Terror: British soldier reportedly beheaded by two men in attack on London street; Update: Video added

posted at 2:01 pm on May 22, 2013 by Allahpundit

A random attack by lunatics? Not quite: The prime minister’s called a meeting of his emergency response team in the aftermath.

The attackers were, allegedly, heard screaming, “Allahu akbar.”

Sky sources understand that senior police officers believe the killing was likely to be a politically-motivated Islamist terrorist attack.

Dozens of weapons – including a number of knives – and pools of blood could be seen on the ground, where a man wearing a Help for Heroes T-shirt is said to have been attacked by two men.

Sky sources say that following their attack, witnesses heard the pair chanting “Allahu akbar” – and asking passers-by to take photographs of them.

This CNN report claims the man was an active-duty soldier, or at least is presumed to be given that he was leaving a barracks when he was attacked. Evidently they hit him with a car to take him down and then, per the Telegraph, beheaded him. Jihadi ritual sacrifice, performed of course with the audience in mind:

Fred Oyat, who saw the incident from the window of his flat, tells Josie Ensor that two black or Middle Eastern men were wondering around the street, walking over the dead body on the floor:

“The two men were shouting,” he says. “They had three knives including a machete and a meat cleaver as well as an old gun.

“The white man was already dead on the floor, his fade covered in blood. He had a big neck wound and his neck was almost off.”

“They seemed to be encouraging people to take photos and waited there until police arrived as if they wanted a fight.

I can’t remember any other attack like that offhand. The M.O. for these degenerates is almost always mass casualties; to target a single person and murder him theatrically is more akin to the taped beheading of Danny Pearl, but I don’t think I’ve heard of them doing that in broad daylight on the street. Typically they kidnap the person first.

Noah Rothman tweeted this pic that he grabbed from ITV. A quote per their post: “We swear by almighty Allah we will never stop fighting you.”

That’s how close bystanders got to the suspects. As far as I know, no one else was attacked even though it took cops 20 minutes to get there; the terrorists were, apparently, intent on killing a soldier. Obvious questions: Was the soldier chosen at random or did they lie in wait for someone in particular? And are there any other members of the cell?

Stand by for updates.

Update: ITV has posted the video of one of these lunatics holding forth after the attack. Click the image to watch.


ta

Update: ITV’s server is overwhelmed, apparently. If you didn’t get to see the clip, the guy says something to the effect of, “I’m sorry women had to see this but our women have to watch when our nations are attacked.” Then he walks off back towards the victim.

Update: Here’s a YouTube version. “You people will never be safe.”

Update: Good point from Rod Dreher: This guy’s accent strongly suggests he’s homegrown.


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Kill them.

Now.

BallisticBob on May 22, 2013 at 7:21 PM

Fallon on May 22, 2013 at 7:06 PM

Thanks for the link.

dogsoldier on May 22, 2013 at 7:23 PM

Kill them.

Now.

BallisticBob on May 22, 2013 at 7:21 PM

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius

iconoclast on May 22, 2013 at 7:26 PM

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 6:53 PM

Yeah, meanwhile one of his victims is living on Ramen noodles, because Zero had the military classify the terrorist attack as workplace violence, and because of that, the soldiers that survived are getting screwed. Adds some salt to the wound.

dogsoldier on May 22, 2013 at 7:27 PM

I’m not arguing with your point. But depending on where you live in America you might expect to be at least shunned around town and your kids shunned at school. So it’s behooves you to keep your mouth shut, just as it does infidels in the muslim world.

Dan_Yul on May 22, 2013 at 5:47 PM

Or maybe people just don’t like your whiny azz.

katy the mean old lady on May 22, 2013 at 7:29 PM

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 6:53 PM
I hope that’s what happens. Let him get up there and tell everyone how it was Allah’s will.

rightmind on May 22, 2013 at 6:56 PM

rightmind:Terrific,a chance for a soap-box ordeal!

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 7:32 PM

Saw CNN report while on the treadmill….

Neither Wolfie, Amanpour, nor the Brit she had tape of ever mentioned the dirty words, Muslim, Islam, religion, etc.

“It was a suspected POLITICAL statement, but very puzzling — we have no idea what this was about, although PM is calling it terror attack.” (or words to that effect – they used ‘political’ every time)

Never played the “Allah Akbar” quote, either, cuz this was a POLITICAL rant, not a religious rant, ya’ know.

When the battle begins on our soil, I hope they come for them first. Fools. Utter fools.

Wonder if MI-5 (or 6, whatever) will track down the insane Imam who was their Friday School teacher.

fred5678 on May 22, 2013 at 7:32 PM

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 6:53 PM

Yeah, meanwhile one of his victims is living on Ramen noodles, because Zero had the military classify the terrorist attack as workplace violence, and because of that, the soldiers that survived are getting screwed. Adds some salt to the wound.

dogsoldier on May 22, 2013 at 7:27 PM

dogsoldier:

Exactly,and Obama d*mn well didn’t want a TERRORIST ATTACK,
on his watch!:)

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 7:35 PM

May have already been posted and if so I apologize, but this crap isn’t limited to the UK:

mr.idaho on May 22, 2013 at 7:37 PM

Are you telling me that christians here don’t want to silence atheists?

Dan_Yul on May 22, 2013 at 5:13 PM

I don’t know any who do. Neither do they want to be silenced.

Shay on May 22, 2013 at 7:46 PM

A quote from an 1899 book by Winston Churchill, The River War, in which he describes Muslims he apparently observed during Kitchener’s campaign in the Sudan:

“How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property – either as a child, a wife, or a concubine – must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the Queen; all know how to die; but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science – the science against which it had vainly struggled – the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient” Rome.

Nothing’s changed, except Churchill would be arrested under the UK hate criems law for saying this today.

Wethal on May 22, 2013 at 6:54 PM

Ditto in the Peoples Republic of Canada.

slickwillie2001 on May 22, 2013 at 7:50 PM

Hey, I just read on a State Run Media site that this was a possible terror attack…!

d1carter on May 22, 2013 at 7:54 PM

Muzzies this century… IRA last century.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 7:56 PM

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 6:53 PM
I hope that’s what happens. Let him get up there and tell everyone how it was Allah’s will.

rightmind on May 22, 2013 at 6:56 PM

rightmind:Terrific,a chance for a soap-box ordeal!

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 7:32 PM

Not 100% sure I catch your meaning, but in general I feel that giving a soap-box to Muslim terrorists might not actually be a bad thing. Let him get up there and in one fell-swoop destroy all the PC myths surrounding his terrorism, because I think the PC myths are more dangerous to us than him getting on the stand and ranting and railing about Allah and the Jews and whatever else. Young Muslim men around the world will hear this crap anyway; I want westerners to understand what we are up against.

rightmind on May 22, 2013 at 8:19 PM

I’m curious as to what might have motivated the attack.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 5:54 PM

Sarcasms or are you that tone deaf?

CTSherman on May 22, 2013 at 5:57 PM

You have to be tone deaf to ask.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 8:28 PM

I hate, hate, HATE autorefresh!!!!

The police in Britian, AND in the US have no duty to protect individuals. This has been upheld be courts in both countries.

And our lords and masters (/sarc tag should be obvious, nu?) in the Democrat party think we should be perfectly happy to lie, unarmed in a pool of our own blood, waiting for the police to come and pick up the pieces.

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 8:29 PM

Muzzies this century… IRA last century.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 7:56 PM

Stupid. The IRA used terrorism because Catholics were discriminated against. Muslims have used terrorism since the inception of the religion, even in places, like England, where they are privileged.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 8:32 PM

Stupid. The IRA used terrorism because Catholics were discriminated against. Muslims have used terrorism since the inception of the religion, even in places, like England, where they are privileged.

The IRA used terrorism because it worked. And religion really didn’t have that much to do with it, except as an identifier between two rival gangs. IRA vs. UVF was Bloods vs. Crips rather than a real religious war. Once the economy picked up violence went down. Both sides could recruit easily because in the ’70s Northern Ireland had an official unemployment rate around 35%. (The Republic dreaded the thought of a “United Ireland” because there was no way they with their 20% unemployment could support Belfast. Equally, London would have loved to have shed the place for the same reason.

We always felt rather sympathetic to DeLorean, because he knew that if his company went under odds were that none of the men and women working for him would ever find another job.

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 8:40 PM

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 8:40 PM

You need to go to a better library.

http://campaignforcivilrights.org/issuesarticles.php?id=176

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 8:52 PM

Muzzies this century… IRA last century.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 7:56 PM

Stupid. The IRA used terrorism because Catholics were discriminated against. Muslims have used terrorism since the inception of the religion, even in places, like England, where they are privileged.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 8:32 PM

Every terrorist a lurved and wanted terrorist?

—– Jocelyn Elders Basilsbest

What other Western terrorist organizations does Basil excuse?
Sadly, the IRA was so fanatical they killed off a potential ally named Lord Louis Mountbatten who had already organized India’s independence (after efforts to defend them from the Empire of the Sun) and had worked to achieve the same independence for the Irish… not the IRA terrorists… but the Irish common (peaceful) man. There is difference if you can discern it.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 8:59 PM

Has it been confirmed? All I’ve seen is that it has “reportedly” happened; Not that I’m an expert on cutting people’s heads off, but after seeing the photo of the suspect, it surprises me that there is blood only on his hands after severing two corotid arteries

Don’t get me wrong, it’s pretty mind-numbing if this HAS happened in broad daylight in the middle of London.

About 5 years ago I read about police in the UK calling their city ‘Londonistan’ – this obviously leaves me wondering just how bad it’s become since then

Reaps on May 22, 2013 at 9:00 PM

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 8:40 PM

You need to go to a better library.

http://campaignforcivilrights.org/issuesarticles.php?id=176

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 8:52 PM

Let’s ignore the pretentious condescension.

Basilsworst is a closed mind with an obvious chip on shoulder and there won’t be any changing it.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:02 PM

Don’t get me wrong, it’s pretty mind-numbing if this HAS happened in broad daylight in the middle of London.

About 5 years ago I read about police in the UK calling their city ‘Londonistan’ – this obviously leaves me wondering just how bad it’s become since then

Reaps on May 22, 2013 at 9:00 PM

London has become a dangerous city. Particularly south of the Thames where it always has been rough in Brixton south towards Croydon. That region has often had its ethnic wars played out whether of Caribbean origin, African commonwealth origin or the Middle Eastern colonial past and immigrants therefrom. You’ve already heard of the ricin situation several years back as well as the well publicized Underground and bus bombings.

The strict gun control means the average citizen is denied basic self defense and the criminal element knows and exploits it.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:10 PM

Animals.

rdbrewer on May 22, 2013 at 9:10 PM

Stockholm riots challenge image of happy, generous state

Coming to a neighborhood near you.

BallisticBob on May 22, 2013 at 9:11 PM

An Islamic beheading on the streets of London, a few miles from the Queen’s palace. Interesting times we live in…

AlexB on May 22, 2013 at 9:11 PM

Is it true that it took the police 20 minutes to arrive on the scene?

The UK is a strict gun control country.

Remember, when seconds count, the police are only minutes away.

patch on May 22, 2013 at 9:13 PM

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 7:32 PM

Not 100% sure I catch your meaning, but in general I feel that giving a soap-box to Muslim terrorists might not actually be a bad thing. Let him get up there and in one fell-swoop destroy all the PC myths surrounding his terrorism, because I think the PC myths are more dangerous to us than him getting on the stand and ranting and railing about Allah and the Jews and whatever else. Young Muslim men around the world will hear this crap anyway; I want westerners to understand what we are up against.

rightmind on May 22, 2013 at 8:19 PM

rightmind:

Oops,sorry. I was being a tad sarcastic on that,well maybe give it a time limit,as I don’t think many people could gut it!:)

canopfor on May 22, 2013 at 9:13 PM

I should add that one of the times I was in London was when Ronaldus Magnus visited Maggie Thatcher and Queen Elizabeth on July 4th of 1982. The Falkland War had ended successfully (with US assistance, of course) and the Alliance against the Soviet Union was well under repair after the world and national defense disaster named Peanut Carter. It was a show of US / UK strength and commitment. The entire city was red, white, and blue with the UK flag and the USA flag in abundance everywhere. It was a great time to visit… with a caution

Everything and I do mean everything security-wise was on full alert with a full awareness that the IRA fanatics might target anyone and everyone. Not just the Queen or Maggie Thatcher but even our great leader (and Chappy Kennedy nemesis) Ronaldus Magnus. I still remember that moment watching Marine One touch down at Buckingham Palace and saying a silent prayer….

Keep our Allies and Ronaldus Magnus safe… from the IRA terrorists, too.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:19 PM

Sickening…

workingclass artist on May 22, 2013 at 9:20 PM

I think they wanted to bait cops, thats why they waited and tried to shoot them.
saved ammo by using the knife, think they wanted to take many cops (or whatever they are called there) down.

dmacleo on May 22, 2013 at 9:20 PM

Meet Jessica Ahlquist

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_Ahlquist

From the article:

During the lawsuit, Ahlquist received hatemail and was verbally attacked by her peers, media outlets, and online. She received death threats, and required police escorts to and from classes.

Dan_Yul on May 22, 2013 at 5:29 PM

So Jessica Ahlquist silenced Christians.

Gelsomina on May 22, 2013 at 9:21 PM

Has it been confirmed? All I’ve seen is that it has “reportedly” happened; Not that I’m an expert on cutting people’s heads off, but after seeing the photo of the suspect, it surprises me that there is blood only on his hands after severing two corotid arteries

Don’t get me wrong, it’s pretty mind-numbing if this HAS happened in broad daylight in the middle of London.

About 5 years ago I read about police in the UK calling their city ‘Londonistan’ – this obviously leaves me wondering just how bad it’s become since then

Reaps on May 22, 2013 at 9:00 PM

good chance there wasn’t much blood pressure after getting hit by a car.

dmacleo on May 22, 2013 at 9:21 PM

This is why Brits need concealed weapons permits – so people come to the rescue & blown these Islamic Extremists away!

easyt65 on May 22, 2013 at 9:25 PM

Who gives a flying you know what if they are homegrown?

tomas on May 22, 2013 at 9:29 PM

Hey, I have an idea. Let’s open our borders wider just like England has done! YES!

SouthernGent on May 22, 2013 at 9:32 PM

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 8:40 PM

You need to go to a better library.

http://campaignforcivilrights.org/issuesarticles.php?id=176

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 8:52 PM

Let’s ignore the pretentious condescension.

Basilsworst is a closed mind with an obvious chip on shoulder and there won’t be any changing it.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:02 PM

Wikipedia

Throughout the 1990s, the Northern Ireland economy grew faster than did the economy of the rest of the UK, due in part to the Celtic Tiger rapid growth of the economy of the Republic of Ireland and the so-called “peace dividend”

The fact LibraryGryffon got it exactly backwards when she claimed the better economy was responsible for the end of hostilities would be of no concern to you viking01, would it.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 9:32 PM


20 MINUTE response? And they think it’s great that their citizens are disarmed?

GarandFan on May 22, 2013 at 9:35 PM

Every terrorist a lurved and wanted terrorist?

—– Jocelyn Elders Basilsbest

What other Western terrorist organizations does Basil excuse?
Sadly, the IRA was so fanatical they killed off a potential ally named Lord Louis Mountbatten who had already organized India’s independence (after efforts to defend them from the Empire of the Sun) and had worked to achieve the same independence for the Irish… not the IRA terrorists… but the Irish common (peaceful) man. There is difference if you can discern it.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 8:59 PM

Pointing out that IRA terrorism is different than Islamic terrorism does not condone it, except in the mind of someone too stupid to appreciate distinctions. Moron.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 9:37 PM

Any word yet from mags on banning knives?
 
Surely that would stop these types of things.

rogerb on May 22, 2013 at 9:43 PM

Dan-Yul; late tot he game, so this Atheist, was then BEHEADED by her parents or neighbors, or was acid merely thrown in her face?

Since your point seems to be that CHRISTIANS are as bad as Muslims. I think you’ve strained your moral equivalence muscles pretty well tonight, might want to go and BenGay on them and get a good rub-down.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:44 PM

The fact LibraryGryffon got it exactly backwards when she claimed the better economy was responsible for the end of hostilities would be of no concern to you viking01, would it.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 9:32 PM

You obviously can’t read. I was talking about the troubles during the ’70s and into the early ’80s when the economy was lousy.

I haven’t heard too much about the IRA blowing things up the last two decades since the economy improved, have you?

But hey, I just lived over there, and had a lot of friends at college from the North, both Catholic and Protestant. I don’t know a thing.

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 9:45 PM

Surely that would stop these types of things.

rogerb on May 22, 2013 at 9:43 PM

Don’t forget cleavers AND cars-which are a two-fer…less crime and fewer carbon emissions.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:45 PM

So…uh let me get this right.

A British soldier was killed in broad daylight in ….east London?

Twenty minutes before the police arrived (guess all those cameras are really working a treat!)….twenty minutes and nobody administered mob justice to these pieces of trash…in fact, nobody laid a hand on them at all??? When one of their own finest is murdered in the street?

Gee…they all seemed pretty tough chasing the cops down the street back a couple of years ago…but they can’t get it up now, huh? Big surprise.

And this was London, right? Not Basra or Kabul? Because at first I though this happened in Afghanistan or something?

Nope. London.

Lately, I’ve gotten really depressed about the state of things. It is a world turned upside down.

Western civilization…..It. Is. So. Over.

Defence Secretary Philip Hammond arrives at COBRA meeting on Woolwich attack, he says safety of British troops is upmost priority

Uh, excuse me Mr. Secretary…one of your soldiers was murdered in broad daylights by Muslim terrorists in the middle of his own country…..it a proper world somebody other than the soldiers should be worried for their own safety right now.

Oh….never mind

Dreadnought on May 22, 2013 at 9:46 PM

Is anyone sure this really didn’t happen in Chicago?

NoPain on May 22, 2013 at 9:47 PM

I haven’t heard too much about the IRA blowing things up the last two decades since the economy improved, have you?

Well that and:
1) the Collapse of the USSR-which funneled training and money to the IRA, and
2) the subsequent collapse of the oil market in the 1990′s impoverishing Qaddafi, another source of money, arms, and training areas;
3) Plus the Good Friday Accords….

So yeah a better economy plus the collapse of the logistical infrastructure of the IRA and political “solution” to the “Tribbles” all kind of made the IRA redundant.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:47 PM

Pointing out that IRA terrorism is different than Islamic terrorism does not condone it, except in the mind of someone too stupid to appreciate distinctions. Moron.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 9:37 PM

Keep it up.

You’ve performed splendidly here as one who has lost his argument… and knows it.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:47 PM

Is anyone sure this really didn’t happen in Chicago?

NoPain on May 22, 2013 at 9:47 PM

In Chicago it would have involved either an Iphone or a basketball game.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:49 PM

I also didn’t say that the improvement in the economy was the only thing that caused the troubles to end, but it was definitely a contributing factor.

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 9:49 PM

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 9:49 PM

I’d posit you have it backwards, the improving economy flows FROM the end of the Troubles, not the other way around.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:49 PM

Oh good grief, basilsworst is actually quoting Wikipedia.

Have they updated those, er, “quotes” attributed to Rush Limbaugh yet?

(facepalm)

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:54 PM

twenty minutes and nobody administered mob justice to these pieces of trash…in fact, nobody laid a hand on them at all??? When one of their own finest is murdered in the street?

Well, it took 20 minutes for the ARMED Millicents to show up….I imagine the UNARMED Policia didn’t much fancy a go-round with the Cleaver Brothers…..

As to the civilians, I challenge you, let me kill someone in cold blood on YOUR street and stand there, blood-covered and defiant, challenging YOU to a cleaver fight…and let’s see what YOU do.

Note I said a CLEAVER fight, you don’t get to bring your firearm, you get a cleaver too…and by some reports they had a firearm (Amazing that the CRIMINALS had one, but I digress), so you get to bring your CLEAVER to the GUNFIGHT….

Given that, whattya gonna do? Really.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:55 PM

I’d posit you have it backwards, the improving economy flows FROM the end of the Troubles, not the other way around.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:49 PM

I think they both contributed to each other. A lot of young men joined the IRA because they had no hope of a job, and the IRA gave them something to do and a sense of community. As the economy improved, those young men had other options, and the IRA couldn’t convince them that the only reason they didn’t have a job was the nasty Brits.

The dying down of the Troubles during the early ’80s helped the economy, but if it hadn’t picked up as much as it did, the IRA would have continued to get recruits, and once recruited they would have had to find something to do with them.

The one thing I can say is that I got to hear Bernadette Devlin in person once in Dublin, and I discovered what it means to have your hackles raise. I truly believe that that woman was evil, and I’ll admit to wishing that the assassination attempt on her had succeeded. If it had, things probably would have died down earlier.

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 9:56 PM

20 MINUTE response? And they think it’s great that their citizens are disarmed?

GarandFan on May 22, 2013 at 9:35 PM

Liberalism leaves you to be the prey of monsters. That is how they like it.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:01 PM

Good thing they banned guns, idiots!

WisCon on May 22, 2013 at 10:01 PM

The dying down of the Troubles during the early ’80s helped the economy, but if it hadn’t picked up as much as it did, the IRA would have continued to get recruits, and once recruited they would have had to find something to do with them.

I don’t know what United Kingdom you lived in, but the Troubles did NOT “die down” in the early 1980′s….from the bombing of the Conservative Party Conference, to bombs in London, to the Inniskilling Bombings, to bombings in Germany, against the British Army, to the continued presence and drain of maintaining the British Forces in Northern Ireland the Troubles continued merrily along UNTIL the USSR went away….

At THAT point, the PIRA lost a lot of ability to wage war and Senn Fein decided to cut a deal….

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:02 PM

Given that, whattya gonna do? Really.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:55 PM

Exactly. The Brits have made themselves toothless by trying to be stylish. The Spaniards tried the same thing after the Madrid train station went boom.

Appeasement only makes the terrorist blood lust amplify.

Not many years ago the usual British “Bobby” was armed with only a blackjack and a whistle. Not much use against bomb-wielding IRA nut or sword / machete / whatever bearing Muzzies.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 10:02 PM

Note I said a CLEAVER fight, you don’t get to bring your firearm, you get a cleaver too…and by some reports they had a firearm (Amazing that the CRIMINALS had one, but I digress), so you get to bring your CLEAVER to the GUNFIGHT….

Given that, whattya gonna do? Really.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:55 PM

I read somewhere that one of the mohammedians did have a pistol and it blew up taking part of his hand with it when he attempted to fire it.

tom daschle concerned on May 22, 2013 at 10:02 PM

Oh good grief, basilsworst is actually quoting Wikipedia.

Have they updated those, er, “quotes” attributed to Rush Limbaugh yet?

(facepalm)

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 9:54 PM

Oh good grief some moron is so lacking in decency that he thinks it’s fair game to accuse me of condoning terrorism because I drew a distinction between the legitimate grievances of Catholics in Northern Ireland and the alleged grievances of Muslims.

You could benefit for reading Wikipedia moron.

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 10:02 PM

I read somewhere that one of the mohammedians did have a pistol and it blew up taking part of his hand with it when he attempted to fire it.

tom daschle concerned on May 22, 2013 at 10:02 PM

Well truly there IS a Beneficent God(Allah).

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:04 PM

When the old pistol was shot towards police it backfired and blew the thumb off one of the men.

Moments later they were cut down in a hail of bullets believed to be fired by a woman marksman. Last night both men were being treated in hospital for their wounds.

From the dailymail article. Of course early reporting is always flawed.

And like I said earlier in the thread, the pussified idiots stood around not helping, well except for this one brave lady. It is a condemnation on western civs that women are the ones with balls.

Incredible moment fearless woman Cub Scout leader confronted second knife-wielding ‘killer’ and told him ‘It is only you versus many and you are going to lose’

tom daschle concerned on May 22, 2013 at 10:05 PM

Well, it took 20 minutes for the ARMED Millicents to show up….I imagine the UNARMED Policia didn’t much fancy a go-round with the Cleaver Brothers…..

As to the civilians, I challenge you, let me kill someone in cold blood on YOUR street and stand there, blood-covered and defiant, challenging YOU to a cleaver fight…and let’s see what YOU do.

Note I said a CLEAVER fight, you don’t get to bring your firearm, you get a cleaver too…and by some reports they had a firearm (Amazing that the CRIMINALS had one, but I digress), so you get to bring your CLEAVER to the GUNFIGHT….

Given that, whattya gonna do? Really.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 9:55 PM

Two guys in the middle of busy city street with knives….and everybody stands around, filming them????

How many people were around? Hundreds??? I’m not talking about one guy charging suicidally.

There was a time where people wold have seen something like that, and been of one mind, I assure you.

No tree branches around? No golf clubs? No 2X4s? No restaurants with a supply of knives? Cricket bats, maybe?

The rioters in London I saw back two years ago seemed to be pretty creative when it came to fashioning weapons to take on police armed with large truncheons and shields?

But one of their own tropps get murdered in the middle of the day, and everybody turns into Caspar Milquetoast?

And if the police stood there doing nothing that’s even more pathetic.

OK. Whatever you say.

Dreadnought on May 22, 2013 at 10:08 PM

Basilsbest on May 22, 2013 at 10:02 PM

Thanks, but I’ll rise above saying this terrorist murderer is better than that terrorist murderer because they had certain “grievances.”

Hitler had or exploited the grievances regarding the Treaty of Versailles.

Which do you prefer to condone? Invasion of Poland or the Invasion of France? The Death Camps or what the SS did in the Ukraine? Compare and contrast the Nazi’s grievances, as necessary.

An answer to these questions plainly without your usual hysterical insults would be appreciated… but not expected!

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 10:10 PM

OK. Whatever you say.

Dreadnought on May 22, 2013 at 10:08 PM

I feel your frustration. I think we have far too much of this crap before. I bet if this happened 100 years ago the crowd would have pounced using whatever they could find.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:12 PM

Well Dreadnought crowds are funny…Flight 93 fought back because they understood it was “Us or them.”

But a crowd of strangers, without any mobilizing force is very likely to do nothing….

Let me put it to you this way..Your options are:
1) Charge the crazies (Singly, because no one else is doing anything) and DIE, leaving-I presume-a Widow and grieving Children; or
2) Do nothing.

Risk Benefit Analysis tells me, you’d do nothing….

Sure IF:
1) The crazies had cornered you and everyone on the street and said, “We’re going to KILL you Infidels” you and the crowd might fight back, though note it wasn’t EVERYONE on Flight 93 that fought…
2) Someone had the nerve to say, “Let’s roll” and begin to at least harass the attackers, THEN the crowd might have joined in.

But to assume a crowd of strangers, is going to SPONTANEOUSLY risk their own lives for another stranger without any possible back-up is expecting a lot from a crowd of humans.

In the US, it MIGHT have been different, in some cities, because someone might have produced a firearm and over matched the Yahoos. In Britain, that’s not an option……

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:15 PM

At this point it’s somewhat moot, but the IRA is/was basically an international gang, using religion as a pretense. They recruited the same way gangs in this country recruit, and most people joined for the same reasons they join gangs over here. The rank and file membership tended to be people who were looking at hopeless lives with no chance of a real job, stuck living on the dole forever. The IRA offered them an income, something to do, and someone to blame. Improving the economy so that potential members had other options cut the pool of recruits.

The leaders were in it for power; very, very few were in it solely to stick it to the English. Which is probably one of the reasons they killed Mountbatten; he would have cut their power.

LibraryGryffon on May 22, 2013 at 10:16 PM

And if the police stood there doing nothing that’s even more pathetic.

OK. Whatever you say.

Don’t know that they did, BUT:

You know as PC Doppler that the ARMED response unit is on the way…why are you going to get involved in a cleaver fight, again?

As long as the PC’s kept the crowd back, and contained the crazies they did their jobs.

I’m sorry again, why risk being cut up, IF you can accomplish your mission and leave the crazies to the Armed Team, coming?

I don’t know, never been in such a situation…personally the option of NOT getting involved in a cleaver fight makes a great deal of sense to me…it might not be HEROIC, but it sure would be PRUDENT.

Again, in the US it would have been different…the first units on the scene would have been armed, and might well have shot miscreants-and possibly 2-10 bystanders. In Britain, again, not an option.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:19 PM

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:15 PM

Ok, ok. You’re right.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:22 PM

It’s good to see someone arguing for people to not get involved and to do it with such pompousness.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:23 PM

Dreadnought on May 22, 2013 at 10:08 PM

Unfortunately Britain is an indicator of where socialism could take us as our population increasingly expects government to assume what used to be civic duty. So the unarmed, complacent Brit dials 999 to solve the problem just as our own slackers await their Obama money for gas for the car, their wacko mortgage deal, or more walking ’round money because they’re owed it.

Though East London covers a lot of territory (and I haven’t searched for the precise incident location) much of that district is seedy at best and outright dangerous 24/7. The Commercial Road reputedly tends to be hookers and open drug sales on the street. Eastward toward Stepney and beyond is rough, blue-collar which used to be tradesmen and dock workers then the docks moved further east the downward spiral continued. Canary Wharf and St. Katharine’s Dock are yuppified urban reclamation exception but further east gets further rough and dangerous even when the terrorist element isn’t looking for a hit.

viking01 on May 22, 2013 at 10:26 PM

Ok, ok. You’re right.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:22 PM

Hard to say, Sarcasm? If so, please hold up the “Sarcasm” sign…like Sheldon I have trouble telling at times.

And if you are being, it’s debatable, but I get a risible laugh from the many Internet Tuff guyz/galz who say, from the comfort of their living rooms/basements what “THEY’D” have done…

If you weren’t being sarcastic, well it’s still debatable, but humans, in a Pack are terribly dangerous, but it takes leadership or cohesion or a palpable uniting threat to turn a HERD into a Pack…

10 Marine RECRUITS (Just off the bus) are not “Marines” they are a herd….after a spell on Parris Island the 7 survivors are a “Pack.” A random crowd on a London street is not a pack, at least not this time.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:28 PM

I’m sorry again, why risk being cut up, IF you can accomplish your mission and leave the crazies to the Armed Team, coming?

According to reports, mother-of-two Ingrid Loyau-Kennett spoke to the alleged attackers after she jumped off a bus to check the victim’s pulse.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2329236/Woolwich-attack–Moment-heroic-woman-tries-remonstrate-knife-wielding-soldier-killer-police-arrived-scene.html#ixzz2U4xaFy5Q
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Some are heroes and some are….well…….

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:31 PM

t’s good to see someone arguing for people to not get involved and to do it with such pompousness.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:23 PM

Gee I’m sorry if I have a view of humans that might be rational and empirically based….I see you were being sarcastic.

Well tell you what, next time there a spot of trouble with come cleaver boyz in E. London, we’ll send YOU…I’m sure YOU’LL be able to motivate the Sheeple into amazing feats of heroism…

If you can’t grasp the difference between random strangers and a unit of people, I can’t help you…

But lets try one more time, next time you’re at DQ or McDonald’s try getting the crowd around you to do something….

I’ll await your report.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:31 PM

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius

iconoclast on May 22, 2013 at 7:26 PM

This. ^^^

dpduq on May 22, 2013 at 10:31 PM

Some are heroes and some are….well…….

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:31 PM

And so this “hero” brought the perpetrators to justice, subdued them single-handedly did she?

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:32 PM

Gee I’m sorry if I have a view of humans that might be rational and empirically based…

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:31 PM

such pompousness.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:23 PM

I am efficient.

Well tell you what, next time there a spot of trouble with come cleaver boyz in E. London, we’ll send YOU…I’m sure YOU’LL be able to motivate the Sheeple into amazing feats of heroism…

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:31 PM

And you build a nice fallacious argument.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:34 PM

And so this “hero” brought the perpetrators to justice, subdued them single-handedly did she?

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:32 PM

More straw.

She has more guts than you’ll ever have. That is clear.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:36 PM

She said the man told her he would like to stay and fight
.
According to the report others shielded the victim’s body as the killers stood over them.
MPs have praised the ‘extraordinary bravery’ shown by the women.

JFKY calls them stupid.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:38 PM

Well you are busy explaining how I’m wrong, I’m just suggesting that there’s one way to demonstrate both my wrongness and your ability to mobilize the herd into a Pack….

I note you’ve got a lot of huffing and puffing to back you up, I’ve got a lot of history, Warsaw Ghetto, Sobibor, Flight 93 to back me up….

I’m not saying that the crowd COULDN’T have taken out the Cleaver Brothers, only that it was extremely unlikely to have, and it doesn’t speak to Socialism, per se, or the “”rot” of Western Civilization, directly…it speaks to natural human instincts for self-preservation given the circumstances.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:39 PM

…it speaks to natural human instincts for self-preservation given the circumstances.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:39 PM

You’re right. You’ve convinced yourself. Don’t you see?

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:39 PM

She has more guts than you’ll ever have. That is clear.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:36 PM

And for all her “guts” who subdued the miscreants, Ms Scouting UK or the Metropolitan Police?

Please show me how she did ANYTHING of a practical nature to preserve the life of the victim or to end the stand off…I’ll wait.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:40 PM

JFKY calls them stupid.

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:38 PM

I didn’t say anyone was STUPID, I said they were “Human.” And again, for all the shielding save the guys life, and in fact, if his head was pretty much sawn thru, what was the HOPE of saving the guys life?

Huzzah for a lady who covered a dead guy with her body, but STILL DID NOTHING TO SUBDUE THE KILLERS.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:42 PM

You’re right. You’ve convinced yourself. Don’t you see?

CW on May 22, 2013 at 10:39 PM

So far I’ve got this thing called EVIDENCE and you’ve got outrage…well there you go, keep pounding the table, having neither the LAW nor the FACTS on your side.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:44 PM

I shall toddle safely off and, hopefully not die in bed….for those who like WWI poetry.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:45 PM

the religion of peace. What an effing lie. These two need to be buried with pigs.

ultracon on May 22, 2013 at 10:45 PM

JFKY, you’re a beta-male, we get it.

IcedTea on May 22, 2013 at 10:46 PM

Well Dreadnought crowds are funny…Flight 93 fought back because they understood it was “Us or them.”

But a crowd of strangers, without any mobilizing force is very likely to do nothing….

Let me put it to you this way..Your options are:
1) Charge the crazies (Singly, because no one else is doing anything) and DIE, leaving-I presume-a Widow and grieving Children; or
2) Do nothing.

Risk Benefit Analysis tells me, you’d do nothing….

Sure IF:
1) The crazies had cornered you and everyone on the street and said, “We’re going to KILL you Infidels” you and the crowd might fight back, though note it wasn’t EVERYONE on Flight 93 that fought…
2) Someone had the nerve to say, “Let’s roll” and begin to at least harass the attackers, THEN the crowd might have joined in.

But to assume a crowd of strangers, is going to SPONTANEOUSLY risk their own lives for another stranger without any possible back-up is expecting a lot from a crowd of humans.

In the US, it MIGHT have been different, in some cities, because someone might have produced a firearm and over matched the Yahoos. In Britain, that’s not an option……

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:15 PM

JFKY:

I don’t think it was fear that kept people from doing anything.

Fear I could understand.

It is a passivity, and pacificism, and paradoxically, a lack of fear-the fear of waking up the next morning and saying “**** I should have done something and now I am going to have to live the rest of my life knowing that. And other people will know it too”.

That fear used to be a factor when someone conducted there own little “risk-benefit analysis”, more than it is now.

That fear motivated me once my life, and it has motivated many many others, but it seems to be something that is disappearing in Western society, (except in the military). Particularly in the UK, a place where that fear used to be a very strong feeling, not so long ago.

Dreadnought on May 22, 2013 at 10:48 PM

IcedTea on May 22, 2013 at 10:46 PM

I know and you’re Capt. James Tiberius Kirk or Capt. Janeway….at least whilst safely in the US, behind a computer screen.

But the next time someone is screaming in the street waving a knife after having beheaded someone, please post the video of you subduing them, with nothing more than a knife or cleaver yourself….I’ll look forward to seeing it.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:51 PM

The Brits are so proud of their gun laws. One guy in the crowd with a permit could have stopped this in a heartbeat. That soldier’s family can thank liberalism.

ultracon on May 22, 2013 at 10:51 PM

Dreadnought on May 22, 2013 at 10:48 PM

And yet battlefields thru history are littered with folkz who ran….Fear is paralyzing and it takes training, leadership, or the thought that IF you don’t act, cornered like a rat, you’re going to die, to get a herd to act…..

IF, you can take a herd and train it or provide it with leadership or give it a chance to realize that it’s fight or die (like Flight 93) you can get a herd to fight and fight like crazy…but unless or until people won’t act.

And in the fact that in this case the herd is facing well-armed hyena’s and they have NOTHING, I’m not surprised the herd did nothing.

I’m not being sarcastic, in the US, it might have been different…in Dallas, say. Someone would have pulled out a pistol. And then it’s not just “you”-unarmed-against the Cleaver Boyz, it’s you and Mr. Colt. THEN, the situation becomes entirely different.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:56 PM

I know and you’re Capt. James Tiberius Kirk or Capt. Janeway….at least whilst safely in the US, behind a computer screen.

But the next time someone is screaming in the street waving a knife after having beheaded someone, please post the video of you subduing them, with nothing more than a knife or cleaver yourself….I’ll look forward to seeing it.

JFKY on May 22, 2013 at 10:51 PM

So… you’re blasting me for talking tough over the Internet while you… talk tough to me over the Internet.

Some of us men in Western Civilization are still men. And as men, we take our role as protectors seriously. There are plenty of things that could have, no, should have happened, gun or no gun. Men who still act like men train and prepare themselves to defend their own. You have obviously trained yourself to stand around with your hands in your pockets.

There are two kinds of non-aggressors: sheep and shepherds. You are a sheep.

IcedTea on May 22, 2013 at 11:00 PM

Just in case – British citizens gave up their gun rights at least 25 years ago. The greatest nation in the previous century (1750-1920) has been turned, b/c of political correctness, into a nation of passive people. The nation that gave the world the Rule of Law, that brought education to so many nations, that removed ridiculous practices (like Hindu widows having to toss themselves onto a fire after their husbands died), has lost its core.

We Americans MUST fight back – hard, yes! Intimidating, yes. Must we do it, yes.

MN J on May 22, 2013 at 11:05 PM

Damned shame no one other than Govt. reps had guns to defend themselves. Perhaps with a couple of .38′s or .45′s in the crowd…this guy would’a lived. Aahh, Europe.

a5minmajor on May 22, 2013 at 11:07 PM

And to think my prog family members wonder why I have a concealed carry permit….

Yakko77 on May 22, 2013 at 11:08 PM

If I may… for a fallen Brit.. probably active duty,..

I WENT into a public ‘ouse to get a pint o’beer,
The publican ‘e up an’ sez, “We serve no red-coats here.”
The girls be’ind the bar they laughed an’ giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an’ to myself sez I:

O it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ “Tommy, go away”;
But it’s “Thank you, Mister Atkins,” when the band begins to play,
The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
O it’s “Thank you, Mr. Atkins,” when the band begins to play.

I went into a theatre as sober as could be,
They gave a drunk civilian room, but ‘adn’t none for me;
They sent me to the gallery or round the music ‘alls,
But when it comes to fightin’, Lord! they’ll shove me in the stalls!

For it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ “Tommy, wait outside”;
But it’s “Special train for Atkins” when the trooper’s on the tide,
The troopship’s on the tide, my boys, the troopship’s on the tide,
O it’s “Special train for Atkins” when the trooper’s on the tide.

Yes, makin’ mock o’ uniforms that guard you while you sleep
Is cheaper than them uniforms, an’ they’re starvation cheap;
An’ hustlin’ drunken soldiers when they’re goin’ large a bit
Is five times better business than paradin’ in full kit.

Then it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ “Tommy how’s yer soul?”
But it’s “Thin red line of ‘eroes” when the drums begin to roll,
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it’s “Thin red line of ‘eroes” when the drums begin to roll.

We aren’t no thin red ‘eroes, nor we aren’t no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An’ if sometimes our conduck isn’t all your fancy paints:
Why, single men in barricks don’t grow into plaster saints;

While it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an “Tommy, fall be’ind,”
But it’s “Please to walk in front, sir,” when there’s trouble in the wind,
There’s trouble in the wind, my boys, there’s trouble in the wind,
O it’s “Please to walk in front, sir,” when there’s trouble in the wind.

You talk o’ better food for us, an’schools, an’ fires an’ all:
We’ll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational.
Don’t mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face
The Widow’s Uniform is not the soldier-man’s disgrace.

For it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ “Chuck him out, the brute!”
But it’s “Saviour of ‘is country,” when the guns begin to shoot;
Yes it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ anything you please;
But Tommy ain’t a bloomin’ fool–you bet that Tommy sees!

Rudyard Kipling

Maybe having enlisted just a few short years after Vietnam, when being in uniform in an airport wasn’t always pleasant, I’ve always had an affinity for Kipling’s honesty..

Rest in Peace Tommy… God be with your family.. and with you.

mark81150 on May 22, 2013 at 11:17 PM

Stockholm riots challenge image of happy, generous state

Coming to a neighborhood near you.

BallisticBob on May 22, 2013 at 9:11 PM

Another story here:
Stockholm burns as rioters battle police after three days of violence in immigrant ‘ghetto’
“.

Amazingly (not) BOTH stories manage to avoid using the words “islam” or “muslim” anywhere in the text!

Sweden is lost. So too, England. And don’t you dare try to enforce too many of our laws in Dearborn MI either!

bofh on May 22, 2013 at 11:20 PM

My token crazy conspiracy theorist Facebook friend is insisting this is a hoax because an old lady with a shopping cart walked through the background and then wasn’t there after the edit.

Followed by ten minutes of the “Sandy Hill Hoax” and the “Boston Bombing Hoax”.

playblu on May 22, 2013 at 11:26 PM

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