Friendly reminder from Obama to the EU: Allies spy on each other

posted at 2:41 pm on July 1, 2013 by Allahpundit

He must be tempted by the phony surprise and indignation among European leaders at the latest Snowden leak to reveal (a) just how complicit they assuredly are in helping the NSA data-mine the planet and (b) how far some of them have gone to steal secrets from the U.S. I’d be curious, in fact, to see a poll of Americans on this subject. Do you support the federal government spying on U.S. allies? What if you knew that U.S. allies were spying on us? What if it could be proved that information gleaned from spying can improve national security?

The Snowden saga started a month ago as the story of a man who risked the wrath of the United States government to let his countrymen know their leaders were collecting vast amounts of electronic information on them. Basically everything is ending up on government servers. That was a big deal, and I’m glad we know about it. A month later, here’s what that story has devolved into in the media:

1. A platform for Julian Assange to rant about the U.S. government, the only one in the world whose opaqueness really seems to bother him;

2. Endless navel-gazing about what journalism is and whether Glenn Greenwald practices it;

3. The catch-me-if-you-can “where’s Snowden?” extradition melodrama and the endless propaganda fun that U.S. enemies are having with it; and

4. Daily reports of new self-serving leaks by Snowden that have little to do with Americans’ civil liberties and lots to do with embarrassing the U.S. government and/or damaging America’s relations with friends and foes. Whatever he has on his hard drives almost certainly belongs now to Russia, if not China as well, whether he gave it up unwillingly or voluntarily as a way to ingratiate himself with his hosts. (Greenwald himself has theorized that Snowden told Chinese media which Hong Kong computers NSA was spying on as a way to curry favor with his new protectors.) How much damage this might do to U.S. national-security interests is unknowable; if you believe Greenwald’s boasting about how much data Snowden has, it must be considerable. Near as I can tell, many Snowden fans think all of this is perfectly legit because he must do whatever he needs to in order to stay out of the feds’ clutches.

Greenwald keeps promising shocking new revelations to come that I guess are going to redeem all of this, but at this point he and Snowden might be prisoners of their own success. My takeaway from the PRISM story and the other Guardian scoops ever since is that the feds have almost everything, and whatever they don’t have yet they’re either working on getting or they can get in cooperation with others. Revealing that phone calls, say, are being harvested too, to be listened to in particular cases if some terrorist’s trail leads back to them, is a lesser bombshell at this point because most of the public has already assimilated the fact post-Snowden of digital surveillance being galactically broad. In fact, per Fox News’s poll last week, 44 percent of Americans now call Snowden a “misguided criminal” versus 22 percent who call him a “hero,” no doubt thanks to those self-serving leaks in point four above. That could change again depending upon what the Guardian has left to reveal, but if it’s all related to the scope of surveillance rather than what’s being done with it, I don’t know how much impact it’ll make. The more recent leaks all feel like aftershocks after the big PRISM quake.

Oh, almost forgot point 5: If you’re a Snowden/Greenwald fan, anything any government official says that hurts your narrative (e.g., that terrorists have gained valuable insight into U.S. surveillance from all of this) is a lie fashioned by a corrupt government to defend the surveillance state. Whereas anything any government official says that helps your narrative (e.g., that this hasn’t done much diplomatic damage) is an admission against interest and therefore reliably true.


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They cheered for him.

They got him.

If only they’d take him. They so deserve him!!!

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 2:43 PM

The swine are such hypocrites. They lament in public against the NSA and they have this in secret with obama.

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 2:44 PM

If everybody is spying on everybody are the US citizens the only schlubs who can’t spy on our government?

VegasRick on July 1, 2013 at 2:45 PM

Obama has no allies besides the Muslim Brotherhood, Kim Jong Un and Brian Williams, Candy Crowley and a few other of his pimps.

viking01 on July 1, 2013 at 2:46 PM

A month later, here’s what that story has devolved into in the (obama) media:

They still dwell in his azz. May all that Beluga choke them, for dereliction of duty.

No matter what Snowden is, he destroyed the last shred of sanctimony form the so-called free governments.

obama destroyed the last shred of moral authority and decency the USA had left.

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 2:49 PM

If you’re a Snowden/Greenwald fan, anything any government official says that hurts your narrative (e.g., that terrorists have gained valuable insight into U.S. surveillance from all of this) is a lie fashioned by a corrupt government to defend the surveillance state.

Only problem with that is that the government has told so many lies and done so much to hide, if not defend the surveillance state, that it is impossible to trust or give half a crap about anything that comes from the varied mouthpieces of this administration, even for those of us who aren’t necessarily Snowden/Greenwald fans.

There are anti-American douchenozzles involved in this, that’s certain, but the overlying fact remains that a fair portion of their perceived credibility relies from the fact that this administration is untrustworthy enough and statist enough that their assertions can’t be dismissed.

Not necessarily to defend any side here, or the Putins that take advantage of them, but there are just so many houses and not enough appropriately nasty poxes. If only there were some heroes on the horizon to support… Ted Cruz, perhaps, but he seems to be in this uncomfortable wait and see position along with the rest of us.

Gingotts on July 1, 2013 at 2:50 PM

Friendly reminder from Obama to the EU: Allies spy on each other

Friendly reminder from Obama: Coptic Christians in Egypt and gays in Russia should cooperate with their persecutors because, well, um, like, ya know, we’re their allies or something.

Once Again, The Obama Administration Told The Copts Not To Protest And To Cooperate With Their Persecutors

Resist We Much on July 1, 2013 at 2:51 PM

Putin fiddles obama.

Yes, he can, Da!!!

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 2:51 PM

If everyone knows everyone else’s secrets, wouldn’t it just be easier for the world to just have one government over everyone? It only makes sense. Nonelected, of course.

a capella on July 1, 2013 at 2:51 PM

Did the info collected by the American government affect the outcome of the last Presidential election..? Who can assure us of this? The State Run Media?

d1carter on July 1, 2013 at 2:52 PM

that terrorists have gained valuable insight into U.S. surveillance from all of this

Terrorists have been using TOR for a while now. Not that the real point of Prism is to stop terrorists. Our government has no interest in stopping them as proven by the manner in which they handled the Boston bombers and Nidal Hassan.

If Zero and the clown posse were serious, those two events would never have happened.

dogsoldier on July 1, 2013 at 2:52 PM

Maybe we should ask James Clapper..?

d1carter on July 1, 2013 at 2:53 PM

Resist We Much on July 1, 2013 at 2:51 PM

I see a pattern developing. He told the Catholics in Ireland their schools are divisive.

dogsoldier on July 1, 2013 at 2:55 PM

Obama looks very tired and disheveled. He is not making a good example of his imperial greatness on his African Safari. Somebody oughta ship him back home where he can go into his special closet and cry. Like a girl.

Key West Reader on July 1, 2013 at 2:58 PM

Exactly when did the need for the huge data storage facility in Utah become necessary and why?

d1carter on July 1, 2013 at 3:01 PM

Does Snowden have any info on the IRS or the FEC?

Cindy Munford on July 1, 2013 at 3:06 PM

And then there’s this… Russia working with FEMA on US “disaster” response?

Please pay close attention to the photos at the bottom of the article.

Key West Reader on July 1, 2013 at 3:08 PM

The real obama

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 3:11 PM

Don’t forget John Pollard.

Cindy Munford on July 1, 2013 at 3:11 PM

If we are going to link (not) trading and spying, then nobody’s gonna’ have stuff. We’ll all be stuffless.

Tsar of Earth on July 1, 2013 at 3:12 PM

They may be spying on each other, but they’re in collusion overall. Our economies and thus mutual political careers of our masters are intertwined with one another.

I don’t think this spying has anything to do with national security, either. It’s about keeping tabs on and finding dirt on others in order to gain a more advantageous position in the political arena…and in accruing more wealth and power.

You don’t think that the Soviet Army, the KGB and the Communist Party were constantly allying, realigning themselves and spying on each other all the time? But yet they were on the same team. That’s how power works in the real world.

They’re not half as worried about each other at the top as they are the Masses below who are patriots and nationalists in their respective countries. To these Socialist elitists, these are the real enemies that need to be destroyed. That hasn’t changed since the days they went after the nationalists of the Axis.

Another thing that hasn’t changed is that Great Britain wants to keep the lid on continental Europe, especially Germany (France hasn’t been much of a threat to them since Napoleon and in fact have been allied with France most of the time since…Spain and Holland haven’t been able to threaten Great Britain for an even longer period).

They’re rival gangs competing for control, but they are in agreement that only the gangs should be running anything-never the unwashed masses/Proles.

It’s like 200-300 years ago when European officers were captured by other Europeans. They were allowed to keep their sidearms so that the enlisted scum could be kept in line even as POWs. They were all officers and gentlemen of the same class after all.

Dr. ZhivBlago on July 1, 2013 at 3:18 PM

If we can stop but one tewwowist…

John the Libertarian on July 1, 2013 at 3:27 PM

The Euro Govts have to act surprised and outraged, otherwise the subjects citizens might figure out that they’re being spied on as well.

JimK on July 1, 2013 at 3:31 PM

f everybody is spying on everybody are the US citizens the only schlubs who can’t spy on our government?

VegasRick on July 1, 2013 at 2:45 PM

Well, duh, RIck. That would be racist.

ghostwalker1 on July 1, 2013 at 3:34 PM

‘Spying on allies is not unusual’: John Kerry, aka Mr. Horsehead

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 3:39 PM

Key West Reader on July 1, 2013 at 3:08 PM

Click on the second picture and notice how the Russian flag stripes creep into the American flag.

Barred on July 1, 2013 at 3:42 PM

Key West Reader on July 1, 2013 at 3:08 PM

Russia working with FEMA. Sounds about right..

SailorMark on July 1, 2013 at 3:43 PM

In addition, the parties approved of U.S.-Russian cooperation in this field in 2013-2014, which envisages exchange of experience including in monitoring and forecasting emergency situations, training of rescuers, development of mine-rescuing and provision of security at mass events

From the article.

Barred on July 1, 2013 at 3:45 PM

Damn… poor Barry being played by a High School Dropout….

Ain’t Obumbles s’posed ta B da smartest guy n da room

roflmmfao

donabernathy on July 1, 2013 at 3:54 PM

We absolutely should not be bugging their embassies or monitoring communication from their embassies. We should expect the same.
We should not be spying on their governments, espionage is a causation for war. Their governments should not be spying on us.

paulsur on July 1, 2013 at 4:13 PM

Obama looks very tired and disheveled. He is not making a good example of his imperial greatness on his African Safari. Somebody oughta ship him back home where he can go into his special closet and cry. Like a girl.

Key West Reader on July 1, 2013 at 2:58 PM

Breaking: Guess Who Else Is In South Africa? Reggie Love!

http://weaselzippers.us/2013/06/30/breaking-guess-who-else-is-in-south-africa-reggie-love/

workingclass artist on July 1, 2013 at 4:20 PM

Boycott the swine

Schadenfreude on July 1, 2013 at 4:21 PM

Jason Bourne is on his way.

BobMbx on July 1, 2013 at 5:07 PM

Really, Obama? I thought that you knew how to talk your way to a better world!

Your whole plan was that you weren’t Bush. You weren’t a bad guy like Bush. You could talk to everybody and they would understand that you’re not a bad guy like Bush. And the reset would be complete!

I actually could admire your frankness, here. If you had been the least bit realistic before hand. It’s funny that we only have to suffer the harsh realities once Dems are in power. If Dems aren’t in power anything less than ideal is an injustice.

Axeman on July 1, 2013 at 5:13 PM

Do you support the federal government spying on U.S. allies?

Who cares. The Constitution doesn’t prohibit it. But it does say a few things about unreasonable search and seizure and warrants here at home.

What if you knew that U.S. allies were spying on us?

Anyone who would suggest they don’t is a moron.

What if it could be proved that information gleaned from spying can improve national security?

No need to prove it. Just ask the Germans and Japanese about WWII. Your question suggests our allies really aren’t our allies. Why would we need to spy on an ally to improve national security?

BobMbx on July 1, 2013 at 5:20 PM

I actually could admire your frankness, here. If you had been the least bit realistic before hand. It’s funny that we only have to suffer the harsh realities once Dems are in power. If Dems aren’t in power anything less than ideal is an injustice.

Axeman on July 1, 2013 at 5:13 PM

This will all be explained away in another vacuous speech about speed bumps and headwinds.

BobMbx on July 1, 2013 at 5:22 PM