Is Oregon writing the Worst. Gun. Law. Evah?

posted at 8:31 am on February 23, 2013 by Jazz Shaw

Living in New York, we’re no strangers to really restrictive new gun laws, but you sort of expect that out here. We may have some competition in the race to the bottom, though, if some legislators in Oregon have their way. In fact, if HB 3200 gets passed into law, you may as well pack up and leave the state if you have any interest in Second Amendment rights. Here’s the top line summary.

Creates crime of unlawful possession or transfer of assault weapon or large capacity magazine.
Punishes by maximum penalty of 10 years’ imprisonment, $250,000 fine, or both.
Requires current owners to dispose of or register assault weapons and large capacity magazines.

That should be bad enough on its own, but if you really dig into the guts of this bill, it actually gets worse. After spending quite a bit of ink defining “assault weapons” as pretty much anything with cosmetic attachments which look scary to somebody, we get to the meat of the proposal.

Any person who, prior to the effective date of this law, was legally in possession of an assault weapon or large capacity magazine shall, within 120 days after the effective date of this 2013 Act, without being subject to prosecution:
(a) Remove the assault weapon or large capacity magazine from the state;
(b) Sell the assault weapon or large capacity magazine to a firearms dealer licensed under 18 U.S.C. 923 for lawful sale or transfer under subsection (2) of this section;
(c) Surrender the assault weapon or large capacity magazine to a law enforcementagency for destruction;
(d) Render the assault weapon permanently inoperable;

Oh, wait… did I say that was the bad part. I think I actually meant to refer to this truly tasty treat near the very end. After specifying that even under grandfathering you can only have one “assault rifle” and three high capacity magazines, these high level edicts are handed down.

(3) The department shall create and maintain a registry for owners of assault weapons and large capacity magazines who qualify for registration under section 4 of this 2013 Act. The department may adopt rules concerning the administration of the registry, including but not limited to renewal and revocation procedures and storage requirements for assault weapons and large capacity magazines.
(4) The department may conduct inspections of registered owners of assault weapons andlarge capacity magazines to ensure compliance with the storage requirements of section 4of this 2013 Act.
SECTION 6. This 2013 Act being necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health and safety, an emergency is declared to exist, and this 2013 Act takes effect on its passage.

For all the talk I hear from gun control proponents this year about how universal background checks won’t lead to some sort of gun registry, it certainly seems like there are a lot of lawmakers who are interested in doing precisely that wherever they can. (Referring to (3) above that is.) And when it comes to (4) what can we say? We are assured on a daily basis that the authorities aren’t coming to kick down the doors of gun owners, but out in Oregon they are clearly opening the door to unscheduled, uninvited visits to people on the list.

And this is so important… so critical.. so vital… that a state of emergency must be declared to exist so the law will go into effect immediately without any period of review or challenges. Now tell me again why we’re all paranoid crazies making up fantasies about the government?

Update (Ed): Patriot Perspective’s Short Timer adds his own thoughts on this topic, and reminds us what Oregon Democrats think of gun-rights supporters:

But remember, Oregon Democrats like Lee Coleman have assured us that this kind of thing is just paranoid delusion from some people in “Kansas or whatever” so “go screw yourself.”


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Tytler understood this 200+ years ago.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy.”

We are a bit past that point now. Ten years ago that ‘great conservative leader’ could have saved the nation. Too late now, even if one exists.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 2:47 PM

Well, it looks as though the VA is taking second amendment rights away from some veterans by deaming them ‘incompetent’. The veteran has to prove they are not by getting a doctors letter. With Obamacare, what are the chances that even more veterans lose their second amendment right to bear arms?

http://www.storyleak.com/constitutional-lawyer-veterans-letters-va-prohibiting-firearm-ownership/

Patriot Vet on February 23, 2013 at 2:48 PM

Do you think we’d have as bad of a disaster in the fiscal cliff deal bill, giving out a big pass on Benghazi, giving tanks and jets to Egypt, and having such a huge gun control push?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:45 PM

Given Romney’s history? Yes to all. He backed the Arab Spring, he passed an Assault Weapons Ban, he supported TARP, auto bailouts, etc. Perhaps Benghazi would have been somewhat different.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 2:50 PM

Biden sent his lacky’s out here to whip up the rainbow and unicorn crowd and HB3200 is the result. You know, like he did in Colorado.

After hearing John Lott on Levin’s show yesterday, I had wondered if it was something like that.

Well maybe it’s in response to a bill my Rep’s submitted last week HB3006:

Invalidates federal firearm laws in State of Oregon.
Declares emergency, effective on passage….

old school on February 23, 2013 at 1:57 PM

Thank you so much for the link!

kakypat on February 23, 2013 at 2:50 PM

When the time comes that they march to your residence with arms demanding your arms there no longer IS a Constitution.

wildcat72 on February 23, 2013 at 2:41 PM

I disagree, but let me explain…

When this time comes, and I (and others that face the same horror) die defending my natural rights, or I survive to face trial, it will be a major event. And the legal arguments will entail… and the Nation will be watching. This is when the rubber hits the road and we can decide whether or not all hope is lost and the unmentionable is the word of the day.

Unfortunately, we still have usurpations to suffer before the hearts of Americans are ready to commit.

Otherwise, I’m right there with you, patriot.

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 2:52 PM

He does not advocate taking up arms ourselves. He supports doing it at the ballot box and through the legal system.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:13 PM

Ummmm, nooooooo. He has guns and will not willingly surrender to tyranny by giving them up. Maybe you should read The Great One’s books to know how far he would go. And, there’s that little known fact of his Jewish ancestry. Don’t think he doesn’t remember what happened to his family members during the 20th century. He’s been very vocal in his disgust and determination to fight these fascists and their gun-grabbing ways.

totherightofthem on February 23, 2013 at 2:54 PM

You have no right to speak for my family in any capacity.

You know nothing of my character, just someone talking tough on the internet.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:34 PM

This isn’t “tough talk”. I have a set of principles that guide my life. They are worth fighting for and yes, worth dying for if it comes to it. I could do no less for all the men who fought and died to ensure my liberty.

Wendya on February 23, 2013 at 2:56 PM

Given Romney’s history? Yes to all. He backed the Arab Spring, he passed an Assault Weapons Ban, he supported TARP, auto bailouts, etc. Perhaps Benghazi would have been somewhat different.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 2:50 PM

Bullshit.

Romney’s a RINO no doubt, but he’s not a socialist. He respects the free market and understands the dangers of radical islam.

I don’t see him giving tanks and jets to Morsi.

Don’t see anywhere close to such a huge gun control push. At least Romney is someone who will listen to conservatives. In MA he had a Dem legislature.

I don’t think he’d make enough cuts but he wouldn’t be anywhere close to spending as much as obama.

Remember Bush was bad spending $4 T in 8 years… then obama spent $6 in just 4 years. So even the worst R was still better than and D.

And if we got an repeal obamacare desk on Romney’s desk he’d sign it. He had proposed to issue waivers for it as well along with a goal of repealing Dodd Frank.

Finally, did you vote for Romney?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:57 PM

The only thing left to ban would be maybe 22′s and handguns.

Done.

The proposed HB3200 in Oregon specifically mentions rimfire. Of course anything with detachable magazine as well, which includes semi-auto pistols.

The progressives know they need to confiscate. Like Di-Fi’s original draft this bill dis-allows any transfer except to an FFL or surrender. Purely confiscation. They are scared senseless of lawful gun ownership.

old school on February 23, 2013 at 2:57 PM

“If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 2:12 PM

Too late. The socialist nationalists are now the majority. May they all perish.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 2:58 PM

Ummmm, nooooooo. He has guns and will not willingly surrender to tyranny by giving them up. Maybe you should read The Great One’s books to know how far he would go. And, there’s that little known fact of his Jewish ancestry. Don’t think he doesn’t remember what happened to his family members during the 20th century. He’s been very vocal in his disgust and determination to fight these fascists and their gun-grabbing ways.

totherightofthem on February 23, 2013 at 2:54 PM

He just got guns within the last few years or so for the record.

He stresses on the radio political and legal solutions.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:59 PM

Which is why the voting franchise needs to be REDUCED, not expanded. I think the baseline voter ID should be your W-2 form that proves you worked and paid taxes.

wildcat72 on February 23, 2013 at 2:34 PM

Hell, I’m for limiting it to owners of real property ala John Adams.

totherightofthem on February 23, 2013 at 3:00 PM

He just got guns within the last few years or so for the record.

He stresses on the radio political and legal solutions.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:59 PM

first, second, third and up to, but not including, last…

affenhauer on February 23, 2013 at 3:01 PM

This isn’t “tough talk”. I have a set of principles that guide my life. They are worth fighting for and yes, worth dying for if it comes to it. I could do no less for all the men who fought and died to ensure my liberty.

Wendya on February 23, 2013 at 2:56 PM

Maybe it is tough talk, maybe it isn’t. Who knows when you’re talking to someone you don’t know over the internet.

Who are you to judge me though and speak for my family?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:02 PM

Both the Second AND the Fourth Amendments?

OhEssYouCowboys on February 23, 2013 at 2:38 PM

And the First. It’s the Second that protects the First, after all.

totherightofthem on February 23, 2013 at 3:02 PM

He just got guns within the last few years or so for the record.

He stresses on the radio political and legal solutions.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:59 PM

He has to. Otherwise he’d be in big trouble with the FCC. Read his books. It will be come clearer where he stands.

totherightofthem on February 23, 2013 at 3:05 PM

He respects the free market

“I like mandates. The mandates work”

I don’t see him giving tanks and jets to Morsi.

He supported Mubarak’s overthrow so why not?

Don’t see anywhere close to such a huge gun control push. At least Romney is someone who will listen to conservatives. In MA he had a Dem legislature.

And in Washington he has Democrats as well.

Was Romney forced to pass Romneycare? He says he’s proud of it so spare me the BS about how he was forced to do all these things by those mean Democrats.

I don’t think he’d make enough cuts but he wouldn’t be anywhere close to spending as much as obama.

Remember Bush was bad spending $4 T in 8 years… then obama spent $6 in just 4 years. So even the worst R was still better than and D.

Totally inadequate is still inadequate. They are negotiating how many cups of coffee to cut back on when the bank is sending a notice for repossessing the house.

And if we got an repeal obamacare desk on Romney’s desk he’d sign it.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:57 PM

BS. He would do no such thing and HE SAID THAT.

So some similarities, some differences, and I hope we’re ultimately able to eliminate some of the differences, repeal the bad and keep the good. – Mitt Romney

He was never going to repeal it.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:05 PM

PRetty easy to say on hotair, pretty different when it really happens.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:24 PM

To each their own set of principles and drivers. How can you judge from your keyboard?

Who are you to judge me though and speak for my family?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:02 PM

So yeah I’ll spare my life to be with my family. F you and anyone else who has a problem with that!!!!

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:11 PM

Those who would sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither

— Benjamin Franklin

You are right on all who brung/kept Obama, though. May all, from the left to the right, and theirs, be utterly destroyed by him. YOU deserve NO less.

Romney differs from Obama in two ways:

1. He loves his country.

2. He is not out to destroy her.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:09 PM

He stresses on the radio political and legal solutions.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:59 PM

I stress the same, for now. Btw, the spent almost an hour goign over what happened to the Jews in Poland and why arms were/are so important, and how they faught to the last man, and how he/we would/should too. You might be a Levin fan, but you are not as familiar with him as you claim.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:11 PM

the spent = he spent

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:11 PM

When this time comes, and I (and others that face the same horror) die defending my natural rights, or I survive to face trial, it will be a major event. And the legal arguments will entail… and the Nation will be watching. This is when the rubber hits the road and we can decide whether or not all hope is lost and the unmentionable is the word of the day.

Unfortunately, we still have usurpations to suffer before the hearts of Americans are ready to commit.

Otherwise, I’m right there with you, patriot.

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 2:52 PM

What guarantee is there of a fair trial or any KIND of trial if things are at that point?

It’s now legal for the President to assassinate by drone any American Citizen he wishes to. There isn’t any prohibition of doing that on US soil either.

You think that even if you GOT a trial, and was acquitted because by some miracle your jury was made up of people not only who read the Constitution, but who knew HOW to read in the first place, that a Regime like Obama’s would even accept that outcome?

They’ve already ignored numerous rulings against their practices (such as the illegal recess appointments to the NLRB, yet the NLRB is still there and issuing rulings) what makes you think that if they are bold enough to send armed thugs house to house to confiscate firearms (and not have the People already in armed revolt) that a little jury trial would deter them?

wildcat72 on February 23, 2013 at 3:14 PM

Those who would sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither

— Benjamin Franklin

Camps, plantations and chopping blocks await you. The only difference will be your type of masters and the delay in your famine and execution. Enjoy your tyrannies.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:14 PM

I like mandates. The mandates work”

He’s a self made CEO who respects the free market. He talked about the need to repeal Dodd FRank and other crippling regulations.

He supported Mubarak’s overthrow so why not?

Pure speculation — on both of our parts really as to what ROmney would or wouldn’t have done.

And in Washington he has Democrats as well.

Was Romney forced to pass Romneycare? He says he’s proud of it so spare me the BS about how he was forced to do all these things by those mean Democrats.

Not saying he doesn’t deserve blame for it, but it was a liberal MAJORITY in MA, not the case with the House in DC. BOner and company are wimps who won’t fight, but given a guy like Romney they wouldn’t be fighting against a socialist.

Totally inadequate is still inadequate. They are negotiating how many cups of coffee to cut back on when the bank is sending a notice for repossessing the house.

Still rather have the guy who spends less.

BS. He would do no such thing and HE SAID THAT.

So some similarities, some differences, and I hope we’re ultimately able to eliminate some of the differences, repeal the bad and keep the good. – Mitt Romney

He was never going to repeal it.

More speculation. I could post quotes of him promising to issue waivers AND to repeal it. Still wouldn’t you rather have a guy worst case scenario repeal some parts of it rather than NONE of it? It’s basic common sense.

I take it you didn’t vote for ROmney since twice you ignored the question. So thanks for not standing up to fight for the nation at the ballot box while calling me out for not standing up to fight if they can to confiscate my guns in a hypothetical scenario.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:17 PM

Who are you to judge me though and speak for my family?
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:02 PM

We don’t judge you nor speak for your family.

We … at least I…just point out that the last couple of days, you don’t seem to be the person you have pretended to be here at HA in the past.

But more to the point; We all believe you completely when you say you won’t fight tyranny other than at the ballot box; Shouldn’t you extend to us the same courtesy when we say we will fight for our rights in a more vigorous manner?

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:19 PM

I stress the same, for now. Btw, the spent almost an hour goign over what happened to the Jews in Poland and why arms were/are so important, and how they faught to the last man, and how he/we would/should too. You might be a Levin fan, but you are not as familiar with him as you claim.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:11 PM

So I’m not that familiar with him if I don’t hear every minute of every show?

I agree with the statement above about why arms are so important. Just saying it’s not as practical as you and others may think to violently resist confiscation efforts.

Put it this way. I have a friend in NY state who has a 10 mag clip. He is p!ssed and has called/argued with his congressman over this. However he will comply and not take up arms to resist confiscation. Is he less of a man or allowing tyranny since he’s not resisting the law and isn’t willing to fight to the death to keep his 10 mag clip?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:21 PM

Finally, did you vote for Romney?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 2:57 PM

As a matter of fact yes, moreover I argued to the best of my ability, that despite his being a moderate and quiet possible a socialist leaning RINO, that He did not hate America and was not interested in “Fundamentally Transforming” America into a Marxist Utopian tyrannical State.

I made the very best case that I could to any and everyone who would listen, and quiet a few who did not want to listen, that Mitt Romney was a better choice for preserving the Constitutional Republic our Founding Fathers created that the jug eared dog eating wonder.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:21 PM

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:21 PM

Yes, he is less of a man. He could, for now, leave NY, for ex. Later he could join the real fight, if it comes to it.

You weasels make me queasy.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:24 PM

Shouldn’t you extend to us the same courtesy when we say we will fight for our rights in a more vigorous manner?

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:19 PM

…and for his/her family’s rights too.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:26 PM

Weasels from the right are way more nausea-inducing than the tyrannical charlatans from the left. Grow a pair, or join the rats.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

He’s a self made CEO who respects the free market.

So is Warren Buffett.

Not saying he doesn’t deserve blame for it, but it was a liberal MAJORITY in MA, not the case with the House in DC. BOner and company are wimps who won’t fight, but given a guy like Romney they wouldn’t be fighting against a socialist.

No they would be signing on to a Republican presidents policies. A president who stated he has progressive views.

You are talking about labels and I am talking about results. Functionally they aren’t any different if the end result of their actions are almost identical.

Still rather have the guy who spends less.

I think it’s a waste of time when you know that neither party is in any way serious about the debt, much less the deficit.

More speculation. I could post quotes of him promising to issue waivers AND to repeal it. Still wouldn’t you rather have a guy worst case scenario repeal some parts of it rather than NONE of it? It’s basic common sense.

No it isn’t common sense. You want to support someone who is pushing the slow socialism and think that will result in something of value. It would be better to destroy the GOP and replace it with a party that will fight because we are going to have to stand up at some point, or let it go to hell. In neither case does supporting someone like Romney make sense.

I take it you didn’t vote for ROmney since twice you ignored the question. So thanks for not standing up to fight for the nation at the ballot box while calling me out for not standing up to fight if they can to confiscate my guns in a hypothetical scenario.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:17 PM

Voting for Romney was fighting for the nation? Get a grip. The guy is a liberal.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

We don’t judge you nor speak for your family.

We … at least I…just point out that the last couple of days, you don’t seem to be the person you have pretended to be here at HA in the past.

But more to the point; We all believe you completely when you say you won’t fight tyranny other than at the ballot box; Shouldn’t you extend to us the same courtesy when we say we will fight for our rights in a more vigorous manner?

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:19 PM

Pretended to be?

Get it straight buddy I’ve never once pretended to be anything. Before you keep embarrassing yourself and slandering me try doing some research on my posting history or keep your big mouth shut.

No one fought harder for conservatives like Bachmann and Santorum then me. No one fought more against Romney in the primary than me. I’ve been and am a huge supporter of Palin.

I argued and encouraged every to get involved as possible in the last election, telling them voting isn’t enough.

I’ve always been honest about areas I’ve disagreed with conservatives with. I’ve gotten into arguments since I support gay marriage.. Go ahead gang up on me, I don’t care. The point is I’m honest about what I believe and am not afraid to admit it and defend it.

You seem to think that if anyone takes a position that doesn’t 100% agree with the general platform then that person is a phony? Guess we need all the same groupthink thought right?

The gun control push sickens me and I support fighting it through the legal and political process. I don’t think fighting to the death over it is the option.

Guess you outted me as a liberal though. Who knew??

Now it’s time to go on down to the local welfare office and ask for all the benefits I can get!

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

Romney doesn’t hate his land and doesn’t live to destroy her.

He is a RINO squish but he is not a marxist Utopian islamo-brothers-lover. Some of you, grow up.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:29 PM

More speculation.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:17 PM

What is not speculation is that Romney did not win. Now we have to deal with the consequences of that loss. No amount of recriminations are going to change that. Just like we are on the verge of having to deal with the Democrats violating the 2nd amendment and possible the 4th and 5th as well.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:29 PM

I would pass a law that allows illegals to sue the employers for ten times their lost wages and benefits and a $10,000 lump sum that they can take back to their country of origin….
I would pass a law that says an illegal is not required to pay rent, pay mortgages, pay car loans, etc. Shut down their support network

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 2:35 PM

+100

Excellent. We need more of that kind of thinking. We need to stop accepting their premises, stop debating on their terms, and stop playing defense. Our response to their offensives should be debate-framing counter-offensives of our own.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 3:30 PM

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

If you can’t see the major differences between Romney and obama then there’s no point in continuing that argument.

By not voting for ROmney all you really did was vote for the reelection of barack Hussein obama.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:30 PM

Romney doesn’t hate his land and doesn’t live to destroy her.

He is a RINO squish but he is not a marxist Utopian islamo-brothers-lover. Some of you, grow up.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:29 PM

The Marxists have divided us to the point where WE sank our own chances of stopping them.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:32 PM

You seem to think that if anyone takes a position that doesn’t 100% agree with the general platform then that person is a phony? Guess we need all the same groupthink thought right?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

The problem is right in front of you. You acted this out throughout the thread.

You are right on all the other stuff, except the capitulation for when they come.

First, they’ll come for your guns.

Then they’ll come for you.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

Guess you outted me as a liberal though. Who knew??
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

No, more of an establishment neo-con than a liberal.

I used to like you a lot here at HA… Maybe not the brightest poster, but with good instincts and values. Someone I expected would be at the barricades with us against tyrrany.
Until your crack last night showing your disdain for paleo-cons.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

Yes, he is less of a man. He could, for now, leave NY, for ex. Later he could join the real fight, if it comes to it.

You weasels make me queasy.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:24 PM

I would give every dime I have to see you say that to his face….

And for the record he has a family business, kind of hard to just up and leave right this second. He does hope to leave in 5 years or so once they can expand the business.

But thanks for making assumptions about people you know nothing about.

Just like swalker you’re another hotair know it all.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

I would pass a law that allows illegals to sue the employers for ten times their lost wages and benefits and a $10,000 lump sum that they can take back to their country of origin….
I would pass a law that says an illegal is not required to pay rent, pay mortgages, pay car loans, etc. Shut down their support network …

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 2:35 PM

+100

Excellent. We need more of that kind of thinking. We need to stop accepting their premises, stop debating on their terms, and stop playing defense. Our response to their offensives should be debate-framing counter-offensives of our own.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 3:30 PM

Escondido California tried that a few years ago, and the California Supreme Court stepped in and said it was unconstitutional.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

By not voting for ROmney all you really did was vote for the reelection of barack Hussein obama.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:30 PM

All who did that, and theirs, deserve full destruction by Obama. They wanted him, they got/kept him. May he succeed, apace. No less is deserved.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:35 PM

As a matter of fact yes, moreover I argued to the best of my ability, that despite his being a moderate and quiet possible a socialist leaning RINO, that He did not hate America and was not interested in “Fundamentally Transforming” America into a Marxist Utopian tyrannical State.

I made the very best case that I could to any and everyone who would listen, and quiet a few who did not want to listen, that Mitt Romney was a better choice for preserving the Constitutional Republic our Founding Fathers created that the jug eared dog eating wonder.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:21 PM

Being in Ca you’re vote doesn’t matter all that much does it?

In that case all you really can do is donate and try to volunteer in other areas.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM

By not voting for ROmney all you really did was vote for the reelection of barack Hussein obama.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:30 PM

By voting for the father of Romneycare you are striking a blow against Obamacare.

By voting for a guy who pass an Assault Weapons Ban you are saving us from a guy who wants to pass an Assault Weapons Ban.

By voting for a guy who ran on saving the entitlements programs you are fighting the welfare state.

By voting for the progressive Mitt Romney you are defeating the progressive agenda.

Orwellian Newspeak

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

Heh, then you’ll lose lots of dough.

Plus, you accuse us of making assumptions, while you make galore of them.

You’re boring, were you not so much ‘fun’ today.

Still, you’re a good one, who just got off track today. Enjoy the day. When time comes we’ll be on the same side of the barricades.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:37 PM

I love to be accused, by the left/right, of “a know it all” when the arguments are lost.

Other than that, I just ‘love’ you all.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:37 PM

Escondido California tried that a few years ago, and the California Supreme Court stepped in and said it was unconstitutional.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

Heh, shouldha’ guessed as much.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 3:38 PM

Or

wellian Newspeak

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM

NO one on Earth, ever was/is/will be more Orwellian/Machiavellian/Pinocchean/Goebbelsian/Muenchhausean than Obama.

Multi-threading with one brain is a god-given gift.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:39 PM

Orwellian Newspeak

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:39 PM

No, more of an establishment neo-con than a liberal.

I used to like you a lot here at HA… Maybe not the brightest poster, but with good instincts and values. Someone I expected would be at the barricades with us against tyrrany.
Until your crack last night showing your disdain for paleo-cons.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

Hey you’re the one making assumptions. I speak the truth about what I believe and am honest and suddenly I’m a pretender. Really says alot more about you than it does about me.

Seems like you’re kind of thinned skinned too. For the record Rand Paul is the person I’d be supporting at this point unless Palin or Cruz ran.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:39 PM

Excellent. We need more of that kind of thinking. We need to stop accepting their premises, stop debating on their terms, and stop playing defense. Our response to their offensives should be debate-framing counter-offensives of our own.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 3:30 PM

We would need a political party who believed in doing that.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:39 PM

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM

Wake up. I fought against Romney in the primary.

What choice did any of us have in the general election??

How much worse can obama be? You’re about to find out and you only have yourself to blame for it.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:41 PM

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:21 PM

Being in Ca you’re vote doesn’t matter all that much does it?

In that case all you really can do is donate and try to volunteer in other areas.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM

By the time we even get to vote here in California it’s more or less already over. I donated money I couldn’t afford to to Cain, Perry, Gingrich and Romney.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:42 PM

Guess we need all the same groupthink thought right?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:27 PM

Yeah, all who know me are gleefully/painfully aware how much I abhor group-anything. Individualism is a wonderous thing, a very American, and unfortunately dying thing.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:42 PM

Heh, then you’ll lose lots of dough.

Plus, you accuse us of making assumptions, while you make galore of them.

You’re boring, were you not so much ‘fun’ today.

Still, you’re a good one, who just got off track today. Enjoy the day. When time comes we’ll be on the same side of the barricades.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:37 PM

So you would be willing to die over keeping your 10 round mag clip??

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:43 PM

Escondido California tried that a few years ago, and the California Supreme Court stepped in and said it was unconstitutional.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:33 PM

Heh, shouldha’ guessed as much.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 3:38 PM

We have passed a number of anti-illegal immigration laws here in California only to have the Court system strike them down.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:43 PM

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:41 PM

Indeed, it was a very tough 2012, and the 2nd and unleashed term has just begun. The Punk deserve to have at it. The underdeveloped teenager was mightily rewarded. He deserves to be himself now, in all his glory, and he will be.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:43 PM

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:39 PM

Nah, I only take you at your word.
When you made that crack about paleo-cons last night, I realized that I had been mistaken about you for the last few years.

I apologize for calling you a pretender though; It was my mistake thinking you were more conservative than you really are.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:44 PM

So you would be willing to die over keeping your 10 round mag clip??

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:43 PM

It’s not the clip I’m after, it’s mine and your freedom. Like Legend said, you’re too narrowly focused, lately. It’s a very significant concept. Think it over. We are on your side.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:44 PM

What choice did any of us have in the general election??

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:41 PM

None whatsoever.

Many chose not to pretend otherwise.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:44 PM

wildcat72 on February 23, 2013 at 3:14 PM

Well, I think you’re missing my point.

What guarantee is there of a fair trial or any KIND of trial if things are at that point?

Who knows? I gave up a long time ago predicting the specifics of the future, but the Nation isn’t going to wake up for hypotheticals. There has to be a point where the people experience and witness a history of offenses and usurpations that bring people to their feet.

I wish they could see it before it happens, but the war of perception is a dirty game. If we are going to overcome the injustices that are headed our way, the tyrant is going to have to throw the first punch, or to put it another way, perception needs to be to our advantage.

what makes you think that if they are bold enough to send armed thugs house to house to confiscate firearms (and not have the People already in armed revolt) that a little jury trial would deter them?

I don’t think a little jury trial will deter them, especailly if they are able to control perception. But again, I encourage not predicting the specifics of the future. Until then, the scenarios you portray, though plausible, are only fantasy. That will not support the type of fortitude that is necessary to throw the bastards into the dustbin of history. We are going to have to allow for events to unfold, and for history to settle the matter. And if we expect history to be on our side, we must suffer some of it first.

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 3:45 PM

deserve=deserves

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:46 PM

None whatsoever.

Many chose not to pretend otherwise.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:44 PM

Some choose to fight the lost war, while they new battle runs over them.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:47 PM

So you would be willing to die over keeping your 10 round mag clip??
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:43 PM

Yes, if they invade my private property to take it.

And I take it back about thinking you should resist tyranny with any more than the ballot box and harshly worded letters to the editor.
If you don’t grasp the proper terminology, you shouldn’t even contemplate touching a weapon.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:47 PM

And if we expect history to be on our side, we must suffer some of it first.

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 3:45 PM

And many will do that suffering in ignorance because they refused to even see where the hurt came from.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:48 PM

I’m not sure it’s even worth getting upset over stuff like this anymore, considering what I’ve heard here and has been said to me in “real life”.

“Oh, calm down…they will never come for your guns. You’re just being paranoid. You’re just mad because Obama won.”

And some over here seem to have the attitude,

“If you have nothing to hide, then you won’t get into trouble with the awthoriteez. It’s the LAW dammit! This is AMERICA, buddy, we’re a nation of LAWS!”

I’d be LMFAO off if I lived somewhere else.

Dr. ZhivBlago on February 23, 2013 at 3:51 PM

Some choose to fight the lost war, while they new battle runs over them.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:47 PM

Exactly, Romney lost, period end of story, and nothing is going to change that. That battle is over and done and we lost. The next battle is coming at as at 900 hundred miles an hour.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:53 PM

I’d be LMFAO off if I lived somewhere else.

Dr. ZhivBlago on February 23, 2013 at 3:51 PM

For good reasons the rest of the world must laugh at the majority of dummies in the US, from both sides.

The troubles are all self-made. In a relatively free land the people always, always, always deserve the gov’t they elect.

p.s. I’m not so sure the last election was legit but we’ll never know.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:54 PM

while they the new battle runs :(

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:55 PM

Some choose to fight the lost war, while they new battle runs over them.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:47 PM

Battles are often won or lost before they even begin. If your leaders don’t believe in what you are fighting for how can you win? If they kinda, sorta believe the enemies basic argument then how can they lead anything? If the terrain and timetable is of the enemies choosing then how can you expect any outcome but defeat?

Boehner, McConnell, Romney, McCain, and the host of GOP weaklings are never going to fight the left. It isn’t in them which Romney and McCain showed when the time came.

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 3:58 PM

It’s not the clip I’m after, it’s mine and your freedom. Like Legend said, you’re too narrowly focused, lately. It’s a very significant concept. Think it over. We are on your side.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:44 PM

You said my friend is less of a man for not going to jail/dying over a 10 mag clip.

I asked if you would be willing to do the same. Would you go to jail/ risk becoming felon over keeping the clip?

Would you fight to the death over it?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:58 PM

I asked if you would be willing to do the same. Would you go to jail/ risk becoming felon over keeping the clip?

Would you fight to the death over it?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:58 PM

The question that you’re struggling to vomit up is -

Are you willing to be disarmed, on the whim of the State?

We know your answer.

And, quite frankly, you’ve taken up far too much space on this thread.

OhEssYouCowboys on February 23, 2013 at 4:02 PM

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petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 4:03 PM

Nah, I only take you at your word.
When you made that crack about paleo-cons last night, I realized that I had been mistaken about you for the last few years.

I apologize for calling you a pretender though; It was my mistake thinking you were more conservative than you really are.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 3:44 PM

Yeah, I send being a “neocon is better than being a paleocon” in response to someone called Erika a neocon for saying she’s strong on national security.

This is in response to years of being called a neocon from Ron Paul kooks who at the same time are ok with letting IRan get the bomb and blaming AMerica.

Here’s some background on the Rand Paul and paleocon for you:

http://www.therightscoop.com/rand-paul-is-a-chip-off-the-old-paleocon-block/

I’d still support Rand at this point though as he’d be going up a bunch of GOPe wimps.

As for you, you’re nothing but a punk. Go ahead and get your head blown off over a 10 mag clip and then call the rest of us cowards for not doing the same.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:03 PM

The question that you’re struggling to vomit up is -

Are you willing to be disarmed, on the whim of the State?

We know your answer.

And, quite frankly, you’ve taken up far too much space on this thread.

OhEssYouCowboys on February 23, 2013 at 4:02 PM

It’s idiotic to die over a 10 mag clip.

If you don’t like my posts, then don’t respond. No loss here..

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:05 PM

And many will do that suffering in ignorance because they refused to even see where the hurt came from.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:48 PM

I’m sorry, perhaps I missed something…

So you’re suffering arms confiscations right now, as we speak? What did they take?

How many armed thugs came to your house and took your firearms?

I guess it’s time for me to risk all property, the lives and welfare of the women and children in my house for what happened that hasn’t even been appealed to SCOTUS for review yet?

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 4:06 PM

As for you, you’re nothing but a punk.
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:03 PM

People who know me would beg to differ.

But thanks for providing some background to that insult to paleocons….
Then you don’t despise them, Correct?

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 4:13 PM

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:41 AM

One of the reasons these kinds of measures are being proposed is that those who come up with them are not considering the consequences. And one of the reasons they feel that way is that there never ARE any consequences.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:46 AM

I lobby legislators on gun issues. When you sit across the desk with them and tell them the eventualities and they tell you they don’t care, you begin to learn Political Reality 101. I was responding to a comment that we just need to explain the situation to the OR legislators and the problem would go away. Been there, done that, and it doesn’t work. There are consequences but not everywhere. If there weren’t they would have come for the guns long ago.

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 4:16 PM

People who know me would beg to differ.

But thanks for providing some background to that insult to paleocons….
Then you don’t despise them, Correct?

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 4:13 PM

Again you attacked me for saying I’m not going to die to protect my guns and called me a phony.

Paleocons,I do despise them, especially the Ron Paul kooks.

Take it you’re one of them?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:18 PM

I guess it’s time for me to risk all property, the lives and welfare of the women and children in my house for what happened that hasn’t even been appealed to SCOTUS for review yet?

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 4:06 PM

If you don’t then you’re just a pretend conservative!!

Just ask all the wizards of smart on this thread!!

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:19 PM

And many will do that suffering in ignorance because they refused to even see where the hurt came from.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 3:48 PM

I’m sorry, perhaps I missed something…

So you’re suffering arms confiscations right now, as we speak? What did they take?

How many armed thugs came to your house and took your firearms?

I guess it’s time for me to risk all property, the lives and welfare of the women and children in my house for what happened that hasn’t even been appealed to SCOTUS for review yet?

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 4:06 PM

I live in California… Figure it out Wiley Coyote.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 4:20 PM

If you don’t then you’re just a pretend conservative!!

Just ask all the wizards of smart on this thread!!

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:19 PM

Believe me, I’m not saying there is never a time, but history says, we ain’t there yet.

Sometimes, though, when I close my eyes for more than a second or two, I fear what history will say when I open them back up.

I remain on alert.

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 4:25 PM

I guess it’s time for me to risk all property, the lives and welfare of the women and children in my house for what happened that hasn’t even been appealed to SCOTUS for review yet?

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 4:06 PM

… and it won’t matter as it makes its way up to SCOTUS because you will have surrendered those items years before and they will have long since been destroyed by the state. At which point, any options you had will have been taken away.

I can see how this happened in the past:

“Now children, yes, those are bad people on the street, just stay inside here for the night, and they will go away”.

“It’s just a little yellow cloth star, I’m not risking my life fighting having to wear that”.

“It’s just a sign, my friends will stick with me and I’m not going to risk my business by refusing to post it”

“Yes, they said we can’t keep guns, but I’m not risking my life or my family’s lives to hold on to them. We’ll just have to depend on the government and police to keep us safe”

“They came for Levi and his family yesterday. We couldn’t do anything about it, they took our guns years ago and besides, we couldn’t risk our lives”

“It’s OK children, just get in the train; we’ll be fine at our new location”

Look, I don’t have the exact answer of where to draw the line in the sand, nor the measures that individuals should take. I do know that we are Americans and we have ancestors who fought and died to prevent tyranny and now we aren’t willing to take some risks. Heck, look at how we reacted in the 70′s to the 55 MPH speed limit! This is even more freedom threatening and the response is, “if the law is passed, go ahead and turn in your magazines and guns, then fight it through the courts” After all, the Obama regime has always been responsive when the courts rule against any of its laws or orders. I also know that we are rapidly approaching that time when complying with government laws is only going to make us more vulnerable to additional tyranny while taking away options to resist, thus emboldening the tyrants.

AZfederalist on February 23, 2013 at 4:26 PM

It’s idiotic to die over a 10 mag clip.

If you don’t like my posts, then don’t respond. No loss here..

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:05 PM

I usually don’t waste my time and text on trolls, but you might want to consider this: It is not the capacity of the magazine the is at stake ultimately, but the loss of freedom because of the ability of the government to arbitrarily outlaw a component of a tool. That strikes at the foundation of liberty. Many are not in this fight because of the firearms they are proposing to ban, the capacity of magazines, or the desire to enact “universal background checks”, but we see a greater evil in the gun grab as a pretext for the encroachment of tyranny.

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 4:27 PM

Take it you’re one of them?
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:18 PM

You take it wrong.

As you have taken wrong everything about me today.

A bit ago you accused me of not knowing your history here at Hot Air.
I have called Ron Paul a loon quite consistently.

Although it appears that we have different definition of paleocons. I don’t consider any of those Libertarians or pseudo-libertarians to be conservative at all, other than their respect for the Constitution.

I’ll tell you what; I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that I misunderstood you if you will extend to me the same courtesy.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 4:27 PM

It’s idiotic to die over a 10 mag clip.

If you don’t like my posts, then don’t respond. No loss here..

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:05 PM

If they can tell you that you can’t have ten shots at a group of punks breaking into your home, what else can they tell you? What happens when they decide you can only have one magazine? When it becomes five shots? Three? None?

You’re not looking at the larger picture. They are focused on achieving a disarmed population, and they’re counting on people not being willing to die for the right to be otherwise.

For me, too much blood (in my own family, and otherwise) has been shed for my constitutional rights for me to act like a coward now.

And I’m a woman.

capitalist piglet on February 23, 2013 at 4:29 PM

AZfederalist on February 23, 2013 at 4:26 PM

I see your analogy but it’s not exactly the same thing:

COming to round up and kill all the Jews vs. confiscating certain types of guns.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:31 PM

If they can tell you that you can’t have ten shots at a group of punks breaking into your home, what else can they tell you? What happens when they decide you can only have one magazine? When it becomes five shots? Three? None?

You’re not looking at the larger picture. They are focused on achieving a disarmed population, and they’re counting on people not being willing to die for the right to be otherwise.

For me, too much blood (in my own family, and otherwise) has been shed for my constitutional rights for me to act like a coward now.

And I’m a woman.

capitalist piglet on February 23, 2013 at 4:29 PM

Ok, then answer this:

If you lived in NY state then would you be willing to die over keeping your 10 mag clip?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:33 PM

I do know that we are Americans and we have ancestors who fought and died to prevent tyranny and now we aren’t willing to take some risks.

AZfederalist on February 23, 2013 at 4:26 PM

How far can the Left push the American people? Pretty damned far, it would seem.

capitalist piglet on February 23, 2013 at 4:33 PM

Sanity check

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 4:35 PM

I see your analogy but it’s not exactly the same thing:

COming to round up and kill all the Jews vs. confiscating certain types of guns.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:31 PM

The only difference is incrementalism and timeline. They didn’t start out by coming to round up and kill all the Jews. They started out with intimidation and confiscating the firearms owned by the Jews. Then they proceeded to identification of all the Jews (registration), then they proceeded to extermination.

We just aren’t at the rounding up point. We are at the registering, restricting, and turning in firearms point.

I’m not liking the idea of complying with step 4 in order for them to be able to easily execute steps 5 and 6.

AZfederalist on February 23, 2013 at 4:35 PM

I see your analogy but it’s not exactly the same thing:

COming to round up and kill all the Jews vs. confiscating certain types of guns.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:31 PM

So you would fight to stop them from carting off the Jews to a death camp?

Stop them with what?

sharrukin on February 23, 2013 at 4:36 PM

I’d be LMFAO off if I lived somewhere else.

Dr. ZhivBlago on February 23, 2013 at 3:51 PM

For good reasons the rest of the world must laugh at the majority of dummies in the US, from both sides.

The troubles are all self-made. In a relatively free land the people always, always, always deserve the gov’t they elect.

p.s. I’m not so sure the last election was legit but we’ll never know.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 3:54 PM

I’m not sure, either but voter fraud on behalf of the Dems seems to have been becoming the norm for them for a long time now, and who’s going to actually do anything about it?

As for the self-made troubles, it’s not just the Dems. We’ve had social Conservatives making up BS laws for such a long time, that it’s become progressively easier for the State to enact whatever laws whenever they want.

In our once-Conservative dominated society, we apparently lost much sleep over people getting high in their homes, or having sex with prostitutes, or buying beer on Sundays, or having to put up a certain kind of mailbox, or roof or whatever…yes, a more safe, ordered society along moral/Biblical lines.

Well, it’s been coming back to bite us in the a$$. Perhaps a little more Libertarianism on our part is what was needed. I can’t believe most didn’t figure out at least 40 years ago that these Leftists were increasingly taking over and using the very groundwork of social legislation that had already been pioneered to take over and use it for their own brand of how people are supposed to live their lives.

Two things-we didn’t notice and didn’t care…it was about us being comfortable and making money. The Marxists were welcomed to take over publishing, the news media, the television media, Hollywood and Academia. Those are all meaningless, frivolous vocations to be involved with anyway. Right?

The other thing is that Reagan and both Bush’s being elected gave us a false sense of security, the idea that there was some kind of magical pendulum swinging back and forth between Liberty and Fascism, between being a Republic as our Forefathers intended or a progeny of the Enlightenment’s poor stepchild, Socialism.

Dr. ZhivBlago on February 23, 2013 at 4:37 PM

Would you fight to the death over it?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 3:58 PM

Yes

You have NO idea what tyranny is.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 4:38 PM

If you lived in NY state then would you be willing to die over keeping your 10 mag clip?

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:33 PM

I would keep the magazine. It’s up to the state to kill me over it (since you seem to be saying they’d do that).

capitalist piglet on February 23, 2013 at 4:38 PM

Paleocons,I do despise them, especially the Ron Paul kooks.
Take it you’re one of them?
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 4:18 PM

Oh, by the way, I DO consider myself and MARK LEVIN and Schadenfreude to be some of the few actual paleocons around. People BORN with conservative values and the willingness to stand up for them, no matter the inconvenience or the risk to life or property.

LegendHasIt on February 23, 2013 at 4:38 PM

The 2nd is there to protect the American people from tyranny.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 4:39 PM

I live in California… Figure it out Wiley Coyote.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 4:20 PM

Take it up with California, then, Elmer Fudd. I used to live there. I left. I live where I don’t have those issues.

So, Elmer, I’m suppose to deliberately risk putting my wife and daughter into poverty and possibly into a casket to wage what? against the United States Government because the freaks in Sacramento did too much acid in The Castro?

First of all, you’re incoherent.

Second, you refused to answer a few basic, fair, and reasonable questions earlier to bring me up to speed on your perspective on the Dorner thing. Lame dude, really f*(&*^g lame.

So, spare me your inability to carry on a discussion without the smartass name calling.

Saltysam on February 23, 2013 at 4:40 PM

I can’t quite believe this exchange.

If my country would kill me over my possession of a piece of plastic and a spring, let them f***ing DO IT.

I will not let my father’s blood be shed for nothing.

capitalist piglet on February 23, 2013 at 4:42 PM

Watch this and don’t let it happen to the American people.

Property and life in bondage ain’t worth it.

Schadenfreude on February 23, 2013 at 4:42 PM

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