WaPo writer terribly worried about GOP infighting

posted at 9:31 am on April 27, 2014 by Jazz Shaw

Chris Cillizza at the Washington Post has a lot on his mind these days, and of course the future of the Republican Party is up near the top of the list. But, you might wonder, in the dawn of a mid-term cycle which is shaping up to potentially offer some bright spots for the Grand Old Party, why is he so concerned? Aren’t things going at least passably well at the moment?

Apparently not. No matter how many gains Republicans might see this November, there’s always 2016 to worry about. And what is the GOP’s biggest problem in the next presidential cycle? Is it Hillary? Liz Warren? A perilous demographic shift in the midst of a fight over immigration policy? Don’t be silly. The real problem, of course, is the Tea Party.

What if the tea party decides to walk away from the GOP in 2016? It could happen.

The relationship (or lack thereof) between the mainstream of the Republican party and the tea party has long been pooh-poohed by GOP strategists as standard operating procedure for a party out of the White House. The base and the establishment feud and, in the end, the base falls in line, they argue. But what if the tea party movement represents something new — and less manageable — for the establishment heading into the 2016 presidential race? …

[I]t’s not unreasonable to think that a similar out-in-the-open political brawl is coming for the big prize: The 2016 presidential nomination. The lines are already drawn — albeit somewhat crudely — with Sens. Ted Cruz and Rand Paul on the tea party side and people like Govs. Jeb Bush, Scott Walker and Chris Christie as well as Sen. Marco Rubio representing the establishment side.

Now, someone will win that fight — that’s the good thing about campaigns, someone always wins. But, the broader issue raised by Galen is whether the loser — assuming it is the tea party wing — will simply fold itself into the Republican party or go its own way.

It’s good that Chris is so concerned, and I’m sure you’re all grateful for his contributions to the discussion. But I have to wonder why there’s only one cutting edge of a double bladed sword mentioned in the endless parade of articles on this subject. The default assumption always seems to be that the 2016 Republican primary will eventually boil down to some sort of showdown between the “establishment” candidate and the “grassroots” candidate. Fair enough. We saw something similar in the last go around and there’s no reason to suspect that it won’t happen again. But the second part of the assumption seems to always be that the Tea Party candidate will lose and then – maybe – their supporters in the grassroots will stay home, leading to yet another humiliating defeat for the GOP.

Now, let’s not pretend that there isn’t a significant, and possibly growing strain of Let It Burn (LIB) attitudes among the base. We see plenty of evidence of that right here among the commentariat. (Yes, we actually do read the comments.) It’s a school of thought bred from an increasing and frequently justified sense of frustration over the tactics and strategies of the party leadership. This stands in contrast to the standard mantra of (as Cillizza acknowledges) the enemy of my enemy is my friend. In other words, rather than LIB, deciding that the squishy Republican who is right 75% of the time is still better than the Democrat who will be right 0% of the time.

But what if it went the other way? Let’s say the Tea Party candidate wins the nomination. (Chris lists Ted Cruz and Rand Paul in this role standing against Jeb Bush, Scott Walker, Chris Christie or Marco Rubio.) Is there any concern that the “establishment” portion of the base would simply stay home? Or should we assume that those voters will be far more prone to the Enemy of My Enemy school of thought and show up in the same numbers to support the upstart primary winner? The more I thought about it, the more sense that made. In fact, I’d say that the odds of the Tea Party candidate getting a larger percentage of the vote in the general election are quite high.

But the one thing that Cillizza doesn’t mention is a larger danger that the Tea Party faces. And that is the risk of turning into a big business themselves. If we can take anything away from the 2012 primary and the wave of 2010, it’s that the Tea Party seems to work best when they work on their own at the local level, with messy, disorganized meetings in local halls, boots on the ground knocking on doors, and small donations to individual candidates in each race. When the Tea Party tries to “grow up” and act like the establishment they seek to oust, problems arise. That seems to be demonstrated aptly when we look at how well the Big Tea Party organizations handle their money. (You’ll note from that article that the Tea Party Patriots gave more money in consulting fees to Jenny Beth Martin than they did to Matt Bevin.)

Either way, it’s something to watch once we finish up this mid-term cycle. Cillizza may be on to something here, though perhaps not what he started out trying to assert.


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tdarrington on April 27, 2014 at 10:09 AM

They managed to find their way here and to avail themselves of all we have to offer. I suggest they just reverse order.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 11:50 AM

casuist on April 27, 2014 at 11:49 AM

You want to suppress the Tea Party?

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 11:52 AM

When they start spouting what they can and can’t do……I think back to 9/11/2001 and remember how quickly they had the names and movements of the murderers, and their immigration status. So I can either join the truthers or they can admit that they could have a much tighter control on who is here and where they are, the government needs to make the call.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 11:42 AM

I think they can find anyone they want to find. I think they can’t find anyone they don’t want to find.

We’ve had foreign nationals illegally in the United States holding mass, public rallies. And to buffer people against the incongruity, they bring up the time-honored racial profiling “thought.” Putting that another way, someone, somehow lets us all know that it would be wrong to notice a mass rally of illegals, to notice the Mexican flags, or to ask anyone at the rally in a “Reconquista” t-shirt — through a translator — if they are in the United States illegally. Let alone do anything about it.

. . . This is all a little nuts.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 11:54 AM

Some problems are easy to solve. How about a $10,000 fine and six-months in jail for every illegal employee that an employer hires? That would motivate employers to dump their illegals.

Special Forces Grunt on April 27, 2014 at 11:48 AM

before you do that you need to make it so business is allowed to do everify as part of the initial process and not only after they are ready to hire.
you also need to protect them from lawsuits when they actually make a decision based off an everify item.
business owners are an easy target to blame but most don’t realize how tied their hands are. sued if they refuse to hire fined if they do hire.
how about we only punish the actual illegal alien.

dmacleo on April 27, 2014 at 11:55 AM

But for those who are here and productive, punishment by forced mass migration of unemployed, impoverished people for “not doing it the right way” is not the right way to go about it.

tdarrington on April 27, 2014 at 10:47 AM

I don’t understand. Illegal immigrants who are productive (i.e. working) in the United States are unemployed and impoverished?

J.S.K. on April 27, 2014 at 11:57 AM

This is Tennis every election. The ball gets hit back and forth and nothing new happens, regardless of who is in the GOP. It is the same big government “solutions.” Enjoy the game, I’m voting third party.

Decoski on April 27, 2014 at 11:57 AM

Is there any concern that the “establishment” portion of the base would simply stay home?

The Cucinelli Factor. The base is expected to fall in line as the neocons push us over the cliff, but when we have a constitutional conservative who fought Obamacare, it’s let’s stab him in the back so the tea party knows who is in charge. Sorry, this is 2014. That failed strategy died in 2012. If you put up guys like the Turtle, expect to lose

Brock Robamney on April 27, 2014 at 11:57 AM

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 11:54 AM

Not to mention the hue and cry that would be raised should ICE and the local constabulary worked together to corral and arrest the illegals for violating our country’s entry statutes and taking root here. Oh, to have a DOJ worthy of the name…

I’d buy a case each of popcorn and Mountain Dew if’n that ever happened…

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 11:58 AM

Enjoy the game, I’m voting third party.

Decoski on April 27, 2014 at 11:57 AM

That is nice of you. You just played into the hands of the Democrats.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:01 PM


You want to suppress the Tea Party?

I must have been freakishly unclear. I meant that establishment figures like McConnell were confident of their efforts to suppress Tea Party primary challenges. I identify with the Tea Partiers.

casuist on April 27, 2014 at 12:02 PM

business owners are an easy target to blame but most don’t realize how tied their hands are. sued if they refuse to hire fined if they do hire.
how about we only punish the actual illegal alien.

dmacleo on April 27, 2014 at 11:55 AM

The problem is that some employers are happy to hire illegal aliens, in part because if they pay them below minimum wage, or provide them with dangerous working conditions, the illegal aliens are less likely to report the problem to the government than would a citizen or legal resident worker.

We should indeed penalize employers who knowingly or recklessly hire illegal aliens.

J.S.K. on April 27, 2014 at 12:03 PM

WaPo writer terribly worried about GOP infighting

Yeah, they really care. Today’s WaPo also features the fact checking weasel examining the rat-eared wonder’s claims about enrollment numbers. And wouldn’t you know that for lying his ass off- complete with cooked census numbers- it was only two Pinocchios for Obama. Any Republian administration would have gotten exponential Pinocchios for the same lies. Glen Kessler really is a despicable partisan whore.

Happy Nomad on April 27, 2014 at 12:03 PM

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 11:58 AM

I’d be happy if I could just vote for somebody who grew up using the word if’n.

Fenris on April 27, 2014 at 12:04 PM

casuist on April 27, 2014 at 12:02 PM

Got it! That’s why I asked, better to do that than to misunderstand.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:05 PM

That is nice of you. You just played into the hands of the Democrats.

I hate that argument. Same argument Romneyists repeated like a mantra to hypnotize themselves into believing their candidate was (a) a full realized human being, and (b) could win a national election. If Republicans want to “fix” ObamaCare and deliver amnesty, we have already played ourselves into the hands of Democrats in particular, progressives in general. Sometimes a protest vote is the only vote.

casuist on April 27, 2014 at 12:06 PM

The problem is that some employers are happy to hire illegal aliens, in part because if they pay them below minimum wage, or provide them with dangerous working conditions, the illegal aliens are less likely to report the problem to the government than would a citizen or legal resident worker.

We should indeed penalize employers who knowingly or recklessly hire illegal aliens.

J.S.K. on April 27, 2014 at 12:03 PM

Unlikely, since they’re frequently the same ones who are the big donors, so that they can do precisely that.

Fenris on April 27, 2014 at 12:06 PM

I hate that argument. Same argument Romneyists repeated like a mantra to hypnotize themselves into believing their candidate was (a) a full realized human being, and (b) could win a national election. If Republicans want to “fix” ObamaCare and deliver amnesty, we have already played ourselves into the hands of Democrats in particular, progressives in general. Sometimes a protest vote is the only vote.

casuist on April 27, 2014 at 12:06 PM

Tell me how voting for a third party helps anyone out, other than a democratic election?

And protest all you want, but voting third as a “protest” only tells me one thing, you should have bothered voting to begin with. With that said.. how many Indies are actually seated? Think about that, and how low that number is, and then come back and tell me how voting for a protest vote it working.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:09 PM

casuist on April 27, 2014 at 12:06 PM

I’m with you on that score! Pity the Republican Elite only listen to each other and their larger money donors (the same ones who also donate to Democrats in the sincere hope that the same favours will be granted) and forget that it’s the PEOPLE in flyover country that are voting–and infinitely more numerous. Shame these same people are in cahoots every four years with the LSM to get the Socialism Lite candidates selected.

Oh, and that we can see through their BS.

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:13 PM

Tell me how voting for a third party helps anyone out, other than a democratic election?

And protest all you want, but voting third as a “protest” only tells me one thing, you should have bothered voting to begin with. With that said.. how many Indies are actually seated? Think about that, and how low that number is, and then come back and tell me how voting for a protest vote it working.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:09 PM

Tell me what’s the point of voting for a Repub that’s the same as a Dem. Might as well not vote. Voting protest is all we have.

crankyoldlady on April 27, 2014 at 12:14 PM

Fenris on April 27, 2014 at 12:04 PM

Heck, I’m happy to vote for candidates that don’t sugarcoat/obfuscate what they REALLY want to say! That’s why I voted for Herman Cain back in 2012…

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:15 PM

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:09 PM

I have to admit to going with the Hillary line when it comes to my vote. “At this point what difference does it make?”. Whether I can actually pull the lever remains to be seen but the Republicans are doing nothing to garner my loyalty.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:16 PM

crankyoldlady on April 27, 2014 at 12:14 PM

I thought that’s what primaries where for? So we un-peons could work to get a candidate of OUR choice on the Big Ballot.

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:17 PM

Tell me what’s the point of voting for a Repub that’s the same as a Dem. Might as well not vote. Voting protest is all we have.

crankyoldlady on April 27, 2014 at 12:14 PM

I have one name for those who think voting indie is going to make everything all right.

Arlene Spector. Or even better… Lisa Murkowski.

So when either dems or repubs have a hissy fit, they go indie and get reelected that way. Seems to work out for that protest vote.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:18 PM

I have to admit to going with the Hillary line when it comes to my vote. “At this point what difference does it make?”. Whether I can actually pull the lever remains to be seen but the Republicans are doing nothing to garner my loyalty.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:16 PM

Because like Murkowski did, and decided to go indie after she lost the primary?

There are no real rules concerning independent’s, like dems and repubs. And I see more people who don’t think they should have lost, via vote, going into the indie roll.

We are losing, twice.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:20 PM

Jazz makes two weird errors here:

1) jazz accuses the writer of feigning concern for the republicans here, when there’s no concern shown. The writer just thinks the subject is interesting and relevant – he makes no implication that he’s concerned for the GOP.

2) jazz says that the opposite effect – the centrist gop “leaving” a tea party candidate – is never talked abiut….but in fact it’s always talked about. That is exactly what the concept of “electability” is – that less ideological centrist voters will “leave” if an extremist is nominated.

There’s a legit question here – does the tea party have the ability or the balls to make a meaningful permanent split from a rino establishment that it clearly hates?

everdiso on April 27, 2014 at 12:22 PM

Heck, I’m happy to vote for candidates that don’t sugarcoat/obfuscate what they REALLY want to say! That’s why I voted for Herman Cain back in 2012…

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:15 PM

Cain wasn’t the most qualified guy in the world, but he’d be a gazillion times better than Obama or Romney. It’s amazing how the press can magnify a few problems into hysteria, but overlook the most serious failings (or even crimes) of the establishment’s favored ones.

Fenris on April 27, 2014 at 12:23 PM

Democrats Racially Diverse; Republicans Mostly White

The general structure:

* Republicans are overwhelmingly non-Hispanic white, at a level that is significantly higher than the self-identified white percentage of the national adult population. Just 2% of Republicans are black, and 6% are Hispanic.

* Seventy percent of Americans who identify as independents are white, but independents have the highest representation of Hispanics (16%) of the three groups. Eight percent of independents are blacks.

* Democrats remain a majority white party, but four in 10 Democrats are something other than non-Hispanic white. More than one in five Democrats are black, roughly twice the black representation in the adult population.

But, here are things in motion:

Racial Breakdown of Independents and Democrats Has Shifted Most Since 2008

The racial and ethnic composition of the Republican Party today is similar to what it was in 2008, the year when Gallup began its daily tracking. There have been essentially no changes in the percentage of GOP identifiers who are white, black, and Hispanic.

Independents have become more Hispanic since 2008 (and slightly more black), while Democrats have become more black and more Hispanic. Phrased differently, the independent and Democratic segments of the U.S. population are now less white than they were in 2008, reflecting the uptick in the U.S. nonwhite population over these five years.

The implications seem pretty simple. As the Hispanic population of the United States grows, the number of Democrat voters grows. Gallop agrees with that:

A second factor that will affect the future of the political parties in the U.S. is straightforward demographics. Projections show that the nonwhite proportion of the American adult population will grow in the years ahead. This means that if current partisan allegiance patterns prevail, the size of the Democratic base will be in a better position to grow than will the Republican base.

If that reality reflected nothing but the organic growth of the population of the United States, I would be fine with it. But exactly why the GOP would deliberately nuke themselves with a massive, artificial and unnecessary demographic shift is beyond me.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 12:27 PM

Fenris on April 27, 2014 at 12:23 PM

I thought with Cain’s business record and stated political philosophy that his being “most qualified” wasn’t in doubt–but it sure was interesting how quickly the (rumoured Democrat) Demolition Squad came out to knock him down a few pegs wen enough voters nibbled on Cain’s bait…

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:28 PM

We are losing, twice.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:20 PM

At this point we lose regardless, if the Republicans don’t pay the price for their disloyalty and outright lies about their stands on issues, it won’t ever stop.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:28 PM

O/T Axe…..
Its almost election season, you have to know I can’t miss that…… ;)
End of O/T……. ;)

angrymike on April 27, 2014 at 12:28 PM

At this point we lose regardless, if the Republicans don’t pay the price for their disloyalty and outright lies about their stands on issues, it won’t ever stop.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:28 PM

Term limits, sweetie. I am all for it. To bad it will take an act of God.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:30 PM

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:18 PM

When Lugar lost to the Tea Party guy, he decided to be a loyal Republican and campaign for the Democrat in Georgia. If these people don’t have any loyalty to the party why should we? McCain has stop just short of endorsing Hillary.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:30 PM

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:30 PM

Term limits have been deemed unconstitutional by SCOTUS because that is what elections are for but unfortunately we all hate Congress with a burning passion….except for our own guy, the only one we vote for.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:30 PM

I thought Luger lost because of the massive (and partially substantiated) doubt cast on his (claim of) in-state residency. Did I miss something?

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:32 PM

the enemy of my enemy is my friend. In other words, rather than LIB, deciding that the squishy Republican who is right 75% of the time is still better than the Democrat who will be right 0% of the time.

Hmm. You assume the Establishment or RINOs actually consider the Dems an “enemy”? Just why do you think there is a Let It Burn faction?

MistyLane on April 27, 2014 at 12:33 PM

Some problems are easy to solve. How about a $10,000 fine and six-months in jail for every illegal employee that an employer hires? That would motivate employers to dump their illegals.

Special Forces Grunt on April 27, 2014 at 11:48 AM

before you do that you need to make it so business is allowed to do everify as part of the initial process and not only after they are ready to hire.
you also need to protect them from lawsuits when they actually make a decision based off an everify item.
business owners are an easy target to blame but most don’t realize how tied their hands are. sued if they refuse to hire fined if they do hire.
how about we only punish the actual illegal alien.

dmacleo on April 27, 2014 at 11:55 AM

Thank you. I want the illegals out as much as anyone, but we have to realize what a narrow box employers are forced into between being fined for hiring an illegal and being fined for discriminating against an illegal by not hiring them. Blame the federal government for that ridiculous predicament.

slickwillie2001 on April 27, 2014 at 12:36 PM

RE:
It would not surprise me at all to see a similar thing happen on the national level if a true conservative (aka TEA Party) candidate should get the nomination.

loveyouall on April 27, 2014 at 10:41 AM

It is already happening- INSANE:

This is precisely what Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) has done.
Clinton, a prospective 2016 Democratic presidential candidate, will appear on stage Saturday with McCain at the Sedona Forum, an annual ideas festival hosted by the McCain Institute for International Leadership at Arizona State University. Clinton is among the national and international business leaders, philanthropists and public figures appearing at the gathering, held in Sedona, the tony red-rocks oasis in Arizona’s Verde Valley.
In a statement released Thursday, McCain called Clinton “my friend” and praised her public service career.

3dpuzzman on April 27, 2014 at 12:39 PM

Rand Paul is on the ESTABLISHMENT side, with his AMNESTY-pushing buddies. The last time I checked, the Tea Party does not support AMNESTY.

Pork-Chop on April 27, 2014 at 9:45 AM

The GOP didn’t support amnesty in its 2012 platform.

http://www.gop.com/2012-republican-platform_Reforming/#Item11

We recognize that for most of those seeking entry into this country, the lack of respect for the rule of law in their homelands has meant economic exploitation and political oppression by corrupt elites. In this country, the rule of law guarantees equal treatment to every individual, including more than one million immigrants to whom we grant permanent residence every year. That is why we oppose any form of amnesty for those who, by intentionally violating the law, disadvantage those who have obeyed it. Granting amnesty only rewards and encourages more law breaking.

That pledge lasted … all of 3 weeks after the election, when GOP leaders started taking advice from Chuck Shumer.

fred5678 on April 27, 2014 at 12:42 PM

3dpuzzman on April 27, 2014 at 12:39 PM

You just know that when Hill gets home to Bill they have a great laugh around a bottle of scotch about what a useful idiot Johnny Mac is.

slickwillie2001 on April 27, 2014 at 12:43 PM

If the GOP is thinking they are going to shift the percentage of Hispanics voting for them — if they think this is “reaching out” to “Latinos” — it isn’t going to happen, and there’s no reason for them to believe it’s going to happen.

Just to restate the obvious — dedicated to John — a blast from the past that sets out the big three, for the eleventy-first time: no credit, all blame, no votes:

Sorry, GOP! Immigration Reform Won’t Win You The Latino Vote

* The GOP won’t even get the credit. The Gang of 8’s legislation will be a bipartisan bill – so why would the GOP get the credit? And, though bipartisan, it would be signed into law by President Obama. Thus, the overarching achievement, historically and in most uninformed voters’ perception, would ultimately be credited to him – not to Rubio or any GOP senator who pushed it. While Rubio does all the legwork, it will be Obama who receives the glory.

No, Bush never received 44% of the Latino vote. In the GOP ‘autopsy’ report released this week, the section on Hispanics optimistically cites the oft-repeated claim that George W. Bush won a record-setting 44% of the Hispanic vote in 2004 – the idea being: “We did it once, we can do it again!” But the truth is ‘Dubya’ never received that high a percentage of the Hispanic vote. No Republican ever has. In fact, many estimates place Bush’s share somewhere in the high 30’s or at an even 40% instead.

The GOP will be blamed for the enforcement mechanisms. Rubio and Rand both stress the need for a review of whether enforcement and border security is running smoothly. So, when these measures fail to live up to their expectations (inevitable), and Republican senators have to apply some brakes or tighten the border (Democrats won’t), any good will earned by the GOP goes out the window and it is once again ‘the anti-immigrant party.’

On the contrary, doing the right thing is the only thing that does move votes. Bush’s anemic 40% was actually an increase, and this was his position:

Tough immigration law enforcement wins Hispanic vote every time

At least 8,000 people cross our borders illegally every day. How do you see it? And what do we need to do about it?

Bush answered, “We’re increasing the border security of the US. We’ve got 1,000 more Border Patrol agents on the southern border. We’re using new equipment. We’re using unmanned vehicles to spot people coming across. We’ll continue to do so over the next four years…”

Contrast Nucking Futz:

Obama’s opponent, Sen. John McCain R-AZ, was the first presidential candidate who actually advocated for and wrote an amnesty bill for illegal aliens. Mr. Amnesty got 31% of the vote to Obama’s 67%.

I can’t find the logic in this GOP suicide.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 12:47 PM

It is as simple as this:

tdarrington on April 27, 2014 at 10:09 AM
You don’t have to deport 12 m illegals . If you have a strong e-verify program with stiff penalties ,
stop handing out benefits and seal the border many will leave . Same with the overstay visa people .
It’s called attrition .

Lucano on April 27, 2014 at 10:33 AM

Plus, if there wasn’t such a propaganda effort against the “Taxed Enough Already” Party, the GOPe would quickly find out THEY are the dinosaurs and the TEA Party are the MAIN STREET GOP.

The GOPe are pretty good at playing out of the Democrat Rules for Radicals hand book, against TEA Party. Guess they had time to read that but not the ACA bill.

I am sorry but after John McCain and his post election show, Romney’s glass chin, Boehner’s Speaker fiasco,
I am done having any of my money go to help putting these Corporate Shills into office. Many I know feel the same, many are not what you would call political interested.

I would rather go down fighting to save what’s left of this Country, then support someone who will only slow the crash down a bit, and don’t give me the “We can’t lead unless we win crap”. The GOP has a pathetic twenty year track record to rest on.

If I go on I would probably start quoting my version of Brave Heart. (And I didn’t even see the movie).

Whiterock on April 27, 2014 at 12:48 PM

I’d buy a case each of popcorn and Mountain Dew if’n that ever happened…

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 11:58 AM

Everyone needs to enroll in hand-to-hand classes (something, anything). :)

Because this world is losing its mind.

. . . thought it was me. Alas, no. That would have been fun. :) This is just harrowing.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 12:52 PM

Term limits have been deemed unconstitutional by SCOTUS because that is what elections are for but unfortunately we all hate Congress with a burning passion….except for our own guy, the only one we vote for.
Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Wrong. Nothing in the constitution that states term limits are unconstitutional. If that were true, then Obama could run again in 2016

Brock Robamney on April 27, 2014 at 12:55 PM

Term Limits doesn’t need an act of God,
The Levin Doctrine is all we need.
The path is outlined in the Constitution.
The Localizing of power is the answer.
We the people need to nullify and correct what has gone wrong in DC.
I am also quite certain this legal path has some worried in the Houses of Marble.

Whiterock on April 27, 2014 at 12:58 PM

Conservatives are to the Republican party what black Americans are to the Democrat party.

Conservatives are suffering from Stockholm Syndrome in their relationship with the Republican party as much as black Americans experience the same in their relationship with the Dems.

it’s that the Tea Party Conservatives seems to work best when they work on their own at the local level, with messy, disorganized meetings in local halls, boots on the ground knocking on doors, and small donations to individual candidates in each race

This is where they need us. We’re the pack mules of the Republican party.

I honestly don’t know how they would fare if they lost that particular asset.

lineholder on April 27, 2014 at 12:58 PM

WaPo writer terribly worried about GOP infighting

The GOP will soon anoint Obamacare and force illegal immigration sanctification )perhaps on the party’s deathbed, because they fully believe their deceived useful idiot base won’t desert them for Hillary.

How wrong they are.

Don L on April 27, 2014 at 1:00 PM

The GOP will soon anoint Obamacare and force illegal immigration sanctification )perhaps on the party’s deathbed, because they fully believe their deceived useful idiot base won’t desert them for Hillary.

How wrong they are.

Don L on April 27, 2014 at 1:00 PM

Second that.

Whiterock on April 27, 2014 at 1:05 PM

In a statement released Thursday, McCain called Clinton “my friend” and praised her public service career.

3dpuzzman on April 27, 2014 at 12:39 PM

I held my nose and voted for that guy for President.

If this is what the GOP is coming to I won’t bother anymore.

Why vote to support a broken system?

If I lived in Chicago I wouldn’t bother to vote in the mayoral election, AKA the Dem primary. There is no general election for mayor in Chicago anymore.

Illinois is close to becoming just like Chicago. GOP Senator Kirk is little more than a right-wing Democrat. He had to be arm twisted into not supporting ultra-left-winger Durbin over the GOP candidate, Oberwies. I’m not a big fan of Oberweis, but for a GOP Senator this decision should be a no brainer.

When elected GOP politicians openly talk about supporting the Dem over the GOP candidate, and talk about offering ‘illegal immigrants’ a ‘path to citizenship’, and talk about helping Dems ‘fix’ Obamacare, there does not seem much point in supporting the GOP. When the GOP nominated Chief Justice, allegedly a ‘conservative’, sides with the big government socialists in supporting as Constitutional the Obamacare mandate that forces citizens to buy health insurance, what’s the point?

As multiple posters have said, there are fewer and fewer reasons to bother voting for the GOP candidate over the Dem.

One cannot vote ‘none of the above’ on a ballot, and voting third party is a waste of time and effort. Been there, done that.

farsighted on April 27, 2014 at 1:05 PM

Obamcare is no longer an issue. We lost. The private system is gutted, and every day the number of people committing to the new arrangement grows.

I am not going to vote Republican so they can manage socialized medicine a bit better. I am not going to vote Republican because they like nation building more than the Democrats. I am not going to vote Republican because they defend the very rich from paying marginally higher taxes than they would under Democrats.

I am not going to vote for people who think the culture in America is no better than the one they want to import from Mexico.

The Republicans have lied and lied and lied about their positions on amnesty. I no longer believe them. None of them. Not even Ted Cruz. They all lie when it comes to amnesty and importing cheap labor.

Other than the invasion, there are no more critical issues on the table. When (not if) they betray us on this, it is time for a populist third party.

fadetogray on April 27, 2014 at 1:05 PM

But the second part of the assumption seems to always be that the Tea Party candidate will lose and then – maybe – their supporters in the grassroots will stay home, leading to yet another humiliating defeat for the GOP.

To avoid this issue, insure that you nominate someone the base can vote for. Dont nominate a Bush or a Christie. This statist candidates are dead on arrival. The base will never support them. The base wants a candidate that comes from their own. Give them what they want to vote for and we won’t have any issues.

paulsur on April 27, 2014 at 1:06 PM

The GOP is dead. We need a third party.

I don’t want to vote for or financially support republicans any longer, they’re turncoats and liars.

KMC1 on April 27, 2014 at 1:12 PM

The minty-fresh nonpareil Resist We Much marked up the election stats in January of last year, for details of the miserable failure of Hispandering.

If Hispanics could be purchased with amnesty, then they would have overwhelmingly voted Republican in 1988. They didn’t so that should tell the “brains” in the GOP something.

Continuing on…

In 1992, Bill Clinton won 61% of the Hispanic vote while President George H.W. Bush won 25% – a difference of 36%.

In 1996, President Bill Clinton won 72% of the Hispanic vote while Senator Bob Dole received a mere 21% – a difference of 51%.

In 2000, Vice-President Al Gore won 62% of the Hispanic vote while George W Bush won only 35% – a difference of 27%.

In 2004, Senator John Kerry won 58% of the Hispanic vote while President George W Bush won 40% – a difference of 18%.

In 2008, Senator Barack Obama, who voted AGAINST President Bush’s immigration reform, won 67% of the Hispanic vote while Senator John McAmnesty won a mere 31% – a difference of 36%.

In 2012, President Barack Obama won 71% of the Hispanic vote while Mitt Romney won only 27% – a difference of 44%.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 1:16 PM

Brock Robamney on April 27, 2014 at 12:55 PM

Not all term limits. I could have been clearer.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 1:21 PM

Opps, what happened to my link?

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 1:21 PM

You know WaPo, it’s awfully hard to meet the exacting standards of Lake Woebegone, when “all your children” (staff) is below the mean.

Another Drew on April 27, 2014 at 1:35 PM

Enjoy the game, I’m voting third party.

Decoski on April 27, 2014 at 11:57 AM

That is nice of you. You just played into the hands of the Democrats.

upinak on April 27, 2014 at 12:01 PM

And voting for the slightly less rabid Democrats in the GOP isn’t playing into the hands of the Democrats, right?

Seriously, who cares? Voting for EITHER party plays into the hands of one flavor of statist or the other. Why should we vote for one breed of statist just to avoid “playing into the hands of” the other breed of statist?

Aitch748 on April 27, 2014 at 1:59 PM

I thought that’s what primaries where for? So we un-peons could work to get a candidate of OUR choice on the Big Ballot.

Newtie and the Beauty on April 27, 2014 at 12:17 PM

Maybe if you’re a resident of those bastions of conservatism – Iowa, Delaware, New Hampshire, etc.

Those of us out in the larger, more conservative states don’t really have a choice by the time the ‘primary’ rolls around to us.

Midas on April 27, 2014 at 2:03 PM

Everyone needs to enroll in hand-to-hand classes (something, anything). :)

Because this world is losing its mind.

. . . thought it was me. Alas, no. That would have been fun. :) This is just harrowing.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 12:52 PM

I’ll be testing for my second degree black belt certification in six months. I’m also training regularly with a few varieties of my favorite firearms.

Just saying.

Midas on April 27, 2014 at 2:09 PM

There’s a legit question here – does the tea party have the ability or the balls to make a meaningful permanent split from a rino establishment that it clearly hates?

everdiso on April 27, 2014 at 12:22 PM

Ross Perot! He got 19% of the vote or thereabouts and allowed Clinton to win. Did the Republicans learn from that? Nope! We’re right back at the same place.

However, I am so frustrated that if the Tea Party broke off and ran a candidate, I’d vote Tea Party and hope that the GOP would get the message.

Vince on April 27, 2014 at 2:42 PM

I can’t find the logic in this GOP suicide.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 12:47 PM

Step back and look at the bigger picture, Axefellow. You’re focused on three voter groups, Republican, Democrat, Independent, and two major political parties that are meant, at least ostensibly, to have two separate platforms.

Think, instead, for a moment, in terms of policy and platform as a product of big donor cash. Mega donor cash directed over time toward a preferred outcome.

We’ve seen donors, particularly mega donors, give to both parties and to candidates running for either party, based solely on policy without regard to party affiliation. They make these contributions, and sponsor fund raisers, in order to promote the policy changes they wish to see made in both parties. The commonality is the donor’s own preferred outcome. It’s fair to say that many of the largest donors have no loyalty, per say, to either political party, only to their own preferred agenda and outcomes. The goal is to effect those outcomes by influencing the elections by promoting candidates who will work to implement their preferred policy…in both parties.

This changes the field. It eliminates the possibility that the electorate will elect a candidate who will not promote the policies that will generate the donor’s preferred outcome.

Consequently, we are seeing relatively little difference between the policies coming out of both parties. The basic premise of the policy is the same, only the degree and details of delivery differ.

One political class responding to one donor class that shares certain goals in pursuit of preferred outcomes.

thatsafactjack on April 27, 2014 at 2:52 PM

thatsafactjack on April 27, 2014 at 2:52 PM

OK. So . . . who, specifically, bought John Boehner?

Rhetorical.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 3:21 PM

That picture is of an America completely bought and paid for already, you know. I wish Wilde was around. It would be interesting to see what he’d say to that, this, any of this.

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 3:23 PM

The “Tea Party” that was a grassroots movement of millions is NOT organized. Those who claim to speak for it are liars, self-promoters who latched onto the name to raise money and make themselves more influential.

They have proven incompetent at organizing, recruiting, vetting, and handling money. All they’ve been effective at is getting themselves on TV and being quoted in the news as “Tea Party” spokesmen, which is why TP went from 60% approval when it was spontaneous to 28% approval now.

In South Carolina, nearly 40% of the voters “considered themselves Tea Party” in 2009, now it is down to 5%.

The voters didn’t change. The image of the Tea Party changed, it was brought down by the jerks who use its name for their own vendettas.

Chris Cizilla is a Democratic propagandist and always has been. Sorry your life is so empty that you have time to waste reading his drivel.

♦◊♦◊

Just because a small minority is loud and seemingly everywhere on the internet, that doesn’t reflect anything more than their noise level. Remember Ron Paul? He won virtually every online poll, yet not a single primary. “Loud” does NOT equal “many.”

Adjoran on April 27, 2014 at 3:42 PM

Even if McConnell beats Bevin, the best thing that TPers and conservatives can do is sit out the November election and let the Democrat win. We probably re-take the Senate, anyway. It would be better with Cornyn at the top spot. He didn’t really win that strongly in Texas, and he has to stay in line with Cruz.

K. Hobbit on April 27, 2014 at 3:53 PM

It would be better with Cornyn at the top spot.
K. Hobbit on April 27, 2014 at 3:53 PM

I have issues with him. He’s my congresscritter.
Here’s his record: http://votesmart.org/candidate/evaluations/15375/john-cornyn

I dislike him as he votes 100% against the wild horses/burros that the BLM is trying to slaughter.

And, I just noticed that under Unemployed and Low-Income, he voted 13% in favor of ACORN in 2006. While at the same time, voting 0% for the wild horses, coyotes, foxes, burros being killed by BLM.

Some of his other votes seem to be PC….I just don’t like him. He consistently refused to answer my emails, except for robot answers totally unrelated to subject matter.

avagreen on April 27, 2014 at 4:35 PM

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/tea-party-pacs-reap-money-for-midterms-but-spend-little-on-candidates/2014/04/26/0e52919a-cbd6-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

PT Barnum had a saying about suckers. How much money have HA diehards contributed to TP groups thinking it was “helping the cause”?

Bradky on April 27, 2014 at 5:29 PM

Just because a small minority is loud and seemingly everywhere on the internet, that doesn’t reflect anything more than their noise level. Remember Ron Paul? He won virtually every online poll, yet not a single primary. “Loud” does NOT equal “many.”

Adjoran on April 27, 2014 at 3:42 PM

LOL so true and well said. If you go to right leaning sites the claim is “we are in numbers too big to ignore and you better vote only for what we say”
while the leftie blogs say “the teabaggers will set us back 2000 years with their crazy philosophies….give as much money to defeat this threat to the country”

Both sides are stretching the truth a bit….

Bradky on April 27, 2014 at 5:36 PM

Axe on April 27, 2014 at 3:23 PM

While I have no doubt that some of them, where necessary, are actually ‘bought and paid for’…and well instructed… I think it’s often more subtle than that in many other cases. I think that they are selected and financed because they will promote the preferred policy in a steadfast way without prompting… or further payment.

thatsafactjack on April 27, 2014 at 5:44 PM

Those whining about “how can we deport 12 m” ignore the reality that many would self-deport if they got nothing for being here.

Penalize employers who hire illegal immigrants – fine them severely enough and put the fines in the Treasury. If there are no jobs and no services they will have less reasons to stay – they can follow the money they were already sending home.

katiejane on April 27, 2014 at 6:26 PM

Just because a small minority is loud and seemingly everywhere on the internet, that doesn’t reflect anything more than their noise level. Remember Ron Paul? He won virtually every online poll, yet not a single primary. “Loud” does NOT equal “many.”

Adjoran on April 27, 2014 at 3:42 PM

Very good point..:)

Dire Straits on April 27, 2014 at 7:20 PM

One political class responding to one donor class that shares certain goals in pursuit of preferred outcomes.

thatsafactjack on April 27, 2014 at 2:52 PM

Exactly.

The lack of loyalty to any political party, the exclusive focus on a policy result, is part of the process.

David Blue on April 27, 2014 at 9:51 PM

News for you buddy-the walk away from the GOP has already started and the results will be seen well before 2016.2014 midterms just may not be what the GOP thinks it will be.

redware on April 27, 2014 at 10:59 PM

Now, let’s not pretend that there isn’t a significant, and possibly growing strain of Let It Burn (LIB) attitudes among the base

Let it burn is anti-American. Burning down the country will not result in anything like the Constitution rising out of the ashes. We already have the best system in human history, we just need to get back to actually using it.

V7_Sport on April 28, 2014 at 7:51 AM

News for you buddy-the walk away from the GOP has already started and the results will be seen well before 2016.2014 midterms just may not be what the GOP thinks it will be.

redware on April 27, 2014 at 10:59 PM

Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama and Harry Reid thank you for walking away.

Keeping a republic is hard, huh. Easier to just complain here.

V7_Sport on April 28, 2014 at 7:53 AM

At this point we lose regardless, if the Republicans don’t pay the price for their disloyalty and outright lies about their stands on issues, it won’t ever stop.

Cindy Munford on April 27, 2014 at 12:28 PM

Totally agree – they’re like kids.

Sooner or later the GOP has to feel consequences otherwise we’re no different than Obama when he tsk, tsks Russia over it’s bad behavior.

We keep telling the GOP – You better stop shafting the base or we’re going to get upset. and do something. They keep scr*wing the base and we keep threatening – maybe it’s time to actually do something?

katiejane on April 28, 2014 at 8:07 AM

Re.crankyoldlady

“Might as well not vote. Voting protest is all we have.”

Or you could actually get out there and work to make your opinion known. You could actually get involved. Seeing as people actually have sacrificed their lives to give you a vote it’s probably the least you can do.

Tell me what’s the point of voting for a Repub that’s the same as a Dem.

How is President Romney vs. President Obama a hard choice? How is Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell vs. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid a hard choice? How is Speaker of the House John Boehner vs. Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi a hard choice?

It isn’t.

Even if you think that Romney is a squishy RINO Massachusetts technocrat with a secret crush on Obamacare, you have to be on the wrong side of the border between ideologically hardcore and ideologically blinded to conclude that spending four years fighting against the very worst imaginable tendencies of a Romney administration would have been anything other than wine and roses compared with spending four years fighting against the very worst tendencies of an Obama administration, especially when the president is in the position of never having to face another election.
[...]
The Obama administration has handed conservatives — and, more important, the country — disaster after disaster after disaster. Rather than scaling back the most worrisome aspects of the surveillance state and the so-called War on Terror, President Obama has expanded on them. Taxes are up, health insurance is a chaotic mess subject to ad hoc revision every time Democratic political necessities demand it, our allies are dispirited, our enemies emboldened, our religious liberties under attack by the very government entrusted with defending them, our economy anemic, with too many of our people unemployed and those who are employed earning too little.

I am not naïve enough to believe that having elected Mitt Romney president or consigning the Democrats to the minority in both houses of Congress would change all that. But unless you are ready to give up on electoral politics entirely — and I confess to wavering on that question with a bias toward despair — then it is a matter of deciding whether X is preferable to Y. And sometimes that is a pretty easy call. Contemplating the inevitable shortcomings of elected Republicans, conservatives may consider the situation and think: “The lesser of two evils is still evil.” And it is. But it’s also lesser. And if that’s the choice we have, it may be unpalatable — but it is a choice that we have to make. I liked the Cthulhu 2012 slogan — “Why Vote for a Lesser Evil?” — but that’s a joke, not a program. The reason to vote for a lesser evil is because we’re responsible adults who don’t want the greater evil to prevail.

V7_Sport on April 28, 2014 at 8:19 AM

We keep telling the GOP – You better stop shafting the base or we’re going to get upset. and do something. They keep scr*wing the base and we keep threatening – maybe it’s time to actually do something?

katiejane on April 28, 2014 at 8:07 AM

Sure, start getting conservatives elected. Find them, help get them through the primaries, help get them across the finish line and into office and then keep them accountable. You aren’t being defeated by some “establishment in the GOP”, there are other voters involved and you have to persuade them. Taking your bat and ball and going home to “let it (the United States of America) burn” is’t persuasive to people outside the echo-chamber. They see it as crazy and recognize that it just elects socialists.

V7_Sport on April 28, 2014 at 8:26 AM

I am so thoroughly disgusted with mainstream Rinos that I wholeheartedly endorse the L.I.B. strategy. You see, I have given up on this country ever being what it once was. For all practical purposes we are broke fiscally as well as culturally. The nation needs to crumble with a restart there after.

I clearly don’t just blame Obama. It is our electorate. I am ready and waiting for the implosion. I mean who doesn’t like Venezuela?

PeaceAtAllCosts on April 28, 2014 at 9:20 AM

It’s starting, the election year is upon us, and the liberal news media wants to discourage republicans and conservatives from coming out to vote in the fall, in fact they continue their war on republicans, ratcheting it up. Find a republican candidate to work for at the local level and stay away from AP headlines. This morning I am reading in a liberal RAG that Cathy McMorris Rogers, says Obamacare is here to stay. She did not say she is in favor of Obamacare, but the media twists it to say so. Without a veto proof republican majority in the Senate, Obamacare is here to stay until a Republican President in the White House.
There is no better reason to vote Republican straight down the ticket.

And when the GOP is ridiculed, I always say, My friends and I are not like that, why do you paint all with the same brush? We are republicans and we are good people. Even Rand Paul talks like that about us, and it is too bad, he talks worse about us than he does about liberals. The libertarians don’t mind these anti-republican headlines, because they want to run down all the good people in the GOP too, they think they have something to gain.

In VA, the libertarians ran Sarvis “former GOP candidate, they called him,” I call him a muckraker and a spoiler.

And finally, about the so called infighting, if all the men in the GOP would act like real men instead of whining so much, then maybe we could get going for 2014 and shove hard to get our candidates thru. There is work to do, there is not time for your silly whining, not when the stakes are increasingly dire.

Fleuries on April 28, 2014 at 10:01 AM

I am so thoroughly disgusted with mainstream Rinos that I wholeheartedly endorse the L.I.B. strategy. You see, I have given up on this country ever being what it once was. For all practical purposes we are broke fiscally as well as culturally. The nation needs to crumble with a restart there after.

I clearly don’t just blame Obama. It is our electorate. I am ready and waiting for the implosion. I mean who doesn’t like Venezuela?

PeaceAtAllCosts on April 28, 2014 at 9:20 AM

Pack up and leave. If you are rooting for the destruction of this country you owe it to yourself and the rest of us to get the hell out.

V7_Sport on April 28, 2014 at 11:21 AM

The left will always tell you whom and what they fear. Based on this alone all good people on the right should be supporting the Tea Party. They’ve tried intimidation by the IRS, false planting of Dem operatives at TP rallies holding racist signs, constantly lying about the TP in the press etc. Now faced with a more fired up Tea Party than ever the left is trying to tell the GOP about how dangerous it is to have such a group as the TP in their midst. This would be funny except such idiots as Boehner, McConnell, McCain, Cantor etc believe this garbage because they live in the DC bubble.

The Democrat Party is scared witless of the Tea Party.

neyney on April 28, 2014 at 11:32 AM

The reason to get together and vote third party is to attack the establishment that owns the GOP and destroy it. Once there is a large and growing number of voters that have abandoned the Republican Party the truth will be much harder for them to deny. The elitists who control the GOP will be forced back another step because they will lose their ability to claim they represent conservatism. Bit by bit they will lose their grip on the reins of power.

Just not voting doesn’t send a message, and it doesn’t expose the establishmentarians for what they are; corrupt cronies who steal the voice of all conservative people by pretending to represent them, all the while working to destroy an American culture which prizes liberty above all.

If the choice is between the status quo where fake conservatives help the Marxists hand the country to a Marxist oligarchy, and destroying a corrupt and deceitful GOP, the choice is clear. Let It Burn is a perfectly valid method of rooting out corruption and exposing the truth when there is no other way.

Nobody is owns conservative votes. The wannabe masters have just assigned every conservative vote to themselves in their fake Right-Left system. It’s time to organize and put an end to their useless, dangerous rule.

Another Libertarian on April 28, 2014 at 4:47 PM

Nobody is owns conservative votes. The wannabe masters have just assigned every conservative vote to themselves in their fake Right-Left system. It’s time to organize and put an end to their useless, dangerous rule.

Another Libertarian on April 28, 2014 at 4:47 PM

Well said.

David Blue on April 28, 2014 at 5:27 PM

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