Bill Clinton on voter ID: Why not solve the problem by putting a photo on every Social Security card?

posted at 6:01 pm on April 10, 2014 by Allahpundit

After years of lefty rhetoric about how even the smallest ID requirement at the polls is some sort of pogrom against minority voters and the poor, I … did not see this coming.

But maybe I should have. Per some polls, support for voter ID reaches 80+ percent. Maybe Bill’s already thinking about purple states in 2016.

With 34 states now requiring some form of identification at the polls, former president Bill Clinton and civil rights leader Andrew Young on Wednesday endorsed the idea of adding photos to Social Security cards as a way to prevent voter suppression…

Clinton and Young, a former mayor of Atlanta, expressed concern that the voter ID laws could discourage poor and minority voters from showing up at the polls, which would circumvent the intent of the Voting Rights Act.

“I’m not against photo identification, but only as long as the cards are free and easily accessible. Providing eligible voters the ability to obtain a photo on a Social Security card eliminates any genuine concern,” Young said. He called on Obama to issue an executive order making such photos available.

Clinton did not go so far as to urge executive action. However, he said, putting photos on Social Security cards would represent “a way forward that eliminates error,” without having to “paralyze and divide a country with significant challenges.”

Help me figure this out. Traditionally, the argument against voter ID is that it puts the poor at a disadvantage by making them spend money they don’t have. Even if the ID itself is free, as it is in some states, it costs money to collect the supporting documents for it, like an official birth certificate. Except that … you also need supporting documents proving your age, citizenship, and identity to obtain a Social Security card. To prove the first two, they ask for a birth certificate. To prove identity, “Social Security will ask to see a U.S. driver’s license, state-issued nondriver identification card or U.S. passport,” although certain other forms of ID might be accepted if those are absent. And SSA emphasizes that all documents must be original or certified copies; photocopies won’t cut it. All of which is to say, how is a Social Security card less burdensome for a voter to obtain than a state-issued ID would be? If anything, it’s more of a pain for the feds since it would require issuing two separate SSA cards — one, presumably without a photo, when you’re a child and can’t vote, and then another with a photo when you turn 18 and can.

The point here, I guess, is to leverage the ubiquity of Social Security. If everyone, including the poor, is already bearing the cost of registering for a number and getting a card, you might as well add a photo and take care of their voter ID too. If it’s unfair to make them bear a burden at the polls, though, why ask them to bear one to produce documents for SSA? Why shouldn’t photocopies of a birth certificate suffice as proof of identity? This has always been the main objection to voter ID — it seems capricious to demand proof of ID for so many things in life, including participation in a protest of voter ID laws, and then wave people through on election day without one. If obtaining photo ID would make the poor’s lives easier in various ways, not just in voting, then naturally you’d want to maximize the incentive for them to do so. That’s a virtue of Clinton’s proposal. Unlike lots of lefties, he sees value in encouraging people have at least one basic form of photo ID.

Exit question: Will righties balk at this because Social Security is federally administered, though? I saw some grumbles in Headlines about this being a de facto national ID card, in which case, no thanks.


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Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 8:16 PM

http://www.bankrate.com/finance/home-equity/id-thieves-target-home-equity-lines-2.aspx

I certainly respect your expertise on this matter but 7/300 = 2.3% … hardly scary to me. Also, you make it sound as though there is no recourse for the homeowner and you’re totally sunk, again, not true.

My homeowner’s insurance and my IDT insurance both cover material asset loss due to criminal activity. Both cover the necessary recovery services to clear my name.

So tell me why I’m supposed to lose sleep over this?

As well, the less credit you use, the less exposed you are to these types of frauds. Sure, criminals can always find ways to get at your personal info, but I’m willing to bet that the 2.3% of the cases you worked were people that did not pay for proper/adequate protection through insurance products. It may sound harsh to say, but if you think you’re old enough to own a home then you should be at least diligent enough to properly insure yourself against the risks. If you can’t or are unwilling to pay for proper insurance, then it’s your fault.

Stop swiping the plastic cards everywhere and you stop leaving your personal information everywhere….last time I checked, Target, Sears, etc were all still willing to accept Uncle Benjamin Franklin and his cousin, Ulysses S Grant….

powerpickle on April 10, 2014 at 8:36 PM

Exit question: Will righties balk at this because Social Security is federally administered, though? I saw some grumbles in Headlines about this being a de facto national ID card, in which case, no thanks.

Lots of people have complained about identity theft, or thieves getting bogus credit cards using stolen Social Security numbers. If Social Security cards had photos on them, this would be harder, since credit card companies could ask for the photo ID to ensure that the applicant looks like the photo on the card.

This is actually a good idea to curb voter fraud. Imagine the outcry in the media if a Republican had suggested this!!!

Steve Z on April 10, 2014 at 8:44 PM

Steve Z on April 10, 2014 at 8:44 PM

I agree with this as well. It looks like Bill may have made a unforced error for the progressives trying to make his dynasty, I mean Hillery, look better in purple states.

The Clintons were always about themselves, even if it hurt the Dems. That is why progressives are not exactly happy with Clinton or his legacy. I think conservatives should run with it, if for no other reason than it makes us look bipartisan, after all Slick is for voter IDs right, and it will make the progressives even more suspicious of him and his wife. Some progressives think he and his wife are DINOs…

William Eaton on April 10, 2014 at 8:52 PM

What does the IRS do to punish those who steal IDs ?

Federal penitentiary. Not going to argue over how much of a punishment that actually is, but 10-20 years is average, with ringleaders and particularly prolific criminals getting up to 30.

Does the IRS pro-actively guard and secure the confidential information of US taxpayers ?

Yes. We screen every single return that comes in, as well as getting eyes-on with any suspicious returns we come across after initial processing. All employee activities are monitored to ascertain whether we’re handling taxpayer information securely and appropriately. Obviously, there are holes in this, but those originate in upper management political appointees, not people like me.

Does the IRS even bother to inform the victims that their IDs are being misused by Democrats
obamavoters criminals and WHO those criminals are ?

To the first part, yes. 5071C, 4883C, 4310C, and 5073C are just a few of the letters we can send out in various circumstances (suspected, confirmed, account locked, etc). To the second part, hell no. Compromising an investigation, putting a taxpayer in potential danger (Something like 20-30% of IDT is committed by someone close to the victim, and if they confront the person suspected, then… Well.), there’s several reasons we won’t tell you who.

Does the IRS verify who gets tax refunds and how many times using TIN #s filed @ LaRaza offices and mexican churches ?

Our filter criteria are not published, in order to make it more difficult to work around them. We watch for a lot of things, though.

IRS, the Islamic Retribution Service gives bonuses to it’s employees for plundering the US treasury to enrich illegals and jihadies.
burrata on April 10, 2014 at 8:26 PM

You’re insane. I’m not even going to bother answering you further. Go listen to Alex Jones and post on Prison Planet. You’ll fit right in.

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 9:00 PM

powerpickle on 014 at 8:36 PM

Perspective on the 2.3%: that’s of people who are already victims of tax-related identity theft. Of the 300 cases I worked, only 2 did not have tax-related identity theft. Over 70% had some form of personal identity theft in addition to the tax-related. The actual problem is much larger, and you’re focusing on one of half a dozen avenues I mentioned. While there are options for recourse (you are a victim of fraud), they require time, energy, and often money. Since you apparently can’t understand my point, caution is good. Paranoia is pointless. Heck, you even linked an article supporting my position.

As to your obsession over bank products, you really don’t have perspective on the problem. For example, I had to drop out of AFROTC in 2006 for medical reasons. In 2010, I was a victim myself…Because my information was still stored on a server halfway across the country that was compromised. If you’ve ever gone to court, your identifying information might be part of the public record (big scandal in California last year about that). If you keep any personal information on your computer, you could be hacked. It is literally impossible to secure yourself 100% against IDT.

The point I’m making isn’t that you need to constantly be freaking out over your credit. My point is that you should be monitoring your credit and accounts regularly, just like you’d take notice if you suddenly spotted screwdriver marks in your windowsill or crowbar marks on your front door.

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 9:26 PM

Federal penitentiary. Not going to argue over how much of a punishment that actually is, but 10-20 years is average, with ringleaders and particularly prolific criminals getting up to 30.

If that was true, half of mexico and the islamic world would be in fed pen .

Yes. We screen every single return that comes in, as well as getting eyes-on with any suspicious returns we come across after initial processing. All employee activities are monitored to ascertain whether we’re handling taxpayer information securely and appropriately.

The screening is done not to stop fraud but to find a way to intimidate the taxpayer and spend 10K of taxpayer money to recover a quarter for the IRS.

Obviously, there are holes in this, but those originate in upper management political appointees, not people like me.

Those loopholes have been put there so that IRS never becomes totally is corruption free, even by mistake. Those who use and abuse those loopholes knowingly or unknowingly , do not deserve bonuses on top of their lavish salaries and benefits.

To the first part, yes. 5071C, 4883C, 4310C, and 5073C are just a few of the letters we can send out in various circumstances (suspected, confirmed, account locked, etc). To the second part, hell no.

ID theft and tax frauds wouldn’t be such a headache and financial drain to victims, if IRS would be doing what you say they do .

Compromising an investigation, putting a taxpayer in potential danger (Something like 20-30% of IDT is committed by someone close to the victim, and if they confront the person suspected, then… Well.), there’s several reasons we won’t tell you who.

So , IRS protects the thief from the victim.

Our filter criteria are not published, in order to make it more difficult to work around them. We watch for a lot of things, though.

If Lithuanians and Mexicans know about it , it’s not a secret.

You’re insane. I’m not even going to bother answering you further. Go listen to Alex Jones and post on Prison Planet. You’ll fit right in.

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 9:00 PM

So you CAN’T DISPROVE that IRS knowingly and happily finds ways to send US taxpayer money to foreigners, including terrorists ?
I can prove what I said.
Guess who’s the sane one ?

burrata on April 10, 2014 at 9:28 PM

One problem… is you get your social security card one time when you are an infant. An infants picture won’t do much good. A drivers license needs to be renewed every four years so at least it stays somewhat up to date, and more importantly is related to where one lives. A social security card has no relationship to being eligible to vote.

To vote one must be a citizen, be registered to vote, be eighteen or older, and must reside within the voting district. None of which is related to a social security number.

Dasher on April 10, 2014 at 9:30 PM

To vote one must be a citizen, be registered to vote, be eighteen or older, and must reside within the voting district. None of which is related to a social security number.

Dasher on April 10, 2014 at 9:30 PM

What Bill Clinton wants is to take voter fraud to the next level.
Motor-voter and ACORN achieved level-1,
this is level-2.

burrata on April 10, 2014 at 9:43 PM

burrata on April 10, 2014 at 9:28 PM

I’ll bite. /sigh

1: That would require a lot of extradition, etc. Cheaper for the taxpayer to just stop the fraudulent returns than hunt someone internationally.

2: I actually know what the filters are. You’re ignorant in this matter and really should stop talking. They’re based on known fraud schemes, not… whatever you think they’re based on.

3: Those holes are flaws in personnel and congressional law, not internal rules. Lerner broke just about every rule concerning UNAX (unauthorized access) and disclosure. If she were subject directly to TIGTA, instead of DoJ, she’d already be in prison. She’s protected as a political appointee. Had I or anyone in my department done similarly, we’d be in a cell block.

4: We focus on tax-related identity theft. It’s one portion of a massive problem, spanning public and private sectors. We do what we can and provide documentation and instructions to victims to help them sort out their personal finances.

5: You’re an idiot. Here’s three examples:
A) I give the victim the address of the suspected crook. The crook is a gang banger. Victim shows up, gets shot.
B) Identity thief files a Married Filing Joint return with two random people. I give one of them identifying infirmary about the other. They assume the other person must be the crook, and go get “revenge”. Turns out, the person they attacked was also a victim. Everything about this scenario except the “me giving out personal information” part is pretty much a daily discussion, having to explain to one victim that, no, the other person on the fraudulent return that was filed is another victim, not the perpetrator.
C) I give out information to someone, who then warns the perpetrator. Perpetrator flees and the investigation is ruined.
There’s three good reasons not to disclose information about the fraudulent return that require no more than a few seconds of thought.

6: They don’t know. They guess, based on which returns get through and which don’t, but they don’t know. It’s a constant contest, like any law enforcement. We have to constantly evolve to meet new tactics the criminals come up with.

7: Demanding I prove a negative… Yeah, you’re “slick”. Pfft. No, that problem starts and stops with Congress, who, in their infinite wisdom, decided that illegal aliens should qualify for refundable credits. So try again.

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 10:00 PM

I give one of them identifying infirmary about the other.

Should have been “identifying information”.

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 10:02 PM

Since you apparently can’t understand my point, caution is good.

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 9:26 PM

Asurea, I understand just fine. Sadly you don’t understand nor are you willing to even entertain the point I’m trying to make.

The problem is this – our country as whole relies on complicated debt products and financial transactions in an attempt to “make it easy”. We have way too many credit cards and access to credit. These “things” require all sorts of complicated business and financial processes to try to make them accessible and fair and all it does is expose people to risk.

Tell me something – how did my parents manage to raise three children (all college educated professionals now), own and pay-off a home and fully fund their retirement all before credit cards and consumer debt was popular? My parents lived a full life and gave their children a full life without ever needing most of the “stuff” we fret about here – HELOCs, personal credit lines, IDT insurance, etc, etc. They worked hard, paid their taxes, used cash or checks in almost all transactions, never got into debt and lived full lives.

The sad thing you don’t get is that if you try to emulate what they did nowadays, it’s hard to do but doable. And if you do, you never need to fear all the scary stories you deal with in your line of work.

powerpickle on April 10, 2014 at 11:28 PM

Maybe we should all get a numbered bar code tattoo put on us, and have a tracking chip implanted just under our skin too.

Nazi Germany was a trend setter. Who knew?

KMC1 on April 10, 2014 at 11:35 PM

powerpickle on April 10, 2014 at 11:28 PM

My original point was that everyone is vulnerable to identity theft, mostly due to the proliferation of information. You seem to be interpreting that as me encouraging and/or supporting debt instruments. I agree with you that they should be avoided if at all possible, both due to common sense and financial prudence ($500 on a TV paid over a year on a credit card=$600, roughly, versus saving up and just spending $500). Where I’m very seriously disagreeing with you is this:

You are stating/implying that avoiding debt instruments protects you from identity theft. This is absolutely false. These “scary stories” aren’t happening because people get into debt, or even behave carelessly. Keep in mind my own personal run-in with the problem: I enrolled in ROTC. These things happen because it is a very profitable crime for criminals to engage in, and everyone is vulnerable.

You made two points in your first post, and have argued the point I didn’t have a problem with (debt is dumb) while avoiding the one I did have a problem with (avoiding debt somehow protects you from IDT).

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 11:42 PM

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 11:42 PM

Like two drunk football fans in a bar, me thinks you and I are the only ones left arguing over the score….time for me to take my final swig of the bottle and head for bed.

I’ll leave with what my original thought was that got lost in all the noise – SSN’s are treated like some kind of sacred cow and they are not. If politicos want to use them for IDs, I have no issue with that. Folks get riled up about national id’s and my SSN is sacred and can’t be shared…whatever, get some LifeLock insurance and you’ll be fine. It may sound flippant but that’s probably because it just doesn’t bother me; my security rests not in my checkbook……

That’s it. Feel free to respond or not, I’m off to bed…..

powerpickle on April 11, 2014 at 12:17 AM

I’ll go for the SSN being a voting card IF you set up an e-verification at the polls…

Key in the number and then go vote…

Problem? Cast a PROVISONAL ballot and let them sort out the SSN later.

Khun Joe on April 11, 2014 at 2:40 AM

Maybe I’m missing something, but aren’t the vast majority of SS cards issued when a baby is born? (For tax deductions) How often would one update the photo?

Another problem I have is the ease with which SS numbers have historically been stolen or just made up. I worked in California for 20 years and made certain that all my employees had legal documents. However….I was pretty sure at least half of them were fraudulent ID’s.
Why should we think photo SS cards would be less subject to fraud?

jeanneb on April 11, 2014 at 8:00 AM

If there’s such a huge black market for stolen pass ports, can you just imagine the jump in that market for SS cards. This old idiot needs to find a rocking chair next to Jimmy C and talk about the good old day when the were the most powerful men in the world. Oh, and he can drag his old lady along for the moment. Maybe they could buy a telescope and search the skies for aliens. You know, do something useful for a change.

Kissmygrits on April 11, 2014 at 9:03 AM

Clinton and Democrats can eff off.

The most obvious reason to reject this idea is because SS cards are one of the easiest forms of national ID to fake. There are literally millions of fraudulent SS cards in use right now. Can you imagine the landslide victories Democrats would enjoy if this scheme worked?

RobertE on April 11, 2014 at 9:04 AM

One problem is that you have to get the photo updated. You get the card early in life, and then show up a sixty to vote. Ripe for fraud.

Hening on April 11, 2014 at 9:32 AM

Photos on SS Cards…

And that’s going to stop fake ID’s how?

Willys on April 11, 2014 at 9:32 AM

Asurea on April 10, 2014 at 11:42 PM

You sound like a stand up guy. I once had a job where when I announced my presence, I was immediately hated. I learned to accept that fact and did my job the best I could in the most pleasant manner. When traveling, I did eat out alone most of the time. Chuckle.

HonestLib on April 11, 2014 at 9:56 AM

Uh let’s look at the SSA website for a quick second, as I suspect this is a scheme for back door voting by Illegals.

We issue three types of Social Security cards. All cards show your name and Social Security number.
1.Shows your name and Social Security number and lets you work without restriction.
We issue it to: ◦U.S. citizens; and
◦People lawfully admitted to the United States on a permanent basis.

2.Shows your name and number and notes, “VALID FOR WORK ONLY WITH DHS AUTHORIZATION.” We issue this type of card to people lawfully admitted to the United States on a temporary basis who have DHS authorization to work.
3.Shows your name and number and notes, “NOT VALID FOR EMPLOYMENT.”
We issue it to people from other countries: ◦Who are lawfully admitted to the United States without work authorization from DHS, but with a valid nonwork reason for needing a Social Security number; or
◦Who need a number because of a federal law requiring a Social Security number to get a benefit or service.

Illegals will be able to get SS Cards and be able to vote.

Johnnyreb on April 10, 2014 at 6:58 PM

You are correct. See my previous post.

There are also instances where illegal aliens (under TPS) can receive SSNs.

I am actually surprised he would float this since it is no secret that SSNs are not exclusive to US citizens.

guinneach on April 11, 2014 at 10:58 AM

I’m pretty sure Clinton missed the point.

The reason they oppose ID cards is because it keeps people from voting illegally.

If people stop voting illegally Democrats can’t throw elections.

If the goal was fair elections well then everyone would be in favor of ID cards.

How can he be so naive?

petunia on April 11, 2014 at 1:24 PM

One big problem with this: You need your son or daughter to have a Social Security card in order to deduct them as a dependent. What are the chances that a 1- year old’s picture is going to look like them in 20 years?

jim56 on April 11, 2014 at 1:34 PM

Why not make Social Security optional?

Why don’t conservatives talk about getting rid of the Social Security Welfare Program anymore?

Another Libertarian on April 11, 2014 at 2:23 PM

I have 3 nationally issued identification cards.

1) TWIC (Transportation Workers Identification Card)
2) Passport
3) Veterans Identification

All three have photo’s, barcodes, chips, and/or magnetic strips. I also had an Airport Security Identification Card well before the rise of the TSA monster.

This effort would stop
1) 100% of voter fraud
2) A very significant amount of illegal immigrant identiity fraud
3) Most identity theft where full identities are recreated

I cannot but 100% endorse photos on Social Security Cards.

OregonPolitician on April 11, 2014 at 2:27 PM

Where’s YOUR SSA card, Bill?

I haven’t seen mine in years.

mojo on April 11, 2014 at 3:46 PM

Bill Clinton on voter ID: Why not solve the problem by putting a photo on every Social Security card?

Once upon a time we had no photography…and surprisingly, society worked rather well.

Dr. ZhivBlago on April 11, 2014 at 4:50 PM

From time to time the guy forgets who he is and wears the wrong color, this one called ‘True’

Willys on April 11, 2014 at 8:02 PM

I got my SS card when I was 16 years old. I am now 66. Do I look the same? I wish!!!! My dad got his card at 15. He is 90 this year! He definitely does not look the same. Does this mean that SS cards will be reissued every 5/10 years? What happens to the old ones? Where do we go to take the pic? HOW MANY MORE BUREAUCRATS WILL NEED TO BE HIRED TO ADMINSISTER THIS PROGRAM? I love the idea of voter ID cards, but, come on; we already have programs for this in every state. In CA, we call it the DMV. Besides, as much as I distrust CA state government, I trust the Feds much, much less. SS cards and numbers are already misused, stolen, and forged. Clinton’s grab at this issue reminds me of Obama’s telling the House that he will not change Obamacare, but he then changes it himself so he gets all the credit. This is just another power grab by the Dems, especially the Clintons.

conservative educator on April 11, 2014 at 8:25 PM

powerpickle

While looking for a case I recall of some elderly man’s house in NYC being mortgaged and foreclosed on, I found this. The one convicted of it had stolen 30 houses.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/17/nyregion/17house.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Here is one about home equity line of credit theft.

http://www.bankrate.com/finance/home-equity/id-thieves-target-home-equity-lines-1.aspx

Madisonian on April 12, 2014 at 8:16 AM

WE can establish the Dept of Voter ID Updates – fund it with 5,000 employees initially and 20 -30 building across the country.

The budget would be a mere 35 billion the first years until all the phones and desks are purchased.

I ten years or so we can start hiring workers when the budget will be increased to only 200 or so billion a year!

Yes, we are using the Obama School of Economics as our guidelines and procedures.

Obamatrix on April 12, 2014 at 10:26 AM

endorsed the idea of adding photos to Social Security cards as a way to prevent voter suppression…

See, now I would have said that a photo ID is a way to prevent voter fraud, rather than suppression. Half-full/half-empty, I guess.

bofh on April 12, 2014 at 10:31 AM

To be honest I do not understand the hostility to a National Identification.

Proper installment would stop 100% of illegal immigrants from getting real jobs (makes real ID program checks possible), would stop 100% of full on identity theft (the type where they get a drivers license, SS card, and more to make a new you in a different location), would stop 100% of voter fraud (please insert your card here to finish your vote, just records you voted), and could be run via ‘partners’ in existing Federal and State identification locations (DMV, VA, and TWIC Centers for example).

OregonPolitician on April 12, 2014 at 3:23 PM

To be honest I do not understand the hostility to a National Identification.

Proper installment would stop 100% of illegal immigrants from getting real jobs (makes real ID program checks possible), would stop 100% of full on identity theft (the type where they get a drivers license, SS card, and more to make a new you in a different location), would stop 100% of voter fraud (please insert your card here to finish your vote, just records you voted), and could be run via ‘partners’ in existing Federal and State identification locations (DMV, VA, and TWIC Centers for example).

OregonPolitician on April 12, 2014 at 3:23 PM

And what is this magical 100% fraud proof ID card to be made of?

You used the 100% line three times in your post. A National ID would stop 100% of Identity Theft? You honestly don’t believe that do you? If you do, show us any legitimate form of ID that exists or is under development that claims that magical 100% number. Nothing anywhere is 100% proof against anything. And I hope that a real Oregon Politician would have already known that.

Johnnyreb on April 12, 2014 at 6:26 PM

Does that mean I will be forever haunted by my parents thought that I looked so cute naked on a bear skin rug?

Liberals stated that we would be issued SSAN’s at birth, and as such I would also ask this question, would my thumb (or foot) print serve as my signature of my SS Card.

MSGTAS on April 13, 2014 at 10:29 AM

Why is Bill Clinton even allowed in polite company. He’s sleaze. That anybody even gives him the time of day is a disgrace.

flataffect on April 13, 2014 at 2:57 PM

If you added a photo to SS cards – then you’d have to have a provision for them to expire and be re-issued in order for the photo to bear a resemblance to the bearer…. and if you’ve stood in line for anything at a SS Office in recent history, you can see the obvious problem of creating a duplicate DMV office.

In fact….. doesn’t the DMV already do all of this with Driver’s Licenses and State Issued ID cards?

2nd Ammendment Mother on April 14, 2014 at 1:35 PM

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