Rand Paul on immigration: Republicans have got to get beyond deportation

posted at 1:21 pm on April 1, 2014 by Allahpundit

Before anyone excommunicates him from the GOP on grounds of RINOism, ask yourself: Will there be a single Republican candidate onstage next year at the debates who challenges him on this point? Don’t say Cruz. Cruz opposes a path to citizenship but he’s in line with Paul, Rubio, etc, on legalization and work permits, which are the truly important provisions. Once legalization is granted, citizenship will inevitably follow. (That’s why it’s crucial to secure the border first, to make sure that this amnesty is the last amnesty.) If Paul’s candidacy is DOA for taking this line, I’m not sure whose candidacy is still alive.

Besides, America is already largely “beyond deportation.”

During a symposium at the Newseum on conservative engagement with Hispanic media outlets, Paul also said Republicans have plenty of ideas that appeal to Latinos, but acknowledged, “We got to get beyond deportation to get to the rest of the issues.”

“The bottom line is that the Hispanic community, the Latino community, is not going to hear us until we get beyond that issue. They’re not going to care whether we go to the same church or have the same values or believe in the same kind of future of the country until we get beyond that. So showing up helps. But you got to show up and you got to say something and it’s has to be different than what we’ve been saying.”…

“I think one way to get the door ajar is say that you know, Mrs. Garcia’s nephew is not going to be sent home to Mexico,” he said. “You know, because everybody — even those who are here illegally — know somebody who is here who doesn’t have the proper visa.”…

Paul, who voted against last year’s Senate comprehensive immigration bill, expressed frustration that the bill still keeps it illegal for immigrants with certain visas to change jobs while in the United States. He gave an example of a migrant worker who came here with a legal visa to pick crops for $9 dollars an hour but later saw a construction job that paid $14 dollars an hour.

The most interesting part of that to me isn’t the deportation bit. After the beating Romney took for advocating attrition through enforcement, a.k.a. “self-deportation,” in 2012, no Republican with national ambitions is going to defend the D-word. The interesting part is that Rand is still kinda sorta pushing the “Latinos are conservatives but just don’t know it yet” line which, I thought, most people who follow politics now accepted was self-serving nonsense endorsed by GOP amnesty fans. More than one poll, including the national exit poll in 2012, show Latinos favoring gay marriage. Abortion is more complicated, but the same 2012 exit poll found that 66 percent of Latinos thought abortion should be legal compared to 59 percent of the overall population. Maybe that’s an artifact of higher turnout among Latino Democrats for Obama’s reelection bid or maybe it’s a more durable trend. As for Paul’s point about sharing a vision for the future of the country, here’s the reality from Pew circa April 2012:

pew

A Gallup poll taken two months later, in June 2012, showed a similar result. When asked whether government is doing too much or not enough, American registered voters overall split 57/37. Latino registered voters split 35/56. And so we return to the big question: Are these preferences more a product of firm ideological inclination or are they more a product of alienation from the GOP over immigration policy? Republicans don’t need to win a majority of Latinos to make Democrats’ lives difficult electorally — even a 40/60 split would be tough for the left — but the “ask” here in terms of legalizing 10+ million people is high given the uncertainty. Look back at the Pew poll and you’ll find a further complication: It’s younger Latinos and recent immigrants who are the furthest left politically. Is that because they’re alienated from the GOP in a way that older generations, which watched Reagan sign the 1986 amnesty, aren’t? Or is it because broader political trends, like the leftward drift and lesser role of religion among younger voters generally, have delivered them there? The problem is more or less fixable depending upon how you answer. Republican candidates, Paul included, have to take the “it’s our fault” line because they can’t afford to formally write off an entire demographic. The trick is convincing Republican base voters that it’s true.


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Joana writes,

That’s revisionism. Who do you think that supported the urban political machines in the East? Why were they voting backbone of the New Deal Coalition? Poles, Italians or Irish were more reliably Democrat until the late 60s than Hispanics are today.

Yes, but you’re not identifying or understanding those European groups’ voting patterns evolved if you think it was just a response to changing GOP political attitudes towards them.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:06 PM

Actually they were invited. Whatever they faced when they got here has no bearing on the invitation. btw, they assimilated into the culture. Latinos refuse to do that for the most part.

cajunpatriot on April 1, 2014 at 2:03 PM

It’s a mistake to say Latinos refuse to do it. It might seem like it at first glance because there’s a continuous wave having the first generation arrival experience but as we see from the polling data in the post, Latinos who have been here for a couple generations have basically assimilated.

alchemist19 on April 1, 2014 at 2:06 PM

“Forty percent of those who are here of the 11 million who don’t have the proper documents,” Paul said. “Forty percent of them came with the proper documents and then somehow lost their documentation.”

They didn’t lose their documents numbskull. They are illegally overstaying their visas.

Mark1971 on April 1, 2014 at 2:07 PM

Illegal aliens will continue to support bigger government as long as they get to be the beneficiaries of it, and not the ones paying for it.

Don’t want deportations? Fine, then end the taxpayer-funded gravy train that so many illegals are now riding. Enforce existing federal laws that prohibit the payment of food stamps, welfare, Medicare Part D prescription drug benefits, etc., to illegal aliens. The Obama administration has been flagrantly violating these laws for years now, and knowingly paying out many billions of dollars every year in various welfare benefits, as well as billions more in “tax credits,” to illegal aliens.

We wouldn’t have as many illegal aliens here as we do if the federal government were not providing all these (illegal) financial incentives for them to come, and stay, here. So instead of talking about deportations, why don’t we talk about how this incredibly corrupt administration has been plundering the U.S. Treasury in order to “fundamentally transform” this nation into a third-world banana republic.

AZCoyote on April 1, 2014 at 2:08 PM

Aw, look, the world is racist.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:08 PM

Mark1971,

They didn’t lose their documents numbskull. They are illegally overstaying their visas.

Yeah, Rand is so disappointingly dishonest on this issue.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:08 PM

AllahPundit writes,

Look back at the Pew poll and you’ll find a further complication: It’s younger Latinos and recent immigrants who are the furthest left politically.

Virtually ALL latino’s south of the border have a penchant for Marxist beliefs. This is WHY these countries have had failed governments for centuries.

Private property rights in Mexico have always been reserved for the elite and the violent. This is the fate of USA if we continue to refuse to defend our borders.

Freddy on April 1, 2014 at 2:10 PM

illinois notcool joanna … the rest

Let me get this straight – you want to amnesty everyone who overstayed a visa or jumped a fence before .,. 2010? But you also want deport everyone after ,say 2010, who overstayed a visa, right? Or do you want to end deportations all together? Be specific. What’s the plan? What’s the cut off date?

BoxHead1 on April 1, 2014 at 2:10 PM

I love it that Paul is a rabid isolationist but he doesn’t give a damn about securing the borders. He screams about not being the world’s police yet he’s okay when the criminals (including Mrs. Garcia’s nephew) are not policed up here at home. It’s as hypocritical as calling “getting beyond deportation” part of immigration reform. Nothing is being reformed, this is just a scheme to reward a bunch of illegal parasites who the political class hopes will, in turn, reward them with votes as newly minted citizens of a nation and culture that they do not respect.

Happy Nomad on April 1, 2014 at 2:10 PM

I was talking to Schadenfreude. Are you really white trying to pretend blacks are slow, or stupid, or something?

NotCoach on April 1, 2014 at 2:02 PM

Sorry about that. I am afraid I am the slow, stupid black type. Please forgive me.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 2:11 PM

Shorter version “because the Pope is a socialist”.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 1:51 PM

Because he supports the social teachings of the Catholic Church?

It’s a mistake to say Latinos refuse to do it. It might seem like it at first glance because there’s a continuous wave having the first generation arrival experience but as we see from the polling data in the post, Latinos who have been here for a couple generations have basically assimilated.

alchemist19 on April 1, 2014 at 2:06 PM

It is also a mistake to say that other immigrant groups assimilated right away. I believe that one of the other posters here pointed to the different cultural enclaves in all the cities… Little Italy, Chinatown, etc. First generation immigrants might not have even picked up English, which is a difficult language.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:11 PM

This is one of the things that irritates me about Rand: He likes straw men. He did it with DOMA, claiming DOMA outlaws gay marriage, and he’s doing it with immigration.

NotCoach on April 1, 2014 at 1:25 PM

Those who use straw men are not at all honest people and if someone is not at all honest, how can you ever believe anything they say?

VorDaj on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

Eighty years ago they were not sucking up welfare benefits and they assimilated, learned the language do success, and didn’t have the democrats hauling them to their underclass plantation. They also came here LEGALLY. What is it with you idiots not understanding the word ILLEGAL?

Cheese Wheel on April 1, 2014 at 1:37 PM

That’s revisionism. Who do you think that supported the urban political machines in the East? Why were they voting backbone of the New Deal Coalition? Poles, Italians or Irish were more reliably Democrat until the late 60s than Hispanics are today.

joana on April 1, 2014 at 1:59 PM

Again, let me spell out the difference between legal immigrants and illegal aliens. Legal immigrants came through Ellis Island and were invited here. Illegal aliens broke the law and arrived here uninvited and we have no idea of their criminal history. I’m sure you will still not get it, but I tried.

Cheese Wheel on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

As recently as the early 20th century, there were rural communities in which German was the only language spoken. Even back then immigrants didn’t just come over here and instantaneously adapt to the American culture, however assimilation almost happened overnight after the US entered World War I.

midgeorgian on April 1, 2014 at 1:59 PM

That’s a fairly unique example because we were at war with their country of origin. And some of the assimilation was a façade. My history teacher in high school came from one of those rural German communities and his story was that they did things in German, when any outsiders showed up to make sure they were doing things the American way they went into English and once they were no longer being observed they went straight back into German.

alchemist19 on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

alchemist19,

It’s a mistake to say Latinos refuse to do it. It might seem like it at first glance because there’s a continuous wave having the first generation arrival experience but as we see from the polling data in the post, Latinos who have been here for a couple generations have basically assimilated.

Wrong.

They speak English, that’s it. They don’t aspire (or don’t have the ability) to achieve the educational and income patterns found in white Americans. And they continue to support big government.

That’s true even for Hispanics who have been in the U.S. for five generations.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

It’s a lot like a lie detector test. If one uses straw men, they flunked.

VorDaj on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

Let me get this straight – you want to amnesty everyone who overstayed a visa or jumped a fence before .,. 2010? But you also want deport everyone after ,say 2010, who overstayed a visa, right? Or do you want to end deportations all together? Be specific. What’s the plan? What’s the cut off date?

BoxHead1 on April 1, 2014 at 2:10 PM

I’ll let the policy makers come up with an exact date.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

Before anyone excommunicates him from the GOP on grounds of RINOism, ask yourself: Will there be a single Republican candidate onstage next year at the debates who challenges him on this point?

I would hope they would at least challenge him on trying to reduce all opposition to amnesty to just “deportation.” That’s a complete mischaracterization of a stand against amnesty.

There Goes the Neighborhood on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

I’m tired of hearing that we can’t deport all those people. WE WOULDN’T HAVE TO IF THEY HADN”T BEEN ALLOWED IN IN THE FIRST PLACE. Stop sucking up to a group that will never vote for you what ever you do. We already have laws. ENFORCE THEM.

Anyone who doesn’t agree with this will never get my vote.

crankyoldlady on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

This is none other than the “Soft Bigotry of Low Expectations”.

All who are for breaking the laws, no matter by whom, assume that all minorities are too dumb to follow laws.

Shame on all of you.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:05 PM

I don’t think anyone is for ignoring the rule of law (other than Obama), what Paul is talking about is dealing with the issue that we have, not the one we wish we had. Nowhere has he ever promoted amnesty and any conjecture that he ‘means’ amnesty with this proposal is just out of control imaginations.

Tater Salad on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

I’ll let the policy makers come up with an exact date.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

So, what if it’s everyone who snuck in after 2008 gets deported? Is that OK with you?

BoxHead1 on April 1, 2014 at 2:14 PM

Sorry about that. I am afraid I am the slow, stupid black type. Please forgive me.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 2:11 PM

You are, but it’s not the color of your skin, it’s your brain.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:14 PM

Listen if you have a plan on how to deport every single person who is not here legally, please share it. Other wise let sane people come to a solution ok.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 1:31 PM

Strawman.
How many do you think we should deport, and under what circumstances?

Mimzey on April 1, 2014 at 2:15 PM

Paul need to GET OVER being president

KBird on April 1, 2014 at 2:15 PM

Will there be a single Republican candidate onstage next year at the debates who challenges him on this point? Don’t say Cruz.

Cruz.

He will challenge Rand as being soft on immigration, as well as being soft on Russia, and soft on a host of other conservative issues.

Rand is continuing to shoot himself in the foot by offering one tone deaf statement after another.

Norwegian on April 1, 2014 at 2:15 PM

Does any candidate support deportation?

Dash on April 1, 2014 at 2:17 PM

You are, but it’s not the color of your skin, it’s your brain.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:14 PM

Hey Schad, are you ready to have your mind blown?

I put my pants on one leg at a time.

NotCoach on April 1, 2014 at 2:17 PM

Cruz

Norwegian on April 1, 2014 at 2:15 PM

I will bet you if and when Cruz makes a formal proposal it will look a lot like Rand’s. So far they have been very close on this subject.

Tater Salad on April 1, 2014 at 2:18 PM

Rabid warmongers don’t understand the word “defense”. Rand Paul is for a strong defense, like Ted Cruz, but doesn’t support Baby Boomer Neo Con nation building wars. Despite years of propaganda to the contrary, defense means defense and not foreign adventurism.

And we could start by rebuilding the US Nuclear stockpile while giving the soldiers a rest, as they are getting ready to deactivate several divisions anyway. Instead of an army, we have tens of thousands of cripples coming back from these stupid nation building utopian fantasies, thanks to the Neo Con Progressive losers. There’s no problem government force can’t fix, according to the GOP Elite. Yeah, real conservative.

The idea that the government even has the power to deport everyone that’s here is a joke. If they admit this, another part of the illusory facade that we call a government these days crumbles. None of these politicians will let that happen on their watch so they are going to dance around the issue.

If someone wants to get serious about this immigration issue, they would start advocating for a complete cancellation of the H1B visa program. It is killing jobs for American tech-degreed college grads.

Another Libertarian on April 1, 2014 at 2:19 PM

Paul included, have to take the “it’s our fault” line because they can’t afford to formally write off an entire demographic. The trick is convincing Republican base voters that it’s true.

GOP: “Screw the base!”

vlad martel on April 1, 2014 at 2:19 PM

To Rand, you might want to get with President McCain and President Romney to get all the particulars for primary behavior and later, the presidential pander machine going into high drive for these Hispanics. It worked so well for them.

Cheese Wheel on April 1, 2014 at 2:20 PM

Illinidiva,

It is also a mistake to say that other immigrant groups assimilated right away. I believe that one of the other posters here pointed to the different cultural enclaves in all the cities… Little Italy, Chinatown, etc. First generation immigrants might not have even picked up English, which is a difficult language.

You’re not getting the main point. Any group which stays here for more than one generation will learn to speak English and see their incomes grow.

That won’t make them politically assimilated for the purposes of Republicans.

Most Jews have been here forever. They still overwhelmingly vote for Democrats and support liberal causes. In fact, Jewish-Americans have never given a majority of their vote to the GOP candidate in a hundred years.

Is this because they’re not assimilated? Is it because the GOP doesn’t support Israel enough?

Of course not. You’d have to be a dumbass to believe that.

Like Jews, immigrants have their own political views, and those views will not match Republican political views for the foreseeable future. You can win a few more on the margins, but you have to be careful not to upset your base while doing so.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:20 PM

I don’t think anyone is for ignoring the rule of law (other than Obama), what Paul is talking about is dealing with the issue that we have, not the one we wish we had. Nowhere has he ever promoted amnesty and any conjecture that he ‘means’ amnesty with this proposal is just out of control imaginations.

Tater Salad on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

It’s either out of control imaginations or folks who just didn’t like Rand Paul and what he’s selling to begin with.

I’m thinking it is the latter.

Punchenko on April 1, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Here’s the new Paul, the same as the old Paul.

There are some things I like about Rand vis-à-vis Ron, but I think there’s something in this family’s genes that points to stupidity.

I don’t care whether it’s an American hater like Obama, trying to take away our liberties to push his agenda, or a Libertarian espousing stupid ideas to prove how anti-government they are that allow the illegal immigrants to take over the country, and limit out military until we don’t fire a shot until we see the whites of their eyes, already invading our shores and borders.

Either end of the spectrum weakens America.

Rand Paul is proving his lack of fitness for POTUS every time he opens his mouth, lately.

ZeusGoose on April 1, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Wrong.

They speak English, that’s it. They don’t aspire (or don’t have the ability) to achieve the educational and income patterns found in white Americans. And they continue to support big government.

That’s true even for Hispanics who have been in the U.S. for five generations.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

How do you know they don’t do aspire of they don’t have the ability to achieve the education and income that white people do? That’s a BOLD statement and so I’m going to need to see some support if you’re saying they can’t be educated.

The poll AP included in the post shows that after a couple generations Latinos become more supportive of the idea of a smaller government which provides fewer services. First generation immigrants overwhelmingly support big government but once assimilation takes place big government loses its appeal.

alchemist19 on April 1, 2014 at 2:21 PM

BTW- Let’s not start the conversation with deport. Let’s start it with E-verify. I wonder how strident in supporting amnesty the US Chamber of Commerce would be if the government really started enforcing the law when it comes to employment of illegals.

Happy Nomad on April 1, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Listen if you have a plan on how to deport every single person who is not here legally, please share it. Other wise let sane people come to a solution ok.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 1:31 PM

You are into straw men seen more than Paul and therefor are even more dishonest than he is. You would make a good democrat politician and maybe you are.

VorDaj on April 1, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Bye bye, Rand Paul. Won’t vote for you now.

stenwin77 on April 1, 2014 at 2:22 PM

You are, but it’s not the color of your skin, it’s your brain.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:14 PM

I am sure it pains you to have to clarify. And my mood just got brighter again. FYI, my brain is what people most love about me. I know, it shocks me too. I was sure my long, lean legs were it too.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 2:22 PM

RANd Paul is going the “gotta please everyone” route. Not going to work. Ends up everyone hates you.

stenwin77 on April 1, 2014 at 2:23 PM

You’re not getting the main point. Any group which stays here for more than one generation will learn to speak English and see their incomes grow.

That won’t make them politically assimilated for the purposes of Republicans.

Most Jews have been here forever. They still overwhelmingly vote for Democrats and support liberal causes. In fact, Jewish-Americans have never given a majority of their vote to the GOP candidate in a hundred years.

Is this because they’re not assimilated? Is it because the GOP doesn’t support Israel enough?

Of course not. You’d have to be a dumbass to believe that.

Like Jews, immigrants have their own political views, and those views will not match Republican political views for the foreseeable future. You can win a few more on the margins, but you have to be careful not to upset your base while doing so.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:20 PM

Perhaps it is because Republican Party is an overwhelmingly Evangelical Christian party based in the South? Some Republican functions I’ve been to have had a Jesus pep rally feel to them. Perhaps a non-Christian might feel uncomfortable in that environment.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:24 PM

The idea that the government even has the power to deport everyone that’s here is a joke.

Are you really that dumb or are you using a left-wing talking point?

Wigglesworth on April 1, 2014 at 2:26 PM

Nowhere has he ever promoted amnesty and any conjecture that he ‘means’ amnesty with this proposal is just out of control imaginations.

Tater Salad on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

I want him to promote enforcing the immigration laws. Has he ever done that?

Mimzey on April 1, 2014 at 2:26 PM

Rand Paul is for a strong defense

Another Libertarian on April 1, 2014 at 2:19 PM

Well, we now know that he’s not. One can not be so derelict in protecting America from an invasion of tens of millions of third world invaders, which his using straw men like a mountebank proves he is, and seriously claim to be for a strong defense.

VorDaj on April 1, 2014 at 2:27 PM

Wrong.

They speak English, that’s it. They don’t aspire (or don’t have the ability) to achieve the educational and income patterns found in white Americans. And they continue to support big government.

That’s true even for Hispanics who have been in the U.S. for five generations.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

Latinos certainly believe in hard work. And it is going to take a few generations for Latinos to catch up to the education and income levels of upper middle class whites. Most immigrants probably have about a fifth grade education.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:28 PM

Hispanics won’t “listen to us” until we are beyond deportation (of illegal aliens). Then which country do they really support, their old country, or this country. Personally I don’t care if they are not citizens and arrived here legally. The government will NOT secure the border and the best and only way to secure the country is to deny a job, health care, welfare or anything else to illegal aliens. They will then leave of their own account, or more likely not come in the first place. There must be very big penalties to anyone who hires an illegal over a citizen. No exceptions.

leader4hru on April 1, 2014 at 2:28 PM

This is none other than the “Soft Bigotry of Low Expectations”.

All who are for breaking the laws, no matter by whom, assume that all minorities are too dumb to follow laws.

Shame on all of you.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:05 PM

Nonsense. This is recognizing and bowing to certain geographic, demographic, and economic realities.

We have a 2000 mile border with Mexico, a nation that is producing people way faster than we are. These people are way poorer than our people, to the tune of per capita GDP being a quarter of that of the US. They exist in a nation whose government is way more corrupt and inefficient than ours, and is increasingly being taken over by criminal organizations. And they are looking north to a nation that not only has a strong demand for low wage labor, but also provides a generous welfare staet

Now, I’ll be the first to admit that I don’t like a wall, for any number of reasons that have nothing to do with Mexico or Mexicans. But given the above realities, it seems to me that you could build that wall to the moon, and the pressures created by those realities are going to mean that people are going to illegally immigrate here, even at the risk of death.

Of course, that said, you are absolutely right about one thing: We, as a sovereign nation, must have the ability to control who we let into this country, and who we do not. Otherwise, sovereignty means nothing.

Which, as far as I can tell, presents us with a conundrum. We have millions of people here that we are not going to spend the resources nor the political capital necessary to ship home. We have tens of millions more who will risk life and limb to get here. We have our national sovereignty resting on control of that border. And we don’t want to engage in policy which will encourage more illegal immigration.

Play that out to its logical end…

JohnGalt23 on April 1, 2014 at 2:29 PM

I want him to promote enforcing the immigration laws. Has he ever done that?

Mimzey on April 1, 2014 at 2:26 PM

Yes

Tater Salad on April 1, 2014 at 2:30 PM

Eighty years ago they were not sucking up welfare benefits and they assimilated, learned the language do success, and didn’t have the democrats hauling them to their underclass plantation. They also came here LEGALLY. What is it with you idiots not understanding the word ILLEGAL?

Cheese Wheel on April 1, 2014 at 1:37 PM

Read about the no-nothing party and the nativist parties in the 19th century. They had a same opinions about the Irish and other immigrants as anti-immigrant activists today. And the temperance movement used the stereotype of lazy, drunk Irish men to get Prohibition passed.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 1:44 PM

It was the “Know Nothing” party, but it’s not a historical parallel at all, for one simple reason: those people were against immigration, period. Many people opposed to illegal immigration are all for expanding legal immigration.

But this constant attempt to paint those who oppose illegal immigration as hating all immigrants is a big part of what is wrong with Rand Paul and much of the GOP.

There Goes the Neighborhood on April 1, 2014 at 2:30 PM

Before anyone excommunicates him from the GOP on grounds of RINOism, ask yourself: Will there be a single Republican candidate onstage next year at the debates who challenges him on this point?

At the rate we’re going it’s going to be hard to tell the difference between the Republican candidates on anything but money. The only difference on amnesty will be how quickly the border security money gets pulled back as a waste.

katiejane on April 1, 2014 at 2:31 PM

Listen if you have a plan on how to deport every single person who is not here legally, please share it. Other wise let sane people come to a solution ok.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 1:31 PM

Fine employers punitively for using illegal immigrants.

Apprehended and convicted of any crime? Deport them and their families so that we don’t break up the families.

Visa overstayers? We had a record of them once. Whenever they pop up, deport them and their families so that we don’t break up families. That’s 40% of the problems right there.

I just don’t see the problem in cutting them off.

BuckeyeSam on April 1, 2014 at 2:31 PM

FYI, my brain is what people most love about me. I know, it shocks me too. I was sure my long, lean legs were it too.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 2:22 PM

I hear tell that what most people find your most attractive feature is your lobotomy scar.

VorDaj on April 1, 2014 at 2:32 PM

Alchemist19,

How do you know they don’t do aspire of they don’t have the ability to achieve the education and income that white people do? That’s a BOLD statement and so I’m going to need to see some support if you’re saying they can’t be educated.

I’m saying it because Mexican immigrants don’t achieve American levels of income and education even after five generations in the U.S. (Source: Generations of Exclusion: Mexican Americans, Assimilation, and Race)

Now you can blame it on society – as the source does – but most immigrant groups achieve parity quite quickly without a pity party being thrown for them. Hispanic-Americans don’t.

Now the polite way of explaining this is to say they don’t aspire to the same set of cultural values as other Americans. The impolite explanation is that they are unable to make it.

The poll AP included in the post shows that after a couple generations Latinos become more supportive of the idea of a smaller government which provides fewer services. First generation immigrants overwhelmingly support big government but once assimilation takes place big government loses its appeal.

No, they don’t. Look at the poll more closely. They still fall well short of the general population after three generations, and the general population (which includes blacks) falls well short of white attitudes towards big government.

So what do you want us to do? Legalize them and then wait for their great grandchildren to be a little more skeptical of big government than their ancestors were?

Great plan, man.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:32 PM

To the Amnesty shills –

All right, since I can’t get an answer, I’ll ask another way.

Is there a cut off date for your amnesty – after which you support deporting ALL who sneak in or overstay their visas? Not a specific date but ANY date (within a year or 2)? Or do you think deportations of expired visa holders is just wrong? I would like to find where your lines , if you have any, are drawn.

BoxHead1 on April 1, 2014 at 2:33 PM

Latinos certainly believe in hard work. And it is going to take a few generations for Latinos to catch up to the education and income levels of upper middle class whites. recreate Mexico.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:28 PM

vlad martel on April 1, 2014 at 2:34 PM

He gave an example of a migrant worker who came here with a legal visa to pick crops for $9 dollars an hour but later saw a construction job that paid $14 dollars an hour.

Right, because why should an American citizen get the preference of taking a higher paying job? Here’s an idea, let’s run an illegal for your job in your district, Mr. Ryan.

Pansie idiots, all of ‘em.

Klick the Dick on April 1, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Illinidiva,

Latinos certainly believe in hard work.

Then why are they on unemployment at much higher rates than whites and Asians? Why do they spend so little time on schoolwork and do so poorly in school?

And it is going to take a few generations for Latinos to catch up to the education and income levels of upper middle class whites.

They don’t catch up even after five generations.

Most immigrants probably have about a fifth grade education.

The why are we letting them in our country? Anyone with a fifth grade education is not going to be an asset to America. His children are not going to be assets to America. Nor are his grandchildren.

They’re going to be burdens, and burdens vote for the Democrats.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:36 PM

Wrong.

They speak English, that’s it. They don’t aspire (or don’t have the ability) to achieve the educational and income patterns found in white Americans. And they continue to support big government.

That’s true even for Hispanics who have been in the U.S. for five generations.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:12 PM

Latinos certainly believe in hard work. And it is going to take a few generations for Latinos to catch up to the education and income levels of upper middle class whites. Most immigrants probably have about a fifth grade education.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:28 PM

Why are we required or being guilted into taking in these criminals? No other country offers such an array of welfare benefits as the US, so in return, should we not receive the best and the brightest who will eventually be an asset to our country? We have enough unemployment, education, and debt problems without importing more problems. Just ask President McCain or President Romney.

Cheese Wheel on April 1, 2014 at 2:37 PM

JohnGalt23 on April 1, 2014 at 1:46 PM

do you identify with any aspects of that particular character?

DanMan on April 1, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Illinidiva, tell the Pope that he can have all the illegal US criminals. He can feed them in the Vatican.

The US has plenty legal ones to take care of.

Wake up, before you ruin your future.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:40 PM

Nowhere has he ever promoted amnesty and any conjecture that he ‘means’ amnesty with this proposal is just out of control imaginations.

Tater Salad

More nonsense that is easily disproven in 30 seconds with a google search.

In an interview with WNDtv, Sen. Paul took on the critics of so-called “amnesty” who oppose efforts to “normalize” illegal immigrants and absorb them into the United States. “Let’s get them work visas, let’s normalize them, let’s make them taxpayers,” he said of the 11 million undocumented immigrants currently residing within the states.

“They’re not going home,” Paul said, adding that even the most vocal opponents of so-called “amnesty” seem to recognize this fact. “Are they for sending these people home? Do they want us to put them in concentration camps, on buses, and send them back home? I don’t think anyone’s proposing that.”

In other words…AMNESTY! Paul is as big a supporter of amnesty as there is, and bigger than many because he basically supports open borders. He will never get my vote, and neither will anyone else who pushes for it.

xblade on April 1, 2014 at 2:40 PM

To the Amnesty shills –

All right, since I can’t get an answer, I’ll ask another way.

Is there a cut off date for your amnesty – after which you support deporting ALL who sneak in or overstay their visas? Not a specific date but ANY date (within a year or 2)? Or do you think deportations of expired visa holders is just wrong? I would like to find where your lines , if you have any, are drawn.

BoxHead1 on April 1, 2014 at 2:33 PM

Obviously, they can’t answer the question because they don’t want it to end. Ever. Kind of like Affirmative Action. Not one person who supports AA can give an answer as to a proposed cut off date. They never want that to end either.

Bob Davis on April 1, 2014 at 2:40 PM

We can deport them all. Yes we can!

claudius on April 1, 2014 at 2:41 PM

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 2:22 PM

Dummies are not attractive; nore are victims.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2014 at 2:43 PM

W. Bush did very well with Latino voters in 04. I remember studying it. It turns out it was his commercials on Spanish language TV where he spoke Spanish that had the greatest influence on Latino voters.

OliverB on April 1, 2014 at 2:44 PM

So Rand Paul is concerned that a foreigner on a work visa cannot move from a $9 American job picking crops to a better $14 American job? Is he concerned at all about the American citizen’s who won’t get these job if a foreigner does? Is anyone in the GOP concerned about American citizens who are suffering in this economy?

magicbeans on April 1, 2014 at 2:44 PM

“Latinos” get almost as much “affirmative action” as do blacks. Just look at acceptance to medical school per grades and MCATs.

VorDaj on April 1, 2014 at 2:44 PM

*bzzzzzt*

Thanks for playing, Rand. You are now dismissed.

Enforce. the f*cking. Law.

Midas on April 1, 2014 at 2:46 PM

That’s why it’s crucial to secure the border first, to make sure that this amnesty is the last amnesty.

But once the illegals are legal they are going to want minimum wage or maybe just welfare. Then we are going to need a whole new crop of cheap labor to clean the toilets of the elite. This never ends. It didn’t end the last time. It won’t end this time. And it isn’t for the poor little illegal immigrants and their kids its for Zuckerberg and the Chamber of Commerce and employers everywhere that don’t want to pay fair wages. They get richer, we pretend we did it for the poor third worlders, and the middle class pays the price in higher local taxes, fewer resources, and lower wages. But that’s been going on for decades. Our leaders are repulsive.

magicbeans on April 1, 2014 at 2:49 PM

Is there a cut off date for your amnesty – after which you support deporting ALL who sneak in or overstay their visas? Not a specific date but ANY date (within a year or 2)? Or do you think deportations of expired visa holders is just wrong? I would like to find where your lines , if you have any, are drawn.

BoxHead1

Amnesty shills are some of the biggest liars around. There is no cut off date they aren’t willing to cave on,no matter how loudly they scream “This will be the last time.” And the lines they have drawn are simple…they are enemies of the country and the American people. Illiniditz for example can’t be satisfied with destroying her own state, she has to spread the misery nationwide.

xblade on April 1, 2014 at 2:51 PM

Immigration needs to become sine qua non for national conservatives, much in the way abortion is for most social conservatives. If a Republican candidate is not for our view of immigration, then we are against him. Period.

And not just illegal immigration, but also for reducing levels of legal immigration and moving away from the rules favoring family-based chain immigration.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:51 PM

I would hope they would at least challenge him on trying to reduce all opposition to amnesty to just “deportation.” That’s a complete mischaracterization of a stand against amnesty.

There Goes the Neighborhood on April 1, 2014 at 2:13 PM

Who, that might run, is going to credibly challenge him? I would say Ted Cruz, except what he advocated for back in September is very close to what Rand Paul said here. Jeff Sessions maybe, but I don’t think he has any plans to run for president. If any of the other likely candidates challenge him, it will come off as a disingenuous play for voters.

Maybe a single-issue candidate will emerge, a la Tom Tancredo, to push the GOP right on immigration. However after their recent primary reforms, I don’t see the GOP allowing low-polling and lesser-known candidates to participate in the debates at all.

midgeorgian on April 1, 2014 at 2:53 PM

Is he concerned at all about the American citizen’s who won’t get these job if a foreigner does? Is anyone in the GOP concerned about American citizens who are suffering in this economy?

magicbeans on April 1, 2014 at 2:44 PM

With our record low unemployment rate? I’m sure that there isn’t a single American that would take a construction job for $14/hour! /

Happy Nomad on April 1, 2014 at 2:53 PM

Then why are they on unemployment at much higher rates than whites and Asians?

The Latino immigrants are generally in volatile and low wage industries.

Why do they spend so little time on schoolwork and do so poorly in school?

Many don’t group up in the homes with the same value of education as whites. They have to take care of parents who might not know English, help them navigate different American circumstances, take care of younger siblings, etc. They might end up as latchkey kids in bad neighborhoods.

My mom was a bilingual kindergarten teacher and a lot of her time was spent educating her parents about how to help with their children’s education.. something as simple as reading to their kids. Or the different resources that are available to them (like a library for instance.) Mexican immigrants from rural villages aren’t going to naturally be the same advocates for their children as upper middle class white families where mom and dad are college educated professionals.

The why are we letting them in our country? Anyone with a fifth grade education is not going to be an asset to America. His children are not going to be assets to America. Nor are his grandchildren.

Are you really advocating for giving people applying for visas IQ tests? And I’m not sure why you wouldn’t think that the Latinos wouldn’t be an asset to America. They actually are very religious and have intact families. I attend a Spanish Catholic Mass and the church is standing room only on even regular Sundays with lots of families.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:54 PM

“I think one way to get the door ajar is say that you know, Mrs. Garcia’s nephew is not going to be sent home to Mexico,” he said. “You know, because everybody — even those who are here illegally — know somebody who is here who doesn’t have the proper visa.”…

Visas? These illegal aliens are breaking the law. They don’t bother with visas. I’m always shocked that our side still sees these criminals as angels drifting into our country, the broken down, hard working migrant who just wants a better life. Ignore the fact they are dropping babies to get welfare, driving drunk and killing citizens, and lowering wages. Rand, you dummy, you’re no better than Christie or Rubio.

Cheese Wheel on April 1, 2014 at 1:30 PM

That’s why you never let it get this far. Combine illegal and legal immigration, and we’ve got enough people with mixed loyalties to push open borders, and they’ve very nearly got the votes to do it. It’s all about their self interest over the interest of the country.

DFCtomm on April 1, 2014 at 2:54 PM

Obviously, they can’t answer the question because they don’t want it to end. Ever. Kind of like Affirmative Action. Not one person who supports AA can give an answer as to a proposed cut off date. They never want that to end either.

Bob Davis on April 1, 2014 at 2:40 PM

I just want to sift out the libertarians, LaRaza types, CoCers from those,if there are any, that are not for open borders but still support amnesty. Call me paranoid but I don’t believe most of the amnesty supporters are for “border security” or borders at all.

BoxHead1 on April 1, 2014 at 2:55 PM

And I’m not sure why you wouldn’t think that the Latinos wouldn’t be an asset to America. They actually are very religious and have intact families. I attend a Spanish Catholic Mass and the church is standing room only on even regular Sundays with lots of families.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:54 PM

Get this through your skull. This is the twilight of low skilled labor, and we’re about to be stuck with hundreds of millions of low skilled laborers that won’t be able to get a job.

DFCtomm on April 1, 2014 at 2:57 PM

ANY amnesty must ELIMINATE all chain migration! No one who has come here illegally should be allowed, under ANY circumstance, to chain migrate ANY family member!

This one point will force the useless racist thugs in congress, like Luis Guiterrez (socialist democrat-Il), to admit that their RACIST agenda is to change the demographics of the USA.

Freddy on April 1, 2014 at 1:32 PM

YES! We also need to eliminate birthright citizenship and CLOSE THE BORDERS.

KickandSwimMom on April 1, 2014 at 2:58 PM

Before anyone excommunicates him from the GOP

Uh, too late AP. The torches were lit and pitchforks brandished before anyone could so much as click the headline.

MJBrutus on April 1, 2014 at 2:58 PM

In an interview with WNDtv, Sen. Paul took on the critics of so-called “amnesty” who oppose efforts to “normalize” illegal immigrants and absorb them into the United States. “Let’s get them work visas, let’s normalize them, let’s make them taxpayers,” he said of the 11 million undocumented immigrants currently residing within the states.

“They’re not going home,” Paul said, adding that even the most vocal opponents of so-called “amnesty” seem to recognize this fact. “Are they for sending these people home? Do they want us to put them in concentration camps, on buses, and send them back home? I don’t think anyone’s proposing that.”

In other words…AMNESTY! Paul is as big a supporter of amnesty as there is, and bigger than many because he basically supports open borders. He will never get my vote, and neither will anyone else who pushes for it.

xblade on April 1, 2014 at 2:40 PM

No where does that say, “give them amnesty” or more importantly it doesn’t ever give them priority to citizenship.

Tater Salad on April 1, 2014 at 3:00 PM

agenda is to change the demographics of the USA.

Freddy on April 1, 2014 at 1:32 PM

That’s right! We cannot allow our precious demographics to be changed, diluted or unpurified by this foreign filth!

/s

MJBrutus on April 1, 2014 at 3:00 PM

Uh, too late AP. The torches were lit and pitchforks brandished before anyone could so much as click the headline.

MJBrutus on April 1, 2014 at 2:58 PM

I saw this coming a mile away, Brutus. The closer we get to 2016, the more Rand is going to sound like Dear Ole Dad, if only because of the media coverage. Politics ain’t beanbag.

gryphon202 on April 1, 2014 at 3:00 PM

YES! We also need to eliminate birthright citizenship and CLOSE THE BORDERS.

KickandSwimMom on April 1, 2014 at 2:58 PM

We let in a million a year legally. As we are currently discussing they’ve on the verge of taking over the GOP. How exactly do we do anything? We may have already crossed a tipping point, to where it doesn’t matter what the natives want.

DFCtomm on April 1, 2014 at 3:01 PM

After the beating Romney took for advocating attrition through enforcement, a.k.a. “self-deportation,” in 2012,

Primarily from his own party. About 5 seconds after the elections results were in, the same consultants who lost the election started spreading this talking point that has no basis in fact whatsoever. It’s almost like it was part of a plan or something.

no Republican with national ambitions is going to defend the D-word.

And yet Obama bragged about being the great deporter? How much heat did he take for that? Let me help you…he got about 71% of the Hispanic vote. So much for that talking point.

It’s a mistake to say Latinos refuse to do it. It might seem like it at first glance because there’s a continuous wave having the first generation arrival experience but as we see from the polling data in the post, Latinos who have been here for a couple generations have basically assimilated.

alchemist19

Yep, they’re just like all the others who immigrated to this country. I guess that’s why I have to press 1 for Russian, 2 for Swahili, 3 for Italian, and 4 for German, but not 1 for Spanish, lol. Yep, it’s a well known fact you have virtually no shot of getting a job in south Florida if you can’t speak French.

xblade on April 1, 2014 at 3:01 PM

hat’s right! We cannot allow our precious demographics to be changed, diluted or unpurified by this foreign filth!

/s

MJBrutus on April 1, 2014 at 3:00 PM

I guess you love some female circumcision, speaking of which where were you and open borders on that topic?

DFCtomm on April 1, 2014 at 3:02 PM

Illinidiva,

The Latino immigrants are generally in volatile and low wage industries.

Their unemployment levels are high no matter what period of time we look at. Volatile industries do well when the economy is booming. So why aren’t Latinos more likely to more employed than whites at these times? They have higher unemployment levels across the board.

Many don’t group up in the homes with the same value of education as whites. They have to take care of parents who might not know English, help them navigate different American circumstances, take care of younger siblings, etc. They might end up as latchkey kids in bad neighborhoods.

Well, many people succeed in less than promising environments. Jews at the turn of the century came to an America which was much less welcoming than the one which Hispanics come to today. And within twenty years they were so successful that Harvard and Yale had to put up quotas to prevent them form overrunning the schools.

The fact is that Hispanics at all income levels underperform in school. If they were as hard working as you suppose them to be, that wouldn’t be the case.

Are you really advocating for giving people applying for visas IQ tests?

Did I mention an IQ test?

An education level is not an IQ test, and the US government already takes into consideration education level and career skills when evaluating legal immigrants.

I don’t want anyone with a fifth-grade education coming to America illegally and believing he has a right to be here. He doesn’t. He’s not an asset, and his descendants will not be assets.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 3:03 PM

That’s right! We cannot allow our precious demographics to be changed, diluted or unpurified by this foreign filth!

/s

MJBrutus on April 1, 2014 at 3:00 PM

Someone of low intellect and thinking skills mischaracterizes the conservative position? Say it isn’t so!

NotCoach on April 1, 2014 at 3:06 PM

Illinidiva,

I almost didn’t see this.

They actually are very religious and have intact families.

They’re religious, but then so are blacks and that fact hasn’t helped the GOP win over African-American voters.

As for intact families, Hispanics have some of the highest illegitimacy rates in the country. More than half are born out of wedlock compared to about a quarter of non-Hispanic whites.

*****

Look, it’s very simple. Hispanics have never voted for the Republican Party, and they never will. The reason is simple: They like big government. So any proposal which seeks to increase Hispanic voters ought to be a NO SALE for any small government Republican who has more concerns than just getting elected to office

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 3:10 PM

And I’m not sure why you wouldn’t think that the Latinos wouldn’t be an asset to America.

So that’s why they start breeding and get on food stamps and disabilities for their anchor babies the moment they land in a Mexican church inside the USA.

They actually are very religious and have intact families. I attend a Spanish Catholic Mass and the church is standing room only on even regular Sundays with lots of families.

Illinidiva on April 1, 2014 at 2:54 PM

So the community that prides itself on each latina under the age of 30 with 6 different fathers for 5 meal-tickets kids can’t stay as a family in their own homeland of mehico ? They can only do that in USA ?
Oh BTW, these barrio churches are more like the Mexican Jeremiah Wright ” churches”

burrata on April 1, 2014 at 3:11 PM

do you identify with any aspects of that particular character?

DanMan on April 1, 2014 at 2:38 PM

I identify with him mostly through his differences with me. I am not an engineer; I was educated as an economist. I am not an atheist.

And frankly, Ragnar Danneskjöld is just too long of a name for internet use, especially in 1993…

/iwannabeapirate

JohnGalt23 on April 1, 2014 at 3:12 PM

I’m saying it because Mexican immigrants don’t achieve American levels of income and education even after five generations in the U.S. (Source: Generations of Exclusion: Mexican Americans, Assimilation, and Race)

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 2:32 PM

Even highly educated Americans vote for the Left. Hell, even Wall Street kicks money over to the Democrats and signs on to their social and economic agenda.

THE LEFT RULES THE WORLD.

It doesn’t matter where the immigrants come from so long as the Ruling Left controls the commanding heights. Everyone — from the smart to the not-so-smart — are assimilated into the reigning ideology.

Those who resist the Ruling Left become lower status and are mocked by the ruling institutions (Evangelical Christians, Southerners, Fly-Over Country, rural people, GOP-supporting minorities, etc.)

And those who resist do not reap the rewards, land the cushy job, a spot at the prestigious university, the Oscar, the Nobel Prize, etc. etc. etc.

Punchenko on April 1, 2014 at 3:12 PM

Brutus is an idiot.

That’s right! We cannot allow our precious demographics to be changed, diluted or unpurified by this foreign filth!

We’re long past that point. We’re now at the point where the nation is heading on the fast track towards California – a political entity which requires massive state intervention to manage a set of peoples who don’t otherwise adhere.

Pincher Martin on April 1, 2014 at 3:14 PM

Secure the Borders! Enforce the Law

workingclass artist on April 1, 2014 at 3:14 PM

One strategy to deal with immigration, although a risky one, would be to play up legal immigration from Asia, mostly from China, as a counter to amnesty to illegals who are mostly Hispanics.

Although Asians did support Obama in the last election, their own self-interests will be in the long term better suited for the GOP. Why? Money and education. Right now Asians on average earn more than whites in America. Leftist policies hurt people trying to move up the social ladder, those that want to set up a business, and those that succeed.

See the fight occurring right now over affirmative action in California. Asians don’t want affirmative action because they are overrepresented in colleges / universities in California and will be hurt for simply being successful in raising their children. However Hispanics and African-Americans are continuing to push for it, despite the Democrat party temporarily dropping it.

This fight over affirmative action is just the beginning. Asians are also overrepresented in the Tech industry, where crazy leftist in San Francisco are now targeting with threats and even violence in some cases.

Selfishness has been used by Dems to target poorer minorities and minorities who are susceptible to that message. Conservatives, over time, should have the same advantage with Asian-Americans. So by supporting more immigration from Asia, mostly Chinese, we could change the dynamic in California by setting the stage for political upheaval in the Democrat Party. The Chinese do not come to this country to live in crime ridden drug infested places like Mexico or Chicago.

The simple fact is the Democrat Party in places like California cannot continue to exist as it is. It is too big and has too many competing interests to survive. The more Asians that arrive, the more they will dilute the power of Hispanics.

William Eaton on April 1, 2014 at 3:14 PM

No where does that say, “give them amnesty” or more importantly it doesn’t ever give them priority to citizenship.

Tater Salad

So, if my neighbor says he repeatedly had sex with the little girl down the street against her will, I guess he didn’t really rape her because he didn’t say “I raped her”, lol.

Sheesh, the depths of denial you amnesty shills will go to is amazing. Newsflash genius…letting them stay here and giving them work permits that allow them to come and go and move around the country just like everyone else IS amnesty. Giving them a pass on multiple crimes that were committed while here illegally that everyone else in the country would have to pay for if they commit them IS amnesty.

I guess denial ain’t just a river in Egypt after all, lol.

And here’s another newsflash….Who gives a sh*t about citizenship? They don’t need it to influence the political winds in this country. Hell, they’re doing it now and they aren’t even legal, lol.

But you keep pretending good old Rand doesn’t support amnesty. But that’s all it will be….pretend.

xblade on April 1, 2014 at 3:15 PM

If we can’t agree on deporting criminals, screw this guy.

BuckeyeSam on April 1, 2014 at 1:24 PM

Listen if you have a plan on how to deport every single person who is not here legally, please share it. Other wise let sane people come to a solution ok.

coolrepublica on April 1, 2014 at 1:31 PM

Bingo. Thank you, Coolrepublica, for this piece of common sense. The right needs to get over the whole deportation fantasy. We simply do not have the money or manpower to find, hold awaiting transport, and deport the millions of people who are here illegally. It cannot be done. Federal and state budgets are already broke. Also, since leftists have managed to give social approval to the murder of over 50 million future potential taxpayers, we need more than ever the tax revenue that illegals are currently not paying.

But, there is NO excuse for not closing the border. There’s no excuse for not enforcing other things, such as voter ID, proof of citizenship to get government handouts, and keeping very close tabs on any future work permit program. I also think any illegal law enforcement happens to find who has a prior criminal record should be deported immediately. If we could just do those things, I think it would be enough to stem the tide and turn the immigration problem around.

idalily on April 1, 2014 at 3:17 PM

Simply because the political class finds enforcement of the law inconvenient, they ask that we, the citizens of this nation, blandly agree to forfeit the rule of law.

I will never forfeit the rule of law.

The myth that this nation cannot move to enforce the law must be exposed.

To claim that this nation cannot secure its borders, cannot expel those who have come to this nation or remained in this nation illegally… is to suggest that the nation is up for grabs from any group of people who decide to claim it as their own.

Why, then, do we still even attempt to maintain the pretense of sovereignty?

12 million people in this nation illegally is an invading army.

That this has been allowed to happen, particularly with an average of 4.5 million people waiting in line per year around the world to come to this nation legally, is shameful and criminal.

To ask the American citizenry to cater to these predatory parasites is despicable and cowardly.

Our political class demonstrates that they care more about their personal careers than they do about this nation and its citizens and legal immigrants in this shameless display of pandering.

Throw the bums out. All of them. And elect some true public servants who value the rule of law and citizenship.

thatsafactjack on April 1, 2014 at 3:18 PM

We have ALWAYS been “beyond deportation” of the 10-12 million illegals already here. It was never a practical possibility, and only idiots thought it was.

There are roughly 3 million custodial arrests in the US every year by all levels of law enforcement combined. City police, county deputies, state troopers, FBI, Secret Service, Treasury, ICE, Parks Police, etc. So to arrest all 12 million illegals would entail a huge increase in police forces, a huge building program even for temporary custody, and to find them, an internal ID checking system.

“Papers, please.” It would take a police state.

~~~

So the real issue is and has been how to deal with them, weed out the career criminals and professional parasites, get the honest workers off the black market and on the tax rolls, and do all that without giving a huge incentive for more illegal entry.

It won’t be easy, and it really can’t be done in some big “omnibus” bill. And it will have to start with enforcement. Border enforcement is an important part, but not so much as people think. Most illegals enter legally and overstay their visas, work, student, and tourist.

We need visa tracking – which other countries manage to do – and to implement the e-Verify employment system to eliminate the use of falsified ID. It works and has been proven, and could be implemented nationally in less than 18 months.

We could pass those first, and then deal with the issue of those here illegally. No need to do it all at once, which has been tried twice before and failed both times.

Adjoran on April 1, 2014 at 3:18 PM

Adjoran on April 1, 2014 at 3:18 PM

+1

MJBrutus on April 1, 2014 at 3:20 PM

Schadenfreude

Bmore on April 1, 2014 at 3:21 PM

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