Family rescued by George Zimmerman from car accident cancels press conference in fear of “blowback”

posted at 8:01 pm on July 24, 2013 by Allahpundit

A terrible moral dilemma. Hold a presser to vouch for the man who rescued you at a moment when he could really use the public support? Or stay out of the line of fire from vigilante lunatics bent on exacting “justice for Trayvon”?

What’s a couple with two small children to do?

The Gerstles were expected to hold a press conference today at the office of Zimmerman’s attorney Mark O’Mara, but cancelled a few hours before it was supposed to take place…

“The family called because they wanted to address the media. I knew that if we did it in an organized way, it would help them get back to a normal life.. But they called today and said they were more worried about blow back from saying anything that would be favorable to George, and decided they did not want to do any media,” O’Mara said.

The lawyer said that when he spoke to the Gerstles “their voices were trembling” and that they feared saying anything positive about Zimmerman “would be toxic.”…

Zimmerman “should be [armed] given the threats against him,” O’Mara said. He added, “If I were him I would leave” the country.

The most amazing thing to me about the rescue is that he was still in Sanford days after the verdict. I figured he and his defense team had devised a plan long ago to move him to Canada or Mexico or parts unknown in the event of an acquittal. He wouldn’t be “safe” there either necessarily, but the effort to track him down and get to him would be prohibitive for all but the most insistent nuts. As it is, I wonder if he’s thinking he can ride out the storm by lying low for a year or two, until most people have forgotten, and then quietly re-emerge somewhere in the U.S. I think he’s making a mistake.

Incidentally, is there an agency (or a charity) at either the state or federal level that provides security for high-profile criminal defendants upon release or acquittal? I’m not thinking about that for Zimmerman specifically, just in general. O.J. could have used it, I’m sure; so could Casey Anthony. I think they’re both guilty as sin, and maybe O.J.’s a special case because he could afford to pay for his own protection, but it seems weird to discharge a defendant from court on grounds that they’re “free” to go when they’re facing hundreds or thousands of death threats with little professional help in thwarting them. National media holds these people out, sometimes rightly and sometimes wrongly, as monsters and then they’re left to fend for themselves against a public that despises them. Is that their idea of “rough justice”? I’m not sure prison wouldn’t have been safer for Zimmerman.


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Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

This has to be one of the stupider things you’ve said out of an ocean of stupid things from you.

Anyone has the right to feel threatened about anything. What you do not have the right to do, is physically assault someone for looking at you or watching you.

To claim otherwise is beyond silly.

No evidence came out at any time that Zimmerman did anything but look at or observe Martin. there was no evidence by witnesses, or by looking at Zimmerman physically, that Zimmerman assaulted Martin in any way.

Your racist theory is that black people have the right to physically assault white people if they believe they have been dissed.

The only racist here is you and people like you who see everything through the lens of race and cannot think logically or be honest.

You are a disgusting and stupid individual.

Monkeytoe on July 25, 2013 at 10:44 AM

What is it news of, exactly?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:38 AM

I shall ignore the Hollywood pressers on whichever dope has done too much dope and the other nonsense which have been found to merit pressers. They do justify it however. Celebrity feeds celebrity coverage..

The event shows that he responds to problems proactively. As opposed to cowering from danger like many other people.

There are people like that. Go to the next war zone and check it.

IlikedAUH2O on July 25, 2013 at 10:47 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance. If the law simply says that one must have a “reasonable fear” to defend yourself, then there’s nothing to suggest that Trayvon had no reasonable fear of Zimmerman. This is why the right has tried to smear Trayvon as a “street thug,” doing so makes it easier for them to elide the fact that the law indicates Trayvon had a right to stand his ground as well.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Jeantel was clear in her testimony that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman after she suggested he was a gay rapist. Zimmerman was a victim of a gay bashing. I am disgusted by libfreeordie’s homophobia.

thuja on July 25, 2013 at 10:36 AM

That has as more validity than the Nazi-style “Big Lie” that slavenowandie’s peddling in this thread.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 10:47 AM

I have no doubt that many Klan members were kind to their families, helped their neighbors in times of need and even engaged in acts of genuine heroism for their fellows. We really have to move beyond thinking about racism as an all encompassing evil which eradicates an individual’s relationship to humanity. Quite the contrary, racism is all about strengthening community bonds, it is all about protecting an imagined notion of community and guaranteeing a stable and prosperous future for those children one imagines as part of one’s heritage. So we shouldn’t be surprised, persuaded or interested in the fact that George Zimmerman helped a family dealing with a car accident. There’s no evidence that I have seen that humanism, in and of itself, is opposed to racism. If we start thinking about racism as both systemic and *strategic,* and we start talking openly about the goals of racism and less about racism’s “morality” we may get somewhere. Zimmerman wasn’t a rabid hating dog, which is the image too many people conjure up when they think “racist.” He was someone who thought he was “protecting his community.” What needs to be investigated is the very notion of “community” and what Zimmerman thinks he is protecting and where he locates threats. So let him save all the people he wants from car wrecks, it is wholly irrelevant to what happened to Trayvon Martin.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:43 AM

I’m glad to know that you, like a god, can see into the hearts of other people and declare them racist with absolutely no personal knowledge of the person. In fact, when every fact relating to the person – who he was friends and neighbors with (black people), who he volunteered time to (black youth) – seems to prove he was not racist.

But no, libfree – with his ESP and “truth” is here to declare Zimmerman racist because libreee, like all other liberals – is simply too damn smart to let facts, or logic, or honesty, or any other factor other than their all encompassing racism drive their thoughts.

You see racism because you are a racist. You know in your heart that you are racist and therefore assume everyone else is just like you.

You are disgusting on every level. From being immoral and dishonest in everything you say, to your beliefs and values.

Monkeytoe on July 25, 2013 at 10:47 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

That’s kind of dumb actually.

Wouldn’t you think that an essential belief of white supremacists like the Klan is to always make black people be afraid of them?

It’s part of the attempt to intimidate or control or suppress them.

In my reading of segregation, black men and women always were afraid of white people in public. They had to get off the sidewalk when a white woman walked near them.

So, in fact I would think it’s the opposite of what you argue.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 10:48 AM

Judge for yourself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loEROU1XA5E

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 10:48 AM

Did you hear Shepard Smith’s absurd comment on it ?

“And the family cancelled the press conference because they didn’t want to be associated with Trayvon’s killer”

Arssanguinus on July 25, 2013 at 9:44 AM

What else would you expect from Shep? He routinely makes it clear that he counts as one FOX’s liberals. Makes him a twofer.

katiejane on July 25, 2013 at 10:49 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Yup, every time I feel threatened, I sucker punch the guy in the nose. Then jump on and do a MMA attack called ground and pound. Yessir…

IlikedAUH2O on July 25, 2013 at 10:50 AM

“And the family cancelled the press conference because they didn’t want to be associated with Trayvon’s killer”

Arssanguinus on July 25, 2013 at 9:44 AM

While I agree with everyone here regarding Zimmerman and what has been done to him by racists like Libfree, it is actually a fact that Zimmerman is Trayvon’s killer. Now, we believe he acted in self-defense and he was acquitted at trial, but the fact remains that Zimmerman did kill Trayvon.

Monkeytoe on July 25, 2013 at 10:51 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Yea. That is why Trayvon called his parents and the cops. He was coming home from prayer meeting and this creepy ass cracker started following him.

That girl is the touchstone any good kid would have picked to call.

If he was out to do a drug deal or steal some jewelry for her…

Wait…

IlikedAUH2O on July 25, 2013 at 10:55 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

I wonder who is representative of The Knockout Game?

smoothsailing on July 25, 2013 at 10:55 AM

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Why are you a racist black supremacist fantasizer?

kirkill on July 25, 2013 at 10:57 AM

Did you hear Shepard Smith’s absurd comment on it ?

“And the family cancelled the press conference because they didn’t want to be associated with Trayvon’s killer”

Arssanguinus on July 25, 2013 at 9:44 AM

The cowardice of white people is an ongoing joke between me and my black friends.

Example.

They giggle about LAPD’s Furman living in Montana or where ever he is hiding.

IlikedAUH2O on July 25, 2013 at 10:58 AM

The fundamental belief, the core principle, in the liberal view of race is that black Americans cannot, indeed must not, be judged by the same standard we judge everyone else. If you do so, you’re either insensitive or, shocking, a racist!

This is also known as: the soft bigotry of low expectations.

Well, unless that black man or women is a conservative or Republican. In which case they can be called every name in the book with impunity.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 10:59 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

That’s kind of dumb actually.

Wouldn’t you think that an essential belief of white supremacists like the Klan is to always make black people be afraid of them?

It’s part of the attempt to intimidate or control or suppress them.

In my reading of segregation, black men and women always were afraid of white people in public. They had to get off the sidewalk when a white woman walked near them.

So, in fact I would think it’s the opposite of what you argue.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 10:48 AM

That’s because slavenowandie actually adopts the arguments and methodologies of white racists and merely seeks to flip them to his political/social advantage. He’s already admitted his intellectual dishonesty:

The jury agreed with him.

You lose.

Good Lt on July 19, 2013 at 9:19 AM

So did OJs. I am actually not interested in re adjudicating the case. The trial happened, what matters is this has mobilized and galvanized the left to continue the fight for justice.

libfreeordie on July 19, 2013 at 9:26 AM http://hotair.com/archives/2013/07/18/rasmussen-just-21-think-zimmerman-should-be-charged-with-a-hate-crime/comment-page-2/#comment-7177686

and here is his filthy little apologia for racism:

Thomas Jefferson wrote the Declaration of Independence….and also owned slaves. By which I mean, it actually doesn’t matter whether or not Zimmerman is a “good” person or even an exemplary person. Racism is not exclusively the province of rabid, hood wearing Klan members (and even many of them were kind to friends and family). Rather, racism whether it is Jefferson’s ownership of black slaves, the Klan’s burning down black churches or George Zimmerman’s presumption that Trayvon Martin was a burglar are all rather banal and emerge from a rational origin, the protection of property, advantage and wealth. Jefferson’s egalitarian principles couldn’t outweigh his desire/need to increase his income with slave labor. Klan members genuinely believed black equality would hurt their own economic futures and George Zimmerman genuinely believed black youth to be threats to “his” community. Once we stop understanding racism as “evil” and more as a system with a specific goal we can start that long overdue, never to arrive “conversation” about race.

libfreeordie on July 22, 2013 at 2:10 PM

http://hotair.com/archives/2013/07/22/stranger-than-fiction-george-zimmerman-emerges-from-hiding-to-rescue-victim-of-car-accident/comment-page-1/#comment-7185918

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:01 AM

2. You DO NOT have the right to physically assault someone, simply because they exercised their right to come and go where they please.

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance. If the law simply says that one must have a “reasonable fear” to defend yourself, then there’s nothing to suggest that Trayvon had no reasonable fear of Zimmerman. This is why the right has tried to smear Trayvon as a “street thug,” doing so makes it easier for them to elide the fact that the law indicates Trayvon had a right to stand his ground as well.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

What is the “reasonable basis” for this fear? Being followed by someone who is “creepy”?

Get it through your head, you do not have a right to not be followed. I do not have a right to not be followed. Black people do not have a right to not be followed. White people do not have a right to not be followed.

No one has a right to attack someone simply because the person followed them. Not you, not me, not Trayvon Martin, not George Zimmerman.
Everyone has a right to defend themselves against a physical assault or credible threat. emphasis on the “credible”. You do, I do, Trayvon Martin did, and George Zimmerman did. And while no one other than Zmmerman and Martin saw who threw the first punch, even Martin’s best friend believes it was likely him, and that he was not defending himself, but rather administering an “ass-whooping”.

Scream “racism” all you want: civilized people of all colors will never sit back and allow people any “right” to jump others simply for following them. You do not have that right, you never had that right, you never will have that right, and as long as large numbers of black people publicly assert such a right, they will find themselves under quite a bit of the very scrutiny they find so offensive.

RINO in Name Only on July 25, 2013 at 11:03 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance… libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

…but if one does feel threatened he can retrace his steps to catch up to “threatened” him by walking 100 feet behind him in his own neighborhood, knock him down, jump on top of him, and try to kill him, because his imbecile girlfriend has convinced him that the Jewis-Incan American following him is a gay rapist.

I only wish that every time this happened, the victim was armed with a pistol.

As usual, a clueless leftist wants nothing to do with the facts. He must hurl racist insults and defame those who speak the truth because he assumes that he is morally superior since he’s a leftist, so facts don’t matter.

Oh, and one of the alternate jurors stated in an interview that Trayvon went back to his father’s house.

Akzed on July 25, 2013 at 11:04 AM

HOW DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW TRAYVON MARTIN MADE IT HOME AND THEN DOUBLED BACK TO CONFRONT GEORGE ZIMMERMAN?

I keep reading that on HotAir threads and want to know where I can verify it.
The Bringer on July 25, 2013 at 10:28 AM

Asking how can anyone “KNOW” is a red herring, but I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. How anyone “knows” anything is something philosophers argue about. However, reasonable and rational conclusions can be drawn from the evidence and the testimony.

On the stand the state’s star witness, Rachel Jeantel, testified that Martin said at one point while on the phone with her that he was behind his father’s girlfriend’s residence, over 300 feet south of where the altercation was and where Zimmerman shot him. That was a minute or two before the 911 phones calls reporting the altercation started. The timeline of the NEN call shows he had plenty of time to get there after Zimmerman reported he ran.

The alternate juror who was interviewed recently stated he was convinced by Jeantel’s testimony, by other testimony, and by the evidence that Martin doubled back from behind his father’s girlfriend’s residence to go back up the path he had come to confront Zimmerman. He would have also voted to acquit on all charges.

Martin’s whereabouts are unknown for about four minutes of time, beginning when he reportedly ran towards his father’s girlfriend’s home when about 300-400 feet from there.

Another alternative, given the timelines of all calls, other testimony, and the locations of all physical evidence, is that Martin ran around the corner of the building and once out of Zimmerman’s sight hid and lay in wait for Zimmerman — watching him, approaching him, and confronting him after he got off the phone with the NEN dispatcher. Note this requires that one must conclude that either Jeantel and/or Martin were not telling the truth about his whereabouts. However, it is consistent with other testimony and the evidence.

Further, all of Zimmerman’s freely given statements to police in the hours and day or two after the incident as to the location the altercation began are corroborated by the physical evidence and the testimony of other witnesses. At the time he gave those statements Zimmerman did not know what witnesses there were much less what they would say. Nor did he know what physical evidence there was or where it was located.

You can find videos of all witness testimony and analysis of the testimony at Legal Insurrection.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 11:06 AM

That has as least as much validity as the Nazi-style “Big Lies” that slavenowandie’s peddling in this thread.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 10:39 AM

The big lie is that Trayvon was an innocent victim, and that Zimmerman was a aggressor. But a knuckle-dragging homophobe like you wouldn’t care. How many gay men must be beat, tortured, and murdered before people like you are stopped?

thuja on July 25, 2013 at 11:07 AM

I wonder who is representative of The Knockout Game?
smoothsailing on July 25, 2013 at 10:55 AM

Feel good story of the day:

‘Knockout Game’ perp shot, killed

Akzed on July 25, 2013 at 11:08 AM

The big lie is that Trayvon was an innocent victim, and that Zimmerman was a aggressor. But a knuckle-dragging homophobe like you wouldn’t care. How many gay men must be beat, tortured, and murdered before people like you are stopped?

thuja on July 25, 2013 at 11:07 AM

Umm, thuja, I’m agreeing with you…

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:11 AM

Race violence alarms, before Zimmerman verdict

Black mobs go ‘bang’ on July 4th

Kaboom! Now black mobs kill 4th of July

Family picnic turns to horror thanks to black mob

Mall maul nothing much, authorities report

Black mob strikes Ohio mother

Bike trail builds reputation for mob attacks

Woman sics dogs on reporter

Knockout Game victim’s eye kicked out of socket

Happy holiday! Let the violence begin

Beach week fun: Kevlar vests and weapons

FBI called into hate crime targeting whites

Police blamed for black crime spree

Shooting victim wanted ‘tribe’ to be peaceful

Violence takes over ‘CelebrAsian’

‘Beach week’ draws black crowd â�� and violence

Gun owner stops home invaders dead

Black mob attack on elderly white halted

Strategy: Reduce violence by taking away Facebook

Media label black-mob violence ‘mischievous teens’

Violent threats follow Detroit takeover

Torture-slaying retrial declared ‘victim-free’ zone

Black mob beats man ‘for no reason’

7 injured at party for 13-year-old rapper

‘COPS’ slammed for portraying blacks as criminals

Taser-armed security guard chases black mobs

25-year-old victim loses Knockout Game

TV-smashing, rock hurling ‘candlelight vigil’

It’s ‘scuffle’ with dozens of people, guns

Help ‘tending wounds’ sought for black attackers

Sanford healing 1 year after Trayvon’s death?

Jawdropper: Black mob meets ‘gay’ beauty pageant

TV anchor: ‘Race-baiters’ behind black-mob claims

‘Knockout Game’ perp shot, killed

70 officers needed to disperse ‘food fight’ rioters

College football stars and the Knockout Game

Detroit facing surge of black violence

Black mob takes over neighborhood, again

Video: Black mob beats man until skull breaks

Seattle in denial about black mobs

Star is born when security guard Tasers ‘crazy lady’

You’re white, you’re guilty, you’re dead!

Surge of black violence called ‘urban terrorism’

‘White and black don’t mix’

Deck the halls, and your fellow shopper, too

$10, cell phone and a bullet to head

Chicago robbery, chase, crash and a riot

Black mobs take over Washington Metro

Race-based Knockout Game meets the Moms

‘We’re looking at the background of the victim’

Football stars accused in racial Knockout Game

Black mob violence hits high-school gridiron

Heisman hopes hit by black-mob attack

Black mob picks on ‘The Wrong Guy’

‘Knockout Games’ a hit with black mobs

Black mob violence blamed on white kids drinking

Black mob hijacks store: ‘We own this’

Attempted robbery that almost became a race riot

Riots, denials and black mobs in Flint

Black mob violence and the media silence

Brand-new surge in black-mob violence

The race riot … and the media cover-up

Black commentators sound off on racial violence

Mighty Salon and little old me

See no evil: Racial violence underreported

‘Perfect storm’ of black violence on ‘gays’

2nd Amendment proves valid defense against black gangs

Black mobs now have soundtrack for violence

Black mobs’ Knockout Game raising alarms

Blogger: Why don’t blacks behave?

Judge to black perps: What are you doing with your lives?

Black mob violence hits Nordstrom

Akzed on July 25, 2013 at 11:12 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance…

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

I have no doubt that many Klan members were kind to their families, helped their neighbors in times of need and even engaged in acts of genuine heroism for their fellows.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:43 AM

WTF? Does HA actually allow this kind of BS and gratuitous race baiting?

HA quickly and summarily bans people if they use unacceptable words deemed racist, but allows this kind of crap to be posted?

How do you spell “double-standard”?

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 11:16 AM

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Why are you a racist black supremacist fantasizer?

kirkill on July 25, 2013 at 10:57 AM

“He who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man.”-Dr. Samuel Johnson

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:18 AM

Umm, thuja, I’m agreeing with you…

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:11 AM

I’m sorry. I try to interpret other people fairly and accurately, but we all make mistakes.

thuja on July 25, 2013 at 11:18 AM

Quotes and transcripts please.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:38 AM

http://www.dlas.org/questions-zimmerman-verdict/

See item #22

dominigan on July 25, 2013 at 11:21 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance…

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

I have no doubt that many Klan members were kind to their families, helped their neighbors in times of need and even engaged in acts of genuine heroism for their fellows.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:43 AM

WTF? Does HA actually allow this kind of BS and gratuitous race baiting?

HA quickly and summarily bans people if they use unacceptable words deemed racist, but allows this kind of crap to be posted?

How do you spell “double-standard”?

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 11:16 AM

I have no problem with the mods banning racist hate speech if they freely choose to do so, as long as they do it for -ALL- such speech. This is a privately owned site.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:23 AM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy…
libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

So says the bigot who perpetually indulges in racist fantasies.

zoyclem on July 25, 2013 at 11:23 AM

The fundamental belief, the core principle, in the liberal view of race is that black Americans cannot, indeed must not, be judged by the same standard we judge everyone else. If you do so, you’re either insensitive or, shocking, a racist!

This is just a lie. What conservatism does is that it holds black people to a different standard while pretending to be colorblind. So for example, take the rationalizations for racial profiling. Conservatives will say, it is OK to racially profile because more black people commit murder than white people. They ignore, of course, that less than 1/10th of 1% of black people in the United States are murderers. This miniscule minority is used to rationalize all kinds of cruel and demeaning state policies and behaviors towards black people. But, apparently, calling that out is “affirmative action” or something.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:24 AM

What is the “reasonable basis” for this fear? Being followed by someone who is “creepy”?

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

Uh oh, did you just walk into admitting that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon? I believe you did.

#ThreadWon

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

#ThreadWon

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

#libfreeisaracebaitingtroll
…who should be banned…again.

kingsjester on July 25, 2013 at 11:30 AM

How about a little understanding for Mr. Zimmerman?

Don Quixote was probably a white Hispanic, after all.

And Hollywood just offered a Ben Stiller movie called “The Watch“.

Men often become fools fail when trying to be heroes.

IlikedAUH2O on July 25, 2013 at 11:32 AM

The fundamental belief, the core principle, in the liberal view of race is that black Americans cannot, indeed must not, be judged by the same standard we judge everyone else. If you do so, you’re either insensitive or, shocking, a racist!

This is just a lie. What conservatism does is that it holds black people to a different standard while pretending to be colorblind. So for example, take the rationalizations for racial profiling. Conservatives will say, it is OK to racially profile because more black people commit murder than white people. They ignore, of course, that less than 1/10th of 1% of black people in the United States are murderers. This miniscule minority is used to rationalize all kinds of cruel and demeaning state policies and behaviors towards black people. But, apparently, calling that out is “affirmative action” or something.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:24 AM

Punky Brewster here wants to INCREASE the power of the state and its police arm while simultaneously denying individuals the right to self-defense. Note his conspicuous absence from this thread:

http://hotair.com/headlines/archives/2013/07/23/the-nypd-is-guilty-of-saving-7383-lives/

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:33 AM

Sorry, insert “and” after the word fools.

IlikedAUH2O on July 25, 2013 at 11:33 AM

I have no doubt that many Klan members were kind to their families, helped their neighbors in times of need and even engaged in acts of genuine heroism for their fellows. libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:43 AM

Akzed on July 25, 2013 at 11:40 AM

Look, if Zimmerman was a black man and Martin was a white young man/teenager and everything else was the same almost everyone here would be saying the same thing

Zimmerman was not guilty of any crime.

The only person(s) who would change his or her view are the liberals who, instead of attacking Zimmerman and defending Martin, would be defending Zimmerman and attacking Martin.

This was a terrible awful tragedy. It had nothing to do with race and everything to do with two people misunderstanding each others intentions.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 11:42 AM

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

There hqad been a rash of burglaries in the area.
But, you have been told that a million times, already.

Nevermind. You are nothing but a race-baiting Troll, banned here already once, under the name DeathToAllMediaHacks. They must be keeping you around here to run up the thread counts.

kingsjester on July 25, 2013 at 11:43 AM

And I’ll repeat: too many liberals – not all but a lot – believe that because black Americans are all victims that they cannot be judged by the same standard we judge everyone else.

Because of racism, historic injustice et cetera.

The soft bigotry of low expectations.

If you deny it then I can document it with volumes.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 11:44 AM

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

Young black men had been burglarizing the neighborhood for months. Next stupid qustion.

Uh oh, did you just walk into admitting that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon? I believe you did.

Uh, since young black men had been burglarizing the neighborhood for months, it is reasonable to expect that such interlopers would attract suspicion.

#ThreadWon libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

Hardly.

Akzed on July 25, 2013 at 11:46 AM

Look, if Zimmerman was a black man and Martin was a white young man/teenager and everything else was the same almost everyone here would be saying the same thing

Zimmerman was not guilty of any crime.

The only person(s) who would change his or her view are the liberals who, instead of attacking Zimmerman and defending Martin, would be defending Zimmerman and attacking Martin.

This was a terrible awful tragedy. It had nothing to do with race and everything to do with two people misunderstanding each others intentions.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 11:42 AM

Exactly, as this case demonstrates:

http://patterico.com/2013/07/21/if-only-there-were-a-case-where-a-white-teen-was-shot-by-a-black-man-who-claimed-self-defense-we-could-evaluate-obamas-comments-that-it-would-have-been-different-whats-that-there-is/

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:47 AM

There hqad been a rash of burglaries in the area. But, you have been told that a million times, already.

Had the burglaries been committed by people who lived in the complex? By those related to those living in the complex? It was dark, how could Zimmerman have known that Trayvon looked like those individuals who had been commiting robberies. Had a detailed description of the perpetrators been released? In fact, hadn’t the police made an arrest in those cases? Was he ignorant of that fact? What about Trayvon made him a suspect?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

the left’s newest “right” – the right to physically assault anyone who looks at you wrong.

Monkeytoe on July 25, 2013 at 9:36 AM

You’re half correct about this, but first you need to racially profile the aggressor and victim. If the races match up in a politically approved way, then it’s a right.

Burke on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

Uh oh, did you just walk into admitting that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon? I believe you did.

#ThreadWon

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

Idiotic.

Zimmerman stated to police that he thought Trayvon was acting suspicious – standing in the rain and looking at houses – in a neighborhood that had recent break-ins.

Zimmerman, being on neighborhood watch likely knew that Trayvon did not live in the neighborhood.

Your firm and religious belief that the only possible reason Zimmerman could have had to observe Martin was race is completely without basis.

Regardless, that does not make a difference. Even had Zimmerman suspected Martin because of race, it might make Zimmerman a bad person but it did not give Martin the right to beat Zimmerman and would not have effected the legal analysis of whether Zimmerman had the right to defend himself from that beating.

You are conflating two very different things

(1) Zimmerman believing Martin was suspicious and therefore observing him; and

(2) Zimmerman shooting Martin after Martin was beating Zimmerman.

In my area, about 2 years ago, we had the reverse Zimmerman trial. A black man saw white kids in his neighbors car in the wee hours of the morning. He approached and warned them to leave and believed one was rushing him. the black man shot and killed the teen-age white boy. In that case, as in the Zimmerman case, I believed the jury should acquit. they did. Google Roderick Scott and Cervini. There was plenty of local press coverage.

In that case, nobody claimed the black man shot the kid because he was white and there was no national outrage. No white person threatened “justice” on Roderick Scott. Nobody called for a federal investigation into Scott to determine if “hate crimes” were committed.

And, like most people here, my analysis of the facts do not depend one iota on anyone’s race. I have the same opinion of both the Zimmerman and Scott cases. one a white shooter, one a black shooter.

It is you, and those like you, who view everything through the lens of race – which makes you the racist.

Monkeytoe on July 25, 2013 at 11:52 AM

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

Let’s get someone to answer Slavenowandie’s question:

In what seemed to be a gentle rebuke of PUSH’s support of the early release from prison of convicted killer Larry Hoover, a controversy that divided many black leaders from community residents, Jackson said: “When we are on the offensive arguing about getting killers out of jail, there is no moral authority in that.”

There can be no excuse for the violence that has spread through urban areas, he said.

“This killing is not based upon poverty, it is based upon greed and violence and guns.”

On Jan. 6-8 in Washington, the Rainbow Coalition will convene a cross-section of civic leaders, legislators and social scientists to deal with the plight of the young black male, Jackson said.

Sen. Carol Moseley-Braun, who was present at PUSH, made brief comments about violence, but did not specifically address the issue of black-on-black crime.

According to the Atlanta-based Centers for Disease Control, homicide is the leading cause of death for black males aged 15 to 24. In 1990, 93 percent of the black murder victims were slain by black offenders and the weapons used most often were guns.

“The first thing America did (when it intervened) in Somalia was to try to buy back the guns they had given because there were too many guns on the street. (President Clinton) should be putting forth a plan to buy up guns and ban them,” Jackson said.

At one point, Jackson’s message took on a personal note as he described a scene that many blacks would be ashamed to admit.

“There is nothing more painful to me at this stage in my life than to walk down the street and hear footsteps and start thinking about robbery,” Jackson told the audience.
“Then look around and see somebody white and feel relieved. . . . After all we have been through,” he said. “Just to think we can’t walk down our own streets, how humiliating.”
http://infoweb.newsbank.com/iw-search/we/InfoWeb?p_action=doc&p_topdoc=1&p_docnum=1&p_sort=YMD_date:D&p_product=NewsBank&p_text_direct-0=document_id=%28%200EB42167B5EB3CB0%20%29&p_docid=0EB42167B5EB3CB0&p_theme=aggdocs&p_queryname=0EB42167B5EB3CB0&f_openurl=yes&p_nbid=J65J53TLMTM3NDc2NzUxMy42Njc4NTE6MToxNToxMjguMjA2LjE3Ny4xOTA&&p_multi=CSTB

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:54 AM

Knowing the repercussions of his words, Obama must be viewed as simply: EVIL. I despise him for what he has done to this country and our peoples. And I equally despise the people who not only agree with his actions, but celebrate the evil he promotes by referring to him as a great man and comparing him to other, actual leaders. It is nauseating to see what our country has become. And it will only get worse the more and more entrenched our abysmal education system becomes.

Ken James on July 25, 2013 at 11:56 AM

Much of this comes down to whether you think Zimmerman had reason to be suspicious of Martin’s behavior.

Most liberals think the only reason he was watching Martin was because Martin was black. And nothing else.

Most non-liberals look at the entire set of facts – including Zimmerman’s past – and disagree.

I wish Zimmerman had stayed in his car. But I wish Martin had gone home.

But the overwhelming evidence is that Zimmerman acted in self defense when he tragically had to shoot Martin.

This wasn’t about race, this was about two people completely misunderstanding each others intentions.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 11:57 AM

Had the burglaries been committed by people who lived in the complex? By those related to those living in the complex? It was dark, how could Zimmerman have known that Trayvon looked like those individuals who had been commiting robberies. Had a detailed description of the perpetrators been released? In fact, hadn’t the police made an arrest in those cases? Was he ignorant of that fact? What about Trayvon made him a suspect?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

You are being purposefully idiotic. A neighbor in the area doesn’t need proof beyond a reasonable doubt to find someone suspicious.

You are trying to use the type of basis needed for a search or arrest warrant for some neighbor seeing someone they think is acting suspiciously.

It is not even an argument, it is just stupid.

In my own neighborhood, I saw a white guy in a car who was just sitting, parked, in the cul-de-sac looking at my neighbors house. After he sat there for about 10 minutes, he started taking pictures. I walked up and knocked on his window and asked him what he was up to.

I did not have a warrant, or “probable cause” or anything other than seeing something that made me suspicious.

Doesn’t it enter your mind that your arguments are completely irrational? That in order to be on your side of the argument, you have to take these illogical positions:

1) nobody can legally observe anyone in public unless they have “probable cause” to believe they committed a crime;

2) absent “probable cause” the only possible explanation for suspicion is racism;

3) absent probable cause, the subject of observation is entitled to physically assault the observer;

4) the observer, thus physically assaulted, is not entitled to defend himself.

Monkeytoe on July 25, 2013 at 11:57 AM

Regardless, that does not make a difference. Even had Zimmerman suspected Martin because of race, it might make Zimmerman a bad person but it did not give Martin the right to beat Zimmerman and would not have effected the legal analysis of whether Zimmerman had the right to defend himself from that beating.

Exactly, the ugly secret that Jackson admitted in 1993 is that apologists for race-based gang violence like Slavenowandie have encouraged a pathology that ultimately wound up hurting poor black communities and causing civil rights mavens like Jesse Jackson to publicly admit to “profiling.”

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 11:59 AM

Much of this comes down to whether you think Zimmerman had reason to be suspicious of Martin’s behavior.

Most liberals think the only reason he was watching Martin was because Martin was black. And nothing else.

Most non-liberals look at the entire set of facts – including Zimmerman’s past – and disagree.

I wish Zimmerman had stayed in his car. But I wish Martin had gone home.

But the overwhelming evidence is that Zimmerman acted in self defense when he tragically had to shoot Martin.

This wasn’t about race, this was about two people completely misunderstanding each others intentions.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 11:57 AM

Yep, slavenowandie has already admitted that he has -no- interest in the truth of what happened that night, and, even if Zimmerman had “profiled,” that doesn’t mean that he was either racist against African-Americans in toto or thought that gang violence was solely a provenance of blacks in this country, anymore than Jesse Jackson does.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 12:02 PM

Hey, libfree…to paraphrase Mark O’Mara,

Avoiding a confrontation does not necessarily mean letting someone slip out of sight. If the neighborhood watch is supposed to be the police department’s “eyes and ears,” doesn’t that imply keeping an eye on possible criminals?

Well, duuh.

It really chapped your rear that not only was he found NOT Guilty, but then, he acted as a hero and helped to rescue that family from a buring car.

Poor perfesser. Another claim of RAAACIIISM shot to Blazes.

kingsjester on July 25, 2013 at 12:07 PM

The Zimmerman trial did serve a useful purpose. It showed (or at least highlighted):

1 There is bigotry in this country but since the 50s-60s it has shifted overwhelmingly to black bigotry toward whites not the other way around.
2 Black family life is a disaster with as many as 80% of black children both born out of wedlock and without a father to guide them.
3 Political correctness has led whites to avert their eyes to the obvious failures of black society because the brand “bigot” can not only cost them their lives but also their jobs, reputation and even their freedom (“hate crime” is nebulous to say the least).
4 Teachers are afraid to discipline black children in school for the same “bigotry” smears and also fears of physical reprisals from the children or their parents or disciplinary action from school officials falsely claiming the teacher “had it in” for the black student.
5 Hopelessly uneducated with no fatherly guidance and everybody afraid to correct them, black children have gravitated toward street gangs and drugs and are responsible for most of the nation’s violence.
6 Black race hustlers from Obama on down fuel the flames of hatred by blaming whites for black failure and profit from the growing racial divisiveness.

MaiDee on July 25, 2013 at 12:10 PM

Profiling is not about race. It’s about statistics.

spinach.chin on July 25, 2013 at 12:16 PM

This is truly sad. Will they need bullet proof vests if they go before the press to thank Zimmerman?

SC.Charlie on July 25, 2013 at 12:17 PM

Profiling is not about race. It’s about statistics. – spinach.chin on July 25, 2013 at 12:16 PM

You aren’t allowed to use statistics or common sense when you are out on the streets in this country. In Detroit 44% of the citizens are functionally illiterate. Can someone tell me why?

SC.Charlie on July 25, 2013 at 12:23 PM

HOW DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW TRAYVON MARTIN MADE IT HOME AND THEN DOUBLED BACK TO CONFRONT GEORGE ZIMMERMAN?

I keep reading that on HotAir threads and want to know where I can verify it.

The Bringer on July 25, 2013 at 10:28 AM

Absolutely none of them have evidence of that claim. But it comforts them to repeat it.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:31 AM

That was from Rachel Jeantel’s testimony. She was the “star witness” for the prosecution. Which has a lot to do with why Zimmerman was acquitted.

But she said that Trayvon made it back to his house before she hung up the phone.

There Goes the Neighborhood on July 25, 2013 at 12:38 PM

As others note, the evidence that Martin got to his home is in Rachel Jeantel’s testimony, Zimmerman’s description, and the timeline.

Obviously, that doesn’t mean that’s what happened.

But it is what they call evidence.

SteveMG on July 25, 2013 at 12:42 PM

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

The race baiting bigoted troll ignores the facts and testimony, again.

The Sandford PD NWP coordinator and trainer, a black woman who trained Zimmerman and thought highly of him, testified in the trial that the behavior Zimmerman observed and described when he called the NEN was “exactly” the kind of behavior that should trigger a call.

The race baiting bigoted troll is willfully ignorant or a liar.

HA tolerates trolls spreading outright lies and making unfounded broad brushed charges of white supremacy directed at others.

What does that say about HA?

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 12:44 PM

Had the burglaries been committed by people who lived in the complex? By those related to those living in the complex?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

The answer to both questions is yes, you willfully ignorant race baiting race hustling dumbf*ck.

If you bothered to learn that facts you would discover that a young black male who was living in the community was arrested and charged with at least one of the burglaries.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 12:53 PM

libfreeordie is impervious to facts when he has a larger Narrative of Higher Truth to preach.

gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:02 PM

HOW DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW TRAYVON MARTIN MADE IT HOME AND THEN DOUBLED BACK TO CONFRONT GEORGE ZIMMERMAN?
 
I keep reading that on HotAir threads and want to know where I can verify it.
 
The Bringer on July 25, 2013 at 10:28 AM

 
Absolutely none of them have evidence of that claim. But it comforts them to repeat it.
 
libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:31 AM

 

Remember the prosecution’s star witness?
 

Jeantel said she told Martin to run but that he responded that he was almost home…
 
“I thought he was going to be OK because he was right by his daddy’s house, but his daddy was not home,” Jeantel said as Martin’s father cried in court.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/US/trayvon-martin-told-friend-man-final-moments/story?id=19490796

 
Here’s a map. Note where the fight occured:
 
http://www.hlntv.com/interactive/2013/06/17/zimmerman-trayvon-map-interactive
 
You’re choosing ignorance because it fits your religion.

rogerb on July 25, 2013 at 1:06 PM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance. If the law simply says that one must have a “reasonable fear” to defend yourself, then there’s nothing to suggest that Trayvon had no reasonable fear of Zimmerman. This is why the right has tried to smear Trayvon as a “street thug,” doing so makes it easier for them to elide the fact that the law indicates Trayvon had a right to stand his ground as well.
libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

First, Zimmerman never claimed to be acting under Stand Your Ground.

Martin would have been within his rights to defend himself if he was attacked by Zimmerman. But the evidence doesn’t indicate that Martin was defending himself but does indicate he was the attacker.

gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:10 PM

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Since getting banned your race-baiting has become more and more stupid.

Perhaps you never were smart.

itsspideyman on July 25, 2013 at 1:11 PM

It would appear that Mr. Zimmerman is, in fact, a sheepdog who has missed his calling.

garnkikaloid on July 25, 2013 at 1:13 PM

Nevermind. You are nothing but a race-baiting Troll, banned here already once, under the name DeathToAllMediaHacks. They must be keeping you around here to run up the thread counts.

kingsjester on July 25, 2013 at 11:43 AM

IOW, HA tolerates previously banned retreads if they spout black grievance industry propaganda, lies, falsehoods, and untruths and run up the comment and eyeball count.

HA’s version of self-serving affirmative action? Or just appeasement? Or both?

And does HA implement race based double-standards for commenting and banning in the interest of making a buck?

If so, how is that different from what Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson do? Or is it just done for appeasement.

To drive home the point, what would happen to someone who blatantly, openly, and aggressively started spouting “real”, as opposed to what is imagined by race baiters, white supremacist propaganda, lies, falsehoods, and untruths on HA?

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 1:13 PM

HOW DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW TRAYVON MARTIN MADE IT HOME AND THEN DOUBLED BACK TO CONFRONT GEORGE ZIMMERMAN?

I keep reading that on HotAir threads and want to know where I can verify it.

The Bringer on July 25, 2013 at 10:28 AM

Absolutely none of them have evidence of that claim. But it comforts them to repeat it.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:31 AM

And where is the evidence he didn’t?

If the law simply says that one must have a “reasonable fear” to defend yourself, then there’s nothing to suggest that Trayvon had no reasonable fear of Zimmerman.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

And once again, where is the evidence.

itsspideyman on July 25, 2013 at 1:14 PM

Nevermind. You are nothing but a race-baiting Troll, banned here already once, under the name DeathToAllMediaHacks. They must be keeping you around here to run up the thread counts.

kingsjester on July 25, 2013 at 11:43 AM

Yep, the lying Moby-troll known as The Race Card, banned several years ago for direct threats against board-members, is apparently back and posting as “Capitalist Hog.”

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 1:17 PM

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 1:17 PM

I had pushed that idiot to the back of my mind, but you are absolutely right. That’s him. AP and Ed had to close threads down because of that jackass.

kingsjester on July 25, 2013 at 1:20 PM

Had the burglaries been committed by people who lived in the complex? By those related to those living in the complex?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

The answer to both questions is yes, you willfully ignorant race baiting race hustling dumbf*ck.

If you bothered to learn that facts you would discover that a young black male who was living in the community was arrested and charged with at least one of the burglaries.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 12:53 PM

libfreeordie is impervious to facts when he has a larger Narrative of Higher Truth to preach.

gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:02 PM

Yep, he’s admitted as much:

I am actually not interested in re adjudicating the case. The trial happened, what matters is this has mobilized and galvanized the left to continue the fight for justice.

libfreeordie on July 19, 2013 at 9:26 AM http://hotair.com/archives/2013/07/18/rasmussen-just-21-think-zimmerman-should-be-charged-with-a-hate-crime/comment-page-2/#comment-7177686

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 1:21 PM

Absolutely none of them have evidence of that claim. But it comforts them to repeat it.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:31 AM

I made a long post addressing this on this thread.

http://hotair.com/archives/2013/07/24/family-rescued-by-george-zimmerman-from-car-accident-cancels-press-conference-in-fear-of-blowback/comment-page-3/#comment-7195481

The race baiting race hustling bigot just ignores it all.

As it has ignored every attempt by numerous others to provide the “evidence of that claim”.

Is the troll willfully ignorant or just a liar or both? Or maybe the troll is just stupid and cannot comprehend most of what it reads.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 1:24 PM

libfreeordie is impervious to facts when he has a larger Narrative of Higher Truth to preach.

gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:02 PM

Collectivist would-be tyrants, whether fascist or marxist, follow the squelching of reality in favor of evil political fantasy all the time.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 1:25 PM

Is the troll willfully ignorant or just a liar or both? Or maybe the troll is just stupid and cannot comprehend most of what it reads.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 1:24 PM

False dilemma fallacy, all of the above is likely to be true. Slavenowandie loves and embraces racism both in his ideology and actions, thus he both fails to read others properly and lies about reality.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 1:27 PM

Put yourself in Trayvon’s shoes. You’re walking home to your father’s house in the dead of night, and a strange man in a car is following you. You’re doing nothing wrong. He keeps following you. He has a gun. And he has been told by police to back off, but he refuses to. Would you view that man as a threat? Would you think he is “stalking” you? If not, why not?

righty45 on July 24, 2013 at 10:44 PM

1. He left the convenience store at 6:29. GZ spotted him at 7:05. The house was 10 minutes away. Following your logic (not recommended, BTW), li’l Trayvon should have been “home” for 25 minutes already, mixing up his Lean.
2. Not his father’s house. His father’s GF’s house.
3. A man who lives there and has a right to be there stopped his truck to see what the hell you were up to, at night, in the rain. He never followed Trayvon in the truck.
4. You’re at your daddy’s GF’s house after being suspended from school after being found to be in possession of burglary tools and stolen property. Your phone holds pictures of your marijuana plant and your illegal gun. You have THC in your system and have just come back from the store with 2/3 the ingredients for a narcotic cocktail. You are standing in the rain looking into windows of a housing complex that has suffered numerous burglaries. I guess “doing nothing wrong” is a relative term.
5. The NEN dispatcher asked GZ what the suspicious character was doing, and he got out of his truck to see. When the NEN operator (who was NOT a police officer) heard him running, he SUGGESTED to GZ “we don’t need you to do that.” Although not necessary, GZ COMPLIED. GZ lost sight of him, to the point of being reluctant to give his address out since he didn’t know where the guy was. If you interpret that to mean “keeps following,” you are either brain-damaged, a non-native speaker of English, or a product of the American public school system.
6. If Trayvon thought the guy was a threat, please supply a link to HIS 911 call. Also, please explain how a guy looking at you from several yards away translates to a credible threat to your life, as opposed to, say, a guy punching you to the ground, sitting on you, and slamming your head into the pavement while saying “You’re gonna die tonight!”
7. Many people have already pointed this out, but the FL definition of Stalking is “willfully, maliciously, and REPEATEDLY following, harassing or cyberstalking” another. Your refusal to educate yourself on the legal definition of stalking does not change the definition. It just makes you look like a rock-skulled idiot.

Maybe you should have done some research on the trial?

Maddie on July 25, 2013 at 1:28 PM

What is the “reasonable basis” for this fear? Being followed by someone who is “creepy”?

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

A person does not need a “reasonable basis” to follow someone.

Following someone = legal action that is not an assault and does not require extenuating circumstances.

Attacking someone = not legal except in self-defense.

what part of this distinction elides you?

Zimmerman explained his hunch. Some would say he was over-reacting, others like you would race-bait, still others would say “you know, I think he was right, there was something a little strange about Martin’s actions”. Reasonable people have different levels of suspicion. To follow or not to follow is a subjective decision that is up to Zimmerman and Zimmerman alone. If you wish to project your racial obsessions onto others, that’s your prerogative, though no one has offed a shred of evidence of racial bias other than “Martin was black”.

Uh oh, did you just walk into admitting that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon? I believe you did.

#ThreadWon

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

Huh? How on earth did you get that from what I said?

RINO in Name Only on July 25, 2013 at 1:31 PM

Eludes

RINO in Name Only on July 25, 2013 at 1:31 PM

Maybe you should have done some research on the trial?

Maddie on July 25, 2013 at 1:28 PM

That would entail actual education. Filthy fascistic creeps like slavenowandie enjoy sticking the educational equivalents of icepicks into their students’ brains, the better to lobotomize them into becoming good little unthinking statist drones. “Righty45″ is the horrific result, a puppet who cannot think for itself.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 1:33 PM

Uh oh, did you just walk into admitting that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon? I believe you did.
 
#ThreadWon
 
libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

 
Huh? How on earth did you get that from what I said?
 
RINO in Name Only on July 25, 2013 at 1:31 PM

 
Hey, remember when they passed those laws prohibiting private citizens from “racially profiling”?
 
Wait, they didn’t? You mean “racial profiling” isn’t illegal?
 
The #ThreadWon part is hilarious, though. Thanks, LFOD. It may even take the place of
 

Imagine that for a bit. Imagine being consumed by your academic fetish but being constantly shown as wrong on almost every topic you introduce here outside of a laughably self-limited sort of “the influence of women professors in gay black history and how it influences future gay history of blacks and women” sphere of knowledge.

 
when you flee threads.
 
(Say, would you mind reposting with an exclamation point at the end of it? That would be even funnier when quoted after you run away.)

rogerb on July 25, 2013 at 1:48 PM

What is the “reasonable basis” for this fear? Being followed by someone who is “creepy”?

What is the reasonable or rational basis for Zimmerman believing that Trayvon represetned a threat that needed to police intervention and to be followed?

Uh oh, did you just walk into admitting that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon? I believe you did.

#ThreadWon

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:28 AM

Perhaps this deserves special attention as it seems revealing of the leftist mindset in this case.

I ask for a “reasonable basis” for Trayvon to conclude he was in dang, to justify a physically assault on Zimmerman’s person. Libfreeordie does not offer any whatsoever. Nor has anyone else. All we have are vague insinuations that somehow Zimmerman is at fault for the situation.

Instead, our resident troll turns the question around and demands a justification for Zimmerman’s entirely legal actions, as though somehow we will all forget that assaulting someone is a crime.

Finally, immediately upon asking the question, without actually waiting for a reply, he provides his own answer, which is (surprise surprise) “racism”. Moreover, he concludes that my answer itself is an admission of such racism. Check and mate!

Note that race is not mentioned anywhere in the quote, but apparently the conclusion is so obvious to libfreeordie that it can be derived as an immediate corollary, and the conclusion is so compelling that the discussion is over. #ThreadWon. Game over, man, game over.

I always knew racism was evil, but I never before would have guessed it could be magical.

RINO in Name Only on July 25, 2013 at 1:58 PM

These race hustlers are so stupid.
They run around screaming that Zimmerman was racially profiling Martin.

Who is Zimmerman? An Obama voting Democrat Latino.

So apparently America’s racist system and culture is being perpetuated by Democrat minorities.

gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:59 PM

I always knew racism was evil, but I never before would have guessed it could be magical.

RINO in Name Only on July 25, 2013 at 1:58 PM

These race hustlers are so stupid.
They run around screaming that Zimmerman was racially profiling Martin.

Who is Zimmerman? An Obama voting Democrat Latino.

So apparently America’s racist system and culture is being perpetuated by Democrat minorities.

gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:59 PM

Especially ones like the Rev. Jesse Jackson…

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 2:07 PM

Imagine that for a bit. Imagine being consumed by your academic fetish but being constantly shown as wrong on almost every topic you introduce here outside of a laughably self-limited sort of “the influence of women professors in gay black history and how it influences future gay history of blacks and women” sphere of knowledge.

when you flee threads.

(Say, would you mind reposting with an exclamation point at the end of it? That would be even funnier when quoted after you run away.)

rogerb on July 25, 2013 at 1:48 PM

Thanks for the link! Slavenowandie’s even more evilly incompetent than I gave him discredit for.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 2:11 PM

Beyond the ones we have seen the racist race hustling troll spread here, another example of the lies the Left is spreading about Zimmerman’s alleged racial profiling.

From July 16, 2013, in the New Republic…

The Law that Acquitted Zimmerman Isn’t Racist But that doesn’t mean the outcome wasn’t

By contrast, Zimmerman was an edgy basket case with a gun who had called 911 46 times in 15 months, once to report the suspicious activities of a seven year old black boy.

There are least three blatant lies here.

Regarding “once to report the suspicious activities of a seven year old black boy”…

A Few Zimmerman-Related Notes

VI. Today on a law professor listserv I frequent, one of the members was fulminating about how Zimmerman had once called 911 because he was afraid of a seven-year-old black boy, and this shows how racist Zimmerman is, and so forth and so on. The professor cited to this blog post at breakingbrown.com. The post cites to a Daily Beast post about Zimmarman’s interactions with the police. The first thing that raised my suspicion was the Beast made it clear that the call was to the police non-emergency number, not 911. The Beast reported the call log as:

April 22, 2011 – 7:09 p.m. Type: TEL Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: Juvenile black male “apprx 7–9” years old, four feet tall “skinny build short blk hair” last seen wearing a blue t-shirt and blue shorts.

This presented me with two possibilities: this was either strong evidence that Zimmerman was truly a paranoid racist nutjob, or the “suspicious activity” he reported was something along the lines of an unsupervised child. So I spent less then a minute googling and found the more detailed police description of his call (page 37 of the link), which paraphrased Zimmerman as follows: “Advsd is walking alone & is not supervised on busy street compl concerned for well-being.”

And thus a call from Zimmerman expressing concern for the safety of a young boy walking alone on a busy street gets turned into Zimmerman calling 911 on a seven year African American boy that he feared because of his racist paranoia. Unfortunately, lots of people seem to be only reading websites like BreakingBrown and not bothering to check on what they read so long as it fits the narrative they’ve already adopted. As noted, even law professors, who one would think would try to investigate before spreading libelous rumors, aren’t immune (though I should note based on blogs and social media I’ve seen, most crim law and evidence professors, including most liberal ones, think that the jury came to the correct conclusion based on the evidence presented).

About “who had called 911 46 times in 15 months”.

From this article…

What Do Zimmerman’s Calls to Police Show About His View of Black Men?

A note about the number of calls GZ made. I’ve listed 43 incidents over about 7.5 years.

And not all of the calls were to 911. Many, maybe most, were NEN calls.

That article also destroys the lie that Zimmerman was deliberately targeting blacks.

Also, it provides the following “facts”…

To conclude, here are details of GZ’s last three calls (the two noted by TalkLeft plus GZ’s fateful call reporting the young black man who would turn out to be Trayvon Martin). It is much less certain whether these reflect GZ’s attempts to help police apprehend particular suspects.

On August 29, police asked Beltaran (victim of home invasion while she was at hom with her baby) if she had any additional information that could help them, but all she could add was that her husband thought he had seen a black male matching her description of the suspect walking in their back yard one week prior to the burglary. The case was put on inactive status that day.

On September 23, GZ reported an open garage door, noting that at a recent neighborhood watch meeting, Sgt. Herx advised him to report anything suspicious.

On October 1, GZ reported that two black males, approximately 20-30 years old, appeared to be loitering in their car at the gate of the community at 1 a.m.; he reported that he didn’t recognize them or their vehicle and was concerned due to the recent burglaries in the neighborhood (#39). Later in October, Belatran successfully identifies one of the suspected burglars, Emmanuel Burgess, from a photo lineup. Burgess, who was out on conditional juvenile parole and living with his parents in GZ’s and Belatran’s complex, had apparently become a suspect when police matched two of the latent palm prints to him in September. Charges were then filed in October. According to trial testimony, Burgess was only arrested in December, however, and then released as a minor.

On February 2, 2012, GZ reported that a black male repeatedly approached the residence of a white male neighbor. Per the audio recording of the call, which was played at trial, this was the home of Frank Taafe, who was out of town at the time. GZ reported that the individual kept walking up to the house and away from it and then back up to it again, as if casing it (#42).

On February 6, Tatiana Deamicis reported that her residence in the complex had been burglarized. Two witnesses (Arnold Arms and Iain Beard) told police that they saw a black male, mid-20s, 5’8”, approximately 180 lbs., standing next to Deamicis’s residence (but not entering or leaving it). Beard believed that the individual had stolen his bike (previously reported to police). On February 7, Arms and Beard called police to report three black males and one white male on bicycles “in a cut through area of the complex (a grass area where [the complex] backs up to Colonial Village Apartments),” one of whom (who would turn out to be Burgess) they believed to be the person they saw with a possible connection to the February 6 burglary. Police responded and obtained permission to search the backpack of one of Burgess’s companions (Ransburg), and discovered two laptop computers. A third companion claimed that he had purchased the one of the laptops the previous night. Officers determined, however, that the serial number matched the computer stolen from Deamicis’s residence the prior day. While the officers were attempting to handcuff the four suspects, one fled, but was apprehended shortly thereafter in the Colonial Village Apartments. Burgess’s juvenile probation was terminated and he was arrested. He was ultimately sentenced by Judge Nelson (who also presided over Zimmerman’s trial) to 5 years in prison. It is unclear whether the other suspects remained in custody or were released after February 7, and it is unclear whether they were tried or convicted for anything.)

It was next to Frank Taffe’s home that Zimmerman first saw Martin walking aimlessly in the rain in the grass between buildings. That is what prompted his NEN call.

And, repeating once again…

The Sandford PD NWP coordinator and trainer, a black woman who trained Zimmerman and thought highly of him, testified in the trial that the behavior Zimmerman observed and described when he called the NEN was “exactly” the kind of behavior that should trigger a call.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 2:16 PM

What about Trayvon made him a suspect?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

His age and gender, mostly.

Good Solid B-Plus on July 25, 2013 at 2:21 PM

And of course, he’s much safer than the unarmed boy he stalked and killed. Yet there is very little concern over that boy’s safety around these parts.

righty45 on July 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

I guess he shouldn’t have brought a sidewalk to a gunfight. *shrug*

cptacek on July 25, 2013 at 2:22 PM

(Say, would you mind reposting with an exclamation point at the end of it? That would be even funnier when quoted after you run away.)
 
rogerb on July 25, 2013 at 1:48 PM

 
Thanks for the link! Slavenowandie’s even more evilly incompetent than I gave him discredit for.
 
ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 2:11 PM

 
The link back to the original thread was the best (fwiw, the entire thread is hilarious):
 

I’ve really gotten under your skin, huh?. You know what’s really funny. You actually get an enormous satisfaction from the idea that you have bested someone with a phd in U.S. history on..wait for it….Hot Air. The conservative blog. Like think about that being the place where you claim victory.
 
libfreeordie on February 5, 2013 at 9:21 AM

 
I’m sure it seemed like a great idea at the time, but I’m positive he didn’t realize what he was admitting:
 
Hot Air. The conservative blog. Like think about that being the place where you have a phd and still can’t adequately debate the topics you introduce.

rogerb on July 25, 2013 at 2:27 PM

What about Trayvon made him a suspect?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

His age and gender, mostly.

Good Solid B-Plus on July 25, 2013 at 2:21 PM

It was also, and maybe first, his behavior in the context of the huge increase in burglaries and attempted break-ins the neighborhood was experiencing. It was Martin’s behavior that Zimmerman first described in his NEN call.

See my post just up thread.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 2:31 PM

First, Zimmerman never claimed to be acting under Stand Your Ground.
gwelf on July 25, 2013 at 1:10 PM

How could he? He was on his back.

cptacek on July 25, 2013 at 2:34 PM

when you flee threads.

(Say, would you mind reposting with an exclamation point at the end of it? That would be even funnier when quoted after you run away.)

rogerb on July 25, 2013 at 1:48 PM

I think and I both know the cowardly, lying, attention seeking, masochistic, self-martyring troll is a narcissist who reads every word posted about it even after fleeing a thread.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 2:46 PM

I think and I both know the cowardly, lying, attention seeking, masochistic, self-martyring troll is a narcissist who reads every word posted about it even after fleeing a thread.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 2:46 PM

He’s this generation’s Rev. Deke O’Malley.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 2:53 PM

I think you and I both know the cowardly…

Too much typing, not enough proofing.

He’s this generation’s Rev. Deke O’Malley.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 2:53 PM

LOL. I had to look that up.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 3:07 PM

He’s this generation’s Rev. Deke O’Malley.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 2:53 PM

LOL. I had to look that up.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 3:07 PM

Chester Himes had punks like that pegged.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 3:10 PM

What is it news of, exactly?

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:38 AM

Well, think if it this way:

The WH Press Office recently announced that King Putt would be giving a speech announcing his daja-pivot to the economy.

* King Putt giving a speech isn’t “new.”

*There was not going to be anything in the speech itself that was “new.”

*Pivoting to the economy isn’t “new.”

And yet, it’s considered “news” because the President was giving a speech, and he was going to do it in the immediate future.

So, someone recently newsworthy does someTHING recently newsworthy, and it is “news.” Maybe you could audit a journalism class at that Top 50 Flagship Public University or something.

Maddie on July 25, 2013 at 3:10 PM

Essential to the white supremacist fantasy of Trayvon’s murder is the notion that black men and boys do not have the right to feel threatened in any circumstance.

libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Nobody but you has said that. So I take it that’s your fantasy?

Trayvon had every right to feel threatened by somebody following him. He even had the right to confront Zimmerman. But when he struck Zimmerman, he started a fight with an armed man, which sometimes leads to tragic results. A jury listened to witnesses, detectives, and medical examiners, and determined that Zimmerman was innocent of the charges against him. But you, who didn’t hear all of that testimony, knows better. How do you KNOW?

Since you clearly believe that facts don’t matter, why don’t you save us all some trouble and tell us what Aaron Hernandez’s sentence should be?

hawksruleva on July 25, 2013 at 4:05 PM

What about Trayvon made him a suspect?
libfreeordie on July 25, 2013 at 11:49 AM

According to testimony, acting strangely in a neighborhood where he was not recognized. This includes looking into the windows of homes in the neighborhood. When you’re in a neighborhood where folks have been robbed, people peeking into windows looks extra-suspicious.

hawksruleva on July 25, 2013 at 4:09 PM

And of course, he’s much safer than the unarmed boy he stalked and killed. Yet there is very little concern over that boy’s safety around these parts.

righty45 on July 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

Boy? He’s 17. Old enough to pass for a man in many countries. I don’t worry about Trayvon’s safety now, because he’s dead. But on the night in question, I would’ve advised him to go home, to CALL POLICE, and to avoid a confrontation.

Your story would force us to believe that Zimmerman called 911 while stalking the person he planned to kill.

hawksruleva on July 25, 2013 at 4:14 PM

Your story would force us to believe that Zimmerman called 911 while stalking the person he planned to kill.

hawksruleva on July 25, 2013 at 4:14 PM

Apparently Zimmerman called NEN instead of 911 to give himself more time to plan it all out and get his story straight. A diabolical criminal mastermind like Zimmerman only needs a few extra minutes to plan a “murder” like this down to almost the second and then execute it before the cops arrived.

As it was the cop showed up fairly quickly, even though it was not a 911 call. If the cop had gotten there just a couple of minutes earlier he might have seen the entire confrontation. Zimmerman’s plan could have fallen apart if a cop just happened to be driving by when he called NEN. Zimmerman devised this entire plan on the fly when all he had planned when he got into his vehicle that night was grocery shopping at Target.

The entire “murder” was planned out and executed flawlessly in the seven minutes between the time Zimmerman spotted his “prey” (Angela Corey’s word in a post not-guilty verdict interview) and “executed” him. Seems he even had the entire four minute call with the NEN dispatcher planned out. And he had considered everywhere Martin could have gone and how he could get to him and “execute” him before a cop arrived. Somehow Zimmerman knew Martin would not run back to where he was staying that night. Zimmerman is a genius. He even knew that if arrested and tried he would “get away with it”.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 4:49 PM

Boy? He’s 17. Old enough to pass for a man in many countries. I don’t worry about Trayvon’s safety now, because he’s dead. But on the night in question, I would’ve advised him to go home, to CALL POLICE, and to avoid a confrontation.

hawksruleva on July 25, 2013 at 4:14 PM

Oh wow. You’ve stepped in it now.

Why wouldn’t you advice Zimmerman to do the same? I can wait.

righty45 on July 25, 2013 at 5:39 PM

Boy? He’s 17. Old enough to pass for a man in many countries. I don’t worry about Trayvon’s safety now, because he’s dead. But on the night in question, I would’ve advised him to go home, to CALL POLICE, and to avoid a confrontation.

hawksruleva on July 25, 2013 at 4:14 PM

Oh wow. You’ve stepped in it now.

Why wouldn’t you advice Zimmerman to do the same? I can wait.

righty45 on July 25, 2013 at 5:39 PM

Zimmerman did, Punky Brewster. Too bad you weren’t paying attention upthread. When someone jumps you and then starts smashing your head into the pavement, your options for avoidance are nil.

ebrown2 on July 25, 2013 at 5:45 PM

On the stand the state’s star witness, Rachel Jeantel, testified that Martin said at one point while on the phone with her that he was behind his father’s girlfriend’s residence, over 300 feet south of where the altercation was and where Zimmerman shot him. That was a minute or two before the 911 phones calls reporting the altercation started. The timeline of the NEN call shows he had plenty of time to get there after Zimmerman reported he ran.

farsighted on July 25, 2013 at 11:06 AM

Compared to the total distance of TM’s trip to the store and back, he was almost back to his father’s girlfriend’s residence, and the walkway on which he died is directly behind her unit. I think that would have been his perspective. It makes sense, as he had nearly reached his destination.

I do not believe TM had made it all the way down the walkway to her unit, however. He did not have time to do that unobserved by GZ, unless the walkway was so dark that GZ could not see anything.

Considering that GZ was running after TM, the most obvious explanation is that TM ran to the “T” and hid somewhere in the dark, hoping GZ would stop his pursuit. GZ was out of his vehicle and on his feet running within 10 seconds of telling the police dispatch officer, “Sh*t, he’s running.” Twenty seconds later, after confirming that GZ was following TM, the police dispatch officer told GZ, “We don’t need you to do that.” I’m not saying GZ had a duty to return to his vehicle, but had he done so (which he did NOT), he would have been back in his vehicle long before the end of the call with the police dispatch officer.

Listening to the police dispatch call, we know that more than a minute later, GZ was still out of his vehicle, somewhere on one of the walkways looking for TM. The call with the dispatch officer ended about 1:45 after “We don’t need you to do that.”

“Could you have them call me and I’ll tell them where I’m at?” GZ said this shortly before the call ended, a point at which he was still not back in his vehicle. This statement suggests that for some reason, GZ speculated that he might not be in place to meet the police at the clubhouse, the location suggested by the police dispatch officer.

GZ had no duty to retreat to his vehicle, but his actions suggest he had no intention of doing so, and more, that he intended to keep pursuing TM until he found him.

Either GZ searched for TM until he found him, which I believe, or TM became exasperated b/c GZ would not stop searching for him and decided to confront him. We don’t know who threw the first punch, though we know TM won the fistfight, which prompted GZ to shoot TM. TM was justifiably suspicious of GZ, especially since after GZ and TM encountered each other face-to-face, GZ (by his own admission ) did not identify himself to TM.

We don’t know exactly how the fight started, or why? I believe MOST of Mr. Z’s account of what happened, but I’m pretty sure he had enough common sense to make sure his version of events solidly supported a self-defense claim. GZ had already concluded TM was a criminal or otherwise up to no good, and he was determined not to let this particular “a*****e” “get away.”

GZ was advised to not pursue TM not just because it could be dangerous for either or both parties, but b/c the potential confrontation could be chock full of misunderstandings between the two parties (and it was) and murky for our legal system to decifer afterwards (that too).

GZ can’t ever admit it now, but I believe deep down, he regrets following TM that night.

The Bringer on July 25, 2013 at 5:47 PM

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