Ted Cruz: No, I won’t hold up the Senate bill to end the shutdown

posted at 2:41 pm on October 16, 2013 by Allahpundit

Remember, Senate rules require 30 hours of debate on a bill unless all 100 members consent to waiving them. If Cruz (or Lee or Rand Paul) withheld his consent, boom — we hit the debt ceiling tomorrow and the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man appears in the streets of New York to wreak havoc. Would Cruz, true to his “don’t blink” ethos, hold out to the bitter end? I thought there was a 99 percent chance that he wouldn’t, but man oh man, that one percent. Joshua Green imagines:

You may be thinking to yourself, “Why on earth would he keep this up?!” The answer is simple: Cruz seeks to be the purest conservative in the 2016 field, and fighting the good fight till the bitter end would lend a romantic flourish to his C.V., at least in the eyes of the Tea Party types who vote faithfully in GOP primaries. It’s no accident that he won last weekend’s Value Voters Summit Presidential Straw Poll going away. Cruz also needs to be able to explain away the humiliating debacle of the Republican collapse he precipitated, and here, too, fighting on would probably help him. In my talks with Cruz allies over the last couple of days, a clear theme emerged: Republicans were losing because those RINOs in the Senate wouldn’t man up and fight. To pin this defeat on others, Cruz will have to do everything he can to heighten this distinction.

The problem with that theory is that GOP nominee Ted Cruz, having swept to victory on the backs of his tea-party supporters, would then need to figure out how to win a general election, and being known as the guy who singlehandedly forced a technical default when literally everyone else was ready to proceed would be … unhelpful to that effort. Plus, like it or not, Cruz will need to build bridges with wealthy Republican donors before 2016, at least to the point where they’re not clamoring to fund someone who can stop him. (Although maybe that’s inevitable.) Making sure that he doesn’t tank the market to make a rhetorical point when there’s now zero chance of achieving any major ObamaCare concessions is a prerequisite. Besides, hasn’t he already positioned himself as “the purest conservative in the 2016 field” after all this? The policy goal of defunding O-Care was always quixotic but the political benefits of pounding the table against the law, staging a 21-hour speech against it, and backing the first major government shutdown in nearly 20 years to protest it are obvious. Whether he’s now the “purest” conservative in the field, he’s certainly the most famously populist conservative. Which, I think, was his main goal on the political side of this. Raising awareness about ObamaCare’s defects was important and salutary, but re-framing the RINO/conservative divide as more of an elitist/populist divide (as he does in the clip below) is what will define his personal brand.

One question, though. Does Cruz’s refusal to delay the vote mean that he too thinks hitting the debt ceiling would be a very bad (even catastrophic) thing? If not then he has nothing to lose by delaying another day or two; it would, as Green says, show his willingness to fight the good fight until the bitter end. But if it’s true that he fears hitting the ceiling, he’s in the unusual position of being on the wrong side of tea-party opinion:

pe

A clear majority — 52 percent — of those who agree with the tea party say it’s unnecessary to raise the debt limit at all. Something to bear in mind if/when Boehner ends up stepping down before the midterms and the caucus is forced to decide whether to elect a centrist or conservative as his successor.

Exit question: Is this good for Rand Paul or bad?

Righties might not like it, but moderate conservatives who think Christie’s too squishy and Cruz too extreme will like it a lot.



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So? He’s a guaranteed ‘no’ vote. Non-story.
*Cornyn the little weasel…*

annoyinglittletwerp on October 16, 2013 at 2:44 PM

Moderate conservatives are why we are in this mess… eff ‘em.

tyketto on October 16, 2013 at 2:44 PM

If there’s nothing to be gained from it, why bother? I don’t want symbolic gestures.

Doughboy on October 16, 2013 at 2:46 PM

A clear majority — 52 percent — of those who agree with the tea party say it’s unnecessary to raise the debt limit at all.

But, but, but, but I thought if all us “extreme right wing fringes” left; the GOP would be just fine and would start winning elections?

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:47 PM

I wouldn’t say nothing. Delaying this one or two days delays amnesty for one or two days. But, whatever, this capitulation and the amnesty capitulation are coming anyway, so what difference does it make?

besser tot als rot on October 16, 2013 at 2:47 PM

Moderate conservative is media-speak for “liberal RINO”

tommyboy on October 16, 2013 at 2:47 PM

With the House caving it doesn’t matter if he delays it a day or two.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 2:48 PM

forced a technical default

LOL, doubling-down on the previously doubled-down, oft-debunked ignorant ‘default’ threat, eh?

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

Actually, delaying a little bit past the deadline could serve a purpose. It would show that hitting the debt ceiling doesn’t equal armageddon. Just like we saw with the sequester and with the shut down.

besser tot als rot on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

But, but, but, but I thought if all us “extreme right wing fringes” left; the GOP would be just fine and would start winning elections?

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:47 PM

They don’t want us to leave. They want us to shut up, donate, and vote.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

Moderate conservative is media-speak for “liberal RINO”

tommyboy on October 16, 2013 at 2:47 PM

I prefer, “center-left statist.”

besser tot als rot on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

Plus, like it or not, Cruz will need to build bridges with wealthy Republican donors before 2016, at least to the point where they’re not clamoring to fund someone who can stop him. (Although maybe that’s inevitable.) Making sure that he doesn’t tank the market to make a rhetorical point when there’s now zero chance of achieving any major ObamaCare concessions is a prerequisite.

Well, he could have Soros like friends who’ll short the market…

the_nile on October 16, 2013 at 2:50 PM

Much has been revealed. I’ll stick with Cruz.

Bmore on October 16, 2013 at 2:51 PM

moderate conservatives

What the hell kind of species is that?

Bitter Clinger on October 16, 2013 at 2:51 PM

They don’t want us to leave. They want us to shut up, donate, and vote.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

He He, Well that won’t be happening anytime soon. I last donated in 2008, and refuse to vote for ANY politician that doesn’t represent me anymore.

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:52 PM

LOL. Cruz has no chance to be the nominee.

-signed everyone (cept the tea party morons)

rubberneck on October 16, 2013 at 2:52 PM

What the hell kind of species is that?

Bitter Clinger on October 16, 2013 at 2:51 PM

A cannabilistic one..

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:52 PM

LOL. Cruz has no chance to be the nominee.

-signed everyone (cept the tea party morons)

rubberneck on October 16, 2013 at 2:52 PM

Any bets on this being a sock puppet for one of our liberal commenters?

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:53 PM

Geez, Allah, can’t you see there is an obvious shortage of Depends in D.C., the Republicans have been crapping a steady stream since the slimdown began?

Cindy Munford on October 16, 2013 at 2:53 PM

Just to reiterate, the shutdown and the debt ceiling are two totally different issues. Why can’t the House send a debt ceiling increase over to the senate, and leave the shutdown unaffected? Negotiate the harmless shutdown and Obamacare funding separately.

anotherJoe on October 16, 2013 at 2:54 PM

He He, Well that won’t be happening anytime soon. I last donated in 2008, and refuse to vote for ANY politician that doesn’t represent me anymore.

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:52 PM

Well we forced the severely conservative Mitt Romney on them so maybe in 2016 we’ll get a good solid moderate Republican who can win an election.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 2:54 PM

LOL. Cruz has no chance to be the nominee.

-signed everyone (cept the tea party morons)

rubberneck on October 16, 2013 at 2:52 PM

If Obamacare turns into a success story…

the_nile on October 16, 2013 at 2:55 PM

Just to reiterate, the shutdown and the debt ceiling are two totally different issues. Why can’t the House send a debt ceiling increase over to the senate, and leave the shutdown unaffected? Negotiate the harmless shutdown and Obamacare funding separately.

anotherJoe on October 16, 2013 at 2:54 PM

Because the surrender weasels won. We must bow down and take it now so that we might live to fight another day.

Happy Nomad on October 16, 2013 at 2:55 PM

Current short term debt $17 Trillion.
Current long term unfunded ponzi SS, MediCare $90 Trillion.

Post this lie and fruad to over pay for time to lie more:

As of Jan. 1, 2014 new short term debt $25 Trillion to the end of Obama and the RINO enabled term.
As of the end of Obama and the RINO eabled term in Jan. 2017 $150 Trillion to cover the ObamaCare fraud and the new Mexican with unknown and unending pre-existing conditions of their no heath care lives in South America.

How any sane person can think the path these commies and RINO’s have U.S. on can be anything other than a self imposed death march is flat a$$ unbeliveable.

There will be a judgement day and it will come with the heat of the sun to all, the guilty of the crimes and those who see it clear coming to U.S. all.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 2:55 PM

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:53 PM

Maybe. I’m pretty sure his brain damage was a result of rubbernecking though. ; )

Bmore on October 16, 2013 at 2:56 PM

We must bow down and take it now so that we might live to fightfold another day.

Happy Nomad on October 16, 2013 at 2:55 PM

FIFY

db on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Sad to see that Cruz is another squishy RINO.

Pablo Honey on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Why can’t the House send a debt ceiling increase over to the senate, and leave the shutdown unaffected? Negotiate the harmless shutdown and Obamacare funding separately.

anotherJoe on October 16, 2013 at 2:54 PM

Obama didn’t want that and neither did the rinos.

the_nile on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Cruz shutdown
-libs history books
Avoid at all cost who was president in 13…

cmsinaz on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Well we forced the severely conservative Mitt Romney on them so maybe in 2016 we’ll get a good solid moderate Republican who can win an election.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 2:54 PM

Well after having two right wing extremists like McCain and Romney; what else can we do but put up a moderate?

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 2:58 PM

You know, the ‘fundamental transformation of America’ began as a ‘quixotic’ effort, as well. As did ‘Obamacare’. As will the subsequent move to ‘single payer’. And amnesty.

The difference is that the left will continue to attain these things because a) their side actually has the will to fight, and b) they’re encouraged by the shit-eating surrender monkeys of the politicians/advisers/chattering class of the right.

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 2:59 PM

forced a technical default

LOL, doubling-down on the previously doubled-down, oft-debunked ignorant ‘default’ threat, eh?

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

Have you missed the park closings? Obama would -make sure- to “lose” the debt payments if given the opportunity. The RINO’s handled this is the absolute worst way possible, behaving like “wreckers” without articulating the “no free lunch” truths this country needs to hear.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:00 PM

Why can’t the House send a debt ceiling increase over to the senate, and leave the shutdown unaffected? Negotiate the harmless shutdown and Obamacare funding separately.

anotherJoe on October 16, 2013 at 2:54 PM

Obama didn’t want that and neither did the rinos.

the_nile on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Exactly, that would have put the spotlight back on the need for fiscal responsibility and the failure of O-care. Can’t have that!

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:01 PM

Ted Cruz got what he wanted. A national stage with which to build his twitter, mailing and fundraising lists. He knew, from the beginning, that Obamacare would not be repealed and that the GOP would cave on the debt ceiling. How did he know? He’s not an idiot. But by going through the kabuki of “showing strength” and “resisting Obama” he has convinced people who don’t have a goal other than opposing Obama and some amorphous “restoration” of a nostalgic fantasy of this nation, that he’s there man. In terms of the sheer skill of his political theatrics, one can’t help but Marvel, almost Obama-esque. Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Anyone know when they vote on this?

CableDude on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Sad to see that Cruz is another squishy RINO.

Pablo Honey on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Did you manage to get signed up for Obamacare yet? I’m sure knowing that something is going to be done about your anally located genital warts is a relief.

M240H on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Pablo Honey on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Poor little baby. Hows that government teet working out for ya?

Bmore on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Have you missed the park closings? Obama would -make sure- to “lose” the debt payments if given the opportunity. The RINO’s handled this is the absolute worst way possible, behaving like “wreckers” without articulating the “no free lunch” truths this country needs to hear.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:00 PM

Then that would be on OBAMA if HE chose to do that. It’s a lie that AP and HA and so many other ‘conservative’ bloggers/journalists continue to perpetuate that it would a) automatically happen, and b) be anyone’s fault other than Obama if it *did* happen.

With friends like these…

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:03 PM

The difference is that the left will continue to attain these things because a) their side actually has the will to fight, and b) they’re encouraged by the shit-eating surrender monkeys of the politicians/advisers/chattering class of the right.

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 2:59 PM

Yup.

the_nile on October 16, 2013 at 3:03 PM

Print, Print, Print the dollars tell the ink runs dry,,

Tax, Tax, Tax until the tax well runs dry,

Tell St. Obama at the Golden Gate that you just have to have him wait until you get the last tax \bill paid before you can die off natural….

I can tell the exchange rate to turn your worthless dollars into useable yen is not going to be an amount set by these dumb a$$ commies and RINO enablers,,, the rate will be set by red commies of China who hate you more than commie Obama.

It is what the RINO’s and the Commies working together brought down on all of U.S..

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:03 PM

Ted Cruz got what he wanted. A national stage with which to build his twitter, mailing and fundraising lists. He knew, from the beginning, that Obamacare would not be repealed and that the GOP would cave on the debt ceiling. How did he know? He’s not an idiot. But by going through the kabuki of “showing strength” and “resisting Obama” he has convinced people who don’t have a goal other than opposing Obama and some amorphous “restoration” of a nostalgic fantasy of this nation, that he’s there man. In terms of the sheer skill of his political theatrics, one can’t help but Marvel, almost Obama-esque. Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Written by the history “professor” who regularly gets history wrong.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:04 PM

Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

No sweetie, he is on the side where Obamacare is a disaster and hurting people. You don’t need to know the future or history to know that is the right side. When your own side on Huff post is bi+chin about the price; you know it will only get worse for “your history.”

melle1228 on October 16, 2013 at 3:04 PM

Sad to see that Cruz is another squishy RINO.

Pablo Honey on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Sure he is-just like I’m a 22 year old DCC named ‘Misty’.

annoyinglittletwerp on October 16, 2013 at 3:05 PM

This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Poll: If Americans Could Have One President Back, Who Would It Be? Reagan.

Resist We Much on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

Sad to see that Cruz is another squishy RINO.

Pablo Honey on October 16, 2013 at 2:57 PM

He will vote against the Reid-McConnell deal. Which will make the Republicans who support it MUCH squishier RINOs. The vote is what will go on record. Actually, the vote that mattered to conservatives went down about 3 weeks ago. As someone noted up-thread: “Much has been revealed.”

de rigueur on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

Written by the history “professor” who regularly gets history wrong.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:04 PM

Don’t be mad because I’m right…..

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

The fact is that it’s probably already too late, but the right – if there’s hope for the country – had better learn pretty f*cking fast that EVERY f*cking hill, EVERY f*cking inch of ground MUST be fought for.

Retreat? Surrender?

With a hat tip to ‘the dread pirate Wesley’ – “death first.”

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

Just because the shi$ has never hit the fan does not mean it will not hit the fan sometime.

The fan in on high and the crapper is overflowing.

Stand back.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

No sweetie, he is on the side where Obamacare is a disaster and hurting people. You don’t need to know the future or history to know that is the right side. When your own side on Huff post is bi+chin about the price; you know it will only get worse for “your history.”

+1

It’s also nice to have libfreeordie on record as stating that vast transfers of wealth from the younger poor and healthy to the richer old and sicker is “the right side of history” that the youth are going to love.

Hey, libfree, is Obama granting unconstitutional waivers to big corporations and Congress from his signature piece of legislation part of being on the right side of history?

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:08 PM

Every Republican needs to just go home and shut their mouths, right now.

It’s now time to let Obama and the dems eat the Obamacare disaster they’ve created.

darkegop on October 16, 2013 at 3:08 PM

Goody, goody, time for the immigration nightmare, let’s just move on to the next crisis for these nasty Americans. Come on McCain, Hot Air execs, McConnell, Boehner, Cantor, Corker, give us all you got.

mobydutch on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

lib free off my money,

What do you thing will the top amount of short and long term debt that the Democrats and the RINO’s will stop at do you have an estimate that includes the cost of ObamaCan’tCare.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

Cruz fought a good fight.

Rand Paul kind of left him out there dangling – but Paul is a slick one.

Cruz isn’t running for POTUS guys – Cruz is a real ideologue who believes in what he’s doing. He believes someone has to fight and take the heat – and it’s him.

He’ll be voting NO against this compromise. So what’s the big deal?

He’ll be remembered as the last guy standing on the day the ObamaCare and Single Payer war was lost … forever.

And that’s not a bad way to be remembered.

HondaV65 on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

Don’t be mad because I’m right…..

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

When that happens (and the over/under isn’t favorable to ‘soon’), we’ll remember not to be mad at you.

Until then, f*ck off, moron.

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

Plus, like it or not, Cruz will need to build bridges with wealthy Republican donors before 2016,

Really? The first conservative nominee in….what, decades? He’ll have no problems with money. And if it does take 200..300..500 million dollars for the next person to win an election, we’re f’ing doomed anyway.

Dongemaharu on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

Have you missed the park closings? Obama would -make sure- to “lose” the debt payments if given the opportunity. The RINO’s handled this is the absolute worst way possible, behaving like “wreckers” without articulating the “no free lunch” truths this country needs to hear.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:00 PM

Then that would be on OBAMA if HE chose to do that. It’s a lie that AP and HA and so many other ‘conservative’ bloggers/journalists continue to perpetuate that it would a) automatically happen, and b) be anyone’s fault other than Obama if it *did* happen.

With friends like these…

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:03 PM

Only if the R-Establishment stepped up to the plate and hung it around his neck, which, as we have seen, they WILL NEVER DO.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:10 PM

Ryan Lizza Is Right

On Twitter, the New Yorker’s Ryan Lizza is picking up on what I think is an important point – and being savaged from the Left for it, naturally:

Who will be more discredited this year: conservatives for pushing us to brink of default or liberals for failure of health care exchanges?

— Ryan Lizza (@RyanLizza) October 16, 2013

It is possible that, having lost the fight over the continuing resolution and failed to delay or to defund Obamacare, conservatives will watch in amazement as the president is forced to do just that on his own. This would, of course, be completely illegal. But it may well happen. Not only will the president be unwilling to watch as the “glitches” persist and threaten the Democratic party’s chances of keeping the senate in 2014, but he will presumably be unwilling to watch passively as an insufficient number of young people sign up to subsidize those with pre-existing conditions and cause his signature law to fold into what has been termed the “death spiral.”

Critics immediately complained to Lizza that he was engaging in “false equivalence.” But I think he understands the importance of this technocratic enterprise’s going well better than do many who support it:

@joanwalsh The ACA is the most important liberal project in decades. If it fails, it is a complete disaster for liberalism.

— Ryan Lizza (@RyanLizza) October 16, 2013

This is to say that if you are going to sell people technocracy, you had better make sure that it works. Think what you will about unified and harsh Republican opposition to the law, but it is going to look pretty appealing to the American public if it does turn out to be the disaster that opponents have predicted. As Lizza, noted, somewhat wryly one suspects, there is no benefit to be found in pretending that the rollout hasn’t been a disaster.

We may need a new term for people who deny that the ACA rollout this month has been a disaster.

— Ryan Lizza (@RyanLizza) October 16, 2013

I’m going with “dreamers.” And dreaming, as we have learned in the last fortnight, gets you precisely nowhere.

I’m going with ‘Debacle Deniers.’

Resist We Much on October 16, 2013 at 3:11 PM

Don’t be mad because I’m right…..

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

I’m not mad. And you are regularly wrong about a subject with which you are supposedly an expert. Lets not pretend you aren’t regularly shown to have your facts and conclusions wrong.

You think people are going to love ObamaCare?
Especially the young who are going to be forced to subsidize people richer than them?

What is it exactly that Ted Cruz has gotten wrong regarding ObamaCare?

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:11 PM

…Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

During the brief time that Jack Kennedy was in office he continued the tax reform that Dwight Eisenhower began. The top federal income tax bracet saw the rate drop from 90% to 36% during this period of reform. As an empircally quantified result of this reform, recorded by the Bureau of Econmic Analysis, personal income in every American socio-economic stratum increased -many almost doubling- and Federal tax revenues increased.

Please tell us what side of history was Kennedy on when he was shot and killed by a Marxist whackjob like yourself?

M240H on October 16, 2013 at 3:12 PM

HondaV65 on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

I will be interested in seeing how McConnell votes. If he doesn’t vote against his own “compromise” I think he will be hit hard with it during his reelection.

Cindy Munford on October 16, 2013 at 3:12 PM

lib free off any money that not yours,

Say you were the ones of China, at what point would you stop your loans to the U.S.A. unless the U.S.A. starts paying for the Health Care of the poor overworked and underpaid ones in China?

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:12 PM

Don’t be mad because I’m right…..

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

You’re right? Which is why you run away from all the uncomfortable questions about Obama and ObamaCare right?

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:12 PM

Don’t be mad because I’m right…..

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

If and when, perchance, that ever happens, we won’t be.

besser tot als rot on October 16, 2013 at 3:13 PM

Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

No sweetie, he is on the side where Obamacare is a disaster and hurting people. You don’t need to know the future or history to know that is the right side. When your own side on Huff post is bi+chin about the price; you know it will only get worse for “your history.”

+1

It’s also nice to have libfreeordie on record as stating that vast transfers of wealth from the younger poor and healthy to the richer old and sicker is “the right side of history” that the youth are going to love.

Hey, libfree, is Obama granting unconstitutional waivers to big corporations and Congress from his signature piece of legislation part of being on the right side of history?

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:08 PM

At least slavenowandie is honest about defining political deviance down and wanting to bankrupt the country, unlike the RINO trolls who snipe at the Tea Party and then run away when challenged about the need for fiscal responsibility in governance.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:13 PM

Cindy Munford on October 16, 2013 at 3:12 PM

It’ll be interesting weather Corn-yn will join Cruz-or revert to his usual RINO ratface self.

annoyinglittletwerp on October 16, 2013 at 3:15 PM

Strange that the Progs and the establishment GOP are on the same side of this..? hmmmmm

d1carter on October 16, 2013 at 3:15 PM

LOL. Cruz has no chance to be theHillary Clinton is my nominee.

-signed everyone (cept the tea party morons) Moby Shill

rubberstamp

FIFY.

xblade on October 16, 2013 at 3:15 PM

Time now to watch obamacare implode (as it has already started) and watch every dem who supported the worst law passed in 100 years scramble before next year’s election. Liberalism is a mental disorder-they live in a land of delusion.

Ta111 on October 16, 2013 at 3:16 PM

Strange that the Progs and the establishment GOP are on the same side of this..? hmmmmm

d1carter on October 16, 2013 at 3:15 PM

They always have been, it’s just now that it has become so obvious that even Sean Hannity has to admit it.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:16 PM

It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

What a weird, counter-factual, wrong-side-of-history (as in, history that’s actually happened, not the Marxist wish casting variety) conclusion, based on this

Texas Sen. Ted Cruz… has emerged as Republican voters’ top pick for the 2016 presidential nomination, according to a poll released Friday.

The Public Policy Polling survey found that 20 per cent of Republicans favor Cruz, followed by 17 per cent for Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul…

The results show that a majority of GOP voters who have a preference – 47 per cent overall – want to see a tea party-linked candidate as their party’s standard-bearer in 2016.

de rigueur on October 16, 2013 at 3:16 PM

questions and no answers

tick tock goes the bull crap clock

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:16 PM

…Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Is that the side of history with 17 Trillion in debt and 200+ trillion in unfunded liabilities?

Is this the side of history that Obama as a Senator railed against when he opposed a debt ceiling increase as a betrayal of future generations?

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:17 PM

F’n RINO!!!!! Didn’t take long for Cruz to CAVE, did it?

NoStoppingUs on October 16, 2013 at 3:17 PM

He will vote against the Reid-McConnell deal. Which will make the Republicans who support it MUCH squishier RINOs. The vote is what will go on record. Actually, the vote that mattered to conservatives went down about 3 weeks ago. As someone noted up-thread: “Much has been revealed.”

de rigueur on October 16, 2013 at 3:07 PM

Hmmm… well, which is it?

Do procedural votes like cloture, waiving debate, etc. actually count? Or not?

Wasn’t it only a cople weeks ago that the cloture vote was the one that counted… but the actual vote was just for show?

But now… it’s the other way around?

This kind of shifting goalpost type thinking seems to me to be a symptom of the Alyinsky-ization of the Right. We’ve kind of become our own version of the old Democratic Underground ne’er-do-wells… and we are starting to think and converse like a bunch of DailyKos kids.

Where are the Burkean Conservatives when we need them?
I suppose those of us whose conservatism was informed by Russell Kirk are just a bunch of CINO’s in today’s ideological landscape on the right.

Pity.

RightWay79 on October 16, 2013 at 3:17 PM

At least slavenowandie is honest about defining political deviance down and wanting to bankrupt the country, unlike the RINO trolls who snipe at the Tea Party and then run away when challenged about the need for fiscal responsibility in governance.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:13 PM

You give liveslaveanddie too much credit. Being a good statist he’s pretty sure he can fund the socialist dream with the wealth of the “rich”, that massive debt is good and necessary blah blah blah.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:19 PM

It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his. But Ted Cruz doesn’t *have* an audience anymore. Rand Paul does, but not Cruz.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

What a weird, counter-factual, wrong-side-of-history (as in, history that’s actually happened, not the Marxist wish casting variety) conclusion, based on this

Texas Sen. Ted Cruz… has emerged as Republican voters’ top pick for the 2016 presidential nomination, according to a poll released Friday.

The Public Policy Polling survey found that 20 per cent of Republicans favor Cruz, followed by 17 per cent for Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul…

The results show that a majority of GOP voters who have a preference – 47 per cent overall – want to see a tea party-linked candidate as their party’s standard-bearer in 2016.

de rigueur on October 16, 2013 at 3:16 PM

The eternal collectivist dream of a “jackboot to the human face forever” will not be deterred by a bourgeois appeal to “objective facts.”

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:19 PM

Nice job libreeordie, you hijacked the thread once again. I’m sure everyone here wants to get back to urinating on Republicans but you distracted us with liberal shiny objects.

rhombus on October 16, 2013 at 3:21 PM

Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his.
libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Written by the history “professor” who regularly gets history wrong.
gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:04 PM

Well now, hold on everone.
libtardfreak may have a good point – for once.
This really isn’t a Reaganite nation anymore – we’re just too far into the Idiocracy. The average Obumble voter, much like libtardfreak here, just doesn’t have the brain power to understand how the Dems (and eRINOs) are gaining total control of their lives – the new slavery of gubmint dependence.
They just have no clue how much they’re actually paying for all these freebies.

dentarthurdent on October 16, 2013 at 3:21 PM

Cornyn is scared out of his re-elction money already,,

He has adds running full time during all the conservative talk shows here in Texas all about how conservative he is, how big a NRA guy he is, how he has all the conservative things he did,,,,

He knows we have him in the spot light, sure the Bush/RINO Christ Cristy Cream money R’s will fund him big time….

Cruz had no money, no one knew him at the start,,,,all Cruz did was tell the truth and ask U.S. to help him help U.S..

Done deal.

Just do it.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

the big thing that’s changed since Reagan has been the total co-opting of big business by the left. For example, the lefties weren’t the only people that didn’t want the mandate delayed. The insurance companies didn’t either…for obvious reasons…they would suffer big losses if only the sick signed up.

no doubt that was one of the big items of the RINO go do was keep the mandate for the insurance companies

this seriously why we need a third party. RINOs can be out front and support all the business initiatives…the Dem would support all the socialist initiatives…big money vs. big money

for the rest of us a small party, say 25 percent, would focus people’s minds…RINOs couldn’t count on us…and I bet their a fair number of liberals who could be convinced not to go full on socialist

r keller on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

Only if the R-Establishment stepped up to the plate and hung it around his neck, which, as we have seen, they WILL NEVER DO.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:10 PM

Then welcome to the monarchy. If you really think there’s no point fighting, because Obama would openly violate even those tenets of the Constitution and get away with (as he has already done in other areas, no argument), then all is lost. Then, there’s really no point worrying about future elections anyway, because Obama’s already shown that he has effectively captured the entirety of the government and runs it his way – the Congress has no power, Obama has assumed it unto himself.

All that is left is open revolution, or to be a slave and pray that Obama will be a benevolent master.

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

Time now to watch obamacare implode (as it has already started) and watch every dem who supported the worst law passed in 100 years scramble before next year’s election. Liberalism is a mental disorder-they live in a land of delusion.

Ta111 on October 16, 2013 at 3:16 PM

But don’t expect ObamaCare’s epic failure to fall on Democrats.

This is the horrific beauty of “liberal democracy” vs outright socialism: when you don’t “literally” control the means of production but instead micro-manage it with endless regulations then when your socialist schemes die you can blame the institutions and the rich instead of your constant interference.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

At least slavenowandie is honest about defining political deviance down and wanting to bankrupt the country, unlike the RINO trolls who snipe at the Tea Party and then run away when challenged about the need for fiscal responsibility in governance.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:13 PM

You give liveslaveanddie too much credit. Being a good statist he’s pretty sure he can fund the socialist dream with the wealth of the “rich”, that massive debt is good and necessary blah blah blah.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:19 PM

Probably, he’s an economic, historical and moral illiterate, by choice. That still puts him head and shoulders above the RINO moral cowards. Creeps like that posing as “moderates” and “pragmatists” are the enablers of tyranny, and they always have been.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

annoyinglittletwerp on October 16, 2013 at 3:15 PM

Didn’t I hear that he is retiring? He’ll vote with the Dems.

Cindy Munford on October 16, 2013 at 3:23 PM

This will probably make it into the QOTD tonight, and it was linked over by Ace, but Brit Hume is exactly right here:

“Veteran political observers on both the left and right are still trying to figure out what the House Tea Party caucus and its Senate pied piper Ted Cruz were thinking when they insisted on using the threat of a government shutdown to defund ObamaCare.

“It was a hopeless strategy that has not only failed in its stated goal, but helped send the Republican Party to its lowest favorability ratings ever.

“In conventional terms, it seems inexplicable, but Senator Cruz and his adherents do not view things in conventional terms. They look back over the past half-century, including the supposedly golden era of Ronald Reagan, and see the uninterrupted forward march of the American left. Entitlement spending never stopped growing. The regulatory state continued to expand. The national debt grew and grew and finally in the Obama years, exploded. They see an American population becoming unrecognizable from the free and self-reliant people they thought they knew. And they see the Republican Party as having utterly failed to stop the drift toward an unfree nation supervised by an overweening and bloated bureaucracy. They are not interested in Republican policies that merely slow the growth of this leviathan. They want to stop it and reverse it. And they want to show their supporters they’ll try anything to bring that about.

“And if some of those things turn out to be reckless and doomed, well so be it.”

Amen.

Rational Thought on October 16, 2013 at 3:23 PM

Cornyn is scared out of his re-elction money already,,

He has adds running full time during all the conservative talk shows here in Texas all about how conservative he is, how big a NRA guy he is, how he has all the conservative things he did,,,,

He knows we have him in the spot light, sure the Bush/RINO Christ Cristy Cream money R’s will fund him big time….

Cruz had no money, no one knew him at the start,,,,all Cruz did was tell the truth and ask U.S. to help him help U.S..

Done deal.

Just do it.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

Yes, he’s clearly already nervous; I hear those commercials every day already.

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:23 PM

Only if the R-Establishment stepped up to the plate and hung it around his neck, which, as we have seen, they WILL NEVER DO.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:10 PM

Then welcome to the monarchy. If you really think there’s no point fighting, because Obama would openly violate even those tenets of the Constitution and get away with (as he has already done in other areas, no argument), then all is lost. Then, there’s really no point worrying about future elections anyway, because Obama’s already shown that he has effectively captured the entirety of the government and runs it his way – the Congress has no power, Obama has assumed it unto himself.

All that is left is open revolution, or to be a slave and pray that Obama will be a benevolent master.

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

That pretty much sums it up. Today is just the first cashing-out of years of childish “I wa’fwee candy” promotion by both parties. There will be much more to come.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:25 PM

Cindy Munford on October 16, 2013 at 3:23 PM

Nope. He’s not retiring.

annoyinglittletwerp on October 16, 2013 at 3:25 PM

Sadly, Cruz is on the wrong side of history. This would’ve worked in the 80s, but we’re no longer Reaganite nation. It isn’t just the message, its the audience. Reagan played to his and Obama played to his.

libfreeordie on October 16, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Whether or not he is on the “wrong side of history” or not is conjecture based on fantasy. Maybe he’s on the right side of history. You’re just praying that he’s on the wrong side because you don’t agree with him and that’s not how things turn out in your fantasies.

But, more importantly, even if he is on the wrong side of history, that doesn’t mean that he is wrong. Despite what happens in your fantasy world, evil can triumph over good in the real world.

besser tot als rot on October 16, 2013 at 3:26 PM

NoStoppingUs on October 16, 2013 at 3:17 PM

Back away from the bong. Cruz is voting NO-that’s not a cave.

annoyinglittletwerp on October 16, 2013 at 3:26 PM

Well now, hold on everone.
libtardfreak may have a good point – for once.
This really isn’t a Reaganite nation anymore – we’re just too far into the Idiocracy. The average Obumble voter, much like libtardfreak here, just doesn’t have the brain power to understand how the Dems (and eRINOs) are gaining total control of their lives – the new slavery of gubmint dependence.
They just have no clue how much they’re actually paying for all these freebies.

dentarthurdent on October 16, 2013 at 3:21 PM

We may not be a Reagan nation anymore but we werent’ really a Reagan nation before Reagan either.

Nixon and Obama have very similar records (massive government expansion, corruption, etc). FDR and LBJ were big statists; it’s been rare for Americans to en masse oppose statist policies in the last 100 years. Liberals have damaged their own brand name though and discredited many of their own policies – a lot of FDR’s big state policies are currently unpalatable to modern Americans.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:27 PM

RightWay79 on October 16, 2013 at 3:17 PM

Yes, of course, procedural votes count. Which is why I referenced the Senate vote of 3 weeks ago, the cloture vote that permitted Harry Reid to strip the initial House CR of Obamacare defunding. Had the GOP senators voted against that, Obamacare as of right now would remain… defunded.

I suppose Cruz’s intention to go along with “unanimous consent” on the Reid-McConnell bill counts as a procedural “vote,” but it’s a vote that will be recorded as, um, “unanimous consent,” resulting in the elimination of a 3-hour delay before inevitable passage of the Reid-McConnell. Not much of a hill to die on.

I’m sure Cruz, like the rest of us, is now awaiting Word From on High as to what WILL be the next hill to die on. Or even to fight on. Or even to take a stand.

de rigueur on October 16, 2013 at 3:27 PM

But don’t expect ObamaCare’s epic failure to fall on Democrats.

This is the horrific beauty of “liberal democracy” vs outright socialism: when you don’t “literally” control the means of production but instead micro-manage it with endless regulations then when your socialist schemes die you can blame the institutions and the rich instead of your constant interference.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:22 PM

The term you’re looking for is “fascism,” of course.

http://www.la-articles.org.uk/fascism.htm

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:28 PM

Amen.

Rational Thought on October 16, 2013 at 3:23 PM

Yep. Spot on.

besser tot als rot on October 16, 2013 at 3:28 PM

That pretty much sums it up. Today is just the first cashing-out of years of childish “I wa’fwee candy” promotion by both parties. There will be much more to come.

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:25 PM

Except when you can’t borrow any more money to run the Government and the give-aways. And then interest rates go up on what you already have borrowed. Than all you can do is print money.

oldroy on October 16, 2013 at 3:28 PM

Amen.

Rational Thought on October 16, 2013 at 3:23 PM

Amen and hallelujah.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:29 PM

forced a technical default

LOL, doubling-down on the previously doubled-down, oft-debunked ignorant ‘default’ threat, eh?

Midas on October 16, 2013 at 2:49 PM

Not a lot of math majors here either: None of You [Reporters] Were Math Majors, Were You?

slickwillie2001 on October 16, 2013 at 3:29 PM

Cruz fought a good fight.

Rand Paul kind of left him out there dangling – but Paul is a slick one.

Cruz isn’t running for POTUS guys – Cruz is a real ideologue who believes in what he’s doing. He believes someone has to fight and take the heat – and it’s him.

He’ll be voting NO against this compromise. So what’s the big deal?

He’ll be remembered as the last guy standing on the day the ObamaCare and Single Payer war was lost … forever.

And that’s not a bad way to be remembered.

HondaV65 on October 16, 2013 at 3:09 PM

No, Cruz never had any intentions of running for president. Cruz is smart. He knows his political career is over; however, book deals, speaking engagements’ stock went through the roof. Paul on the other hand is running

Redford on October 16, 2013 at 3:30 PM

The term you’re looking for is “fascism,” of course.

http://www.la-articles.org.uk/fascism.htm

ebrown2 on October 16, 2013 at 3:28 PM

Fascism is a pretty strong word. For it to be fascism you’d need a president who gave special deals to corporations…oh, wait.

gwelf on October 16, 2013 at 3:30 PM

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