Amash amendment to restrict NSA powers fails by 12-vote margin in House

posted at 10:01 pm on July 24, 2013 by Mary Katharine Ham

A strange bedfellows moment on the floor of the House Wednesday, as a coalition of libertarian Republicans and liberal Democrats joined up in an attempt to restrict the NSA’s domestic spying powers. The amendment was vocally opposed by leadership of both parties, even earning a White House statement against it on the eve of the vote.

Our friend Dave Freddoso captures the moment:

Speaking against the bill on the floor, Reps. Michelle Bachmann and hawkish freshman and Iraq vet Rep. Tom Cotton, among others. The roll call is here, if you’d like to see how your Congressman voted. The totals: 94 Republicans and 111 Democrats in favor, and 134 Republicans and 83 Democrats against.

I’m on the Amash side of this issue. Evidence that the NSA’s domestic spying has actually prevented terrorist attacks has been rather sparse and unconvincing, and while I respect that we occasionally have to make some sacrifices to protect ourselves, coughing up the metadata for every phone call we make doesn’t seem like the right balance to me. Supporters of such programs downplay the idea of metadata, as Cotton did today—“an excel spreadsheet with five columns”—but it only takes a couple of points of metadata to give you a lot of information about a person. Given that we are American citizens not under investigation, I don’t want them having, not to mention storing that information about us. And, I’m with PATRIOT Act author Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner in questioning whether the law even authorizes it.

Critics of the amendment say it’s not so simple:

“It’s very likely that if this Amash amendment fails it will fail because the Democrats are more aligned then we are with robust counterterrorism policies,” the aide said.

“What is this saying about the GOP being the voice for a strong and robust America?” the aide asked.

By attempting to demolish a program that has been proven to protect American lives, Amash “is giving Snowden a success,” the aide said. “What kind of incentive does that send to everyone else about what they can achieve” by leaking top secret information, he asked.

“And it’s the Republicans doing this?” the source asked “The party of Lincoln? The party that stands for a strong defense?”

In addition to sending the wrong public message, Amash’s amendment would prevent the NSA from identifying a terrorist by their phone number, a routine intelligence matter that is a key tool in the fight against terrorists.

“That’s specifically the tool Amash wants to take away,” said the aide.

I imagine we have a split audience in the comments, here, so enjoy the messages circulated by both sides prior to the vote, via TechCrunch:

Opposed to the amendment:

While many Members have legitimate questions about the NSA metadata program, including whether there are sufficient protections for Americans’ civil liberties, eliminating this program altogether without careful deliberation would not reflect our duty, under Article I of the Constitution, to provide for the common defense. Furthermore, the Amash amendment would have unintended consequences for the intelligence and law enforcement communities beyond the metadata program.

In favor:

In short, this amendment would not prohibit the government from spying on terrorists under Section 215, or from collecting information in bulk about American’s under other legal provisions. However, the amendment would prevent the bulk collection of sensitive information on innocent Americans under Section 215 – and important improvement.

The Amash fact sheet:

“The government would have to provide facts to the FISA court to show that there are reasonable grounds to believe that the records sought (1) are relevant to an appropriately authorized national security investigation and (2) pertain to the person (including any group or corporation) under investigation,” according to his office.

As a limited-government conservative, I find it heartening to see this many House members questioning this policy. Though conventional wisdom suggests selling security at any price is the safer side of this issue with the American people, the closeness of the vote suggests that’s not necessarily still the case. Voters making cost-benefit analyses about any federal program is enough to make my heart sing:

Polls showed the idea — depending on how you describe it — playing incredibly well. Members of Congress read polls. With that in mind, and with other anti-NSA amendments in the offing, the agency actually met with select members of Congress to lobby them. Last night, the White House released a statement to “urge the House to reject the Amash Amendment, and instead move forward with an approach that appropriately takes into account the need for a reasoned review of what tools can best secure the nation.”…

Had seven members of any party switched their votes, the amendment would have been adopted. But the Speaker of the House wanted this sucker to go down. He voted against it, something he doesn’t have to do unless a bill’s in trouble, and as the vote came in he could be heard saying “I like all those ‘no’ votes!”

Wouldn’t take many more Ayes for this to go differently another time.


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Comment pages: 1 2

…we were missing ba11s?

KOOLAID2 on July 24, 2013 at 10:02 PM

Time and time again these so called conservatives vote on the side of big government.

MoreLiberty on July 24, 2013 at 10:03 PM

Do we have a list of the Republicans that voted against this?

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:04 PM

Do we have a list of the Republicans that voted against this?

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:04 PM

…she supplied the link above…’how your spineless person voted’

KOOLAID2 on July 24, 2013 at 10:06 PM

Any doubt that the GOP would sell out the American people has been removed.

chewmeister on July 24, 2013 at 10:06 PM

Big statist republicans just need to fade the hell away. Security at the cost of rights is completely insane. If trading a right for Obamacare is bad, then it equally as bad for any other right.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 10:06 PM

Please print out or bookmark the no votes and let’s primary as many of the enemies of our freedom and liberty as possible. Make them pay for making the systematic violation of our civil rights possible.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 10:07 PM

“Give me your tired, your poor…Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free..
And every breathe you take..
Every move you make…
Every bond you break…
I’ll be watching you”

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:08 PM

…and who would’ve thought that the Amish could get a little bi-partisanship going. God bless those peace loving folks.

Vince on July 24, 2013 at 10:09 PM

Do we have a list of the Republicans that voted against this?

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:04 PM

May all their mistresses give them the clap.

CurtZHP on July 24, 2013 at 10:09 PM

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2013/roll412.xml

Roll Call Vote on the Amash Amendment

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 10:10 PM

Eh. Amash is an annoying rabblerouser. This is just opportunistic grandstanding at this point. We should not legislate in haste. I’m FAR more concerned by the privacy breaches in ObamaCare and by the IRS which have zero, zip, nada to do with national security.

Buy Danish on July 24, 2013 at 10:10 PM

Big statist republicans just need to fade the hell away. Security at the cost of rights is completely insane. If trading a right for Obamacare is bad, then it equally as bad for any other right.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 10:06 PM

Hard to believe that so many Tea Party votes went in support of intrusive, incredibly costly, big government behavior.

There has to be a middle ground between protecting civil liberties and identifying terrorist plots, and the US is nowhere close to that place today.

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

Another win for the Stasi and it’s criminals.

VorDaj on July 24, 2013 at 10:12 PM

Amish terrorists?

RedNewEnglander on July 24, 2013 at 10:13 PM

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

…braying another mindless statement!

KOOLAID2 on July 24, 2013 at 10:14 PM

Amash amendment to restrict NSA powers fails by 12-vote margin in House

Doesn’t matter anyway.

The dysutopian authors and directors have trained us to believe that we’ll come under the thumb of Big Brother in X number of pages or in three hours or less at the theater.

Looking back, it’s obvious that it’s a slow, drawn out, protracted operation. And I’m not even sure that the vast majority of it is carried out by some cabal of individuals.

I read on another site about six years ago where the Supreme Court had upheld some kind of Fourth Amendment case. A commenter posted something to the effect of, “See there? All you people that think the government is out to steal your rights need to get a life.”

They’ll maintain the illusion of Liberty by throwing us a bone once in a while. And there will always be the self-appointed thought police, debunkers, and new normalcy bias sheeple who will tell us that everything is always on the up and up. Then there’s the Flag Wavers that tell us, “Can’t happen here! This is America, Pal.”

So, we’re screwed.

Dr. ZhivBlago on July 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

Hard to believe that so many Tea Party votes went in support of intrusive, incredibly costly, big government behavior.

There has to be a middle ground between protecting civil liberties and identifying terrorist plots, and the US is nowhere close to that place today.

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

I’d say we could start finding that middle ground with this bill. Like limiting searches to people that the government has probable cause on instead of our phone calls.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

And every breathe you take..
Every move you make…
Every bond you break…
I’ll be watching you”

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:08 PM

Every breath you take
Every call you make
Every word you spake
Obama wants to be molesting you
Every single day
Every word you say
Every night you stay
Obama wants to be molesting you
Oh, cant you see
He wants you to belong to the collective Obama we
To molest all your life how his heart does ache
With every step you take
Every moment you’re awake
Every call you make
Every claim you stake
Obama wants to be molesting you

VorDaj on July 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

This is the world’s largest Extortion List.

The have a list of all of your phone calls, websites you visited, and Google searches for the last 5 years.

The phone has been around for 100 years, and no President has ever collected your phone logs.

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:16 PM

There is no security from Muslims, nor illegal alliens, just molesting Americans.

VorDaj on July 24, 2013 at 10:17 PM

There has to be a middle ground between protecting civil liberties and identifying terrorist plots, and the US is nowhere close to that place today.

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

After 5 years of the Greatest President Evah…
We have to a wee bit closer…

Hmmmm?

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:17 PM

Vocally opposed by both parties leadership, well that’s heartening.

Now if you will excuse me I need to keep track of the Blackhawk helo which is circling around my place up high (no shiite).

Bishop on July 24, 2013 at 10:17 PM

VorDaj on July 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

Not bad….

:)

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:18 PM

No:

Bachmann, Boehner, Issa, King, Ryan

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:18 PM

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:04 PM

Ehm…RANDY NEUGEBAUER.

annoyinglittletwerp on July 24, 2013 at 10:19 PM

There has to be a middle ground between protecting civil liberties and identifying terrorist plots, and the US is nowhere close to that place today.

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

After 5 years of the Greatest President Evah…
We have to a wee bit closer…

Hmmmm?

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:17 PM

What’s to track? I mean, according to the troll’s precious savior, al Qaeda’s on the run.

CurtZHP on July 24, 2013 at 10:20 PM

Please print out or bookmark the no votes and let’s primary as many of the enemies of our freedom and liberty as possible. Make them pay for making the systematic violation of our civil rights possible.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 10:07 PM

C’mon! A lot of good reasons for and against this. I for one would have voted for the amendment but I believe there were a lot of principled votes against.

Vince on July 24, 2013 at 10:21 PM

Hard to believe that so many Tea Party votes went in support of intrusive, incredibly costly, big government behavior.

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

Only as hard to believe how many demorats didn’t vote for it considering their allegiance to big government in every other aspect of our lives.

Bishop on July 24, 2013 at 10:21 PM

NSA doing what NSA was chartered to do…collect electronic information from foreign enemies and potential enemies of the United States is perfectly fine with me. Worked closely with them over the years, here and overseas.

But, this meta-data stuff?

Domestic collection?

A Department of Defense organization?

Spending billions? All of it non-accountable to those who are paying for it?

Private companies collect this info every time you log on to a site or buy something online, or use your credit card to make a purchase…and they then target you with that information.

Those ads around this thread, on other sites? The ones I am looking at are probably not the same as the ones you are looking at? The mail adverts I receive are generated by my patterns of purchases,when, where and what…and how much.

Such does not effect my liberty, my freedom…is just annoying.

Now, if we had a benevolent, trustworthy government, where every government employee was of sterling character, every official of solid integrity, and none never acted out of malice or avarice…I would still oppose this collection of domestic metadata.

Now, ask yourself…how many times have you heard about, read about, or observed a government employee acting with no regard for integrity, honesty, totally devoid of character? Never?

I start making phone calls to a few people who share my views; at what point am I targeted as being part of some conspiratorial cell? Based on patterns alone? And all we are talking about is philately? Or militaria for collectors?

Or, if one of them is a hot head and is deeply imbued with that silly notion of liberty, freedom, and love of the Constitution, am I, by metadata association, now part of a splinter cell? Deemed hostile to government? A threat? A sleeper?

Worth repeating, often:

“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” — Thomas paine.

If that was good enough for the Founders, it is good enough for me.

Such is a threat, however, to the current governance with which we are shackled. Remember, our DHS has already published guidance that states Christians, “bitter clingers,” Tea Party types, former military, veterans of spec/ops, and the like, are potential terror threats within the United States.

My Congressman got it wrong…again.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 10:22 PM

I’d say we could start finding that middle ground with this bill. Like limiting searches to people that the government has probable cause on instead of our phone calls.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

That is what the Amash Amendment was about!!!! I have read what Bachmann said and she is totally confused as what the Amash Amendment was about! Others above that are quoted are plain out lies.

When Conyers and Nadler voted Yes on this and Bachmann voted no, there is a problem.

And it wouldn’t surprise me if half of the House members that voted either didn’t understand what the Amendment was about (like Bachmann) or believed the lies that the opponents spewed!!

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 10:23 PM

Hard to believe that so many Tea Party votes went in support of intrusive, incredibly costly, big government behavior.

There has to be a middle ground between protecting civil liberties and identifying terrorist plots, and the US is nowhere close to that place today.

bayam on July 24, 2013 at 10:11 PM

Oh, you’re right. Since its inception the TEA Party movement has been in favor of “intrusive, incredibly costly, big government behavior.”

That’s like saying the Democratic Party is in favor of outlawing abortion and tough voter ID legislation.

Dr. ZhivBlago on July 24, 2013 at 10:26 PM

What’s to track? I mean, according to the troll’s precious savior, al Qaeda’s on the run.

CurtZHP on July 24, 2013 at 10:20 PM

This is good.

Juan Williams can get his job back on NPR…
Juan doesn’t have to be nervous any more when aboard an airplane….

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:27 PM

So,I bet my E-Mail is still getting Scruntenized!!

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:28 PM

My Congressman Walberg talks a good game but he let me down with his ‘no’ vote.

8 weight on July 24, 2013 at 10:30 PM

Scruntenized? That can’t be good.

Bishop on July 24, 2013 at 10:30 PM

Good thing they don’t pay attention to linked noms and comments at Conservative blog sites.

Bmore on July 24, 2013 at 10:31 PM

MeanWhile,back at NSA Central/Control:

NSA Sources Drying Up After Snowden Leaks: NSA Chief
Tuesday, Jul 23, 2013 | Updated 4:42 AM PDT
*********************************************

The leaks by and diplomatic tumult surrounding National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden have greatly distorted how the agency actually works

and prompted some intelligence sources to dry up, the U.S. Army general who runs the agency said.

Gen. Keith Alexander,

in an interview at the Aspen Security Conference in Colorado, said the NSA has “concrete proof” that terrorist groups are changing the way they operate to evade U.S. intelligence, “and it’s going to make our job tougher,” he said. He also disputed the suggestion that the U.S. government could, or would want to, listen to all of Americans’ phone calls or read their emails. He also defended the NSA’s PRISM data collection program. “The purpose of these programs, and the reason we use secrecy, is not to hide from the American people, not to hide it from you, but to hide it from those who walk among you who are trying to kill you,” he said.(More…………….)
==============================

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/national-international/NATL-NSA-Sources-Drying-Up-After-Snowden-Leaks-NSA-Chief-216519251.html

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:32 PM

I believe there were a lot of principled votes against.

Vince on July 24, 2013 at 10:21 PM

So?

Their principles may be honest, but they are also wrong. I am sure their are principled Communists but that doesn’t mean they are right, nor should they be in office.

sharrukin on July 24, 2013 at 10:35 PM

So,I bet my E-Mail is still getting Scruntenized!!

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:28 PM

…it only picks something if it mentions “Obama” in it….if you mention JugEars…DumboEars…DogEater…etc…..I think you’re safe to go!

KOOLAID2 on July 24, 2013 at 10:35 PM

Good thing they don’t pay attention to linked noms and comments at Conservative blog sites.

Bmore on July 24, 2013 at 10:31 PM

Bmore:

Oh thats a great point,haha:)

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:35 PM

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:28 PM

…it only picks something if it mentions “Obama” in it….if you mention JugEars…DumboEars…DogEater…etc…..I think you’re safe to go!

KOOLAID2 on July 24, 2013 at 10:35 PM

KOOLAID2:Oh man,I bet Bishop is priorty #1 !:)
(sarc)

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:37 PM

Scruntenized? That can’t be good.

Bishop on July 24, 2013 at 10:30 PM

Bishop:

Oh you scoff,you just wait till you have a #9 Reamer Tool
shoved in front of you……..(snark):)

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:39 PM

Thanks you Justin Amash for showing leadership on this crucial issue. The sooner we can throw out those that voted against your amendment and replace them with more champions of freedom and liberty like yourself, the sooner we can get American back on the right track.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 10:39 PM

This is good.

Juan Williams can get his job back on NPR…
Juan doesn’t have to be nervous any more when aboard an airplane….

Electrongod on July 24, 2013 at 10:27 PM

He still does sir. All them whiteys wishing him ill will.

arnold ziffel on July 24, 2013 at 10:41 PM

Eh. Amash is an annoying rabblerouser. This is just opportunistic grandstanding at this point.

Buy Danish on July 24, 2013 at 10:10 PM

So says our resident authoritarian Romneycare supporter.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 10:42 PM

Michelle Bachmann usually doesn’t get things like this wrong, but she dropped the ball on this one.

What say you, Bishop?

She’s your rep.

I

Bruno Strozek on July 24, 2013 at 10:42 PM

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:32 PM

Hogwash.

Not you.

General Alexander.

So, China, Russia, all the Middle East and Cuba and North Korea…all have stopped using telephones, the internet, radios, telemetry, data transmission, radar, and any other form of telecommunications?

Hogwash.

Alexander is also the commander of United States Cyber Command in addition to his NSA position.

He must think us fools.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 10:42 PM

Any President that had a clue, would understand that a vote t his close needs to have some people going up the the Capital and explaining to those who supported this amendment, why it’s important to have this authority.

I believe this president has no clue, he just knows he won.

bflat879 on July 24, 2013 at 10:43 PM

If you are an R in the House, a “nay” vote on this was smart. Why? When we have the next terrorist attack, and it’s not an “if”, Obama and his sycophant media would blame it all on the Rs, even if the NSA lack of info had nothing to do with it.

Plus, most of the R’s are far less worried about the civil libertarians in their districts than the ones who will blame them from being “soft” on defense and security should a major terrorist attack be waged. It is what it is.

TXUS on July 24, 2013 at 10:48 PM

Amazing! My liberal rep has never voted against Obama on anything, but she did on this. Probably because dems were split on this. I’m with Amash. I don’t believe they need to scrutinize 300 mil people every time they have a concern. They could narrow it down. I guess from now on we can expect that every time a crime is committed all of us will be scrutinized. Pretty inefficient use of resources and time and horrific abuse of privacy.

Charm on July 24, 2013 at 10:48 PM

No:

Bachmann, Boehner, Issa, King, Ryan

faraway on July 24, 2013 at 10:18 PM

I’ve always liked Bachmann, and I understand her point of view to some extent, not that I agree with it, but I guess now I’m actually glad to see her go. If only we could get rid of everybody else that voted no, as quickly.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 10:54 PM

And it wouldn’t surprise me if half of the House members that voted either didn’t understand what the Amendment was about (like Bachmann) or believed the lies that the opponents spewed!!

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 10:23 PM

There are billions of taxpayer dollars spent on the police-state racket, maybe hundreds of billions. Certainly there are a corresponding number of lobbyists promoting the NSA and all of the lucrative technology greasing palms in Washington DC and NY media outlets.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 11:02 PM

Thanks you Justin Amash for showing leadership on this crucial issue. The sooner we can throw out those that voted against your amendment and replace them with more champions of freedom and liberty like yourself, the sooner we can get American back on the right track.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 10:39 PM

Thanks FR, I know he’d appreciate hearing that. Sometimes we forget those that actually work on behalf of the American People. Thanks for the reminder:-)

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 11:04 PM

Oh, you’re right. Since its inception the TEA Party movement has been in favor of “intrusive, incredibly costly, big government behavior.”

That’s like saying the Democratic Party is in favor of outlawing abortion and tough voter ID legislation.

Dr. ZhivBlago on July 24, 2013 at 10:26 PM

Well, your irony would be appropriate and accurate if not for the apparent fact that, as Bayam implies, a number of so-called “tea partiers” voted against Amash’s amendment. I’m not sure to what degree that is the case, but I know Bachmann voted no, which is hugely disappointing to me because I supported her for POTUS in ’12. I knew she was a hawk, so am I, but I thought she leaned more toward the freedom and liberty side than she apparently does.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 11:07 PM

I’m with Amash. I don’t believe they need to scrutinize 300 mil people every time they have a concern. They could narrow it down. I guess from now on we can expect that every time a crime is committed all of us will be scrutinized. Pretty inefficient use of resources and time and horrific abuse of privacy.

Charm on July 24, 2013 at 10:48 PM

It’s either that, or profiling. And profiling is more evil than terrorism.

Better that a hundred thousand little old ladies be monitored,indexed, or groped than a single twentysomething male Islamist feel he’s being singled out “unfairly”. You know, just because he falls into the category that accounts for roughly 99% of Islamic terrorists.

That just wouldn’t be fair.

And besides, The One is more worried about those little old ladies. They might be members of the Daughters of the American Revolution, a notorious anti-government group.

Or a church group, that prays to some God other than The Messiah.

Or worst of all….

Registered Republicans.

clear ether

eon

eon on July 24, 2013 at 11:09 PM

To those that were disappointed with the outcome, please write your representative if they voted for it and voice your support to them.

They need some positive encouragement to fight the good fight.

Mark Meadows-R NC dis. 11- was on the right side of this. Good for him.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 11:11 PM

So,I bet my E-Mail is still getting Scruntenized!!

canopfor on July 24, 2013 at 10:28 PM

Often times I get very little if any email during the day, and people will start calling me asking why I haven’t responded, and then sometime later in the day my email will finally start showing up in my inbox. It may just be a glitch with my system or an overloaded GMail server, but it is eerily reminiscent of when my comments here at HotAir occasionally get stuck in moderation and have to wait for somebody at HotAir to give the OK to let them post for public viewing.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 11:14 PM

Sorry for the double post. Just a bit annoyed at this.

One thing is clear. Big state security conservatives are going to have to do some MAJOR introspection as rights get more infringed upon. Be it 4th amendment violations or gestapo swat teams on the local level, we will need to balance our love for first responders with a healthy skepticism and measurement of their worth.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 11:15 PM

Charm on July 24, 2013 at 10:48 PM

You were amazed and I almost fainted when Conyers and Nadler were on the floor of the House speaking in favor of the Amash Amendment!

We don’t have any privacy when they can collect our daily phone communications and our emails.

I appreciate the effort that our good guys make tho.

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 11:18 PM

eon on July 24, 2013 at 11:09 PM

Nicely done:-)

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 11:24 PM

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 11:11 PM

That’s a good idea. I have 5 to thank tomorrow and 11 to give the third degree to:-)

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 11:28 PM

Often times I get very little if any email during the day, and people will start calling me asking why I haven’t responded, and then sometime later in the day my email will finally start showing up in my inbox. It may just be a glitch with my system or an overloaded GMail server, but it is eerily reminiscent of when my comments here at HotAir occasionally get stuck in moderation and have to wait for somebody at HotAir to give the OK to let them post for public viewing.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 11:14 PM

I’ve noticed that when clicking on links for various, different sites, but I believe all are of a political nature. I get a redirect notice and to click on the link if it doesn’t go through in ten seconds or whatever it is. So there is an uncomfortable lag. I could see it if it were always the same site, but it’s not.

Been noticing them more lately, say over the last month or so.

Could be some kind of ad thing, or maybe different sites with the same hosting company?

Dr. ZhivBlago on July 24, 2013 at 11:29 PM

Certainly there are a corresponding number of lobbyists promoting the NSA and all of the lucrative technology greasing palms in Washington DC and NY media outlets.

FloatingRock on July 24, 2013 at 11:02 PM

I’m sure there are. That is the biggest problem in government.

bluefox on July 24, 2013 at 11:35 PM

Thank god the amendment failed … now I can sleep better knowing that no pot smoking losers who make their radical Islamist ties known, and whose names are given to our dear government by a foreign country (twice), will ever be able to harm Americans.

Sparky5253 on July 24, 2013 at 11:35 PM

Big statist republicans just need to fade the hell away. Security at the cost of rights is completely insane. If trading a right for Obamacare is bad, then it equally as bad for any other right.

Chubbs65 on July 24, 2013 at 10:06 PM

I do not see any difference between data mining, and having the King’s soldiers search your home without warrant, to see if you have anything improper

We are in trouble in this country because power is now for the sake of power

entagor on July 24, 2013 at 11:42 PM

Sp

arky5253 on July 24, 2013 at 11:35 PM

The Amash Amendment had nothing to do with the FBI.

NSA had nothing to do with Boston.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 11:43 PM

NSA had nothing to do with Boston.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 11:43 PM

That’s the problem.

The NSA is supposed to monitor communications between Al-Qaeda and their network. Tsarnaev was surfing the Al-Qaeda website (based offshore obviously) for the recipe to make bombs. He then used that to make his bomb. How did the NSA not detect that? It is the Al-Qaeda website for Christ sake. How were they not monitoring that website?

The Al-Qaeda bomb making forum does seem like a rather obvious source to be watching.

Tsarnaev was also in contact with radical Chechens (again offshore) which should also have triggered the NSA.

The Russians warned the US about Tsarnaev which also should have triggered a NSA background check on the guy.

If the NSA cannot spot a guy like Tsarnaev then why do they even exist?

sharrukin on July 24, 2013 at 11:55 PM

The roll call is here, if you’d like to see how your Congressman voted. The totals: 94 Republicans and 111 Democrats in favor, and 134 Republicans and 83 Democrats against.

My guy (Lamborn) was one of the Ayes on the Republican side.

No surprise, and glad to see it. Sadly both of my Senators are less representative of my personal wishes, but I am generally a fan of Lamborn.

gekkobear on July 24, 2013 at 11:57 PM

sharrukin on July 24, 2013 at 11:55 PM

Probably just a big misunderstanding.

After Obama directed NASA to be focused on Moslem Outreach, somebody over at Fort Meade misread that…thought Obama said NSA needed to focus on Moslem Outreach…

Well, these things happen,you know. Can’t monitor, identify, intercept, collect, collate, analyze anything that stems from Moslems…we got to reach out…Obama told us.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 11:59 PM

Well, these things happen,you know. Can’t monitor, identify, intercept, collect, collate, analyze anything that stems from Moslems…we got to reach out…Obama told us.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 11:59 PM

They actually put the mosques off limits for investigations without special authorization from the Sensitive Operations Review Committee.

They see the average US citizen as the enemy, while Muslims are out of bounds.

sharrukin on July 25, 2013 at 12:05 AM

Noone should be surprised. Big Bird still has a gig. Aint Lois Lerner still on the taxpayers dime to the tune of 6 figs? We’re all screwed! Congress can’t even pick the low hangin’ fruit. Eff them bastards.

racquetballer on July 25, 2013 at 12:09 AM

OK…back to the even more bizarre…

Earlier tonite I used the expression “O. Jesus.” on another thread…the postal one. On my screen/page, at Hot Air since, I have had a half-dozen ads appear regarding “Jesus.” Or Christian-oriented entities…Christian Mingle…and others.

Never had them before.

Private company data mining?

Prism 2.0?

Hmmm…odd.

They should know I am not a Christian. I am a Catholic. :-)

coldwarrior on July 25, 2013 at 12:16 AM

All government, in its essence, is a conspiracy against the superior man: its one permanent object is to oppress him and cripple him.

roflmmfao

donabernathy on July 25, 2013 at 12:28 AM

“In keeping silent about evil, in burying it so deep within us that no sign of it appears on the surface, we are implanting it, and it will rise up a thousand fold in the future. When we neither punish nor reproach evildoers, we are not simply protecting their trivial old age, we are thereby ripping the foundations of justice from beneath new generations.”

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

donabernathy on July 25, 2013 at 12:32 AM

The swine who voted against this amendment have revealed themselves as enemies of the Constitution and the American people. Their lampposts await, as do we.

NealK on July 25, 2013 at 12:34 AM

What a shame. What a shame. What a shame.

John the Libertarian on July 25, 2013 at 12:36 AM

coldwarrior on July 25, 2013 at 12:16 AM

I’ve never had that happen before. I have been on other sites looking for some item and then bring up a HA window and then see an ad for what I had been looking for.

Since that happened as you described, then HA may have changed their format to allow it.

I’ve noticed a change or two in the past week on HA threads, but not what you describe.

We need a Stealth application:-)

bluefox on July 25, 2013 at 12:40 AM

Shame.

AshleyTKing on July 25, 2013 at 12:59 AM

“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” — Thomas paine.

If that was good enough for the Founders, it is good enough for me.

Such is a threat, however, to the current governance with which we are shackled. Remember, our DHS has already published guidance that states Christians, “bitter clingers,” Tea Party types, former military, veterans of spec/ops, and the like, are potential terror threats within the United States.

My Congressman got it wrong…again.

coldwarrior on July 24, 2013 at 10:22 PM

Well said.

The problem is the Republican Leadership showed what/who they support by defeating this Amendment. Reports that a close failure actually counts as a win tilts into Obama-administration-level spin.

At the end of the vote this was just another kabuki show.

A “win” would be to actually pass this amendment to defund…or to defund Obamacare…or to defund…..(take your pick).

Republicans need to walk their talk or they’ll join the Whigs.

Perfesser on July 25, 2013 at 2:05 AM

What puts the lie to their claim to stop terrorism is the marathon bombing and Nidal Hassan. In those cases the government had much more than NSA data and chose to do nothing because of political correctness.

dogsoldier on July 25, 2013 at 5:56 AM

If this was a Democrat issue… a 12 vote fail would be celebrated as a victory. Keep pushing..

JellyToast on July 25, 2013 at 6:10 AM

A Constitutional Republic has no need for a secret court that issues general warrants which allow the NSA to gather and keep every electronic communication you make and save it for further use. General warrants were specifically sited by our founders as a problem with the nasty Brits and King George.

MoreLiberty on July 25, 2013 at 6:44 AM

PRISIM, NSA, All of it should be dismantled.

Its not necessary and is illegal.

TX-96 on July 25, 2013 at 7:16 AM

The 4th Amendment died when the naked scanners and TSA checkpoints were set up.

It was a CLEAR violation and it was not pushed back against by a lazy electorate.

Now we see how hard it will be to get those freedoms back!

Tyranny……….is incremental.

PappyD61 on July 25, 2013 at 8:03 AM


In addition to sending the wrong public message, Amash’s amendment would prevent the NSA from identifying a terrorist by their phone number, a routine intelligence matter that is a key tool in the fight against terrorists.


Just one of the lies to misdirect.

I am disappointed in Wolf. He is usually on the right side of liberty/freedom. Kuddos for Amash for supporting the constitution!

TerryW on July 25, 2013 at 8:21 AM

Ya know, with all the folderol going on about NSA (signals intelligence) and with all the telephone calls we get in spite of the “no-call” lists, why can’t NSA do something popular with every American. That would justify most of the extremities of their continuance. If you get any of those pestering telephone calls at all hours of the day from people like “Rachael at credit card services”, the notice that the FBI etc, etc. and you turn them in, the only answer is that the authorities can’t find them and can’t control them. Why don’t we have NSA find them and authorize reprisals Chinese style. We could put a stop to this harassment with a few of these scummy jerks on their knees, outside their call centers that the government can’t find, and a pullet placed in a position to cause a schematic cascade. Then almost everybody in the good ol’ US of A would stand and applaud and re-elect the political scum that keep this stuff going.

Old Country Boy on July 25, 2013 at 8:30 AM

My freshman (freshwoman?) Congresswoman voted against. How depressing. And I was so happy to get rid of Dan Burton.

Chris of Rights on July 25, 2013 at 8:32 AM

Just in case this thread is still active, Glenn Beck is all over this. He expects to get Bachmann on his radio program this morning.

Also will have Justin Amash on.

He’s just as perplexed and angry as everyone that this Amash Amendment was defeated.

How could our “friends” vote no on this?

Tune in if you can.

bluefox on July 25, 2013 at 9:14 AM

I just wrote my rep to tell him he has lost me as a voter. To allow the continued illegal data gathering by the NSA is an outrage.

sadatoni on July 25, 2013 at 9:24 AM

coldwarrior on July 25, 2013 at 12:16 AM

HA makes lots of money on the advertising you see on their pages. I recently started a new business and do a lot of my work on the internet. It is related to real estate and now I get tons of ads on real estate, foreclosures, courses on real estate, etc…

Your mention of “Jesus” has probably triggered the sale of your name, or however they do this, to a number of religious groups.

This could also, be keyword related, search engine optimization, pay-per-click or whatever also.

Vince on July 25, 2013 at 9:27 AM

My freshman (freshwoman?) Congresswoman voted against. How depressing. And I was so happy to get rid of Dan Burton.

Chris of Rights on July 25, 2013 at 8:32 AM

And she’s having a town hall meeting tomorrow, just minutes from my house. How convenient.

Chris of Rights on July 25, 2013 at 9:34 AM

I am so p.o.’d and outraged about that Amash Amendment vote. I’ve been working this morning printing out the Roll Call Votes and have my list of U.S. House members to contact. Haven’t decided yet whether I want to call or email or fax!! Out of my State U.S. House members of 16, only 5 voted yes.

Not in a good mood today.

Beck just said Senator Mike Lee will be on also.

If any of you have anything I should say or ask about that vote, just post:-)

bluefox on July 25, 2013 at 9:41 AM

My freshman voted for it and he’s running for the Baucus seat next year. I only call it the Baucus seat because he’s been sitting in it for like foreveh. Let’s face it the whole camel is in our tent and it’s not leaving.

Kissmygrits on July 25, 2013 at 9:44 AM

Vince on July 25, 2013 at 9:27 AM

Makes perfect sense.

When a private company does it…it is annoying.

When government does it, using a Defense Department Agency…it is beyond annoying.

The technology is there…what is to prevent any government employee or agency from pinging on keywords, and then establishing that all HotAir readers are some sort of subversive potentially violent sleeper cell intent on bringing down the current government?

Yep, the technology is there, it exists…and we are supposed to “trust” government and that new multi-billion dollar facility out in Utah to make sure no innocent citizen is ever so tarnished?

[Wonder what'll happen if I start using phrases from the Koran with every post I make? Ads for Moslem Date dot com, or a knock on the door from DoJ...or an invite to join a sleeper cell...a real one?]

:-)

لطقس أل سينج كومبي!
.
.

coldwarrior on July 25, 2013 at 9:45 AM

[Wonder what'll happen if I start using phrases from the Koran with every post I make? Ads for Moslem Date dot com, or a knock on the door from DoJ...or an invite to join a sleeper cell...a real one?]

:-)

لطقس أل سينج كومبي!
.
.

coldwarrior on July 25, 2013 at 9:45 AM

They will put you on a hands-off list.

sharrukin on July 25, 2013 at 9:49 AM

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