Snowden tells Chinese paper: Yes, the U.S. is hacking Chinese and Hong Kong computers

posted at 6:41 pm on June 12, 2013 by Allahpundit

Via CNN, a perfect illustration of why even pols with deep libertarian sympathies insist on reserving judgment about this guy. The most amazing thing about it is how gratuitously self-destructive it is to Snowden’s credibility. No one doubts that the U.S. is cyberspying on China; if the feds are capable of putting something like PRISM together, they’re capable of exploiting Chinese security vulnerabilities. Confirming for a Chinese paper that we’re doing what everyone knows we’re doing doesn’t even qualify as a “leak.” His whole point in his Guardian interview with Greenwald, though, was that he’s not out to hurt American interests, merely to clue his fellow citizens into something the government’s doing to them that should concern them. Yakking to a Chinese paper about U.S. cyberespionage proves that that’s not quite true. He’s also out to embarrass the U.S. by revealing stuff that’ll raise tensions with other nations, even if the stuff he’s revealing is supported by most Americans.

Then again, we already had an inkling of that when the Guardian revealed a few days ago amid the FISA/PRISM bombshells that Obama had asked his natsec team for a list of potential overseas cybertargets. There’s nothing scandalous about that. Preparing for war contingencies is what the commander-in-chief and the country’s military do. But it’s embarrassing to the U.S. to have it revealed and it’ll cause diplomatic headaches with other countries, and evidently that’s enough for Snowden. The “best-case” scenario for him telling Chinese media that we’re spying on China is that he figures that inflaming local sentiment against the U.S. will make it harder for Chinese/Hong Kong authorities to extradite him. Which is to say, instead of gratuitously humiliating America, in this scenario he’s merely betraying state semi-secrets to protect himself. Somewhere Obama’s watching this CNN clip and smiling because he knows that, like it or not, he’s locked in a battle for public opinion with Snowden right now. And everyone who saw this segment this afternoon is now thinking the same thing: If Snowden’s willing to tell China this, what else is he willing to them that he knows? Advantage: Obama.

Actually, I spoke too soon in saying that he merely revealed something everyone knew in confirming that the U.S. spies on China. He was quite a bit more specific than that:

The Post said Snowden provided documents, which the paper described as “unverified,” that he said showed U.S. cyber operations targeting a Hong Kong university, public officials and students in the Chinese city. The paper said the documents also indicate hacking attacks targeting mainland Chinese targets, but did not reveal information about Chinese military systems…

“We hack network backbones — like huge internet routers, basically — that give us access to the communications of hundreds of thousands of computers without having to hack every single one,” Snowden said, according to the paper. “Last week the American government happily operated in the shadows with no respect for the consent of the governed, but no longer.”

And here’s what our freedom-loving, Ron-Paul-supporting hero said about Putin’s fascist kingdom, which is using the idea of granting him asylum to score its own cheap propaganda points against the U.S.:

“Asked if he had been offered asylum by the Russian government, he said: ‘My only comment is that I am glad there are governments that refuse to be intimidated by great power,’” the Morning Post reported.

If there’s anyone who appreciates standing up to great government power, it’s Vladimir Putin. Imagine how heroic Snowden will look to middle America if he ends up essentially defecting to Russia. Incidentially, while Snowden’s comments to the Chinese paper were breaking this afternoon, Uncle Jimbo at Blackfive was posting his findings after looking into Snowden’s claim that he began training to join Special Forces back in 2003. That can’t be true, says UJ:

The 18 X-ray program is a way to go directly from the street to the Special Forces course. You first would attend basic and advanced individual training and then airborne school. Upon successful conclusion of those you head to Bragg for some prep training and the Special Forces Assessment and Selection course. If you pass all of those, then and only then do you start Special Forces training.

Mr. Snowden wasn’t even eligible for this program as he didn’t even graduate from High School.

Either Snowden left the military before ever realizing that he was ineligible for Special Forces or he deliberately exaggerated his ambitions in his Guardian interview. Add that to the other mysteries surrounding him, like how an IT guy managed to lasso such a large and diverse collection of documents. That’ll be the White House’s strategy against him going forward, I think — claiming on the one hand that data-mining helps thwart lots and lots of terror attacks and emphasizing on the other that Snowden’s story has holes in it and that he seems to enjoy sharing state secrets with China. Stay tuned.

Update: A succinct summary of Snowden’s comments to the Chinese paper from Dave Weigel:

Snowden’s problem is larger than domestic spycraft. It’s a problem with spycraft, period. The people circling him and now and dreaming of a “treason” case against him have to notice that.


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Is he trying to get droned? Is he trying to start a war with China? WTH

ted c on June 12, 2013 at 6:45 PM

This may be the part where “heroic selfless whistleblower” starts to morph into “traitor”.

farsighted on June 12, 2013 at 6:47 PM

Yakking to a Chinese paper about U.S. cyberespionage proves that that’s not quite true. He’s also out to embarrass the U.S. by revealing stuff that’ll raise tensions with other nations, even if the stuff he’s revealing is supported by most Americans.

He previously said he didn’t want to influence the election, even though he knew about PRISM before November 2012. If that were true, and he still felt so compelled to reveal all, there was nothing to stop him from telling everyone in December 2012.

Again, the timing of the revelation about PRISM vis-a-vis the cybersecurity talks with China is very likely not a coincidence.

Stoic Patriot on June 12, 2013 at 6:47 PM

The 18 X-ray program is a way to go directly from the street to the Special Forces course. You first would attend basic and advanced individual training and then airborne school.

this stain spent all of 3-5 months in the Army. He was nowhere near any 18-series schooling.

ted c on June 12, 2013 at 6:47 PM

I think he’s insane.

Seriously.

ladyingray on June 12, 2013 at 6:47 PM

Just…dammit.

Bee on June 12, 2013 at 6:48 PM

I think he’s nuts to begin with and now he’s becoming China’s Peter Arnett. This is going to get worse.

forest on June 12, 2013 at 6:49 PM

Ha!!! Freaking Flake! Lol!

Bmore on June 12, 2013 at 6:50 PM

Yes, the U.S. is hacking Chinese and Hong Kong computers

If we aren’t we are failing.

If the Chinese did not know it they are failing.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 6:50 PM

This is going to get good. I am starting to believe Beck a little more every hour. LIB! You scumbags allowed this POS to ruin this country and now is the time for a little payback. Your tears will be delicious and I will laugh.

VegasRick on June 12, 2013 at 6:51 PM

It’s not fashionable anymore to consider someone’s personal background in hiring them. Obama — no father, absent mother, no executive experience — let’s make him POTUS! Snowden — high school dropout, parents divorced when he was 17, a little community college — let’s give him access to the most sensitive classified information. Then people are like … gee, we never saw this coming.

Paul-Cincy on June 12, 2013 at 6:52 PM

freedom-loving, Ron-Paul-supporting hero

Ah, now it all makes sense…er, well, you know what I mean…

Knott Buyinit on June 12, 2013 at 6:52 PM

I hope Dark Current doesn’t volunteer to fly this guy anywhere.

oldroy on June 12, 2013 at 6:52 PM

No one doubts that the U.S. is cyberspying on China

Ya think?

From last year:
Feds Now Want to Spy by Hacking Foreign Gaming Consoles

whatcat on June 12, 2013 at 6:53 PM

The Manchurian Candidate

ReaganWasRight on June 12, 2013 at 6:54 PM

What’s more scary: Snowden is saying this, or our Government hired him and he had a high security clearance?

portlandon on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

It’s not fashionable anymore to consider someone’s personal background in hiring them. Obama — no father, absent mother, no executive experience — let’s make him POTUS! Snowden — high school dropout, parents divorced when he was 17, a little community college — let’s give him access to the most sensitive classified information. Then people are like … gee, we never saw this coming.

Paul-Cincy on June 12, 2013 at 6:52 PM

How many more are there like him? Scary.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Via CNN, a perfect illustration of why even pols with deep libertarian sympathies insist on reserving judgment about this guy

What a laugh.

What’s more relevant is that so many conservatives have thrown out their concern for national security because they think sanctifying Bradly Manning’s traitorous bosom buddy Edward Snowden will help score political points against Obama.

Shame on you all! Shame on you all for supporting this traitor!

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Since this idiot is so enamored with Special Forces why not let ODA Delta have a crack at him so he can see what he missed out on?

Art on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Nothing but a traitor. Hero my @ss. Hang him high.

Aplombed on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Via CNN, a perfect illustration of why even pols with deep libertarian sympathies insist on reserving judgment about this guy. The most amazing thing about it is how gratuitously self-destructive it is to Snowden’s credibility.

The Story is not about Snowden…But let’s keep talking about him anyway cause it’s a useful diversion and sells well on Youtube.

So useful Snowden can’t seem to help himself…played like a violin.

I expect Cummings to claim this story/scandal is over now by the end of the week.

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Ah, now it all makes sense…er, well, you know what I mean…

Knott Buyinit on June 12, 2013 at 6:52 PM

I assume you mean if this guy admired and supported the little nut-job, he’s got to be one of the same?

oldroy on June 12, 2013 at 6:57 PM

My country? Spying? On the Chinese? And getting Swiss bankers drunk?

Now I am shocked.

I guess I deserve to be captured, tracked, logged and filed by my own government.

flicker on June 12, 2013 at 6:57 PM

Either Snowden left the military before ever realizing that he was ineligible for Special Forces or he deliberately exaggerated his ambitions in his Guardian interview

His credibility is shot. Of course we’re hacking the Chinese and the Chinese are hacking us. But the diplomatic way of handling it is to not talk about it. And the NSA has been collecting data for a long time.

rbj on June 12, 2013 at 6:57 PM

Patsy?

Ugly on June 12, 2013 at 6:58 PM

Snowden tells Chinese paper: Yes, the U.S. is hacking Chinese and Hong Kong computers

and the Chinese didn’t know that already ?
Really ?

burrata on June 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

Shame on you all!

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Says the one who has no shame.

portlandon on June 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

If the Chinese did not know it they are failing.
CW on June 12, 2013 at 6:50 PM

What a pathetic brush-off of the fact that this guy is likely leaking extremely sensitive and damaging information to the Chinese. I guess the fact that Snowden is a shameful traitor gets in the way of your “but we live in a police state and this could knock Obama down a few points!” hysteria/glee.

Since when did you all become such a bunch of anti-American, Bradley Manning-supporting Michael Moore types on national security?

You guys really do follow behind and obey whatever Rush tells you. LAME.

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 7:00 PM

That settles it. I’m ignoring any other docs he releases detailing the extent to which my government is spying on me.

EddieC on June 12, 2013 at 7:03 PM

You guys really do follow behind and obey whatever Rush tells you. LAME.

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 7:00 PM

Phuck off you little b8tch. I cannot tell you the last time I listened to Rush f*ggot.

Is what I said true or not you d8ckhead?

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:03 PM

A picture shows Edward Snowden in 2002 pulling down his pants when he worked as a webmaster and editor for a Japanese anime company run by friends in Maryland..

Seven Percent Solution on June 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

We know more about Snowden’s past than we know about Hussein’s :(

burrata on June 12, 2013 at 7:03 PM

Obama should have had a better handle on “his” NSA, huh?

After all, everything else is “his”.. “My military” “My secret service” “My administration” “My staff” “My plans.. my budget” “My appointees” “My State Department”, …

/No, Obama don’t know nothing. If Obama’s Administration and Obama’s NSA can spy on hundreds of millions of people why couldn’t they spot this guy as an open and obvious threat?

This is a coup

Rush is right.

Key West Reader on June 12, 2013 at 7:05 PM

What a pathetic brush-off of the fact that this guy Preeezy is likely leaking extremely sensitive and damaging information to the Chinese.
bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 7:00 PM

Finally we agree and I thought that bench Obama gave the Chinese was cheap as well.

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:06 PM

Breaking News: Countries Spy on each other!!!!

portlandon on June 12, 2013 at 7:06 PM

How many more are there like him? Scary.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 6:55 PM

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 7:00 PM

Eat cyanide loser.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:06 PM

Is he trying to get droned? Is he trying to start a war with China? WTH

ted c on June 12, 2013 at 6:45 PM

Reminds me of the opening scene in The Bourne Legacy (0:04-0:20). Fiction? Hmm.

conservative pilgrim on June 12, 2013 at 7:07 PM

A picture shows Edward Snowden in 2002 pulling down his pants when he worked as a webmaster and editor for a Japanese anime company run by friends in Maryland..

Seven Percent Solution on June 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

Obama Administration recruits hackers… August 2011

He’s a high school drop out hacker. And a good one at that. Obama’s so cool though….. recruiting pimply teenaged high school drop out hackers to high positions at the NSA… Pfffft. :::Choom:::

Key West Reader on June 12, 2013 at 7:08 PM

Running makes him look guilty.

Faramir on June 12, 2013 at 7:08 PM

Running makes him look guilty.

Faramir on June 12, 2013 at 7:08 PM

Cuz he is.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:09 PM

Of course we’re hacking the Chinese and the Chinese are hacking us. But the diplomatic way of handling it is to not talk about it.

You think only the diplomats know what the score is?

And the NSA has been collecting data for a long time.
rbj on June 12, 2013 at 6:57 PM

Seeing as how even when given very specific data from the Russians the intelligence community was totally clueless on the Boston Bombers, that’s not very reassuring.

Though they did get the goods on that Mohammad YouTube filmmaker guy, though….

whatcat on June 12, 2013 at 7:09 PM

Snowden tells Chinese paper: Yes, the U.S. is hacking Chinese and Hong Kong computers

I want to quibble with that characterization. The interview with the SCM Post does use the phrase “hacking computers” but it is their characterization. What Snowden has said is that they are “hacking” routers, not computers, so they are intercepting communications enroute through the “backbones”, not actually hacking computers. In fact he says they are doing allows them to not hack a single computer:

“We hack network backbones – like huge internet routers, basically – that give us access to the communications of hundreds of thousands of computers without having to hack every single one,” he said.

We already knew this from the first Guardian story and to think it wasn’t happening to the Chinese also, seems a bit of naivete. And considering that Snowden is suggesting we’ve hack 61,000 routers globally means he could do this interview and make this claim to a newspaper in every country in the world.

Now, I’m not a computer geek, but I’ll hazard to say that the PRISM program does not allow the government to hack any individual computer in order to see what is on the hard drives of those computers which is not sent through those “backbones”.

Dusty on June 12, 2013 at 7:10 PM

No one doubts that the U.S. is cyberspying on China

Ya think?

From last year:
Feds Now Want to Spy by Hacking Foreign Gaming Consoles

whatcat on June 12, 2013 at 6:53 PM

OK I’ll bite…

If all Snowden is doing is regurgitating old news from Techzines and WIKI…Why are the DC Fascists so ehemmm…upset?

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:11 PM

Traitor.

Ronnie on June 12, 2013 at 7:11 PM

Y’know, after this Snowden guy is hung high there still is that NSA REVELATION you all will have to deal with. It’s not b*tchng about Snowden is going to erase everyone’s memory.

We now know that all are emails,passwords,browsing history,credit card transactions… are accessible to more then a few government agents. All it takes is 1 agent in the paid service of BO,BWS ,Grahm or the SEIU and we no longer have a democracy. You can’t bottle that back up.

All the ostriches can hate Snowden from now until forever.

BoxHead1 on June 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

Some hero.

thebrokenrattle on June 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

Yeh turds like bluegill never answer the easy questions.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:14 PM

A picture shows Edward Snowden in 2002 pulling down his pants when he worked as a webmaster and editor for a Japanese anime company run by friends in Maryland..

Seven Percent Solution on June 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

The psychological metaphors running around in Snowden’s brain illustrated by this little prank … sure, Freud might say, “sometimes pulling your pants down is just pulling your pants down”. It might also relate to, you know, being an exhibitionist, a desire to reveal in public. I mean, it’s funny to think about.

Paul-Cincy on June 12, 2013 at 7:14 PM

Looks like Assange is going to get a roommate

HopeHeFails on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

a democracy fair democratic elections.

BoxHead1 on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Is he trying to get droned? Is he trying to start a war with China? WTH

ted c on June 12, 2013 at 6:45 PM

Are you dense? China has known for years. In fact, that’s why they started hacking us. We hacked them first.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

and the Chinese didn’t know that already ?
Really ?
burrata on June 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

I suspect they’ll go for Ed’s Captain Louis Renault Award.

whatcat on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Again, Manning leaked millions of documents including memos and diplomatic communiques without screening them, or probably even understanding them.

Snowden released a few documents that showed that the US governemnt is spying on its own citizens. So far (and that is a hopeful so far) he has not compromised anything that US enemies should not already know about.

SO now we know, too.

flicker on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Hey but at least we aren’t talking about the IRS ,the AP , or Benghazi.
/

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

Traitor.

Ronnie on June 12, 2013 at 7:11 PM

Our founding fathers were traitors.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

We hacked them first.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Link please.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

What bothers me about this guy is that he was hired as a computer systems administrator but he doesn’t talk like a computer systems administrator. I would have expected a lot more geeky tech talk but he sounds more like a newbie and it’s kind of creepy because he’s been in this sector for almost 10 years.

Dusty on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

Our founding fathers were traitors.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

Not to this country.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:17 PM

Y’know, after this Snowden guy is hung high there still is that NSA REVELATION you all will have to deal with. It’s not b*tchng about Snowden is going to erase everyone’s memory.

We now know that all are emails,passwords,browsing history,credit card transactions… are accessible to more then a few government agents. All it takes is 1 agent in the paid service of BO,BWS ,Grahm or the SEIU and we no longer have a democracy. You can’t bottle that back up.

All the ostriches can hate Snowden from now until forever.

BoxHead1 on June 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

Yep.

Shooting the messenger doesn’t change the message.

Even if Snowden is certifiable…The reaction to his revelations is certainly revealing.

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:17 PM

Our founding fathers were traitors.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

To the other side, doofus.

Ronnie on June 12, 2013 at 7:18 PM

So let’s assume that Snowden is an agent of the Chinese government.

How does that alter what the US government is doing?

sharrukin on June 12, 2013 at 7:18 PM

Are you dense? China has known for years. In fact, that’s why they started hacking us. We hacked them first.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

That’s a rather bold statement. While I’m confident we are spying on just about every nation in the world, how do you know such specifics as you claim here?

NotCoach on June 12, 2013 at 7:19 PM

Yep.

Shooting the messenger doesn’t change the message.

Even if Snowden is certifiable…The reaction to his revelations is certainly revealing.

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:17 PM

Exactly.A lot of conservatives turned out to hate the rule of law and the constitution. Who woulda thunk it?

BoxHead1 on June 12, 2013 at 7:19 PM

If all Snowden is doing is regurgitating old news from Techzines and WIKI…Why are the DC Fascists so ehemmm…upset?

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:11 PM

Because he made a big deal about it. You keep this information quiet.

rbj on June 12, 2013 at 7:20 PM

From last year:
Feds Now Want to Spy by Hacking Foreign Gaming Consoles

whatcat on June 12, 2013 at 6:53 PM

OK I’ll bite…
If all Snowden is doing is regurgitating old news from Techzines and WIKI…Why are the DC Fascists so ehemmm…upset?
workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:11 PM

I think you missed my snark – the point starts with something like “if the US is spying on Chinese Angry Bird aficionados….”

whatcat on June 12, 2013 at 7:21 PM

constitution Constitution

BoxHead1 on June 12, 2013 at 7:21 PM

C’mon, guys. What’s the problem? Every defender of PRISM says “We all KNEW they were doing this…”

The same goes for this. If we all “knew”, what difference does it make?

MadisonConservative on June 12, 2013 at 7:22 PM

Again, Manning leaked millions of documents including memos and diplomatic communiques without screening them, or probably even understanding them.

Snowden released a few documents that showed that the US governemnt is spying on its own citizens. So far (and that is a hopeful so far) he has not compromised anything that US enemies should not already know about.

SO now we know, too.

flicker on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Our founding fathers were traitors.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM
Not to this country.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:17 PM

This is “it” in a nutshell. Now what?

/

Key West Reader on June 12, 2013 at 7:23 PM

“If I know every single phone call you made I’m able to determine every single person you talk to. I can get a pattern about your life that is very, very intrusive. The real question here is what do they do with this information they collect that does not have anything to do with Al-Qaeda? And we’re going to trust the president and the vice president of the United States that they’re doing the right thing. Don’t count me in on that.“

- Joe Biden, 2006

But, we’re supposed to trust this administration. No thanks.

Resist We Much on June 12, 2013 at 7:23 PM

Ha. Charlie Rose just asked if he did this to become famous. Good question. Another guy says, no way! He was sincere. Another said, he has a “savior complex”.

Our ideas of what’s public and private are changing. You walk on the street, you’re videotaped. That’s just the way it is. Anything available on the internet — public. Phone records, credit card transactions, financial transactions … these are private but are close to the public/private borderline. At least, I’m going to begin to consider them nearly public.

Paul-Cincy on June 12, 2013 at 7:23 PM

I’m starting to feel sorry for those kids who left the Amish and Mennonite sects. They were living under the radar but now, they are just one of us…

http://www.tlc.com/tv-shows/breaking-amish

Fallon on June 12, 2013 at 7:24 PM

That’s a rather bold statement. While I’m confident we are spying on just about every nation in the world, how do you know such specifics as you claim here?

NotCoach on June 12, 2013 at 7:19 PM

Not to this country.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:17 PM

I don’t think he’s a traitor to this country, either. A traitor to this government? Maybe. But to the american people? He did us a favor.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:24 PM

Bluegill fo

Triple: link please. You deaf?(blind?)

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:25 PM

oh, forgot the link: http://au.businessinsider.com/us-nsa-unit-tao-hacking-china-for-years-2013-6

The tactics china uses when hacking us companies like google?

Guess who developed them.

Cmon, it’s a gimme.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

And if you listen…being carried on the wind…is the sound of crying Paulbots that their master once again has been proven WRONG!

I’m not suprsied by this revelation: if this kid wanted to expose the program correctly why the heck didn’t he go to the House or Senate Intel commitees and do it in a closed session under oath?

Why didn’t. He go to the WasPost? NY Times? Hell even Michael Savage or Glen Beck would have given him oodles of airtime to flush the program into the light.

But all that aside (as bad as the program is, I don’t picture 1984 just yet) what ELSE has this mutt got in his head or on a USB drive and why wouldn’t I be surpised if he doesn’t dump it into the hands of hostle nations to the US?

This kid ain’t no hero: he’s a burned spy on the run and he’s going to be willing to eff ALL of us over in the name of some extreme political BS.

The only difference between him and Manning is Snowdens GF worked the pole, instead of…well you know…

BlaxPac on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

He is going to appear in an extradition hearing at a court run by teh Chinese Government soon. He is covering his rear end. Also, this sentence makes no sense: “if the feds are capable of putting something like PRISM together, they’re capable of exploiting Chinese security vulnerabilities.” Prism was not a data collection platform. it is a data analysis platform. Analysts have “real time access” not to providers’ servers, but to data of various sorts as it arrives into the system. In other words, if you are an analyst, you wouldn’t have to wait a week for newly collected data to be posted to the analysis system, you could see it as it comes in. So far they have been pretty consistent in saying Prism held only data concerning foreigners, not US citizens.

The only thing I have seen SO FAR that NSA had on citizens is basically what amounts a copy of Verizon customers’ phone bills. I don’t care if NSA looks at my phone bill. I don’t want they listening to my calls and there is no evidence they were doing that but they can look at my phone bill.

crosspatch on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

I don’t think he’s a traitor to this country,
triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:24 PM

You didn’t address the point about our founders.

I wonder why.

-

Oh and link please.

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

Looks like Assange is going to get a roommate

HopeHeFails on June 12, 2013 at 7:15 PM

I hadn’t heard that Snowden was planning to take up refuge in the Ecuadorian Embassy in Londonistan.

Resist We Much on June 12, 2013 at 7:27 PM

Hey but at least we aren’t talking about the IRS ,the AP , or Benghazi.
/

CW on June 12, 2013 at 7:16 PM

Or PRISM or killing American citizens with drones or fake federal govt email accounts or the DOJ snooping on the reporter Rosen illegally or Holder lying under oath or Clapper lying under oath or Fast & Furious or (fill in the blank). Yeah, Snowden is the focus of our ire. Obama and his scandals? What scandals? Hey, did you see the latest picture of Snowden? What a loser!@!!11@!! /

conservative pilgrim on June 12, 2013 at 7:27 PM

Preparing for war contingencies is what the commander-in-chief and the country’s military do.

Don’t make me laugh.

VorDaj on June 12, 2013 at 7:29 PM

The level of ignorance displayed here is astounding. Of course, there’s no other way really…

Aplombed on June 12, 2013 at 7:29 PM

I just want to hear what this guy has to say. Let him talk. Let’s not lose sight of the financial interests that China has on our currency.

Key West Reader on June 12, 2013 at 7:29 PM

Guess [...]

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

Don’t assert something as true, and then come back and say, it’s obvious. It brands you with the disease of the liberals who post here … no credibility. You know when a liberal posts a link to support their point, it never supports their point.

Paul-Cincy on June 12, 2013 at 7:30 PM

Color me unsurprised.

One of the disappointing aspects of this whole controversy has been that no matter which side of the privacy/security debate one is on, this guy deserves total condemnation, and has from the beginning.

If he was seriously concerned about trespassing on Americans’ privacy, he’d have gone to the congressional intel committees, not to friggin’ Glenn Greenwald.

Thanks to this bozo we’re now going to have a public debate in which we outline exactly for the bad guys where exactly our monitoring won’t go. Brilliant.

And he says he’s been concerned about people in government not being accountable to the law — then he runs off to Hong Kong. The guy could demonstrate his sincerity about legal accountability by getting his ass back to the US.

No one should be surprised that he’s selling us out to the Chinese.

Chuckles3 on June 12, 2013 at 7:30 PM

I don’t understand why it is so hard to separate the two issues. On the one hand you have secret information released pointing out that the government is violating the 4th Amendment and spying on its citizens. On the other hand, you have a guy that is either a whistle blower or guilty of espionage. If it turns out he was a whistleblower, that is all fine and well. Of course, if it turns out that he is releasing secret data to other nations or releasing it to the media at the behest of other nations, he should be treated as a spy. It’s too early for me to say definitively what Snowden’s motivation was, but it in no way lessens the severity of what the NSA has done.

ReaganWasRight on June 12, 2013 at 7:30 PM

Snowden was, and is, just following Obama’s DHS heads call to patriotic Americans – “If you see something, say something”.

VorDaj on June 12, 2013 at 7:31 PM

And if you listen…being carried on the wind…is the sound of crying Paulbots that their master once again has been proven WRONG!
I’m not suprsied by this revelation: if this kid wanted to expose the program correctly why the heck didn’t he go to the House or Senate Intel commitees and do it in a closed session under oath?
Why didn’t. He go to the WasPost? NY Times? Hell even Michael Savage or Glen Beck would have given him oodles of airtime to flush the program into the light.
But all that aside (as bad as the program is, I don’t picture 1984 just yet) what ELSE has this mutt got in his head or on a USB drive and why wouldn’t I be surpised if he doesn’t dump it into the hands of hostle nations to the US?
This kid ain’t no hero: he’s a burned spy on the run and he’s going to be willing to eff ALL of us over in the name of some extreme political BS.
The only difference between him and Manning is Snowdens GF worked the pole, instead of…well you know…
BlaxPac on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

Wow, some sense here in the comments. Where did you come from?

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 7:31 PM

crosspatch on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

No evidence.

MontanaMmmm on June 12, 2013 at 7:32 PM

The truth of the allegations about the extent of federal agencies’ collection of information on all of us is independent of Snowden’s personal veracity or character. The PowerPoints he stole and released, together with the copy of Verizon warrant – however he obtained it, are obviously legitimate, and their interpretation is accurate enough – given the incontrovertible evidence of the reaction of the Senators and Congressmen who have been more fully briefed. Ron Wyden’s saying “I’ve been trying to tell you, but I was legally constrained from saying it myself.” Diane Feinstein and Lindsey Graham both jumped stupidly to “yeah, but so what?” Google, et al, have said “we’d really like to tell you the whole story, but we’re not allowed to,” so there’s definitely a whole and huge story, slowly being told, that most Americans aren’t going to much like.

Most likely, what’s going on, is a massive data collection program, with the data supposedly only being mined, once proper permission is given. Given the nature of government, that data, once collected, will be mined, and mined extensively, under whatever high-minded sounding name.

“We can find pedophiles!”

“We can find habitually drunk drivers!”

“We can find domestic people with a serious beef against the government!”

If we ONLY PREVENT ONE DEATH, IT’S WORTH IT!

Can’t argue with that logic. No, really, you can’t. Because it’s not a conclusion, it’s an axiom.

notropis on June 12, 2013 at 7:33 PM

Again, the timing of the revelation about PRISM vis-a-vis the cybersecurity talks with China is very likely not a coincidence.

Stoic Patriot on June 12, 2013 at 6:47 PM

Of course it’s not a conicidence.

jimver on June 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM

they can look at my phone bill.

crosspatch on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

But what if they share it with your husband?

VorDaj on June 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM

The only thing I have seen SO FAR that NSA had on citizens is basically what amounts a copy of Verizon customers’ phone bills. I don’t care if NSA looks at my phone bill. I don’t want they listening to my calls and there is no evidence they were doing that but they can look at my phone bill.
crosspatch on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

Yes, and like you I’ll be waiting to see what else comes out. But in the meantime I feel as you do.

By the way, you always seem so knowledgable about scientific and technical stuff. No matter the topic. How do you always know so much?

bluegill on June 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM

I don’t understand why it is so hard to separate the two issues.

ReaganWasRight on June 12, 2013 at 7:30 PM

I don’t understand why people keep bringing up this straw man. No one finds it hard to separate the two issues. No one has even hinted that they do.

Ronnie on June 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM

I don’t care if NSA looks at my phone bill. I don’t want they listening to my calls and there is no evidence they were doing that but they can look at my phone bill.

crosspatch on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

I’m just going to re-post this for you. I want you to re-read it.

Best regards,
KWR

Key West Reader on June 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM

If only he’d leaked his docs to the Washington Times, we might consider their content.

EddieC on June 12, 2013 at 7:35 PM

He’s watched by untold millions, maybe 100 million, with his hipster glasses and careful 3 day old growth of beard. He projects a sense of decency, honor, sincerity. I don’t buy it. He’s loving this. This is his life now, in the spotlight. That’s what’s going on.

Paul-Cincy on June 12, 2013 at 7:35 PM

I don’t think he’s a traitor to this country, either. A traitor to this government? Maybe. But to the american people? He did us a favor.

triple on June 12, 2013 at 7:24 PM

Yup.

the_nile on June 12, 2013 at 7:36 PM

Why didn’t. He go to the WasPost? NY Times?

BlaxPac on June 12, 2013 at 7:26 PM

He did. Neither agreed to publish the 41 PRISM slides, which was his demand for exclusivity. So, he went to Greenwald’s, whose column both he and I have read for a very long time. Greenwald, along with another American journalist, Spencer Ackerman, and a British journ/editor, Ewen MacAskill, got the Verizon exclusive. Last Thursday, The Washington Post agreed to break the PRISM story and publish most of the slides. The Washington Post beat The Guardian by 20 minutes in publication.

Now, if people would also start to pay attention to by-lines in broadsheets, they’d be able to put more of the pieces together. Laura Poitras, along with another writer, broke the PRISM story in The Washington Post last Friday. Poitras also interviewed Snowden in Hong Kong along with Greenwald before any of this broke. If you go look at the by-line on The Guardian story on Sunday where Snowden’s outs himself, you will find, ta-da!, the names of both Glenn Greenwald and Laura Poitras, along with Ewen MacAskill.

Resist We Much on June 12, 2013 at 7:37 PM

All the ostriches can hate Snowden from now until forever.

BoxHead1 on June 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

Shooting the messenger doesn’t change the message.

Even if Snowden is certifiable…The reaction to his revelations is certainly revealing.

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:17 PM

If all Snowden is doing is regurgitating old news from Techzines and WIKI…Why are the DC Fascists so ehemmm…upset?

workingclass artist on June 12, 2013 at 7:11 PM

Because he made a big deal about it. You keep this information quiet.

rbj on June 12, 2013 at 7:20 PM

Exactly.

I don’t see why people would come on HotAir, a conservative site, and camp out, using faulty logic and giving erroneous agruments, pointing at other tenuously-argued examples to justify or minimize the current conversation.

Smearing the truth-teller is a political tool that has been used, and recorded in history, for millenia.

It’s demonic.

The only thing I can guess is that they must be paid to do it. OFA.

flicker on June 12, 2013 at 7:37 PM

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