Weekly jobless claims fall to lowest level in 5 years

posted at 10:01 am on May 2, 2013 by Ed Morrissey

Yesterday’s ADP employment report was a bust, but two other indicators out this morning ahead of tomorrow’s April jobs report look a little more promising.  Weekly initial jobless claims dropped to their lowest level in five years at 324K, a level that has correlated to significant job growth in the past:

In the week ending April 27, the advance figure for seasonally adjusted initial claims was 324,000, a decrease of 18,000 from the previous week’s revised figure of 342,000. The 4-week moving average was 342,250, a decrease of 16,000 from the previous week’s revised average of 358,250.

The advance seasonally adjusted insured unemployment rate was 2.3 percent for the week ending April 20, unchanged from the prior week’s unrevised rate. The advance number for seasonally adjusted insured unemployment during the week ending April 20 was 3,019,000, an increase of 12,000 from the preceding week’s revised level of 3,007,000. The 4-week moving average was 3,055,500, a decrease of 18,000 from the preceding week’s revised average of 3,073,500.

Two years ago, I ran the numbers from nearly a decade of data to refute the Reuters/AP myth that the 400K level correlated to strong jobs growth.  (The job-growth stagnation of the last two years put paid to that myth as well.)  The numbers showed that the correlation to stronger job growth came at the 325K level.  However, it should be noted that the correlation comes with a consistent performance at that level, and that this took place in an era of 66% labor-force participation rates, too.  And, as always, correlation is not causation, and is not a perfect indicator in any sense.

Still, Gallup also sees reasons to cheer up.  Their measure of employment to population rose sharply in April, and their measure of unemployment dropped significantly as well:

The U.S. Payroll to Population employment rate (P2P), as measured by Gallup, was 44.5% for the month of April, up from 43.4% in March. This is the highest P2P rate so far in 2013, but is still more than a percentage point lower than the 45.7% seen last October, the highest P2P rate Gallup has measured since it began tracking employment in 2010. …

Gallup defines the “workforce” as adults who are working or are actively looking for work and available for employment. The U.S. workforce participation rate in April was 68.5%, an increase over both March 2013 (67.7%) and last April (67.5%).

Gallup’s unadjusted unemployment rate for the U.S. workforce was 7.4% for the month of April, down more than half a point since March 2013, and nearly a one-point drop from April 2012. This is the second-lowest monthly employment rate Gallup has measured since it began tracking employment in 2010. The lowest monthly unemployment rate Gallup has found is 7.0%, in October 2012.

Gallup’s seasonally adjusted U.S. unemployment rate for April was 7.8%, unchanged from March 2013, but down almost a full point compared with April 2012. Gallup calculates a seasonally adjusted employment rate by applying the adjustment factor the government used for the same month in the previous year. Last year, the government adjusted April’s rate upward by 0.4 percentage points, while March was adjusted downward by 0.2 points. This explains the lack of change in the adjusted employment rate, despite the decline in the unadjusted number.

In other good news, the trade gap fell to its lowest level in three years:

Finally, the March trade deficit fell more than expected, to $38.83 billion.

The trade deficit gap dropped as imports recorded their biggest decline since 2009, the latest sign of slowing domestic demand.

The Commerce Department said on Thursday the trade gap narrowed 11.0 percent to $38.8 billion – the second smallest since January 2010.

So perhaps this may be one month where ADP undershoots the actual job-growth figure.  What do you expect it to be?  I’ll guess that the unemployment rate and participation rate remain unchanged, and we’ll see 120,000 jobs added.  Take the poll on the jobs figure:


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None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

The numbers will be revised.

First, fit the narrative.

Second, fit the math.

Third, file it away…unless it fits the narrative.

US Bureau of Labor Statistics Prime Directive (2009- )

coldwarrior on May 2, 2013 at 10:06 AM

To bad the sequester happened, or things would be better. Reason #21 why republicans will never win the white house.

rubberneck on May 2, 2013 at 10:07 AM

Poll fixed, should update to open momentarily.

Ed Morrissey on May 2, 2013 at 10:07 AM

first three votes for the same range.

tom daschle concerned on May 2, 2013 at 10:10 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Nice try. Obama loves the poor so much he created millions more. It’s liberalism that supports union drone workers and welfare drone layabouts.

It’s conservativism that lifts all boats with prosperity. History proves it time and time again.

kirkill on May 2, 2013 at 10:10 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

It’s called compressed margins genius. As costs continue to increase and in a manner that can’t be passed on to the end user one has to make up the difference somewhere and the result is fewer new hires and squeezing increased productivity out of your current workforce. Take the government boot off of entrepreneurs necks and you’ll see an uptick in wages and hiring. Leave things the way they are this is what you get.

I’d love to double my staffs wages because that would mean that we’ve got wicked organic demand and growth for our services. I can’t because we don’t. Contrary to Dear Leaders paradigm I want to make them rich because if they are then I am. Despite all of his and your wishful thinking, risk taking and innovation creates wealth – not the Feds or some new regulation.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:10 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

I beg your pardon. I thought you were pretty ignorant when it came to the economy. That’s actually quite insightful.

hawkdriver on May 2, 2013 at 10:10 AM

Still printing a trillion dollars a year, everything is fine and dandy. Everyone is getting a raise, it’s called obamacare.

wheelgun on May 2, 2013 at 10:11 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Illegal aliens depress wages, especially for low-skill or manual labor jobs (and both parties are at fault here, for not enforcing the laws). Why hire a US citizen, when you have to pay prevailing wages, and deduct IRS withholding and FICA? Instead, you can hire illegal aliens, and pay them lower wages and not take the tax hit.

Ward Cleaver on May 2, 2013 at 10:11 AM

Labor Force Participation Rate.
Labor Force Participation Rate.
Labor Force Participation Rate.
Labor Force Participation Rate.

Change that and these numbers dance to whatever tune you like.

As for libfree… Yeah everyone was much worse off working instead of on welfare.

WitchDoctor on May 2, 2013 at 10:12 AM

Also check the number of people getting disablility. It’s the new unemployment insurance. Those two numbers need to be release together.

Oil Can on May 2, 2013 at 10:13 AM

More people giving up?

Ward Cleaver on May 2, 2013 at 10:13 AM

***

But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Can you please re-read what you wrote here, and then recast it? I have no idea WTF you tried to say. I can tell that you’re dumping on conservatives, but beyond that, all you’ve done is confirm that you can’t write your way out of a wet paper bag.

BuckeyeSam on May 2, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Sounds like we’ve reached the point of diminished returns .
Trade gap ? Could be because nobody has any trade .

Lucano on May 2, 2013 at 10:15 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Yes, it’s a MASSIVE CONSPIRACY.

This massive conspiracy is called “the law of supply”.

Now, I know that, as a liberal, you’ve never been exposed to any economics whatsoever, so I’ll go slow.

If you have 20 glasses of lemonade, you have to offer a lower price than when you have 10 glasses of lemonade to get individuals to buy more of it.

Now, what happens when you have 200 applicants for every job opening? (I know, logical progression is very hard for a liberal. I’ll not make you hurt yourself: the result is- you pay lower wages!)

makattak on May 2, 2013 at 10:17 AM

wheelgun on May 2, 2013 at 10:11 AM

Heard that Harry Reid is now saying that Obamacare can be fixed, made better, if only it were given another injection of revenue…i.e., tax the crap out of American taxpayers even more. Can’t wait to see job growth skyrocket if that happens and O-care comes 100% online.

From each according to their ability to each according to their needs…except for the leaders of the proletariat…quaint concept.

Never been tried before.

coldwarrior on May 2, 2013 at 10:18 AM

WitchDoctor on May 2, 2013 at 10:12 AM

Indeed. I wonder how much of the decline comes from people dropping off the rolls because they have reached the end of their benefits.

Difficultas_Est_Imperium on May 2, 2013 at 10:19 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

None of the above matters since communist drivel has shown time and time again to destroy economies and slaughter millions. Did mommy put 1/64 of an ounce more milk in your brothers glass than yours?

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 10:20 AM

It’s conservativism that lifts all boats with prosperity. History proves it time and time again.

kirkill on May 2, 2013 at 10:10 AM

That’s true – but the liberals always re-write history to “show” their way is better,
when we know it is not…..

redguy on May 2, 2013 at 10:21 AM

makattak on May 2, 2013 at 10:17 AM

It’s no use. He’s one of those brainiacs who believes Social Security is a right.

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 10:21 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM
Can you please re-read what you wrote here, and then recast it? I have no idea WTF you tried to say. I can tell that you’re dumping on conservatives, but beyond that, all you’ve done is confirm that you can’t write your way out of a wet paper bag.

BuckeyeSam on May 2, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Actually it was brilliant, in a libfreeordie rationalize all data to suit the talking points kind of way.

He’s trying to take a modest gain in employment numbers and padding the eventual questions as to why the other elements of the economy, wages, GDP, housing and such aren’t following suit. The economy isn’t improving and they’re looking for any culprit.

hawkdriver on May 2, 2013 at 10:21 AM

I all honesty, anyone in the trenches knows that these numbers (however bright) don’t reflect the growing sense of apathy and hopelessness that the real economy presents right now for millions of unemployed and under-employed Americans. Operating costs (both personal and professional) continue to increase, sometimes by double digits, and the governments only response is “you’ve made enough money haven’t you” or “you didn’t build that”. And yet they wonder why companies aren’t reinvesting available cash in capital investments or entering new markets.

The dirty, no so secret secret, is that the producers in this nation are many things but stupid isn’t one of them. And if you create an environment where one’s ROI doesn’t begin to offset the risk one has to take to further produce, then said producer packs up and sits tight. It really that simple. And libs wonder why we darned selfish producers aren’t more “compassionate”.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:23 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Butt hurt that you have no definable skills that might allow you to earn a decent wage? I imagine the future has always been bleak for a repulsive maggot such as yourself.

Polish Rifle on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

I beg your pardon. I thought you were pretty ignorant when it came to the economy. That’s actually quite insightful.

hawkdriver on May 2, 2013 at 10:10 AM

I’m not an economist, I tend to trust those men and women a bit more. But I am aware of the tactics employers have used to eliminate middle class wages while expanding executive pay and increasing lower income jobs. I am also aware that taxation and regulatory policy, despite conservative myths, have very little to do with those trends. I thought it was verboten to talk about income inequality and class amongst conservatives. Who knew hawkdriver.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

Labor Force Participation Rate.
Labor Force Participation Rate.
Labor Force Participation Rate.
Labor Force Participation Rate.

Change that and these numbers dance to whatever tune you like.

WitchDoctor on May 2, 2013 at 10:12 AM

This is why we’re boned long-term. The top line UE is gamed six ways to Sunday but the % of employed Americans (and hence taxpayers) are the one’s that fund the govt. And that number is historically low.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:27 AM

The government numbers get set at mid-month (the week including the 12th, to be exact), so I’ll go low – 75K jobs added, shrinkage of both LPR and U-3 rate by 0.1 percentage points.

Steve Eggleston on May 2, 2013 at 10:27 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.
libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Did you find that little diatribe in Chairman Mao’s memoirs?

How about this instead: conservatism espouses personal responsibility and market driven wage levels, and a robust economy where personal merit drives and leads to greater prosperity should you choose to work for it.

can_con on May 2, 2013 at 10:27 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

So jealous that libfree has created a world, for itself, of rainbows everyday and cotton candy unicorn farts.

{sigh} ain’t public education great?

socalcon on May 2, 2013 at 10:28 AM

We are approaching levels of income inequality in private sector employment that rivals the Progressive Era, for those unfamiliar those are the years which spawned the American labor movement. The depression of wages will only increase if the corporatists in the GOP and Democratic parties get their immigration reform bill passed. Either workers are going to organize or our descent into a banana republic will continue unabated. Are we willing to reach across the color line this time and organize all workers, and not be divided by “southern strategy” and “welfare queen” crap? We shall see, it is up to young people. The Boomers already dismantled the middle class from Reagan to Obama. Time to see what young folks can do.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:29 AM

Can you please re-read what you wrote here, and then recast it? I have no idea WTF you tried to say. I can tell that you’re dumping on conservatives, but beyond that, all you’ve done is confirm that you can’t write your way out of a wet paper bag.

BuckeyeSam on May 2, 2013 at 10:14 AM

libfree doesn’t write. He/she/it cuts and pastes from OFA or whomever is paying for trolling services. He/she/it couldn’t tell you the first thing about what was posted either.

Happy Nomad on May 2, 2013 at 10:30 AM

I am also aware that taxation and regulatory policy, despite conservative myths, have very little to do with those trends.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

Oh? Proof? And don’t forget how often you slap yourself upside your own head after being embarrassed by your own declarations. Before giving yourself another bruise you should withdraw this deceleration.

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 10:30 AM

How about this instead: conservatism espouses personal responsibility

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

and market driven wage levels,

Why is why conservatives howled in defense of massive bonuses paid to employees of banks who had been bailed out by taxpayers.

and a robust economy where personal merit drives and leads to greater prosperity should you choose to work for it.

You’re a fool. The “market” is just people. Much like “the government.” So when people who are at the top of the market decide how much money they want to make, they merely have to deem themselves meritorious of it. In order to rationalize their pay they deem those below them less meritorious. You think the market is some objective even playing field? You’re a moron.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:29 AM

Yes, and we remained in a depression because of this communist crap until WWII started and FDR abandoned the New Deal. Remind us again how you got your degree from some top notch “history” department, won’t you?

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Labor Force Participation Rate.

I don’t think it’s importance can possibly be overstated. The rest of the rates are based off that number, which hasn’t held steady. Any decrease in the UE rate is a function of math, not improving underlying conditions.

byepartisan on May 2, 2013 at 10:33 AM

These job reports seem to be a game of ping-pong – one week jobless claims are down, next week only 88,000 jobs are created. There must be politics behind these “good” numbers, particularly when you hear officials changing the way inflation or GDP is measured. Things aren’t getting better, so they lie to us and hope we’re duped into believing.

rickv404 on May 2, 2013 at 10:33 AM

libfreeordie = commie

BeachBum on May 2, 2013 at 10:35 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

What fraud?

Why is why conservatives howled in defense of massive bonuses paid to employees of banks who had been bailed out by taxpayers.

Taxpayer dollars going to pay private sector employees through corporate welfare.

You’re a fool. The “market” is just people. Much like “the government.” So when people who are at the top of the market decide how much money they want to make, they merely have to deem themselves meritorious of it. In order to rationalize their pay they deem those below them less meritorious. You think the market is some objective even playing field? You’re a moron.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Wow. That is just…wow.

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 10:35 AM

. I thought it was verboten to talk about income inequality and class amongst conservatives. Who knew hawkdriver.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

BuckeyeSam on May 2, 2013 at 10:14 AM
Actually it was brilliant, in a libfreeordie rationalize all data to suit the talking points kind of way.

He’s trying to take a modest gain in employment numbers and padding the eventual questions as to why the other elements of the economy, wages, GDP, housing and such aren’t following suit. The economy isn’t improving and they’re looking for any culprit.

hawkdriver on May 2, 2013 at 10:21 AM

Brilliant, but with a different motive besides the truth. I just admire your rocket scientist level ability to rationalize.

I am truly impressed.

hawkdriver on May 2, 2013 at 10:35 AM

libfreeordie = commie

BeachBum on May 2, 2013 at 10:35 AM

Ya think?

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 10:36 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

Trusting economists?
Like you trust Hayek, Williams, von Mises, Friedman, right?

Good luck with that!

22044 on May 2, 2013 at 10:36 AM

We are approaching levels of income inequality in private sector employment that rivals the Progressive Era, for those unfamiliar those are the years which spawned the American labor movement. The depression of wages will only increase if the corporatists in the GOP and Democratic parties get their immigration reform bill passed. Either workers are going to organize or our descent into a banana republic will continue unabated. Are we willing to reach across the color line this time and organize all workers, and not be divided by “southern strategy” and “welfare queen” crap? We shall see, it is up to young people. The Boomers already dismantled the middle class from Reagan to Obama. Time to see what young folks can do.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:29 AM

You are so full of crap. Since you trust economists read some Thomas Sowell. He’s debunked this “income equality” mantra numerous times. There is actually a great deal of class/income mobility in America. Add to that the fact that while wages have remained fairly static over the last several decades the purchasing power of a static wage has increased dramatically over time. The middle class now has basically all the same things that a 1%er has.

And for those who do have difficulty getting out of poverty it’s by and large not rapacious corporations (who actually offer opportunities out of poverty) but cultural and familial issues – like one parent homes and poor education (poor education being highly correlated to poor family life).

gwelf on May 2, 2013 at 10:37 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:29 AM

Why would you deny your global comrades a little prosperity in favour of protectionism and “unmerited” wage levels in the U.S. ?

can_con on May 2, 2013 at 10:38 AM

The depression of wages will only increase if the corporatists in the GOP and Democratic parties get their immigration reform bill passed. Either workers are going to organize or our descent into a banana republic will continue unabated. Are we willing to reach across the color line this time and organize all workers, and not be divided by “southern strategy” and “welfare queen” crap? We shall see, it is up to young people. The Boomers already dismantled the middle class from Reagan to Obama. Time to see what young folks can do.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:29 AM

Right … let’s exacerbate the cycle of poverty already created by the left. Let’s make everything cost more, making people even more dependent on government. Then you can argue for even higher wages and more government until the entire thing collapses.

You support the direct causes of every problem we face today and your answer is communism.

darwin on May 2, 2013 at 10:39 AM

I am also aware that taxation and regulatory policy, despite conservative myths, have very little to do with those trends.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

Seriously? Increased costs of doing business actually increases cash flow? Again, are you serious? True story, the group health insurance policy for my employees has increased, since 2010, almost 300%. Yes, you read that right, 300%. And the carrier says that an additional 40-60% is expected for next year. Now, this is same policy despite the price increases. Let’s just say that I pass this on to my customers. I provide the same service despite the increase in price. So, it’s really just an implicit tax on the end user, who assuming she has no increase in wages, now has less disposable income and hence less consumption. That’s a decrease in economic output Skippy.

Anyone who says that increased regulation and taxation doesn’t depress economic output is either an idiot, a marxist or both.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:39 AM

gwelf on May 2, 2013 at 10:37 AM

Good reference to Sowell.
His name did not come up immediately in my mind, but if there was an Economists’ Hall of Fame, he’s there as well.

22044 on May 2, 2013 at 10:39 AM

Anyone who says that increased regulation and taxation doesn’t depress economic output is either an idiot, a marxist or both.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:39 AM

Don’t you have to be one to be the other?

darwin on May 2, 2013 at 10:40 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Uprising’s been tried already.
Remember OWS?

22044 on May 2, 2013 at 10:41 AM

Claims number went down because a massive amount of people who were on the tailend of their unemployment are getting bounced about two months earlier than expected due to one of the budget agreements Obama and Boehner made. 99 weeks is now 74.

It also adjusted the P2P number in the process.

I’m still expecting an economic crater this summer because we have no logical policy from either party. It’s haphazard.

budfox on May 2, 2013 at 10:42 AM

Believing economic talking points from libby

is like Tiger Woods taking a golf lesson from Barack Obama.

22044 on May 2, 2013 at 10:43 AM

Indeed. I wonder how much of the decline comes from people dropping off the unemployment rolls because they have reached the end of their benefits.

Difficultas_Est_Imperium on May 2, 2013 at 10:19 AM

I would like to see the next number for disability payments. From one roll to another.

herm2416 on May 2, 2013 at 10:43 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

No, we understand why the people running Fannie/Freddie didn’t get prosecuted but instead got raises and praise from their Democrat protectors in Congress. And we understand why no politicians were prosecuted who created the regulatory forces (started with Clinton) pushing lending institutions to give money to people who couldn’t pay it back to avoid being accused of racism (something you should be familiar with).

gwelf on May 2, 2013 at 10:44 AM

Libby is the same fool who wanted 10 months of mandatory paid maternity leave for all new mothers.

With apologies to RWM, fund your utopia…without us.

22044 on May 2, 2013 at 10:45 AM

Yeah. Y’all need to learn more about your boy Hayek. He was kind of….insane:

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2013/01/philip-pilkington-the-origins-of-neoliberalism-part-i-hayeks-delusion.html

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2013/01/philip-pilkington-the-origins-of-neoliberalism-part-ii-the-americanisation-of-hayeks-delusion.html

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:42 AM

Watch out everyone, libfreeordie is now linking comments from some obscure writer to discredit a world-renowned economist.

What’s next, a huffingtonpost article on Milton Friedman?

gwelf on May 2, 2013 at 10:48 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Why is why indeed. Why doesn’t your administration do something about it?

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:42 AM

I get a dog-whistle vibe of racism when you use “Y’all”.

hawkdriver on May 2, 2013 at 10:49 AM

You’re a fool. The “market” is just people. Much like “the government.” So when people who are at the top of the market decide how much money they want to make, they merely have to deem themselves meritorious of it. In order to rationalize their pay they deem those below them less meritorious. You think the market is some objective even playing field? You’re a moron.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

This is just more of your usual insipid nonsense.

Do you think that employers don’t compete for labor? They do. The current problem is that the liberal policies you push have caused a huge amount of unemployment, thus a glut of available labor.

When there’s more labor available, the cost of labor goes down. It has nothing to do with your class warfare bs, and everything to do with the basics of business.

It’s really simple. You want more regulations? You want higher taxes? Then businesses are going to pay people less. Live with it.

PetecminMd on May 2, 2013 at 10:51 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Don’t assume that most of us don’t want those responsible to be currently involved in a man-ship with their cell mate. The problem is that the Feds are just as culpable as the primary actors. That’s why they’re not prosecuted. That and the fact that the Corzine’s of the world has stupid deep pockets.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:52 AM

The U.S. Payroll to Population employment rate (P2P), as measured by Gallup, was 44.5% for the month of April, up from 43.4% in March.

I absolutely don’t understand this statistic. How can this jump over 1% in one month. The US population is what, 310 million? Where did 3 million jobs come from? Even if you only count population that is employment aged, this is still an enormous number of employed that have magically appeared.

trigon on May 2, 2013 at 10:54 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages due to Obamacare. But since conservatism liberals only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits Obama looking good I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Just keeping you honest.

DethMetalCookieMonst on May 2, 2013 at 10:56 AM

If we can just get more people to give up on working and looking for work….

PatriotRider on May 2, 2013 at 10:59 AM

What’s next, a huffingtonpost article on Milton Friedman?

gwelf on May 2, 2013 at 10:48 AM

That would be 20 steps up from the harebrained garbage brainfree digs up.

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 11:00 AM

Don’t assume that most of us don’t want those responsible to be currently involved in a man-ship with their cell mate. The problem is that the Feds are just as culpable as the primary actors. That’s why they’re not prosecuted. That and the fact that the Corzine’s of the world has stupid deep pockets.

volnation on May 2, 2013 at 10:52 AM

The housing bubble was government created, so I am curious what fraud was committed on Wall Street. Considering the canned drivel brainfre spews he won’t be able to answer this.

NotCoach on May 2, 2013 at 11:02 AM

I dunno. People I know looking for work say they’ve seen little improvement in years, courtesy of the Obama economy. I know I’d hate to be graduating during this so called “recovery”…

changer1701 on May 2, 2013 at 11:02 AM

If we can just get more people to give up on working and looking for work….

PatriotRider on May 2, 2013 at 10:59 AM

That’s brilliant … if there are fewer people in the work force then business will have to compete for those workers and pay higher wages! Then because they are paid more they can be taxed more!!!!!!!!!!

libcommieordie’s dream come true!

We’ll worry about the unemployed later …

darwin on May 2, 2013 at 11:04 AM

It’s all those newly minted Part Time workers. Since they had to put everyone on part time to avoid Obamacare penalties, they had to hire extra parttimers to make up the difference.

JimK on May 2, 2013 at 11:06 AM

ObamaCare Is Blocking Job Creation, Economic Growth
http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials-viewpoint/050113-654297-obamacare-threatens-jobs-income-and-health-care.htm

In Jobs Report, Look for the Obamacare Effect

Washington needs to break the cycle of weak job growth month after month. To do that, we need to honestly deal with one of the main roadblocks to job creation: President Obama’s health care law.

Colbyjack on May 2, 2013 at 11:13 AM

The numbers are only “better” because people have given up or work part time at one or more jobs.

PattyJ on May 2, 2013 at 11:14 AM

Looks like sequestration is working. More please.

BKeyser on May 2, 2013 at 11:15 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

As long as you suppress the rich from getting richer by restricting the free market, the poor will stay poorer. Terrible conundrum, huh.

TexAz on May 2, 2013 at 11:18 AM

rubberneck on May 2, 2013 at 10:07 AM

Sequestration was Obama’s Idea:

Jay Carney Admits Sequester was the President’s idea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAd1trp0rgk&feature=player_detailpage

WH Adviser Gene Sperling: We Did Put Forward The Framework Of Sequester
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTkn3bY6qmQ&feature=player_detailpage

Sen. Max Baucus (D-MT): Sequestration Was Obama’s Idea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAd1trp0rgk&feature=player_detailpage

Colbyjack on May 2, 2013 at 11:18 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Depress wages? Yeah, ask those employees who have gone from 40 hr work weeks to 25 hours due to Obamacare….

hillsoftx on May 2, 2013 at 11:21 AM

Why is an decreasing trade gap good news if it reflects decreasing domestic demand?
If it reflected increased exports then that would be good news but it doesn’t

breffnian on May 2, 2013 at 11:25 AM

When talking of “static wages,” don’t forget that from 1945 to about 1968 or so, there was a bubble of industrial wages propped up by the fact that the United States was the only major industrial nation to come out of World War II with an intact industrial base.

If a Belgian wanted a car in those years, his main options were all American cars. If a Londoner wanted an electric stove, her options were largely all American. American labor was in such high demand that their compensation in proportion to their productivity was unusually high. After about 1968 or so, European and Asian domestic industry started taking over, and we no longer needed screw-turners in widget factories enough to pay them $60K/year.

Sekhmet on May 2, 2013 at 11:34 AM

When will the Obama party end? When the bond market decides it doesn’t want to fund our debt any more. Then long term bond rates spike and our debt service becomes 600-700 billion a year. All rates have to do really is return to their historical average of 5-6%. Right now they are 2.5%. In 1995 they were 8%. At those rates, debt service would be over a trillion a year.
Then the crash happens and the welfare state ends. Then a country obsessed with welfare, gun control and the “war on women” finds something real to worry about.

breffnian on May 2, 2013 at 11:34 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Illegal aliens depress wages, especially for low-skill or manual labor jobs (and both parties are at fault here, for not enforcing the laws). Why hire a US citizen, when you have to pay prevailing wages, and deduct IRS withholding and FICA? Instead, you can hire illegal aliens, and pay them lower wages and not take the tax hit.

Ward Cleaver on May 2, 2013 at 10:11 AM

Yep, and the reason that the hallowed “gap between rich and poor” continues to grow is cheap illegal alien labor. So let’s legalize thirty million of them!

slickwillie2001 on May 2, 2013 at 11:35 AM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages. But since conservatism only cares about profit lines and drone workers with no chance for wage growth increase profits I guess we can call this good news.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

what is a “profit line”?? is that like a “profits and earnings ratio”??

chasdal on May 2, 2013 at 11:35 AM

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2013/01/philip-pilkington-the-origins-of-neoliberalism-part-ii-the-americanisation-of-hayeks-delusion.html

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:42 AM

So wait, a whole lot of insinuations about somebody’s mental state or adjustment to reality convinces you that he was unstable?

I guess I consider you whacko because I read a lot of people questioning your sanity.

A quote:

The political right found themselves completely flummoxed by such a situation. More practical men, like President Ike Eisenhower, jumped on board, while fringe elements, like Joe McCarthy, fled into paranoia, attacking many prominent liberals as Communist agents.

This is crap. McCarthy was a labor-friendly, moderate Republican. So as well as giving several un-motivated assessments of Hayek’s sanity, he gives no motivation that liberals were attacked as Communists simply as a result of McCarthy’s reaction to New Deal-ish concepts or a lack of a purely unplanned economy.

As if the much more invasive Democrat-chaired House UnAmerican Activities Committee was driven by Democrat rejection of New Deal measures!

Axeman on May 2, 2013 at 11:36 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

tell us why you think 0bama and Holder havent prosecuted anyone of the fannie/freddie housing bubble??

chasdal on May 2, 2013 at 11:37 AM

The real unemployment rate -23%

slickwillie2001 on May 2, 2013 at 11:37 AM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:42 AM

Re mental health, have you found yourself a good rape-victim counselor yet?

Remember, -it’s not your fault.

slickwillie2001 on May 2, 2013 at 11:39 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

tell us why you think 0bama and Holder havent prosecuted anyone of the fannie/freddie housing bubble??

chasdal on May 2, 2013 at 11:37 AM

In fact the REB wants to make his honeypot/criminal Penny Pritzker the new Commerce Secretary!

Obama Nominates Chicago Exec Penny Pritzker as Commerce Secretary

Make out like a gangster during CRA-mortgage meltdown, buy the REB an estate in Hawaii, –> get government cabinet job!

slickwillie2001 on May 2, 2013 at 11:43 AM

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

I’ve asked those questions multiple times. And every single conservative I know has also asked those questions. Maybe you should actually meet some conservatives in real life…oh wait, you do know the bigots you hang out with in your critical race theory department soirees don’t really know any conservatives either or know what questions we ask.

Here’s the thing Homeboy…we already know the answer. Obama can’t have his biggest donors and members of his cabinet in prison.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/05/06/why-can-t-obama-bring-wall-street-to-justice.html

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2011/11/obama-prosecuting-fewer-financial-crimes-than-under-either-bush-presidency.html

HumpBot Salvation on May 2, 2013 at 11:51 AM

HumpBot Salvation on May 2, 2013 at 11:51 AM

Don’t forget the slimeball Jon Corzine. Free as a bird.

slickwillie2001 on May 2, 2013 at 11:56 AM

More Pilkington:

The starting point of neoliberalism is the admission, contrary to classical liberalism, that its political program will triumph only if it acknowledges that the conditions for its success must be constructed, and will not come about “naturally” in the absence of concerted effort.
Read more at http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2013/01/philip-pilkington-the-origins-of-neoliberalism-part-ii-the-americanisation-of-hayeks-delusion.html#pjSVsKJOEdjCjLX0.99

This, as well, is odd. If “neoliberalism” is the opposition to planned economies and the main goal of which is to keep the lassaiz faire, Adam Smith doctrines in place of an economy naturally correcting itself. Then it actually does believe that this situation comes about naturally.

Unless the opposition is going to claim that “planned economies” come about naturally. So if somebody is pushing in one direction, perhaps the only answer is to push back.

Incidentally, Pilkington doesn’t consider that it’s relevant that somebody “hears Marx” in what modern liberals say, because he personally doesn’t believe that governments should take over the means of production. However, he considers it significant that he “hears” Hayek in the Tea Party (so it is nothing more than Hayek’s propaganda), when accusing those on the right for being unhinged hearing the resemblance to Marx in somebody’s opinion and compressing that to “socialism”.

Typical I-can-some-up-and-diagnose-all-of-you-but-you-have-to-listen-to-each-word-I-say liberalism, to me–which is integral to the fabric of the liberal nullification bubble.

I have no great devotion to Hayek, and have long disbelieved classical economics–even finding Keynes’s “in the long run, we are all dead” valid; but Pilkington doesn’t impress me as being worthwhile. In one sentence acknowledging Friedman for his Monitarism, a government response to the case of market imbalance, and then pigeonholing him as some Hayek initiate. Somehow not scared off by a less-than-classical approach, despite being the sine qua non of Hayek’s “affliction”.

Axeman on May 2, 2013 at 12:12 PM

So we’re still stuck on these totally irrelevant meaningless cooked skewered burnt-to-a-crisp bs numbers?

stukinIL4now on May 2, 2013 at 12:26 PM

None of this matters while employers continue to depress wages.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Obama, don’t you have a golf game?

There Goes the Neighborhood on May 2, 2013 at 12:44 PM

We are approaching levels of income inequality in private sector employment that rivals the Progressive Era, for those unfamiliar those are the years which spawned the American labor movement. The depression of wages will only increase if the corporatists in the GOP and Democratic parties get their immigration reform bill passed. Either workers are going to organize or our descent into a banana republic will continue unabated. Are we willing to reach across the color line this time and organize all workers, and not be divided by “southern strategy” and “welfare queen” crap? We shall see, it is up to young people. The Boomers already dismantled the middle class from Reagan to Obama. Time to see what young folks can do.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:29 AM

You idiots voted Obama in, remember? Now we have:

* the worst recovery since the Depression
* the worst poverty in 50 years
* the fastest corporate profits growth ever
* the largest income disparity in 60 years
* negative wage growth through the recovery
* record deficits and debt as a % of GDP
* ObamaCare jacking up premiums, depressing wages and making insurance companies rich
* the smallest relative labor force in 25 years

Mark whatever side you people are on now so I can steer clear of it.

Chuck Schick on May 2, 2013 at 12:47 PM

Nice try, Hawk.

I am also aware that taxation and regulatory policy, despite conservative myths, have very little to do with those trends….. libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:26 AM

One brief, shining moment, and then, that MOUTH.

Tenwheeler on May 2, 2013 at 12:47 PM

Sorry:

* the smallest relative labor force in 35 years

Chuck Schick on May 2, 2013 at 12:48 PM

So, has anyone informed Bernanke about this improved economy?

DDay on May 2, 2013 at 12:48 PM

How about this instead: conservatism espouses personal responsibility

Why is why conservatives consistently wonder why no one on Wall Street has been prosecuted for the massive fraud involved in the housing bubble crash. Oh wait…conservatives never ask those questions.

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Oh, we’ve asked. But we can’t get an answer as to why Dodd and Frank weren’t impeached, prosecuted, tarred, and feathered for destroying the very industry they were supposed to regulate.

And it was the Congressional Black Caucus that came out as one and denounced any attempt to reform FNMA/FRMC as a racist attack on minority housing.

As for Wall Street, they were pretty much irrelevant. When the government totally distorts an industry by forcing FNMA/FRMC to buy loans from banks that were ridiculously overvalued and unsecured, it’s hardly surprising that some people will try to get rich by getting some of that money while it’s available.

There Goes the Neighborhood on May 2, 2013 at 12:53 PM

Hello………NEW WORKERS ALERT!!!

http://washingtonexaminer.com/byron-york-could-there-be-another-wave-of-illegal-immigration/article/2528465

The Pew Research Center’s Global Attitudes Project released a survey Monday to help set the stage for President Obama’s visit to Mexico later this week. In 1,000 in-person interviews conducted across Mexico last month, Pew researchers asked, in Spanish, “If at this moment, you had the means and opportunity to go to live in the United States, would you go?” Thirty-five percent of those surveyed said yes.

The population of Mexico is about 110 million. If the Pew numbers are correct, that means about 38 million would like to live in the U.S.

Going into a little more detail, Pew found 20 percent of all Mexicans would be “inclined to go work and live in the U.S. without authorization.” That’s about 22 million people who might come to the U.S. illegally, if they had the chance.

PappyD61 on May 2, 2013 at 1:21 PM

The population of Mexico is about 110 million. If the Pew numbers are correct, that means about 38 million would like to live in the U.S.

Going into a little more detail, Pew found 20 percent of all Mexicans would be “inclined to go work and live in the U.S. without authorization.” That’s about 22 million people who might come to the U.S. illegally, if they had the chance.

…..and how many of these tens of millions would be DEMOCRAT VOTERS looking for the teat on the Federal sow?

But by all means, we must believe and obey MARCO RUBIO on this issue.

PappyD61 on May 2, 2013 at 1:23 PM

libfreeordie on May 2, 2013 at 10:32 AM

I missed your excellent rebuttle, adding in called me a fool and a moron for full effect.

You’re a fool. The “market” is just people. Much like “the government.” So when people who are at the top of the market decide how much money they want to make, they merely have to deem themselves meritorious of it. In order to rationalize their pay they deem those below them less meritorious. You think the market is some objective even playing field? You’re a moron.

Global markets determine product costs and prices, which includes labour. I have little sympathy for anyone demanding a “living wage” to make socks or some other product in the US when you compare global wages and poverty levels. What you deem a living wage is in the top 5% of global income levels.

Step outside your bubble and realize that global GDP growth especially in 3rd world countries is on the rise and that is something to be celebrated. Sorry it hurts some in the US, primarily labour unions, but thats the world we live in. Get used to it and quit your whining.

can_con on May 2, 2013 at 1:31 PM

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