Reversal in WSJ/NBC poll: Majority once again thinks abortion should be illegal in most or all circumstances

posted at 6:01 pm on April 12, 2013 by Allahpundit

Blogworthy not just because it complements the Gosnell coverage but because this old post kicked off two days of arguments in the comments about whether Americans really were becoming more pro-abortion over time. That trend fit with various other trends towards social liberalization, starting with gay marriage, and with post-election claims that the long-touted Democratic realignment had arrived.

False alarm:

ab

Good news and bad news there for pro-lifers. The bad news: The new numbers are in line with most of the other data over the last 10 years. Americans aren’t becoming more pro-choice but they’re not really becoming more pro-life either. (If the Gosnell story breaks out in a big way, that may change in the next round of polling.) The good news: The January numbers showing 54 percent in favor of legal abortion in most or all circumstances looks like an outlier. Either it’s statistical noise or the Akin/Mourdock backlash from last summer finally faded and left pollsters with the pre-2012 status quo. At the very least, you can take the new numbers as a sign that Republicans’ efforts to limit abortion at the state level aren’t generating a backlash (yet).

Still, though, 45 percent support abortion rights in most or all circumstances. What does that mean specifically? WaPo answers:

ab2

You can see vividly in that second column why Akin and Mourdock were such a liability for the GOP. There’s good news and bad news in this data too, of course. The good news is that abortions for reasons of personal convenience draw majority opposition, even in cases where the mother says she can’t afford the child. The bad news is that there’s more than 40 percent support for abortion under every circumstance here, even when you phrase it as blithely as “for any reason.” (Oddly, “for any reason” appears to have more support than “Don’t want to marry the man,” which I would think falls under”any reason.”) I often hear pro-lifers say that future generations will look back in horror at what America permitted over the last 40 years in the name of “women’s health”; I wish that were true, but I’m not sure what they expect to see happen between now and, say, 2050 to move these numbers dramatically. You’ve got 40 percent of the public, and probably 80 percent of the media, willing to bless fetal neck-snipping on demand as some sort of civil-libertarian triumph. What’s going to dissolve those numbers? If the facts of the Gosnell case don’t do it, what?


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Out: abortions
In: post-natal specimen cleanup

crrr6 on April 12, 2013 at 6:05 PM

Progressive War on America. Battlefield: The womb

Polls mean nothing to those denied the chance to breathe.

PappyD61 on April 12, 2013 at 6:07 PM

why don’t we poll all the stuff the media doesn’t cover?

Do you favor arming Mexican drug cartels at the expense of American lives?
Do you favor arming Syrian rebels at the expense of American lives?
Do you favor infanticide at the expense of American lives?

these are yes/no responses we’re looking for.

DanMan on April 12, 2013 at 6:08 PM

As we continue to have blips in the polling based on the idea that most abortions must arise from rape or incest; over half of black babies are aborted every year. The left has done a very good job of making it all about the “rare” even as genocide occurs around us.

Happy Nomad on April 12, 2013 at 6:10 PM

Mentioned it in another thread, the majority support for abortion in November was self-inflicted Todd Akin non-sense along with the War on Women meme. America is by 5 to 10 point margin pro-life. Gosnell is just starting to be covered. Not many of those 40% hard-core abortion supporters can be won over, but some of them can. Gosnell is what abortion is about; he is not an isolated case. That is why the media is afraid to report it.

mwbri on April 12, 2013 at 6:15 PM

why don’t we poll all the stuff the media doesn’t cover?

Do you favor arming Mexican drug cartels at the expense of American lives?
Do you favor arming Syrian rebels at the expense of American lives?
Do you favor infanticide at the expense of American lives?

these are yes/no responses we’re looking for.

DanMan on April 12, 2013 at 6:08 PM

I don’t like your premise because it seems to elevate American lives above all others. How about this:

Do you favor the administration’s arming Mexican drug cartels even though it will result in the deaths of thousands of innocent Mexicans as well as US Border Patrol agents?

Do you favor the administration continuing to arm America’s enemies in Syria, Egypt, and other parts of the middle east?

Do you favor the extermination of human life for no other reason than the biological female involved is a bar slut?

Happy Nomad on April 12, 2013 at 6:18 PM

How did Todd Akin get more press than Kermit the mass murderer..? Amazing!

d1carter on April 12, 2013 at 6:19 PM

The GOP is going to be the party of “We’re slightly less extreme democrats.” Good luck with that! I won’t be a part of it.

Wigglesworth on April 12, 2013 at 6:19 PM

But, fewer abortion would mean fewer “TROPHIES” for abortionists …

http://www.jillstanek.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/baby-feet.png

How will abortionists, like democrat/liberal HERO Kermit Gosnell fill their TROPHY CASES?

Pork-Chop on April 12, 2013 at 6:20 PM

Exit Questions (with apologies to AP)

Will the Gosnell atrocities have an impact on public opinion like the Newtown murders?

Will it be just as short-lived?

Will the right-to life crowd use the bodies as a soap box to push for more restrictive abortions law, as the gun grabbers did? Or will they they have the common sense to let the facts speak for themselves?

novaculus on April 12, 2013 at 6:20 PM

I wish that were true, but I’m not sure what they expect to see happen between now and, say, 2050 to move these numbers dramatically.

Kermit Gosnell. Most people just are not aware of just how awful abortion is in general.

Abortion clinics are horrible places to work with very high rates of employee turnover, ans people don’t know this.

The most adamant abortion supporters in this country are also the most monstrous people among us, and people don’t know this.

People have little or no understanding of the reason for the vast majority of abortions (inconvenience).

The public debate today is framed in such a way as to dehumanize those who fight for life, and raise high those who pretend they are champions of women’s rights.

If the truth were widely know there would be a much different public perspective on abortion. And we wonder why the major media outlets won’t cover the Gosnell story.

NotCoach on April 12, 2013 at 6:22 PM

Maybe the results depend on how you ask the question and its wording. Hmmmm? I suspect this is true of other polls, with the questions deriving from the biases of the pollsters. Gosh, a new concept!

Old Country Boy on April 12, 2013 at 6:24 PM

Using gosnell, a sociopathic serial killer who only used a clinic as a means to his killing end, as of it’s a proper representation or anything that anyone supports or agrees with is absolutely disingenous.

You can’t tar all gun owners with the Newtown brush any more than you can tar all people who don’t think it’s should be made completely illegal in all cases with the Gosnell brush.

That guy, that circumstance, it wasn’t normal. Any more so than Dylan Harris and Eric Klebold were your average gun owners.

Genuine on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

If you want to end abortion in this country expand it. By that I mean change a women,s right to choose to a parent’s right to choose.

meci on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

Happy Nomad on April 12, 2013 at 6:18 PM

I have to take exception with your use of the term bar slut, crack whore on the other hand…

halfbaked on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

As we continue to have blips in the polling based on the idea that most abortions must arise from rape or incest; over half of black babies are aborted every year. The left has done a very good job of making it all about the “rare” even as genocide occurs around us.

Happy Nomad on April 12, 2013 at 6:10 PM

They must be so conflicted. On one hand, they love to see the lower classes keeping their reproduction down to the minimum, as per Margaret Sanger’s intentions. On the other hand, imagine how many more votes they’d be able to get if all those Black babies had been born instead of aborted?

ardenenoch on April 12, 2013 at 6:30 PM

What’s going to dissolve those numbers?

When people are actually educated on the facts and truth.
It is what did it for me in my college days.
Unfortunately, we have no real media or educational system
that addresses this in an honest way.
We have a dumb downed populace..that is by design.

I asked a few people I know this week about the Gosnell case
and the facts around it. They looked stunned..
I don’t think people even realize what is going on in this country..
which is obvious when you see footage from citizens on the street answering questions. Like those Howard Stern video’s to
the latest one posted here about a guy asking people in LA how they felt about the NORK sequester and if they favored it.(made of, to show how damn stupid our people are)
Ht/T whoever posted it here..forgot who.
It is hilarious and disturbing at the same time.
Why BHO is president.

bazil9 on April 12, 2013 at 6:30 PM

Abortion as a poll subject. It should be a no brainer, but that is the problem I assume. Nobody on the abortion side has one that works.

Limerick on April 12, 2013 at 6:34 PM

Genuine on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

Please explain how the outcome of his abortion clinic is different from the outcome of any other abortion clinic.

kingsjester on April 12, 2013 at 6:37 PM

Genuine on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

Agree with you, in part.
No broad brush, here, BUT …
Should we expand on the abhorrent conditions, etc. methinks many will grasp the concept that these ‘centers for the protection of a woman’s right to choose’ are merely abortion mills, disregarding the health of not only a fetus, but the patients as well !!
I know I will be !!

pambi on April 12, 2013 at 6:41 PM

That guy, that circumstance, it wasn’t normal.

Genuine on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

And how do you know that? Tell us.
You do a tour of abortion clinics around the country?
You work at one?

bazil9 on April 12, 2013 at 6:41 PM

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/pelosi-newtown-initiatives-school-safety-might-have-protected-those-children-lot-better

(CNSNews.com) – House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was vague in her answer about how Senate gun control legislation, now under consideration, could have prevented the shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School, but said initiatives for school safety might have provided better protection to the children in Newtown.

“How can we ever not act upon the killing of 20 little children?” she asked.”

PappyD61 on April 12, 2013 at 6:42 PM

Yeah I scratching my head trying to figure out what ‘normal’ baby killing is.

Sorry, abortion folks, it is homicide and there isn’t one of you or one of anyone who can convince me otherwise.

Limerick on April 12, 2013 at 6:44 PM

At the very least, you can take the new numbers as a sign that Republicans’ efforts to limit abortion at the state level aren’t generating a backlash (yet).

Nor should they. The key is to keep reminding people, persuasively through argument and through images, that it is in fact an innocent, helpless unborn child that we are fighting to protect, and that we have no stake in this other than to see justice done and protection given to those babies.

I often hear pro-lifers say that future generations will look back in horror at what America permitted over the last 40 years in the name of “women’s health”; I wish that were true, but I’m not sure what they expect to see happen between now and, say, 2050 to move these numbers dramatically. You’ve got 40 percent of the public, and probably 80 percent of the media, willing to bless fetal neck-snipping on demand as some sort of civil-libertarian triumph.

You’re correct that the key to breaking the bulwark is media coverage. (Simply look at their non-existent coverage of the March for Life, which I can personally testify was enormous.) It’s also a matter of getting attention. Most folks don’t think about politics 24/7. They’ll give abortion a passing thought, and then move on like they do with other political issues, and then go about their lives.

The great political realization of the right is that culture is more important than politics, but it is the great realization of the left that politics can be used to change culture. Abortion and gay marriage both got their momentum from court decisions. Overturn Roe v Wade. The media will go ballistic, but at the same time you will have a window opening in which these sorts of things can be further brought to light.

Another way to deal with things is entertainment. The Fox show “House” had several episodes that conveyed a pro-choice sentiment, but they did have one episode where House has to perform surgery on an unborn child. While performing the surgery, the unborn child raises his hand and grabs onto Dr. House. Little do people know that it was based on a real-life happenstance.

If you permeate the culture, and convey those values through entertainment (not browbeat, but teach) you will help further engrain a culture of life in the United States.

Stoic Patriot on April 12, 2013 at 6:45 PM

I love when people just throw out statements without any
evidence or facts. Look! Here is my opinion..based on…ummm err..my opinion!

bazil9 on April 12, 2013 at 6:45 PM

There are YouTube testimonies by abortion doctors and assistants that decry the horrid conditions, money-centered practices of MANY clinics, mostly PP.
THOSE are the ones who’d been brought to recognize their participation in the rampant delusion of it all.
There’s a good chance that Gosnell was ‘simply’ an evil, mass murderer who’d loved his work, having found his perfect niche.
Either way, this needs be exposed, BROADLY.

pambi on April 12, 2013 at 6:48 PM

If the facts of the Gosnell case don’t do it, what?

cripe, we’ve then hit the bottom of the slippery slope…

cmsinaz on April 12, 2013 at 6:49 PM

DanMan on April 12, 2013 at 6:08 PM

+1
wouldn’t that be a hoot

cmsinaz on April 12, 2013 at 6:50 PM

Genuine,

Gosnell is abortion whether the abortionist is a late-term killer or not. Do not cede the issue. You would not send your dog or cat to most these clinics based on their cleanliness alone. How many really good doctors let alone middle ability doctors go into the abortion field? The pro-abortion crowd cannot prevent abortion from being a back alley practice even if legal. It attracts bad doctors not wanting to lose their license and those who want to still make a buck. They are all ghouls with some being ghouls beyond all measure.

mwbri on April 12, 2013 at 6:52 PM

share this story with others- people might be under the impression that the gosnell story is a rare and unusual case and once you tell them that this happens all over the country, they might rethink their position on abortion…

Delaware abortion clinic facing charges of unsafe and unsanitary conditions

Sachiko on April 12, 2013 at 6:58 PM

I hate to sound cruel but abortions tend to be done by leftist on other leftist and potential leftist. Darwin will yet be proven right. Evolution by natural selection picks “winners” on reproduction and the survival of offspring to reproduce.

Does the leftist model of aborting their offspring, broken marriages, fatherless homes, gay marriage, women having no children sound like a future evolutionary success story? I would say no…..

Evolution by natural selection in ironic twist of fate will be on the side of the conservatives who want stable families, want kids, like kids, and are not having lots of sex with people they can’t reproduce with and who are of the same sex.

William Eaton on April 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

Using gosnell, a sociopathic serial killer who only used a clinic as a means to his killing end, as of it’s a proper representation or anything

Genuine on April 12, 2013 at 6:25 PM

Abortion kills human beings. Nice spin. Sorry the poll didn’t go your way.

CW on April 12, 2013 at 7:03 PM

I often hear pro-lifers say that future generations will look back in horror at what America permitted over the last 40 years in the name of “women’s health”; I wish that were true, but I’m not sure what they expect to see happen between now and, say, 2050 to move these numbers dramatically. You’ve got 40 percent of the public, and probably 80 percent of the media, willing to bless fetal neck-snipping on demand as some sort of civil-libertarian triumph. What’s going to dissolve those numbers? If the facts of the Gosnell case don’t do it, what?

i too think that there will be a time when we look back and wonder, “how did we allow this?” for three reasons:

1. the gosnell story is a growing story right now. and if pro-lifers make a strong effort to spread the story around, AND make it clear that this is NOT a rare case, people might rethink their position.

2. just a general rise in pro-life blogs, websites, and facebook pages. i have seen a lot of those. those pages update a lot and give out good information and pictures, and young people (like me) are liking those pages too. there is a growing pro-life social networking trend!!

3. PRAYERS!!!

Sachiko on April 12, 2013 at 7:04 PM

You’ve got 40 percent of the public, and probably 80 percent of the media, willing to bless fetal neck-snipping on demand as some sort of civil-libertarian triumph. What’s going to dissolve those numbers? If the facts of the Gosnell case don’t do it, what?

Just 80% of the media? Bull. I don’t even take the tweets from the media promising to ‘cover’ Gosnell into account… just pure lip service. It’s more of 90-95% of the media… the same percentage who blindly ignored the March for Life back in January, plugged their ears and went, “LA LA LAAAAAA I CAN’T HEEEEEEEEEEEAR YOOOOOOUUUUUUU!!!”

Nothing will ever change their minds. But I do believe that karma will come back and turn on them in horrible ways.

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 7:05 PM

I hate to sound cruel but abortions tend to be done by leftist on other leftist and potential leftist. Darwin will yet be proven right. Evolution by natural selection picks “winners” on reproduction and the survival of offspring to reproduce.

William Eaton on April 12, 2013 at 6:59 PM

Sorry but NO. If you were aborting the person having the abortion your argument might be logical.

But you’re aborting an innocent child. Who has nothing to do w/ their parents ideology.

MikeknaJ on April 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

But you’re aborting an innocent child. Who has nothing to do w/ their parents ideology.

MikeknaJ on April 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

And not all of the vics grow up to be liarbals.

CW on April 12, 2013 at 7:20 PM

I think we really should be encouraged by these numbers quite honestly considering just how much the deck is stacked against the pro-life position in the media. As long as we can continue to challenge these people ourselves the truth will eventually seep into the American consciousness. Don’t despair, just keep guiding people to the horrible truths of abortion.

NotCoach on April 12, 2013 at 7:23 PM

Nothing will ever change their minds. But I do believe that karma will come back and turn on them in horrible ways.

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 7:05 PM

I believe in miracles .. even if for just a few.
For those who KNOW, but reject the Truth, they’ll get theirs.

pambi on April 12, 2013 at 7:27 PM

Imagine how much lower the support numbers would be if we covered the Gosnell trial! Aren’[t you glad we kept quiet about that? It was for the greater good!

– Mainstream Media

mintycrys on April 12, 2013 at 7:35 PM

Nothing will ever change their minds. But I do believe that karma will come back and turn on them in horrible ways.

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 7:05 PM

“It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”

Heb. 10:31

Cleombrotus on April 12, 2013 at 7:36 PM

Nothing will ever change their minds. But I do believe that karma will come back and turn on them in horrible ways.

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 7:05 PM

I believe in miracles .. even if for just a few.
For those who KNOW, but reject the Truth, they’ll get theirs.

pambi on April 12, 2013 at 7:27 PM

Precisely.

It matters more to get the attention of those few by pure interpersonal measures. In my opinion, that’s been the only real way Roe supporters have eventually converted into Roe opponents (including the actual “Roe” herself). And I’m not even talking about the dyed-in-the-wool supporters; I’m talking about those who lean that way but never stopped to consider that Roe was badly written, purposefully divisive and enacted by the wrong branch of government (one such example out of many). I actually made one such leaner pause for a second when I brought that forward.

As for the media, I’m in Let.It.Burn mode.

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 7:44 PM

And since the lefties are quick to say we should pass more gun control laws because polls indicate that a majority of people support them – we should be quick to suggest that we ban abortion, because polls indicate that more and more people oppose it.

Hill60 on April 12, 2013 at 7:56 PM

If and when Gosnell is convicted, anti abortion groups should purchase billboard time and show the specifics of the case. Let’s open the dialog between mother and child when they’re traveling down the road and see the horrific pictures.

skeeterbite on April 12, 2013 at 8:04 PM

Nothing will ever change their minds. But I do believe that karma will come back and turn on them in horrible ways.

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 7:05 PM

It sorta already does (see: Roe Effect).

Imagine how far gone this country would be with all those extra voting-age Democrats alive? They’ve artificially suppressed their numbers into parity with their enemy.

mintycrys on April 12, 2013 at 8:07 PM

Republicans ought to be named the MeToo Party.

Either now (or soon doe to “evolving”)

Democrats: We favor higher taxes
Republicans: Me Too

Democrats: We favor infanticide.
Republicans: Me Too

Democrats: We favor illegal alien amnesty
Republicans: Me Too

Democrats: We favor gun control as an excuse to eviscerate the middle class and individual liberty
Republicans: Me Too

Democrats: We favor homosexual marriage.
Republicans: Me Too

Democrats: We favor using environmentalism as an excuse to stifle all growth, turns our enemies (Republicans) into ineffectual and effete ninnies and make us (the Democrats) the king of the block
Republicans: Me Too.

IN THE NEAR FUTURE

Democrats-We favor the rights of NAMBLA (North American Man Boy Love association)and favor legislation making sex between 47 year old men and 5 year old boys completely legal.
Republicans: Me Too.

MaiDee on April 12, 2013 at 8:26 PM

Sorry but NO. If you were aborting the person having the abortion your argument might be logical.

But you’re aborting an innocent child. Who has nothing to do w/ their parents ideology.

MikeknaJ on April 12, 2013 at 7:12 PM

I did not say it was right, I am simply saying the majority of babies being aborted have leftist mothers or from mothers that are easily lead by leftist. That has a major impact on the political and demographic make up of the country. Allowing abortions will hurt leftist more than conservatives over the long run. That is all I am saying…not that I think abortions are a good thing morally. I am just stating a cold fact, sort of like wars are bloody and cost money, even the “good” ones. Abortions overwhelming kill the children of the left yet the left supports support it because they are really stupid.

God’s will…

William Eaton on April 12, 2013 at 8:26 PM

Imagine how far gone this country would be with all those extra voting-age Democrats alive? They’ve artificially suppressed their numbers into parity with their enemy.

mintycrys on April 12, 2013 at 8:07 PM

If those children were actually born, and later found out they were to have been aborted by their parents, it’s highly plausible that they WOULDN’T become Democrats.

But that’s the thing. We don’t know because we are assuming behavior patterns of dead people. Even though the Roe Effect might have some merit, it might also have as much credibility as anything Karl Rove and/or Dick Morris spew (none).

Allow me to phrase it in the form of a question. If you found out that your mother nearly aborted you, would YOU still support Roe?

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 9:21 PM

“Any country that accepts abortion, is not teaching its people to love, but to use any violence to get what it wants.”
Mother Teresa of Calcutta

This is the real crux of the matter. Do we live in a society ruled by law and governed by logic, reason, and persuasion? Or will we devolve into a society ruled by the whims of men and governed by force, domination, and ultimately violence?

Will we have liberty or death?

Please note the lack of alternatives.

Chaz706 on April 12, 2013 at 9:35 PM

Imagine how far gone this country would be with all those extra voting-age Democrats alive? They’ve artificially suppressed their numbers into parity with their enemy.

mintycrys on April 12, 2013 at 8:07 PM

Parity my aunt’s glasses. That overworn line has never been true and never will be unless the Quiverfree brand of pro-natal fanaticism sweeps the entire flipping nation.

This is the real crux of the matter. Do we live in a society ruled by law and governed by logic, reason, and persuasion? Or will we devolve into a society ruled by the whims of men and governed by force, domination, and ultimately violence?

Will we have liberty or death?

Please note the lack of alternatives.

Chaz706 on April 12, 2013 at 9:35 PM

+1. Sometimes the world really is 1-bit color, black and white…and not the 32-bit color of liberal fantasy, where you can pick any one of millions.

MelonCollie on April 12, 2013 at 9:44 PM

If those children were actually born, and later found out they were to have been aborted by their parents, it’s highly plausible that they WOULDN’T become Democrats.

Allow me to phrase it in the form of a question. If you found out that your mother nearly aborted you, would YOU still support Roe?

Myron Falwell on April 12, 2013 at 9:21 PM

I don’t support it. I find it morally abhorrent and think that it’s murder. I’m just okay with liberals supporting it, since we need less of them if abortion is ever going to go away…and there will be less of them, since the Roe Effect likely has tangible effects on voting demographics.

As to the first point: Have you ever heard a liberal say that they’re thankful they were born, but were glad their mother “had the choice?” I have a sinking feeling that knowing they were going to be aborted would have little effect on their political views. I’ve heard this enough to know that there is a Reality Distortion Field that surrounds them and those of their ilk. The ideology causes their views, and not the other way around.

See, studies and polls have shown that children greatly tend to hold views and political positions similar to their parents:

so while you say:

Even though the Roe Effect might have some merit, it might also have as much credibility as anything Karl Rove and/or Dick Morris spew (none).

…according to the link, it actually seems to have quite a bit of merit. Roe Effect may be speculation in spirit, but it’s a pretty fair assumption in operation, if you assume that there is a very large chance that the offspring of liberals will tend to be liberal and have liberal voting patterns (is likely a fair assumption), and you assume that liberals, who support abortion, are vastly more likely to have abortions than conservatives, who do not support abortion (also likely a fair assumption). Besides, with what we know about liberal pie-in-the-sky cult behavior, there’s no logical reason to insinuate that oh-so-many children of abortion-supporting liberals would become conservative because of their parents’ views on abortion. You’re projecting a conservative point-of-view onto children raised by parents with a liberal mindset and worldview.

mintycrys on April 12, 2013 at 11:18 PM

Besides, with what we know about liberal pie-in-the-sky cult behavior, there’s no logical reason to insinuate that oh-so-many children of abortion-supporting liberals would become conservative because of their parents’ views on abortion. You’re projecting a conservative point-of-view onto children raised by parents with a liberal mindset and worldview.

mintycrys on April 12, 2013 at 11:18 PM

Regardless, it’s **still** an assumption. For all we know, they could have rebelled against their parents en masse… not that’s never happened before…

I just can’t assume the untold millions of murder victims would all be a part of the collectivist state if they were actually born. We really don’t know. And to make such an assumption is unfair to all of them.

Myron Falwell on April 13, 2013 at 3:56 AM