Have Democrats agreed to make border security a prerequisite for a path to citizenship?

posted at 10:41 am on April 1, 2013 by Allahpundit

You tell me. Listen below to Schumer on yesterday’s “Meet the Press” describing the process agreed on by the Gang of Eight. First comes probationary legal status, which has always been the Democratic prize. Then comes border security, replete with certain “metrics” to quantify improvement. Then comes the path to citizenship. He doesn’t explicitly say that the citizenship process won’t begin unless and until the goal in each of those metrics is reached (although he does use the words “after that happens” about border security), but he’s also not giving you the pure amnesty-shill line in which border security and citizenship operate concurrently and independently of each other. I’ve never understood why, if they’re getting probationary legalization right off the bat, Democrats would put up a fuss over Rubio’s demand that border security serve as a “trigger” for the citizenship process. Once you’ve got legalization, you’ll get citizenship sooner rather than later. Better that they cave on the “trigger” to give Rubio some political cover to keep pushing this bill to conservatives than make a stink that ends up further spooking border hawks. For now, just bookmark this clip for easy reference later this week or next when we finally get to see the details of the new bill. It’ll be fun to compare the two just to see how weaselly Schumer ended up being in his language here.

Quick question from the LA Times, by the way. If the GOP’s keen to win over Latinos by caving on principles they’ve held in the recent past, why not cave on ObamaCare too? It’s at least as important as immigration to the voters they’re trying to woo:

Latinos, who have the lowest rates of health coverage in the country, are among the strongest backers of President Obama’s healthcare law. In a recent national poll, supporters outnumbered detractors by more than 2 to 1. Latinos also overwhelmingly see guaranteeing healthcare as a core government responsibility, surveys show…

“This is going to hurt Republicans,” said Matt Barreto, cofounder of Latino Decisions, a nonpartisan national polling firm. “When Republicans keep saying they will repeal the health law, Latinos hear the party is going to take away their healthcare.”…

Surveys indicate that close to 30% of Latino citizens and legal permanent residents lack health insurance. By comparison, just 11% of white and 17% of black Americans are uninsured, according to the latest data from the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention…

Nearly half of Latinos in a recent Pew Research Center poll said they trusted the federal government to do the right thing “always” or “most of the time.” Just 20% of white respondents felt that way. And two-thirds of Latinos believed the federal government should ensure that everyone has access to health insurance, a 2012 Latino Decisions survey found.

Politico has a pair of stories up today about the emerging paths to citizenship in Congress, one in the House and the other in the soon-to-be-revealed Gang of Eight bill. The House GOP apparently wants a citizenship process that takes roughly 20 years; the Gang of Eight allegedly will require thousands of dollars in fines to be paid by illegals before they can qualify (versus just $500 proposed by the White House). Assuming this thing passes, the story of the next two years on immigration will be Republicans struggling to hold the line on whatever final numbers end up in the bill while Democrats use 2016 political pressure to try to get them to lower the requirements for citizenship. (After all, if the point is to take illegals out of limbo, why stick them in a citizenship process they can’t afford? The argument will quickly move towards taking them out of that legal limbo too.) The great risk for the GOP in framing its immigration moderation explicitly as a way to win Latino voters is that grassroots conservatives will expect some electoral bang for their buck fairly soon. That’s not the way most Republicans are selling this — typically you hear them say that winning over Latinos is a long process, with immigration reform a first necessary step — but GOP border hawks will want to see at least some improvement upon Romney’s share of the Latino vote three years from now. And Republican pols surely know it. That’s why they have an incentive to cave, if not now then later, on citizenship requirements. The closer we get to 2016, the more pressure they’ll face to show some improvement with Latinos, which in turn will encourage further concessions if their polling among that group hasn’t changed much. And they’ll make those concessions knowing that the base will forgive them in the interest of winning back the White House. But if they don’t win, lots of bitterness to come.

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It’s the appearance of border security they have agreed, not real border security. I’m not even so sure of the appearance.

Oil Can on April 1, 2013 at 10:43 AM

There will be no border security period.

voiceofreason on April 1, 2013 at 10:45 AM

Yep. According to Big Sis, the border is more secure than it has ever been. Bring on the amnesty already!

Free Indeed on April 1, 2013 at 10:45 AM

Nothing personal to Latinos — but our law has a long mistrust of those who come from other nations.

Aside from British colonists and our Founders, name an immigrant group that hasn’t looked to the Gov’t and corruption like selling votes.

IlikedAUH2O on April 1, 2013 at 10:45 AM

But McCain has held a bazillion hearings on Border Security, isn’t that enough? Is it ever going to be ENOUGH?

Neo on April 1, 2013 at 10:45 AM

If the GOP’s keen to win over Latinos by caving on principles they’ve held in the recent past, why not cave on ObamaCare too?

You say that like they haven’t already.

Odysseus on April 1, 2013 at 10:46 AM

Hahahahaha.
A post about border security with a picture of Chuckie Schumer.
.
Another April Fools’ photo!!
Good one,guys.

Dr. Carlo Lombardi on April 1, 2013 at 10:47 AM

I’m extremely against gay marriage, but I wish others against it wouldn’t bring religion in on their arguments.

Why do you and the establishment GOP assume this? Guys, we’re getting to the point where traditional politics does not matter and is not fun. People will just tune out.

ninjapirate on April 1, 2013 at 10:48 AM

In case no one has noticed these idiots can write and pass bills all day long but do not feel compelled to enforce them. Talk is cheap, especially if it keeps the great unwashed quiet.

Cindy Munford on April 1, 2013 at 10:48 AM

They struggle with the cost of a wall and the idea of ladders.

We don’t use land mines, though. and some wags like me keep bringing up the shoreline.

I can’t figure out why we just don’t follow our success in keeping drugs out. Pay the nations to stop selling backpacks and ladders! We have no drugs coming in…wait..

IlikedAUH2O on April 1, 2013 at 10:50 AM

“This is going to hurt Republicans,” said Matt Barreto, cofounder of Latino Decisions, a nonpartisan national polling firm. “When Republicans keep saying they will repeal the health law, Latinos hear the party is going to take away their healthcare.”…

Did anyone tell the Latinos that they are actually going to have to fork over some $ for this free health care? Because I bet they think O-Care is a freebie. So they leave their no opportunity socialist country and come here and vote for debt laden social programs that will bankrupt our country as well. It’s like a metastasing cancer.

As far as this border security business, Republicans can get any compromise they want passed in Congress but remember the executive branch is responsible for executing the laws. Obama’s idea of executing laws is a lot different than the traditional interpretation.

DaveDief on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

Notice border security isn’t a prerequisite for legalization, only citizenship. Once they are legalized the GOP will be beaten over the head every election cycle until they cave and give them citizenship.

The devil is in the details.

Can someone who has been arrested for drunk driving get papers?
Can someone with a misdemeanor conviction get papers?
What docs are required to show continuous residency in the USA?

Wigglesworth on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

“Border security” is nothing but a ruse. It’s a joke. It’s meaningless.

There is nothing without strong interior enforcement and the treasonous illegal-supporting weasels want to do away with interior enforcement – totally. This BS about “border security” is a sick joke and an offense to the intellect.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

In other words we’re screwed. “Metrics” of border security will be a gaggle of congressman visiting the southern border every year, peering over a section of tin-sheet wall into Mexico, and shaking hands with a few Border Patrol officers.

“Looks good” they will say contentedly before heading off for lunch and golf at an exclusive resort.

Bishop on April 1, 2013 at 11:01 AM

And who is it that defines “border security”? Grahamnesty? Schumer? Give us a freaking break you idiots. Who forms these “gangs”? Total morons. If Rubio is smart, he will distance himself from anything Grahamnesty or Schumer lend their hands to……… neither is worth a modicum of trust. And we, the people, will be victimized again.

ultracon on April 1, 2013 at 11:02 AM

Making deals with Upchuck Schumer is rather similar to making deals with the devil.

Bitter Clinger on April 1, 2013 at 11:02 AM

Are Republicans stupid enough to think that democratics might follow through on such a commitment?

slickwillie2001 on April 1, 2013 at 11:02 AM

Why not? They’ll just fudge the numbers to declare the border secure, even with fence-jumping occurring right in front of senatorial delegations. They won’t let the STATES that know better have any say.

michaelo on April 1, 2013 at 11:04 AM

“Border security” is nothing but a ruse. It’s a joke. It’s meaningless.

There is nothing without strong interior enforcement and the treasonous illegal-supporting weasels want to do away with interior enforcement – totally. This BS about “border security” is a sick joke and an offense to the intellect.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

-
The short answer is…
-

RalphyBoy on April 1, 2013 at 11:07 AM

There will be no border security period.

[voiceofreason on April 1, 2013 at 10:45 AM]

Yeah. The fact that they not showed no interest in it being a requiring it to begin with and have resisted it for this long, means they’ll do everything within their power to nullify that provision.

Dusty on April 1, 2013 at 11:08 AM

Since Napolitano already insists that the border is secure – they can move on to the next step.

Hill60 on April 1, 2013 at 11:09 AM

About the only good thing to come from an amnesty bill is it’ll fasttrack the total collapse of the country. It may even arrive before Obama’s 2nd term is up which would be poetic justice.

Doughboy on April 1, 2013 at 11:12 AM

No, they have not. They never will.

astonerii on April 1, 2013 at 11:13 AM

If Schumer is involved in this, the US and conservatives are scroomed.

That is all.

trigon on April 1, 2013 at 11:14 AM

When one of the political parties accepts that they can change our laws to allow them to import new voters, the system has become corrupt.

slickwillie2001 on April 1, 2013 at 11:15 AM

…to Chuck Schumer…every day is April Fools Day!

KOOLAID2 on April 1, 2013 at 11:16 AM

Easy: Schumer is speaking = he is lying.

There will be no impediments to amnesty in reality – if there are ‘goals’ that ‘must’ be met ‘first’, they will be bogus, arbitrary, and reported as having been successfully ‘met’ whenever they damn well want them to have been ‘met’.

Meanwhile, nothing will have changed in reality in terms of border security. Nothing ‘good’ anyway.

Midas on April 1, 2013 at 11:19 AM

Since Napolitano already insists that the border is secure – they can move on to the next step.

Hill60 on April 1, 2013 at 11:09 AM

Doesn’t matter. This proposal will reward the little brown trespassers with legal status. Then any mention of a secure border will be met by the administration with….

Does it really matter at this point? And it won’t.

Happy Nomad on April 1, 2013 at 11:20 AM

… and Chuck Schumer may go straight to hell, as well. And none too soon.

Midas on April 1, 2013 at 11:21 AM

If states are handing out drivers’ licenses to illegals like jelly beans at the WH Egg Roll, then how is illegals’ voting without citizenship stopped. Motor-Voter registration guarantees further questionable elections.

onlineanalyst on April 1, 2013 at 11:21 AM

The devil is in the details.

Can someone who has been arrested for drunk driving get papers?
Can someone with a misdemeanor conviction get papers?
What docs are required to show continuous residency in the USA?

Wigglesworth on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

And remember that Obysmal says that it is wrong to ask for papers when someone is just going out for some ice cream.

onlineanalyst on April 1, 2013 at 11:25 AM

The GOP has problems with trying to hand a little ground meat to a hungry tiger.

For Latino votes, why not put all Latinos in charge of border security and even social security records, driver licenses and voter registration? That would get them into the GOP with the respect and trust they would be getting!

It would be respectful! Ask Senator McCain!

Just like the GOP had President Obama’s base run the debates and be monitors to show their trust for those people. Good thing we have these smart guys running the GOP.

Look how well that worked out!

My reactionary bud asked me to post this. I told him it would be ignored.

IlikedAUH2O on April 1, 2013 at 11:34 AM

Can someone who has been arrested for drunk driving get papers?
Can someone with a misdemeanor conviction get papers?
What docs are required to show continuous residency in the USA?

Wigglesworth on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

And when they show something like pay stubs with a fake SSN, do they get prosecuted for that crime?

Happy Nomad on April 1, 2013 at 11:34 AM

Latinos, who have the lowest rates of health coverage in the country, are among the strongest backers of President Obama’s healthcare law.

Gee, what a shock that the group of people with the lowest rates of health insurance coverage favors a law that requires other people to pay for their coverage.

Who could have seen that coming?

Also, keep in mind that Obamacare, by its own express terms, grants eligibility for taxpayer subsidies to any person “lawfully present” in the U.S. There is no requirement that the person be a citizen, or that they have a green card.

That means that as soon as the millions of illegal aliens living in the U.S. get their “probationary” legal status (or whatever else they end up calling it), they are eligible for all those big fat Obamacare subsidies. Also keep in mind that the IRS estimates that the lowest cost for an Obamacare policy for a family of four will be over $20,000 per year.

This is going to get ugly . . . fast.

AZCoyote on April 1, 2013 at 11:43 AM

Border jumpers don’t deserve a ‘path to citizenship’!
My grandfather/great grandparents followed the rules to enter this nation. Why is it that THEY had to follow the rules-but rules don’t apply to this new generation of ‘immigrants’?
Actually-I already know why. My family were fair-light hair/eyes/skin-Jews.
Nowadays-dark skin gets you all sorts of ‘extras’. Yeah-I said it.

annoyinglittletwerp on April 1, 2013 at 11:44 AM

And remember that Obysmal says that it is wrong to ask for papers when someone is just going out for some ice cream.

onlineanalyst on April 1, 2013 at 11:25 AM

That was when Obama was demagoguing AZ’s SB-1070 law. Which never allowed the police to arbitrarily stop an innocent person and demand papers in the first place. The law merely allowed police to ask to see proof of citizenship or legal residency if the person had already been stopped for another suspected crime, and the officer formed a reasonable suspicion during the stop that the person was in the country illegally.

But Barry Obama was never one to let actual facts get in the way of his race-baiting.

AZCoyote on April 1, 2013 at 11:49 AM

I have yet to hear a convincing argument about why comprehensive immigration legislation is necessary.

What is “broken” about our current system? Are our problems not caused by failure to enforce the laws currently in the books?

What does it mean to get illegals “out of the shadows”? Does this mean that with legalization the amnestied will be able to suck the social welfare benefits without fear of repercussions? How will their status differ from those who are citizens, naturalized or natural born?

onlineanalyst on April 1, 2013 at 11:53 AM

Can someone who has been arrested for drunk driving get papers?
Can someone with a misdemeanor conviction get papers?
What docs are required to show continuous residency in the USA?

Wigglesworth on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

The answer to the first two questions is “yes.”

As for the third question, it won’t matter. DHS does not have the personnel or the money to verify the authenticity of whatever documents millions of illegal aliens submit as proof of long-term U.S. residency. (DHS also does not have the political will to weed out fraudulent wannabe Dim voters.)

In the 1986 amnesty, the government estimated that more than 1/3 of the approved amnesty applications were fraudulent. Keep in mind also that the government ended up granting amnesty to more than twice the number of illegal aliens that it originally estimated would be eligible.

Personal computers and photoshop software were not nearly as cheap and easily accessible in 1986 as they are today. Just think how much easier it will be for the next group of amnesty-seekers to forge “proof” of their U.S. residency.

AZCoyote on April 1, 2013 at 11:58 AM

Let’s believe the liars this time!

They don’t uphold the current laws or secure the current border, but, by gosh, they sure will do it better in the future.

Because… they promise they will!

Reagan being duped by their lies was a one-time fluke.

Gee golly, I trust them this time.

The Dem leopards have changed their spots.

profitsbeard on April 1, 2013 at 12:12 PM

If the GOP’s keen to win over Latinos by caving on principles they’ve held in the recent past, why not cave on ObamaCare too?

Umm, from my point of view implementatation of Obamacare has continued almost unabated. Looks like they caved on that looooong ago.

paulsur on April 1, 2013 at 12:20 PM

Like Reagan learned the hard way – DemocRats lie, are charlatans, dishonest thugs. They never keep their end of the bargain. Thus, they can ‘agree’ to anything, and fool the stupid Rs.

The land is snatched and destroyed by both parties. The people are too stupid to realize and vote for the idiots, who destroy them. Such moronic people, in the majority, deserve full and utter destruction. May justice be done.

Either ‘pitchfork’ almost the entire House in 2014, and most all who’re up for re-election in the Senate, or be Fluked, royally, by them. No more mercy or indulgence. Stupid gets what stupid does. It’s a relatively free land and fools vote for their tyrants, on both sides. Enjoy.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2013 at 12:22 PM

1. Show me the security.

2. Show me the security 5 years from now.

3. Show me the numbers of illegals in the U.S.A. after that time.

4. Then we talk.

5. Now they lie.

6. Now we fight.

They come for your land, your gold, your lives, you now and we Apache before, this time we fight together or they take it for good.

You, Americans are the new Apache.

Ask any Apache how this unlimited legal and illegal immigration works out long term.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on April 1, 2013 at 12:30 PM

To Schumer is to Lie.

A Lie is a Schumer.

The Schumer Lie.

Lie like a Schumer.

Lie =’s Schumer

Shumer =’s Lie

APACHEWHOKNOWS on April 1, 2013 at 12:33 PM

The Two Party Evil Money Cult enabled by the Gobbles News Network of lies lust for these wage/vote slaves.

It is an evil thing.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on April 1, 2013 at 12:35 PM

That means that as soon as the millions of illegal aliens living in the U.S. get their “probationary” legal status (or whatever else they end up calling it), they are eligible for all those big fat Obamacare subsidies. Also keep in mind that the IRS estimates that the lowest cost for an Obamacare policy for a family of four will be over $20,000 per year.

This is going to get ugly . . . fast.

AZCoyote on April 1, 2013 at 11:43 AM

Correct. Meanwhile, illegals suck up the low entry jobs now. What is left: retail, restaurant, clerical is being cut to part time to avoid the Obamacare burden, which is too high for many of these jobs. I know people who cannot find a base job with more than part time. Some of them are about to become homeless. This is because employers are requiring hour flexibility and on-call to hold the new part time jobs. It is almost impossible to get two part time jobs that do not overlap

. And they’ll make those concessions knowing that the base will forgive them in the interest of winning back the White House. But if they don’t win, lots of bitterness to come.

Wrong

They will not forgive them

I and the people I know will not vote that party anymore. Rubio is out already. Paul is out already.

Those who argue we are cutting off our nose to spite our face are full of it. The face is gone, dead, if this goes through. Another Hot Air contributor wrote this, which is the hard truth of what has happened:

It doesn’t matter which party you vote for anymore, the government no longer serves the people, they serve K-street, and it turns out that foreigners have more representation in our government than the American people do.

FloatingRock on March 31, 2013 at 1:37 PM

These actors want a borderless nation. They do not want a nation. They want a play ground for international profiteering.

The nation will be out of the hands of the citizens if this goes through. They know it.

Remember when McCain said he was through on amnesty? This group is never through. Rubio is out of the closet. Rand is gaming everyone. He is now following his father in attempting to strengthen the RINOs to diminish the conservative bloc. It is all a charade.

When I listen to Rubio now, all I hear is Jeb Bush. IMHO Rubio will sign anything that comes up, as fast as it appears, but he will fall back on the mantra that he tried, tried to get hearings etc. This is pure gaming. Guess they are trying to keep him alive in case they need him in 4 years

Yeah, the guy who tried to do it right

entagor on April 1, 2013 at 12:46 PM

They come for your land, your gold, your lives, you now and we Apache before, this time we fight together or they take it for good.

You, Americans are the new Apache.

Ask any Apache how this unlimited legal and illegal immigration works out long term.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on April 1, 2013 at 12:30 PM

You are correct.

Sadly, you lose 2X if they succeed

entagor on April 1, 2013 at 12:50 PM

Lookie here, fools.

Schadenfreude on April 1, 2013 at 12:55 PM

Chuck, this is from one of your brother Senators, http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=oswego+safe+haven&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

mixplix on April 1, 2013 at 1:09 PM

Whoops!

mixplix on April 1, 2013 at 1:10 PM

These actors want a borderless nation. They do not want a nation. They want a play ground for international profiteering transnational progressivism.

entagor on April 1, 2013 at 12:46 PM

How dare you suggest that they are interested in anything as….capitalistic… as profit? They work only for the good of all mankind!!

/typical lefty, foaming at the mouth

What we are seeing here is the J.Wellington Wimpy version;

I will gladly trade you amnesty (and lots of new Democrat voters) now for a secure border next year.

Except of course “next year” never actually gets here.

When Schumer is smiling, he’s thinking of how he’s torching yet another part of the America that he loathes- defined as “everything that Saul Alinsky loathed”. Expecting him to deal honestly when he can gut this country and turn it into a one-party state run by him and his cronies just by lying is expecting too much of him, or his cronies.

Any Republican who goes along with this is an idiot. And will soon be out of a job, when all those “new Dem” voters show up in his district or state and vote for his opponent. GOPers forget that no matter how much they suck up to the Dems, they are not and never will be “members of the club”, anymore than a “made man” (businessman in hock to the Mob) was ever “one of the Family”.

And once the Dems have that overwhelming captive voting bloc, they will really start “building social justice”. About the way it’s been built all over South America and Europe by their like-minded friends.

And no, you won’t enjoy it.

clear ether

eon

eon on April 1, 2013 at 1:33 PM

We are long past the time when border security promises on paper are sufficient.

We now require border security implementation. Everything else comes AFTER that.

Because we’ve seen time and time again that the promises end in shattered fragments while the amnesties linger on.

Adjoran on April 1, 2013 at 1:44 PM

Can someone who has been arrested for drunk driving get papers?
Can someone with a misdemeanor conviction get papers?
What docs are required to show continuous residency in the USA?

Wigglesworth on April 1, 2013 at 10:57 AM

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Whatever they can print up on a computer.

And when they show something like pay stubs with a fake SSN, do they get prosecuted for that crime?

Happy Nomad

No.

Amnesty will give them a pass on any document fraud committed while illegal, plus many other criminal acts included child and spouse abuse. Meanwhile, will legal American citizens get the same consideration when this amnesty gets passed? No. If an American grandma commits ID theft, is she given a pass because she’s a grandma? No.

If you’re an American using a fake SSN, you get punished, and it’s on your record forever. If you’re an illegal using a fake SSN, you get the welcome mat. And sadly, there are apparently enough Americans who are ok with that. It’s why the country is doomed. No nation can survive the level of ignorance that is taking over this one.

xblade on April 1, 2013 at 2:40 PM

Doesn’t matter.

None of what any of them say matter.

Amnesty is coming.

That’s all the Democrats wanted and they’re getting it.

Border Security won’t even get token attention. It dozens that’ve too.

They’ll ‘deem’ it secure and that will be that. I’ll be surprised if it takes even six months before the big press conference and the pomp and circumstance declares the border secure without a damn thing being done to actually secure it.

All a joke…

catmman on April 1, 2013 at 3:47 PM

Last week UK Prime Minister David Cameron made a major speech on immigration, further stoking up the vicious witch-hunt against migrant workers that has dominated British politics recently.

Cameron said the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition government was pledged to end Britain’s reputation as a “soft touch” for immigrants by restricting their rights to state benefits, National Health Service (NHS) treatment and social housing. Immigration Minister Mark Harper declared, “We want to make sure our rules are among the toughest in the world.”

J_Crater on April 1, 2013 at 6:34 PM