Experts: Obama should have seen Iraq unrest coming

posted at 11:21 am on June 17, 2014 by Allahpundit

Foreign Policy had a story about our intelligence failures last week too but I’m still not persuaded. Was this really a matter of not seeing ISIS coming, or was it a matter of seeing it but not being able to do much about it?

Lawmakers from both parties and even some non-partisan analysts say the Obama administration should have better anticipated the rise of Sunni militants, who captured Iraq’s second-largest city last week and could pose a terrorism threat both within and outside the country’s borders…

“It was very clear to people how bad these guys are,” Michael Leiter, a former top counterterrorism official in both the Bush and Obama administrations, said in an interview. “I don’t know if this was a tactical error or an intelligence error.”

Any question about the group’s capabilities or intentions should have been answered when the militants took Fallujah in January, Leiter said.

“I think our intelligence has failed us miserably, from not being aware of the threat that we’ve faced and how this could unfold as quickly as it has. This has been planned for quite some time,” Sen. Joe Manchin, a Democrat from West Virginia, said on NBC’s Meet The Press Sunday. “My first thing to recommend to the president is get your intelligence group back on track, making sure that we have the intel that we need for whatever options we have, that are going to be accurate.”

Contrast that with this passage from The Hill. Date: October 30, 2013, seven and a half months ago.

The teaming of al Qaeda’s Iraqi cell and affiliated Islamic militant groups in Syria into the new Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham (ISIS) has developed into “a major emerging threat to Iraqi stability . . . and to us,” a senior administration official told reporters on Wednesday.

“It is a fact now that al Qaeda has a presence in Western Iraq” extending into Syria, “that Iraqi forces are unable to target,” the official said.

That growing presence “that has accelerated in the past six to eight months” has been accompanied by waves of bombings and attacks that threaten to throw Iraq into a full-blown civil war.

Yup, pretty much. Two months after that story appeared, ISIS seized Fallujah, which must have settled any lingering doubts within the IC about how dire the threat was. At the end of April of this year, six weeks or so before ISIS took Mosul, Reuters reported that the U.S. was quietly expanding its intelligence presence inside Iraq and holding “urgent” meetings in Washington and Baghdad on how to counter ISIS. All of which is to say, the big push south towards Baghdad didn’t sneak up on us. On the contrary, intel experts have been warning since day one of the Syrian civil war that the longer it dragged on, the more certain it was that Sunni jihadis fighting Assad in the north would begin to leak south into Iraq and cause problems there. Nor was it any secret that Maliki’s antagonized the Sunnis in Anbar by trying to assert Shiite hegemony in Iraq rather than build coalitions. Go figure that a heavily armed, battle-tested Sunni jihadi force might be able to advance quickly in territory controlled by a Sunni minority that hates the government in Baghdad.

This seems to me, then, not so much an intelligence failure as a case of the White House not knowing how to react. Obama wanted to hit Assad last fall to punish him for using chemical weapons and maybe create some space for, ahem, “moderate” Syria rebels to advance, but he gave up when he saw there was no support for it in Congress. He’s spent years weighing whether to arm the “moderates” there to act as a bulwark against Assad on the one hand and jihadi rebels on the other, but there are few moderates to be had and the ones who are there are in disarray. Any weapons you send them are likely to end up controlled by ISIS, just as ISIS now controls U.S. arms and machinery that it captured in Mosul from the Iraqi army. And of course, a guy who got elected in 2008 promising to end the war and bring the troops home wasn’t about to intervene against ISIS on the other side of the border in Iraq until the threat became truly grave. As grave it is right now, there’s still little appetite among the public for doing anything militarily to save Baghdad, despite loads of TV news coverage about it. Imagine how little appetite there would have been in, say, February if O had announced we needed to start bombing again in Iraq to halt ISIS’s advance before they reached Mosul.

If there’s a big intelligence failure here, I think it has less to do with ISIS than with the Iraqi army. Apart from all the political reasons not to intervene, Obama may have been counting on the fact that if ISIS pushed too far south, the Iraqi army would answer the bell and the Sunnis who helped oust Al Qaeda in Iraq as part of the “Awakening” years ago would join them. Hasn’t worked out that way. Iraqi troops who felt no loyalty to the government deserted and local Sunnis who, you would have thought, had learned their lesson after welcoming jihadis to counter the U.S. occupation decided to welcome them again. That’s the part that seems to have caught U.S. spies off guard. How come? Observers have been grumbling for years that Maliki’s sectarian approach was going to break the country apart. Watching parts of the army disintegrate under pressure is a symptom of that. There wasn’t much we could have done at this point to stop it, but not to anticipate it is bizarre.

Update: Ed e-mails with a good point:

One point about the tribal leaders switching sides. We convinced them to do that the first time against their usual Sunni interests in the Anbar Awakening, in part by at least hinting that we’d be around for the long haul against both the extremists and as a moderating influence on the Shi’ite-majority government. We bailed on both of those explicit or implicit promises, and without that, their instincts are to ally with the Sunnis no matter what. I’d say they’re learning the correct lesson, unfortunately.

A foreseeable consequence of America’s departure. Not an intelligence failure.


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The Obama Presidency is really the Costanza Presidency.

Had he done the opposite of everything he did, the nation would be in great shape.

Nethicus on June 17, 2014 at 11:23 AM

He’ll always side with the Muslims. He said he would.

Key West Reader on June 17, 2014 at 11:24 AM

Don’t bother him, he’s about to putt.

Ward Cleaver on June 17, 2014 at 11:25 AM

Actually, he just read about in the newspaper like everyone else…

Pest on June 17, 2014 at 11:25 AM

Experts: Obama should have seen Iraq unrest coming

America should have seen Obama coming…….

Electrongod on June 17, 2014 at 11:25 AM

If he could give just one more speech…does ISIS play golf?

d1carter on June 17, 2014 at 11:25 AM

As I posted in Headlines:

Why the assumption he didn’t know? Of course he knew and choose to do nothing about it.

How many times are people going to fall for the old “I just read about in the paper” or “caught flatfooted again” excuse.

Unbelievable

WisRich on June 17, 2014 at 11:25 AM

Dog Eater let his fat mouth get ahead of himself, all those proclamations of success before the dust had truly settled and now he’s gone to own them. So of course he does nothing because doing nothing is better than doing something and effing it up like he effs up everything else his claws touch.

Just accept we are going to have 2.5 years of harrowing occurrences to suffer through before hopefully jumping back on the tracks.

Bishop on June 17, 2014 at 11:27 AM

Is it a coincidence that ISIS began their attack about 3 days after Obama released the Taliban 5?

portlandon on June 17, 2014 at 11:28 AM

Hot Air readers should have seen this double post coming :)

faraway on June 17, 2014 at 11:28 AM

You think?

He’s arming and supporting an Army in Syria which gave rise to ISIS (Islamic State of “IRAQ” and ash Sham) and ISIL (Islamic State of “Iraq” of Levant). They fly Al Qaeda flags and he does nothing.

He armed them. He supported them. He cheered their victories as they were capturing heavy weaponry and armor like the T72s bombing Tal Afar and BIAP. He released the most dangerous man from Camp Bucca in 2009, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi , who went on o command the movement.

hawkdriver on June 17, 2014 at 11:29 AM

Ray Charles saw this coming.

HumpBot Salvation on June 17, 2014 at 11:29 AM

Yes, but Obama is not like us. He’s so much smarter than we are he’s actually dumber than we are. Only such pure intellectual genius can operate at such a level.

ConstantineXI on June 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM

We bailed on both of those explicit or implicit promises, and without that, their instincts are to ally with the Sunnis no matter what. I’d say they’re learning the correct lesson, unfortunately.

Lesson learned; never trust a anyone who sees America and western culture as the problem. That includes Obama and his friends.

Tater Salad on June 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM

Can’t the guy just eat his waffles.

HumpBot Salvation on June 17, 2014 at 11:31 AM

He would have but Moochell used that section of the paper for their dog.

Sven on June 17, 2014 at 11:31 AM

He was too busy releasing terrorists.

viking01 on June 17, 2014 at 11:31 AM

Blame the gop for not helping me out
-obama

LSM have their talking points

cmsinaz on June 17, 2014 at 11:32 AM

This seems to me, then, not so much an intelligence failure as a case of the White House not knowing how to react.

Obama is so cerebral, his thought process so intellectual and deep, that sometimes it takes him 8-12 months to make a decision.

Obama is skinny, because by the time he decides what he wants for breakfast, its lunch time the next day.

portlandon on June 17, 2014 at 11:32 AM

When he appears before the cameras to make comments now, about anything, he seems dazed and worn down. He thought he was the Messiah, but he now knows he was mistaken. Bummer.

Appalacher on June 17, 2014 at 11:32 AM

Just accept we are going to have 2.5 years of harrowing occurrences to suffer through before hopefully jumping back on the tracks.

Bishop on June 17, 2014 at 11:27 AM

I turn 42 in a couple weeks, and I suspect I am not going to live to see an America fully recovered from the disaster known as Barack HUSSEIN Obama.

And that assumes the morons who vote don’t give us more of him.

ConstantineXI on June 17, 2014 at 11:32 AM

Hot Air readers should have seen this double post coming :)

faraway on June 17, 2014 at 11:28 AM

At least it’s a break from the stories on the unintended consequences of legal pot and Libertarian Fright Theater.

rhombus on June 17, 2014 at 11:33 AM

So, the news of the growing problem was in the papers, so he could have read it.

What’s Obama’s excuse now?

PattyJ on June 17, 2014 at 11:33 AM

Helen Keller could have seen it coming.

myiq2xu on June 17, 2014 at 11:34 AM

No beer summit maybe a waffle summit instead?

cmsinaz on June 17, 2014 at 11:35 AM

All this proves what Obama thinks of America and it’s history. He thinks we will only make matters worse.

Look at his closest friends, allies and influences prior to becoming president; Bill Ayers, Rev. Wright, Prof. Derrick Bell, Prof. Henry Gates, Father Flagler and Eric Holder. None of them have anything nice to say about America or it’s history.

Tater Salad on June 17, 2014 at 11:35 AM

Dude, this happened two weeks ago!

cbenoistd on June 17, 2014 at 11:35 AM

When he appears before the cameras to make comments now, about anything, he seems dazed and worn down. He thought he was the Messiah, but he now knows he was mistaken. Bummer.
Appalacher on June 17, 2014 at 11:32 AM

He’s not capable of realizing that, he’s so smart.

What he wants to do is scream at US for “failing to appreciate” his “greatness”.

ConstantineXI on June 17, 2014 at 11:36 AM

The Obama acted stupidly.

viking01 on June 17, 2014 at 11:38 AM

The Obama Presidency is really the Costanza Presidency.

Had he done the opposite of everything he did, the nation would be in great shape.

Nethicus on June 17, 2014 at 11:23 AM

Starting off with not running for president…

DinaRehn on June 17, 2014 at 11:38 AM

What he wants to do is scream at US for “failing to appreciate” his “greatness”.

ConstantineXI on June 17, 2014 at 11:36 AM

You are exactly right! He is beaten down, not by the job, but because we are too “stupid” to understand his view of the world.

Tater Salad on June 17, 2014 at 11:38 AM

Who said he didn’t see it coming and this is exactly what he wanted?
Obama is all for a Muslim Caliphate across the Middle East.
His choice of leadership of the Caliphate was the Muslim Brotherhood…but all that can be worked out later.

albill on June 17, 2014 at 11:39 AM

He saw it coming, it just didn’t fit his narrative. So he’ll let it fester for a while, give a few speeches on global warming and hope another crisis arises that makes him look less of a jackass than this one does.

Fore!

fogw on June 17, 2014 at 11:39 AM

It’s shocking because after 9/11, maybe we overreacted, but we built up this huge effort to fight against Al Qaeda, just huge, and now this. It’s crazy.

LashRambo on June 17, 2014 at 11:40 AM

Muslims killing each other is nothing new.
Even Stevie Wonder could have seen that coming

weedisgood on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever? I seem to recall that there was a timeline in place for their eventual withdrawal.

If the current events were foreseeable after a US troop withdrawal, then surely the prior administration saw it as well.

It is truly a great strategy to do something unsustainable, such as Social Security, when you know you will not be around to reap the consequences.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Obama should have seen Iraq unrest coming

Seen it coming? Hell he wanted it to come, he encouraged it…..he is on the side of the Sunni’s.
All of his “supporting the rebels” in Syria??? These are the same rebels that are now invading Iraq…..
It will be an Islamic World War and Obama started it because he thinks the Muslims have been oppressed. Plus Obama wanted to undo what Bush did. So after ISIS kills 30 million people, that will be an Obama accomplishment…..but 25 million of those will be Muslim. The Nazis have nothing on ISIS.

Soon, Iran and Syria will be at war with Saudi Arabia….I suggest we keep drilling and fracking in the US or we will see $10 gal gas……

redguy on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Update: Ed e-mails with a good point:

No he didn’t, his computer crashed and all of his emails were lost…

oscarwilde on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Give him a break. He’s struggling to feed his kids.

redzap on June 17, 2014 at 11:42 AM

Hitler should have seen the Polish invasion coming.

faraway on June 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM

Our national intelligence knew this was coming, therefore Obama knew it was coming. He just couldn’t/wouldn’t do anything about it because of his view that US involvement IS the problem, and that only more involvement would exacerbate the problem.

Therefore he is only going to realize it is happening “when he saw the news reports on TV”.

Tater Salad on June 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM

Darn, imagine where we’d all be if only zero had attended his daily National Security briefings like a good lad…

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 11:44 AM

Obama: “Newspapers need to be federalized, because I’m not getting the information I need on a timely basis.”

faraway on June 17, 2014 at 11:44 AM

Our national intelligence knew this was coming, therefore Obama knew it was coming. He just couldn’t/wouldn’t do anything about it because of his view that US involvement IS the problem, and that only more involvement would exacerbate the problem.

Therefore he is only going to realize it is happening “when he saw the news reports on TV”.

Tater Salad on June 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM

Obama doesn’t spend enough time at work to know anything intelligence knows.

In no earlier than 10, out never later than 3, vacation every other month.

ConstantineXI on June 17, 2014 at 11:45 AM

“NeoCons!”

-libfree

Bishop on June 17, 2014 at 11:47 AM

As James Taranto likes to say in his ‘Best of the Web’ review daily (http://opinionjournal.com), “What would we do without experts?”

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 17, 2014 at 11:47 AM

Via twitchy fnc reports that benghazi suspect caught……new squirrel for the lsm

cmsinaz on June 17, 2014 at 11:47 AM

Soon, Iran and Syria will be at war with Saudi Arabia….I suggest we keep drilling and fracking in the US or we will see $10 gal gas……

redguy on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

And prepare to deal with any climate change issues brought on by nuclear detonations and the resulting fallout.

rhombus on June 17, 2014 at 11:47 AM

Our national intelligence knew this was coming, therefore Obama knew it was coming. He just couldn’t/wouldn’t do anything about it because of his view that US involvement IS the problem, and that only more involvement would exacerbate the problem.

Therefore he is only going to realize it is happening “when he saw the news reports on TV”.

Tater Salad on June 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM

The artificial peace was never sustainable. We can’t afford to be in the Muslim land forever. The barbarians were itching to to what barbarians do.

weedisgood on June 17, 2014 at 11:48 AM

Update:

Dude, this happened like two days ago!

cbenoistd on June 17, 2014 at 11:48 AM

Well, this story is now going to have to go back to the end of the line. Our troops captured a Benghazi suspect in Libya. Obama will now claim credit to resolving the fake scandal. Football spiking time!

Brock Robamney on June 17, 2014 at 11:48 AM

Ya think? One week after he assumed office the bombings in Iraq resumed. This has been 5 years in the making.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:48 AM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever?
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Your simplistic question isn’t even relevant. The question would be, “Did Bush incite the Syrian uprising and Civil War and end up ostensibly creating ISIS and ISIL through direct support?”

The condition of Iraq at the end of the Bush Administration were it even unstable, which it wasn’t, is not the point. Obama for all intent and purposed helped create the army and political force/movement that just overran the country.

I know this is all a little inconvenient for your Libertarian memes, but try to keep up.

hawkdriver on June 17, 2014 at 11:50 AM

Yepper brock…..all hail dear leader

cmsinaz on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever? I seem to recall that there was a timeline in place for their eventual withdrawal.

If the current events were foreseeable after a US troop withdrawal, then surely the prior administration saw it as well.

It is truly a great strategy to do something unsustainable, such as Social Security, when you know you will not be around to reap the consequences.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Ok, so Bush screwed this up… I get that argument.

One question.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2010/02/vice-president-biden-iraq-could-be-one-of-the-great-achievements-of-this-administration/

On Larry King Live last night, Vice President Joe Biden said Iraq “could be one of the great achievements of this administration. You’re going to see 90,000 American troops come marching home by the end of the summer. You’re going to see a stable government in Iraq that is actually moving toward a representative government.”

What EXACTLY did Bush do AFTER FEBRUARY 2010

gekkobear on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

The Obama Presidency is really the Costanza Presidency.

Had he done the opposite of everything he did, the nation would be in great shape.

Nethicus on June 17, 2014 at 11:23 AM

I think of him more as the Rufus T. Firefly president.

“If you think this country’s bad off now, just wait till I get through with it!”

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Via twitchy fnc reports that benghazi suspect caught……new squirrel for the lsm

cmsinaz on June 17, 2014 at 11:47 AM

I predict that like OBL, this hurts R political chances.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Zero was informed by a lot of people this would happen. He thinks he’s smarter than everyone who actually knows something.

dogsoldier on June 17, 2014 at 11:52 AM

Our troops captured a Benghazi suspect in Libya. Obama will now claim credit to resolving the fake scandal.

Brock Robamney on June 17, 2014 at 11:48 AM

I thought the YouTube guy was already captured….????

/

Electrongod on June 17, 2014 at 11:53 AM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever? I seem to recall that there was a timeline in place for their eventual withdrawal.

If the current events were foreseeable after a US troop withdrawal, then surely the prior administration saw it as well.

It is truly a great strategy to do something unsustainable, such as Social Security, when you know you will not be around to reap the consequences.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Ok, so Bush screwed this up… I get that argument.

One question.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2010/02/vice-president-biden-iraq-could-be-one-of-the-great-achievements-of-this-administration/

On Larry King Live last night, Vice President Joe Biden said Iraq “could be one of the great achievements of this administration. You’re going to see 90,000 American troops come marching home by the end of the summer. You’re going to see a stable government in Iraq that is actually moving toward a representative government.”

I understand Bush screwed it up, but since it wasn’t screwed up in 2010 when it was a “great achievement” he must have screwed it up after Feb 2010… how did he manage that precisely?

Or perhaps could this be something screwed up after 2010… by someone who had some power during that timeframe?

gekkobear on June 17, 2014 at 11:53 AM

What EXACTLY did Bush do AFTER FEBRUARY 2010

gekkobear on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

You listen to Joe Biden and expect something intelligent?

He was right about Iraq splitting in 3 after a US invasion though so maybe I am giving him a raw deal. At the time, things seemed OK, so of course Biden was going to use it for political points.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:54 AM

Via twitchy fnc reports that benghazi suspect caught……new squirrel for the lsm

cmsinaz on June 17, 2014 at 11:47 AM

I predict that like OBL, this hurts R political chances.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Doubtful, but yet to be seen. And possibly the most stupid thing written here today that didn’t come from the bluegilled hagfish.

This is very bad news for zero. Where is he going to put this guy if not Guantanamo?

cozmo on June 17, 2014 at 11:55 AM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever?
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

we still have over 100,000 troops strationed in Germany, Japan and Korea.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:55 AM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever?

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

Tell me, did we plan on having US troops in Japan forever?

Did we plan on having US troops in Korea forever?

Did we plan on having US troops in Germany forever?

Almost no one complains about the troops in those countries, and we’ve had them there much MUCH longer than we had troops in Iraq.

Was it too much to ask that we keep a modicum of troops there until the place was stable? Heck, Japan, S. Korea and Germany have been better than stable for decades and we still have troops there…

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 11:55 AM

that’s stationed.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:55 AM

hive mind.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM

#stronglywordedmemotoISISontheway

TXUS on June 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

No, you are incorrect. The plan was to stay there long enough to insure the Iraqi people could stand on their own. They were not ready when, for purely political reasons, King Putt decided that he would abandon them.

Look, you don’t quit on someone just starting physical therapy. This is the same thing. Zero couldn’t care less about the Iraqi people. When Maliki wanted 20,000 US troops to stay there, Zero said no.

Zero is a traitor, not just to us, but to anyone foolish enough to get near him.

dogsoldier on June 17, 2014 at 11:57 AM

Well, Bush was told that bin Laden was determined to attack inside the US a few weeks before 9/11 and the left thinks he should have been able to prevent those attacks. I’m sure they’ll agree that Obama should have seen this coming.

Occams Stubble on June 17, 2014 at 11:57 AM

Was it too much to ask that we keep a modicum of troops there until the place was stable? Heck, Japan, S. Korea and Germany have been better than stable for decades and we still have troops there…

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 11:55 AM

Ja, they are there still. My question still stands: Did GWB and the prior administration have in place a plan to draw down troops from Iraq? Was there not a plan in place when Obama took office?

If there was, should Obama have “altered the plan” to overturn Bush and keep troops in Iraq against the wishes of the Iraqi government. Remember, that the Iraqi government would not give troops immunity from prosecution. Also recall we have big bases in Jordan and Kuwait, next door.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:58 AM

He did. He loves it.

Schadenfreude on June 17, 2014 at 11:59 AM

hive mind.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM

Sorry for the inconvenient facts pal, if you have different figures feel free to post them. You’re as clueless as they come, buddy.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:59 AM

The artificial peace was never sustainable. We can’t afford to be in the Muslim land forever. The barbarians were itching to to what barbarians do.

weedisgood on June 17, 2014 at 11:48 AM

I suspect ‘it was unsustainable’ is the new talking point. Awkwardly for the president, though, he was proclaiming victory in Iraq in 2011.

Oopsie. Well, math is hard.

For the slower ones out there, let’s review the timeline.

• In 2009, Bush leaves office and Obama is inaugurated.

• In 2011, Obama proclaims Iraq is one of his great achievements.

• In 2014, the failure in Iraq is all Bush’s fault.

Yep, that makes perfect sense.

There Goes the Neighborhood on June 17, 2014 at 12:01 PM

I predict that like OBL, this hurts R political chances.
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Your nom is apropos, I’ll give you that much.

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 12:01 PM

Tell me, did Bush plan on having US troops in Iraq forever?
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:41 AM

we still have over 100,000 troops stationed in Germany, Japan and Korea.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:55 AM

antisense has a perfect nom. It never makes logical sense.

hive mind.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM

Sorry for the inconvenient facts pal, if you have different figures feel free to post them. You’re as clueless as they come, buddy.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:59 AM

yaedon was sarcastic. Good sarcasm doesn’t necessitate sarc tags :)

You are right, of course. antisense is always blinded, by choom likely.

Schadenfreude on June 17, 2014 at 12:02 PM

hive mind.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 11:56 AM

Sorry for the inconvenient facts pal, if you have different figures feel free to post them. You’re as clueless as they come, buddy.

pc253 on June 17, 2014 at 11:59 AM

Uh…the term “hive mind” indicates that we independently posted the same/similar replies. As in, we agree with each other.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:03 PM

Well, Bush was told that bin Laden was determined to attack inside the US a few weeks before 9/11 and the left thinks he should have been able to prevent those attacks. I’m sure they’ll agree that Obama should have seen this coming.

Occams Stubble on June 17, 2014 at 11:57 AM

Funny thing is whenever you ask those Leftists exactly how Bush could have prevented those attacks (in a matter that they would approve of, naturally!) they can never answer.

Del Dolemonte on June 17, 2014 at 12:04 PM

He did. He went golfing and living in a 10,000 square feet house, airconditioned, in the desert, while preaching “climate change”.

Not to worry, Susan Rice is in charge of your national security. You’re in good hands.

Uh…the term “hive mind” indicates that we independently posted the same/similar replies. As in, we agree with each other.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:03 PM

So, it wasn’t snark, it was even better then.

Schadenfreude on June 17, 2014 at 12:04 PM

My question still stands:
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:58 AM

So does mine. Troops left in Iraq whether under Bush or obama have less to do with the Iraqis being overrun than the forces that overran them which obama helped to create.

What responsibility can you muster for Bush with Syria?

hawkdriver on June 17, 2014 at 12:05 PM

If there was, should Obama have “altered the plan” to overturn Bush and keep troops in Iraq against the wishes of the Iraqi government. Remember, that the Iraqi government would not give troops immunity from prosecution. Also recall we have big bases in Jordan and Kuwait, next door.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:58 AM

mmmm I don’t know. Aren’t leaders supposed to adjust to current situations and make decisions accordingly or are they supposed to only make decisions that help them politically?

HumpBot Salvation on June 17, 2014 at 12:05 PM

So, it wasn’t snark, it was even better then.

Schadenfreude on June 17, 2014 at 12:04 PM

Indeed.

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:06 PM

I predict that like OBL, this hurts R political chances.
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:51 AM

Your nom is apropos, I’ll give you that much.

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 12:01 PM

I say this because once more information is know about Benghazi, there is less chance to read into it negative things about the administration. Now that this guy is caught, they can say the conspiracy theories are now busted. It will simply be a political argument going forward, which will not hurt the administration as much because they will be able to blunt any attacks over this as being… political.

Maybe I am wrong and somehow finding this bad guy will help the Rs.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 12:06 PM

Uh…the term “hive mind” indicates that we independently posted the same/similar replies. As in, we agree with each other.
yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:03 PM

“Hive mind” is like SO 1984-ish…today’s nomenclature is “GMTA” (Great Minds Think Alike).

Get with the program, Yaedon ;-)

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 12:06 PM

Do NOT forget that Obama let the leader of ISIS out of prison. Bush had him in prison.

Obama couldn’t play nice with the Iraqis so he took his ball and went home.

Obama armed AlQaeda (ISIS, ISIL) in Syria and Libya.

Things were not bad, maybe even good, in Iraq and then Obama and his “fecal touch” came along. The man destroys anything and everything that he touches. This is ALL on Obama. Every single bit of it.

jukin3 on June 17, 2014 at 12:10 PM

I say this because once more information is know about Benghazi, there is less chance to read into it negative things about the administration. Now that this guy is caught, they can say the conspiracy theories are now busted. It will simply be a political argument going forward, which will not hurt the administration as much because they will be able to blunt any attacks over this as being… political.

Maybe I am wrong and somehow finding this bad guy will help the Rs.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 12:06 PM

More likely that this guy will confirm that this had nothing to do with the conspiracy theory floated by the administration that the attack was launched due to a youtube video. The same administration who made it political by refusing to cooperate with any investigation and going as far to send Cankles to a committee hearing to shriek….”at this point what difference does it make”.

You really are kind of a moron.

HumpBot Salvation on June 17, 2014 at 12:11 PM

So does mine. Troops left in Iraq whether under Bush or obama have less to do with the Iraqis being overrun than the forces that overran them which obama helped to create.

What responsibility can you muster for Bush with Syria?

hawkdriver on June 17, 2014 at 12:05 PM

Oh yes, if Obama listened to McCain and publicly, (or secretly), gave weapons to to Al Qaeda rebels fighting in Syria then he is responsible. Bush had little to do with that, other than the initial invasion of Iraq.

If Obama did not give weapons to Al Qaeda in Syria, then he is not culpable for them attacking Iraq.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 12:12 PM

Ja, they are there still. My question still stands: Did GWB and the prior administration have in place a plan to draw down troops from Iraq? Was there not a plan in place when Obama took office?

First of all, the question is moot in regards to what good policy is about.

Secondly, IIRC, there was no Bush plan to completely remove all troops from Iraq. In fact, Bush’s drawdown plan was derided by leftists because it didn’t bring enough troops home (i.e., there would have been troops left in Iraq).

If there was, should Obama have “altered the plan” to overturn Bush and keep troops in Iraq against the wishes of the Iraqi government.

Under your false assumption, yes, the plan should have been altered. Obama should have used his famous diplomacy to talk Malaki into keeping our troops there.

Remember, that the Iraqi government would not give troops immunity from prosecution.

Again, we needed some more of the “smart power” diplomacy to convince Iraq otherwise. He didn’t even try.

Also recall we have big bases in Jordan and Kuwait, next door.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 11:58 AM

Fat lot of good those bases are doing us or the Iraqis, huh?

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:12 PM

More likely that this guy will confirm that this had nothing to do with the conspiracy theory floated by the administration that the attack was launched due to a youtube video. The same administration who made it political by refusing to cooperate with any investigation and going as far to send Cankles to a committee hearing to shriek….”at this point what difference does it make”.

You really are kind of a moron.

HumpBot Salvation on June 17, 2014 at 12:11 PM

I am saying what the administration will say, and how that changes the political atmosphere. I think they will win on messaging, especially in light of recent events.

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 12:15 PM

antisense on June 17, 2014 at 12:12 PM

Thanks for agreeing. Bush nothing to do with Syria.

As to McCain. Yep, shilled for the FSA. But it was The obama Administration that supported them. That you feel the need to try to absolve obama for what might be the worst calamity of his presidency is telling.

hawkdriver on June 17, 2014 at 12:16 PM

“Hive mind” is like SO 1984-ish…today’s nomenclature is “GMTA” (Great Minds Think Alike).

Get with the program, Yaedon ;-)

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 12:06 PM

Heh. Old and busted again. Never the new hotness.

Wait…how out of date is that saying?

yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:17 PM

I say this because once more information is know about Benghazi, there is less chance to read into it negative things about the administration. Now that this guy is caught, they can say the conspiracy theories are now busted. It will simply be a political argument going forward, which will not hurt the administration as much because they will be able to blunt any attacks over this as being… political.
Maybe I am wrong and somehow finding this bad guy will help the Rs.
antisense on June 17, 2014 at 12:06 PM

Lemme get this straight…Charlene Lamb admits that it was HER decision to not provide adequate security in Benghazi, despite repeated requests for it AND adequate funding to do so; despite repeated calls to get them the heck outta there and a monitored real-time feed, zero and Hillary out and out ignored the gravity of the Benghazi situation and declined to send help to rescue the trapped ambassador and Benghazi personnel; despite numerous excuses laid out by this administration for it’s Benghazi failures that have been destroyed in even by the LSM, you’re still holding on to the concept that “negative things” are read into the blame placed on this administration? Furthermore, you are also believing that an ALLEGED suspect, who will be tried at some future time for ALLEGED terrorist crimes pertaining to the Benghazi attack, will testify PRE-TRIAL to Congress and put all those pesky Benghazi rumours/facts/suppositions/conspiracy theories to rest?

You DID pick an apropos nom for yourself.

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 12:17 PM

Allah, you’re overthinking what’s going on in the White House….
The answer is very simple: they don’t care. “Period.”

n0doz on June 17, 2014 at 12:18 PM

Heh. Old and busted again. Never the new hotness.
Wait…how out of date is that saying?
yaedon on June 17, 2014 at 12:17 PM

In all honesty, I like the new busted hotness: hive mind. It hums ;-)

Newtie and the Beauty on June 17, 2014 at 12:19 PM

Considering everybody else did see it coming, you’d think we’re the smart ones.

formwiz on June 17, 2014 at 12:21 PM

Yeah I’m surprised too, -that Barry’s crack national security staff didn’t see this coming.

slickwillie2001 on June 17, 2014 at 12:29 PM

Rush just said that ‘Al Qaeda is on the march’.

What is he ‘bleating on’ about?

faraway on June 17, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Terrorism flourishes under obama.

He gave them a million green lights and they took them.

Schadenfreude on June 17, 2014 at 12:33 PM

A foreseeable consequence of America’s departure. Not an intelligence failure.

When politics trump sanity. I hope heads get chopped off.

Schadenfreude on June 17, 2014 at 12:35 PM

The Oval Office TV was on the fritz.

southsideironworks on June 17, 2014 at 12:39 PM

Yeah I’m surprised too, -that Barry’s crack national security staff didn’t see this coming.

slickwillie2001 on June 17, 2014 at 12:29 PM

You said “Barry’s crack.”

hawkdriver on June 17, 2014 at 12:40 PM

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