effectively and appropriately is also not a consequence of who paid for it.

So when our little proglodyte friends smarmily argue that employers being forced to pay for free birth control reduces pregnancies and abortions, don’t just smack them down verbally , but grind their tiny pointed heads into the dust.

Its for the children.

Dolce Far Niente on July 12, 2014 at 1:19 PM

Yup, and others including Luke Russert tweeted her comments with no mention of their falsity.

rockmom on July 12, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Were they not legacy hires, Luke Ressert would be reporting the hog futures on a 5,000 watt AM radio station in Iowa followed by Joe Beck calling the Burlington Bees Single A game.

bw222 on July 12, 2014 at 2:00 PM

Throughout the visit, four staff members spoke with and observed R.Z. and her step-father. All of them had opportunity to see that R.Z.’s birth date indicated she was only thirteen—well below the age of consent. Yet, none of them asked R.Z. about their relationship. None of them asked why their last names were different. None of them asked about potential sex abuse. And none of them reported anything to the state.

After the abortion, R.Z. walked back out to the parking lot, got into her step-father’s car, and went back home. And the abuse continued.

Two months later, on July 18, 2012, Timothy was outside of the home, and Cary was left alone with her daughter. Young R.Z. took the opportunity to tell her mom the news—her own step-father was sexually abusing her, and had been doing so for years.

Cary spun into action. She took the thirteen-year-old to the hospital and immediately reported the abuse. She contacted Planned Parenthood for her daughter’s medical records, and discovered that her husband had arranged for a secret abortion for R.Z. earlier that year.

http://www.lifenews.com/2014/07/11/planned-parenthood-sued-for-doing-abortion-on-raped-13-year-old-returning-her-to-rapist/

davidk on July 12, 2014 at 2:06 PM

four contraceptive methods

They are not CONTRAceptives.

davidk on July 12, 2014 at 2:08 PM

“Look at me!”, she says, waving her arms in the air.

claudius on July 12, 2014 at 2:11 PM

I just got back from the drug store after picking up my medication. I have to take it every day for actual medical reasons, you know, like I would be very sick or die without it. I have prescription coverage through my health insurance provider and it still costs me $25 bucks every time I pick it up. I’m okay with that. I’m not a pathetic excuse for a human being who needs to force others to provide for my needs, much less my immoral recreational desires.

These women almost make me ashamed to be a female. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us.

pannw on July 12, 2014 at 2:38 PM

The Democrats are not interested in providing free contraceptives to women. If they were Obama would just have HHS make a rule that any women could go into any pharmacy and get free contraceptives and the bill gets sent to the government.

What the Democrats are interested in is creating an issue so that young single women who aren’t paying attention to what is actually going on will vote for Democrats thinking they are preserving their access to contraceptives.

Tsuchino1 on July 12, 2014 at 2:52 PM

Anyone who wants it can buy it, and any employer who desires to provide it as part of health insurance coverage is still free to do so. Eighty-five percent of employer-provided health insurance already did that before the HHS contraception mandate was imposed on businesses,…

What that means, under Obamacare, is that, as an employee, I’m being forced to pay for contraceptives and abortifacients by my employer. My employer is in the 85% who have those coverages as part of their policy. And I’m not allowed to opt out. It’s got to be at least a minor factor

Seems the best solution is to not have employer policies — to have everyone contract with an insurer directly. Then we get the coverage we want, and nothing more, and nothing which is antithetical to our faith.

unclesmrgol on July 12, 2014 at 3:01 PM

Her remarks were definitely worthy of a “pants on fire” call out, rather than simply “false.”

cat_owner on July 12, 2014 at 3:39 PM

The fact that Nancy won’t pay for my Lamborghini is limiting my access to my desired sports car.
Doc Holliday on July 12, 2014 at 11:54 AM

[grabs sham-wow and Windex...tries ALT's *glare*...doesn't work...resumes mumbling under breath...]

Newtie and the Beauty on July 12, 2014 at 3:46 PM

Obamacare was intended to give medical care to the poor at the cost of the middle class. It is succeeding. Some people say that it’s main intention is to bankrupt the nation, but those are only the middle class whiteys who are complainin’.

HiJack on July 12, 2014 at 3:46 PM

Megyn did an update last night after Nanzi’s minion claimed she “misspoke”. Can’t find a link, but it was very entertaining television!
Naturally Curly on July 12, 2014 at 12:12 PM

Ask, and ye shall receive… ;-)

Newtie and the Beauty on July 12, 2014 at 3:47 PM

Obamacare was intended to give medical care to the poor at the cost of the middle class. It is succeeding. Some people say that it’s main intention is to bankrupt the nation, but those are only the middle class whiteys who are complainin’.
HiJack on July 12, 2014 at 3:46 PM

In order:

No it wasn’t
No it isn’t
It’s supposed to cripple/bankrupt the health insurance industry and make way for single-payer
No they aren’t.

Newtie and the Beauty on July 12, 2014 at 3:50 PM

IT’S A DEMOCRAT TALKING POINT!
WHO CARES IF IT’S TRUE OR FALSE.

From Powerline Blog July 11, 2014 by John Hinderaker
Dumb Dick Durbin Demagogues Hobby Lobby

Harry Reid has used similar formulation as will dozens of other elected and MSM Democrats over the rest of this election cycle. The White House will used slightly toned-down formulations but it’s a go-to play for the 2014 election game.

The Democrats are looking at their voter base: LBGT – check, Greens – check, unions – turnout down, blacks – turnout down, Hispanics – working it hard, Married women – trouble, GET THE SINGLE WOMEN, they are the Democrats only hope for holding the Senate.

ERGO, say over and over again that Republicans don’t want women to have access to contraception.

pilsener on July 12, 2014 at 3:54 PM

The idea is that by enabling the insurer to bypass the employer, the employer would have no burden on religious expression in part because premiums would remain stable, so they would not have to pay more for that coverage.

And we know how good the current administration is at predicting future prices for health insurance, right?

J.S.K. on July 12, 2014 at 3:58 PM

Obamacare was intended to give medical care to the poor at the cost of the middle class. It is succeeding. Some people say that it’s main intention is to bankrupt the nation, but those are only the middle class whiteys who are complainin’.
HiJack on July 12, 2014 at 3:46 PM

In order:

No it wasn’t
No it isn’t
It’s supposed to cripple/bankrupt the health insurance industry and make way for single-payer
No they aren’t.

Newtie and the Beauty on July 12, 2014 at 3:50 PM

Sorry. Forgot to add the snark tag.

HiJack on July 12, 2014 at 4:02 PM

Off topic

Since Hotair is pretending nothing is going on in Mississippi, here’s video of a press conference held yesterday that outlines the election fraud that took place in the Cochran race.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvK5inzIjVM#t=20

xblade on July 12, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Bump. And thank you for posting this link, xb.

If this evidence pans out, Some people might be looking at jail time for FEC violations. Hey, didn’t Lois Lerner used to work at the FEC? Well, nevermind – I’m sure we can count on them for a fair investigation…

And the same strategy appears to be popping up in Georgia, so here’s another race that HA can studiously ignore: Democrats Deploy Their Mississippi Strategy Against Jody Hice in Georgia

bofh on July 12, 2014 at 5:21 PM

Off topic

Since Hotair is pretending nothing is going on in Mississippi, here’s video of a press conference held yesterday that outlines the election fraud that took place in the Cochran race.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvK5inzIjVM#t=20

xblade on July 12, 2014 at 12:32 PM

This should be a separate thread and spread throughout the blogosphere. NOW!

HiJack on July 12, 2014 at 6:19 PM

Hypocrisy and obfuscation appear to be the acceptable foundational belief system these days. Nancy has now fully subscribed. She, as so many others do, may refer to herself as Catholic. Whether that is true is not a decision she is qualified to make. It is a word choosen by the speaker to represent what they themselves wish to be true, or what they would have others believe. The truth is only between each of us and God. How one lives is the path either through the narrow gate or not. Her statements of late would seem to indicate she has taken her pieces of silver and sold her soul. Although it is not my place to to judge anyone, it would appear that Nancy may well have succumbed to the false god Obama as her savior, despite her education in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, to the contrary.

peck on July 12, 2014 at 9:37 PM

Is this really “on firmer ground”? It’s the same argument under another pretext — that by not paying for a woman’s contraception, it’s a de facto ban, this time by bosses rather than the courts. It again assumes that something is “banned” and inaccessible because you can’t get someone else to buy it for you. That’s absurd on its face, but oddly Politifact never really gets around to addressing this “firmer ground.” They just note that the courts aren’t going to ban contraception as a result of Hobby Lobby, and that women (and men) can still buy it on their own.

You know what that does? It makes it their own private business, and not that of their bosses the way it would if the employees demanded that the bosses pay for it. This should have gotten a “pants on fire” rating, and Politifact should have been more circumspect with their own claims within this fact check.

Politifact doesn’t live up to its name?

Well, I am just shocked!!

Good job of fact checking the self-appointed fact checkers. More, please.

There Goes the Neighborhood on July 12, 2014 at 11:07 PM

Politifact doesn’t live up to its name?

Well, I am just shocked!!

Good job of fact checking the self-appointed fact checkers. More, please.

There Goes the Neighborhood on July 12, 2014 at 11:07 PM

Every one of the “self-appointed fact checkers” is just another liberal media scam.

slickwillie2001 on July 12, 2014 at 11:52 PM