Liberals wonder: Is Obama to blame for Healthcare.gov’s failures — or are Republicans?

posted at 4:41 pm on October 25, 2013 by Allahpundit

Via Mediaite. In fairness, this is less of an either/or thing for them than an “and.” No one (I think) is claiming that Republicans bear most of the responsibility for the failures of a program passed entirely with Democratic votes and developed with Hopenchange technocratic know-how. It’s less about shifting blame than sharing it.

Don’t let Democrats get away with it, says … Kirsten Powers, who only recently discovered that if you like your plan you’re not necessarily allowed to keep it.

Obama quickly became an effective advocate for the view that government is a critical part of the solution to society’s problems. So effective that he won reelection in the midst of a struggling economy. Even Republicans had to admit the 2012 face-off had ended with a rejection of the conservative creed that government is the problem. In an election postmortem, Newt Gingrich told Bloomberg News that conservatives were “profoundly wrong” in their reading of public sentiment and must “rethink our assumptions.” He said, “Part of it is a greater willingness to have government activism than most conservatives thought.”

Obama and liberals were winning the argument. Then came the epic incompetence of the last few weeks. The rollout of the insurance exchange that is central to the success of the Affordable Care Act has been nothing short of a disaster. This failure is a double whammy: it puts the future of Obamacare in even greater peril while placing Obama’s case for activist government on life support. If the government can’t build a functioning website to support the most important initiative of the president’s administration, then how can it be trusted to do anything?

Indeed. Sam Stein of HuffPo makes the same point in the clip, which may or may not earn him a scolding from fellow lefties for being too honest about the implications of the Healthcare.gov Chernobyl. As for the GOP’s alleged culpability in all this, there’s one argument they’re kicking around right now and one that Obama will start hammering over the next few weeks if his crack tech team can’t get the website on track. The current one is that Republicans made HHS’s job harder by refusing to cooperate in implementing the law, in particular by refusing to develop state-run exchanges for red states. That forced Obama and Sebelius to build their own leviathan federal site to serve 30+ state populations, which guaranteed the sort of heavy traffic that made the site unstable in the early going. But all of that just circles back to KP’s point: Massive centralized projects are what a Democratic administration’s supposed to do best. No one’s seriously suggesting that they didn’t have enough money to build a functioning site; the tab, per WaPo’s best estimate, is $170 million so far and counting. Ezra Klein groused yesterday that congressional Republicans have tried to hamstring the law at every turn, but the only reason there’s a House Republican majority in the first place is because of the ferocious backlash to O-Care’s passage in 2010. To this day, more people view the law unfavorably than favorably. Klein even cited the legal challenges to O-Care that ended up in the Supreme Court last year as evidence of GOP obstructionism. But the Supremes ruled that the mandate did violate the Commerce Clause. It was upheld anyway by John Roberts as a tax, but not only did five justices think the Commerce arguments against the mandate were meritorious, they actually proved to be winning. Were people not supposed to litigate the issue lest they obstruct Precious’s pet boondoggle even though the Supreme Court agreed, in part, that they were right?

That’s the current argument — that things might be going okay if it weren’t for those meddling Republican kids. (Klein, incidentally, doesn’t go that far himself. He’s been forthright in putting most of the blame on the White House, to the point where he’s now posting stuff like this to remind grumpy liberals that, no, Healthcare.gov isn’t “just a website.”) The argument for blaming Republicans that’s still to come is if the site continues to melt down deep into November and Obama has no choice but to ask Boehner and the House to work with Reid on a fix. What does Boehner do then? That gets back to my point this morning about the “Bad Samaritan,” to borrow Ted Cruz’s phase. The GOP has spent three years, most recently and notably during the shutdown, building its brand as the anti-ObamaCare party. They benefited from it three years ago. But if O asks for help now and they refuse categorically, he might be able to exploit their brand to blame the site’s failure on them, at least in part. “We could have fixed it by spring,” he’ll say, “but Republicans would rather see the exchanges fail.” That’s not without risk for the GOP. It’s grossly unfair to them, given that Obama’s incompetence has put them in this position, but politics ain’t beanbag.

But maybe I’m being too pessimistic. Even lefty Greg Sargent admits that if O can’t get the website working by his czar’s new self-imposed deadline of late November — which is unlikely — it’s “political Armageddon for Dems.” Exit question: Is KP right that Healthcare.gov’s sustained failure will cause people, especially younger people, to lose faith in liberalism? I want to believe, but the longer I’m around politics, the more I think ideology is less something people are reasoned into than something they “feel” and then build a framework of reason around. It’ll certainly help turn people off to liberalism at the margins, but no one’s expecting a sea change. Or are they?


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That’s right, morons. It’s not the rapist’s fault the girl got worked over. The fault clearly lies with policeman who took the report.

CurtZHP on October 25, 2013 at 4:46 PM

Sorry azzholes, you broke it you bought it. You didn’t need or want republican input to pass it. Republicans are under no obligation to fix this fukked up piece o’ chit that you created.

HumpBot Salvation on October 25, 2013 at 4:48 PM

Liberals wonder: Is Obama to blame for Healthcare.gov’s failures — or are Republicans?

I’m sure the Weeping Boner and the rest of the Vichy Republican slugs will accept that it’s their fault, the same way they loved to repeat Barky’s intellectually offensive lie about reaching the debt limit triggering default. And then the Vichy Republican scum will call Tea Partiers raaaacists … to impress their leftist bosses.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on October 25, 2013 at 4:49 PM

As for the GOP’s alleged culpability in all this, there’s one argument they’re kicking around right now and one that Obama will start hammering over the next few weeks if his crack tech team can’t get the website on track. The current one is that Republicans made HHS’s job harder by refusing to cooperate in implementing the law, in particular by refusing to develop state-run exchanges for red states. That forced Obama and Sebelius to build their own leviathan federal site to serve 30+ state populations, which guaranteed the sort of heavy traffic that made the site unstable in the early going.

Well there are a few problems with that excuse. First, it insinuates that the only problem with Obamacare is the website which is far from true. Even if every GOP governor and/or state legislature had been onboard with creating an exchange, that wouldn’t have done anything to keep the costs of premiums and deductibles down. Secondly, even in blue states that have their exchanges, no one is signing up! Unless it’s for Medicaid which doesn’t count. And thirdly, are the Dems seriously going to go with the argument that Republicans at the state level are to blame because they had the temerity to not capitulate to Obama and implement his POS law as if it was a commandment handed down from DC? Good luck with that heading into the midterms.

Doughboy on October 25, 2013 at 4:50 PM

The GOP has spent three years, most recently and notably during the shutdown, building its brand as the anti-ObamaCare party. They benefited from it three years ago. But if O asks for help now and they refuse categorically, he might be able to exploit their brand to blame the site’s failure on them, at least in part. “We could have fixed it by spring,” he’ll say, “but Republicans would rather see the exchanges fail.” That’s not without risk for the GOP. It’s grossly unfair to them, given that Obama’s incompetence has put them in this position, but politics ain’t beanbag.

Let the Democrats make that argument. It’s a loser.

Throat Wobbler Mangrove on October 25, 2013 at 4:50 PM

The failure of the website is what is visible. The failure of the policies and technology behind the scenes is much worse. Given the inattention to privacy that is likely to occur your anal abscess will soon be on websites around the world. BOHICA!

Mason on October 25, 2013 at 4:51 PM

Mr Hairy Reid, This war is lost.

the_nile on October 25, 2013 at 4:51 PM

Blame the R’s you worthless fluffers. You know you want to. Leftists are by nature, emotion based shallow thinkers. Likely they will stay that way.

Bmore on October 25, 2013 at 4:53 PM

The argument for blaming Republicans that’s still to come is if the site continues to melt down deep into November and Obama has no choice but to ask Boehner and the House to work with Reid on a fix. What does Boehner do then? That gets back to my point this morning about the “Bad Samaritan,” to borrow Ted Cruz’s phase. The GOP has spent three years, most recently and notably during the shutdown, building its brand as the anti-ObamaCare party. They benefited from it three years ago. But if O asks for help now and they refuse categorically, he might be able to exploit their brand to blame the site’s failure on them, at least in part. “We could have fixed it by spring,” he’ll say, “but Republicans would rather see the exchanges fail.”

I’ll take the Bad Samaritan for $1000, Alex.

And, yes, I want to see the exchanges fail, pal.

Bitter Clinger on October 25, 2013 at 4:54 PM

We need to start giving thanks to King Obama for giving us an easy policy fix for health insurance and healthcare in the United States. Because just simply repealing this legislation will reduce costs, and expand access. So the next time someone asks you what your solution to the problem is just tell them about the wonderful benefits of repealing ObamaCare.

NotCoach on October 25, 2013 at 4:56 PM

LIBERALISM! Liberalism is to blame!

It’s the ideology stupid! It’s the idea of universal health care in a free country of 300+ million!

But, once again, they’re going to find a scapegoat. Either the other side or an ineffectual lame duck president for whom they have no more use. The ideology must survive no matter the cost!

29Victor on October 25, 2013 at 4:56 PM

See the comments to this. Hilarious.

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 4:57 PM

Given the inattention to privacy …

Mason on October 25, 2013 at 4:51 PM

It’s not inattention, it seems, but policy.

kunegetikos on October 25, 2013 at 4:57 PM

Favorite comment from link, above

Targeting the young people now that he almost finished off the middle class.

— Anthony S

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 4:58 PM

American liberals are the most reprobate, stupid, ignorant, spiteful, sluggardly, bunch of perverse imbeciles the world have ever had the unfortunate burden to bear.

Murphy9 on October 25, 2013 at 4:58 PM

Sounds typical of Democrats. Blame Republicans for their failed policies by repeating the lie over and over using a compliant media.

iamsaved on October 25, 2013 at 4:59 PM

Old and Busted: Ditches and Slurpees
The New Hotness: Glitches and Slurpees

Christien on October 25, 2013 at 5:00 PM

Culpability?

It’s far more likely any decision as culpability will come down to political expediency winning out over reality.

We’ve already had a collection from the hard left attempt to foist the meme that it’s all the fault of the GOP because of their continued resistance and opposition to the ACA. Other than fellow ideologues, the only other one’s that are likely to buy this (far more likely than say LIV) are the Vichy Republican caucus – who need little prodding to moan and whinge that the only solution is more progressive-lite initiatives.

I’m with you Allah re KP’s question… I would like that to be the case. That’s what would happen in a ‘normal’ ‘logical’ world. The challenge is that far too many ideologues will only see what they want to believe as opposed to believing what they really are seeing. Then we have the lamestream media who still are showing no signs of applying reason or logic in lieu of their imitations of the Ministry of Truth.

Where I hope the change is really going to be felt is within the center – the quite centrists who don’t do many polls, and are feeling a lot of the pain associated with the clusterfark. They are the one’s who hopefully will see in this debacle the proof that big government is neither the solution or has the capability to be the solution for big problems.

Athos on October 25, 2013 at 5:00 PM

See the comments to this. Hilarious.
Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 4:57 PM

It’s unbelievable. smh!!!

Murphy9 on October 25, 2013 at 5:00 PM

I find Progressives to be morally disgusting. Those MSLSD “women” say this and praise Wendy Davis in the same skanky breath. Talk to the hand!

MontanaMmmm on October 25, 2013 at 5:01 PM

No one (I think) is claiming that Republicans bear most of the responsibility for the failures of a program passed entirely with Democratic votes and developed with Hopenchange technocratic know-how.

Give Krugman time. He’s already suddenly discovered that mountains of massive debt isn’t such a bad thing. I’m sure he’ll suddenly discover that the Republicans rigged Healthcare.gov to fail and that the real cause of everyone’s premiums skyrocketing is the insurance companies that are in bed with Bush.

Bitter Clinger on October 25, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Don’t let Democrats get away with it, says … Kirsten Powers, who only recently discovered that if you like your plan you’re not necessarily allowed to keep it.

At least Kirsten Powers has the right gender to benefit from much of the stuff we all are supposed to pay for.

Uniform pricing and mandatory coverage for stuff that makes no sense for the INDIVIDUAL is insane. Essentially I’m expected to pay for some welfare queen’s bastard child, some addict’s rehab, and other services that I’ll never access.

Happy Nomad on October 25, 2013 at 5:03 PM

Ha, they quote KY and miss that NO one signed up in Oregon.

What a bunch of fools…talking gnats…

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:04 PM

These people give me the creeps. Delusional psychotic animals, when will you take some responsibility.

Bishop on October 25, 2013 at 5:04 PM

Exit question: Is KP right that Healthcare.gov’s sustained failure will cause people, especially younger people, to lose faith in liberalism?

AP.

AP, unfortunately, I believe that the younger folks will simply say that the US is not exceptional and will accept that we cannot expect great things from our leaders.

They will NOT lose faith with liberalism, but rather OUR country.

Jabberwock on October 25, 2013 at 5:05 PM

You have NO idea how happy this video made me.

It s/b forbidden to have so much schadenfreude :)

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:05 PM

if you want to pass secondary blaim..
the press

the press is criminally liable for all things BHO…period

going2mars on October 25, 2013 at 5:05 PM

In a sane world, anyone who started to blame Republicans for this would be cut off in mid-sentence, gagged, and horse-whipped.

Erich66 on October 25, 2013 at 5:05 PM

Juan Williams just now on The Five-

The Obamacare rollout debacle will deter people from the wonderful world that awaits once we get past these glitches.

Happy Nomad on October 25, 2013 at 5:05 PM

I can’t wait for the SCOTUS case on the different treatment of states.

What fools…thank you for making this thread.

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM

blame even

going2mars on October 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM

Just when I thought Democrats couldn’t get stupider. It’s like blaming the ref for the fact that you don’t know how to build a team.

MrX on October 25, 2013 at 5:06 PM

The later part…no, dummy, the Rs need not help with anything.

Let it die, let this HHS obama’care’ sink.

Just watch it. The bow is already under water :)

Yes, I want obama and obama’care’ to fail because it’s good for the country and her children.

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:07 PM

Where are the ‘esteemed’ trolls. Must be re-education time.

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:08 PM

Hey if you can’t keep the motorized goal posts in operation, just shift the blame to your enemy. See how easy that is?

Johnnyreb on October 25, 2013 at 5:08 PM

Exit question: Is KP right that Healthcare.gov’s sustained failure will cause people, especially younger people, to lose faith in liberalism?

Sadly, no IMO. Liberals don’t put that much thought into their positions. They have these vague squishy ideas about society that they never really question.

Happy Nomad on October 25, 2013 at 5:10 PM

If the government can’t build a functioning website to support the most important initiative of the president’s administration, then how can it be trusted to do anything?

What happened to ” you didn’t build that ” thing Idi Hussein is so fond of yapping about in front of Oidiots ? Aren’t his illiterate union thugs responsible for everything that is ever built ? So why are the unions not being credited for the smooth and successful building of ObamaCAIR website ? I mean it is working smoothly right ? right ?
I think Idi Hussein should send in his trolls to say this for the next few days :

The reason this website is a disaster is because unions didn’t built it

burrata on October 25, 2013 at 5:11 PM

The argument for blaming Republicans that’s still to come is if the site continues to melt down deep into November and Obama has no choice but to ask Boehner and the House to work with Reid on a fix.

Need Boehner for what? They are just making it up as they go. Does the legislature get back into the process?

I want to believe, but the longer I’m around politics, the more I think ideology is less something people are reasoned into than something they “feel” and then build a framework of reason around. It’ll certainly help turn people off to liberalism at the margins, but no one’s expecting a sea change.

I agree that people are progressives because they believe being progressive is cool. But they would stop being progressives for the same reason. The objective failure of their ideas, as an argument, might not persuade people who were never persuaded by argument to being with — but not being cool will.

If being progressive means hanging out with that gaggle of vacuous losers, young progressives will choose another identity. All we have to do is make sure all this uncoolness hangs around their necks and not ours.

Axe on October 25, 2013 at 5:11 PM

Teachable moment for freedom and liberty,But no repubs to educate?
Why?

tygart on October 25, 2013 at 5:12 PM

the president will be the president until 2016

Thanks for clarifying. I mistakenly thought he will be POTUS until late January 2017.

Christien on October 25, 2013 at 5:13 PM

Exit question: Is KP right that Healthcare.gov’s sustained failure will cause people, especially younger people, to lose faith in liberalism?

Sure she’s right, she is such a soooper genius, afterall she dated the Weeny boy !!

burrata on October 25, 2013 at 5:14 PM

Let’s shame the Governor’s….but leave Dear Leader alone.

I’m still not listening to dumb people.

d1carter on October 25, 2013 at 5:14 PM

If/when the website starts working, Democrats’ problems with Obamacare will only worsen. More people will find out that their premiums and deductibles will skyrocket, and be forced off their previous health insurance plans.

Obama’s claims that “If you like your health insurance plan, you can keep it” and “Premiums will decrease by $2500 per year” will be shown to be bald-faced lies, and American voters of all political opinions hate being lied to, especially when it hits them in the wallet or purse.

Obama and the Democrats will have a hard time blaming Republicans, not one of whom ever voted for the law, and who have been arguing against it for 3-1/2 years. While Democrats argued during the recent shutdown that “Republicans don’t want you to have affordable health care”, such an argument won’t fly next January when people find out that Obamacare makes health insurance much more expensive than before. Republicans can then shout from the rooftops, “We told you so back in October–give us a Senate majority in November 2014 and we’ll repeal the whole thing, and you can go back to the health insurance plan that 74% of you liked in 2009.”

Steve Z on October 25, 2013 at 5:15 PM

“look (if you could just get past the website)
you can see the Emerald City from here”
Dorothy 1939

going2mars on October 25, 2013 at 5:15 PM

The Republicans, to their credit, didn’t cast one single vote to pass Obamacare.

They were, however, actually locked out of the room, physically, while the Democrats drafted this egregious piece of legislation.

Obamacare was passed, in the dead of night, Christmas Eve, and even then the Democrats had to shatter ‘The Byrd Rule’ and use Reconciliation to pass a bill that was not a budget bill. This meant warping the interpretation of that rule beyond all reasonable recognition. Even those factions of the Democrat’s own party who had reservations about the bill, or were against it and the way it was meant to pass, were bullied, browbeaten, threatened into voting lock step with their party in congress to pass this legislation and it resulted in the Blue Dogs and the Pro Life Democrats becoming creatures of myth, as they lost their seats the next election.

Republican governors, for the most part, have steadfastly refused to endanger the health and well being of the residents of their state by rushing to implement Obamacare exchanges. This, given the enormity of the failure of the federal project, was a wise and prudent position and it remains the wisest course of action today.

The Republican’s are in no way, to no degree, responsible for the failure of Obamacare.

thatsafactjack on October 25, 2013 at 5:15 PM

Must be re-education time.

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:08 PM

I liked this point in your link:

The law’s supporters hope that 18- to 35-year olds will be patient with the site’s many glitches and are banking on the fact that many younger people are planning to wait until the last possible minute to sign up in the first place, when the site will theoretically be fixed.

Hope is never a good strategy. Younger people don’t really plan months in advance. And even if they wait to the last minute to enroll, what happens when they find out how much it will cost them to actually sign up?

The math simply doesn’t work here.

Happy Nomad on October 25, 2013 at 5:16 PM

KP is still a true believer…why do we listen to these people who are so wrong. Could she not see this before now? Or, as David Gregory asks, Could there be something poltical in this..? LOL.

d1carter on October 25, 2013 at 5:17 PM

WOW !
I just told the trolls what to say and they are still not here ?
:(

burrata on October 25, 2013 at 5:18 PM

Orrin Hatch came very close to calling for re education of the Tea Party?

d1carter on October 25, 2013 at 5:18 PM

On the red state refusal to setup exchanges which put the load on the Fed website.

If the website and associated software and databases were working properly then it would be a matter of providing more servers and bandwidth to handle the extra load. People would encountered the World Wide Wait but they would eventually get through at one point or another (the demand would not be there around the clock) and things would get better as the system was expanded.

========

The basic problem was that the complexity of what was being attempted was not understood or given an appropriate weight.

What seems to have happened might be somewhat equivalent to JFK proclaiming we will go to the moon before the decade is out, then nine years later putting the moon shot mission on the pad without having gone through the previous Mercury, Gemini, and earlier Apollo flights (and associated testing).

Russ808 on October 25, 2013 at 5:19 PM

The GOP will bail out Obozo becausr they want this crapsammich as much as they do

neyney on October 25, 2013 at 5:21 PM

Orrin Hatch came very close to calling for re education of the Tea Party?

d1carter on October 25, 2013 at 5:18 PM

I don’t question Orin Hatch for two reasons. First, Mark Levin has been a staunch supporter. And he was my high school graduation speaker more years ago than I care to admit.

Happy Nomad on October 25, 2013 at 5:23 PM

Let’s talk a minute about timing here. The March 31 “deadline” has now been proven to be a Feb. 14 deadline as it takes 6 weeks (two for verification and one for actual enrollment) to have a policy enforce. The czar said today that the site will definitely be functioning for people to sign up by “the end of November.”

Many people have already gotten notices that their insurance will be terminated Dec. 31.

So if I’m losing coverage Dec. 31, and I have to sign up with an exchange to keep coverage. I sign up at the “end of November.” That’s still AT LEAST two weeks that I’m completely without coverage. And there are now HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of people in this situation.

So even IF Healthcare.gov is “ready to go” at the end of November, and even IF people can get signed up… can the ins. companies, and the government even get all these people’s new policies in effect without more than a two week non-coverage period?

UnderstandingisPower on October 25, 2013 at 5:26 PM

OT!!! NSA Hacked.

heh.

See Drudge.

MontanaMmmm on October 25, 2013 at 5:27 PM

That forced Obama and Sebelius to build their own leviathan federal site to serve 30+ state populations, which guaranteed the sort of heavy traffic that made the site unstable in the early going. But all of that just circles back to KP’s point: Massive centralized projects are what a Democratic administration’s supposed to do best.

The list of Obama’s off-putting characteristics include being lazy and a blowhard. He shows no hesitation to enlighten on big ideas as well as his latest views on post modern culture. The problem is he doesn’t want to break a sweat on the details. He is also intellectually incurious. It’s amazing how much he has to say on topics about which he has only the least bit of knowledge. He might be the world’s quintessential dilettante. Maybe Obamacare is doomed to fail, but with his personality I also don’t think it should surprise anyone that Obama is the type of guy who often just can’t close the deal. Anyway, maybe massive centralized projects are what Democratic administrations do best. However, Obama is a communist. Probably what he counted on was the states doing the heavy lifting in designing efficient exchanges and then later with an executive order nationalize them and consolidate them into one large federal exchange. Just like his late buddy Chavez did with the oil industry in Venezuela. Typical behavior of authoritarian/totalitarian leaders.

DaveDief on October 25, 2013 at 5:31 PM

I think ideology is less something people are reasoned into than something they “feel” and then build a framework of reason around.

What, you don’t think liberals can be “mugged by reality”?

You’re probably right, though. There are huge swaths of people who see Republicans as the “mean party” or the “party that doesn’t care about people.” One or two mistakes by the Democrats isn’t going to change that. They certainly haven’t in the past.

calbear on October 25, 2013 at 5:31 PM

On the issue of young people signing up … or not… if the Democrats want them to sign up they are going to have to do what the U.S. Selective Service does U.S. Selective Service in that these are the penalties for failure to register:

Penalties for Failure to Register for the Draft

Men who do not register could be prosecuted and, if convicted, fined up to $250,000 and/or serve up to five years in prison. In addition, men who fail to register with Selective Service before turning age 26, even if not prosecuted, will become ineligible for:

Student Financial Aid – including Pell Grants, College Work Study, Guaranteed Student/Plus Loans, and National Direct Student Loans.
U.S. Citizenship – if the man first arrived in the U.S. before his 26th birthday.
Federal Job Training – The Job Training Partnership Act (JTPA) offers programs that can train young men for jobs in auto mechanics and other skills. This program is only open to those men who register with Selective Service.
Federal Jobs – men born after December 31, 1959 must be registered to be eligible for jobs in the Executive Branch of the Federal government and the U.S. Postal Service.

In addition, several states have added additional penalties for those who fail to register.

Interesting to note that illegal aliens are required to register… as it clearly states ‘any male living in the Untied States ages 18-15′… and the exceptions are:

Who Does NOT Have to Register for the Draft?

Men who are not required to register with Selective Service include: nonimmigrant aliens in the U.S. on student, visitor, tourist, or diplomatic visas; men on active duty in the U.S. Armed Forces; and cadets and midshipmen in the Service Academies and certain other U.S. military colleges. All other men must register upon reaching age 18 (or before age 26, if entering and taking up residence in the U.S. when already older than 18).

If the Democrats want these young people to sign up for health care insurance, they’re going to have to impose some penalties that are meaningful… as Selective Service does.

I also think that if illegal aliens are going to be allowed to benefit from our health care system in any way, including emergency rooms, that we need to require something from them, as well. Failure could trigger the fines/prison term, AND the NO CITIZENSHIP ever clause. Perhaps a special health care insurance specifically for ‘Foreign nationals in the nation illegally’.

PS- I think that if women are to be sent into combat, they should be registered for the draft as well. Only fair. Equal is equal.

thatsafactjack on October 25, 2013 at 5:33 PM

Is KP right that Healthcare.gov’s sustained failure will cause people, especially younger people, to lose faith in liberalism? I want to believe, but the longer I’m around politics, the more I think ideology is less something people are reasoned into than something they “feel” and then build a framework of reason around.

You are right, KP is wrong.

Unfortunately.

Good Lt on October 25, 2013 at 5:36 PM

In all honesty, can a Liberal explain their logic to “The Obamacare rollout failure is due to Republicans”?

I mean, since the Republicans have *only* been able to execute a perfect cl*sterf*k over the past six years, and all.

socalcon on October 25, 2013 at 5:38 PM

What, you don’t think liberals can be “mugged by reality”?

calbear on October 25, 2013 at 5:31 PM

I don’t. We’re talking about the same people who defended the USSR for decades.

Reality doesn’t come into the picture. They can always find some reason that what SHOULD have worked didn’t.

29Victor on October 25, 2013 at 5:41 PM

Well, it was the republicans that did it. here’s how:

George Bush refused to buy global warming, thus spawning Katrina on the poor folks.

Katrina you see, came in fast and destroyed most everything in sight.

Now along comes Obamacare and scientist have already proven that it followed the same mode of operation as Katrina (spawned by Bush a somewhat republican)

Thus *scientific evidence is available to prove that Bush and the republicans sabotaged the nice presidents’ generous gift of healthcare for all for free almost.

(*Evidence can be found for this data on healthcare.gov.)

the above is satire for you trolls

Don L on October 25, 2013 at 5:44 PM

The Republican’s are in no way, to no degree, responsible for the failure of Obamacare.

thatsafactjack on October 25, 2013 at 5:15 PM

That’s the reality of the situation.

However, the perception can be entirely different…and we all know that there are times when perception can trump reality.

There have already been a number of trial balloons sent up by various progressives to float memes that can define perception by blaming the GOP for some / all of the debacle.

When we apply logical thinking, we know that none of them can or should get any traction – but then we’re not progressive ideologues in the media who are expert at propaganda or LIV’s who won’t invest the time to apply any critical thinking if they even know how to.

The crack in the dam that will likely cause the entire premise to collapse will be when the ‘fix’ is done, and the LIV’s find out that the ACA is still fundamentally broken, that Obama’s promises were lies, and they are either without insurance coverage or they can’t afford the insurance coverage (premium or deductible) they can get even with the subsidy. Then they are going to start asking why government couldn’t really fix this mess – a mess that government created.

Athos on October 25, 2013 at 5:49 PM

On the issue of young people signing up … or not… if the Democrats want them to sign up they are going to have to do what the U.S. Selective Service does in that these are the penalties for failure to register:

Yep, 30 years after I signed up, I still had to provide my registration number when applying for a federal job (BTW I had been employed as a Naval officer during the intervening period).

Young people would be idiots to enroll in Obamacare. They know it. The whole scheme is on a death spiral and nobody wants to admit it.

Happy Nomad on October 25, 2013 at 5:52 PM

Fixing the website, delaying the individual mandate and/or extending the enrollment period does NOTHING to change the underlying problems with Obamacare like skyrocketing premiums. A delay will only delay the sticker shock…possibly past the 2014 elections, which is why Red State Dems are willing to do it.

A delay has nothing to do with being a Good Samaritan. At this point, it is a crass political calculation by Democrats, who are afraid of their own constituents.

The majority of the ‘unsuspecting public,’ who is now facing reality, voted for Obama.

It is time for Americans to learn that elections DO HAVE consequences.

Let the pain rain…hard.

Resist We Much on October 25, 2013 at 5:53 PM

That forced Obama and Sebelius to build their own leviathan federal site to serve 30+ state populations, which guaranteed the sort of heavy traffic that made the site unstable in the early going.

Oh … please. That is not even that difficult a task. And this “heavy traffic” cr@p is really annoying.

The problem with BarkyCare is not related to this stupid website (that high schoolers could have designed better and more quickly). The website is just a minor joke sideline. The fact that they spent over half a billion on this joke and still couldn’t get a product that even appears to work (whether it does or not) is enough to put these people in jail for fraud and all sorts of other crimes, not to mention that they are too stupid and incompetent to be allowed to roam free on the streets.

But … our great GOP can’t be bothered with actually fighting to get this gargantuan offense to America and to the Constitution killed and below dirty, where it belongs. The Vichy Republicans are busy colluding with the treasonous, dog-eating retard in order to aid and abet illegals’ invasion of our sovereign territory.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on October 25, 2013 at 5:57 PM

Hey AP:

I think someone should dig up a review of the timeline where HHS and the Administration missed their deadline for issuing the exchange requirements for the states necessary for the states to build their own exchanges. Not to mention that when they did issue the requirements, there was, what, a year or less left for individual states to build their own exchange by the October 1, 2013 launch date/deadline. Definitely a lose-lose situation for individual states.

And now the lefty MSM bozos are still trying to pin this own “Red States”.

Puuuuuhleeeeaaaase.

parke on October 25, 2013 at 6:08 PM

Surely this is just an amazing coincidence:
/s

Michelle Obama’s Princeton classmate is executive at company that built Obamacare website.

LegendHasIt on October 25, 2013 at 6:22 PM

Healthcare.gov would have enjoyed a flawless launch but for punk Republican flash mobs that descended on the site and rampaged through it.

Expert at use of social media, the Republicans were able to organize three or four people who – at the agreed upon moment – logged onto Healthcare.gov.

Over the span of the next 20 seconds, this raging mob entered just enough information into the site’s account-creation fields that the server farm was completely overwhelmed.

We at Healthcare.gov are still trying to clean up in the wake of this wanton vandalism.

So, yes. The blame for this entire mess rests squarely on the shoulders of Republicans.

FlameWarrior on October 25, 2013 at 6:28 PM

Funny, Nancy Pelosi didn’t want Republican input. King Barack said “I won!”.

Let them fix it. I don’t see any Republican tags on that POS legislation.

GarandFan on October 25, 2013 at 6:33 PM

The argument for blaming Republicans that’s still to come is if the site continues to melt down deep into November and Obama has no choice but to ask Boehner and the House to work with Reid on a fix.

Phht. Seriously? The REB doesn’t need Congress to do whatever he needs to do to fix Obamacare.

slickwillie2001 on October 25, 2013 at 6:38 PM

AP:

I think reason batters for a while, but people hang on for emotional reasons for as long as they can, actually. In the face of such a political disaster, I expect a few converts away from liberalism. And anyway, it’s high time the youngsters figure out that today’s liberals are the most uptight, pursed-lipped, “get off my lawn” moralizers out there. Sheesh.

Grace_is_sufficient on October 25, 2013 at 6:48 PM

Actually there are 2 groups responsible for this debacle. First of all, the obvious one, the whole Democratic Party and Barack Obama. They were willing to push this through without one Republican vote, not Susan Collins, or anyone else. They always say, it’s never good to push through lifetime legislation like this, on a partisan basis, which is why the Republicans didn’t tackle Social Security Reform, out of respect for the Democrats.

Secondly, the tea party, but not for the reasons you think. They gave the Republican party the House majority, those Republicans elected John Boehner as Speaker of the House. I can’t think of too many people who could possibly squander a mandate to get rid of Obamacare like John Boehner did, but he did. The tea party couldn’t do much different but the majority Republicans in the House could have done a much better job of derailing this garbage legislation.

bflat879 on October 25, 2013 at 6:57 PM

Liberals wonder: Is Obama to blame for Healthcare.gov’s failures — or are Republicans?

…even 57 pieces of bubble gum…won’t stretch that far!

KOOLAID2 on October 25, 2013 at 7:13 PM

Heads be asplodin’ at MSNBO

myiq2xu on October 25, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Even lefty Greg Sargent admits that if O can’t get the website working by his czar’s new self-imposed deadline of late November — which is unlikely — it’s “political Armageddon for Dems.”

Wish I could believe it, but I just watched the most incompetent boob ever to hold the office, who failed to deliver on 98.4% of his promises easily win reelection.

40% of Americans will vote for the communists no matter what. They will not risk giving up sugar daddy. That number creeps up each year.

mankai on October 25, 2013 at 7:19 PM

Where are the ‘esteemed’ trolls. Must be re-education time.

Schadenfreude on October 25, 2013 at 5:08 PM

Whenever there is unexpected bad news the Obamasphere goes silent as the drones await new instructions talking points.

myiq2xu on October 25, 2013 at 7:19 PM

For f**k’s sake, HOTGAS has had like ten posts today pimping MSNBC. Knock that sh** off … or is that all you got?

M240H on October 25, 2013 at 7:21 PM

Well,
In a sense they are…first they put up McCain as the candidate against Obama then they put up Romney.

Yeah, I can see that the GOP is responsible for this mess, sorta, maybe…

*sigh*

ProfShadow on October 25, 2013 at 7:31 PM

Just blame the failure all the Republicans that voted for Obamacare…

Wait… that number is ZERO…

Khun Joe on October 25, 2013 at 7:57 PM

I keep thinking about that huge bill that nobody was allowed to inspect or debate and Pelosi saying they had to pass it if they wanted to see what was in it. The Dems railroaded this thing through Congress and has demonized anybody who opposed it, on top of lying to the American people about how it would affect them. It’s their creation from start to finish and nobody but a moron or a Yellow Dog Democrat would believe it’s the GOP’s fault that it’s crashing. They’ve had three years to get it ready, so where is it?

flataffect on October 25, 2013 at 8:37 PM

AP, I like you but this is a typical example of you overthinking things. The best thing Republicans have done in the past six years is forcing everybody to call the Affordable Care Act “Obamacare”. The public isn’t going to respond to the kind of strategic blame-changing and buck-passing the Democrats would need for the public to even slightly blame Republicans. Democrats passed it. Obama signed it. Republicans have tried everything they can to stop it, and all they were told was to suck it up and deal with it because it’s “the law of the land”. Well, then.

People need to remember that one good piece of 2012 election postmortem wisdom: Elections. Have. Consequences.

jas88 on October 26, 2013 at 3:00 AM

There could be a video of Obama clubbing a baby seal to death and other liberals would blame Republicans. Then, the masses of moron Democrat voters would believe it.

cajunpatriot on October 26, 2013 at 5:08 PM