Video: Japan adds Patriot missile defenses as tensions rise

posted at 3:21 pm on April 9, 2013 by Ed Morrissey

Business as usual, or a sign that Japan is taking the latest belligerence from North Korea more seriously? CNN reports from one of the Patriot missile batteries that sprang up overnight in three places around Tokyo. They aren’t taking any chances on whether Kim Jong-un and the DPRK are blowing smoke or really want to blow up the region:

UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon is taking the crisis more seriously as well.  The BBC reports on Ban’s worry that the tensions could create a war via misunderstanding, and urged Kim to de-escalate the crisis:

UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon has warned the crisis on the Korean peninsula may become “uncontrollable”.

He once again urged North Korea to tone down its “provocative rhetoric” and to keep open a joint North-South Korean industrial complex. …

Speaking to reporters in Rome, Mr Ban said: “If any small incident is caused by miscalculation or misjudgement, it may create an uncontrollable situation.”

He also called for the Kaesong Industrial Complex to be kept open, calling it “one of the most successful cooperative projects between the South and North”.

Japan has also sent two of its most modern warships out to bolster its missile defenses.  If North Korea plans to test its missiles over Japan, it appears that Japan is ready to test its missile defenses and send another message to Pyongyang — and that may start exactly what Ban fears.

It’s been a while since we’ve heard from the Virtual President of the United States, Bill Whittle.  Fortunately, the VPOTUS held a virtual press conference today, explaining that the problems with smoking guns is that the bullets have already been fired.  The trick in crises like these is to smash the guns before they smoke (via the Right Scoop):

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Yea those Patriot Missiles are going to do us a lot of good when North Korea de-orbits the satellite they have in orbit right over the US. Btw it is coming up from the South where we have no defenses.

Here is a email I sent some friends…

Didn’t realize the satellite they put into orbit will be over the US April 10th. Perhaps Dr. Pry isn’t so alarmist after all?

And it is coming from the South as Dr. Pry warned us about…this is worrisome.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/dec/19/north-korea-emp-attack-could-destroy-us-now/

Here is the article that warned about the path of the satellite.
http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/report-intelligence-says-there-will-be-an-attack-on-american-soil_04082013

Probably nothing but just a FYI…

I checked the path and on April 10th the satellite will pass over the tip of the panhandle of Florida into Alabama then Miss then Tenn.
http://www.n2yo.com/passes/?s=39026

Might not be a terrible idea to make sure you have a 3 day supply of water and such.

Pierre

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 3:25 PM

Well it appears the little nk worm is getting the attention he craves? Time to put up or shut up you worthless little worm? Me thinks nk will not come out on top here!
L

letget on April 9, 2013 at 3:26 PM

Who woulda thunk that the Chinese would be such fans of kabuki? The more I read the more it seems this is all meant as a bit of theater to put a halo on Chinese international level-headedness

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 3:26 PM

Glad you got this story up.

I just received this story from Stratfor, and was looking for the HA story here.

avagreen on April 9, 2013 at 3:26 PM

Stuck on stupid. Just join up with South Korea and invade the commie shithole – 90% of the locals will greet you like heroes, and the number of victims will be smaller in the long run.

Archivarix on April 9, 2013 at 3:27 PM

Do we have a laser that can take out the rocket like 6 seconds after lift off? Oh, wait….stars wars would have just made the world unsafe.

Oil Can on April 9, 2013 at 3:32 PM

Archivarix on April 9, 2013 at 3:27 PM

lol…the last thing this situation needs is a Japanese Marine on Korean soil. The flash would be visible from Neptune.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 3:33 PM

We should talk softly and carry a big stick; a decent President would simply say that “if N Korea shows ANY agression whatsoever, KimUn and his band of generals, will smashed like a bug flying down wind in into a semi-truck coming the other direction at 80 MPH”.

Tater Salad on April 9, 2013 at 3:33 PM

I keep seeing those beautiful German Shepards on TV and I am so surprised they have survived the chef’s knife.
Our dear leader would fit right in over in Nork world.

RovesChins on April 9, 2013 at 3:34 PM

The world has done NOTHING about this – for decades.

It will do NOTHING – now.

We are fast approaching the time when 2 fanatically led countries will have deliverable nuclear devices.

And they couldn’t care less if there is a nuclear exchange, and their own peoples suffer massively for it. North Korean communism has already led to millions of starved-out dead. Iran’s leader thinks he has a holy duty to wage war against Israel and us.

War is nothing to either.

OhEssYouCowboys on April 9, 2013 at 3:34 PM

I wish Bill Whittle was our president.

joekenha on April 9, 2013 at 3:34 PM

Japan should announce that it plans on acquiring nuclear weapons, not would the Norks poop blood but so would the ChiComs.

Bishop on April 9, 2013 at 3:35 PM

lol…the last thing this situation needs is a Japanese Marine on Korean soil. The flash would be visible from Neptune.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 3:33 PM

You made me laugh.

OhEssYouCowboys on April 9, 2013 at 3:35 PM

Good thing Kerry is now in charge at State.

mwbri on April 9, 2013 at 3:37 PM

Bishop on April 9, 2013 at 3:35 PM

Oh, quite sure they could make one in three mins. We gave them a freighter full of tasty ingredients back in the 90s. Cooking the books on that boatload of material would be childs play for the the Japanese.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 3:37 PM

War is nothing to either.

OhEssYouCowboys on April 9, 2013 at 3:34 PM

One has grown in a hot house where others always back down to threats.

The other wishes to see the world burn.

Neither is healthy for the future survival of anyone.

ajacksonian on April 9, 2013 at 3:38 PM

China is going to love this.

mwbri on April 9, 2013 at 3:38 PM

Japan should announce that it plans on acquiring nuclear weapons, not would the Norks poop blood but so would the ChiComs.

Bishop on April 9, 2013 at 3:35 PM

If we were really intent on pointing out to China it’s inadequacies we would also encourage S. Korea and Taiwan to develop nukes.

Really, if China is happy with a nuclear NoKo, then they should be A-OK with a nuclear Japan, S. Korea and Taiwan.

ajacksonian on April 9, 2013 at 3:39 PM

Hmmm. VPOTUS has balls. The real POTUS has virtual balls.

Oil Can on April 9, 2013 at 3:46 PM

One has grown in a hot house where others always back down to threats.

The other wishes to see the world burn.

Neither is healthy for the future survival of anyone.

ajacksonian on April 9, 2013 at 3:38 PM

Bingo. And, again, the former is responsible for the starvation deaths of millions of its own, through the Utopia of collectivization.

Neither gives a shit about mega-deaths and war.

OhEssYouCowboys on April 9, 2013 at 3:51 PM

China is going to love this.

mwbri on April 9, 2013 at 3:38 PM

Indeed, it’s the real X factor in this situation. Up to now when North Korea has antagonized South Korea and the United States the Chinese could be reasonably sure the Americans weren’t going to do anything, or at least they wouldn’t start it, so they could wait the situation out until eventually everyone got bored and the status quo returned. Japan taking new steps and beefing up their defensive (and potentially offensive) measures is pushing us towards uncharted waters. It’s very interesting from a safe distance.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 3:53 PM

North Korea is China’s pet dog and won’t do anything that’s not OK with China.

VorDaj on April 9, 2013 at 3:54 PM

its ok folks I have been told over and over by many posters that there is nothing to see here and its all a big scam.

seems like a good why to surprise people by making them think you won’t doing anything no matter what the hell you say or do.

just ignore the mobilization of China’s army on the border, its and Russia’s recent military exercises, the building of anti-carrier missles by china, north korea shutting the factories, North koprea telling all diplomats to leave, north korea telling foreigners to get the hell out of the south. It all means nothing. Oh and the fac tthat the USa is moving heavy assets into the area and now Japan that doesn’t mean anything either. Forget about Japan/China almost going to war over land a couple months ago, forget the flybys, the threats etc. None of it means anything its all just Kim talking insane.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 3:56 PM

Well, I’m relieved the UN has weighed in.

/

tom daschle concerned on April 9, 2013 at 3:59 PM

Stuck on stupid. Just join up with South Korea and invade the commie shithole – 90% of the locals will greet you like heroes, and the number of victims will be smaller in the long run.

Archivarix on April 9, 2013 at 3:27 PM

chenny is that you? Seems like I heard that proclamation before…..something about Iraq…

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 3:59 PM

just ignore the mobilization of China’s army on the border, its and Russia’s recent military exercises, the building of anti-carrier missles by china, north korea shutting the factories, North koprea telling all diplomats to leave, north korea telling foreigners to get the hell out of the south. It all means nothing. Oh and the fac tthat the USa is moving heavy assets into the area and now Japan that doesn’t mean anything either. Forget about Japan/China almost going to war over land a couple months ago, forget the flybys, the threats etc. None of it means anything its all just Kim talking insane

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 3:56 PM

Normalcy bias…no one wants to believe that it is possible for North Korea to be responsible for upwards of 200 million Americans dying…he is just a funny crazy bastard.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:00 PM

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:00 PM

No worries. Voter registration cards are indestructible.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:02 PM

Normalcy bias…no one wants to believe that it is possible for North Korea to be responsible for upwards of 200 million Americans dying…he is just a funny crazy bastard.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:00 PM

If you can find a reputable escrow service I’ll bet you the Kaesong Industrial Complex reopens before 2/3 of the US population dies in a war instigated by North Korea.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 4:05 PM

Oh I wonder if anyone noticed the satellite launch by North Korea in december that just happened to put the sat in orbit over the USA?

North Korea successfully launches satellite

The rogue nation has a history of making such claims even after failed liftoffs, but it appears to be telling the truth this time.

“Initial indications are that the missile deployed an object that appeared to achieve orbit,” the North American Aerospace Defense Command, a joint U.S.-Canadian effort, said in a statement. “At no time was the missile or the resultant debris a threat to North America.”

http://www.mnn.com/earth-matters/space/stories/north-korea-successfully-launches-satellite

hmmmm wonder what was placed in orbit?

How North Korea Could Destroy The United States

Posted 04/04/2013 06:55 PM ET

But other observers are concerned that a specific target may not be what the possibly imploding North Korean regime may have in mind.

The three-stage missile North Korea launched last December that also orbited a “package,” which experts say could be a test to orbit a nuclear weapon that then would be de-orbited on command anywhere over the U.S. and exploded at a high altitude, releasing an electromagnetic pulse (EMP). That would fry electronic circuitry and the nation’s power grid.

This concern recently has been reinforced by a little-publicized study released in May 2011, titled “In the Dark: Military Planning for a Catastrophic Critical Infrastructure Event,” by the U.S. Army War College that said a nuclear detonation at altitude above a U.S. city could wipe out the electrical grid for hundreds, possibly thousands, of miles around.

The satellite launched by Pyongyang coincided with a third round of nuclear tests described as a “nuclear test of a higher level,” most likely referring to a device made from highly enriched uranium, which is easier to miniaturize than the plutonium bombs North Korea tested in 2006 and 2009, said Cheong Seong-chang, an analyst at the private Sejong Institute in South Korea.

Such an EMP device would not have to be particularly high yield. It would not be designed to create a big explosion, but to convert its energy into gamma rays, that generate the EMP effect.

Read More At Investor’s Business Daily: http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/040413-650684-north-korea-emp-blast-could-destroy-america.htm#ixzz2PzyIC7Da
Follow us: @IBDinvestors on Twitter | InvestorsBusinessDaily on Facebook

yeap NOTHING TO SEE HERE FOLKS>>….

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:06 PM

Normalcy bias…no one wants to believe that it is possible for North Korea to be responsible for upwards of 200 million Americans dying…he is just a funny crazy bastard.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:00 PM

Yeah no one wanted to believe Peral harbor was in danger from the air, no one wanted to believe that Saddam was going to invade Kuwait and SA. No one waqnted ot believe the USSR was going into Afganstain nor russia in georgia. And no one wants to believe the muslim brotherhood is th next Nazi regime but there comes a time when we have to face the real possiblities of what can happen and not assume nothing will.

I don’t know if anything will happen. but I do know the “level of concern” is not at the point it should be from the world with a country threatening to wage nuclear war.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:11 PM

If you can find a reputable escrow service I’ll bet you the Kaesong Industrial Complex reopens before 2/3 of the US population dies in a war instigated by North Korea.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 4:05 PM

Given that all empires end and that no one but god knows when they will end I think it would be foolish to bet. But a cautious leader understands the threats and does as much as he can to eliminate threats prior to them becoming threats.

Given what I have read by Dr. Vincent Pry that has not happened…no Republican or Democrat has taken the threat of EMP seriously and we may soon find out how mistaken that was.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:13 PM

Any nuclear weapon detonated above an altitude of 30 kilometers will generate an electromagnetic pulse that will destroy electronics and could collapse the electric power grid and other critical infrastructures — communications, transportation, banking and finance, food and water — that sustain modern civilization and the lives of 300 million Americans.

As the Heritage Foundation reports, an EMP attack with a warhead detonated warhead 25 to 300 miles above the U.S. mainland “would fundamentally change the world. Airplanes would fall from the sky; most cars would be inoperable; electrical devices would fail. Water, sewer and electrical networks would fail simultaneously. Systems of banking, energy, transportation, food production and delivery, water, emergency services, and even cyberspace would collapse.”

Nobody is harmed or killed immediately by the blast. But life in the U.S., the world’s only superpower and the world’s largest economy, would come to a screeching halt as a country dependent on cutting-edge 21st century technology regresses in time almost a century instantaneously.

Read More At Investor’s Business Daily: http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/040413-650684-north-korea-emp-blast-could-destroy-america.htm#ixzz2Q00D3S6D
Follow us: @IBDinvestors on Twitter | InvestorsBusinessDaily on Facebook

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:13 PM

Possible, sure. Also possible is China playing for peacekeeper cred.

For all the would-be Billy Mitchell’s out there I hope you’re wrong. If not then boy did I screw up.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:13 PM

no Republican or Democrat has taken the threat of EMP seriously and we may soon find out how mistaken that was.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:13 PM

Reagan did with his star wars missle defense but once in orbit there isn’t much they can do.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:15 PM

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 3:56 PM

Lets walk this through calmly.

What does NK, China, and/or Russia stand to gain by attacking the US?

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 4:17 PM

Given that all empires end and that no one but god knows when they will end I think it would be foolish to bet. But a cautious leader understands the threats and does as much as he can to eliminate threats prior to them becoming threats.

Given what I have read by Dr. Vincent Pry that has not happened…no Republican or Democrat has taken the threat of EMP seriously and we may soon find out how mistaken that was.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:13 PM

So you won’t put your money where your mouth is? Noted.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 4:18 PM

Japan should be worried. Maybe about North Korea, but certainly worried about the United States.

For nearly two decades, the U.S. has attenpted to regionalize negotiations with the NORK’s, and include all the relevent parties, so as to avoid bilateral negotiations (ie, blackmail).

Now comes news the Obama administration secretly abandoned this longstanding U.S. approach, and may have invited this crisis. Obama administration officials foolishly met with the North Koreans in country several times over the last couple of years, in China last fall, and as recently as last month in New York, all without informing Japan or Taiwan.

If you want to know why we are in this mess with North Korea, the answer is the usual one: an incompetant administration busily driving the world toward war.

MTF on April 9, 2013 at 4:20 PM

Lets walk this through calmly.

What does NK, China, and/or Russia stand to gain by attacking the US?

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 4:17 PM

Good luck to you, sir.

*munches popcorn*

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 4:20 PM

Lets walk this through calmly.

What does NK, China, and/or Russia stand to gain by attacking the US?

Far too rational train of thought. Rational thought and Lil Kim do not coexist in this world.

Just maybe, Lil Kims milked the world and bled his own people for all he thinks he can get out of them, and if he strikes and NK is vaporized for his effort. Oh, well, he’ll probably have left the building for an undisclosed luxury villa to live the rest of his days from his Swiss and Macao bank accounts funded from decades of stealing from the North Korean people.

hawkeye54 on April 9, 2013 at 4:23 PM

Sorry- forgot to link the report on the secret bilateral meeting in New York last month. Here it is.

MTF on April 9, 2013 at 4:24 PM

What does NK, China, and/or Russia stand to gain by attacking the US?

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 4:17 PM

1) power

2) land resources

think your enemies will not do something becaus e you won’t isn’t a good way to think. The USa has nothing to gain by attacking Russia, China nor North Korea. That doesn’t mean the people in power in those countires don’t have anything to gain from attacking us.

3) wages in mexico are now lower then they ar ein China what happens to China’ economy as the cpaitalists start outsourcing jobs from china to places likie Mexico, Veitnam, Phillipines, Africa for lower wages?

4) communists never worry about profit.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:25 PM

On and on with the EMP…get back to me with themath/physics…how much does this satellite mass?

Nuclear weapons come in at hundreds of kilograms….and a really good EMP burst needs to be multi-kiloton…have the N.Koreans perfected such a device, and can they loft something so massive?

Get back to me with something more than some “Doctor’s” report, please.

JFKY on April 9, 2013 at 4:26 PM

yeap NOTHING TO SEE HERE FOLKS>>….

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:06 PM

About the worst place for an EMP over the US is 300 miles up over Topeka, KS.

You don’t need a big one, either.

ajacksonian on April 9, 2013 at 4:27 PM

This crisis is a predictable attempt at blackmail, and it’s an example of exactly why the last three presidents have all insisted on six-party talks with North Korea. But the Obama administration thought they knew better.

What tools.

MTF on April 9, 2013 at 4:27 PM

So you won’t put your money where your mouth is? Noted.
alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 4:18 PM

Where my mouth is? It is below my nose above my chin. Do you dispute the danger of an EMP strike? Have you read the reports put out by Dr. Vincent Pry for the US House of Representatives? Have you read Speaker Gingrich’s words in regards to this mortal threat.

Never before in history has this ability existed. This ability of a failed state to take down the most powerful nation the world has seen…with one strike. Poof.

Besides if I win the bet I won’t be able to collect…

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:27 PM

Just a short comment on the picture above the HA article.

If the fire control on those PAC-3 interceptors is allowed (“weapons free” as they say in the Navy) to pickle off a few of the missiles, there is going to a LOT of broken glass in that neighborhood. Quiet they ain’t.

Missilengr on April 9, 2013 at 4:28 PM

Maybe Lil Kim got his hands on the Red Dawn remake and thought it sounded like a good plan? If so, he evidently didn’t watch to the end.

(Oh, and if he did set off an EMP over North America, it certainly wouldn’t impact our Pacific-based forces – which would proceed to turn South Korea from a peninsula into an island.)

GWB on April 9, 2013 at 4:30 PM

If the fire control on those PAC-3 interceptors is allowed (“weapons free” as they say in the Navy) to pickle off a few of the missiles, there is going to a LOT of broken glass in that neighborhood. Quiet they ain’t.

Missilengr on April 9, 2013 at 4:28 PM

True, but this is also a Nation that has been nuked before.

Broken glass or vaporized cities?

I know which I would choose…

ajacksonian on April 9, 2013 at 4:30 PM

Before this thread is over Allah will be making ROEs for zombies.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:33 PM

I got some bare-bone necessities for comms and power generation in my EMP shelter…big old metal cabinet sealed on the inside with aluminum tape, checked for being a complete electrical circuit throughout, 90 degree angles behind the doors and grounded out.

For a CME I cut the ground wire.

Looks like stage two of EMP protection has moved to the top of my list… quick shelter stuff, to be sure, but them’s the breaks.

ajacksonian on April 9, 2013 at 4:33 PM

I cannot let this stupidity go unchallenged:

Reagan did with his star wars missle defense but once in orbit there isn’t much they can do.
unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:15 PM

To which I reply: Bull Shiite

Missilengr on April 9, 2013 at 4:33 PM

And learn how to spell ‘missile’

Missilengr on April 9, 2013 at 4:34 PM

If you want to know why we are in this mess with North Korea, the answer is the usual one: an incompetant administration busily driving the world toward war.

MTF on April 9, 2013 at 4:20 PM

interesting info. thanks for the links.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:38 PM

Nuclear weapons come in at hundreds of kilograms….and a really good EMP burst needs to be multi-kiloton…have the N.Koreans perfected such a device, and can they loft something so massive?

Get back to me with something more than some “Doctor’s” report, please.

JFKY on April 9, 2013 at 4:26 PM

False…matter of fact a successful EMP weapon will act like a fizzled conventional nuke. It will emit massive amounts of Gamma.

“..North Korea’s last round of tests, conducted in May 2009, appear to have included a “super-EMP” weapon, capable of emitting enough gamma rays to disable the electric power grid across most of the lower 48 states, says Dr. Peter Vincent Pry, a former CIA nuclear weapons analyst and president of EMPact America, a citizens lobbying group.

North Korea’s nuclear tests have been dismissed as failures by some analysts because of their low explosive yield. But Dr. Pry believes they bore the “signature” of the Russian-designed “super-EMP” weapon, capable of emitting more gamma radiation than a 25-megaton nuclear weapon…” Source: Newsmax

Earlier this year a citizen petitioned the NRC to revisit the issue of grid disruption, this time focusing on the spent fuel pools at U.S. nuclear power plants. The petition calls for a new rule that would require nuclear power plant spent fuel pools to have emergency systems capable of functioning for two years in the absence of an operating electric grid. The NRC is currently analyzing dozens of public comments on the petition, and the agency expects to issue a decision on the petition in the middle of next year.

http://public-blog.nrc-gateway.gov/2011/10/31/keeping-u-s-reactors-safe-from-power-pulses/

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:40 PM

Ok got it, the DPRK takes out China’s largest trading partner and the Chinese think it is funny. Sounds like a great movie.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:42 PM

Ok got it, the DPRK takes out China’s largest trading partner and the Chinese think it is funny. Sounds like a great movie.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:42 PM

Expecting rational behavior to win out all the time is a poor way to look at the world. World War 1 was a terrific example of stupidity winning the day.

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:46 PM

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:46 PM

Granted. All I’ve been trying to say is that it is just as likely that China is playing puppetmaster for the crown of international peacemaker. Nothing like being who the world turns to for security.
I just can’t buy that they want any part of destroying their own economy just to dance on our graves.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:51 PM

Ok got it, the DPRK takes out China’s largest trading partner and the Chinese think it is funny. Sounds like a great movie.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:42 PM

I’m not saying you are wrong but can you answer me why communists would care about trading partners? china isn’t a cpaitalist country. It has opened itself up to some capitalism since the fall of the Berlin wall but its government is one party controlled. It keeps “internal” peace with tanks. It forces its women to kill off their children, it censors its media. Unlike the old Soviet Union China is the world’s manufacture. It has 1.5 billion people that would quickly take up in slack in consumption or other equally numbers of people through out the world. the days of the USa being the only place to do “business” is fast fading away.

Yes it would hurt China. The question is would the hurt be bigger then the gains China could make?

Or do the communists even care about trading or profits?

Did Obama care about profits when he rammed through obamacare? did he care about the economy when he raised taxes. Socialists will always place profit a dead last when making a decision.

Like I said not saying you are wrong but I could see where China won’t care about trading partners since we were nice enough to build their economy for them.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 4:56 PM

Just wondering…… Is the X-37 still in orbit?

ThePrez on April 9, 2013 at 4:58 PM

just to dance on our graves.

Limerick on April 9, 2013 at 4:51 PM

i doubt that would be the reason. Sure some of them would just like the left danced on thatcher’s grave. The main reason would be for resources to feed its economy IMO. the China/japan conflict is a good example of why china would not be sad to see us reduced in the world. If not for the threat of the USA China would have those islands at this point.

The USA’s budding relationship with India to counter a rising China is another reason China might like to see the USA reduced. Same goes for the Aussies/china relationship, the Persian gulf etc.

as China riaises it is coming into more and more conflict with the USa and its allies. China unlike the USA at its new world order crap still believes in the concept of the nation state.

again nothing in this says china would like for it to happen. Just that there is plenty of reasons why it would not be sad to see it happen.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 5:03 PM

1) power

China has no need to obtain power through force. In addition, China’s power is economic, and wasting your largest customer is a real buzzkill. If the Russians are again desiring of world-wide dominance, there are much easier pickings close to home. Again, wasting the largest economy (for the present time) kills all economies, then there is no reason (or means) to use force to take power (there’s nothing to take).

NorK: Lunacy. But they don’t have any ability to project power. And if they did, it would go into South Korea.

2) land resources

China has vast, undeveloped resources with an incredible labor force to go get it. Same thing in Russia.

NorK: Are we really supposed to imagine North Korea invading the US and slicing off a chunk as its own? Seriously? Those people are so paranoid they’re afraid of sending their army across the border…thinking that many would drop their arms and flip the bird as soon as they were out of range.

think your enemies will not do something because you won’t isn’t a good way to think. The USA has nothing to gain by attacking Russia, China nor North Korea. That doesn’t mean the people in power in those countries don’t have anything to gain from attacking us.

You should stop watching the zombie shows. We are not defenseless nor combat ineffective after the first strike. We still have a formidable retaliatory strike component that deters most of what you’re suggesting. Everybody loses.

3) wages in mexico are now lower then they are in China what happens to China’ economy as the cpaitalists start outsourcing jobs from china to places likie Mexico, Veitnam, Phillipines, Africa for lower wages?

The answer, if this happens, is what? Our fault…”DIE YANKEE!”?

4) communists never worry about profit.

Chicomms do. A lot.

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 5:10 PM

Where my mouth is? It is below my nose above my chin. Do you dispute the danger of an EMP strike? Have you read the reports put out by Dr. Vincent Pry for the US House of Representatives? Have you read Speaker Gingrich’s words in regards to this mortal threat.

Never before in history has this ability existed. This ability of a failed state to take down the most powerful nation the world has seen…with one strike. Poof.

Besides if I win the bet I won’t be able to collect…

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 4:27 PM

I know what an EMP is, I just side with the large cadre of defense experts and analysts who argue (convincingly) that the threat isn’t what Dr. Pry and Captain-The-Moon-Will-Be-The-51st-State make it out to be.

If North Korea launches an EMP attack on the continental United States then the US Pacific Fleet headquarters in Honolulu won’t be affected; they will retaliate and turn North Korea into a parking lot in very short order. It’s a suicide mission for the NorKs to launch such an attack. If you’re launching a suicide attack than rather than cut the power and hope for secondary effects in the confusion when we’re all bored and can’t play Angry Birds on our phones anymore you’d have a greater destructive effect by detonating that nuke in a city. The EMP threat is overblown.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 5:16 PM

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 5:10 PM

Everything you said here is spot-on.

I’ve run into people worried about secret conspiracies where the Chinese are puppetmasters controlling this whole situation to start something with the US. For me it always comes down to two things: We are China’s largest trading partner and they are one of the biggest holders of US debts. Storekeepers don’t go to war with their best customers and creditors don’t start wars with their debtors. It’s mutually assured economic destruction. Whatever is happening it’s not a Chinese plot to get at us.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 5:23 PM

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 5:10 PM

war is very profitable for the winner. China might have economic power but it does not have world power. the biggest advantage to outsourcing for China was the cheap labor. If labor is cheaper somewhere else china loses what economic power it has quickly. Communists don’t care about profit. chicoms or any other communists. the people of china might care about it, the growing middle class in china might care about it but the real communists don’t. they care about power. and as of now China is still ruled by the communist party not the middle class and not the new capitalist class

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 5:24 PM

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 5:16 PM

the world is one big happy place.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 5:27 PM

China likes a NK talking crazy, not a NK actin
g crazy. When NK talks crazy it bothers the SK , Japan and the US. When NK acts crazy it disrupts the status quo.

Fred 2 on April 9, 2013 at 5:37 PM

If labor is cheaper somewhere else china loses what economic power it has quickly. Communists don’t care about profit. chicoms or any other communists.

The bolded sentence is in direct conflict with the italicized sentence.

If commies don’t care about profit, why would they be concerned with labor costs? Could it be that labor costs impact….profits?

Please explain.

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 5:39 PM

the world is one big happy place.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 5:27 PM

I never said that. From your comments you seem to see the world as a very black and white place when in actuality there are many shades of gray.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 5:46 PM

No EMP requires a full burst, not a “fizzle” Pierre…the only time we’ve ever seen its effects were in the Star Fish Prime shots, in the 1960′s…and those were Hi Yield, Hi Altitude….

You might want to read some more.

JFKY on April 9, 2013 at 5:51 PM

…thinking that many would drop their arms and flip the bird as soon as they were out of range.

BobMbx on April 9, 2013 at 5:10 PM

Heh heh. Like that visual.

Cleombrotus on April 9, 2013 at 6:12 PM

If North Korea launches an EMP attack on the continental United States then the US Pacific Fleet headquarters in Honolulu won’t be affected; they will retaliate and turn North Korea into a parking lot in very short order. It’s a suicide mission for the NorKs to launch such an attack. If you’re launching a suicide attack than rather than cut the power and hope for secondary effects in the confusion when we’re all bored and can’t play Angry Birds on our phones anymore you’d have a greater destructive effect by detonating that nuke in a city. The EMP threat is overblown.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 5:16 PM

Under the REB, I have serious doubts that the US would retaliate with nuclear strategic attacks after a high-altitude EMP attack on CONUS.

slickwillie2001 on April 9, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Under the REB, I have serious doubts that the US would retaliate with nuclear strategic attacks after a high-altitude EMP attack on CONUS.

slickwillie2001
on April 9, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Explain this to me.

avagreen on April 9, 2013 at 7:08 PM

No EMP requires a full burst, not a “fizzle” Pierre…the only time we’ve ever seen its effects were in the Star Fish Prime shots, in the 1960′s…and those were Hi Yield, Hi Altitude….

You might want to read some more.

JFKY on April 9, 2013 at 5:51 PM

Well I have the weight of several fairly in-depth studies behind me…what references do you have?

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 8:55 PM

Your move JFKY…

North Korea’s last round of tests, conducted in May 2009, appear to have included a “super-EMP” weapon, capable of emitting enough gamma rays to disable the electric power grid across most of the lower 48 states, says Dr. Peter Vincent Pry, a former CIA nuclear weapons analyst and president of EMPact America, a citizens lobbying group.

North Korea’s nuclear tests have been dismissed as failures by some analysts because of their low explosive yield. But Dr. Pry believes they bore the “signature” of the Russian-designed “super-EMP” weapon, capable of emitting more gamma radiation than a 25-megaton nuclear weapon.

Pry believes the U.S. intelligence community was expecting North Korea to test a first generation implosion device with an explosive yield of 10 to 20 kilotons, similar to the bomb the U.S. exploded over Nagasaki in 1945. He said, “So when they saw one that put off just three kilotons, they said it failed. That is so implausible.”

PierreLegrand on April 9, 2013 at 8:58 PM

I never said that. From your comments you seem to see the world as a very black and white place when in actuality there are many shades of gray.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 5:46 PM

mostly in history the shades of gray are placed there to confuse and muddly the waters. Professors like to talk about the shades of gray and how things aren’t black and white. However, when you look at most issues and if you drill down to the core of the issue it is very black and white.

Politics is fluid and geopolitics no less so. Who your friend is today can change by the time you wake up. China will continue to be our trading partner up until it is no longer in its interest to do so. and if the government feels the relationship has run its course. china will end it profits be damned. They can do this becaus eunlike a republic they control the entire government and don’t have to care about the impacts on their serfs. If it comes to domestic riots they will let the tanks solve the problem.

You seem to think that the profit motive will be enough to ensure China doesn’t get ina pis$ing match with us. I am pointing out that socialists and communists have NEVER cared about profit. From Obama to Chicoms porfits is the last thing they think about. Lady Thatcher understood that. The socialists would rather have the poor poorer if it meant the rich was less rich. With that type of thought process what matter to China and North korea is “profit margins”? or trading revenues?

People act upon events for all kinds of reasons. Some like the companies that outsourced the US jobs used the profit motive to justify their decision irregardless of how it weakened their country. Others use different core beliefs to justify their decisions. Thinking everyone in the world is out to make a buck and will act accordingly has never been shown to happen in human history.

Hitler didn’t care about profit when he invaded. Japan struck out due to filling boxed in and deprived of resources that they felt their country needed to secure to grow. Saddam wanted to be king of the middle east he didn’t care about profit. Hell Saddam even set billions of $ of oil on fire. IT was never about the money.

Most wars are never about the money. Most wars are about power and becoming more powerful. victory brings its own kind of riches and if defeated you don’t care about money when the bullet hits you.

the only way to stop war is to make the aggressor understand beyond a shadow of a doubt they can’t win. Peace through strength. Another one of thos eblack and white ideas.

China doesn’t know they will lose. the Soviet Union knew even if they won they would lose. The more China thinks they can win and gain consessions the more they will push.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 9:02 PM

You seem to think that the profit motive will be enough to ensure China doesn’t get ina pis$ing match with us. I am pointing out that socialists and communists have NEVER cared about profit. From Obama to Chicoms porfits is the last thing they think about.

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 9:02 PM

Yeah, I do think China does cares very much about continuing to benefit from the $200 billion+ annual trade surplus they enjoy with the US.

I understand it’s difficult for you to see past the ‘communist’ label, but you’ll need to if you want to actually understand the situation.

DarkCurrent on April 9, 2013 at 11:18 PM

unseen on April 9, 2013 at 9:02 PM

DarkCurrent nailed it; you’re hung up on the “communist” label and it’s clouding your judgment. Let me break this down for you using another term: “dictator”.

There have been a number of times on Rush’s show where he’s talked about the most difficult problem the Chinese leadership faces everyday being jobs. Eventually he revealed that the source for this anecdote was President Bush himself from something the president got from a conversation with Hu Jintao so I think the sourcing on this analysis is pretty good.

Every dictator’s principle concern is staying in power. There are a billion people in China. Big groups of people are hard to control. Big groups of agitated people who don’t have jobs and are all in the same place are VERY hard to control. So it should come as no surprise that Hu Jintao admitted to President Bush that Hu’s biggest concern was creating 25 million jobs per year out in the Chinese countryside in order to keep the peasants out of the cities because the cities just can’t handle that many people; they’re overcrowded and polluted enough already with services under strain to keep up and there aren’t enough jobs there for all of them. China NEEDS jobs to keep coming in. That means people have to be making money and turning profits so while they may refer to themselves as communists the fact is pure communism is such an ineffective way to operate an economy that the Chinese have been forced to abandon a lot of it in favor of an injection of capitalism because it’s the only way the dictators could remain in power.

China’s single biggest trading partner helping to create the jobs it so desperately needs is the United States. The US is edged out by the European Union as the largest entity China trades with. Every significant economy in Europe is also a member of NATO. If China starts shooting at the United States and NATO invokes Article 5 (an attack on one is an attack on all) then China loses its two biggest trading partners. Japan and South Korea (#5 and #6) will probably come along for the ride, too. Plus if things really got ugly China’s #3 partner is Hong Kong who could be taken out in one fell swoop. Make no mistake, conflict with the United States and its allies puts the Chinese government at significant risk in a way that Hitler, Imperial Japan and Saddam never were.

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 11:53 PM

North Korea does not want to wake up a militaristic Japan… We may end up with Giant Mechs with Nukes…or wave guns….;)

dec5 on April 10, 2013 at 2:47 AM

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 11:53 PM

The problem with China is not that it is communist. That’s just a label/holdover from the expired era of Mao. The problem is that they are still very totalitarian, with all of the mechanisms of coercion of the old Leninist state, but more that they are now completely mercantilist, which is a pernicious and discredited economic policy that dates from the 17th and 18th centuries (and, to be fair, originated in the West). Mercantilism led not only to tariffs and trade barriers, but also the pointless hoarding of wealth at the national level and aggressive and militaristic foreign policies as states sought to control resources outside of their borders and exclude each other from potential markets.

In Tibet, Xinjiang and Gansu, along withe South China Sea and the Senkaku Islands, to name just a few, China is running the classic mercantilist playbook, just about 200 years too late. The U.S. is currently being milked for currency, but that balance of trade surplus is only one chip in a larger game. If by sacrificing that chip they can gain a positional advantage somewhere else they won’t hesitate for a moment.

HTL on April 10, 2013 at 2:57 AM

alchemist19 on April 9, 2013 at 11:53 PM

DarkCurrent on April 9, 2013 at 11:18 PM

yeap it’s one big happy world. and even though China’s ruling party is communist it doesn’t really mean they are communist nor socialists nor democratic, nor feudalism and the rulers of China don’t care about power they just want to provide jobs to their people because Rush said Pres bush said the leader of China said so. Well war tends to create jobs and it tends to keep the people quiet as it redirects their anger towards an outside enemy. Don’t believe me? The entire North Korea crisis is being played out for that very reason so Kim can keep power and direct his people’s anger outward. If North Korea can do it for 60 years you think China with its censorship can’t do it for a couple years?

Not all people are capitalists no matter how we wish it. Ideology motives some people more then making a buck, nationalism motives people more then making a buck, tradions, friendships etc

But the biggest motivation for leaders is always a thirst for Power. If it is in China’s best interest (however the government of China sees the best interest) to stop trade it will in a heartbeat. It doesn’t matter iof its $2 or $200 billion. North Korea just shut down its factories to make a point they just closed their border to tourism from China. You think money means anything to Kim? And it won’t mean a damn thing to China or the USA if the nation’s interests are threatened either. you think the gov of china or DC cares if its decisions wipes out wealth for its citizens. They care only enough to worry about the riots that it will cause and if they have enough force to contain said riots and revolts they will do it in a heart beat.

maybe you all should remember what Lenin said

” The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”

unseen on April 10, 2013 at 9:01 AM

Interesting.

I’ve been following this satellite on the link given further up (http://www.n2yo.com/?s=39026), both on my Kindle (early this a.m.) and now on this computer. It seems to stop and hover…..the first time I noticed was right over Texas for several long, long minutes this a.m.

Alarmed (thinking my Kindle had a brain hiccup), I logged on to this computer, but by that time it had started moving again.

But the same thing happened on this computer when it was to the west of Australia in the middle of the ocean. I watched as it went up and down in altitude, but not forward (by looking at the altitude feed on the right).

Not sure anyone will see this post, but in case….has anyone been tracking this thing?

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:44 PM

OK. It’s hovering over the middle east right now, barely moving.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:46 PM

Still hasn’t moved.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:47 PM

Same spot: LATITUDE:
29.95
LONGITUDE:
56

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:48 PM

Moving slowly:
LATITUDE:
33.44
LONGITUDE:
55.14

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:49 PM

LATITUDE:
37.8
LONGITUDE:
54

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:50 PM

Moving a little faster as it leaves that area:
LATITUDE:
43.34
LONGITUDE:
52.38

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:51 PM

Moving a little faster, but still slower than when it was over other parts of the world.
LATITUDE:
54.49
LONGITUDE:
48.21

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:55 PM

Moving a little faster as it leaves that area:
LATITUDE:
43.34
LONGITUDE:
52.38

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 12:51 PM

It’s just an old Beta Reticulian probe that scouts Earth every few decades.

DarkCurrent on April 10, 2013 at 12:57 PM

It hovered over Denmark and Sweden, and now it’s over the ocean and up to regular speed.

Definitely spying.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:03 PM

Zipping to Iceland……no hovering at all……over the ocean.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:03 PM

Zipping to Iceland……no hovering at all……over the ocean.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:03 PM

The same programmed sequence it’s been executing for the last few thousand years. Nothing to be alarmed about, really.

DarkCurrent on April 10, 2013 at 1:06 PM

It’s just an old Beta Reticulian probe that scouts Earth every few decades.

DarkCurrent on April 10, 2013 at 12:57 PM

Actually, it’s not…..it’s the NK satellite

Source: North Korea (NKOR)
Comments: KWANGMYONGSONG 3 is a North Korean Earth observation satellite, which according to the DPRK is designed for weather forecast purposes, and whose launch is widely portrayed in the West to be a veiled ballistic missile test.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:07 PM

This didn’t get copied from the site:

Launch date: December 12, 2012

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:08 PM

KMS 3-2
LOCAL TIME:
12:10:12
UTC:
17:10:12
LATITUDE:
65.06
LONGITUDE:
-109.17
ALTITUDE [km]:
507.73
ALTITUDE [mi]:
315.49
SPEED [km/s]:
7.71
SPEED [mi/s]:
4.79
AZIMUTH:
355.1

N
ELEVATION:
-7.5
RA:
12h 1m 45s
DEC:
47° 49′ 54”

http://n2yo.com/satellite/?s=39026

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:11 PM

Actually, it’s not…..it’s the NK satellite

Source: North Korea (NKOR)
Comments: KWANGMYONGSONG 3 is a North Korean Earth observation satellite, which according to the DPRK is designed for weather forecast purposes, and whose launch is widely portrayed in the West to be a veiled ballistic missile test.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:07 PM

Right, a NORK LEO satellite that hovers over places? Sure.

It’s a decrepit alien survey spacecraft.

DarkCurrent on April 10, 2013 at 1:14 PM

Right, a NORK LEO satellite that hovers over places? Sure.

It’s a decrepit alien survey spacecraft.

DarkCurrent on April 10, 2013 at 1:14 PM

First, you were wrong about what kind of satellite it was.
When that failed, Now, your ridiculing what the site plainly shows (if you cared enough to watch). I posted the longitudes and latitudes. Guess I’m really clever…..

Have you even watched it, or are you just blowing smoke?

I think the latter.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:21 PM

It’s much faster now going over the Pacific.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:31 PM

It is claimed to have 3-axis control to point a camera to earth. The satellite will broadcast its remote sensing data in the UHF band and video in the X-band.

http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/nmc/masterCatalog.do?sc=2012-072A

Apparently, it’s stopped broadcasting as there’s nothing to be seen now. Just a blank screen.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:42 PM

First, you were wrong about what kind of satellite it was.
When that failed, Now, your ridiculing what the site plainly shows (if you cared enough to watch). I posted the longitudes and latitudes. Guess I’m really clever…..

Have you even watched it, or are you just blowing smoke?

I think the latter.

avagreen on April 10, 2013 at 1:21 PM

I thought it was pretty obvious I was joking…

“It’s just an old Beta Reticulian probe that scouts Earth every few decades.”

DarkCurrent on April 10, 2013 at 8:42 PM

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