EPA on the Renewable Fuel Standard: Uhm, we’re totally just now realizing that this is unrealistic and inadvisable

posted at 1:01 pm on December 11, 2013 by Erika Johnsen

It is one heck of a bizarre, twisted role reversal when the Environmental Protection Agency is the one acting as the voice of reason in any of their countless political battles, but I take it as a testament to just how deeply messed up this entire Renewable Fuel Standard debacle really is. Big Ethanol flew into an almighty uproar last month when the EPA announced that they were finally planning to relent on their scheduled increases to the biofuel volumes that refiners are required to blend into the nation’s fuel supply, and the powerful lobby has been hinting that they will challenge the EPA’s legal authority to make any adjustments to the RFS other than ones that continue to expand the mandate.

In other words, ethanol producers would really like the EPA to just flatly deny the undeniable reality that refiners are running up against the “blend wall,” a.k.a. the point at which mixing the required volumes will exceed the 10 percent ethanol threshold that auto manufacturers deem acceptable for use in cars and trucks, largely because the RFS’s crucial assumption that Americans will continue to consume an ever-increasing amount of gasoline hasn’t actually panned out.

Keeping up the charade is a completely unrealistic stance on which I don’t think even the EPA is willing to double down, as one official testified in a Congressional hearing today, via The Hill:

A top Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) official said on Wednesday that the agency’s biofuel program has led to an unrealistic demand for petroleum refiners, a confirmation of warnings that have long been made by oil companies.

Christopher Grundler, the head of the EPA’s Transportation and Air Quality Office, told the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee that the Renewable Fuel Standard (RFS) has threatened to force petroleum refiners to mix a blend of gasoline that cars can’t use. …

“We’re recognizing that the blend wall has been reached,” he said during Wednesday’s hearing on the annual mandate.

“Reaching the blend wall clearly presents constraints to using higher ethanol quantities because of the infrastructure and other market limitations,” Grundler added. …

Many car companies have told drivers that using a blend of gasoline with 15 percent ethanol could void their warranties. The driving club AAA has also warned that the blend is “potentially damaging” and could drive up gas prices at the pump.

Of course, the EPA has known for ages that this particular piece of corporate pork was a market-inflating, price-spiking, not-”green” endeavor that they only pretended to like because it helped lengthen the list of their super awesome, “all of the above” climate-change plans, but the total failure of the RFS to spur the commercial cellulosic ethanol production on which they were hanging their grandiose hopes is well past the point of political dismissal.


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“On to the next Fascist boondoggle!”

Akzed on December 11, 2013 at 1:06 PM

Big Oil beats Big Corn!

It “is well past the point of political dismissal.”

But it does NOT mean the EPA had a ‘moment of clarity’.

It means the folks with the better lobbyists won.

PolAgnostic on December 11, 2013 at 1:07 PM

Yeah. Can’t do it. On to regulating rainwater runoff.

oldroy on December 11, 2013 at 1:08 PM

Corn is Food

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:09 PM

Big Oil beats Big Corn!

It “is well past the point of political dismissal.”

But it does NOT mean the EPA had a ‘moment of clarity’.

It means the folks with the better lobbyists won.

PolAgnostic on December 11, 2013 at 1:07 PM

“On 9 October, the API filed a federal lawsuit challenging the government’s estimate over how much ethanol must be blended into the US fuel supply this year.

On other side of the divide, the move would be bad news for local corn growers, who provide the raw materials for the fuel. This would reduce the volume of corn-based ethanol to about 800 million gallons less than this year’s 13.8 billion gallons, even though the law had required 14.4 billion gallons in 2014.

Stephen Brown, vice president and counsel at Tesoro Corp said that if these numbers are valid and if EPA’s goal was to put out a proposal that makes everyone less than happy, then their mission has accomplished.

“Directionally, though, Big Corn should view the upcoming pincer move — from the agency and from the Energy and Commerce Committee — as a pretty strong signal that the train is leaving the station and they might want to buy a ticket, ” Brown said.

However, the major loser in the circulating equation could be Brazil because the EPA considers its ethanol “advanced”, as it is made of sugarcane and offers much more carbon savings that corn ethanol. US imports of Brazilian sugar cane ethanol could be cut by more than half if the speculating numbers are adopted….”

http://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Big-Win-for-Big-Oil-on-Ethanol-Mandate.html

“In September, US-based Valero Energy Corp.–the largest independent refinery in the world—began seriously lobbying Washington to scrap the ethanol mandate urgently because refiners can’t keep up with the costs of maintaining the stringent biofuels targets.

The plea has resonance because not only is Valero the largest independent refining company in the world, it is also the third-largest ethanol producer in the US. Even with its position as both refiner and ethanol producer, the company can’t align costs with targets under a mandate which requires refiners to use 13.8 billion gallons of ethanol this year alone….”

http://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Biofuels/Big-Oil-Breaks-Out-Legal-Guns-Over-Ethanol.html

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:17 PM

Biofuels. Keep in mind why the do that. It’s for cronyism, to benefit (enrich $$$) politician’s friends, and big agricultural donors as well.

Lol, I’m joking kind of, cronyism isn’t the “reason” they do it. The stated reason… global warming. Er, climate change, er total global climate eruptions disruptions. Whatever. The damage biofuel does to engines, all the federal spending, the tightening of food supplies world wide, the artificial infringement on the normal fuel market, all this… they do it all for climate change. But here’s a good good article from yesterday that points out the fallacies of leftist pushers of climate change: http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/12/10/on-the-futility-of-long-range-numerical-climate-prediction

An excerpt:

Guest essay by Dr. William M. Gray

My 60-year experience in meteorology has led me to develop a profound disrespect for the philosophy and science behind numerical climate modeling. The simulations that have been directed at determining the influence of a doubling of CO2 on Earth’s temperature have been made with flawed and oversimplified internal physical assumptions. These modeling scenarios have shown a near uniformity in CO2 doubling causing a warming of 2-5oC (4-9oF). There is no physical way, however, that an atmospheric doubling of the very small amount of background CO2 gas would ever be able to bring about such large global temperature increases. It is no surprise that the global temperature in recent decades has not been rising as the [failed] climate models have predicted.

anotherJoe on December 11, 2013 at 1:21 PM

just now realizing that this is unrealistic and inadvisable

Accurately describes pretty much EVERY Dem policy.

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:21 PM

Lol, I’m joking kind of, cronyism isn’t the “reason” they do it. The stated reason… global warming. Er, climate change, er total global climate eruptions disruptions. Whatever.

anotherJoe on December 11, 2013 at 1:21 PM

In days of yore this was called weather.

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:25 PM

This is great to hear, Erika. Thanks for posting the news.

Dusty on December 11, 2013 at 1:28 PM

EPA admits incompetence, relaxes ethanol standards; shifts focus to airlines, requires 10% of passengers to be transported via Star Trek-like transporters by the year 2020.

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:29 PM

Corn is Food

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:09 PM

More specifically, corn is what we feed to the real food. You know the creatures with beaks and/or tails.

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:30 PM

More specifically, corn is what we feed to the real food. You know the creatures with beaks and/or tails.

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:30 PM

I saw a good t-shirt at our new Bass Pro Shops -
“Hey vegans – my food poops on your food.”

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:33 PM

Corn is Food

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:09 PM

and soylent green is people – coming soon to an 0bamascare health center near you….

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:34 PM

Corn is Food

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:09 PM

Burning your food is stupid

STL_Vet on December 11, 2013 at 1:35 PM

“Of course, the EPA has known for ages that this particular piece of corporate pork was a market-inflating, price-spiking, not-”green” endeavor…”

But but but the Greenies got some happy selfless-group-selfies while the feelgood delusion lasted, right?

Tsar of Earth on December 11, 2013 at 1:36 PM

I saw a good t-shirt at our new Bass Pro Shops -
“Hey vegans – my food poops on your food.”

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:33 PM

Eyes in front: Diner

Eyes on the side: Dinner

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:37 PM

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:30 PM

I saw a good t-shirt at our new Bass Pro Shops -
“Hey vegans – my food poops on your food.”

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:33 PM

I consider myself a second tier vegetarian – I only eat animals that eat vegetables….

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

Yeah. Can’t do it. On to regulating rainwater runoff.

oldroy on December 11, 2013 at 1:08 PM

You know they already do that, right? My buddy in Colorado is not allowed to capture and store (in rain-barrel) the water that runs off his roof.

Tsar of Earth on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

Countless small engines and marine power plants have been ruined by the current fuel blend, not to mention the lower BTU’s available per gallon of ethanol blend. Americans are paying more for food and fuel with no environmental benefit at all. Grasslands have been plowed under and nitrate fertilizer run-off has increased to grow more corn. The whole process has a negative benefit.

joe btfsplk on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:37 PM

I like that one too.
Goes well with the other comment I just posted.

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:39 PM

I wonder how many decades and trillions of dollars it will take for them to realize they can’t regulate climate either.

antipc on December 11, 2013 at 1:39 PM

You know they already do that, right? My buddy in Colorado is not allowed to capture and store (in rain-barrel) the water that runs off his roof.

Tsar of Earth on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

And in Maryland they just tax you for rain.

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:40 PM

I wonder how many decades and trillions of dollars it will take for them to realize they can’t regulate climate either.

antipc on December 11, 2013 at 1:39 PM

You do realize that this isn’t about regulating the climate right? They only use the junk science to help them regulate you!

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:41 PM

Putting ethanol in the gas ruins the gas and your engine ………….. especially your small engines such as lawn mowers.

Now when are they going to allow gas cans with vents to be manufactured again. The ones they now sell make me spill a lot of gas and diesel when I fill my tractor and other equipment out here on my farm.

SC.Charlie on December 11, 2013 at 1:41 PM

joe btfsplk on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

negative benefit?That is solid gubmint bureaucrat doubletalk.

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:42 PM

Yeah. Can’t do it. On to regulating rainwater runoff.

oldroy on December 11, 2013 at 1:08 PM

Since when has “can’t do it” ever stopped them in the past?

Gator Country on December 11, 2013 at 1:42 PM

but the total failure of the RFS to spur the commercial cellulosic ethanol production on which they were hanging their grandiose hopes is well past the point of political dismissal.

If, by the words “political dismissal”, you mean the Iowa caucuses are no longer important. With so many state parties moving their straw polls, caucuses, etc., etc., etc. up the last presidential election cycle, the Iowa caucuses are not nearly as important as they were just the election cycle before. So it is no longer vital for presidential hopefuls to prostitute themselves to Iowa and Big Corn. The fact that the Farm Bill has stalled is another indication that Iowa has lost its political luster.

Corn is Food

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:09 PM

It’s time to remember that. All the bleeding heart liberals squealing over the disparity of income between northern countries and southern ones should be reminded of how dependent impoverished southern countries are on corn and other grains. After the RFS went into effect, the price of tortillas in Mexico shot through the roof causing all sorts of problems for poor Mexicans. Corn is food in poor peoples’ stomachs, not fuel in trendy, liberal SUVs.

catsandbooks on December 11, 2013 at 1:44 PM

Corn is Food

workingclass artist on December 11, 2013 at 1:09 PM

More specifically, corn is what we feed to the real food. You know the creatures with beaks and/or tails.

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:30 PM

Horns; you forgot horns.

M240H on December 11, 2013 at 1:44 PM

“Hey vegans – my food poops on your food….”
dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:33 PM

“…then eats it.”

Akzed on December 11, 2013 at 1:45 PM

Burning your food is stupid

STL_Vet on December 11, 2013 at 1:35 PM

.
It also increases the number of children who starve to death each year.

Whatever happened to “if it will save the life of ONE child”?

PolAgnostic on December 11, 2013 at 1:45 PM

Remember when Thomas Jefferson mandated that the hay fed to horses had to have 10% grain? Yeah, me neither.

Kafir on December 11, 2013 at 1:46 PM

And in Maryland they just tax you for rain.

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:40 PM

And our municipal water rates just went up because “our area experienced an unusually rainy summer”. Last year, they went up because of increased demand.

?

Next year I expect them to go up because “we experienced normal weather and demand this year”.

Tsar of Earth on December 11, 2013 at 1:47 PM

You know they already do that, right? My buddy in Colorado is not allowed to capture and store (in rain-barrel) the water that runs off his roof.

Tsar of Earth on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

Water rights are a HUGE deal in Colorado.
To be honest, rules like that pre-date the EPA.
Just a few years ago, a town I used to live in (Monument) was forced – by the state, not the EPA – to drain a small lake that had existed since the early 1900s because of complaints by downstream water rights holders that they weren’t getting enough water during the drought.

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:47 PM

“Hey vegans – my food poops on your food….”
dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:33 PM

“…then eats it.”

Akzed on December 11, 2013 at 1:45 PM

Keep in mind you’re talking about a group of people that consider cat shit coffee to be a delicacy.

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:49 PM

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 1:41 PM

Yeah but they can’t actually admit to that so it’s either claim victory over climate change (which might kill their budget) or invent a new culprit causing predictably unpredictable weather.

antipc on December 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM

Keep in mind you’re talking about a group of people that consider cat shit coffee to be a delicacy.

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:49 PM

So if I tell a libtard to “eat sh11te” – I’m actually wishing him well? Right?

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:51 PM

The driving club AAA has also warned that the blend is “potentially damaging” and could drive up gas prices at the pump.

Actually, the current blend damages a lot of engines. Ethanol is a moderately poor fuel for an internal combustion engine (unless it’s designed just for that – and even then the energy density is poor).

Eyes in front: Diner

Eyes on the side: Dinner

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:37 PM

No eyes: Garnish

I consider myself a second tier vegetarian – I only eat animals that eat vegetables….

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 1:38 PM

I’ve said for a long time that I love vegetables – I just prefer them pre-chewed and turned into this tasty thing called “meat”.

GWB on December 11, 2013 at 1:54 PM

Eyes in front: Diner

Eyes on the side: Dinner

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:37 PM

Maybe. Maybe not.

M240H on December 11, 2013 at 1:59 PM

Putting ethanol in the gas ruins the gas and your engine ………….. especially your small engines such as lawn mowers.

Now when are they going to allow gas cans with vents to be manufactured again. The ones they now sell make me spill a lot of gas and diesel when I fill my tractor and other equipment out here on my farm.

SC.Charlie on December 11, 2013 at 1:41 PM

Just mod the can so it works like they used to:

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=fix+CARB+gas+can&sm=3

Or you can buy a NATO can, but they are much more expensive.

wearyman on December 11, 2013 at 2:00 PM

I have a 2002 Tahoe. It would not idle. The lower head gasket had become dry and brittle allowing gas to escape. Ethanol dried the gasket out causing the leak.

I “had” a small gas powered hedge trimmer. My son put gasoline with 10% ethanol in the engine. It caused the inside of the plastic fuel lines to melt forever cloging the fuel system. It was thrown away

Do not think Ethanol in fuel is just a “small” thing. It will destroy your automobile, small gas engines, including boat motors, scooters, chainsaws. etc. . . The production creates more polution than is reduyced in burning it in your auto. The production of the vast amounts of corn use more energy to produce a gallon of ethanol than it cost to refine gasoline. The farm production of the corn for ethanol causes the run off of nitrogen that flows through our rivers into the Gulf of Mexico causeing alge blooms killing one of the greaest fisheries in the world. Ethanol hurts our environment and Nation.

OldSarg on December 11, 2013 at 2:03 PM

Back in 2004 the nation was in a panic of what would happen with an Arab boycott and lack of oil/fuel. There was also the proof, albeit in the lab, that we could make ethanol from any cellulose such as tree limbs picked up curbside and wood waste from construction sites, along with switch grass, etc… Problem is that in never worked actual real world application. This is often the case with game changing research.

Give me a break on the whole food argument since much of the corn produced for well over a century has been used for industrial purposes. Especially its starches are used in all sorts of things, or don’t freaking use starch in your shorts for crying out loud. Don’t use oil/natural gas, since wells use starch (corn) based polymers in drilling fluids. Don’t use ANY construction adhesives including wallpaper paste either. Freaking morons.

Kermit on December 11, 2013 at 2:05 PM

Was the whole “Bio-fuel” initiative actually ever supposed to be “green” to begin with? I mean the fact that (at least in theory) ethanol is “renewable” and it’s “organic” (i.e. “It comes from plants.”) brings “green” to mind, although it is nothing of the sort. Wasn’t it originally meant as a way out of the peak oil (“Peak what!?!?”) problem?
Really when you think of it in that light, Biofuels are just a political boondoggle retooled into a new political boondoggle. When the phony peak oil problem went away, it just morphed into a phony green initiative.

Glenn Jericho on December 11, 2013 at 2:07 PM

And our municipal water rates just went up because “our area experienced an unusually rainy summer”. Last year, they went up because of increased demand.

Next year I expect them to go up because “we experienced normal weather and demand this year”.

Tsar of Earth on December 11, 2013 at 1:47 PM

Funny how that works. When gas prices go up, we get tagged here for a “temporary” increase in fees for trash removal and electricity. Gas prices go down again but the “temporary” increase never does.

Happy Nomad on December 11, 2013 at 2:08 PM

After completely repealing the ethanol mandate, we should throw BIG CORN a little “Pork” and mandate that

“ALL machinery used in planting and harvesting corn run on 100% ethanol by 2015.”

KenInIL on December 11, 2013 at 2:10 PM

Problem is that in never worked actual real world application. This is often the case with game changing research.
Kermit on December 11, 2013 at 2:05 PM

Actual “game changing research” WORKS in the real world.
If the research doesn’t work in the real world, it’s not “game changing”.

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 2:18 PM

……….in other crucial news:

water is WET
winter is COLD………………film at 11

Katfish on December 11, 2013 at 2:19 PM

winter is COLD………………film at 11

Katfish on December 11, 2013 at 2:19 PM

I have it on questionable authority (algore) that winter is no longer cold.

dentarthurdent on December 11, 2013 at 2:26 PM

the move would be bad news for local corn growers

that translates to bad news for big agriculture corporations who’ve been making easy profits off an artificially inflated commodity. Calling these things local farmers is like calling Walmart “local big box retailers”

bannor on December 11, 2013 at 2:38 PM

So when will the EPA mandate that all vehicles be powered by the wind?

GarandFan on December 11, 2013 at 2:39 PM

Was the whole “Bio-fuel” initiative actually ever supposed to be “green” to begin with? I mean the fact that (at least in theory) ethanol is “renewable” and it’s “organic” (i.e. “It comes from plants.”) brings “green” to mind, although it is nothing of the sort. Wasn’t it originally meant as a way out of the peak oil (“Peak what!?!?”) problem?
Really when you think of it in that light, Biofuels are just a political boondoggle retooled into a new political boondoggle. When the phony peak oil problem went away, it just morphed into a phony green initiative.

Glenn Jericho on December 11, 2013 at 2:07 PM

Also keep in mind that EBFs destructive effect on engines was seen as a good thing by the “deep-ecos”, especially the ones working at EPA. The more engines destroyed, the fewer vehicles in private hands. Therefore, the more peasants forced onto public transportation, “where they belong”.

Ray LaHood, the ex-SecTrans, said his job was to “coerce people out of their cars”. EPA concluded that destroying the engines was as good a way to do this as any.

Eco-fanatics are all about “monkeywrenching”- it’s their definition of “propaganda of the deed”. The more of civilization they can destroy, the closer to their Old Stone Age, agrarian socialist, “green” Utopia we come, in their estimation.

At EPA, they just hope you’re too stupid to figure out why their policies are consistently destructive.

clear ether

eon

eon on December 11, 2013 at 2:40 PM

So when will the EPA mandate that all vehicles be powered by the wind?

GarandFan on December 11, 2013 at 2:39 PM

I’ll take my own supply with me.

oldroy on December 11, 2013 at 2:44 PM

Have we reached “Peak Ethanol”?

Another Drew on December 11, 2013 at 2:52 PM

Eyes in front: Diner

Eyes on the side: Dinner

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:37 PM

Maybe. Maybe not.

M240H on December 11, 2013 at 1:59 PM

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01778/sharkattack_1778841b.jpg

He he he…

timberline on December 11, 2013 at 2:59 PM

Making alcohol from corn:

In Appalachia, they call that “Sippin’ Whiskey”!

Another Drew on December 11, 2013 at 3:00 PM

Keep in mind you’re talking about a group of people that consider cat shit coffee to be a delicacy.

BobMbx on December 11, 2013 at 1:49 PM

Waitaminnute……

I’m no vegan. Nothing like a 1-1/2″ thick ribeye grilled medium over mesquite coals.

But…..that coffee is some really good stuff.

Jus sayin…………

Tenwheeler on December 11, 2013 at 3:41 PM

Well, duh. Took them long enough.

RebeccaH on December 11, 2013 at 3:45 PM

Yeah. Can’t do it. On to regulating rainwater runoff.

oldroy on December 11, 2013 at 1:08 PM

Yep, coming soon to a town like yours. I remember reading with disbelief that in some location it is illegal to catch rainfall in your own yard. The rain barrel confiscations begin.

Qzsusy on December 11, 2013 at 4:52 PM

Now when are they going to allow gas cans with vents to be manufactured again. The ones they now sell make me spill a lot of gas and diesel when I fill my tractor and other equipment out here on my farm.

SC.Charlie on December 11, 2013 at 1:41 PM

Yep, only the feddle gummint can make a gasoline can so safe that it has become useless.

slickwillie2001 on December 11, 2013 at 5:16 PM

Yep, coming soon to a town like yours. I remember reading with disbelief that in some location it is illegal to catch rainfall in your own yard. The rain barrel confiscations begin.

Qzsusy on December 11, 2013 at 4:52 PM

One of my Senators from New Mexico – the esteemed Senator Udall, is proposing a bill that would make pollution in storm-water illegal.

oldroy on December 11, 2013 at 5:19 PM

Why is it these A-Holes have never heard of “methanol”…. Oh yeah because it comes from Natural gas and is cheap and plentiful and doesn’t reward green and corn cronies….

elowe on December 11, 2013 at 5:21 PM

On vacation this summer I actually found a station (in Kansas of all places) that sold unblended regular. I was stunned at how much farther down the road I got with that tank of gas.

trigon on December 11, 2013 at 5:56 PM

Up until a few weeks ago I could by unblended gas at Cenex for about a 10 cent premium over other stations. Now only the top grade is ethanol free, and I’m paying about a 40 cent premium to get it. Thanks Obma. Thanks EPA.

claudius on December 12, 2013 at 3:22 PM

We have four times as many vehicles on the road today as we had in 1970. Our air tests cleaner today than it did in 1970.

There is no problem with vehicular emissions.

World population will peak in 40 to 50 years and then enter a long term decline that will vary from glacial to moderate.

I would still expect energy demand to increase, just slower. The world continues to get relatively richer. A higher percentage of the world population will soon be using oil, gas, and coal.

The corn market will adjust, the dirt will allow other crops to be grown, just like always. And perhaps corn will find new international markets if cheaper energy makes transportation less expensive.

Free markets, how do they work?

Meremortal on December 21, 2013 at 5:02 PM