Three terrible stories from the week in protecting and serving

posted at 10:01 pm on February 19, 2014 by Mary Katharine Ham

Good for Brandy Berning, a single mom pulled over for driving in an HOV lane, for recording this incident and for sticking up for herself. After the officer got in her car, tried to steal her phone, assaulted her, arrested her, and put her in jail for a night, all charges were dropped.

In the next story, a young man in San Francisco called 911 for two people he came across in the wake of a bike accident. He was told by the dispatcher to await police and ambulance, and when he did, he ended up arrested, in jail, and in a solitary padded cell with no clue as to when he’d be released. He and his friend were also told they couldn’t take pictures or record. It starts bad and gets worse.

Sgt. Espinoza, short, stout, grey and assertive, asked Ben and me whether we had witnessed the accident. We said that we hadn’t, but arrived shortly thereafter. I was standing 15 feet from the scene beside Officer Kaur, a stocky female of South Asian complexion. She turned to me and abruptly said that I was not needed as a witness and should leave immediately. I told her we were headed home, just across the way, when my friend and I encountered the accident; and that I’d recently broken my elbow in a similar bike accident here and deeply cared about the outcome.

The firemen were examining Rebecca and Josh. Ben was still supporting Rebecca’s back when Sgt. Espinoza and Officer Gabriel grabbed him from behind without warning, putting him in an arm lock and jerked him backwards over the pavement. They told him sternly that he had to leave now that trained medical professionals had arrived, implying that he was interfering and justifying their violent actions. The officers dragged him across the sidewalk, propping him against the building. Rebecca was still holding Ben’s cellphone when she lost his support. “Where are they taking him?” she asked perplexedly.

It all happened within 5 minutes of the police’s arrival. The sirens and emergency vehicles, the sudden arrival of over half a dozen uniformed personnel, two of whom had grabbed my friend, transformed an intimate street scene into something chaotic. Officer Kaur shouted at me to cross the street. It was very sudden and I was, admittedly, in shock. I stammered that I intended to head home, but that my friend was over there. I pointed at Ben against the wall, and said I’d like to take him home with me.

Arrested

Without warning, I was shoved from behind by Officer Gerrans and then collectively tackled by Officers Gerrans, Kaur and Andreotti. As they took me to the ground, one of the officers kneed me in the right temple. On the pavement, I begged them to watch out for my recently broken right elbow. Knees on my back and neck pinned me to the ground. I was cuffed and left face down.

I was not told that I was under arrest, what the charges were, nor read my rights. I rolled over onto my back so that I could see the arresting officers and ask them their intentions.

Officer Kaur pulled me up so that I was in a sitting position, and then stepped onto my handcuffed hands, grinding them into the pavement. I was so suddenly transported to a distant reality, that I was still coming to terms with its operating principles. “Is this protocol?” I inquired and instinctively wriggled my hands from under her boots. Officer Kaur had full control of me physically. Again, she stomped her boots on my hands, demanded that I “keep [my] hands on the ground,” pushed me back face down, and walked away.

Read the whole thing if you have time. It has a lot of liberal-mugged-by-reality vibe to it, but the reality is just the force of the state, with which so much of San Francisco is normally so enamored when it’s super-excited to use said force to exact the “good” they want to see in society. There’s a sad part where the victim of this ordeal briefly seems to castigates himself for his white upper-middle-class privilege, wondering if he should even complain about his treatment when others have received much worse. He overcomes this insecurity to tell the tale, and good for him. Because, no, the police are not supposed to be allowed to detain you in solitary confinement for days at a time just because you grew up in a spacious suburban ranch house. And, someone who grew up in a ranch house telling his story might help others who did not reside in the suburbs.

Both of these stories ended with the detained getting out of jail and going on to live their lives (and, one hopes, get some kind of apology or disciplinary action out of the police).

Not this one. Christopher Roupe, a 17-year-old ROTC member in Georgia, was shot and killed by an officer trying to find his father, who had violated probation. It’s unclear exactly what happened, but it is clear Roupe should not have been killed:

EUHARLEE, Ga. – An attorney representing the family of a 17-year-old Georgia boy who was shot and killed by a police officer says the boy was holding a video game controller when he was shot after opening his door.

Christopher Roupe was fatally shot in the chest Friday, Feb. 14 when Euharlee officers showed up at the door of his mobile home to serve a probation violation warrant for the boy’s father, WSB-TV reports. A female officer reportedly told the Georgia Bureau of Investigation that Roupe pointed a gun at her after he opened the door.

But the family’s attorney, Cole Law, said the boy was holding a Nintendo Wii video game controller, and was about to watch a movie.

“The eyewitnesses on the scene clearly state that he had a Wii controller in his hand. He heard a knock at the door. He asked who it was, there was no response so he opened the door and upon opening the door he was immediately shot in the chest,” Law told WSB.

Neighbor Ken Yates said that he saw the female officer immediately after Roupe was killed and described her as being visibly distraught.

“This is tragic,” Yates told the station. “She came out of this house. She put her head in her hands and she was sobbing. Supposedly, he opened the door with a BB gun and in my opinion I think he was playing a game with his neighborhood buddies.”

Terrible. Be careful out there, folks. Even when there’s no ill intent or misuse of power, mistakes by police happen too often and are too often deadly.


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@brokenrattle

I agree in large part, since learned and discovered quite a bit about the Code during research into and composition of my master’s thesis project, Ethics among LEOs and the levels of struggle they face. Am considering soliciting its adoption here in Florida.

KissMyAmericanFlag on February 20, 2014 at 11:34 AM

KissMyAmericanFlag on February 20, 2014 at 11:34 AM

Good, the more people know about the Code, the better.

thebrokenrattle on February 20, 2014 at 11:46 AM

Good, the more people know about the Code, the better.

thebrokenrattle on February 20, 2014 at 11:46 AM

Also agreed: Duplicity is historically
_unhealthy_.

Now soliciting potential contacts, beyond those I already spoke with state-by-state…;-)@KissMyAmFlag on Twitter.

KissMyAmericanFlag on February 20, 2014 at 12:13 PM

Reading these comments I’m not sure all those stories of people crapping on cop cars the Occupy Wall Street rallies weren’t really Hotairians just trying to make those disparaged 99%ers look bad.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 12:13 PM

pendell2 on February 20, 2014 at 10:41 AM

Your point is a good one. I would say that the reason the cops are so heavily armed and militarized is the result of the laws they are being made to enforce. Specifically, the “war on drugs,” “the war on terror,” and the “war on immigrants.” All of these wrong-headed and failed efforts have justified ever more police power, loss of privacy and escalation of force.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Your point is a good one. I would say that the reason the cops are so heavily armed and militarized is the result of the laws they are being made to enforce. Specifically, the “war on drugs,” “the war on terror,” and the “war on immigrants.” All of these wrong-headed and failed efforts have justified ever more police power, loss of privacy and escalation of force.
MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM

“War on immigrants” lol

RDE2010 on February 20, 2014 at 12:47 PM

Your point is a good one. I would say that the reason the cops are so heavily armed and militarized is the result of the laws they are being made to enforce. Specifically, the “war on drugs,” “the war on terror,” and the “war on immigrants.” All of these wrong-headed and failed efforts have justified ever more police power, loss of privacy and escalation of force.
MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM

“War on immigrants” lol

RDE2010 on February 20, 2014 at 12:47 PM

Brutus just made a great case for nullification and probably didn’t even realize it.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 12:51 PM

Reading these comments I’m not sure all those stories of people crapping on cop cars the Occupy Wall Street rallies weren’t really Hotairians just trying to make those disparaged 99%ers look bad.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 12:13 PM

That goes clear over my GFY line. GFY.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 12:52 PM

http://www.mrconservative.com/2014/02/33964-video-police-beat-man-to-death-in-front-of-family-then-steal-the-cell-phone-that-recoreded-it/

Police beat man to death in front of his family, then steal the cell phone that recoded it.

Nothing to see here, Keep moving.

Kuffar on February 20, 2014 at 12:57 PM

Reading these comments I’m not sure all those stories of people crapping on cop cars the Occupy Wall Street rallies weren’t really Hotairians just trying to make those disparaged 99%ers look bad.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 12:13 PM

That goes clear over my GFY line. GFY.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 12:52 PM

I don’t give a shit about your GFY line so why don’t you give a shit on a cop car.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 12:57 PM

“War on immigrants” lol

RDE2010 on February 20, 2014 at 12:47 PM

You are obviously unaware of the wide spread and outrageous abuses to American citizens that occur over a 100 miles from our national borders. Laugh, clown, laugh.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:58 PM

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:58 PM

Here’s just one article describing it.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:59 PM

I don’t give a shit about your GFY line so why don’t you give a shit on a cop car.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 12:57 PM

Um, GFY means I’m through attempting any form of debate with you. So kindly GFY.

You are obviously unaware of the wide spread and outrageous abuses to American citizens that occur over a 100 miles from our national borders. Laugh, clown, laugh.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:58 PM

By ICE agents? News to me. I thought you were talking about a “war on immigrants.” Now you’re talking about citizens. Ummm….?

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:00 PM

“War on immigrants” lol

RDE2010

MJBrutard knows all about being wrongheaded, lol.

xblade on February 20, 2014 at 1:01 PM

Here’s just one article describing it.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:59 PM

Oh, the humanity! ICE agents attempting to enforce the law! *GASP* Whatever will we do?!

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:01 PM

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:00 PM

The war on immigrants has produced wide scale abuse against innocent citizens. Just as the wars on drugs and terror have. Get it?

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 1:02 PM

The war on immigrants has produced wide scale abuse against innocent citizens. Just as the wars on drugs and terror have. Get it?

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 1:02 PM

Sorry dude. I’m not going to take PBS’ word for that. Anyhow, getting stopped for immigration checks is nowhere near important to me as opposed to American citizens getting shot by law enforcement over answering the door with a video game controller. Your selective outrage would be funny if it weren’t so utterly pathetic.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:04 PM

NC Cop on February 19, 2014 at 10:33 PM

I’m not one to ask anyone to stay if he doesn’t want to, but I wish you’d reconsider. Because HA doesn’t have an ignore button, I have one in my head, and when I see comments by people I find not worth the bother, I just skip over them. There are lots of sharp commenters on this site, and it’s a shame to miss out on them because others are obnoxious jackasses. Sort of the way you don’t want people to view all police officers, you know?

DrMagnolias on February 20, 2014 at 1:06 PM

Police beat man to death in front of his family, then steal the cell phone that recoded it.

Nothing to see here, Keep moving.

Kuffar

After 72 hours of silence, police chief Jerry Stillings released a statement saying he doesn’t believe his officers acted out of line and that they “subdued the suspect however they could.”

Nair wasn’t pleased with the statement and said “They do not have the license to kill, they have the license to protect,”

And let me tell you, if we don’t like your looks we will protect the f**king shit out of you…

Kuffar on February 20, 2014 at 1:07 PM

I’m not one to ask anyone to stay if he doesn’t want to, but I wish you’d reconsider. Because HA doesn’t have an ignore button, I have one in my head, and when I see comments by people I find not worth the bother, I just skip over them. There are lots of sharp commenters on this site, and it’s a shame to miss out on them because others are obnoxious jackasses. Sort of the way you don’t want people to view all police officers, you know?

DrMagnolias on February 20, 2014 at 1:06 PM

PROTIP: If your first concern in standing up for your principles is what other people will think of you, you’re doing it wrong.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:11 PM

So kindly GFY.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:00 PM

Funny that’s just what your mom said just before she got arrested.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 1:13 PM

I’m a little surprised that no one on this thread has accused me of being a MOBY yet. I guess there are too many people who feel the same way I do on this matter to dismiss me as that far fringe.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:14 PM

Be careful out there, folks.

Except that being careful doesn’t work. All the recent incidents like this one indicate that if the police have made a mistake, you’re dead.

They go to the wrong house, they don’t knock, they bust in, they see you, they shoot you. You’re in bed, they shoot you. You have no weapon, they shoot you. You have a gun in your hands while not knowing who just broke in, they shoot you.

The police shoot you and you’re dead. No matter what, if they come to your house for any reason, you’re going to dies. Soon.

Defending yourself? Doesn’t work. The police are going to keep coming at you until they shoot you and you are dead.

And there is nothing you can do about it.

chuckh on February 20, 2014 at 1:19 PM

Your point is a good one. I would say that the reason the cops are so heavily armed and militarized is the result of the laws they are being made to enforce. Specifically, the “war on drugs,” “the war on terror,” and the “war on immigrants.” All of these wrong-headed and failed efforts have justified ever more police power, loss of privacy and escalation of force.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 12:32 PM

“War on immigrants” lol

RDE2010 on February 20, 2014 at 12:47 PM

Are you kidding? Have you priced out a pair of kid gloves lately?

slickwillie2001 on February 20, 2014 at 1:32 PM

End the war on drugs! Cause Chris Roupe didn’t have to die!

/facepalm

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:38 PM

There are sadly way too many incidents such as this. I think it is wrong to make generalizations about us living in a police state and that all law enforcement are bad; there are good law enforcement officers that sometimes make bad decisions. But there are also many working in law enforcement that do not belong there. In the shift toward having government having more control over our lives, I think examples such as this are increasing. Individuals in a position of authority need to be held to a much higher standard to ensure that that authority isn’t abused. There is a tendency to give too much benefit of the doubt to law enforcement. There is also a tendency with law enforcement officers to not correctly assess the situation and use the ‘tough-guy’ approach, causing an unnecessary escalation.

The most recent example of abusive authority involves my wife’s brother in Kansas City, Missouri. He and his wife adopted a daughter out of foster care a few years ago. She came with emotional baggage that has made for many challenges. My brother-in-law and his wife are the kindest most loving parents and are better equipped to help their daughter than anyone else I can think of. After a trip to a psychiatric hospital a few weeks ago, subsequent to an episode, their daughter became angry when leaving the hospital and said she didn’t want to get into the car. A cop came over. My brother-in-law was able to coax his daughter into the car but in the process she threatened to hit her dad. The cop launched into action and against the strong protests of my brother-in-law, grabbed the then-sobbing, frightened eight year-old girl, handcuffed her and hauled her away. Other cops showed up and the parents tried to reason with them that their actions weren’t necessary and they were creating a traumatic experience for a little girl who was very vulnerable. They didn’t listen, took her away and wouldn’t let her parents visit her. It took about four days of pleading for them to release their daughter back into their custody.

Who handcuffs an eight year-old girl?

tyrex on February 20, 2014 at 1:53 PM

Who handcuffs an eight year-old girl?

tyrex on February 20, 2014 at 1:53 PM

Not a comment on your specific event, but I can think of some reasons to cuff a child.

One is to teach the child the seriousness of his/her actions. I have seen laughing children become very sober once they hear that click.

Another is for their own protection. Out of control children can and do hurt themselves and sometimes need police restraint until medical personnel show up.

A child can be out of control because of simple bad behavior or it may be medical. But regardless, the child’s welfare is obviously very important.

Having said that, I am extremely concerned with a seemingly increase of officer overreach.

davidk on February 20, 2014 at 2:04 PM

Funny that’s just what your mom said just before she got arrested.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 1:13 PM

Newbs raising the level of discourse on HotAir, one comment at a time……..

GWB on February 20, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Gryphon, your an embarrassment to all conservatives.

Dragoro on February 20, 2014 at 2:27 PM

Gryphon, your an embarrassment to all conservatives.

Dragoro on February 20, 2014 at 2:27 PM

And that chick who shot Christopher Roupe is an embarrassment to all sworn law enforcement officers. You know what the difference is? The targets of my disdain will live to see another day.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 2:30 PM

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:11 PM

How lovely of you to condescend to offer PROTIPs to the rest of us on HA. Otherwise, the site might have collapsed by now.

DrMagnolias on February 20, 2014 at 2:31 PM

Most police supervisors? Most police deapartments? Dude, you need to get over your Joe Friday fantasies. It may have been true for you, but that doesn’t mean it’s true for most police departments now.

Gryphon- I wont deny that there are bad apples in law enforcement. Just the authority that comes with the job alone attracts some unsavory, angry people. I’ve had to arrest one of my own patrolmen before, so I am not just talking about what I would do- I’m talking about what I’ve done. But my experience and my old department are not unique.

I also have a significant amount of experience with large numbers of police officers across many jurisdictions in many different states, and I stand by what I said. I doubt very seriously that you are speaking from the same breadth of experience. If you think things look bad now, you have no IDEA how bad things would be if your imaginary world where MOST police supervisors do not deal with bad cops actually existed. MOST do take action. Most do speak out. It happens every day. Just because police departments are not personally sending you an email every time it happens doesn’t mean it isn’t happening.

But yeah- there is a problem when these things happen at all. Departments need to be doing a better job of selecting and hiring officers, and monitoring them once they’re on the job. But when you attribute these incidents solely to “cops are bad” you’re no different from the people who say “Teabaggers are racist”.

guinneach on February 20, 2014 at 2:34 PM

People don’t look fondly upon police who shoot without ascertaining whether there is even a threat. Look at what happened in California when the cops shot up that vehicle with the two women delivering newspapers during the Dorner manhunt. Recommendation: no suspension, no charges. That’s egregious. There is just too much covering up of bad apples which gives all the police a poorer image.

Laddy on February 20, 2014 at 2:39 PM

Wait. I’m confused. In the first video, the woman clearly secretly recorded the conversation between her and the officer, and then snarkily told him after the fact. From what I’m seeing of Florida law, the courts have said you CAN record police but you must inform them that you are doing so before you do it. Unless the 3 sources that agree on the issue are all factually mistaken.

So, she secretly recorded the officer, then acted like, oops, I forgot to tell you I did so, then refused his direct orders? Why are we defending her again?

TheBlueSite on February 20, 2014 at 2:44 PM

Why are you having so much contact with the police as to “know” how multiple police agencies handle their complaint processes? Why are so many of your contacts with the police negative? The law of averages would preclude most people from ever having any contact with the police, much less a contact that was negative.

There’s a term for people who have so much contact with Internal Affairs that they know more about it than the officers do: “Usual suspects.”

Dukeboy01 on February 20, 2014 at 10:31 AM

LOL..it never fails. A police department sycophant will always say something ridiculous. Sorry, my job, very legal and legal job, actually puts me in a place to know how corrupt, how gang-banger like, how anti-community countless police department are.

But go for it, believe what you need to believe. You obviously need to believe cops are the good guys.

Cpt. Kirk on February 20, 2014 at 2:53 PM

Wait…I just listened to the entire recording. You CANNOT refuse to hand an officer your phone if he deems it part of evidence. You CANNOT refuse to get out of your car. You cannot do any of the stuff she does. Why record the officer in the first place? She sounds like one of those annoying people who go to reason.com 47000 times a day and look to harass police. Imagine being an officer, pulling someone over for violating a traffic law, being nice about it, no problems, then the person says- oh, I forgot to tell you I secretly started recording this conversation in a clear attempt to provoke you.

We have got to stop defending people like this. There was no reason for her to record. There was no reason for her to do it secretly. She could’ve just taken the ticket and left. Why does she now claim all sorts of abuse, yet has no evidence (convenient), scars?? Rocks embedded in her leg? Come on, this is a clear move to make a payday.

TheBlueSite on February 20, 2014 at 2:57 PM

But yeah- there is a problem when these things happen at all. Departments need to be doing a better job of selecting and hiring officers, and monitoring them once they’re on the job. But when you attribute these incidents solely to “cops are bad” you’re no different from the people who say “Teabaggers are racist”.

guinneach on February 20, 2014 at 2:34 PM

I didn’t say cops are bad. What I said was, cops will not, as a rule, speak out against each other when crimes are committed in the line of duty. And that I don’t trust cops as a matter of instinctual self-preservation. Very few cops are criminally prosecuted for anything outside of DWI or kiddie pr0n.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 3:00 PM

Do you people honestly think that the cop who shot Christopher Roupe did her department, or the policing profession in general, any favors? Or do you think that, right or wrong, she brought herself, her department, and her profession into disrepute? That is such a simple question, I don’t think I should have to wait around for an answer, but go ahead.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 3:03 PM

I also have a significant amount of experience with large numbers of police officers across many jurisdictions in many different states, and I stand by what I said. I doubt very seriously that you are speaking from the same breadth of experience. If you think things look bad now, you have no IDEA how bad things would be if your imaginary world where MOST police supervisors do not deal with bad cops actually existed. MOST do take action. Most do speak out. It happens every day. Just because police departments are not personally sending you an email every time it happens doesn’t mean it isn’t happening.

guinneach on February 20, 2014 at 2:34 PM

Hmmmm….yeah, no. You are not the only with an incredible amount of experience. I also have a significant amount of experience with large numbers of police officers across many jurisdictions in many different states. I doubt very seriously that you are speaking from the same breadth of experience. From small towns, to suburban cops to big city police department corruption is rampant across the USA in police department. The problem comes when State attorney offices aling themselves with the police corruption. Ever heard of “cops, we testilie to get the bad guys out of the street”?

Given what you have said, I doubt very much you have the experience you claim.

The thing is that things are as bad as you want to deny they are. Police departments harrassing pro-life activisits. Police department being used by politicians as their personal body guards. Police departments intimidating citizens who video and audio record their criminal activity. The problem is most watch commanders, sgts., chief’s of police believe their officers long before they believe the citizens.

and here is the kicker for you. Any and ALL policemen who enforce immoral laws are corrupt. What do they teach you in police acadamy? Policemen are not there to judge the law. You are there to execute the law. It is sad what I have seen, cops enforcing laws they will admit are immoral. Talk about a lack of backbone and morality.

Corruption is rampant in most aspects of today’s world, but it is amazing how pro-policemen individuals love to claim somehow this corruption isn’t found in police departments.

Cpt. Kirk on February 20, 2014 at 3:04 PM

I didn’t say cops are bad. What I said was, cops will not, as a rule, speak out against each other when crimes are committed in the line of duty. And that I don’t trust cops as a matter of instinctual self-preservation. Very few cops are criminally prosecuted for anything outside of DWI or kiddie pr0n.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 3:00 PM

Yeap, exactly. The vast majority of cops will never speak out againt one of their own.

A few years back internal affairs in Chicago found in all the computers, only accesible to policemen, in ALL police stations, child pornography. Not only was this kept from major news outlets. the only thing the city and the chief of police did is install computer programs, which asked for a login username and password. The state attorney’s office never became involved.

Police will rarely go after cops who carry out criminal activities.

Cpt. Kirk on February 20, 2014 at 3:09 PM

Funny that’s just what your mom said just before she got arrested.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 1:13 PM

A “your mom” joke? My God, I’m embarrassed for you.

cptacek on February 20, 2014 at 3:34 PM

We have got to stop defending people like this. There was no reason for her to record. There was no reason for her to do it secretly. She could’ve just taken the ticket and left. Why does she now claim all sorts of abuse, yet has no evidence (convenient), scars?? Rocks embedded in her leg? Come on, this is a clear move to make a payday.

TheBlueSite on February 20, 2014 at 2:57 PM

Why not record it? Maybe the reason she recorded it was just in case something happened. If something happens, you can’t go “oops, I forgot to push record. Can we recreate it?”

cptacek on February 20, 2014 at 3:35 PM

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:14 PM

Let me explain. You are most certainly out on the whacko fringe. Make no mistakes on that score. It just so happens that you are keeping company with a large number, if not a majority of those at H/A.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 3:42 PM

The internet has made reporting and learning of these atrocities carried out by cops against citizens more easy to find. In almost every case the cop thug is found to have operated within department procedure and nothing ever happens to them. What should happen in many cases is that they be charged with assault and attempted murder or murder and be prosecuted as any regular citizen would be.

It doesn’t happen though and now that these stories are so common, when a cop gets shot or killed, I automatically think it was probably self defense. Cops are not your friend. Cops routinely lie to get prosecutions and cover their butts. Cops are not here to “serve and protect”. Cops are criminally involved in every type of crime we have from murder to things like stealing weapons, money and drugs from the property rooms to resell,to blackmail. Cops have no incentive to stop crime because it is job security for them. Cops commit about half the violent crime in this country, but it almost never gets reported as the crime it is, but rather “police procedure”.

Most cops are just thugs with a badge and it isn’t changing anytime soon. And if they’d like to prove any of this wrong they need to clean up their act.

earlgrey on February 20, 2014 at 4:36 PM

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 1:14 PM

Let me explain. You are most certainly out on the whacko fringe. Make no mistakes on that score. It just so happens that you are keeping company with a large number, if not a majority of those at H/A.

MJBrutus on February 20, 2014 at 3:42 PM

Heh. “You are most certainly out on the whack fringe…[with]…a majority of those at H/A.” Someone left the irony on.

gryphon202 on February 20, 2014 at 4:38 PM

Newbs raising the level of discourse on HotAir, one comment at a time……..

GWB on February 20, 2014 at 2:21 PM

First off I’ve had an account on here since 08. I just happen to have a job and a life and don’t spend all day bantering with anonymous strangers.
Secondly I made one comment and Gryphon told me to “Go eff myself” but I’m sure you found that profound and intellectually enlightening. Thank goodness there are Newbs on here though,you old hacks are tiresome.

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 4:41 PM

MEOW

Meow on February 20, 2014 at 4:43 PM

Bluesite’s opinion:

“You CANNOT refuse to hand an officer your phone if he deems it part of evidence. You CANNOT refuse to get out of your car. You cannot do any of the stuff she does. Why record the officer in the first place? She sounds like one of those annoying people who go to reason.com 47000 times a day and look to harass police. Imagine being an officer, pulling someone over for violating a traffic law, being nice about it, no problems, then the person says- oh, I forgot to tell you I secretly started recording this conversation in a clear attempt to provoke you.”

Bluesite is wrong on a number of points. First, the police have been trained, and allowed far too long to operate as though they were acting within a war zone. They do not. They work on our streets, under the authority we allow them. That is the agreement and the contract in a civilized society. They have authority over us, as long as they obey the law and the rules.

I spent over a generation in police work. I and many other officers fought against the militarization and the “us vs Them” mentality taught the police in today’s forces across the nation. They are just human and revert to their training under stress. They think they own the area- as they are taught to believe this. In this case, citizens will provoke the police- if they do it legally, the police must realize they cannot act illegally. We are supposed to be better than the idiot pushing our buttons. Also, the police cannot seize anything they want when they want it- we have things called subpoenas and warrants to legally seize property from citizens. If there was video the police wanted, they could review it, ask the citizen to forward it to them or get a warrant for the video.

Cops are dumb when it comes to things like “You cannot video tape us when we are doing our job.” Foolish position constantly thrown out by judges. It would be like a politician making a public speech in a public area and not wanting video of it. Sorry pal- it comes with the territory.

As for getting out of the car…well yes and no. If the officer can articulate the person needs to exit the vehicle for safety or investigative purposes he can order it. But he cannot order people to move- against their will- without cause. That is one of the first rules police forget. The Supreme Court has ruled a police “street contact” is consensual on the part of the citizen. If the police walk up and say “What’s your name?” and you have done nothing and in a lawful area you can say “No disrespect but I do not want to talk to you.” You can walk away and they can’t stop you.

They work for us, not us for them. They forget that- especially at the federal level where accountability and penalty for bad acts are non-existent.

archer52 on February 20, 2014 at 5:20 PM

Corrupt Cops are the worst violators of the public trust in any country. More so than politicians.

TX-96 on February 20, 2014 at 5:20 PM

Dial 911 and die. The police are not your friends. They are not your family pet’s friends.

It’s time to start responding to no-knock raids with shotgun blasts.

SirGawain on February 20, 2014 at 5:22 PM

Wait…I just listened to the entire recording. You CANNOT refuse to hand an officer your phone if he deems it part of evidence. You CANNOT refuse to get out of your car. You cannot do any of the stuff she does. Why record the officer in the first place? She sounds like one of those annoying people who go to reason.com 47000 times a day and look to harass police. Imagine being an officer, pulling someone over for violating a traffic law, being nice about it, no problems, then the person says- oh, I forgot to tell you I secretly started recording this conversation in a clear attempt to provoke you.

We have got to stop defending people like this. There was no reason for her to record. There was no reason for her to do it secretly. She could’ve just taken the ticket and left. Why does she now claim all sorts of abuse, yet has no evidence (convenient), scars?? Rocks embedded in her leg? Come on, this is a clear move to make a payday.

Actually you can refuse to do those things. If you refuse an officer and he turns out to be one of those abusive bad apples that some folks here think are prevalent, then you’ll probably get your payday.

But all that being said, cops need to have a thick skin. Much thicker than your average Joe. Because citizens are going to be assholes to you every day. The uniform makes you a target for that crap but the response you need to have is a smile and a nod and that’s it. Too many guys and some gals dont consider that they are going to have their buttons pushed every day when they think of how cool it might be to be a cop. If you dont think you can handle that without pushing someone around, or twisting the interpretation of a law so that you can arrest someone who pissed you off, then you had better stay away from law enforcement.

I used to have to do extra duty at an abortion mill in Charleston, SC. Im not religious but I am definitely pro-life. There was a certain family- VERY religious and very outspoken who used to protest at this clinic on weekends. The powers that be put us there to make sure that these folks werent blocking access to the clinic, and that their signs werent blocking rights of way. The guy who was the patriarch of this family was an extremely obnoxious guy who carried a video camera around and if you came close he would try to push your buttons… put the cam right in your face, remind you over and over that he would own you and your house and car if you violated his right to be there in any way. It was maddening to me- on the issue of abortion I actually agreed with the guy although we certainly arrived at our opposition to abortion in different ways. I not only had to take his abuse and keep a straight face, but I had to provide protection to people who I basically consider to be morally bankrupt. The moral of this story is that it is immaterial whether the person is trying to set you off or not. You arent being paid to let your emotions control your actions. And you are going to have to serve people you might abhor. THAT’S the job. Every day. I dont regret a single day of the many years I did it, but I had to get out because I’d probably be dead of a stroke today if I had stayed.

guinneach on February 20, 2014 at 5:35 PM

Notice how a disproportionate amount of police state abuse comes from female and minority officers? Affirmative action is not good for freedom for many reasons.

Related: Maybe they needed to meet their quota for white arrests in order to keep Holder at bay?

Spartacus on February 20, 2014 at 9:25 PM

There are two very good articles related to this topic on the following site. This type of behavior is more the norm than the exception by LEOs today.

usarmyretired on February 22, 2014 at 8:41 AM

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