IRS canceled e-mail back-up service – weeks after Lerner hard drive crash

posted at 9:21 am on June 23, 2014 by Ed Morrissey

The coincidences just keep on a-rolling in the IRS targeting scandal. It turns out that the IRS didn’t just pay some low-level schlep to recycle backup server tapes on a six-month basis to maintain their e-mail records. They paid an outside firm, Sonasoft, to archive that data for long-term retrieval — or at least they did. That contract got canceled just weeks after Lois Lerner’s hard-drive failure, the Daily Caller learned:

The Internal Revenue Service (IRS) cancelled its longtime relationship with an email-storage contractor just weeks after ex-IRS official Lois Lerner’s computer crashed and shortly before other IRS officials’ computers allegedly crashed.

The IRS signed a contract with Sonasoft, an email-archiving company based in San Jose, California, each year from 2005 to 2010. The company, which partners with Microsoft and counts The New York Times among its clients, claims in its company slogans that it provides “Email Archiving Done Right” and “Point-Click Recovery.” Sonasoft in 2009 tweeted, “If the IRS uses Sonasoft products to backup their servers why wouldn’t you choose them to protect your servers?”

Sonasoft was providing “automatic data processing” services for the IRS throughout the January 2009 to April 2011 period in which Lerner sent her missing emails.

But Sonasoft’s six-year business relationship with the IRS came to an abrupt end at the close of fiscal year 2011, as congressional investigators began looking into the IRS conservative targeting scandal and IRS employees’ computers started crashing left and right.

Oddly, this doesn’t appear to have come up in testimony from officials at the IRS. John Koskinen’s opening statement at the House Ways and Means Committee hearing of how hard the IRS worked to retrieve that data didn’t include any effort to restore a Sonasoft backup from the servers, or mention any outside contractor at all. The existence of this contract appears to have been a better-kept secret than NSA snooping through Internet service providers.

Perhaps the contractor’s relationship with the IRS and Koskinen’s slow fan-dance of transparency will come up in this week’s hearings on the IRS scandal. Koskinen has House Oversight Committee appearances scheduled for tonight and tomorrow, and Darrell Issa gave the IRS Commissioner more than 50 questions to answer. And in the #5 position, Issa wants specifics about outside contractors:

5. Please identify all vendors and outside contractors used by the IRS for the following purposes:

q. To develop, service, or maintain the IRS’s e-mail systems.

r. To develop, service, or maintain the IRS’s e-mail exchange servers.

s. To recycle or destroy IRS hard drives.

t. To provide mobile phone and data services.

The answers to these might end up forcing Koskinen to apologize — but don’t bet on it.

By the way, the White House insists that no special prosecutor is necessary for the IRS probe:

The White House rejected calls on Friday for a special prosecutor to look into lost IRS emails and the inappropriate targeting of conservative groups, saying Republican investigations have failed to find a smoking gun.

Both the Internal Revenue Service and the administration have already demonstrated “extensive cooperation” with Republicans in Congress, Principal Deputy Press Secretary Josh Earnest said, adding there have been 750,000 pages of documents provided, as well as 64,000 e-mails from then-IRS division chief Lois Lerner.

“Our willingness to cooperate with this investigation is evident from the numbers,” Earnest said, charging that a “a large number of claims and conspiracy theories that have been floated about this process by Republicans just have not panned out, frankly.”

Earnest also said that there’s “zero evidence” to show malfeasance, which is a handy way of saying that all of the hard drives at the IRS have been destroyed. I wonder if that’s also true at Sonasoft.

Update: J.E. Dyer has lots more about Sonasoft at Liberty Unyielding:

Whatever Sonasoft’s obligations after the contract was terminated, it’s clear that the company had a relevant contractual obligation to the IRS at the time of the supposed email loss.  There seems to be no question that Sonasoft’s knowledge of the email “catastrophe” needs to be investigated.

But there’s more to this drama – and it’s (go figure) political.  Sonasoft is a small company, founded and run in Silicon Valley by a Mr. Nand (Andy) Khanna.  It isn’t clear whether Andy Khanna is any relation to Rohit (Ro) Khanna, a Pennsylvania-born attorney who served as an Obama appointee in the U.S. Department of Commerce, and is now a Democratic candidate for the House of Representatives in the 17th district of California (in Silicon Valley).  But what is clear is that the two other members of Sonasoft’s board of directors – the members other than Andy Khanna – are both working hard to get Ro Khanna elected.

Here are the players.  On the Sonasoft board of directors, Dr. Romesh K. Japra, M.D., is the chairman of the board.  The board director is Mr. Romi Randhawa, whose day job is president and CEO of HPM Networks, another Silicon Valley IT company.

And then there’s Ro Khanna.  Khanna has connections to Obama that go way back, to Obama’s first run for the Illinois state senate, when Khanna was at the University of Chicago as an undergrad.   Will Burns, a Chicago Democratic political operative, recruited Khanna to walk precincts with Obama during the campaign, and Khanna was reportedly star-struck …

Be sure to read the rest, as it’s too lengthy and complicated to excerpt.


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Pretty sure only Lerner pleaded the 5th here….not her ‘top capos’.

I might have structured the sentence poorly(I do that) but I meant it to read that Lerner plead the 5th (not the capos).

I don’t have a clue as to what Issa is doing. In terms of my opinions of these hearings, I do have some ‘out there’ thoughts on it. But as far as these emails being erased, my opinions are shared by pretty much every normal person. If you don’t see something suspicious then …

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 12:59 PM

pleaded plead

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 12:59 PM

This is the clearest evidence that politicians, oligarchies, and tyrants – now and in the future – will abuse the power of the IRS to target and punish their personal / party political enemies to ensure and secure their own re-elections.

No matter what anyone says, THIS IS NOT A 1-TIME EVENT! It WILL happen again in the future! The IRS (an Homeland Security, FBI, ATF, and others as we have seen) can and IS being used as a WEAPON … BY American politicians AGAINT AMERICANS – their own consituents! This should shock NO ONE as the Obama administration and Democrats already made the decision to use the IRS as a tool to punish everyone who refused to comply with Obamacare — they created a specific new tax as part of a type of Negative Re-Enforcement – a WEAPON / TOOL – to get people to comply.

The ONLY way to ensure the IRS can NEVER be used as a WEAPON against the American People again is for all Americans to use this opportunity to FORCE OUR REPRESENTATIVES to DISSOLVE THE IRS AS WE KNOW IT and to IMPLEMENT A ‘FAIR’ OR ‘FLAT’ TAX!!

easyt65 on June 23, 2014 at 12:59 PM

I might have structured the sentence poorly(I do that) but I meant it to read that Lerner plead the 5th (not the capos).

I don’t have a clue as to what Issa is doing. In terms of my opinions of these hearings, I do have some ‘out there’ thoughts on it. But as far as these emails being erased, my opinions are shared by pretty much every normal person. If you don’t see something suspicious then …

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 12:59 PM

Ok – I re-red and see you mean that the ‘capos’ have also ‘lost’ their emails.

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

You are so damn dishonest and immoral it is frightening sometimes.

Monkeytoe on June 23, 2014 at 10:40 AM

Well you’re not scary at all.
Ad-hom is as harmless as it is pointless.

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 12:40 PM

Monkeytoe wasn’t making an ad-hom. He was pointing out the facts.

Of course, without a moral compass it is hard to tell the difference.

HumpBot Salvation on June 23, 2014 at 1:05 PM

Verby is starting to sound like an Adolf fan knowing the Russians have Berlin surrounded….

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:06 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

I think that ship sailed a long time ago.

Once those emails come out, the best she will get is a plea-bargain.

Turtle317 on June 23, 2014 at 1:07 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

Why on earth would you offer her immunity at this point? We already know she violated federal law by sending confidential and private tax information restricted to the IRS to outside federal agencies.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:11 PM

Indeed, if emails were intentionally destroyed it is criminal.
Intentionally destroying them would also be stupid and pointless.
So it shouldn’t be hard to prove any of this.
I’m sure they’ll do that any day now, right?

But while we’re waiting…how about some theories…right?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 11:50 AM

Apparently, the IRS has known about this at least since February (and some far longer).

I think they finally told Congressional investigators on Friday, June 13, so they’ve been working on it about 10 days…

Patience, dear troll. I’m sure something will break loose in a few weeks…

cs89 on June 23, 2014 at 1:15 PM

Why on earth would you offer her immunity at this point? We already know she violated federal law by sending confidential and private tax information restricted to the IRS to outside federal agencies.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:11 PM

Yep, she should be frog marched thru the streets of DC as example to the other bureaucrats.

HumpBot Salvation on June 23, 2014 at 1:15 PM

Why on earth would you offer her immunity at this point? We already know she violated federal law by sending confidential and private tax information restricted to the IRS to outside federal agencies.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:11 PM

Verby wants Lerner to score immunity so she can clam up tighter than Susan MacDougal without becoming Vince Foster.

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:15 PM

Verby is starting to sound like an Adolf fan knowing the Russians have Berlin surrounded….

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:06 PM

Lord Haw Haw?

Del Dolemonte on June 23, 2014 at 1:16 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

If this was orchestrated by the WH or Obama himself, what are the odds that she would tell the truth no matter what we offered her? You think they would let her basically get the first black president impeached and inflict incalculable damage to your party’s electoral future?

I would have every confidence she would lie like a rug to give Obama and the media all the excuse they need to bury this story for good. The only way to get to know what happened is to recover those emails or to have a whistle-blower step forward. Lerner has no credibility and every reason to lie.

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 1:21 PM

Lord Haw Haw?

Del Dolemonte on June 23, 2014 at 1:16 PM

Ja.

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:22 PM

Ok – I re-red and see you mean that the ‘capos’ have also ‘lost’ their emails.

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

I don’t know. That part is beyond below pay grade :)

I’m not sure. I don’t trust Issa to hold her to the truth(legally). I’m not sure that the consequences of her possibly lying, even after immunity, would be sufficient. Really, I haven’t thought enough about that option. My fear is that Issa is slow walking this (here is where you can credibly claim a wild conspiracy theory has been proffered – though I still would defend it).

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 1:22 PM

That part is beyond below pay grade :)

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 1:23 PM

my – OK I’m done – can’t comment and work.

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 1:23 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

Don’t remember the details, but do recall some kind of “immunity” deal being floated a few months ago but shot down.

At this point, I’m not sure what will happen- but it’s clear to me this is a big deal. Guess we’ll see what rocks are turned over, and what (if anything) is found under them…

cs89 on June 23, 2014 at 1:24 PM

Lerner has no credibility and every reason to lie.

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 1:21 PM

Ditto.

That’s why the real butt-hurt is looming on the horizon.

I think the IRS should come clean. The Dems are already hurting in the upcoming 2014 elections. It would only help their credibility for when 2016 rolls around.

If you want to play long – play long!

You think people are going to let the IRS scandal get swept under a rug?

That’s a fool’s bet. I wouldn’t take that one to Vegas.

Turtle317 on June 23, 2014 at 1:26 PM

There needs to be a million person Taxpayer march on Washington over this issue with everyone burning tax returns.

SC.Charlie on June 23, 2014 at 1:27 PM

BoxHead1 on June 23, 2014 at 1:22 PM

On immunity for Lerner, here’s what I’ve heard from those in that pay grade –
She likely doesn’t have anything to offer in exchange for testimony and/or they don’t really have anything of substance on her.
If she was indeed holding any cards here, her team would have negotiated full immunity by now. If Issa, et all truly felt she had something of value to share, we’d have heard it by now. But as she doesn’t – she’s more useful this way.
And that makes sense, right?
I mean…otherwise why not just announce she has full immunity and call her fwd.

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:27 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

If there is MUCH bigger fish to fry, maybe limited immunity

ConservativePartyNow on June 23, 2014 at 1:28 PM

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 1:21 PM

If offered immunity, at this point, Lerner would simply say that she orchestrated the entire effort to focus and harass conservative political organizations entirely on her own.

The case and investigation would end – and those outside who may have been involved in the IRS illegal abuses of power and actions exonerated by Lerner’s admission. Furthermore, because of the immunity, Lerner would be untouched for her violations of federal law.

Immunity was never a real option if one wanted to get to the bottom of the investigation. It was only an option to sweep it under the rug.

John Dean, who orchestrated the Watergate cover-up on the orders of Nixon, only turned on Nixon when he bowed to political pressure and fired Ehrlictman, Haldeman, and Dean. Of those, only Dean was pissed / disloyal enough to not take one for the ‘team’. His testimony blew open the investigation…and once Sirica ordered the release of the WH tapes, Nixon’s goose was cooked.

Obama / Democrats learned well from that. They are running the anti-Watergate playbook here – and have been from day 1 in this and the other Obama Admin scandals. That’s why no once ever has been fired. All have promises of golden parachutes and pardons, if needed.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:29 PM

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:27 PM

This is as much for you…..

You need to also remember the first rule of hole digging….

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:31 PM

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:27 PM

Here’s the problem. She’s already been nailed for forwarding classified/confidential information to other government agencies.

But as other have pointed out, that’s not what the investigators are after.

I seriously doubt immunity will be offered. I think those emails will surface, charges are going to pile up, and Barky and Holder are going to have to give her a jail-free card.

Damage done.

Turtle317 on June 23, 2014 at 1:34 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

Obviously immunity would be an end-run around her fifth amendment dodge, and could compel her to testify. If I’m not mistaken, such immunity would not be a choice for the witness. She could either talk, or be charged with contempt (obstruction?) and sent to jail pending a change of heart. Lies or misleading statements would also invalidate the immunity. This all assumes a non-corrupt DoJ which is not a safe bet, so that tactic is probably moot.

Immolate on June 23, 2014 at 1:35 PM

So verbaluce has totally ignored the hole he dug for himself, admitting that those emails do exist but the IRS and the Whitehouse are lying about it and has moved on to immunity for Lerner…

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 1:43 PM

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:29 PM

Yep. Any break in this case will not come from her testimony, unless we get someone or some document or testimony to implicate her, and even then I’m not sure how easy it would be to bring her to court. I think that would require Holder to bring charges, which would be like asking OJ to help investigate Nicole’s murder.

The only condition under which I would offer her immunity is if her testimony passed a polygraph, a condition to which you know she’d never agree.

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 1:44 PM

Lyin’ Lois was in charge.

The claim that she has little to offer is specious and laughable.

In the private sector she’d likely be in the slammer already.

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:45 PM

Doesn’t immunity require someone who’s willing and wanting to testify?

Lerner is a true believer. And she knows that Obama and Holder won’t do anything to her, so she already effectively has immunity. Or does verbaluce really want us to believe the the Justice Department is working hard right now to investigate and prosecute the several crimes that were committed in the IRS? Verbaluce? Crimes were committed. Years ago. So, where’s the DOJ prosecution at this point?

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 1:46 PM

So verbaluce has totally ignored the hole he dug for himself, admitting that those emails do exist but the IRS and the Whitehouse are lying about it and has moved on to immunity for Lerner…

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 1:43 PM

He drank the Kool-Aid deeply and now is trying not to blame Jim Jones (or Ogabe).

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:47 PM

In the private sector she’d likely be in the slammer already.

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 1:45 PM

If the Administration and Lerner were both R / Conservative, she’s be in the slammer already – or at least on trial in the DC District for her contempt of Congress charge. Not even John Mitchell had the balls to cover for Nixon like Holder does for Obama.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 1:48 PM

The ONLY way to ensure the IRS can NEVER be used as a WEAPON against the American People again is for all Americans to use this opportunity to FORCE OUR REPRESENTATIVES to DISSOLVE THE IRS AS WE KNOW IT and to IMPLEMENT A ‘FAIR’ OR ‘FLAT’ TAX!!

easyt65 on June 23, 2014 at 12:59 PM

^^^^^^THIS. If the GOP would make this the central plank in the 2016 campaign, the election would be a walk-over, no matter which GOPe stooge they put up.

Harbingeing on June 23, 2014 at 1:50 PM

So verbaluce has totally ignored the hole he dug for himself, admitting that those emails do exist but the IRS and the Whitehouse are lying about it and has moved on to immunity for Lerner…

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 1:43 PM

Huh?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:56 PM

So verbaluce has totally ignored the hole he dug for himself, admitting that those emails do exist but the IRS and the Whitehouse are lying about it and has moved on to immunity for Lerner…

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 1:43 PM

Huh?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:56 PM

Huh?

You’ve said multiple times that there is no way those emails were lost. It’s crazy conspiracy talk to suggest otherwise. But the Whitehouse and IRS have repeatedly claimed they are not recoverable.

So which is it verbaluce? Massive and highly coincidental and unbelievably targeted IT failure at the IRS or are the IRS and Whitehouse lying when they say the emails are gone forever?

And where’s the DOJ investigation into the several federal crimes committed at the IRS?

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 2:02 PM

The lawyers at Powerline eviscerate one of Verbie’s standard efforts to spin innocence towards Lerner, Obama, and the rest of the Administration….hard evidence vs circumstantial evidence…

As a general matter, evidence can be direct or circumstantial. Direct evidence is direct proof of a fact, such as testimony by a witness about what that witness personally saw or heard or did. Circumstantial evidence is indirect evidence, that is, it is proof of one or more facts from which one can find another fact. Both direct and circumstantial evidence are entitled to consideration. Either can be used to prove any fact. The law makes no distinction between the weight to be given to either direct or circumstantial evidence.

The propositions above come straight out of federal jury instructions for use by federal judges in trials held before them. The jury instructions may even include an illustrative example: “[I]f you wake up in the morning and see that the sidewalk is wet, you may find from that fact that it rained during the night. However, other evidence, such as a turned-on garden hose, may provide an explanation for the water on the sidewalk. Therefore, before you decide that a fact has been proved by circumstantial evidence, you must consider all the evidence in the light of reason, experience, and common sense.”

Epstein implies that only direct evidence is “hard evidence.” This is simply not the case. Direct evidence can and frequently is far weaker than circumstantial evidence.

Both direct evidence and circumstantial evidence can be “hard evidence.” Obama’s declaration that there is “not even a smidgen” of corruption in the IRS is direct evidence (insofar as it absolves himself of wrongdoing), but by itself in the light of reason, experience, and common sense, it is worthless. Indeed, in the light of experience, it may be strong circumstantial evidence of a coverup.

Epstein is an attorney and he knows all this. His job is to blow smoke.

Verbie is doing little beyond blowing smoke…as ineffectively as the apparatchik Julian Epstein did yesterday on Fox News Sunday.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 2:08 PM

From the Daily Caller – Issa’s questions for IRS chief tonight.

1. Explain, in detail, Lois Lerner’s 2011 hard drive failure, including the date it happened, and give the names of all employees who worked on retrieving data from it.

2. When did you learn that the hard drive failure affected the Oversight Committee’s subpoena into the IRS targeting scandal, and which IRS staffers realized that the subpoena could not be fulfilled?

3. Explain all the steps the IRS took to retrieve data from Lerner’s hard drive.

4. Name all IRS employees that worked on agency email servers between 2009 and 2014.

5. Name all IRS contractors that worked on agency email or hard drive systems.

6. Give the names of the IRS employees most knowledgeable about email servers and data retention.

7. Identify the IRS employees that last had possession of Lerner’s computer, cell phones, hard drive, backup email tapes and information about errors in IRS electronic hardware.

8. Give us all relevant information about IRS document retention policies.

9. Name the type of email service the IRS uses and the type of email exchange server and tell us whether any email is stored on an IRS shared drive.

10. Explain in detail the IRS’ electronic data restoration and archival systems.

11. How many forensic images from Lerner’s failed hard drive still exist?

12. How many forensic images from Lerner’s failed hard drive still existed on August 31, 2011 (when the IRS’ contract with Sonasoft expired)?

13. List all the software and hardware malfunctions that occurred at the agency between January 1, 2011 and June 30, 2011.

14. Give us Lerner’s computer barcode.

15. Give us Lerner’s cell phone barcode.

http://dailycaller.com/2014/06/23/darrell-issa-to-grill-irs-commissioner-monday-night-on-lerners-missing-emails/

As an IT guy, I can tell you these are great questions. Kudos to Issa for getting the right questions to ask, particularly the ones in bold.

I can tell you that we’re used to our bosses asking us to do crazy things without any explanation. If one of these guys were asked to turn over the tapes for undisclosed reasons or manipulate the backup process or data, I doubt all of those guys will cover for them. At some point the tentacles of these scandal will reach someone not willing to lie on behalf of their boss.

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 2:10 PM

If she was indeed holding any cards here, her team would have negotiated full immunity by now. If Issa, et all truly felt she had something of value to share, we’d have heard it by now. But as she doesn’t – she’s more useful this way.
And that makes sense, right?
I mean…otherwise why not just announce she has full immunity and call her fwd.

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:27 PM

Ahhhh.

Newest “argument”. Because she hasn’t been offered immunity, it proves she is innocent.

Good work Verb – you’ve outdone yourself on the dishonesty/idiocy scale with this nonsense.

If I’m every being investigated for anything, I’ll use that as my defense – hey, if you are investigating whether I did something wrong, but you haven’t offered me immunity, it proves I’m innocent, so stop the investigation!!”

You really are stupid, aren’t you?

Monkeytoe on June 23, 2014 at 2:12 PM

Are you at all suspicious as to why they wouldn’t grant her immunity?
I mean…she’s not the one folks are after here.

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 12:47 PM

See – if you have evidence of wrongdoing, what you should immediately do is give the main culprit immunity, otherwise, it proves you aren’t serious about your investigation.

I love the way you come up with absolute nonsense and believe it to be thoughtful.

Monkeytoe on June 23, 2014 at 2:14 PM

Verby would offer better bullshit excuses for Lerner, Koskinen and Ogabe…

…. but his computer keeps crashing and he missed yet another payment for the backup service.

viking01 on June 23, 2014 at 2:16 PM

You cancel you contractor “back up service” – then tell them it is illegal for them to have the sensitive taxpayer data and please delete data and destroy the storage hardware beyond any chance of recovery. Then you have a crash where you stored this data and recycle that storage hardware. POOF records gone from IRS

Solution – do searches on servers of the agencies like White House, DOJ and others using Lois Lerner (and the others involve)email as a search key. Should be a simple procedure if granted access to each server

Seems like Lois sent official emails using an alias (illegal I think)- be sure to keep those in the loop. What was that name — Richard… something

minus200 on June 23, 2014 at 2:18 PM

Indeed, if emails were intentionally destroyed it is criminal.
Intentionally destroying them would also be stupid and pointless.
So it shouldn’t be hard to prove any of this.
I’m sure they’ll do that any day now, right?
But while we’re waiting…how about some theories…right?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 11:50 AM

Since you haven’t proven your case while the IRS/WH refuses to cooperate, it proves you have no case.

See, congress asked for these emails 2 years ago. the IRS fought it and refused to give them, now suddenly claims they were “lost”, but that somehow proves it was all innocent and there is nothing here.

I love the way your mind “works” verbulace – its reverse conspiracy theory. In your mind, everything that dems do prove they are in the right and innocent of anything, no matter what.

Lost emails? check – that proves innocence!
Haven’t been given immunity? check – that proves innocence!
A full prosecution hasn’t yet occurred? Check – proves innocence.

In your little mind, if someone is not yet convicted, then you can’t have an investigation. How can you have an investigation if you haven’t proven your case yet?

And gov’t agencies have no duty to respond to congress or give them information / documents in response to subpoenas. After all, if it is the opposing party they may have mean motives and therefore anything the agency does is perfectly acceptable. this is after all a democracy and agencies don’t report to congress and there is no need for oversight.

I know the left has always maintained that position – that gov’t agencies are free to do what they want and congress can go screw. I’m sure you’ll have that same attitude when a republican is in the WH.

Monkeytoe on June 23, 2014 at 2:19 PM

I can tell you that we’re used to our bosses asking us to do crazy things without any explanation. If one of these guys were asked to turn over the tapes for undisclosed reasons or manipulate the backup process or data, I doubt all of those guys will cover for them. At some point the tentacles of these scandal will reach someone not willing to lie on behalf of their boss.

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 2:10 PM

Excellent point. That’s really the crux of the investigation at this point – asking the right question / getting to the person who isn’t bought off or on the team because of political ideology.

I see a similarity in this and the actions of the Admin / DoD in the wake of the desertion of Bergdahl – making all of the members of the platoon (company?) sign NDA’s to enforce their silence. A number of these spoke out in the wake of the Administration’s shenanigans re Bergdahl – so we need to find someone from the IT side in the IRS or a third party contractor who will come forward.

The risk is that person will be vilified and made a pariah. That’s a tough thing for someone to invite on them self.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 2:20 PM

Every (insert your choice here: day, week, or month) there seems to be another radically different story (read as excuse) for missing emails of Lois Lerner and wait……. so far, 6 others in regard to the IRS scandal. This tale is put forth by the latest government employee who’s turn it is at the moment to play Maxwell Smart saying, “would you believe……..” The parallels are striking, but what is not funny is that it is the government involved against private organizations and now what appears to be a massive and widespread cover up of those apparently directed actions (or inaction as it may be).
It is a sad state of affairs for this emergence of the USA as the newest banana republic. It is going to take serious work to undo the damage that has been done by the Usurper In Chief.

geezerintraining on June 23, 2014 at 2:31 PM

I’m saying that even if these emails were willfully and criminally destroyed by Lerner, you’d need every single person she emailed and every single person who emailed her to destroy their emails as well. AND you’d need every backup system all of their servers to be corrupted or destroyed.
So if you are right that Lerner (or IRS) deleted these…you are right that she and they are utter idiots.
(Maybe we’ll find something to agree on?)

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 11:24 AM

Ahh, so you are saying that the email can be found and you agree that every agency should have to come forward with any and all emails to/from Lerner?

No doubt you are right that many agencies who received emails from Lerner will not be involved in any conspiracy and will not likewise destroy emails. The likelihood is that there are only a few individuals involved, and they will have destroyed their copies by now. And, of course, congress doesn’t necessarily know who those individuals are to search their emails.

So, what did the IRS accomplish – it made finding any relevant emails much, much more difficult and time consuming.

Instead of just getting her emails, they will have to canvass all federal employees’ emails.

Your “argument”, such as it is, is that because it is possible that some of the emails will be found elsewhere, it proves that the email destruction was not done purposefully.

that’s inane. Just because someone “might” be able to piece together some evidence somewhere else, it doesn’t mean that the extremely fishy destruction of the emails (the easiest, most efficient, and most complete way to obtain the documents) was not done on purpose.

Your logic makes no sense. You proclaim, “well, the evidence might exist elsewhere, so that proves the IRS did not do this on purpose” there is no logical flow. Nothing in “a” leads to “b”.

I’ll give you an example. A criminal’s accomplice is killed. Now, there is other evidence aside from the accomplice’s testimony that could convict the criminal, but the accomplice is in the best position to quickly and easily get the criminal locked up.

Does the fact that other evidence may or may not exist prove the criminal did not kill the accomplice? Why or why not?

the correct answer is the potential existence of other evidence does not prove or disprove whether the criminal killed the accomplice.

Now, turning back to the issue at hand. the fact that there may be Lerner emails existing piecemeal all over the federal gov’t does not prove or disprove whether the IRS purposefully destroyed the emails in its possession.

Meanwhile, the facts we have make the destruction of those emails by the IRS look very, very questionable at best.

Are you starting to understand why your “arguments” are nonsense?

Monkeytoe on June 23, 2014 at 2:31 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

Nice convoluted illogic. About your speed.

itsspideyman on June 23, 2014 at 2:32 PM

From the Daily Caller – Issa’s questions for IRS chief tonight.

crrr6 on June 23, 2014 at 2:10 PM

Great questions are worthless until answers are obtained. Quickly. Unless Issa or Camp uses the power of Congress to lock up someone found to be in contempt, I consider them to be contemptible themselves for failing to seek the truth. Shame on them.

horatio on June 23, 2014 at 2:34 PM

Lerner was issued a Blackberry by the IRS. This a fact based on the IRS response to Issa’s letter. Why is this not being investigated?

luckybogey on June 23, 2014 at 2:36 PM

Can we agree the Lerner should be offered immunity?

verbaluce on June 23, 2014 at 1:03 PM

Huh? Why would anyone do that? Has Lerner offered to testify against people up the food chain? No? Then why should she be offered anything other than a nice warm cozy jail cell?

You seem very confused about the whole immunity concept.

RINO in Name Only on June 23, 2014 at 2:37 PM

In Victor Davis Hanson’s latest essay, he doesn’t directly address the topic of this thread – but does so indirectly in a way that should be a wake-up call for all of us, in particular apologists and spinners like Verb….

Pls take the time to read it – it’s a very good read.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 2:39 PM

Lois Lerner is not the key to this case. It is some hard-working current or previous IT professional who serviced the IRS system.

We continue to focus on only one time frame and miss the elephant in the room. Erased taped (more fairly, re-used tapes) and cancelled contracts and what is or is not available today is all fascinating, but the glaring flaw in the administration’s fairy tale has nothing to do with today.

At the time of the event, backups existed, both daily back-up tapes and, apparently, an independent back up by an outside vendor. Why do we have back-ups? To restore data in the event of an “event” such as a crash, virus or drive corruption (or fire or a natural disaster). What do we do when we have a crash of a hard drive? We restore or replace the hard drive and we RESTORE THE DATA.

The point is, these emails were backed up. The back up existed. Lois Lerner and her colleagues (6 others) who claim to have had computer crashes didn’t stop working and quit. No, they continued to work, with replaced or repaired hard drives. And, without any doubt, the backed up data (including the pesky e-mails) was restored to rebuild those hard drives.

Those e-mails were not only “official” records, they were records of ongoing business of the agency. Lerner and the others needed their e-mail traffic restored to avoid losing valuable back-and-forth regarding ongoing matters. They would have howled for them. Again, we have back-ups so we can restore data. These hard drives (if they crashed at all) were RESTORED to their previous state, including their e-mail traffic.

Rep. Issa has asked questions related to the IT activity at the time of this supposed event so, hopefully, this glaring hole in the “dog ate my homework” story will be addressed.

Simply ask yourself, if your computer crashed, would you like to have your e-mail backed up, particularly if it related to your business? If you had a back-up, wouldn’t you use it? Of course. So would Lois Lerner. If hers were lost in the first place.

The conclusion? Those machines, whether they crashed or not, were back up and running soon thereafter, with all of their e-mail traffic right back where it had been. So, if e-mails have gone missing, they were not lost in a crash — they were deleted intentionally.

IndieDogg on June 23, 2014 at 2:44 PM

For a guy who’s supposed to be a world class fixer, Koskinen sure has a counter-constructive approach. He acts like his mission is to cover the mess up, not fix it… Like he got his talking points from the WH.

Oh well, so what else is new?

petefrt on June 23, 2014 at 3:05 PM

The conclusion? Those machines, whether they crashed or not, were back up and running soon thereafter, with all of their e-mail traffic right back where it had been. So, if e-mails have gone missing, they were not lost in a crash — they were deleted intentionally.

IndieDogg on June 23, 2014 at 2:44 PM

We need to understand why the contract was terminated and how long Sonasoft was required to keep the existing emails after the contract ended.

Was the contract terminated, for instance, because the IRS discovered that Sonasoft wasn’t adequately backing up emails?

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 3:05 PM

I have located Lois’ lost emails. This guy has them in San Fran near Sonasoft. I have pictures to prove it.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/bar/4508416620.html

He even has the tape drive to restore them with.

VenHill on June 23, 2014 at 3:08 PM

Here are the other six people’s emails in question. They’re in Idaho now but when I called the guy he wasn’t sure where the van was headed. Said something about a new lucrative Fed contract to bus illegal border crossers all over the country. I think he lied. If you look at the picture, it is obviously heading East.

http://boise.craigslist.org/cto/4434731684.html

VenHill on June 23, 2014 at 3:15 PM

We need to understand why the contract was terminated and how long Sonasoft was required to keep the existing emails after the contract ended.

Was the contract terminated, for instance, because the IRS discovered that Sonasoft wasn’t adequately backing up emails?

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 3:05 PM

Then why didn’t the Whitehouse and IRS come out and say this?

Koskinen was grilled about not disclosing the loss of emails to Congress sooner. And you want us to believe the emails were lost because of the incompetence of a third party vendor and Koskinen didn’t want to bring that up as an excuse?

Koskinen could have just blamed the private sector dog for eating his homework but passed because…?

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 3:27 PM

In Victor Davis Hanson’s latest essay, he doesn’t directly address the topic of this thread – but does so indirectly in a way that should be a wake-up call for all of us, in particular apologists and spinners like Verb….

Pls take the time to read it – it’s a very good read.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 2:39 PM

There are two very disturbing aspects to this IRS corruption.

First, the actual corruption.

Secondly, the lefts non-reaction. The left actively argues for a more expansive and intrusive state. Progs of years of yore talked a lot about a capable and impartial and supposedly effective technocracy that would manage important affairs for all Americans for the public good. We could trust the bureaucracy because it would never be corrupted. It would be transparent and accountable in ways a corporation supposedly never could be. It would be filled with “public servants” that would not only be competent but would be above the political fray.

Now the left doesn’t even pretend all that much anymore that the bureaucracy shouldn’t be tyrannical in nature when dealing with undesirables.

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 3:33 PM

Now the left doesn’t even pretend all that much anymore that the bureaucracy shouldn’t be tyrannical in nature when dealing with undesirables.

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 3:33 PM

Which is why I continue to point out to Verb that the mask has dropped and the left’s desire to be brown shirts is on full display.

the reality is that there are enough facts adduced thus far in this matter that anyone with any principals would say “there’s a lot of smoke there, it should really be investigated because if what it appears happened actually happened, it is really, really bad”.

Instead, the leftists all circle wagons and say “nothing to see here”, happy in the knowledge that it was “evil righties” targeted for unjust abuse and harassment by the gov’t.

As I continue to say – not ethics, no morals, no honesty – that is what defines today’s American left.

Monkeytoe on June 23, 2014 at 3:45 PM

The conclusion? Those machines, whether they crashed or not, were back up and running soon thereafter, with all of their e-mail traffic right back where it had been. So, if e-mails have gone missing, they were not lost in a crash — they were deleted intentionally.

IndieDogg on June 23, 2014 at 2:44 PM

Good point.

We have a Lois Lerner email in the wake of the hard drive crash sent to the IT team that worked on the hard drive – in it she only references ‘lost personal files’ that she had stored on that drive, and not ‘lost emails’ or ‘lost email directories’. In fact, from the tone of the message, she wasn’t all that upset that those personal files couldn’t be recovered – as if she had them elsewhere and could access them from that other location.

So that creates a separation between the loss of the emails and the hard drive crash event. What happened to those emails? Given the timing, the crime, the obfuscations, the possibility of deliberate action is significant.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 3:46 PM

From Sonasoft:

4. Secure and Guaranteed Email Archiving Enterprise Feature
The SonaVault Email Archiving software solution employs reliable safeguards including encryption to ensure that the email is tamper-proof without the possibility of being altered. Our secure archiving solution is achieved through encryption and hash calculations to determine the tampering of emails. SonaVault uses Microsoft’s Journaling mechanism to extract and archive messages. This ensures that every message which goes out and enters an Microsoft Exchange Archiving Server is archived even if the message is deleted by the user from his or her mailbox.

Furthermore, SonaVault extracts messages out of the journal mailbox, digitally signs it, compresses, encrypts and then archives it to SonaVault Archive Stores. Once the messages are successfully archived, they are deleted from the journal mailbox.
http://www.sonasoft.com/products/sonavault-email-archiving-software/

Sonasoft has the emails. Now all that Issa needs to do is subpoena them.

Patriot Vet on June 23, 2014 at 4:02 PM

For a guy who’s supposed to be a world class fixer, Koskinen sure has a counter-constructive approach. He acts like his mission is to cover the mess up, not fix it… Like he got his talking points from the WH.

Oh well, so what else is new?

petefrt on June 23, 2014 at 3:05 PM

Koskinen was right though. Those bought and paid for politicians asking him pointless questions do not deserve any apology. Nice try trying to frame it in the context of ” Do you think the American people deserve an apology”.

farleftprogressive on June 23, 2014 at 4:23 PM

For a guy who’s supposed to be a world class fixer, Koskinen sure has a counter-constructive approach. He acts like his mission is to cover the mess up, not fix it… Like he got his talking points from the WH.

Oh well, so what else is new?

petefrt on June 23, 2014 at 3:05 PM

Koskinen was right though. Those bought and paid for politicians asking him pointless questions do not deserve any apology. Nice try trying to frame it in the context of ” Do you think the American people deserve an apology”.

farleftprogressive on June 23, 2014 at 4:23 PM

The American people expect their public servants to do right.

davidk on June 23, 2014 at 4:27 PM

What are the chances that Sonasoft also lost the back up emails?

Amjean on June 23, 2014 at 10:44 AM

Not a chance. Would be a violation of SOX for EACH EMAIL LOST.

ConservativePartyNow on June 23, 2014 at 10:53 AM

Since the emails actually belong to the IRS, I would imagine they were turned over to the IRS when the contract was cancelled. Which was probably the reason the contract was cancelled in the first place: to get the emails back safely in their possession, so they didn’t have to take any chances on Sonasoft just happening to still have a damaging email.

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 23, 2014 at 4:34 PM

I’ll give the IRS an “E” for effort. But here is the cold, hard reality:

You really can’t destroy email at the volume/level the IRS is claiming. You can scrub every computer. You can delete entire accounts. You can run DOD 0-bit scrub software. You can physically destroy drives.

As every IT pro can attest, it has been tried and tried again by all sort of nefarious types – but in the end, what do you get?

A list of emails that incriminate one or more people.

Good luck with that one, IRS.

Turtle317 on June 23, 2014 at 11:28 AM

True. I’m betting the goal is to stall long enough that the investigation can be turned into a political liability for the investigators, in hopes that the GOP will just cave in order to protect their reputations in the media.

And it may well work.

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 23, 2014 at 4:38 PM

OT, but not really.

Keep this up, Mississippi.

Schadenfreude on June 23, 2014 at 4:41 PM

IRS canceled e-mail back-up service – weeks after Lerner hard drive crash

This tells me that Lerner’s emails were then restored while the back-up company was still under contract with the IRS.

So where are the emails?

RJL on June 23, 2014 at 5:03 PM

to get the emails back safely in their possession, so they didn’t have to take any chances on Sonasoft just happening to still have a damaging email.

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 23, 2014 at 4:34 PM

This^^^^^

Assuming they were backing up off site over dark fiber and the IRS wasn’t just using Sonasoft’s bells and whistles on-site.

VenHill on June 23, 2014 at 5:04 PM

IRS canceled e-mail back-up service – weeks after Lerner hard drive crash

This tells me that Lerner’s emails were then restored while the back-up company was still under contract with the IRS.

So where are the emails?

RJL on June 23, 2014 at 5:03 PM

Time to subpoena Sonasoft folks and records. In the meantime, put Lerner and Koslizardgrin in the House jail and let them sweat.

Midas on June 23, 2014 at 5:15 PM

Every IRS employee from office janitor to commissioner should be put under oath with the notion that they are all guilty until they give up the next co-conspirator. As the IRS does….you are assumed guilty until you prove otherwise. Whats good for the goose kind of thing.

jaywemm on June 23, 2014 at 5:26 PM

How Did an IRS Official Know with Certainty that the Obama Campaign Would Continue One of Its Attacks?

The email is from September 2010, but the presidential campaign was already in full swing.

In the email, IRS tax-exempt official Sarah Hall Ingram tells her cohorts, including Lois Lerner, about a coordinated media campaign against the Citizens United decision. Ingram praises that campaign, and demonstrates foreknowledge of what is to come.

In the email, Ingram says “The ‘secret donor’ theme will continue — see Obama salvo and today’s Diane Reehm (sp).”

Ingram doesn’t hint anything less than certainty that an Obama campaign theme will continue forward into the future. Which it did — President Obama attacked the Citizens United decision in the days after this email. Ingram calls the president’s coming actions a “salvo,” which proved to be uncannily accurate.

Maybe Sarah Hall Ingram is just a very good guesser.

How did Sarah Hall Ingram, not a political officer but an official at the Internal Revenue Service in a politically sensitive position, know with certainty that Obama would continue hammering on this theme? Was she in contact with anyone at the White House or someone who played any role in the Obama campaign?

Ingram certainly was in contact with the Obama White House. She made 165 visits there during the IRS targeting period.

Links in a chain….

If the ‘missing emails’ proved innocence, they would have been released already. If the parties were innocent, clear cogent evidence would have been released already.

But when parties aren’t innocent and have something to hide, they dodge, obfuscate, spin, misdirect, and point fingers elsewhere. Here we have not only major root crimes around the abuses of power at the IRS for political advantage, but violations of multiple federal laws in what appears to be a multi-agency operation with unexplained links to the White House…and suspicious coordination with WH political efforts and messages.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 5:27 PM

The American people expect their public servants to do right.

davidk on June 23, 2014 at 4:27 PM

Yes they do. And the ones currently in DC are not public servants. 99% of them are hacks that only care about their seats.

farleftprogressive on June 23, 2014 at 5:34 PM

Good post on Ace of Spades highlighting that current IRS Commissioner John Koskinen not only is in that position because he’s a partisan progressive, but that he committed perjury before Congress during his testimony in March 2013 and his testimony last Friday.

I wonder if he can dig himself out of that hole testifying today and tomorrow before House Oversight, or if he’ll double down on perjury as so many Obama appointees have done in the past 5 1/2 years.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 5:36 PM

Yes they do. And the ones currently in DC are not public servants. 99% of them are hacks that only care about their seats.

farleftprogressive on June 23, 2014 at 5:34 PM

Applies to the bureaucrats too.

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 5:38 PM

The guys over at IBD are surmising that perhaps the GOP is involved with this too, a common political enemy found in a boat-tipping Tea Party.

Bishop on June 23, 2014 at 10:03 AM

I have come to that conclusion also. I don’t care if it’s bi-partisan corruption, put them all in jail. In fact, it might finish off the GOPe, a big bonus.

8 weight on June 23, 2014 at 5:41 PM

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 5:36 PM

Typo correction – March 2014

gwelf on June 23, 2014 at 5:38 PM

Exactly. Those ‘professional’ bureaucrats are interested in keeping their well paying extremely safe jobs that have little real accountability and responsibility. Heaven forbid they might have to compete in the private sector. Bosses there want tangible results and productivity.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 5:46 PM

If I’m reading this correctly, that means Sonasoft HAS backup tapes. IF the contract was cancelled AFTER Lerner’s hard drive crash, well……. that says the company w/the backup info has it.

Counting my college instruction, I only have 30+years in IT. I didn’t program or fix but I know what it takes to run an IT operation. So does the IRS. The data is somewhere.

MN J on June 23, 2014 at 5:47 PM

I have come to that conclusion also. I don’t care if it’s bi-partisan corruption, put them all in jail. In fact, it might finish off the GOPe, a big bonus.

8 weight on June 23, 2014 at 5:41 PM

And… who’s going to do that if the GOPe is in on it, I wonder?

Holder’s protecting Democrats, and Issa may just be protecting GOPe (would explain why *NOTHING* ever happens in his investigations). They may be of different stripes, but expecting foxes from either side to investigate and prosecute those guilty of eating the chickens is… well…

Midas on June 23, 2014 at 5:47 PM

If I’m reading this correctly, that means Sonasoft HAS backup tapes. IF the contract was cancelled AFTER Lerner’s hard drive crash, well……. that says the company w/the backup info has it.

Counting my college instruction, I only have 30+years in IT. I didn’t program or fix but I know what it takes to run an IT operation. So does the IRS. The data is somewhere.

MN J on June 23, 2014 at 5:47 PM

If you had provided that service for the IRS, and that service was subsequently canceled, I suspect the IRS would demand of you any and all tapes at that point. I doubt highly they simply walked off and let Sonasoft retain any records/tapes. *Especially* if they were canceling the contract because they were trying to cover their trail.

Midas on June 23, 2014 at 5:49 PM

Should be a simple procedure if granted access to each server

Seems like Lois sent official emails using an alias (illegal I think)- be sure to keep those in the loop. What was that name — Richard… something

minus200 on June 23, 2014 at 2:18 PM

True- but that’s a very big “IF…”

cs89 on June 23, 2014 at 5:56 PM

If you had provided that service for the IRS, and that service was subsequently canceled, I suspect the IRS would demand of you any and all tapes at that point. I doubt highly they simply walked off and let Sonasoft retain any records/tapes. *Especially* if they were canceling the contract because they were trying to cover their trail.

Midas on June 23, 2014 at 5:49 PM

You’re assuming that a government agency was competent or that the left hand at the IRS knew what the right hand was doing.

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 6:08 PM

You’re assuming that a government agency was competent or that the left hand at the IRS knew what the right hand was doing.

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 6:08 PM

How incredibly naive and vapid…that’s about as cogent as Koskinen’s claims last Friday during testimony that the lost emails / crashed hard drivers were because of insufficient IT funding or as coincidental that all of the emails lost just happened to be those of 7 people being specifically targeted by Congressional investigations.

Clearly, Lois Lerner, Sarah Hall Ingram, and others were competent enough to not only launch BOLO and specific targeting of conservative political groups in conjunction, and coincidentally with a WH political push against Citizens United, but to also send 1.1 million records to the FBI / DoJ for possible criminal prosecutions.

These, and Lerner’s emails to the IT team, sure look like not only did the right hand know what the left was doing, but both hands learned quite a bit from the failed Watergate cover-up.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 6:26 PM

How incredibly naive and vapid…that’s about as cogent as Koskinen’s claims last Friday during testimony that the lost emails / crashed hard drivers were because of insufficient IT funding or as coincidental that all of the emails lost just happened to be those of 7 people being specifically targeted by Congressional investigations.

Clearly, Lois Lerner, Sarah Hall Ingram, and others were competent enough to not only launch BOLO and specific targeting of conservative political groups in conjunction, and coincidentally with a WH political push against Citizens United, but to also send 1.1 million records to the FBI / DoJ for possible criminal prosecutions.

These, and Lerner’s emails to the IT team, sure look like not only did the right hand know what the left was doing, but both hands learned quite a bit from the failed Watergate cover-up.

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 6:26 PM

So being allegedly competent in one area means they’re competent in the IT areas? I’ll ask my doctor to try to help me to fix my home server during my next checkup.

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 6:55 PM

So being allegedly competent in one area means they’re competent in the IT areas? I’ll ask my doctor to try to help me to fix my home server during my next checkup.

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 6:55 PM

While you are at it, ask him why Lerner took the fifth rather than try and explain what went on re her JOB.

arnold ziffel on June 23, 2014 at 7:00 PM

So being allegedly competent in one area means they’re competent in the IT areas? I’ll ask my doctor to try to help me to fix my home server during my next checkup.

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 6:55 PM

Nice fallacy – a “perfect” response for when one is called on making an argument that is far from cogent and valid.

I expected better, but got little more than the drivel that Verbie usually offers.

Lerner and the senior management of the IRS don’t have to be competent in IT areas – just authoritative and order certain trusted IT folks to undertake certain tasks in order to protect themselves from a Congressional investigation into an illegal abuse of power for partisan political purposes. As long as incriminating emails are ‘lost’, those involved protected from above and don’t talk, then apologists like you have a field day, particularly when the party involved is the ‘D’ and not the ‘R’. If the latter, obviously the rules change, right?

Athos on June 23, 2014 at 7:08 PM

If you had provided that service for the IRS, and that service was subsequently canceled, I suspect the IRS would demand of you any and all tapes at that point. I doubt highly they simply walked off and let Sonasoft retain any records/tapes. *Especially* if they were canceling the contract because they were trying to cover their trail.

Midas on June 23, 2014 at 5:49 PM

You’re assuming that a government agency was competent or that the left hand at the IRS knew what the right hand was doing.

jim56 on June 23, 2014 at 6:08 PM

If there’s anything bureaucrats are experts at, it’s covering themselves.

Just like a certain dog I know that doesn’t always seem too bright … until there’s food involved. Then she becomes an evil genius.

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 23, 2014 at 7:25 PM

They’re laughing at republicans. They know everyone knows they did a thorough job of deleting those emails and they know Obama will protect them for doing his wishes. With the low-life senate democrat’s willingness to never allow a successful impeachment no matter the lies and illegalities nothing can be done – at least not until after 2016. Only then can we hope for a Republican administration to make them pay with prosecutions, if they have the balls – but I suspect most Republicans are basically neutered.

Chessplayer on June 23, 2014 at 9:49 PM

Subpoena her Blackberry. Doubt it has any info, but it might…as well as the memory card.

Then subpoena Verizon for her govt texts and emails that synced with her Blackberry.

Finally, hit her with criminal charges and subpoena her personal emails. Don’t 0bambi officials like to use their personal email for “sensitive” topics they don’t want monitored?

freedomfirst on June 23, 2014 at 12:17 PM

I have a government issued Blackberry. It only shows the last thirty days of emails, but Lerner’s may be different.

As for the Sonasoft contract being “cancelled”, it’s my guess that it was a one year contact with five option years. Under government procurement rules/law, the contract must be re-bid after the six years have passed. So, Somasoft may not have had their contract “cancelled”, but it could not be renewed and they did not land the follow-on contract, or the IRS chose not to use a archival service.

There is absolutely no way Lerner did not have her hard-drive and emails restored when it “crashed”. There is no way a person in her position could perform her duties without all her previous emails. It is an impossibility. I’m a mid-level government contractor and had my government email archive file become corrupted a couple of years ago. I immediately had a serious panic attack not having access to my past emails. Fortunately, the IT guys were able to restore all my emails from their backups.

The hard drive “crash” is, in my opinion, a total fabrication. If it did “crash”, it did so after she left the IRS. It was reformatted, then shredded, to destroy the evidence.

GAlpha10 on June 23, 2014 at 10:33 PM

The head of the IRS, testifying again under oath before Congress tonight, stuck to his lies about how the IRS’ computer systems were so bad they needed a complete new system with new PCs that would cost 10 – $30 million but declared the IRS hasn’t had / doesn’t have the money. Rep Issa quickly pointed out that the IRS gave out $89 million in BONUSES not long ago and has an IT Budget of over $1.5 BILLION per year. Issa then asked the IRS Chief that since he supposedly knew the IRS’ computers and system have been so in need of replacement why haven’t they done so. The IRS Chief replied by saying they have had HIGHER PRIORITIES than to spend $30 million on new computers/a new computer system.
– Wow, this guy as some n@ds – I’ll give him that much.

easyt65 on June 23, 2014 at 11:08 PM

As for the Sonasoft contract being “cancelled”, it’s my guess that it was a one year contact with five option years. Under government procurement rules/law, the contract must be re-bid after the six years have passed. So, Somasoft may not have had their contract “cancelled”, but it could not be renewed and they did not land the follow-on contract, or the IRS chose not to use a archival service.

Even so, the idea that the IRS demanded that Sonasoft destroy all of the IRS archives it possessed – instead of transferring those archives to a new vendor or back to the IRS – is criminal.

It may be that the IRS had some valid reason for not continuing Sonasoft’s contract.

But, the IRS has a duty to maintain gov’t files (including emails) for some period of time. And, for practical reasons, would want to maintain such archived files.

So, the only reason that the IRS could possibly have ask Sonasoft to destroy the archives without first either getting a copy or making sure the IRS had its own archive of the same files, is criminal.

Or else the IRS’s explanation is this “you know that contract where we paid you millions to archive our data? Well, we decided we don’t want any archive of any data anymore so destroy it all”. Otherwise, what the IRS is claiming defies common sense.

No gov’t agency or private company would do this – ever, unless it purposefully wanted the data destroyed for some improper reason.

It just would not happen otherwise.

Monkeytoe on June 24, 2014 at 10:05 AM

Any doubts I had that this was ordered from the top are being dissipated. Daily ever more.

Our US cousins your tax collection service is no more than an Obama shill fest.

Esperanza on June 24, 2014 at 11:01 AM

No gov’t agency or private company would do this – ever, unless it purposefully wanted the data destroyed for some improper reason.

It just would not happen otherwise.

Monkeytoe on June 24, 2014 at 10:05 AM

I’m with you 1000%.

GAlpha10 on June 24, 2014 at 1:45 PM

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