Woman to Rep. Moran: “Why aren’t you pro-choice [on] self-defense for women?”

posted at 8:01 am on March 12, 2013 by Ed Morrissey

Good question — which is why Rep. Jim Moran (D-VA) evaded it by complaining about the length of the questions.  Bear in mind that Moran held this townhall meeting specifically to discuss legislative responses to the Newtown shootings; it was titled “Preventing Another Newtown: A Conversation on Gun Violence in America.” If it’s a conversation, shouldn’t Moran be prepared to, y’know, converse?   Instead, Moran refused to address the issue of self-defense for women:

It’s unclear what length of questions he expected.  Perhaps it was something along the lines of “When you gonna grab the guns?”

Note too the loud cheers that erupt when the question is posed.  Clearly, this woman’s concern didn’t come from the fringe, not even among Moran’s constituents.  The question of rape is especially pertinent, since it is primarily a crime of domination and power.  Why wouldn’t we want women to have the ability to change the power equation in these attacks? And while it’s true that a weapon can be turned against its owner, as one woman shouts in near the end, it’s at least as likely that a woman will get killed in a rape as it is that she’ll lose her weapon in a struggle with an attacker.  A properly trained and armed woman would still have  an advantage over an attacker, or at least a fighting chance.

Too bad Rep. Moran is apparently incapable of answering that question.  Maybe he should stop holding townhalls on subjects for which he has little knowledge and spend his time studying up on those issues instead.

Update: Two different readers, my friend and Brad Thor among them, says that the woman is Celia Bigelow.  Katie identified her in her Townhall post.


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Okay let’s take this rapist education logic to the next level. Do we really think that we can educate rape out of existence so that women don’t need to protect themselves?

Are budding rapist even educatable considering we don’t even know really what causes someone to rape? And if we apply this logic, shouldn’t we be then educating children about becoming pedophiles and domestic violence committers.

That used to be what parents were for, and why the government gave them tax breaks and other benefits. I guess that’s not an operable scenario anymore.

Socratease on March 12, 2013 at 4:19 PM

Are budding rapist even educatable considering we don’t even know really what causes someone to rape?

Just look to the Koran. There you’ll find your answers.

BobMbx on March 12, 2013 at 4:40 PM

Demtards like Moran don’t want women to defend themselves.
1) That would endanger his vicious son.
2) It would end the stream of victim sob stories used to justify their power-grabbing tyrannical control policies.

dentarthurdent on March 12, 2013 at 4:42 PM

And as luck would have it, we have this update

The “Lack of Affirmative No” defense.

Underage, intoxicated woman fails to clearly say no, ends up having “consensual sex”. This is the defense in this case.

Okay…so where’s the statutory rape charge?

BobMbx on March 12, 2013 at 4:54 PM

So why are you trying to deprive women of the right of self-defense from tyranny?

So why are you trying to deprive women of the right of self-defense from criminals?

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 3:50 PM

And I say…

DON’T LET UP!

This line of questioning needs to stay at the center the debate.

Saltysam on March 12, 2013 at 3:54 PM

Thank you.

The best the proppressives can seem to manage is a dance around the truth that in the end they want innocent folk – including women – deprived of their right of self-defense against criminals and tyrants.

A LIE of obfuscation is still a LIE.

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 4:55 PM

Galt2009, IF
we educate men NOT to rape; and as long as womyn have bladders and colons, plus access to rape whistles, they ARE prepared to deal with rape…Geeeez, you know how they are…all emotional and
Sh!te, they might just pull out a pistol and *pop*Pop*…

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 4:59 PM

How does taking away someone’s right of self defense protect them?

Galt2009 on December 21, 2012 at 10:21 AM
Are there or are there not proposals to ban private ownership of civilian (semi-auto) models of military (full-auto) rifles, and carbines?
.
If you’re acknowledging this, then it’s hardly “hypothetical”.
The Second Amendment is FIRST, about self defense against a Tyrannical government. Common criminals come after that.
Then dangerous/nuisance animals … and so on.
Citizens should be allowed to possess the same weaponry as your local and state police. Anything less than that, means your ability to defend yourself against a tyrannical government is compromised. Period.

listens2glenn on December 21, 2012 at 2:12 PM

It’s not hypothetical when you have a tyrannical government breathing down you neck or you have perp breaking down your door in the middle of the night and the police are a lifetime away.

I suppose one reason we need to emphasize the opposition to tyranny aspect of the 2A is that we citizens need parity with our would-be oppressors.

The other aspect of this argument is that the government is Always going to have guns.

Proppressives like to play their little game of thinking that depriving the innocent of guns will somehow translate to depriving criminals of guns – that doesn’t work but they like to use that fanciful idea to push their disarmament cause.

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 5:05 PM

Galt2009, IF
we educate men NOT to rape; and as long as womyn have bladders and colons, plus access to rape whistles, they ARE prepared to deal with rape…Geeeez, you know how they are…all emotional and
Sh!te, they might just pull out a pistol and *pop*Pop*…

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 4:59 PM

Hahahaha.. That’s some good sarc there.

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 5:07 PM

Hahahaha.. That’s some good sarc there.

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 5:07 PM

And no /s tag…I mean did Swift have to market “A Modest Proposal” with a /sarc tag?

My favourite so far has been the commenter here, who asked, What if blowing the “rape whistle” just brings more rapists?

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM

Proppressives like to play their little game of thinking that depriving the innocent of guns will somehow translate to depriving criminals of guns – that doesn’t work but they like to use that fanciful idea to push their disarmament cause.

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 5:05 PM

Of course – as the Demtards in Colorado vote to ban magazines larger than 15 rounds. How did the ban on alcohol work? How have the bans on MJ, cocaine, heroin, and many other substance worked out?
This just makes more people criminals, and criminals will be able to get large magazines one way or another. The drug cartels will just add magazines into the bales of MJ and other drugs they regularly get into this country.

dentarthurdent on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM

Of course – as the Demtards in Colorado vote to ban magazines larger than 15 rounds. How did the ban on alcohol work? How have the bans on MJ, cocaine, heroin, and many other substance worked out?
This just makes more people criminals, and criminals will be able to get large magazines one way or another. The drug cartels will just add magazines into the bales of MJ and other drugs they regularly get into this country.

dentarthurdent on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM

Use a different strategy. Ban hypodermics larger than 10ml, prescriptions larger than 10 pills per refill, alcohol containers greater than 6 ozs., and rolling paper containers that have more than 3 papers.

This strategy is called “educating the people” in NY (by denying a choice).

BobMbx on March 12, 2013 at 5:24 PM

I don’t think she did either. But he think she did, because she said “yes”.

alwaysfiredup on March 12, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Consent is not what he “thinks.”

Resist We Much on March 12, 2013 at 5:55 PM

I don’t think she did either. But he think she did, because she said “yes”.

alwaysfiredup on March 12, 2013 at 2:57 PM

I thought the bank teller meant to give me $1,000,000! Honest! I did! It’s really, really true!

Resist We Much on March 12, 2013 at 5:56 PM

No meant no, and yet he didn’t stop. No consent.

alwaysfiredup on March 12, 2013 at 1:41 PM
I feel bad for men. I think I will advise my 14 year old that he will need to get written consent forms before he has sex..

melle1228 on March 12, 2013 at 1:44 PM

Or….just wait until married!?! Oh wait, there’s that Judeo-Christian thingy again so never mind.

Nutstuyu on March 12, 2013 at 7:19 PM

Galt2009 on March 12, 2013 at 5:07 PM

.
My favourite so far has been the commenter here, who asked, What if blowing the “rape whistle” just brings more rapists?

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM

.
I missed that one ! … Thanks for re-posting. : )

listens2glenn on March 12, 2013 at 7:50 PM

So someone questioned a a public servant at a public meeting?

Well, she should be thankful the public servant didn’t call 911 and accuse her of terroristic threats.

NJ Mother Pressured to Turn Over Her Guns, Charged With ‘Terroristic Threats’ After Reading the Constitution at Tax Dispute Assembly
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/03/12/nj-mother-forced-to-turn-over-her-guns-charged-with-terroristic-threats-after-reading-the-constitution-at-tax-dispute-assembly/

JellyToast on March 12, 2013 at 8:43 PM

Type Alert: It’s Moron, not Moran.

EdmundBurke247 on March 12, 2013 at 9:28 PM

She has NOT legally consented.

Resist We Much on March 12, 2013 at 2:55 PM

I don’t think she did either. But he think she did, because she said “yes”.

alwaysfiredup on March 12, 2013 at 2:57 PM

Jeez AWFU, do you hear how stupid you sound? So does the mugger think the muggee consented because they ended up giving him their wallet anyway?

Nutstuyu on March 12, 2013 at 10:15 PM

…in stead of saying NO…more than once…shoot him inthenuts!…end of conversation!

KOOLAID2 on March 12, 2013 at 10:53 PM

Moran’s a perpetual piece of crap to begin with; pick a topic, any topic.

Midas on March 12, 2013 at 10:55 PM

These fools have no decency.

Schadenfreude on March 12, 2013 at 11:16 PM

My favourite so far has been the commenter here, who asked, What if blowing the “rape whistle” just brings more rapists?

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM

…never thought about that before…spooky and very true!

MelonCollie on March 13, 2013 at 12:13 AM

It’s obvious: white democrat male knows what’s best for everyone, females and minorities included. When it comes to the reach of his power, it’s inclusive and knows no boundary.

He should just say that. It’s what he thinks.

virgo on March 13, 2013 at 12:57 AM

You elect Morans morons and a moron you get.

Sherman1864 on March 13, 2013 at 1:18 AM

Q: “Why aren’t you pro-choice [on] self-defense for women?”
A: “We’re going to have to limit these questions.”

FTG.

Kenosha Kid on March 13, 2013 at 1:46 AM

Men have been taught by liberals that there are no consequences to their actions, and that all humans are free to express their sexuality any way they choose.

Seriously? This is how you’re going to accuse liberals of fostering rape culture? I didn’t think it could get any stupider than your “True Marriage Equality” shtick, but here’s a lower place.

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:12 AM

My favourite so far has been the commenter here, who asked, What if blowing the “rape whistle” just brings more rapists?

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM
…never thought about that before…spooky and very true!

MelonCollie on March 13, 2013 at 12:13 AM

You all do realize that rapists are not zombies right?

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:16 AM

Liberalism really has infected Steubenville Ohio I guess. How would a gun have helped this young woman? The culprit here are two young men who have been taught that because they play football they can do whatever they want. I guess liberals are behind the worship of football culture?

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57573919-504083/steubenville-rape-case-how-drunk-is-too-drunk-to-consent-to-sex/

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:17 AM

You all do realize that rapists are not zombies right?

You realize you are humour-challenged, right?

JFKY on March 13, 2013 at 11:25 AM

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:17 AM

How would have “education” helped, though Lib? Are you saying that these players were never told that taking advantage of drunk girls was frowned upon?

And no one is claiming fire arms are THE solution, but they are A solution, but one that Moran and you seem determined to deny to womynz.

JFKY on March 13, 2013 at 11:35 AM

Liberalism really has infected Steubenville Ohio I guess. How would a gun have helped this young woman? The culprit here are two young men who have been taught that because they play football they can do whatever they want. I guess liberals are behind the worship of football culture?

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57573919-504083/steubenville-rape-case-how-drunk-is-too-drunk-to-consent-to-sex/

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:17 AM

You really going to try to claim that you freaks on the left who want to sell g-strings to five year old girls are not to blame for this childish hyper-sexualized culture that we currently suffer under?

Remember, we on the right are sexual prudes I thought? At least according to your Hollywood inspired version of reality?

I will ask again…if your liberal Dem icons Clinton/Kennedy were not educated by the “strong”, “intelligent” leftist mothers then what could possibly be the explanation.

Your attempt to spin this the way you are makes me question your humanity, but like most hypocritical leftist woman you will claim to believe in anything as long as gubment daddy says so. Just another weak woman.

ClassicCon on March 13, 2013 at 11:44 AM

Liberalism really has infected Steubenville Ohio I guess. How would a gun have helped this young woman? The culprit here are two young men who have been taught that because they play football they can do whatever they want. I guess liberals are behind the worship of football culture?

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57573919-504083/steubenville-rape-case-how-drunk-is-too-drunk-to-consent-to-sex/

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:17 AM

.
ANY … hedonistic, “party-hearty” environment is going to be a “petri dish” for ANYTHING (rape falls under that).
ALL of the participating kids, and their PARENTS should be charged with EVERYTHING they can possibly be charged with.

Especially the parents !

listens2glenn on March 13, 2013 at 12:15 PM

My favourite so far has been the commenter here, who asked,

What if blowing the “rape whistle” just brings more rapists?

JFKY on March 12, 2013 at 5:12 PM
.

…never thought about that before…spooky and very true!

MelonCollie on March 13, 2013 at 12:13 AM

.
You all do realize that rapists are not zombies right?

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:16 AM

.
You do realize, it’s still funny though, right ?
.
Oh wait …..

listens2glenn on March 13, 2013 at 12:21 PM

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 12:33 PM

And Pravda proclaimed the Arsisng of the New Soviet Man….I can summon fiery demons from the vasty deep….see we can ALL talk, that doesn’tmake the claims TRUE….

Why don’t we also teach men not to drive to fast, not to steal, not to under-pay taxes…OH WAIT we do, but it’s ahsn’t ended those scourges either.

Libfree you are a spam-bot or just a very clever Conservative, trolling to make “your” side look bad, right? Or this is a sophisticated piece of Performance Art, desgined to entertain, correct?

JFKY on March 13, 2013 at 12:45 PM

blockquote>You all do realize that rapists are not zombies right?

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:16 AM
You do realize that rapists actually have brain problems right?

Sidestepping the fact that you’re showing no comprehension of sarcasm or dark humor – and some people are just plain bad – no matter what they’ve been taught.
The problem is a liberal mentality that the rapist can do or have whatever he wants, and liberals don’t want women to be empowered enough to be able to defend themselves. See Jim Moron’s son, Bill Clinton, the entire Kennedy clan, Eliot Spitzer, and many more examples.
Conservative men encourage the women in their lives to get guns and learn how to use them for self-defense.
Liberal men are afraid of women having guns.
What does that say about each of them?

BTW – I just helped my wife pick out her own AR-15 to go with her Draco AK pistol, and we’ve been looking over concealed carry handguns for her as well.

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 12:59 PM

What lessons have men been taught that makes a significant number of them feel they can force themselves on women they take on a few dates or who is kind to them?

libfreeordie
on March 12, 2013 at 8:50 AM
.

Men have been taught by liberals that there are no consequences to their actions, and that all humans are free to express their sexuality any way they choose.
So, YOU have probably caused men to rape …..

blink
on March 13, 2013 at 9:59 AM

.
Seriously? This is how you’re going to accuse liberals of fostering rape culture? I didn’t think it could get any stupider than your “True Marriage Equality” shtick, but here’s a lower place.

libfreeordie
on March 13, 2013 at 11:12 AM

.
Hey blink, your first word (men) should be replaced with “people”.

Other than that, I’d say blink‘s comment is DEAD NUTS, RIGHT-ON ! … The (expletives)s the matter with you, libfree’ ?
.

Since rapists cut across every race, class and geographic bracket there really is some larger cultural issue at play here.

libfreeordie
on March 12, 2013 at 8:50 AM

.
Yes, the larger cultural issue at play here is liberalism.

blink
on March 13, 2013 at 9:59 AM

.
The absence of open, public recognition of God.

listens2glenn on March 13, 2013 at 1:00 PM

http://www.ebony.com/news-views/5-ways-we-can-teach-men-not-to-rape-456#axzz2NKk72o9D

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 12:33 PM

And yet the “black culture” does none of that. Listen to the most popular rap music and you will find exactly the opposite attitudes and behaviors being glorified.
And none of those 5 steps will prevent a deviant, disturbed man from raping if he is so inclined. Getting shot by a potential victim will definitely stop him though.

And nobody is telling any woman she MUST have a gun. Conservatives are saying women must BE ALLOWED to have a gun for self-defense if that is their CHOICE.

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 1:03 PM

Liberal men are afraid of women having guns.
What does that say about each of them?

dentarthurdent
on March 13, 2013 at 12:59 PM

.
.
. . . . . . . . . . . . Y E S ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !
.
“Billy J” and Teddy would’ve been taken care of , lonnnnnnng ago.

Hell, we would have been spared the whole Clinton Presidency !

listens2glenn on March 13, 2013 at 1:07 PM

http://www.ebony.com/news-views/5-ways-we-can-teach-men-not-to-rape-456#axzz2NKk72o9D

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 12:33 PM

http://therapup.net/2009/04/11-rap-songs-to-disrespect-women-to/

Which one of these will young black males pay more attention to?
Tell us again where the culture problem is.

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 1:10 PM

“Billy J” and Teddy would’ve been taken care of , lonnnnnnng ago.

Hell, we would have been spared the whole Clinton Presidency !

listens2glenn on March 13, 2013 at 1:07 PM

I’ve always loved the story about Dick Armey when he was leading the investigation into the Clinton / Monica affair.
(supposedly) A reporter asked Armey what he would be doing if he was in Clinton’s shoes. Armey’s response was (supposedly) “I’d be looking up from a pool of blood while my wife said how do I reload this thing.”

My wife, who is a hot tempered, possessive Irish/Norwegian redhead, said “darn right!!!” about that story.
And I’m busy helping her buy more guns…..
(maybe I’m not so bright….)

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 1:16 PM

http://www.ebony.com/news-views/5-ways-we-can-teach-men-not-to-rape-456#axzz2NKk72o9D

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 12:33 PM

.
Who do you know that is teaching these “5 ways” to any youth, any where ?

Zerlina Maxwell should take the lead ….. and head into the “urban jungles” and present these ideas to all those testosterone-loaded young men, and see what happens.

We all know exactly what’s going to happen . . . . . unless God is invoked.

Every one needs GOD to help them deal with “impulses” that they know damn well are WRONG.

Testosterone-loaded young men need God to remind them not to “think with the wrong head”.

listens2glenn on March 13, 2013 at 1:25 PM

Is it because you hate women?

blink on March 13, 2013 at 1:29 PM

Of course it is. libtardfree is from the culture of “sometimes you just gotta slap a ho”. They sure as he11 don’t want women shooting at them when they get slapped around…..

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 1:32 PM

It’s great that you want to teach men not to rape.
blink on March 13, 2013 at 1:29 PM

Now – let’s also see them just teach young black men not to shoot each other, not to drive by shootings at groups of innocent people, not to use and deal illegal drugs, not to rob innocent people, not to beat up and rob old people, etc, etc.
Let’s see how that goes…
Oh ya – it’s been tried – and it doesn’t work!!

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 1:36 PM

Seriously? This is how you’re going to accuse liberals of fostering rape culture?

libfreeordie on March 13, 2013 at 11:12 AM

I think a better example might be your commentary here advocating older men being able to have their way with teenage boys.

hawkdriver on March 13, 2013 at 2:03 PM

From the Jim Moron paranoid thread in the green room:

Well, I guess it depends on whether it was “a garden variety slap across the face” or not or something…

BIDEN ADDRESSES DOMESTIC ABUSE: ‘Not your garden variety slap across the face’…

Resist We Much on March 13, 2013 at 1:20 PM

Soooo, if I just give the ole ho a “garden variety slap across the face” – then no harm done and no crime ehh?
Libtardfree will be happy to hear that Ebony training program for rapists that he/she/it is pushing is already have some real results…..

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 2:04 PM

dentarthurdent on March 13, 2013 at 2:06 PM

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