Boston mayor: This bombing’s making me reconsider my position on the death penalty

posted at 6:41 pm on April 23, 2013 by Allahpundit

Theory: The Gosnell trial is to the pro-choice cause what the Boston bombings are to the anti-capital-punishment cause. That can be tested, of course, with a poll. Let’s see what public support for the death penalty in deep-blue Massachusetts looks like this week compared to how it’s looked in the past. Any pollsters out there want to check? Don’t worry about your data being skewed by the public’s swell of emotion after a terrible slaughter. It’s totally legit to recraft policy when tempers are running hot. Ask Obama about that vis-a-vis gun control.

If you think Menino’s talking tough because he suspects, almost certainly correctly, that most of the city’s voters want to see Tsarnaev get the needle, guess again. He announced a few weeks ago that he’s retiring after this term. He’s got nothing to gain politically by saying it. What you’re seeing here, I think, is simply a guy grappling with justice for a killer whose guilt doesn’t seem to be in question. If the affidavit’s correct, it’s plain from the video footage that Tsarnaev was one of the bagmen. He put the bomb down six feet or so behind an eight-year-old kid and his even younger sister. He partied two days later, then ended up tossing bombs at the cops who chased him him. The leading theory of why they killed the officer at MIT is because they wanted an extra gun so that they could kill more people. If you believe the Boston Globe and other media, Tsarnaev’s reportedly confessed to virtually all of this in the hospital. Odds are good that he won’t even contest the charges at trial but will focus on penalty mitigation. The one irresistible argument against capital punishment is the risk that it’ll be imposed on an innocent man, but if the man’s not innocent, even by his own admission, with a pile of physical evidence against him, what’s the argument then? That it costs the state a little more to handle death-penalty appeals? Menino can’t find a reason. Neither can I.

There are some people, Menino maybe now among them, who oppose capital punishment on principle except in cases of terrorism. I’ve never fully understood that. If death is wrong because it’s a power that shouldn’t be trusted to the state, why make a special exception for the state vis-a-vis … its political enemies? If the answer to that is that some offenders warrant special condemnation, how is that an argument to spare other offenders who deserve death too but acted from nonpolitical motives? It’s a matter of justice, not expression. Tsarnaev deserves it, but so do the Bundys and Dahmers who kill and kill and kill and kill to gratify themselves. The question, I think, begins with whether there’s any doubt that the accused is guilty (a higher bar than exists now) and, if not, ends with whether the jury feels sufficient pity for the defendant, for whatever reason, to spare him. Poll Boston on this one, see what you get.


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Politically not-so-courageous. It’s like saying how much you hate Nazis.

DTTS on April 23, 2013 at 6:47 PM

‘mumbles’ was also against ‘homophobia’( ie selling chicken sammies while opposed to same sex marriage) after he was for it( when building ‘menino’s mosque’ chock full of hating on the gays and jews- to the point of advocating murdering them.)

like barry, our mumbles is a ‘nuanced’ thinker…

mittens on April 23, 2013 at 6:48 PM

My favorite dumb antiDP argument is that they should be made to sit in prison and think about their crimes. lol!

Oh, I’m sure they do think about their crimes, but they are “pleasuring” themselves while they do it.

Blake on April 23, 2013 at 6:48 PM

Curious, that atrocities like this, especially hitting so close, sometimes changes perspectives, even if momentary.

hawkeye54 on April 23, 2013 at 6:50 PM

does not elevate his stature in my perception.

tom daschle concerned on April 23, 2013 at 6:52 PM

What difference does it make if he’s reconsidering if he’s up for reelection or not? If he’s got another election to think about and keeps the same position, it’s political. If he changes his mind because he’s got no more elections to worry about, then he still hasn’t done anything particularly courageous because he has nothing to lose.

Is like to see these guys see the light when their career is genuinely on the line.

Dongemaharu on April 23, 2013 at 6:52 PM

Williams-Sonoma Concedes Victory to Terrorists, Pulls Pressure Cookers From Shelves

http://reason.com/blog/2013/04/23/williams-sonoma-concedes-victory-to-terr

LOL.

Pork-Chop on April 23, 2013 at 6:54 PM

What does he have to say about death penalty for the innocents ?
Yaknow like little babies who have not even commited any crime ?

burrata on April 23, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Got to wonder why 9/11 didn’t change his thinking. Almost 3000 killed there. Funny how your mindset changes when something happens in your own back yard.

Then there’s the rest of us, who favored the death penalty long before there was a 9/11 or bombing in Boston. Bad guys are bad guys, they deserve the ultimate punishment. Liberal PC weenies have yet to figure that out.

fogw on April 23, 2013 at 6:56 PM

After seeing videos of home owners being ordered out of their homes at gunpoint.. hands held over their heads.. I’ve reconsidered how this manhunt was handled. It was wrong. Plain wrong!

Where was the 14th amendment? How did they pick houses to search? Were they just walking down streets and picking houses at random?
The videos are at the Daily Mail. Pretty disturbing. They were pointing their weapons are everyone.. and yet they had a clear description of the bomber. Why didn’t they use blood hounds? Probably because they clash with the body armor.

I think now that they were just looking for an opportunity to do this and bomber manhunt supplied them with one.

Also.. what were the rules of engagement? You know they have them for our troops overseas.. but I bet they had none on the streets of Boston. An American citizen had a greater chance of being killed on the streets of Boston by pretend soldiers than enemy combatants do overseas when confronted by real soldiers. Rules of engagement for our soldiers fighting terrorists.. none I bet for SWAT raiding innocent American homes.

JellyToast on April 23, 2013 at 6:56 PM

My favorite dumb antiDP argument is that they should be made to sit in prison and think about their crimes. lol!

I’ll bet Sirhan Sirhan and Charles Manson, et al, constantly reminisce about their crimes. With proper care, exercise and diet, they may be so fortune to continue to do so for up to another 20 years.

hawkeye54 on April 23, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Mumbles is like any other liberal … they’re anti-this or anti-that until reality touches them, then they sing a different tune.

In other words, as long as all the bad stuff doesn’t affect them they’re more than happy to shove their liberal agenda down your throat.

darwin on April 23, 2013 at 6:56 PM

A liberal talking tough. Pfffft!

No cost to him, because he knows that other liberals will make sure death sentences are never carried out.

NJ passed a ‘get tough on crime’ death penalty law. And the liberal Democrat state supreme court invalidated every decision. Last count I heard, years ago, it was 27 cases.

Liam on April 23, 2013 at 6:56 PM

So this is one of those “a conservative is a Lefty that’s been mugged” type of moments?

visions on April 23, 2013 at 6:57 PM

So this is one of those “a conservative is a Lefty that’s been mugged” type of moments?

visions on April 23, 2013 at 6:57 PM

No.

The heading in the file folder is “Bullshit”.

Liam on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

Williams-Sonoma Concedes Victory to Terrorists, Pulls Pressure Cookers From Shelves

http://reason.com/blog/2013/04/23/williams-sonoma-concedes-victory-to-terr

LOL.

Yeah, I’ll bet their are hundreds of potential terrorists among their clientele. First place I’d think to as a go to source for what I’d need for nefarious purposes I tell ya.

hawkeye54 on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

Probably the wrong forum and the wrong thread to come out against the death penalty, but here goes:

If it is not necessary to kill a person, I do not believe it is morally justified to kill him.

PackerBronco on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

I’m biased about the death penalty. I’m from Texas. We get it. Evil is punished.

Ron White says it best: ” if you come to Texas and kill somebody, we will kill you back. That’s our policy. Right now there’s a bill in the Texas legislature that would speed up the execution process of those convicted of a heinous crime with more than three credible witnesses. If more than three people saw you do what you did you don’t sit on death row for 15 years Jack, you go straight to the front of the line. Other states are trying to abolish the death penalty. My state’s puttin in an express lane.”

tru2tx on April 23, 2013 at 7:01 PM

More Americans will continue to die as long as the government keeps treating these scum as poor misguided fools instead of lining them up and shooting them. Obama’s Department of InJustice won’t declare him an enemy combatant, so the longer he sits in jail the more jihadists he will make.

txhsmom on April 23, 2013 at 7:02 PM

Also.. Daily Mail reported SWAT was yelling “Identify yourselves” while standing on homeowner’s front porches pointing their guns at the occupants.
Nothing wrong with that picture. No warrant needed. This is a crisis. Police don’t need to identify themselves.. just look at their m-16 pointing at your face. That’s all the ID you need to see. Now come out with your hands on top of your head!

I still can’t get over it.. massive lock down.. martial law, hundreds of police at least, armored vehicles, helicopters all searching for a wounded 19 year old… and he’s finally caught by an old guy having a cigaret moments after the police give it up.

JellyToast on April 23, 2013 at 7:04 PM

Probably the wrong forum and the wrong thread to come out against the death penalty, but here goes:

If it is not necessary to kill a person, I do not believe it is morally justified to kill him.

PackerBronco on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

I believe in the death penalty, but it should be applied very sparingly. Is there a place where a crime, or series of them, are so heinous that death is the proper justice for those crimes?

Liam on April 23, 2013 at 7:05 PM

My favorite dumb antiDP argument is that they should be made to sit in prison and think about their crimes. lol!
 
Oh, I’m sure they do think about their crimes, but they are “pleasuring” themselves while they do it.
 
Blake on April 23, 2013 at 6:48 PM

 
I think we’ve had the conversation before. I’m very anti death penalty IF we stop providing cable TV, libraries, heat and AC beyond 60 in the winter and 90 in the summer, lights other than natural lighting, and any other entertainment that involves more than “1-2-3-4 I declare a thumb war”. They’d be cheaper to house, and let extreme boredom be part of their sentence.
 
And no fried food. A vegetarian, no-salt diet (but cheap canned or almost out-of-date veggies, not fresh) and forced exercise so they’ll live well into their 80s.
 

Sit. Wait. Remember the outside. Sleep. Wake. Sit. Remember the outside. Repeat for 60 years.
 
But with prisons as they are now? Yeah, fry them.

rogerb on April 23, 2013 at 7:11 PM

Allahpundit,

Here is my answer to your question.

I don’t believe the state should be playing God. I believe the punishment will be exacted by the hands of God. However (and this is hard for me to condemn even Dzhokhar to capital punishment), terrorism seeks to rip the stitches of our just society apart. If our society is successfully toppled all or in part, there will be many more unjust murders that take place at the hands of the state.

h a p f a t on April 23, 2013 at 7:12 PM

Probably the wrong forum and the wrong thread to come out against the death penalty, but here goes:

If it is not necessary to kill a person, I do not believe it is morally justified to kill him.

PackerBronco on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

I think it is morally justified. Rapists, murderers, kidnappings should be punishable by death. As well as treason.. depending upon the severity and the harm caused.
It’s also time to make prison rape punishable by death with the sentence carried out quickly. Of course… that will never happen in my life time. Our prisons should not be places where anarchy reigns.

JellyToast on April 23, 2013 at 7:13 PM

I don’t believe I’ve ever met anyone who claims to be an opponent of capital punishment actually against capital punishment. To test this ask them if they are prepared to say that the conclusion of the Nuremburg trials is morally unjustified.

It is the advocate of capital punishment whom values life (and justice) more than the opponent.

anuts on April 23, 2013 at 7:13 PM

Ugh. I hope that posted. …and only once. I kept getting a “WordPress error.”

h a p f a t on April 23, 2013 at 7:14 PM

I don’t believe the state should be playing God. I believe the punishment will be exacted by the hands of God.

h a p f a t on April 23, 2013 at 7:12 PM

According to the God of the Bible, we are commanded to exact capital punishment.

anuts on April 23, 2013 at 7:21 PM

What a fat dumba$$. He could lose the weight, the dumba$$ is permanent.

msupertas on April 23, 2013 at 7:21 PM

Just more bs. This guy may follow if the path of Bill Ayres. Maybe Obama and Holder will pardon him as they walk out the door. Look at who is working with Paul Ryan to put immigration reform together. I voted for Romney/Ryan. Two complete losers.

alanstern on April 23, 2013 at 7:24 PM

here is a link to mumbles greatest hits. he is such a tool….

http://howiecarrshow.com/mumbles-greatest-misses-available/

and Howie Carr has a podcast of his show on itunes, well worth the listen.

deimos on April 23, 2013 at 7:25 PM

Could we have Gosnell perform a post-partum abortion on Tsarnaev?
Perhaps using some hedge-shears instead of scissors?
That would work for me.

Another Drew on April 23, 2013 at 7:25 PM

if the man’s not innocent, even by his own admission, with a pile of physical evidence against him, what’s the argument then? That it costs the state a little more to handle death-penalty appeals?

Not only is in cost-ineffective, if the death penalty is widespread, there will be someone innocent eventually put to death. The bar for guilt is beyond a reasonable doubt, but sometimes seemingly unreasonable doubts turn out to be accurate. Everyone operates under the same rules, so, unless you’re going to rip out the foundation of our justice system, you have to chose between some innocents accidentally put to death and a rare-to-banned death penalty.

There are some people, Menino maybe now among them, who oppose capital punishment on principle except in cases of terrorism. I’ve never fully understood that. If death is wrong because it’s a power that shouldn’t be trusted to the state, why make a special exception for the state vis-a-vis … its political enemies? If the answer to that is that some offenders warrant special condemnation, how is that an argument to spare other offenders who deserve death too but acted from nonpolitical motives?

The state is the prosecutor and executioner, so crimes against the state are, in a sense, more serious than even murder. There’s also a more practical argument: In Europe, where there is no death penalty, there’s often a revolving door for terrorists in a way there wouldn’t be for other murderers, due precisely to the political aspects of their crimes, and political pressures. That’s why the Israelis assassinated the perpetrators of the Munich Olympics massacre; they knew the Europeans would never serve lasting justice. So there’s much more reason to make sure those criminals never get out alive than there is for other criminals, who are virtually guaranteed not to (due to natural death)… unless, of course, they’re later exonerated.

calbear on April 23, 2013 at 7:25 PM

Heh, the handle has nothing to do with “fat”. It’s an acronym. But I digress

It’s not up to is mere mortals to decide who deserves to live or die. If you can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that people committing federal capital crimes are guilty, then I’d reluctantly consider death appropriate.

h a p f a t on April 23, 2013 at 7:26 PM

And, for reminder, how many liberals are of the view that global-warming ‘deniers’ need to be put to death?

And the same with Wayne LaPierre, and every member of the NRA?

Ask that of the next anti-death-penalty liberal you meet.

Liam on April 23, 2013 at 7:27 PM

Not In My Backyard has come home to roost.

Naturally Curly on April 23, 2013 at 7:30 PM

A simple hanging is too good for the terrorist dirtbag.

Upon conviction place him in a 5×5 foot cell of armor plate about thirty feet high and open at the top…. with a bomb securely installed somewhere in the floor or wall of the cell. Then let the dirtbag know that food will be thrown down to him at usual times but that bomb will go off sometime, someday… without any warning… and is expected to only blow off the lower half of his body so he can experience exactly what he put dozens of completely innocent Americans through… at least for as long as he lasts.

viking01 on April 23, 2013 at 7:30 PM

LOGIC over comes EMOTION!!!
(le sarc)

canopfor on April 23, 2013 at 7:34 PM

A mugged liberal wakes up, but it’s only for show, he’s a Democrat through and through.

RJL on April 23, 2013 at 7:35 PM

So this is one of those a conservative is a Lefty that’s been mugged type of moments?

visions on April 23, 2013 at 6:57 PM

A real knee-slapper how that never happens.

98ZJUSMC on April 23, 2013 at 7:35 PM

Boston mayor: This bombing’s making me reconsider my position on the death penalty

…so instead of the missionary position…he now will go doggie style?

KOOLAID2 on April 23, 2013 at 7:41 PM

“But, don’t you dare even think about opening up a Chick-fil-A in my town, er, I mean, Beantown! I’ll impose the death penalty on all of your applications before you can say ‘Mumbles, may I? Please, please, please, with sugar on top…and chocolate sprinkles…and marshmallows…and pistachios…and Oreo crumbles…and chocolate chunks…and Reese’s Pieces…and walnuts…and M&Ms…and chocolate whipped cream…and Irish coffee-flavoured whipped cream…and a cherry…no, make that three cherries?!?!? PLEASE!’”

- Mayor Thomas Menino

Resist We Much on April 23, 2013 at 7:42 PM

In other words, its fine when when it happens to people in other peoples cities, but now that its actually affected me, I want their heads!!!

Dragoro on April 23, 2013 at 7:43 PM

Menino will probably pull a Whinestein once his personal security environment gets a boost and his limo gets some bomb-proofing.

Then, like Whinestein, as long as his personal bodyguards are well armed with plenty of ammo then the peons can pound sand again as far as any 2nd Amendment rights for self-defense or the giving of tough penalties for terrorist perps are concerned.

viking01 on April 23, 2013 at 7:49 PM

Boston mayor: This bombing’s making me reconsider my position on the death penalty

…so instead of the missionary position…he now will go doggie style?

KOOLAID2 on April 23, 2013 at 7:41 PM

KOOLAID2:Correct,the LeaningForwardTinglesManouvre!:)

canopfor on April 23, 2013 at 7:52 PM

Have we heard yet if little brother was a registered democrat?

djl130 on April 23, 2013 at 7:57 PM

If this turd focused more on keeping terrorism out of Boston rather than Chick-Fil-As, things may have turned out differently.

Smoothies on April 23, 2013 at 7:58 PM

I have long noticed that most anti-death penalty types have some red-line beyond which they “reconsider”.

My memory is a little spotty on this, but I recall reading book by, IIRC, an FBI profiler in which he told a story about Ed Harris. Ed was doing research for a part. They played for him a tape of a serial killer torturing and murdering a little girl. He liked to tape his murders. Ed Harris “reconsidered” his anti-death penalty position after that.

farsighted on April 23, 2013 at 7:59 PM

It’s totally legit to recraft policy when tempers are running hot. Ask Obama about that vis-a-vis gun control.

Tempers would eventually calm, of course, if mass shootings weren’t happening what seems like every goddamn week.

triple on April 23, 2013 at 8:00 PM

What you’re seeing here, I think, is simply a guy grappling with justice for a killer whose guilt doesn’t seem to be in question.

I call that the “no doubt” threshold. Which is well beyond the “no reasonable doubt” threshold.

farsighted on April 23, 2013 at 8:03 PM

I put this in the same category as Amanda Palmer’s poem to the surviving terrorist. Using the bombing and its victims to be attention whores by claiming how much more “special” they are than us unenlightened riff-raff.

Gator Country on April 23, 2013 at 8:06 PM

Have we heard yet if little brother was a registered democrat?

djl130 on April 23, 2013 at 7:57 PM

His political registration has not been reported in the liberal media, and from that I conclude that he is a registered democratic.

slickwillie2001 on April 23, 2013 at 8:13 PM

why would this make one reconsider their long held core beliefs? If you think the death penalty is wrong for killers then why would you think its ok for a bomber. Oh yeah because it was in your city. That’s bullcrap and this guy can’t be trusted with power.

If you think the death penalty is fine for killers then you don’t have to be one person for a killer in Ca and one for a killer in Boston.

Does any policitican have core beliefs anymore?

unseen on April 23, 2013 at 8:14 PM

If this turd focused more on keeping terrorism out of Boston rather than Chick-Fil-As, things may have turned out differently.

Smoothies on April 23, 2013 at 7:58 PM

Great line.

slickwillie2001 on April 23, 2013 at 8:15 PM

What you’re seeing here, I think, is simply a guy grappling with justice for a killer whose guilt doesn’t seem to be in question.

or a lying politician re-examing his beliefs in light of poll results showing his city (the one that elects him) wants the bomber hung from the nearest lamppost

unseen on April 23, 2013 at 8:16 PM

Yeah, I’m suuuure it is. For maybe, what, all of five minutes for the camera?

MelonCollie on April 23, 2013 at 8:18 PM

It’s not much of a deterrent if it is never applied. Perhaps even in a public way. When it’s so sanitized it loses it’s “see, this is what will happen to you” effect.

I’m with the Nuge on this.

Besides, Checnyans are known for sawing peoples heads off.

Stretch a neck.

wolly4321 on April 23, 2013 at 8:18 PM

Tempers would eventually calm, of course, if mass shootings weren’t happening what seems like every goddamn week.

triple on April 23, 2013 at 8:00 PM

‘Seems’ beings the operative word.

Resist We Much on April 23, 2013 at 8:40 PM

beings being

Resist We Much on April 23, 2013 at 8:53 PM

Boston mayor: This bombing’s making me reconsider my position on the death penalty

Yeah, ya dipstick, nothin’ like a two by four right between the eyes to get your attention. Is it too much to hope that maybe you’ll also reconsider a few of your other notions that are wrong….and really stupid.

Oldnuke on April 23, 2013 at 9:05 PM

Does any policitican have core beliefs anymore?

unseen on April 23, 2013 at 8:14 PM

Yes. All of them of whatever flavor have one core belief. Say whatever gets ME the most votes so I can keep my lucrative gig.

Oldnuke on April 23, 2013 at 9:08 PM

If it is not necessary to kill a person, I do not believe it is morally justified to kill him.

PackerBronco on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

“It’s a matter of justice, not expression.”

April 23, 2013 by Allahpundit

Cleombrotus on April 23, 2013 at 9:25 PM

…if mass shootings weren’t happening what seems like every goddamn week.
 
triple on April 23, 2013 at 8:00 PM

 
When was the last one?
 
(Not counting the constant minority shootings/murders that you’re indifferent to, of course.)

rogerb on April 23, 2013 at 9:28 PM

My favorite dumb antiDP argument is that they should be made to sit in prison and think about their crimes. lol!

Blake on April 23, 2013 at 6:48 PM

Mine is “The death penalty doesn’t deter crime”. My response is always “Well this particular a$$hole isn’t going to commit any more crimes and that’s deterrence enough for me.”

Oldnuke on April 23, 2013 at 9:39 PM

Alternate Headline: Idiot pulls head out of butt.

RovesChins on April 23, 2013 at 10:42 PM

My favorite dumb antiDP argument is that they should be made to sit in prison and think about their crimes. lol!

Oh, I’m sure they do think about their crimes, but they are “pleasuring” themselves while they do it.

Blake on April 23, 2013 at 6:48 PM

and commit even more crimes against their fellow man while in prison.

Dr. ZhivBlago on April 23, 2013 at 10:44 PM

Oh no, not another evolving liberal!

Maybe the mayor should think before he speaks … but then he would not be a liberal. They always know the answer without thinking.

virgo on April 24, 2013 at 2:14 AM

The death penalty is an awful idea. Why create a martyr?
Let the f****r rot.

NotoriousFin on April 24, 2013 at 5:06 AM

It’s like saying how much you hate Nazis.

DTTS on April 23, 2013 at 6:47 PM

Especially Illinois NAZIs.

The death penalty is an awful idea. Why create a martyr?
Let the f****r rot.

NotoriousFin on April 24, 2013 at 5:06 AM

You don’t think he’ll be a martyr in prison? You haven’t been paying attention. (cf the Blind Shiek and his followers)

If it is not necessary to kill a person, I do not believe it is morally justified to kill him.

PackerBronco on April 23, 2013 at 6:59 PM

If you’re going to toss that silliness out, then you need to define “necessary”.

I don’t believe the state should be playing God. I believe the punishment will be exacted by the hands of God.

h a p f a t on April 23, 2013 at 7:12 PM

Obviously you aren’t reading the same scriptures that I am. The ones where God specifies that the reson for governments is “to bear the sword” – that is, to punish evil-doers, including the use of the death penalty.

GWB on April 24, 2013 at 9:39 AM

Conservative: A Liberal that got mugged.

Looks like Menino got mugged. Attitudes change when it finally affects you.

NoPain on April 24, 2013 at 10:39 AM