Video: World shocked that espionage agency conducts espionage

posted at 2:01 pm on September 2, 2013 by Ed Morrissey

In yet another revelation from the Edward Snowden cache, Glenn Greenwald told a Brazilian news show that the NSA successfully penetrated the communication of Mexican president Enrique Pena Nieto’s e-mails before and after the e;ection, and also intercepted some of the communications of Brazilian president Dilma Vana Rousseff. This will shock those who haven’t yet realized that the NSA’s explicit mission is to, er, intercept communications abroad in order to conduct and facilitate intelligence gathering:

The National Security Agency’s spy program targeted the communications of the Brazilian and Mexican presidents, and in the case of Mexico’s leader accessed the content of emails before he was elected, the U.S. journalist who obtained secret documents from NSA leaker Edward Snowden said Sunday.

Journalist Glenn Greenwald, who lives in Rio de Janeiro, told Globo’s news program “Fantastico” that a document dated June 2012 shows that Mexican President Enrique Pena Nieto’s emails were being read. The document’s date is a month before Pena Nieto was elected.

The document on which Greenwald based the report includes communications from Pena Nieto indicating who he would like to name to some government posts among other information. It’s not clear if the spying continues.

As for Brazil’s leader, the June 2012 document “doesn’t include any of Dilma’s specific intercepted messages, the way it does for Nieto,” Greenwald told The Associated Press in an email. “But it is clear in several ways that her communications were intercepted, including the use of DNI Presenter, which is a program used by NSA to open and read emails and online chats.”

The U.S. targeting mapped out the aides with whom Rousseff communicated and went a level further by tracking patterns of how those aides communicated with one another and also third parties, according to the document.

NBC dedicated 88 seconds of air time to it today:

Visit NBCNews.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy

I have two reactions to this. First, while the revelations are embarrassing to the US — the first rule of espionage is not to get caught — this isn’t exactly a shock, except perhaps to the extent that the NSA has succeeded. We continue to fund the NSA to do precisely what this reveals: listen in on foreign communications in order to keep from getting surprised by events in the present and future.  We can debate whether we should have an NSA that does this, although it would probably be a short and one-sided debate, but that’s its explicit mission.  The controversy isn’t about the NSA listening in on foreign conversations and foreign leaders, but on the NSA conducting domestic surveillance, which American law is supposed to prohibit.

Second: This is not whistleblowing.  What Snowden is doing with these revelations is explicitly intended to damage the US and its ability to conduct intelligence outside of its borders, not to push a much-needed debate on the PATRIOT Act and checks on domestic surveillance after 12 years.


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NSA conducting domestic surveillance

My only beef. And it’s a big one.

John the Libertarian on September 2, 2013 at 2:05 PM

‘Friends’

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:05 PM

Perhaps one of our CIA operatives in The Soviet Union Russia can show Snowden first hand what a good agent can accomplish. That will end the leaks from this troublesome traitor.

simkeith on September 2, 2013 at 2:06 PM

Recall how not long ago the Brazilians cheered the obama carnival.

No one c/b more schadenfreudig than I am at the stupid obama-cheering-world. You wanted him, you got him!!!

This includes the US dummies too.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:08 PM

Those Brazilians and their sugar racket!

Jeddite on September 2, 2013 at 2:10 PM

Perhaps one of our CIA operatives in The Soviet Union Russia can show Snowden first hand what a good agent can accomplish. That will end the leaks from this troublesome traitor whistleblower with no free US resort to expose his gov’t’s unconstitutional actions.

simkeith on September 2, 2013 at 2:06 PM

In a not so USSR similar USA he should have been able to go to congress and tell them what is going on.

YOU deserve to be destroyed by said gov’t, all of you who give up your freedoms for the illusion of security.

I do hope that the US gov’t will kill Snowden. I hoped he’d take a private plane from Hong Kong to Russia, so that obama would have him droned. It would have been the irony of all ironies in all of history.

Snowden might be many things, but he well always be the guy who brought obama to size, for the entire world to see. He undressed him, totally. That the US doesn’t know what all he’s got makes this the stupidest and most thuggish admin. in history.

Enjoy your tracking, sheepleton of the world. Russia laughs at you because obama enabled them to do so. Therein lies the legacy of Snowden. It’s a worthy cause to die for, and he knows/accepts it.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:15 PM

Double quotes are better than single :(

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:16 PM

In yet another revelation from the Edward Snowden cache, Glenn Greenwald told a Brazilian news show that the NSA successfully penetrated the communication of Mexican president Enrique Pena Nieto’s e-mails before and after the e;ection, and also intercepted some of the communications of Brazilian president Dilma Vana Rousseff. This will shock those who haven’t yet realized that the NSA’s explicit mission is to, er, intercept communications abroad in order to conduct and facilitate intelligence gathering:

This shows that Snowden and his idiot supporters have no clue what they’re talking about. I’m glad the NSA is spying on the dirtbag Mexicans and Brazilians. That is exactly what the NSA is supposed to do and anyone who thinks there’s anything wrong with that is a moron.

I guess … seeing how Mexicans and Brazilians are nothing but “undocumented Americans” (just waiting for each of them to criminally force himself into our country to then claim his “rightful” American citizenship) then one might be confused as to the difference between the NSA doing its actual job spying on foreigners versus spying on my emails and the like …

Snowden was a Barky-supporter – which made him an America-hater and idiot. The NSA is out-of-control in domestic spying on all Americans that it has no business doing, but Snowden had no clue about why any of that was wrong. That moron thinks that us spying on anyone is wrong. Friggin pea-brain, Barky-supporting douchebag traitor.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on September 2, 2013 at 2:16 PM

NBC also aired ZERO time when Oblama started dissing on our White-Mexican friends…

patman77 on September 2, 2013 at 2:19 PM

Second: This is not whistleblowing. What Snowden is doing with these revelations is explicitly intended to damage the US and its ability to conduct intelligence outside of its borders, not to push a much-needed debate on the PATRIOT Act and checks on domestic surveillance after 12 years.

None of it is whistleblowing. Do you think that the terrorists which the NSA was tracking using metadata have not already changed how they do business, in an attempt to make it impossible for us to track them? Doing business by phone was a guaranteed red light, and the terrorists thought they were needles in haystacks. What Snowden has shown them is the fact that the needle is now quite visible in the haystack.

If I were the terrorists, knowing what I’ve been told by Snowden, I’d completely abandon comms by the phone system and move to “one shot” websites and things of that ilk, along with out of band communications. So, what Snowden has done is shatter the complacency of the terrorists, and for no extension or putative extension of our existing rights.

How many of you have changed how you use the phone in light of the NSA revelations? If not, why not? It’s still going on….

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:20 PM

Edward “Death to the American Pigs!” Snowden.
Beloved of Fidel Castro, ChiComs, Chavezites, and ex-KGB agents.
Hero of some conservatives.

Wait…what?

AngusMc on September 2, 2013 at 2:21 PM

but he well will always be the guy

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:22 PM

14:59

Ellis on September 2, 2013 at 2:22 PM

The controversy isn’t about the NSA listening in on foreign conversations and foreign leaders, but on the NSA conducting domestic surveillance, which American law is supposed to prohibit.

American law does prohibit domestic spying. That’s why the NSA is a rogue organization that has betrayed the trust placed in its operations. Clapper and Alexander should be in jail for overseeing domestic surveillance let alone lying to Congress about it.

Which is why Snowden isn’t a hero but we’d never know just how much criminal activity the NSA was engaged in either.

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 2:23 PM

Double quotes are better than single :(

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:16 PM

It’s like exclamation points. Two are better than one.

John the Libertarian on September 2, 2013 at 2:24 PM

This shows that Snowden and his idiot supporters have no clue what they’re talking about. I’m glad the NSA is spying on the dirtbag Mexicans and Brazilians. That is exactly what the NSA is supposed to do and anyone who thinks there’s anything wrong with that is a moron.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on September 2, 2013 at 2:16 PM

NSA conducting domestic surveillance

My only beef. And it’s a big one.

John the Libertarian on September 2, 2013 at 2:05 PM

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:26 PM

MSM reactions;

NSA spying on Americans in CONUS:

“Who cares? Besides, they’re all evul tea****ers, so they deserve it, the FBI should kill ‘em all anyway.”

NSA spying on the head of state of a country that has ongoing insurrections, porous borders, a tendency to dump its unwanted population on us ala’ Castro, a massive drug industry run by the insurrectionists and its own corrupt officials, which is also pressuring us to abridge our citizens’ Constitutional rights to keep its dubiously-honest regime’ in power;

OMG!!!ELEVENTY!!!!HELLLPPP!!! VIOLATION OF INTERNATIONAL LAW OR SOMETHING!!!YEEEARRRGGHH!!

Obvious conclusion;

Heinlein was correct in concluding that actual ratiocinative powers (i.e., the ability to think) are not a requirement to be a “journalist”.

clear ether

eon

eon on September 2, 2013 at 2:26 PM

Enjoy your tracking, sheepleton of the world. Russia laughs at you because obama enabled them to do so. Therein lies the legacy of Snowden. It’s a worthy cause to die for, and he knows/accepts it.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:15 PM

Ah, sheepleton — the ultimate epithet. Heh.

OK, so, how many of us are able to defend ourselves against terrorists? Do you check your plane for bombs? Do you carefully examine all of the other passengers for strange behavior? To put it bluntly, there anything you personally can do to stop them? I didn’t think so. Therefore, you are a sheep. All of your protestations to the contrary — you are a sheep.

As a fellow sheep I greet you — ba ram ewe. ba ram ewe.

Now, what protects the sheep from the wolves? A: Sheep dogs. But the sheep fear the sheep dogs, because only motive separates the sheep dog from the wolf. They smell like wolves, and, in some manners act like wolves — except they don’t prey on the sheep.

That’s the wolf’s job.

Now, as a sheep, wouldn’t you like the smartest, most knowledgeable sheep dog guarding you? You don’t have to like him or his manners, but he really does have to be a good guard…

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:28 PM

NSA charter is specifically for NSA to intercept, collect, analyze, and produce intelligence product from foreign nations and pass that intelligence to the President and policy makers to enhance the security of the United States vis-a-vis foreign enemies and potential enemies.

Anyone who is against that NSA mission is living in a fool’s paradise…or the local looney bin…or should be.

It is in the use of NSA…an activity of the Department of Defense…using the US military to spy on American citizens within the borders of the United States of America not for national security reasons but for the mere convenience to policy makers and the President, that runs contrary to our Constitution, our established laws, and our Rights as Citizens.

Anyone who is in favor of that NSA mission does not deserve to live here, in the United States, under our Constitutional governance…and should surrender their citizenship immediately.

If DoJ, the FBI or Department of Mockery Prevention wishes to establish such a huge, expensive and all pervasive set-up to monitor USA citizens….have at it…let’s see that discussion and debate in Congress and in public…then submit it to a national referendum.

Or have we already become Erich Mielke’s East Germany?

As for Snowden…he lost his “cred” when he started passing around the things NSA can legally do…instead of sticking to the script and exposing the illegalities of NSA’s new age mission.

If he suddenly finds he suddenly has a lot in common with Georgy Markov…well, stuff happens.

coldwarrior on September 2, 2013 at 2:29 PM

It’s like exclamation points. Two are better than one.

John the Libertarian on September 2, 2013 at 2:24 PM

But does it go to eleventy?

Steve Eggleston on September 2, 2013 at 2:31 PM

My only beef. And it’s a big one.

John the Libertarian on September 2, 2013 at 2:05 PM

Eh, you have to break a few….uh…joints of beef to make a goulash.

What, you would rather DIE in a fiery plane crash caused by a Tea Party fanatic than accept having your every communication surveilled? You are a homophobe and a communist.

Bishop on September 2, 2013 at 2:32 PM

Whew! What a relief! I’ve been waiting for another example from Greenwald/Snowden of an American’s rights being violated!

Right! We haven’t seen ONE showing that NSA the organization systematically read the emails etc of Americans.

NavyMustang on September 2, 2013 at 2:40 PM

Let’s be clear: I want the NSA to snoop on every other living being on the face of the planet except our citizens.

I don’t care much if, say, Germany reads my emails. They’re not my government. They can’t come for me. Theoretically. I’m happy to be on all sorts of watch lists for governments all over the world so long as none of them have the power to come knocking on my door. And I have zero heartburn about my nation doing the same.

If I have been plotting to blow up something in another country, and they figure that out by intercepting my emails, and I’m dumb enough to go there and they catch me, that’s how the system is supposed to work. I expect my country to at least try to do the same thing.

TexasDan on September 2, 2013 at 2:41 PM

What, you would rather DIE in a fiery plane crash caused by a Tea Party fanatic than accept having your every communication surveilled? You are a homophobe and a communist.

Bishop on September 2, 2013 at 2:32 PM

Yeah, look at all the lives that have been saved by domestic spying. The Fort Hood shooting, the Times Square bomber, the Boston Marathon bombing…… all foiled by domestic spying! Right?

The NSA damage control tried to assure us that they were really really effective at stopping terrorism by spying on us but we’d have to take their word for it. And I don’t buy a word of it. I think the data they’ve collected has been used for partisan political purposes and they’ve abused the secrecy normally afforded the intelligence community in the name of national security.

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM

Second: This is not whistleblowing. What Snowden is doing with these revelations is explicitly intended to damage the US and its ability to conduct intelligence outside of its borders, not to push a much-needed debate on the PATRIOT Act and checks on domestic surveillance after 12 years.

Then why is nothing done about the bolded part”

How many of you have changed how you use the phone in light of the NSA revelations? If not, why not? It’s still going on….

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:20 PM

Didn’t have to because what they are doing was known for the knowing. I said often “if you have not been hurt by Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, Google, Yahoo, Microsoft, e-mail, cellphones…etc., then you will be”. It was known by a few. Snowden exposed the constitution-usurpers on domestic spying, which shocked even the court which is supposed to approve it and Diane Feinstein. The land needs to wake up or go to the gulags…that simple.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:44 PM

As for Snowden…he lost his “cred” when he started passing around the things NSA can legally do…instead of sticking to the script and exposing the illegalities of NSA’s new age mission.

If he suddenly finds he suddenly has a lot in common with Georgy Markov…well, stuff happens.

coldwarrior on September 2, 2013 at 2:29 PM

Yeah. I was on the fence about him for awhile, but no longer. A hero would have taken the specific documents needed to demonstrate illegal domestic spying, and would have gone to members of congress under whistle-blower protection, maybe with a journalist or two in the know in case that got quashed.

The way he did it, what he took, the individuals to whom he entrusted that info–all paint a different picture.

TexasDan on September 2, 2013 at 2:45 PM

Let’s be clear: I want the NSA to snoop on every other living being on the face of the planet except our citizens.

TexasDan on September 2, 2013 at 2:41 PM

You’re missing a pretty important part of the story. NSA has been datasharing and other agencies have used this “classified” information for partisan political purposes and have even created a system to lie about the source. This isn’t open and transparent government (I never expected NSA to be that) but this is corrupt government that betrays the trust we’ve placed in it.

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 2:47 PM

Edward “Death to the American Pigs!” Snowden.
Beloved of Fidel Castro, ChiComs, Chavezites, and ex-KGB agents.
Hero of some conservatives.

Wait…what?

AngusMc on September 2, 2013 at 2:21 PM

Can you hold more than one thought in God-given brain? Yes, you can.

He can be all that…and still, what they are doing domestically is unconstitutional. Enjoy the thugs. They track your every move, not only phones and e-mail. It’s unconstitutional.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:47 PM

Heinlein was correct in concluding that actual ratiocinative powers (i.e., the ability to think) are not a requirement to be a “journalist”.

clear ether

eon

eon on September 2, 2013 at 2:26 PM

Stassel had a show on yesterday “Stupid in America”. One hued principal “I don’t believe in testing kids and also not tenured teachers”.

Stossel “How do you know they are learning/teaching?”

Principal “By looking into their eyes”.

Jeantels and such vote.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:51 PM

“I don’t believe in testing kids and also not tenured teachers”.

Stossel “How do you know they are learning/teaching?”

Principal “By looking into their eyes”.

Jeantels and such vote.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 2:51 PM

The fact of the matter is that we are failing children. They “graduate” from high school unable to start college without first taking remedial classes. The drop out rate among minorities is around 50%. And we’ve definitely developed the next generation of LIVs who can tell you which Kardashian is bedding which pro athlete but couldn’t tell you anything about government that isn’t covered by Schoolhouse Rock and/or Parks and Recreation.

I’m neutral on the idea of using testing as a performance standard for teachers only because I haven’t seen one such system that doesn’t afford plenty of opportunity for blame shifting (i.e. I can’t help it if I got all the stupid kids in my class) and the unions are very good at blaming society for the incompetence of far too many teachers.

But how do you measure a child’s progress without testing? The “eye test” seems pretty damned idiotic.

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 3:00 PM

…I don’t like what he did…or how he did it…but who in Congress would have protected him? …we would know NOTHING right now.

KOOLAID2 on September 2, 2013 at 3:02 PM

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:28 PM

First, you must have self-congratulated –flagellated yourself with that entire comment.

Ah, sheepleton — the ultimate epithet. Heh.

It is, thanks to a brilliant friend. You should add it to the dictionary.

OK, so, how many of us are able to defend ourselves against terrorists? Do you check your plane for bombs?

Yes

Do you carefully examine all of the other passengers for strange behavior?

Yes

To put it bluntly, there anything you personally can do to stop them?

Yes

I didn’t think so.

No, you didn’t.

Therefore, you are a sheep. All of your protestations to the contrary — you are a sheep.

You can enjoy your sheepledom, but I will NEVER be a sheep. They only get fooled and eaten.

As a fellow sheep I greet you — ba ram ewe. ba ram ewe.

I would never even want to be in your vicinity, weasel. I don’t hang out with sheep.

Now, what protects the sheep from the wolves? A: Sheep dogs.

See Israel and their profiling, psycho-methods, and all the others…still talking about flying and anti-terrorism means.

But the sheep fear the sheep dogs, because only motive separates the sheep dog from the wolf. They smell like wolves, and, in some manners act like wolves — except they don’t prey on the sheep.

That’s the wolf’s job.

If you’d pay attention, I never said that nothing s/b done to protect the people of the USA/world against the 7th century-thinking, but this century-means-applying and very clever and ruthless, terrorism. They want to kill us all. Period. I loathe all who declared “terrorism is dead”. Keep eyes wide open.

Now, as a sheep, wouldn’t you like the smartest, most knowledgeable sheep dog guarding you?

Just look at this admin. and you see: Hasan, Boston, Benghazi, Iran, Iraq, Lybia, Egypt, Pakistan, Syria…Yemen, Tunisia…yeppers, very smart. Meh, they killed decrepit and impotent Bin Laden…and I’m not convinced yet that they did…he might have been dead already. Until they show me proof I’ll stick to my proof, that he’s been dead since a long time ago.

You don’t have to like him or his manners, but he really does have to be a good guard…

Indeed, but he isn’t, not this guard, these guards, and they are not supposed to do thing illegally…IRS, NSA, HHS, DHS, FEC, quite a few more…all directly linked to the domestic NSA spying…my big and only peeve.

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:28 PM

Other than that, enjoy your reasoning.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:05 PM

The real story is that Snowman had to exist at all for us to find out the level of government intrusion infecting our lives.

We don’t have public servants or representatives of the people any longer, now they’re mostly self-serving, hypocritical, retarded losers looking to pad their own wallets at the expense of anyone and everyone else.

Maxine Waters and Charlie Rangel were not who the Founders had in mind when they imagined a government chosen by the people.

Bishop on September 2, 2013 at 3:07 PM

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:28 PM

Anyone who calls people “sheeple”, simply thinks he is better than them.

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:08 PM

…Senator Senile is being interviewed right now!
…he IS NUTS!…Lindsey Cracker too!…New Syria!
F the two of them!..

KOOLAID2 on September 2, 2013 at 3:09 PM

…I don’t like what he did…or how he did it…but who in Congress would have protected him? …we would know NOTHING right now.

KOOLAID2 on September 2, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Look at how many in Congress tried to cover the whole thing up when it did come to light.

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 3:09 PM

This is about a federal government and a spying agency that has gone rogue, attacks the very people who support it, and is destined to fail.

Stepan on September 2, 2013 at 3:09 PM

Anyone who calls people “sheeple”, simply thinks he is better than them.

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:08 PM

No, anybody who voted for Obama should be grateful if all they are called is sheeple. Greedy stupid unthinking bastards who are getting what they deserve from the government they voted into power.

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 3:11 PM

Do you carefully examine all of the other passengers for strange behavior? To put it bluntly, there anything you personally can do to stop them?

unclesmrgol on September 2, 2013 at 2:28 PM

Airline passengers have stopped more terrorist attacks like the Underwear Bomber, the Shoe Bomber, Flight 93, than the TSA has (none).

sharrukin on September 2, 2013 at 3:12 PM

Anyone who calls people “sheeple”, simply thinks he is better than them.

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:08 PM

Anyone who doesn’t recognize that the land/world are full of sheeple, out X-mas shopping in Aug/Sept, while they are being ruined, is clueless.

Wake up, or enjoy it. The choice is still yours.

Jeantels and the obamaphonelady are sheep.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:13 PM

MSNBC are sheep

The media, most of them are sheep.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:14 PM

Always with this weird hero/traitor false dichotomy. Snowden can be neither a hero, nor a traitor.

Jeddite on September 2, 2013 at 3:17 PM

Anyone who calls people “sheeple”, simply thinks he is better than them.

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:08 PM

Indeed…only socialists/communists believe in equality…for the sheep. Your masters, however, love the sheep, while they live the lives of wolves.

Think free or enjoy it.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:18 PM

Anyone who is in favor of that NSA mission does not deserve to live here, in the United States, under our Constitutional governance…and should surrender their citizenship immediately.

coldwarrior on September 2, 2013 at 2:29 PM

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:22 PM

One of the big take-aways from this is our supposed representatives and our courts are too dumb to realize when liberties are being trampled. That is at best. At worst they are complicit.

Remember the George HW Bush grocery scanner image? That is every last one of our public defenders. They don’t have real jobs – so how can you expect them to be knowledgeable enough to protect our liberties?

antisense on September 2, 2013 at 3:24 PM

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:13 PM

Ironically, you are among the most sheep-like of all commenters on here, going on and on: “Wakeupfoolsmaytheybelugacaviarsheeple!”

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:24 PM

Baa Baa pack sheep, Have you any wool?

Yes sir, yes sir, three bags full.

All for my master, who keeps the wolf away

While I sit here and eat my hay.

LegendHasIt on September 2, 2013 at 3:32 PM

Perhaps one of our CIA operatives in The Soviet Union Russia can show Snowden first hand what a good agent can accomplish.

simkeith on September 2, 2013 at 2:06 PM

Our Man Flint Yusuf

Shy Guy on September 2, 2013 at 3:34 PM

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:24 PM

You do make irony indignant.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:34 PM

Shy Guy on September 2, 2013 at 3:34 PM

Hell, the infiltration goes all the way to the top.

Brennan is almost certainly a convert.

LegendHasIt on September 2, 2013 at 3:40 PM

eon on September 2, 2013 at 2:26 PM

Violation of international law. ROFLOL. This just shows how ignorant our media is. The US has refused to sign any of the Geneva Conventions (International Law) that prohibit electronic spying. Besides the media we have a lot of other Americans that don’t know this.

chemman on September 2, 2013 at 3:40 PM

Snowden was a Barky-supporter – which made him an America-hater and idiot. The NSA is out-of-control in domestic spying on all Americans that it has no business doing, but Snowden had no clue about why any of that was wrong. That moron thinks that us spying on anyone is wrong. Friggin pea-brain, Barky-supporting douchebag traitor.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on September 2, 2013 at 2:16 PM

Eh. I can forgive this Obama voter because he removed himself from the teat and actually did something. Unlike the rest of them who will fight to the death for their teat. His life is over, really. I’d call that penance for a bad vote.

As for the spying is wrong issue, I think at this point (imho of course) that it’s all about embarrassing the Obama Regime. If it were anything else they (Snowden/Greenwald) would have dumped everything. Apparently there’s still more out there.

I don’t care about the Captain Obvious crap. Like the Brazilians and Mexicans aren’t spying on us??

Still liking this Snowden chap. That may change, but not with this.

kim roy on September 2, 2013 at 3:43 PM

Anyone who calls people “sheeple”, simply thinks he is better than them.

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 3:08 PM

…your rattle…IS broken!

KOOLAID2 on September 2, 2013 at 3:45 PM

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 3:00 PM

The problem isn’t just blame shifting. Which I agree goes on far too much. My typical high school chemistry class (low-socioeconomic school district) had 36 students. Of those 36 students 3-5 read at grade level (10-12). The rest fell between 3.5 and 5.5. I would work hard to disaggregate the information so those low readers could understand what was being asked of them. When it came time for the standardized tests though the tests were written at the 11th grade level and I couldn’t disaggregate the test questions so those students had a chance to actually answer what was asked. I spent a lot of the year also teaching them how to recognize context clues. So most of my students did achieve proficient scores on the standardized test but really should have scored higher if the questions were written to their level of reading.

chemman on September 2, 2013 at 3:59 PM

OT – Cool!!!

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 4:00 PM

When this was proposed as a means for the NSA to conduct their surveillance — seeking the subpoena first and requiring telecoms to hold the data — the intelligence community scoffed at the notion, saying it was impractical for telecoms and for rapid investigations. The DEA and AT&T seem to think otherwise. What other telecoms are cooperating with the DEA in this endeavor? And why isn’t the NSA operating in this manner, rather than defaulting to building its own massive databases of citizen transactions without any probable cause for 99.999% of those whose records are collected?

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 4:09 PM

Hmm, if only there was some way to determine what the Syrian government was doing. Any ideas?

William Teach on September 2, 2013 at 4:15 PM

Hmm, if only there was some way to determine what the Syrian government was doing. Any ideas?

William Teach on September 2, 2013 at 4:15 PM

Maybe they could use the same crack team of analysts that was instrumental in predicting how Egypt was going to turn out?

sharrukin on September 2, 2013 at 4:21 PM

Egyptian Media Says Obama is a Muslim Brotherhood Member

Did this espionage agency know this?

If not, I’m not surprised.

1 in 5 Flagged CIA Applicants Have Ties to Hezbollah, Hamas and Al Qaeda

Akzed on September 2, 2013 at 4:26 PM

Snowden was a Barky-supporter – which made him an America-hater and idiot. The NSA is out-of-control in domestic spying on all Americans that it has no business doing, but Snowden had no clue about why any of that was wrong. That moron thinks that us spying on anyone is wrong. Friggin pea-brain, Barky-supporting douchebag traitor. ThePrimordialOrderedPair on September 2, 2013 at 2:16 PM

You’re happy being spied on? Good for you. You’re happy with “anyone” being spied on? Move to Cuba.

However, maybe the whole thing’s a ruse. Maybe a Barky-supporter doing something that harms the nation shouldn’t be surprising.

I think the spying part is more harmful than exposing the spying part, but I think you catch my drift.

Akzed on September 2, 2013 at 4:30 PM

If you have principles, and you attempt to live up to them everyday, you don’t need to spy.

When you are paranoid, and have an insatiable desire to control everything you survey, you create and fund the NSA.

Our government abandoned whatever principles it had long ago, and now exists only to ensure its continued existence.

Term limits, and no compensation of any kind for elected federal officials.

BobMbx on September 2, 2013 at 5:37 PM

Jeantels and the obamaphonelady are sheep.

Schadenfreude on September 2, 2013 at 3:13 PM

Even a sheep wouldn’t claim to a court that it had written a letter that it couldn’t read :) Those idiots are below sheep.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on September 2, 2013 at 6:19 PM

You’re happy being spied on? Good for you.

Akzed on September 2, 2013 at 4:30 PM

No. Show me where I said anything of the sort in my comment – any of my comments. I’m happy that the NSA is spying, internationally, which is what they are supposed to do.

We didn’t need Snowden to inform us that the feral government has run amok and is violating the Constitution at every turn. We’ve known that for the entire time of the Indonesian’s “reign”. We’ve known that Washington is breaking the law and abusing American citizens as a matter of policy, while bowing to illegals and islamists dirtbags all over the country. Domestic spying is part and parcel of BarkyCare, which the GOP couldn’t even be moved to force one friggin reading, in full, of even one of the many 2000+ page versions of the bill that had flown around Congress before it was ILLEGALLY forced through (and we all knew about all the crimes used to push it through).

We’ve known all this stuff and how Barky and his junta have targeted Americans (see the DHS declaring Tea Partiers and Constitution-lovers to be domestic terrorist threats). No one can claim that they haven’t known about all this BS going on. The NSA domestic crimes are just one more piece, and anyone with a brain could have guessed that that was all going on.

But, as to foreigners and areas outside of our sovereign territory – the Constitution doesn’t apply and our agencies are allowed to do p[retty much anything. The whole point of our spy agencies is to break the laws of any other nation we think we want some information about. Those agencies are specifically designed to break those laws of others, which is why they aren’t allowed to operate domestically, for the most part.

But, all of these criminal acts have gone on day after day with Barky and his junta running things. We didn’t need Snowden for anything. We needed the cowards in the GOP House to start impeachment proceedings against barky and all of his henchmen – and then to have them all criminally prosecuted after they are tossed from office. But, as that isn’t happening, none of this other stuff matters as the crimes just continue, unabated.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on September 2, 2013 at 6:29 PM

What gives me pause as far as the NSA is concerned is that they hired that sorry SOB to being with.

BigWyo on September 2, 2013 at 6:29 PM

What gives me pause as far as the NSA is concerned is that they hired that sorry SOB to being with.

BigWyo on September 2, 2013 at 6:29 PM

What gives me pause is the half-assed background check for his security clearance with just his mom and pole-dancing girlfriend interviewed before getting read into some very sensitive programs. HOW MANY OTHER SNOWDENS ARE STILL LURKING THE HALLWAYS OF FORT MEADE?

Happy Nomad on September 2, 2013 at 6:41 PM

Or maybe they’re shocked at the complete disregard for our Constitution??

KMC1 on September 2, 2013 at 7:02 PM

Violation of international law. ROFLOL. This just shows how ignorant our media is. The US has refused to sign any of the Geneva Conventions (International Law) that prohibit electronic spying. Besides the media we have a lot of other Americans that don’t know this.

chemman on September 2, 2013 at 3:40 PM

The number of Hague and Geneva accords we haven’t signed is rather amazing, considering the way such documents are waved around by our leaders. For example, Syria is being accused of violating the 1925 Geneva protocol banning chemical weapons (war gases, like mustard, phosgene, etc.) with its apparent use of same.

Two problems there are

1. The present Syrian government did not exist in 1925, and therefore wasn’t around to sign it. And

2. While forty nations eventually did sign it, the United States wasn’t one of them.

We also never signed the 1921 Geneva agreement, because among its restrictions was a ban on the use of submarines in warfare. (Germany didn’t sign either- gee, I wonder why?) And we only signed the Limited Nuclear Test Ban Treaty of 1963 after a clause prohibiting the use of nuclear weapons in actual combat was removed. (The Kennedy administration argued that such a prohibition had no business in a treaty prohibiting above-ground testing.)

Oh yes, all those people who claim our use of hollow-point bullets in police and self-defense use violates the Hague convention of 1905? Guess what?

No, we didn’t sign that one, either. It had that same clause about submarines, and one about aircraft, too.

cheers

eon

eon on September 2, 2013 at 7:37 PM

First rule…the Big One…there are no friendly countries.

Rule two…NO government talks honestly with any other government…ever.

Many can will and do act friendly. Many will tell you what they may wish to tell you, or tell you what they believe you want to hear.

Friendly nations canhave evetns happen to change that. Things can change in a minute…one bullet to the right head…things change rapidly.

Paranoia?

No, Practicality.

Fer instance…as was the case in the early days of WWII…WE spied on our allies. Why? They might lose. Not having people on the ground, in place, under our control could make the difference between a soft landing, for us, or a harsh landing for everybody. Or not knowing that maybe faced with the losses, and civilian casualties, one “ally” may sue for peace on their own…and we have to get out and fast. Or maybe one ruler was actually a lot more pro-Nazis than the press and dip circuit had led us to believe. Nice to know stuff.

We do the same to day. For pretty much the same reasons.

International communications…yes, we spy on that, as well.

Damn well better.

Corporations, big business, they do it all the time…why is there such a market for private encryption and such a market among private companies, globally to enhance their communications, keep them secret? Are they all up to evil deeds? No. Just acting prudently in a dog-eat-dog market.

If a foreign government gets word of a new design or process for widgets, that is one thing.

But if another company, say in Japan or India, China, Malaysia gets wind of the same…that is rocking mega bucks in no time. All produced, on the market and sold before your idea gets past the enviro-whackos and EPA, I’d wager.

So, knowing that your ally, your foreign BFF is about ready to tell you you just don’t float her boat anymore and Igor, or Ravish or TsuHui Tchai and their country is gonna be taking care of her needs…might be nice to know that before you send another boat load of missiles, or tanks, or just a bundle of cash to your good friend and ally, your foreign BFF…and she then scres you over and keeps the cash,m or tanks, or missiles. Has happened before…in recent history. Costly in so many many ways, too.

So, espionage, to put a nice French name to it, has been around a while, and will be. In our business we are known as the second oldest profession.

Espionage started way way way back, in the days when when Og was concerned that Oompa his wife may have been plying the oldest profession, and sent his best buddy Crump to find out.

But…using the military to spy on American citizens inside the United States?

When did that become right?

Legal?

Constitutional?

As Andi asked prison guard Hadley at Shawshank…”Captain Hadley, do you trust your wife?”…do you trust your government?

coldwarrior on September 2, 2013 at 9:07 PM

…your rattle…IS broken!

KOOLAID2 on September 2, 2013 at 3:45 PM

Always has been, baby!

thebrokenrattle on September 2, 2013 at 9:23 PM

How much do you think the Soviets and Putin are laughing at us right now?

nazo311 on September 2, 2013 at 10:13 PM

How much do you think the Soviets and Putin are laughing at us right now?

nazo311 on September 2, 2013 at 10:13 PM

That “Reset” button Hillary gave them on behalf of Obama?

Putin, Medvedev, Lavrov and General Sergei Shoigu are using it as a hockey puck for pick up games in between meetings at the Russian White House over on Krasnopresnenskaya.

Yeah, they are laughing.

coldwarrior on September 2, 2013 at 11:24 PM

QOTD…on the thread above…phone it in!

KOOLAID2 on September 3, 2013 at 12:33 AM