Video: Who’s up for a two-and-half-hour debate on evolution versus creationism featuring Bill Nye, the Science Guy?

posted at 11:21 am on February 5, 2014 by Allahpundit

Judging by the interest this subject draws in the comments on our site and elsewhere online (more than 500,000 people watched the live feed last night), you guys definitely are, notwithstanding the shining truth of USA Today’s headline. (The futility of debate was acknowledged at the debate itself.) Sample exchange:

Moderator Tom Foreman of CNN had a list of audience-submitted questions directed at either Nye or Ham, with the other given a chance to respond. When asked about what existed before the Big Bang, Nye began his answer with “I don’t know.”

“This is the great mystery—you’ve hit the nail on the head,” he replied passionately. “What was before the Big Bang? This is what drives us, this is what we want to know. Let’s keep looking, let’s keep searching.”

For Ham, the answer is simple. “There’s a book out there that tells us where matter came from,” he explained. “It’s the only thing that makes logical sense.”

Partly because it’s futile, some scientists are irritated with Nye for showing up. He says he did it because creationism is a political fact of life in most of America that won’t go away by ignoring it, but his critics think the debate is the equivalent of teaching both theories in school. Even if the teacher offers no judgment on which is correct, the fact that they’re treated as equally respectable is a win for creationists.

I didn’t have time to watch but NBC has a nice recap — evidently, “observational science” versus “historical science” was a key point for Ken Ham — and Time magazine has a nearly minute-by-minute blow by blow. Ham isn’t just a believer in creationism, he’s the founder of Kentucky’s Creation Museum, where the debate was held. He’s also a young-Earth creationist, which makes some of the exchanges about evidence extra zesty. Three clips for you here, two of them snippets and the third the whole shebang in case you’ve got the time and interest. Enjoy.




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Panther, how come you defend the ultra-religious muzzies? You, the UN, and all your hypocritical cohort? How come you are so selective in hating the religious?

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:04 PM

The Hotair Huckabee clan starts the calendar 6,000 years ago and wonders why people give them zero credibility.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 11:55 AM

No one wonders why you’re a laughingstock.

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:05 PM

Unintended Bishops are simply the best!

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:05 PM

Bill Nye The “Science” Guy

FACTS:
1. Nye has NO DEGREES IN SCIENCE – NONE, NADA, ZIP, ZILCH, ZERO !!!!!!
…in other words: HE’S A FRAUD.
2. He’s a lunatic-leftist who IGNORES REAL SCIENCE to promote the leftist-ideology of the GloBULL Warming HOAX !

TeaPartyNation on February 5, 2014 at 11:55 AM

While I agree with your basic premise of Nye pushing an agenda, he does have a Bachelor of Science degree in Mechanical Engineering. And, yes, mechanical engineering is considered a science. Hence the Bachelor of Science degree.

Shump on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

Unless you’re a hardcore creationist of the 6000 year old earth variety, there’s no reason to deny the possibility that evolution is the method God used to create everything. If God exists and is truly timeless, millions of earth years are nothing to him.
The existence of God, or lack thereof, cannot be proven or disproven.

Yep.

And I also don’t believe a book written over 1000 years ago by men who had very limited understanding of everything around them has all the answers – in literal form. So I don’t buy the creationist theories either.

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 11:56 AM

It’s actually worse than that. Even the various people who wrote and edited what eventually got compiled into “the Bible” didn’t intend it to be taken as literal history in any sense that we use today. It’s just such a feeble and limited way to approach an incredibly rich document.

And for the record, I think Nye is a dweeb.

peski on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

You want to gloss over the major problem with the foundation of your argument, and you accuse us of over-simplification?

crrr6 on February 5, 2014 at 11:53 AM

Well, you leave out many important parts of a very complex process of evolution that takes millions of years to occur in order to over-simplify to try to deny the facts and valid points of it. And yet you claim evolution is completely wrong because everything we need to know was written in the Bible over 1000 years ago – God did it, period, end of story.
Yes – you are over-simplifying.

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

I happened to be off work today so I got to watch some of it this morning on youtube.

Ham tried to keep the discussion to science while Bill Nye just made accusations and mocked the Bible.

Also.. Bill Nye said one thing so stupid.. that nature works from the bottom up. That “good design eats up” bad design. He used the example that when you find a watch you assume it had a designer and builder. But then he said “nature doesn’t work that way.” It’s not “top down but bottom up.” In other words.. just because you look at a watch and realize it had a designer and builder doesn’t mean nature works like that. When you look at nature and see good design.. that’s because all the bad design was “eaten up” by the good design.

OK.. now think for a moment. This is an example of someone throwing words out into the air hoping it all makes sense to the one who hears it just because he said it.

First.. what he’s saying is order comes from chaos. Second.. he’s saying that the watch and it’s builders/designers are somehow outside of nature. So there’s this universe and set of laws around man but there’s this different universe and set of laws in nature.

Why? Because he said so. That’s really the sum of everything he said. “Because he said so.”

JellyToast on February 5, 2014 at 11:50 AM

The good vs bad design argument also misses the biggest point: complexity.

Just take DNA. It’s so complex and contains so much information and does so much that if you want to claim that it spontaneously arose from random chemical reactions it seems preposterous.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

why people give them zero credibility.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 11:55 AM

Your fascist socialist master doesn’t call them “people”. Get with the program, sheep. They are the “folks”.

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

It’s one thing to argue intelligent design by God as Creator, it’s another thing to say it happened just a few thousand years ago.

JetBoy on February 5, 2014 at 11:52 AM

I agree with that. Of all the choices to pick for a debate with an evolutionist, why a young earther? Why? That said, why is any creationist debating an evolutionist? Whats the connection? Why not a debate between a carpenter and a global warmer? You might be able to see a “connection” between the two, i.e. a carpenter might have to “evolve” because of changing housing needs…but carpentery and global warming are separate topics.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

Your fascist socialist master doesn’t call them “people”. Get with the program, sheep. They are the “folks”.

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

Workers. We’re called workers!

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:08 PM

I managed to stomach the whole thing, mainly because they were showing it at my church, and it was nice to be around people of “probably” like mind. So I am sure the actual number of people who watched it was even larger.

On my Twitter account, I wrote (non-Twittercondensed version)- “At the creation debate, I saw one man trusting man, and one man trusting God. Being that man is inherently sinful and untrustworthy, which one do you think seemed more at peace?”

And it was true. Bill Nye LOOKED like he was trusting in man’s world for the answers, at times like he was desperate. Likewise, Ken Ham LOOKED like he was trusting in God for his answers, so for the most part he looked calm.

You should see the mocking of Ken Ham and Christians in general on Twitter, BTW. Just put in #creationdebate and you will see what I mean.
Romans 1 could not be more true:

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

Sterling Holobyte on February 5, 2014 at 12:08 PM

The socon cult should really get out of politics and stay inside their churches…where they belong. Fairy tales belong in books.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 11:51 AM

You don’t get out much, do you? You seem to be conflating social conservatives with fundamentalist Christians. Not the same thing.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2014 at 12:09 PM

cschande and HA vaults will tell you, galore, that we are NOT Huckabee-lovers. Don’t lie, Panther.

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:09 PM

Workers. We’re called workers!

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:08 PM

NO, you are the “folks”. See how often obama said that in the O’Reilly fiasco (for both).

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:09 PM

Every atheist is that way. it’s part of their religion.

jetch on February 5, 2014 at 11:44 AM

I’ll bite…

Much in the manner that liberals will make fun of a conservative who is either gay or who is rumored to be gay while ignoring the (by today’s definition) inherent homophobia in their statement, so too does the religious mock the atheist and then calls atheism a religion, as though cutting off the nose to spite the face is, in fact, a clever put-down.

If the only atheists you know are those you see on television or taught your zoology course in college, you don’t really know anything about atheists or atheism, which is fine, but making sweeping statements about people who don’t believe the same limited, sketchy, contradiction-riddled thing as you is something lazy people do. American SoCons have no interest in how the Earth was formed – they have everything they need in those first couple dozen verses from Genesis that were copypasta’d in this section earlier. Why debate the matter? In your eyes, you’ve already won, so what are you trying to prove?

Most atheists don’t argue this stuff because it’s Russell’s Teapot and nothing more.

King B on February 5, 2014 at 12:10 PM

Debate I’d rather watch – but will never happen:

Michal Mann/Nye vs Richard Lindzen regarding “anthropomorphic climate change”.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:10 PM

The socon cult should really get out of politics…

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 11:51 AM

But this should stay in?

How stupid are you, really?

You leftists are never truly liberal or progressive, never. You are always dictatorial fascist thugs.

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:11 PM

It’s quite simple: Science is limited in what it can measure(thus prove or disprove) to the spatial temporal world-this it can not prove or disprove God in anyway.
Nye is an imposter and heretic to science if he tries.

Don L on February 5, 2014 at 12:12 PM

The debate is based on a false premise, namely, that science, even evolution, is incompatible with a creator.

So called “intelligent design” will never be a valid scientific theory. It is a valid philosophical stance, and it should be taught as that.

I watched parts of the debate. There was a great deal of nonsense spewed by both sides.

If you want to know what “science” is, take one of the numerous physics classes from the top American universities that are available theses days online. There is a great deal of math and experimentation involved which is not everybody’s taste.

If you want to know reasons why “intelligent design” is a plausible philosophical stance, take a similar class from the theology or philosophy departments at the same universities.

I don’t get what’s the great deal about this nonsense, really.

p_incorrect on February 5, 2014 at 12:13 PM

Note how courageous Panther is.

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:13 PM

Very funny, anyone who doesn’t subscribe to the socon “infancy” of earth is a socialist. Another reason socons are a huge albatross around the neck of personal liberty. The “any true Scotsman” argument fails on some many levels.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:13 PM

If you believe that man has the intellectual capacity to discover or fully comprehend the whole truth about matter and the universe more than say a dog has the capacity to understand the theory of relativity, then you will probably be an atheist no matter what.

However, if there is science out there that is beyond the comprehension of mankind such such that our tools and axioms are useless, are we still talking about science or religion?

crrr6 on February 5, 2014 at 11:48 AM

But you’re bringing more philisophical things into it. Atheists, and especially anti-theist love to talk science. My example brings strict undeniable science into it showing that an ID is indeed possible.

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:14 PM

Bill Nye was an embarrassing buffoon on stage last night. Ham was eloquent with brilliant point. Nye was flummoxed throwing everything he had at Ham hoping something, anything would stick.

Ham was at ease and confident in his answers, while Nye was lost, frightened and confused.

We now know why Darwinists refuse to debate creationists….they are scared of a clock cleaning.

Pablo Honey on February 5, 2014 at 12:15 PM

NO, you are the “folks”. See how often obama said that in the O’Reilly fiasco (for both).

Schadenfreude on February 5, 2014 at 12:09 PM

I think Obama spell’s that ‘volks’.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:15 PM

Michal Mann/Nye vs Richard Lindzen regarding “anthropomorphic climate change”.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:10 PM

Yes! That’s one I would love to see.

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:15 PM

Money quote!

Question: What, if anything, would ever change your mind?

Ken Ham: “Well, the answer to that question is, I’m a Christian … No, no one is ever going to convince me that the world of god is not true.”

Bill Nye: “We would need just one piece of evidence … Bring on any of those things and you would change me immediately.”

ZachV on February 5, 2014 at 11:45 AM

Except of course the existence of God isn’t really answerable by science.
And you could easily interpret much that science has discovered as evidence pointing to the existence of a God who designed everything.

It’s a poor scientist who pretends otherwise.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 11:59 AM

It gives away the game. I don’t think Ham realized this, but it came down to an exercise in saying that Creationism only makes sense if you are specific type of Christian. In other words, how evolution makes sense to everyone regardless of their religious beliefs, or even in spite of them, but Creationism/ID only makes sense to a tiny portion of the world’s population.

What will change your mind?
Ham: Nothing.
Nye: Evidence.

It’s such a perfect quote.

ZachV on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

Funny watching socon reaction to actual facts. Turn you water into wine and then walk on it. Tough act but people with a 4-year-old mentality believe it is possible.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 11:48 AM

YOu know those computer programs where the CREATOR is able to change one thing into another, even though the actual physics of the program does not allow the CREATION in said program to do such a thing? Adults believe that such things exist but apparently you don’t.

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

“Nye, Nye, Nyey, goo, goo,,!

CO2 is a plant food.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

I think Obama spell’s that ‘volks’.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:15 PM

Yup, as in “ein volken, ein reich, ein fuhrer!!!”

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

Even if the teacher offers no judgment on which is correct, the fact that they’re treated as equally respectable is a win for creationists.

That’s right. We can’t have anyone questioning the state’s established religion.

besser tot als rot on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

The good vs bad design argument also misses the biggest point: complexity.

Just take DNA. It’s so complex and contains so much information and does so much that if you want to claim that it spontaneously arose from random chemical reactions it seems preposterous.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

And yet attributing the complexity of DNA to a magical god that didn’t require creation himself isn’t.

Ironically Christians feel we are more sophisticated than their own god seems to be.

mazer9 on February 5, 2014 at 12:18 PM

Michal Mann/Nye vs Richard Lindzen regarding “anthropomorphic climate change”.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:10 PM

This is the closest thing you are going to get

p_incorrect on February 5, 2014 at 12:18 PM

For some reason the link got lost, so here it comes http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9Sh1B-rV60

p_incorrect on February 5, 2014 at 12:19 PM

When you look at nature and see good design.. that’s because all the bad design was “eaten up” by the good design.

JellyToast on February 5, 2014 at 11:50 AM

So where are all the remnants of all those bad designs? Seems like they should outnumber the “good” designs. At the very least some should be laying around somewhere.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:19 PM

Ms. Garrison: All right, kids, it is now my job to teach you the theory of evolution.

Butters: Oh boy!

Ms. Garrison: Now I, for one, think evolution is a bunch of *bullcrap*! But I’ve been told I have to teach it to you anyway. It was thought up by Charles Darwin and it goes something like this…

[she goes up to a large poster of evolution and begins pointing things out with her pointer]

Ms. Garrison: In the beginning, we were all fish. Okay? Swimming around in the water. And then one day a couple of fish had a retard baby, and the retard baby was different, so it got to live. So Retard Fish goes on to make more retard babies, and then one day, a retard baby fish crawled out of the ocean with its…

[she waves her left hand limply]

Ms. Garrison: …mutant fish hands… and it had butt sex with a squirrel or something and made this.

[she points to a prehistoric mammal rodent]

Ms. Garrison: Retard frog-sqirrel, and then *that* had a retard baby which was a… monkey-fish-frog… And then this monkey-fish-frog had butt sex with that monkey, and that monkey had a mutant retard baby that screwed another monkey… and that made you!

[she faces the class, with the new girl among them looking around]

Ms. Garrison: So there you go! You’re the retarded offspring of five monkeys having butt sex with a fish-squirrel! Congratulations!

I tend to think, except for the 6k yr old issue, the 2 camps are not really far apart.whatever.

dmacleo on February 5, 2014 at 12:20 PM

Socons really twist themselves into pretzels defending “young earth” doctrine. Truly a cult.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:20 PM

While I agree with your basic premise of Nye pushing an agenda, he does have a Bachelor of Science degree in Mechanical Engineering. And, yes, mechanical engineering is considered a science. Hence the Bachelor of Science degree.

Shump on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

A BS degree may be technical but it is hardly a course of study that makes one an expert on creationism or global warming (you have to go to Harvard and become a VP for that). Nye’s agenda is not grounded in real science.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2014 at 12:21 PM

Very funny, anyone who doesn’t subscribe to the socon “infancy” of earth is a socialist. Another reason socons are a huge albatross around the neck of personal liberty.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:13 PM

Asinine. Do you spend your time just making up the most outlandish strawmen possible?

besser tot als rot on February 5, 2014 at 12:21 PM

Bill Nye thinks a monkey gave birth to the first humans and then mocks Ham for believing Noahs Ark.

I have yet to see any monkeys give birth to humans…the Ark on the other hand is evidenced in the Bible.

Who exactly is the one who believes in fairy tales again?

Pablo Honey on February 5, 2014 at 11:56 AM

Most of us already know this but PABLO HONEY IS AN ATHEIST POSING AS A CHRISTIAN IN THIS THREAD!!

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:22 PM

An excellent book is Francis S. Collins, The Language of God: A Scientist Presents Evidence for Belief,” 2006.

Collins is a committed Christian who headed the human genome project. Denying evolution is not something he has any sympathy for, and he explains why by surveying what biology knows about these matters. Creationism is both ignorant and destructive of religion. The evidence for evolution is simply overwhelming in its consistency and variety, and evolution is the foundational theory of modern biology for good reasons.

The Bible is a book of faith, not a book of science, and to treat it as the latter is to make it a mockery. There is no good reason whatever for this conflict, other than self-promotion by a few publicity-hungry individuals.

With “friends” like the creationist crowd, religion needs no enemies. Creationism is a bogus ideology that rests of ignorance and deception, and the damage it does is done to religion.

Byron on February 5, 2014 at 12:22 PM

Socons really twist themselves into pretzels defending “young earth” doctrine. Truly a cult.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:20 PM

Really?? Can you provide some names of the socons defending “young earth”? Just name of few of the ones you used as data points to arrive at your conclusion.
Thanks in advance.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:23 PM

Very funny, anyone who doesn’t subscribe to the socon “infancy” of earth is a socialist. Another reason socons are a huge albatross around the neck of personal liberty. The “any true Scotsman” argument fails on some many levels.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:13 PM

Yes – but, you are also coming across as lumping everyone to your right together as “all socons” and and stereotyping ALL of them.

For the record – I’m a politically conservative, constitutional, gun-toting, pro-evolution, anti-AGW, atheist (who celebrates Christmas) who believes we just don’t have all the answers – either in our current level of science knowledge or in the Bible.

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

Most of us already know this but PABLO HONEY IS AN ATHEIST POSING AS A CHRISTIAN IN THIS THREAD!!

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:22 PM

Pablo is one of the dumbest posters on Hot Air…nothing of interest to say…ever.

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

Creationists start from the point of view that the Bible is the Word of God and therefore science will not contradict anything It states.

Intelligent Design starts with the point of view that when they see something that looks design it probably has a designer. Some ID scientists are atheists.

Most evolutionists are atheists. Any hint of the metaphysical is anathema.

************************

I my opinion, theistic evolution is an oxymoron.

davidk on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

Asinine. Do you spend your time just making up the most outlandish strawmen possible?

besser tot als rot on February 5, 2014 at 12:21 PM

Are you saying the earth is over 6,000 years old? Heresy!!!

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

Most of us already know this but PABLO HONEY IS AN ATHEIST POSING AS A CHRISTIAN IN THIS THREAD!!

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:22 PM

Good alert, if anyone’s still reading this. :)

22044 on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

You know who really won yesterday? Bill Nye. Were it not for him making an ass of himself in that “debate” nobody would be talking about him today.

Happy Nomad on February 5, 2014 at 12:25 PM

Socons really twist themselves into pretzels defending “young earth” doctrine. Truly a cult.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:20 PM

Poor little bigot. You never did tell us why you got booted out of the military? Drugs or your bigotry?

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:25 PM

So where are all the remnants of all those bad designs? Seems like they should outnumber the “good” designs. At the very least some should be laying around somewhere.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:19 PM

There’s lots of them.
Haven’t you heard Bill Engvall’s description of the dork fish?

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:26 PM

…why is any creationist debating an evolutionist? Whats the connection? Why not a debate between a carpenter and a global warmer? You might be able to see a “connection” between the two, i.e. a carpenter might have to “evolve” because of changing housing needs…but carpentery and global warming are separate topics.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

Because people love a good train-wreck.

JetBoy on February 5, 2014 at 12:26 PM

If evolution was so great, why is the world in such a mess?

JellyToast on February 5, 2014 at 12:26 PM

Yes – but, you are also coming across as lumping everyone to your right together as “all socons” and and stereotyping ALL of them.

For the record – I’m a politically conservative, constitutional, gun-toting, pro-evolution, anti-AGW, atheist (who celebrates Christmas) who believes we just don’t have all the answers – either in our current level of science knowledge or in the Bible.

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

You would be a communist compared to my personal views of liberty.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM

Pablo is one of the dumbest posters on Hot Air…nothing of interest to say…ever.

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:24 PM

Pablo and Panther were separated at birth.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM

I believe that God was behind the creation of the universe. But I do not believe science is in opposition to God, as many atheists believe creationists seem to

FIFY

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM

Pablo and Panther were separated at birth.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM

I’m thinking Panther in NonPartisan’s braindead brother. About the same level of intellect.

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:28 PM

Poor little bigot. You never did tell us why you got booted out of the military? Drugs or your bigotry?

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:25 PM

He admitted to a dishonorable discharge?

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:28 PM

It gives away the game. I don’t think Ham realized this, but it came down to an exercise in saying that Creationism only makes sense if you are specific type of Christian. In other words, how evolution makes sense to everyone regardless of their religious beliefs, or even in spite of them, but Creationism/ID only makes sense to a tiny portion of the world’s population.

What will change your mind?
Ham: Nothing.
Nye: Evidence.

It’s such a perfect quote.

ZachV on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

Not really. Nye is essentially saying the same thing – that nothing will change his mind because he’s saying only science will persuade him…on a question science cannot answer.

That’s Nye’s faith in action. Science is a religion to him. He gets Truth from it. He believes it can answer questions that it cannot.

Nye will state with absolute certainty that there isn’t a God, right? That’s an article of FAITH. Science has not and can not prove or disprove it. And as I said science at the very least would make someone curious as to how things of such grand complexity could “spontaneously” arise from “nothing” and not knowing the answer leave room open to explanations that are beyond modern science – the old scifi line of advanced science seeming to be magic to less advanced minds.

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:29 PM

Guessing most socons are right now clutching their prayer beads and hoping for “spontaneous” banning of all contrary opinion.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:29 PM

Yup, as in “ein volken, ein reich, ein fuhrer!!!”

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

Precisely

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:29 PM

Pablo and Panther were separated at birth.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM

They seem to have the same cadence :)

22044 on February 5, 2014 at 12:30 PM

Ham: Nothing.
Nye: Evidence.

It’s such a perfect quote.

ZachV on February 5, 2014 at 12:16 PM

Not as perfect as it may seem.
Without a definition of what would constitute “evidence” for Nye’s acceptance, it’s really not much more than a throwaway concept.
Science requires defined standards.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:30 PM

Flying along here, awesome.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:30 PM

If anyone reading this thread knows Panther, and lives near enough to him/her/it, an intervention is necessary. He/she/it is talking to the computer the way crazy people used to talk to the pictures of their Great Aunt Gertrude. No one is listening, no one cares, he/she/it makes no sense whatsoever, but is having this angry argument with the air. Serious medication is probably involved, unused.

Athanasius on February 5, 2014 at 12:31 PM

You know, Genesis isn’t a science textbook. Moses, while a brilliant man, had very little training in what we would call science. God would have had a difficult time explaining bacteria to anyone before the enlightenment.

So I don’t rely on Genesis as a science textbook, except as a broad overview–God created the Earth in a series of steps.

Vanceone on February 5, 2014 at 11:49 AM

True – but it’s fascinating how much of the Genesis creation account is a rational, unfolding process. The “earth was without form, and void” and … dark, and water was everywhere. That’s near-perfect even for an evolutionist. There weren’t fantastic creatures like in the Norse myths.

Then, God created light. Boom.

It’s amazing how Moses was able to lay this all out without giants or frost or nymphs or other things.

The most illogical thing Bill Nye said was that Noah was “unskilled.” Really. There were ziggurats and pyramids in ancient times – man was certainly capable of creating a really cool boat.

LibertyJane on February 5, 2014 at 12:31 PM

Most of us already know this but PABLO HONEY IS AN ATHEIST POSING AS A CHRISTIAN IN THIS THREAD!!

DethMetalCookieMonst on February 5, 2014 at 12:22 PM

Not true.

I used to be an athiest (just like Kirk Cameron), but I saw a Ray Comfort video that totally demolished evolution and athiesm.

So now I’m on board with ya’all.

Pablo Honey on February 5, 2014 at 12:31 PM

The earth is 6,000 years old…because!!!! Shut up, the socons explained.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Guessing most socons are right now clutching their prayer beads and hoping for “spontaneous” banning of all contrary opinion.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:29 PM

You’re really tearing those windmills up, Don.

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:33 PM

Not true.

I used to be an athiest (just like Kirk Cameron), but I saw a Ray Comfort video that totally demolished evolution and athiesm.

So now I’m on board with ya’all.

Pablo Honey on February 5, 2014 at 12:31 PM

And I’m the Pope.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:33 PM

And I’m the Pope.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:33 PM

Which makes you a Dove killer.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:35 PM

You would be a communist compared to my personal views of liberty.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM

Ahhhh, ok, so there’s you and the rest of the world that’s all commies.
Well ok then…..

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:35 PM

And I’m the Pope.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:33 PM

I knew it!

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:35 PM

The earth is 6,000 years old…because!!!! Shut up, the socons explained.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:32 PM

Now you’re just being a troll.

And “socon” doesn’t mean YEC’er.

JetBoy on February 5, 2014 at 12:36 PM

Leaving science aside, from his Wiki page, it appears that Nye is anti-economics:

In July 2012, Nye endorsed President Barack Obama’s reelection bid.[54]

BuckeyeSam on February 5, 2014 at 12:37 PM

That said, why is any creationist debating an evolutionist? Whats the connection?

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:07 PM

It’s a great question and I think I have the answer. For some reason, creationists think that by pointing to contradictions in evolution, the creationists’ “design” argument is validated.

This, of course, is as nonsensical as creationism itself.

beselfish on February 5, 2014 at 12:37 PM

Guessing most socons are right now clutching their prayer beads and hoping for “spontaneous” banning of all contrary opinion.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:29 PM

180 degrees off base. It’s not the religious people who demand banning..it’s the progressives who demand the banning of all things that don’t support their ideological religion. Silence AGW skeptics..ban traditional values from schools..ban certain words from being spoken..ban certain energy sources..ban certain foods..ban certain ideas…ban guns..ban tee shirts with pictures of guns..ban imaginary “finger guns” etc, etc.
How blind does one have to be to not notice this??

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:38 PM

I knew it!

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:35 PM

What gave me away? The funny hat?

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:38 PM

Which makes you a Dove killer.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:35 PM

Mmmmmmm, dove!

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:40 PM

What gave me away? The funny hat?

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:38 PM

Your typing has a South American accent…/

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:40 PM

180 degrees off base. It’s not the religious people who demand banning..it’s the progressives who demand the banning of all things that don’t support their ideological religion. Silence AGW skeptics..ban traditional values from schools..ban certain words from being spoken..ban certain energy sources..ban certain foods..ban certain ideas…ban guns..ban tee shirts with pictures of guns..ban imaginary “finger guns” etc, etc.
How blind does one have to be to not notice this??

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:38 PM

Socons are no different than liberals. You want the government to support and enforce your views of “young earth.” You want to think you are different but not so much. I think of all socons the same as liberals, another group of statist.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:41 PM

It’s no doubt that such a debate stokes great fires. I suggest most (including many Christians) miss the point of why the literal view of Genesis 1 is so important.

Here’s a clue….The theme of the Bible…

normschaef on February 5, 2014 at 12:41 PM

After watching the debate, I’m leaning toward that second possibility. Last night, it was easy to pick out the smarter man on the stage. Oddly, it was the same man who was arguing that the earth is 6,000 years old.

It was like watching the Broncos play the Seahawks. Nye never had a chance.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/05/the-bill-nye-ken-ham-debate-was-a-nightmare-for-science.html

davidk on February 5, 2014 at 12:42 PM

OT/ If this thread could somehow “evolve” to include Sara Palin, gay something or other, abortion and global warming, this thread could go on forever!

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:42 PM

Socons really twist themselves into pretzels defending “young earth” doctrine. Truly a cult.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:20 PM

As opposed to the Cult of O’bama and the Cult of Global Warming? Not even close.

F-

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2014 at 12:42 PM

Mmmmmmm, dove!

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:40 PM

Agreed. Mourning Doves are the silver dollar pancakes of the edible avian world.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:42 PM

Anyone here actually study Genetics, (molecular), at university?

Just me? Oh.

antisense on February 5, 2014 at 12:43 PM

OT/ If this thread could somehow “evolve” to include Sara Palin, gay something or other, abortion and global warming, this thread could go on forever!

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:42 PM

Let’s talk about the evolution of guns.

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:43 PM

Socons are no different than liberals. You want the government to support and enforce your views of “young earth.” You want to think you are different but not so much. I think of all socons the same as liberals, another group of statist.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:41 PM

Can you provide some example of your claim instead of just claiming it?
Thanks.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:44 PM

Your typing has a South American accent…/

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:40 PM

Lol. Is my Argentinian accent really that thick? I thought I covered it well with my Austrian. I guess not.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:44 PM

Lol. Is my Argentinian accent really that thick? I thought I covered it well with my Austrian. I guess not.

NotCoach on February 5, 2014 at 12:44 PM

Austrian with a twist of Latin….

dentarthurdent on February 5, 2014 at 12:44 PM

You want the government to support and enforce your views of “young earth.” You want to think you are different but not so much. I think of all socons the same as liberals, another group of statist.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:41 PM

Can you also provide evidence to your claim of me having “young earth” views?
Thanks again.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:45 PM

Most recent (2012) Gallup poll:

46% believe that GOD created humans in their present form

32% believe that humans evolved, guided by GOD

… and then you have people like Bill Nye …

15% believe in the standard theory of evolution

Pork-Chop on February 5, 2014 at 12:46 PM

Anyone here actually study Genetics, (molecular), at university?

Just me? Oh.

antisense on February 5, 2014 at 12:43 PM

I studied welding which is sort of like genetics, they both have a “G” in them, so yeah.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:46 PM

As opposed to the Cult of O’bama and the Cult of Global Warming? Not even close.

F-

Del Dolemonte on February 5, 2014 at 12:42 PM

^ Another dumb4ss who thinks anyone who isn’t in the socon camp supports the cult of mother gaia and Obama. Total fail.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:46 PM

Socons are no different than liberals. You want the government to support and enforce your views of “young earth.” You want to think you are different but not so much. I think of all socons the same as liberals, another group of statist.

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:41 PM

Well, bigot that explains it. You’re just not much of a thinker. Get back to your bong, you can tilt at all those windmills later.

HumpBot Salvation on February 5, 2014 at 12:48 PM

Here’s a clue….The theme of the Bible…

normschaef on February 5, 2014 at 12:41 PM

It is?? How so?
Or did you mean to type “it’s A theme?

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:48 PM

Can you also provide evidence to your claim of me having “young earth” views?
Thanks again.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:45 PM

Do you deny the Bible? Heresy!!! Do you also reject that Jesus walked on water and came back from the dead? Are you a Christian or just have your own views?

Panther on February 5, 2014 at 12:49 PM

Anyone here actually study Genetics, (molecular), at university?

Just me? Oh.

antisense on February 5, 2014 at 12:43 PM

I studied welding which is sort of like genetics, they both have a “G” in them, so yeah.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:46 PM

I have a degree in Womyns Studies with a minor in communications/journalism so I’m an expert on everything.

/libtard

gwelf on February 5, 2014 at 12:49 PM

Questions:

1. Origin of the universe

2. Development of life on Earth

3. Evolutionary processes of said life

All separate, but often confused. Examine them one at a time. Do not use potential gaps in knowledge in one to “disprove” the other.

Bill Nye’s quote about changing his mind when presented the evidence speaks volumes: He is willing to accept new evidence. Creationists will never accept any evidence to the contrary of their positions.

Remember, what we call evolution is just the sum of many changes over time. An organism doesn’t “try” to evolve. Just like sandstone doesn’t try to become metamorphic.

antisense on February 5, 2014 at 12:50 PM

Anyone here actually study Genetics, (molecular), at university?

Just me? Oh.

antisense on February 5, 2014 at 12:43 PM

What did your university studies tell you about the origins of those molecules? Where did the matter come from?
They avoided that? Oh.

Mimzey on February 5, 2014 at 12:50 PM

I studied welding which is sort of like genetics, they both have a “G” in them, so yeah.

Bishop on February 5, 2014 at 12:46 PM

Welding is awesome. if I could go back, I might have taken something more engineering related – like materials engineering. Suppose I could combine the two and genetically engineer supermaterials ‘n stuff.

antisense on February 5, 2014 at 12:52 PM

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