Cold war: U.S. tells Russia to give back Snowden, or else

posted at 9:01 pm on June 24, 2013 by Allahpundit

Imagine how much worse U.S./Russian relations might be right now if we hadn’t had that “reset.”

Does this mean Snowden really did get on a plane to Russia? Because if it turns out he didn’t and the whole Russia-to-Cuba-to-Ecuador thing was just a ruse, then we should dismantle the NSA on principle. If they can’t locate America’s most wanted man, who can’t bear to be apart from his computer, after he’s absconded with a treasure trove of intelligence, then they’re not so useful that we need to keep this eye in the sky afloat.

“They are on notice with respect to our desires,” Kerry said. “It would be deeply troubling if they have adequate notice and notwithstanding that they make a willful decision to ignore that and not live within the standards of the law.

The U.S. has transferred seven prisoners to Russia over the last two years, Kerry said, and the U.S. expects reciprocity. He also took a shot at China and Russia’s treatment of freedom of speech online…

A State Department official said Monday that as far as the U.S. government knows, Snowden is still in Russia and while the State Department is frantically contacting several governments about Snowden, Russia is the primary focus. The State Department is laying out a range of consequences for the Russians if they don’t cooperate and the Russians seem to be holding Snowden in Moscow while they consider their response to Washington, the official said…

To drive home that point, several senior officials have reached out to their Russian counterparts over the last 24 hours. FBI Director Robert Mueller has called his Russian counterpart at the FSB twice today, an administration official said Monday. Deputy Secretary of State Bill Burns and Ambassador to Russia Mike McFaul, a former senior White House official, have also been working the issue hard with their Russian contacts, the official said.

If I were Putin I’d hand him over, after “debriefing” him and his hard drives thoroughly, of course. What benefit is there to holding him once you’ve gotten what you need from him? They’ve already scored big propaganda points by humiliating Obama and we do, of course, have ways of making life more difficult for Moscow if they drag this out. Better to give him up as a “goodwill” gesture, to ensure that we’ll continue to extradite prisoners that they want and, maybe, be a bit more conciliatory on Syria than we’ve been lately. Frankly, Putin might relish the thought of “partnering” with Obama in seeing someone viewed by many Americans as a heroic dissident sent to prison. That’ll come in handy the next time the State Department accuses Moscow of taking political prisoners and persecuting regime critics.

First, though, comes the “extraction.” And it is, almost certainly, coming:

“Russian intelligence and counter-intelligence will have a lot to ask such a well-informed person. I have no doubt that this will be done,” a Russian special services veteran told the Interfax news agency on Sunday on condition of anonymity.

“I am sure that Snowden will have had a busy evening and a sleepless night,” the source added of the American’s reported stayover Sunday night in the transit zone of Moscow’s Sheremetyevo airport after landing from Hong Kong.

“Snowden presents a lot of interest for the FSB (security service). He can give information on technical aspects of intercepting data,” said Russian security expert and commentator for the Novaya Gazeta newspaper Pavel Felgenhauer.

“A debriefing in the presence of technical specialists takes a lot of time,” Felgenhauer told AFP, suggesting that interviews with Russian secret services could take place in a third country.

I can’t think of a reason why ruthless intel services like Russia’s and China’s wouldn’t be as rough as they need to be with this guy to get him to turn over what he has. He’s already revealed that the NSA spied on Medvedev at the G20 summit a few years ago and hacked into Chinese computers. Both regimes now have a national interest in finding out what he knows, which they can sell to their respective publics just in case the locals take an interest Snowden’s fate. This is why, for the life of me, I can’t understand why Snowden’s defenders insist that he hasn’t compromised national security in what he’s done. Even if that’s true so far, he claims to know much more than what he’s leaked; Glenn Greenwald’s giddily declared many times that more leaks are coming. National intelligence sources are telling ABC this afternoon that, in fact, if Snowden made public everything he knows, it could deal a “potentially devastating blow” to U.S. security. Follow the last link and read at least the section titled “Technical Roadmap of the U.S. Surveillance Network.” If they’re telling the truth, which is debatable, the security lapse in making this stuff available to an IT guy is unimaginably gigantic.

Is there any scenario, realistically, in which Russia or China or whoever ends up getting him doesn’t put the screws to him to find out what he knows? If someone fled from Russia or China to the U.S. with the kinds of secrets about them that Snowden has about the U.S., wouldn’t you hope/expect the FBI or CIA would “debrief” that guy at length? Either you believe (a) that Snowden doesn’t know much and therefore can’t hurt U.S. interests — and I’m not sure why anyone would think that at this point — or (b) that Snowden knows a lot and therefore it’s extremely dangerous for him to be placing himself within arm’s reach of Russian and Chinese intelligence. Either the whole FISA/PRISM/Snowden storyline is no big deal because it’s all small potatoes or it’s a very big deal, in which case we have a very, very big national-security problem. Pick one.


Related Posts:

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Comment pages: 1 2

Cold war: U.S. tells Russia to give back Snowden, or else

…and pretty please give Kraft his ring back.

itsnotaboutme on June 24, 2013 at 9:03 PM

…another strongly worded statement!
.
.
.Hi twerp

KOOLAID2 on June 24, 2013 at 9:03 PM

*SNICKERS* Or else what?!

ThePrez on June 24, 2013 at 9:04 PM

I can’t stop laughing.

That Putin and China tell obama how it is makes for 100% proof that the USA has lost her last shred of moral authority and decency in the world.

obama killed them off.

The world which cheered for obama deserves him in full.

Schadenfreude on June 24, 2013 at 9:05 PM

Or else what, exactly?

Obama will give another speech? Where he’s ultra, super-duper cereal?

Putins been laughing at this guy for years., even more so now.

catmman on June 24, 2013 at 9:06 PM

not as much fun when it is you being screwed by leaks is it Giggles?

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:07 PM

If they can’t locate America’s most wanted man, who can’t bear to be apart from his computer four laptops

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:07 PM

If I were Putin I’d hand him over, after “debriefing” him and his hard drives thoroughly, of course.

“Ve haff veys of making you talk. Take his computer away from him until he cooperates!”

itsnotaboutme on June 24, 2013 at 9:07 PM

Cold war: U.S. tells Russia to give back Snowden, or else

I’ll hold my breath and stomp my feet and tell evwee buddy what a horrible waysist meany you are!

So there!

Bruno Strozek on June 24, 2013 at 9:08 PM

Flexibility

Snowden might have done bad things but in weird ways has exposed the bigest piles of mold to sunshine. May all the bad ones be destroyed, in full. They lied enough already.

“Civil servants” turns out to be neither. They are both oxymorons.

The WH is in utter disarray and the eunuchiness is incredibly schadenfreudig to watch.

Schadenfreude on June 24, 2013 at 9:09 PM

and now Mr. Snowden, we shall de-brief you!

E L Frederick (Sniper One) on June 24, 2013 at 9:09 PM

Putins been laughing at this guy for years., even more so now.

catmman on June 24, 2013 at 9:06 PM

I’ve heard that he’s so pleased he’s going take his shirt off and to wrestle a rabid mountain lion.

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:10 PM

we do, of course, have ways of making life more difficult for Moscow if they drag this out.

Do we? What are they?

Shay on June 24, 2013 at 9:10 PM

The value to Russia and China of the United States acting like the international thug is considerable. It may in fact be more valuable than anything Snowden has on his computer. It isn’t as if they don’t already know what is going on in the spy world.

sharrukin on June 24, 2013 at 9:11 PM

or else

Putin is laughing his azz off.

The entire world laughs at the US, deservedly so.

Once beacon of freedom to the world, now an eunuchy land, with an exposed nakid nobody behind the curtain.

I so hope that Snowden has all or some of obama’s records, no not the certificate. There are better ones than that.

Schadenfreude on June 24, 2013 at 9:11 PM

I’ll just bet Putin is hiding under his bed right now. Laughing. Gee, if we really wanted to put a scare into ‘em, why not threaten to send Mooch over?

ghostwalker1 on June 24, 2013 at 9:11 PM

“Ve haff veys of making you talk. Take his computer away from him until he cooperates!”

itsnotaboutme on June 24, 2013 at 9:07 PM

Oddly, this is exactly the same technique we use with our 13 year old to get him to cut the grass…

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:11 PM

Don’t make me fill out a basketball bracket against you.
 
- President Barack H. Obama

rogerb on June 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

Snowden will end up getting his own show on Russia Today, where he’ll fit right in.

Mark1971 on June 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

“Without firing a shot!”

Jeddite on June 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

I can’t understand why Snowden’s defenders insist that he hasn’t compromised national security in what he’s done.

These days, I don’t care anymore… and quite honestly, knowing what the USG is up to around the world to promote agendas I don’t agree with I hope it is compromised.

Is there any scenario, realistically, in which Russia or China or whoever ends up getting him doesn’t put the screws to him to find out what he knows?

The only screws they have is to turn him over to the US.

ninjapirate on June 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

The value to Russia and China of the United States acting like the international thug is considerable. It may in fact be more valuable than anything Snowden has on his computer. It isn’t as if they don’t already know what is going on in the spy world.

sharrukin on June 24, 2013 at 9:11 PM

Hi shari, how are you? Some things never change, do they?

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:13 PM

Putin: Buahahahahahahahaha. Oh, uh, really – you kill me! Put on your Mom jeans again and strut for me – then maybe we’ll talk.

Hill60 on June 24, 2013 at 9:14 PM

Snowden will end up getting his own show on Russia Today, where he’ll fit right in.

Mark1971 on June 24, 2013 at 9:12 PM

I’ve heard they’re fixing him up with Anna Chapman…

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:14 PM

Give him back or else we send Michelle there for a “vacation”

birdwatcher on June 24, 2013 at 9:14 PM

or else . . . what? I thought having more flexibility was going to bring peace.

ritewhit on June 24, 2013 at 9:14 PM

SNORT
CHORTLE
GU FREAKING FAW

Rio Linda Refugee on June 24, 2013 at 9:15 PM

For the first time in my life….my caring about America’s well-being is suspect.

A pity. But hey, when half the citizenry and a good deal more of the political class view you as the enemy…

Hawkins1701 on June 24, 2013 at 9:15 PM

Obama should challenge Putin to a SNAPChallenge!

bloggless on June 24, 2013 at 9:16 PM

Hi shari, how are you?

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:13 PM

Hey to you to.

sharrukin on June 24, 2013 at 9:16 PM

“or else” – this is the most hilarious phase in the obama fiasco era. Thank God for irony. One couldn’t see this in fiction/the movies.

Schadenfreude on June 24, 2013 at 9:17 PM

Hawkins1701 on June 24, 2013 at 9:15 PM

Isn’t it amazing what a few Democrat administrations and a few feckless Republican administrations can do to one’s love of country these days.

Cleombrotus on June 24, 2013 at 9:18 PM

Trade him for Carney.

He lies better than Goebbels.

Schadenfreude on June 24, 2013 at 9:18 PM

Or else what???

He will have Reggie hit him with his purse.

LegendHasIt on June 24, 2013 at 9:18 PM

Pretty sure the Russians and Chinese already know about our cyber programs. The Russians are more interested in ginning up domestic (Russian) support and to humiliate the US internationally then any intel Snowden has, which they know will end up being released to the public anyways.

No one will be putting the screws to him.

Timin203 on June 24, 2013 at 9:18 PM

. Better to give him up as a “goodwill” gesture, to ensure that we’ll continue to extradite prisoners

I don’t know about the US but I know there are a few of Russian scumbags who has stolen money from Russians and were given asylum in the UK.

ninjapirate on June 24, 2013 at 9:19 PM

Sounds like me an my daughters…but after telling them they’ll lose their snack…I got nothing.

tomas on June 24, 2013 at 9:19 PM

Then why didn’t China do exactly what you think Russia will do? Debrief him and then turn him over? And I think that Greenwald would have reported if Snowden was debriefed or tortured for information by the Chinese. I think Putin would much rather have Snowden be a thorn in Obama’s side for another year than to gain some information they already have on NSA security measures and then have Snowden come back to the US and tell everyone that Russia interrogated him for hours and hours and hours and/or tortured him for info.

thphilli on June 24, 2013 at 9:19 PM

Kerry to Putin: I came here to kick ass and chew bubblegum, and I’m all out of kick ass.

Godzilla on June 24, 2013 at 9:19 PM

This is what America voted for twice…hope and change!

d1carter on June 24, 2013 at 9:20 PM

Snowden: I will tell you whatever information I have.

FSB: We know.

Southernblogger on June 24, 2013 at 9:20 PM

Well thank goodness Russia isn’t a geopolitical rival or something.

HumpBot Salvation on June 24, 2013 at 9:20 PM

Putin probably hurt himself laughing so hard at the shuck and jive master.

stephana on June 24, 2013 at 9:21 PM

yeah…. Barack is gonna go into General Manly Throw McMomJeans Hero of Hole 19 Personal Slayer of OBL mode with new KUNG POW grip and beat up Russia….

look I am a penultimate cold war baby and I don’t care anymore.

If I recall correctly Barack through his actions, deference, and snubs has sent the message Russia and China are more valued allies than the United Kingdom and Canada. The UK and Canada both cultivate contacts within the US Intel community so if Bark and .50 Kerry are to be taken at their word I am not supposed to be any more worried than when one of our guys had lunch with the cousins correct?

Obama is using the United States military and diplomatic might to aid Al Qaeda allied operatives along with the Muslim Brotherhood in now 3 sovereign nations without congressional approval or UN permission.

I seem to recall this really pi**ed the left off when they accused Bush of doing it to FIGHT radical Islamists.

Point is the guy is dangerous and stupid enough I am learning to care as little about US security as the democrats did under Bush the younger and when Reagan won.

Sow the wind democrats reap the whirlwind, I’m ready for your “post American” patriotism now.

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:23 PM

Rovin on June 24, 2013 at 9:21 PM

Beat me by that much…LOL.

d1carter on June 24, 2013 at 9:23 PM

Remember when Reagan and Gorbachev got along? Good times.

birdwatcher on June 24, 2013 at 9:23 PM

This is what America voted for twice…hope and change!

d1carter on June 24, 2013 at 9:20 PM

precisely…

You wanted this America?

Enjoy…just remember Snowden ain’t mine he is an Obama backer…

this is YOUR mess not mine donkey.

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:24 PM

Obama should challenge Putin to a SNAPChallenge!

bloggless on June 24, 2013 at 9:16 PM

Funeeeeeeeeeeee!

VegasRick on June 24, 2013 at 9:24 PM

Embarrassing. We are a laughingstock of the globe…

OmahaConservative on June 24, 2013 at 9:24 PM

I pick BIG DEAL.

HiJack on June 24, 2013 at 9:25 PM

Wait a minute! Didn’t the Presidents side keep telling us for the dirt four years of the regime that Hawaii is partof the United States? I recall being told something like that, as regards births anyway.

My point is that before Edward Clownhead was in in Russia, spilling our most vital secrets to the damn KGB (or FSB or whatever they call it these days), and before he was in China doing the same for our friends in the PLA counter intelligence arm, he was in HAWAII!!!!

If we wanted t stop him he could have been stopped at the airport. NSA failure.

Or, they could have never let him remove data from their systems. NSA fail!

Or failed his background check and never hired. EPIC NSA fail.

Instead, now Mr. President Incompetent is out there applying the wrecking ball to his only international relationship. Before Goofball and his idiot minions are done we won’t have any alliances left, the world will be at war, our internal security will be gone, the economy will be so bad we will all live in boxes under bridge crossings and our medical care will be nonexistent. And Russia will hate us, too

MTF on June 24, 2013 at 9:26 PM

“It would be deeply troubling if they have adequate notice and notwithstanding that they make a willful decision to ignore that and not live within the standards of the law.

Bwahahahahahahaha

Oh Lurch, you slay me.

itsacookbook on June 24, 2013 at 9:28 PM

Bwahahahahahahaha

Oh Lurch, you slay me.

itsacookbook on June 24, 2013 at 9:28 PM

If you put Jungle John Kerry and Joey Plugz Biden on opposite ends of the capital dome and had them play tiddlywinks the stupidity could power DC for a century.

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:30 PM

Beat me by that much…LOL.

d1carter on June 24, 2013 at 9:23 PM

Ain’t twitter grand?

Rovin on June 24, 2013 at 9:31 PM

The (high) quality and (high) quantity of analysis that comes out of this blog continues to amaze me.

aquaviva on June 24, 2013 at 9:34 PM

Man, I can’t wait for Hilary to run on her foreign policy experience and how she did a super awesome job on repairing US relations around the woooooooooooooooorld!

If the GOP had any brains (which we know that they dont) they would run a video of Hilary the Russian FM showing us the US/Russian ‘reset’ buttom

Lance Murdock on June 24, 2013 at 9:36 PM

“They are on notice with respect to our desires,” Kerry said

When they thwart those desires you could always throw your service medals over the fence of the Kremlin. Wait a minute you already did that at the White House and no one listened to you then.

chemman on June 24, 2013 at 9:37 PM

What’s Obama going to do if the Russians don’t hand over Snowden?

Stop giving them our classified missile defense data?

Moreover, the White House responds to Russian programs and threats to overwhelm our missile-defense systems in a nuclear attack with offers to share classified technical data about these systems that would enhance Russia’s ability to defeat them.

http://fortunascorner.wordpress.com/2013/06/23/obamas-plan-for-nuclear-reductions-is-letting-moscow-get-away-with-murder/

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324577904578555552707034238.html

So…who is it who’s endangering our national defense again?

He’s already revealed that the NSA spied on Medvedev at the G20 summit a few years ago and hacked into Chinese computers

That’s silly. Do you really think the Russians and Chinese didn’t already know this? Even with the very generalized info Snowden gave out at the beginning, the Russians and Chinese certainly figured this out, if they didn’t know it already, which is very very doubtful.

Dreadnought on June 24, 2013 at 9:38 PM

But in a damning appraisal, a wide variety of congressional Democrats and presidential scholars said in interviews that there is another decisive factor behind Obama’s current paralysis: his own failure to use the traditional tools of the presidency to exert his will.

Obama does not instill fear — one of the customary instruments of presidential power. Five years of experience, say lawmakers of both parties, have demonstrated that there is not a huge political or personal cost to be paid for crossing the president. link

I guess Chicago thuggery politics has it’s on borders too.

Rovin on June 24, 2013 at 9:39 PM

Funny how the story is all about Snowden, and not about how the US government is spying on honest American citizens – whom 0bama calls “domestic terrorists” because they’re not on board with his progressive agenda.

Snowden is the ultimate “look, squirrel!”

Rebar on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

Now now, the adults are in charge, remember?

supernova on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

Oooh, I bet Putin’s manboobs are all a’quiver over the Man-Child’s huffing, puffing, can’t blow down shit threats.

As I said on another thread…

I loved this…

‘The blood is on the hands of both parties. There is always a question as to who is to blame.

One should hardly back those who kill enemies and eat their organs. It is hardly in relation to the humanitarian and cultural values Europe has been professing for centuries. I believe you will not deny that one should hardly back those who kill their enemies and eat their organs.

Do you want to support these people? Do you want to supply arms to these people?
Is it them who you want to supply with weapons? Then this probably has little relation to humanitarian values that have been preached in Europe for hundreds of years.

If we speak calmly, in a businesslike fashion, let me draw your attention to the fact that Russia supplies arms to the legitimate government of Syria in full compliance with the norms of international law. We are not breaching any rules and norms.

Let me emphasize that: we are not breaching any rules and norms, and we call on all our partners to act in the same fashion.

You will not deny that one does not really need to support the people who not only kill their enemies, but open up their bodies, eat their intestines in front of the public and cameras. Are these the people you want to support?’

– Vladimir Putin, 17 June 2013

Something is seriously wrong with this country when Putin is correct and our government is arming cannibals.

Talk about – to use one of Obama’s favourite phrases – being ‘on the wrong side of history.’

How the hell did we get to the point where the Muscovite Macho Man, who rules with an iron fist, makes more sense than the POTUS, who is arming BARBARIANS AND CANNIBALS WHO WANT TO DESTROY US?

Resist We Much on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

on = own

Rovin on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

I guess Chicago thuggery politics has it’s on borders too.

Rovin on June 24, 2013 at 9:39 PM

No he’sgot the internal thuggery down cold he just casn’t bear to go against the seedbed of the Dreams and Schemes of Mommy and Daddy! Bark is a Red Diaper baby….Russia and China are the “good guys”…he’ll never say “no” to them and mean it

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:41 PM

Go Russia.

rrpjr on June 24, 2013 at 9:42 PM

Why do Obama and his minions only reserve their Chicago Democratic Machine Thug Politics© for conservative and Libertarian American citizens? Why not where it could actually be useful: against agitating foreign nations?

visions on June 24, 2013 at 9:43 PM

I guess Chicago thuggery politics has it’s on borders too.

Rovin on June 24, 2013 at 9:39 PM

When I was a kid, when I would complain about something my Dad would say “Well, you know what they say in Russia about that”…..”tough sh!tsky”.

VegasRick on June 24, 2013 at 9:43 PM

Putin: Wearing big boy jeans.

Obama: Well, we know the answer to that one.

Putin understands the application of power, when and where and especially how to do it.

Obama talks a good game, if TOTUS is up and running, maybe, but understand? Hardly.

If Washington actually believes we can compel, force, embarrass Russia into doing our bidding, then we’ve a lot bigger problems than Snowden.

Speak softly and carry a big stick.

Or shoot yer mouth off and hope like hell your opponent just gives in.

The stakes?

Putin has to do nothing, nothing at all.

Obama has to somehow compel Putin to do something Putin is not wont to do…ever. Man to man…Putin has little if any respect for the President. Nothing there to show respect for at all. From the Putin perspective.

He understands there is little to nothing the US can do….to him, or Russia. Putin also understands that right now the United States needs Putin a lot more than we need Obama.

Take Syria, for example. Who has skin in the game and who can exert influence better? With Iran? With China? With North Korea? Just about anywhere in the world where Russia has a stake or foothold…Putin will set the music, arrange the instruments and choreograph the opening night.

Obama? Lucky if he can get tickets to the performance.

Snowden may be the boldest whistleblower ever or the most brazen agent of a foreign government in decades….but right now, Snowden is of little importance. NSA, DHS and DoJ working hard to ursurep the Constitution in the name of “security.” Overseas entanglements costing us time, money and most important the lives of our best…daily. And for what? So Obama can look good for posterity?

Sad to say, but after a lifetime of service to my nation, I find that I am more in tune with Vladimir Putin at this stage than I am with the guy occupying the Office of the President.

The one I have grudging respect for.

The other…not a dram.

And for those who never saw this sort of thing coming…well, thank you for your votes in 2008 and 2012…you got him…deal with it.

coldwarrior on June 24, 2013 at 9:43 PM

Funny how the story is all about Snowden, and not about how the US government is spying on honest American citizens – whom 0bama calls “domestic terrorists” because they’re not on board with his progressive agenda.

Snowden is the ultimate “look, squirrel!”

Rebar on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

Operation Shiny Objects is a go…

I’ll care about Snowden if/when he’s put on trial…I am concerned about an our of control partisan civil service every minute of the day since the IRS broke and it was revealed how partisan several branches have gotten.

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:43 PM

Resist We Much on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

+100 Nailed it.

coldwarrior on June 24, 2013 at 9:44 PM

I can hear Putin laughing from my house…

Seven Percent Solution on June 24, 2013 at 9:45 PM

Talk about – to use one of Obama’s favourite phrases – being ‘on the wrong side of history.’

How the hell did we get to the point where the Muscovite Macho Man, who rules with an iron fist, makes more sense than the POTUS, who is arming BARBARIANS AND CANNIBALS WHO WANT TO DESTROY US?

Resist We Much on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

Putin loves his country, wants to protect its interests, is a devout Christian concerned about the encroachment of Islam in his nation I’ll put it this way I’d vote Putin over Obama yes Putin is a bit corrupt and a tyrant in some ways but stay loyal don’t cross him and you know he’ll show loyalty….

BRAK! on the other hand….

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:46 PM

Five years of experience, say lawmakers of both parties, have demonstrated that there is not a huge political or personal cost to be paid for crossing the president.

Tell that to the 500 Tea Party groups reamed by the IRS, and Catherine Englebrecht, and Gibson Guitar and…

rrpjr on June 24, 2013 at 9:48 PM

The more that Obama makes Snowden an issue, the more valuable he is to Putin. That means that Snowden could be traded for something else of value, or he could be released to somewhere like Iceland, or Ecuador as a snub and a demonstration of Obama’s weak hand.

sharrukin on June 24, 2013 at 9:49 PM

If I were Putin I’d hand him over, after “debriefing” him and his hard drives thoroughly, of course. What benefit is there to holding him once you’ve gotten what you need from him? They’ve already scored big propaganda points by humiliating Obama and we do, of course, have ways of making life more difficult for Moscow if they drag this out.

What? What are we going to do? Aid Jihadist fighting against Russia? Call off a Nuclear Arms meeting? Seriously this guy is a propaganda dream come true for the Russians.

As for our National Security, well what is the purpose of National Security? To protect America, right…so what is America about? Freedom, Liberty….the Constitution of the United States. So what do you call a “national security” program that violates the constitution, that rips it to shreds, and that makes a joke of it?

For me it would be called the enemy…but it is clear some are cool with ripping up the constitution, destroying the whole point of this country (remember we are not a nationality based on a ethnicity)all so that we can score some points over the Russians and Chinese, and of course protect us from 7th century barbarians.

Heck with national security like that who needs Russians and Chinese…and Jihadist! We protected the country but destroyed America…

William Eaton on June 24, 2013 at 9:50 PM

Putin to 0bummer… ” I fart in your general direction. Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries”.

bloviator on June 24, 2013 at 9:50 PM

How the hell did we get to the point where the Muscovite Macho Man, who rules with an iron fist, makes more sense than the POTUS, who is arming BARBARIANS AND CANNIBALS WHO WANT TO DESTROY US?

Resist We Much on June 24, 2013 at 9:40 PM

My feelings exactly. Everything’s upside down. It’s Alice in Wonderland.

Burke on June 24, 2013 at 9:52 PM

Have they tried this?

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

I’ll care about Snowden if/when he’s put on trial…I am concerned about an our of control partisan civil service every minute of the day since the IRS broke and it was revealed how partisan several branches have gotten.

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:43 PM

Several branches? Try…..most branches

Considering how bad it is, it amazes me that Republcians manage to get anything done at all when they are in office. In many ways, this IRS scandal is only the tip of the iceberg.

Dreadnought on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

Don’t forget, Russia warned the US about the Boston Marathon bombers, and the US did nothing.

birdwatcher on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

Hillary is warming up her broom as we speak.

coldwarrior on June 24, 2013 at 9:54 PM

Cold war: U.S. tells Russia to give back Snowden, or else

Will he unleash the dreaded Civilian National Security Force?

More likely the Dem shills in media outlets will receive talking points telling them to write kinda mean things about Putin.

Dr. ZhivBlago on June 24, 2013 at 9:54 PM

There was a column a week back that asked “what if Sarah Palin were president?” that went on to list what she would have done differently than Otraitor has done during his reign.

I think in this case, not that Palin would have found herself in this predicament in the first place, but she would have Putin’s testicles in a mason jar on the Resolute Desk.

And treasonous POS like BHO would spend their days b!tching and moaning about how hot the weather is in Cuba.

turfmann on June 24, 2013 at 9:55 PM

Don’t forget, Russia warned the US about the Boston Marathon bombers, and the US did nothing.

birdwatcher on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

Then Obama blamed the Russians for not protecting us from the Boston Bombers…really it is unreal. That is the thanks they got for actually doing something for us for once. Putin reached out and Obama slapped his hand.

If I was the Russians I would milk this melodrama for all it is worth.

William Eaton on June 24, 2013 at 9:57 PM

Either you believe (a) that Snowden doesn’t know much and therefore can’t hurt U.S. interests — and I’m not sure why anyone would think that at this point — or (b) that Snowden knows a lot and therefore it’s extremely dangerous for him to be placing himself within arm’s reach of Russian and Chinese intelligence. Either the whole FISA/PRISM/Snowden storyline is no big deal because it’s all small potatoes or it’s a very big deal, in which case we have a very, very big national-security problem. Pick one.


Uhmmmmmmmmm …. NO.

Really, AP … you need to take a logic course or something.

Are you being interviewed for a gig on the McLaughlin Group?

The Lame Stream Media ALWAYS demands people decide between two FALSE choices … with one carefully phrased to be more socially acceptable.

Let’s just run through a wider array of choices, quickly, shall we?

1) Snowden is being portrayed as Beyond Bond, more Cunning Than Cruise in Mission Impossible and able to penetrate THE MOST SECURE of the American intelligence agencies all by himself …….. and having this pablum force fed to you DOESN”T initiate your gag reflex?

Is EVERY journalist and big time blogger these days more trusting than a baby seal watching someone coming at them with a club???

Snowden had a HIGH level (30 – 40 people on the FISA court distribution list) source. The probability of this is asymptotically approaching 1.0

So are you peddling your FALSE choices as part of protecting National Security?

Or are you SO easily distracted?

2) Let’s presume, for the sake of argument, Snowden is NOT as trusting as a baby seal …

… then Snowden is:

a) A Chinese agent

b) A Russian agent

c) the designated FRONT man for the actual source of all of this information

d) An American TRIPLE agent providing disinformation on technical and humint details.

e) All of the above

3) EVERYTHING Snowden has revealed so far was already KNOWN to Russia, China, etc, etc..

Wait? … What?

a) Everything revealed so far has fallen within the “Known knowns’ realm. Deducing American capabilities along these lines is a straightforward exercise in logic … even if you leave simply means of verifying capabilities out of the mix. Some of those are what are generally referred to in the media as “tradecraft”. Others are based on Physics and Einstein’s comments on the Oberserver effecting what they are observing.

b) Is Edward Snowden the ONLY person on the planet attempting to penetrate American intelligence agencies? Or is there a very large number of people and resources dedicated to this same goal from … pretty much any government of any size on the face of the planet? Let’s make the SAFE assumption – ALL of the HIGH level information and MUCH of the techinical details have already been obtained by a fair number of these foreign governments.

c) Hey, Edward Snowden makes a MUCH better story for the Obama Administration than having to admit they have ONE OR MORE highly placed MOLES leaking our most confidential programs and processes like a sieve … doesn’t it? Seriously, why hasn’t the FBI just put out a recent photo of him wearing a red & white striped shirt with atasseled cap on his head???

Or would that be TOO obvious?

PolAgnostic on June 24, 2013 at 9:59 PM

That’s silly. Do you really think the Russians and Chinese didn’t already know this? Even with the very generalized info Snowden gave out at the beginning, the Russians and Chinese certainly figured this out, if they didn’t know it already, which is very very doubtful.

Dreadnought on June 24, 2013 at 9:38 PM

This is the punch line nobody gets. What if both Chinese External Intelligence (used to be the “New China News Agency” at 15 Bow String Alley, Peking) and the FSB didn’t bother doing more than a cursory inter on Snowden because they already had access to most of the data he had, or at least knew how to get it if they wanted it?

(Note that I’m pretty sure they don’t give a rat’s a$$ about your Aunt Emily’s secret recipe’ for strawberry preserves.)

If an outside contractor IT guy can get data to the degree that Snowden claims, the only reasonable conclusion is that “No Such Agency”‘s security is virtually non-existent. Which means that it’s a good two-dollar bet that they’ve already been penetrated, probably by somebody doing a Jonathan Pollard- or worse, a John Walker.

Not to mention the possibility of purely computer-based breaches, i.e. hacking. Again, if an IT contractor has that much access, their security sucks.

The real story here might not be Snowden. It might be these two things;

1. The Russian and Chinese intelligence services may have penetrated our most super-secret “spy” agency to a degree that makes the Venona intercepts look like a couple of kids playing “I Spy”.

2. Said super-spy outfit was so damned busy spying on Americans that they were too wrapped up in themselves to notice.

clear ether

eon

eon on June 24, 2013 at 10:01 PM

not as much fun when it is you being screwed by leaks is it Giggles?

harlekwin15 on June 24, 2013 at 9:07 PM

Yep, he got where he is by leaking information on his political opponents.

slickwillie2001 on June 24, 2013 at 10:05 PM

Russia said it would consider asylum for Snowden. What are the chances this could happen? Might they use the same reasoning as Ecuador?

dbrhmccrtr on June 24, 2013 at 10:08 PM

Don’t forget, Russia warned the US about the Boston Marathon bombers, and the US did nothing.

birdwatcher on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

Then Obama blamed the Russians for not protecting us from the Boston Bombers…really it is unreal. That is the thanks they got for actually doing something for us for once. Putin reached out and Obama slapped his hand.

If I was the Russians I would milk this melodrama for all it is worth.

William Eaton on June 24, 2013 at 9:57 PM

The Russians missed the boat on the Tsarnaevs; they should have lied and told the FBI that the Tsarnaevs were neo-Nazi skinheads. The FBI would have been all over them then.

Unfortunately the FBI heard ‘muslims’ and they gave the case a very low priority.

slickwillie2001 on June 24, 2013 at 10:10 PM

Give him up, or we’ll send you a strongly worded memo.

The Rogue Tomato on June 24, 2013 at 10:10 PM

Why is Steve Urkel sitting on a stage with Putin?

VegasRick on June 24, 2013 at 10:12 PM

Mr. Putin, how about a trade, just like we used to do at the Glienicke Bridge in Berlin.

At the appointed time, you tell Snowden to begin walking to the West; at the same time, we will tell Obama to start walking toward the East.

Ummm, no?

Don’t want Obama, either?

coldwarrior on June 24, 2013 at 10:14 PM

Hillary is warming up her broom as we speak.

coldwarrior on June 24, 2013 at 9:54 PM

LOL “C’mon, Straw Thunder, we’ve got a job to do!”

cynccook on June 24, 2013 at 10:14 PM

Don’t give him back. Let him leave to go where he wishes.

You want to really slap Obama in the face, Putin? Now’s your chance. He deserves it.

MadisonConservative on June 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

Russia said it would consider asylum for Snowden. What are the chances this could happen? Might they use the same reasoning as Ecuador?

dbrhmccrtr on June 24, 2013 at 10:08 PM

I’d love to see Putin come out and say they are giving Snowden asylum because he knows he could never get a fair trial in the USA and would probably be killed by the govt before he even got a chance at a trial.

VegasRick on June 24, 2013 at 10:15 PM

Don’t forget, Russia warned the US about the Boston Marathon bombers, and the US did nothing.

birdwatcher on June 24, 2013 at 9:53 PM

Goddammit. Like I needed more to think about. F**K.

I despise this government.

MadisonConservative on June 24, 2013 at 10:16 PM

I love it when the State Run Media twists themselves into pretzels…

d1carter on June 24, 2013 at 10:20 PM

Comment pages: 1 2