Is Oregon writing the Worst. Gun. Law. Evah?

posted at 8:31 am on February 23, 2013 by Jazz Shaw

Living in New York, we’re no strangers to really restrictive new gun laws, but you sort of expect that out here. We may have some competition in the race to the bottom, though, if some legislators in Oregon have their way. In fact, if HB 3200 gets passed into law, you may as well pack up and leave the state if you have any interest in Second Amendment rights. Here’s the top line summary.

Creates crime of unlawful possession or transfer of assault weapon or large capacity magazine.
Punishes by maximum penalty of 10 years’ imprisonment, $250,000 fine, or both.
Requires current owners to dispose of or register assault weapons and large capacity magazines.

That should be bad enough on its own, but if you really dig into the guts of this bill, it actually gets worse. After spending quite a bit of ink defining “assault weapons” as pretty much anything with cosmetic attachments which look scary to somebody, we get to the meat of the proposal.

Any person who, prior to the effective date of this law, was legally in possession of an assault weapon or large capacity magazine shall, within 120 days after the effective date of this 2013 Act, without being subject to prosecution:
(a) Remove the assault weapon or large capacity magazine from the state;
(b) Sell the assault weapon or large capacity magazine to a firearms dealer licensed under 18 U.S.C. 923 for lawful sale or transfer under subsection (2) of this section;
(c) Surrender the assault weapon or large capacity magazine to a law enforcementagency for destruction;
(d) Render the assault weapon permanently inoperable;

Oh, wait… did I say that was the bad part. I think I actually meant to refer to this truly tasty treat near the very end. After specifying that even under grandfathering you can only have one “assault rifle” and three high capacity magazines, these high level edicts are handed down.

(3) The department shall create and maintain a registry for owners of assault weapons and large capacity magazines who qualify for registration under section 4 of this 2013 Act. The department may adopt rules concerning the administration of the registry, including but not limited to renewal and revocation procedures and storage requirements for assault weapons and large capacity magazines.
(4) The department may conduct inspections of registered owners of assault weapons andlarge capacity magazines to ensure compliance with the storage requirements of section 4of this 2013 Act.
SECTION 6. This 2013 Act being necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health and safety, an emergency is declared to exist, and this 2013 Act takes effect on its passage.

For all the talk I hear from gun control proponents this year about how universal background checks won’t lead to some sort of gun registry, it certainly seems like there are a lot of lawmakers who are interested in doing precisely that wherever they can. (Referring to (3) above that is.) And when it comes to (4) what can we say? We are assured on a daily basis that the authorities aren’t coming to kick down the doors of gun owners, but out in Oregon they are clearly opening the door to unscheduled, uninvited visits to people on the list.

And this is so important… so critical.. so vital… that a state of emergency must be declared to exist so the law will go into effect immediately without any period of review or challenges. Now tell me again why we’re all paranoid crazies making up fantasies about the government?

Update (Ed): Patriot Perspective’s Short Timer adds his own thoughts on this topic, and reminds us what Oregon Democrats think of gun-rights supporters:

But remember, Oregon Democrats like Lee Coleman have assured us that this kind of thing is just paranoid delusion from some people in “Kansas or whatever” so “go screw yourself.”


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Man, what others felonies can get a person a 10 year prison stretch in Oregon?

For peace of mind to all you folks in Oregon, and Missouri which is contemplating a similar bill, y’all can ship those banned weapons down to Texas. We will find them a good, loving, home.

cozmo on February 23, 2013 at 8:38 AM

As certain as the sun rising in the east:

Universal background checks –> gun registration –> gun taxation/restrictions/confiscation

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 8:39 AM

Resist we must. Democrats need to purge the fascists from their party. Otherwise, there is nothing to talk about.

rbj on February 23, 2013 at 8:39 AM

Treason!

losarkos on February 23, 2013 at 8:40 AM

“Get all the fools on your side and you can be elected to anything.” –Frank Dane

Archivarix on February 23, 2013 at 8:42 AM

Man, you rarely get 10 years for murder,but just be prepared to stop a runaway Tyrant and they throw the book a you! I m pretty sure that I see where this is going, and if it does, dollars to donuts where will not be an election in 2020.

rgranger on February 23, 2013 at 8:42 AM

They are getting the storage inspection idea from some organization. Possibly Brady, or possibly a foreign nation, their goal is banning firearms one step at a time.

jpmn on February 23, 2013 at 8:47 AM

rbj on February 23, 2013 at 8:39 AM

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO…..

That HAS to be satire, right?

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 8:48 AM

I’m paraphrasing, but I believe there was a scene in Wyatt Earp where there’s a large group of townfolk that want to lynch somebody, and only Earp stands in their way.

One of the men in the crowd says something to the effect of “He’s only got six bullets, he can’t get all of us.”

And Earp cocks the hammer of his revolver and says “Fine by me. Which six of you want to die?”

The crowd disperses.

I have no idea if that’s historically accurate, but it’s a great scene.

That seems to be the attitude gun owners are going to have to start adopting. You want our guns? Come get them. Just let me know which sacrificial lambs you want to send to get them. May not get all of you, but we will get some of you.

Or better yet, make these Democratic lawmakers go door to door trying to confiscate weapons.

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 8:49 AM

Hey, nobody’s talking about confiscating your guns you guys. Except for the people who are talking about confiscating your guns.

JohnBrown on February 23, 2013 at 8:50 AM

Why bother with laws? They’ll say that guns negatively impact health, and therefore they can just let Sec. Sibelius make the edict as part of a “the Secretary shall determine” Obamacare fiat. No need for this messy “voting” stuff.

bofh on February 23, 2013 at 8:53 AM

I am sure it has taken these “law makers” more than 3 hours to write this “law” Careful and remember the warning Viagra provides. If you erection last more than 3 hours, call your doctor or, look at a image of Pelosi.

BobK on February 23, 2013 at 8:54 AM

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 8:49 AM

Here it is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=co5xVHsMRV0

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 8:59 AM

What is this supposed to prevent again?

Count to 10 on February 23, 2013 at 9:00 AM

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 8:59 AM

Wyatt Earp? Are we still allowed to watch that anymore?

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:01 AM

What part of Texas is Oregon in?

docflash on February 23, 2013 at 9:03 AM

they’re just blowing right through all of the Bill of Rights at breakneck sped now that King Puppy Chow-Down has been re-elected. because like the 2nd amendment, the 4th amendment is just a giant hinderance when it comes to building Utopia , saving poor innocent children, and stopping climate change. and certainly getting rid of the 2nd and 4th amendment from that tired old document written by long dead guys creates jobs, or something.( some one has to confiscate all those legally owned guns…)

does that mean his entire presidency is just a ‘crisis- or artificial, manufactured crisis- that must not got to waste’? i thought it was the best, most glorious presidency/messiahship the world has ever known?

another glaring problem in all this freedom grabbing is that when actual criminals use any sort of firearm to kill people, their violations of any gun laws are the first charges dropped, pled down, or never even considered. these fascist goons, using manipulative histrionics, make restrictive gun laws they say to save lives. and when someone illegally takes a life, well, the gun laws never seem to be applied to them. which just proves that gun control restrictions aren’t ever meant to be about the rule of law but are simply meant to trump the 2nd amendment.

mittens on February 23, 2013 at 9:05 AM

Just because conservatives seem a little paranoid doesn’t mean the liberals aren’t out to grab our guns…

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 9:08 AM

What if they wrote a law and no one complied?

Liam on February 23, 2013 at 9:08 AM

Registration——Confiscation—–Extermnation…

REGISTER NOTHING!

Kuffar on February 23, 2013 at 9:09 AM

Wow… One of those home inspections is likely to go bad pretty fast. Police departments don’t even do the drugs raids well.

myrenovations on February 23, 2013 at 9:10 AM

Wait until President Obama starts her first term.

After a brief but brilliant career serving in the US Senate from Illinois (following the prison term of her likely rival for the Senate seat Jesse Jackson, Jr.). Senator Michelle Obama was sworn in as the nations 46th President today. Obama immediately signed an Executive order banning the sale and production of all firearms in the U.S. Globally, UN Secretary General Barack Obama hailed the action as this global power couple began their campaign for Universal individual disarmament and “human security”.

Oregon?……..meh.

PappyD61 on February 23, 2013 at 9:10 AM

SECTION 6. This 2013 Act being necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health and safety, an emergency is declared to exist, and this 2013 Act takes effect on its passage.

The “emergency” should be examining the mental health of these Oregon legislators. “Preservation of the public peace”??? Responsible gun owners in Oregon should organize a peaceful demonstration at their statehouse and sign petitions of impeachment for every one of these gestapo zealots.

Rovin on February 23, 2013 at 9:11 AM

What if they wrote a law and no one complied?

Liam on February 23, 2013 at 9:08 AM

That’s why they want to get into our homes to inspect for them. They know most people won’t otherwise comply.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:13 AM

What if they wrote a law and no one complied?

Then you’d be called Mr. President.

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 9:13 AM

Just because conservatives seem a little paranoid doesn’t mean the liberals aren’t out to grab our guns…

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 9:08 AM

working link

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 9:14 AM

Too bad the links I posted don’t work…but the image is at moonbattery.

In any event this gun grab is fascist lunacy

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 9:15 AM

The Democrats have taken a poll and believe they can Rahm anything they want through with little or no opposition, after all, who doesn’t want to protect the children.

I hope those low information voters understand this is what they voted for. Thanks to Pravda and Izvestia, none of them understand the constitution, the 2nd amendment, and why it’s important for them to have gun rights. God help us if the Democrats get away with this. Remember, the Gestapo was part of a socialist state.

bflat879 on February 23, 2013 at 9:16 AM

Oregon is no worse than Maryland…

I can attest to that.

Gatsu on February 23, 2013 at 9:16 AM

Attention, General Zod!

You still looking for someplace where you can yell “KNEEL!” and the people will comply with virtually no resistance whatsover?

HAVE I GOT A STATE FOR YOU!!!!!

pilamaye on February 23, 2013 at 9:17 AM

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 8:49 AM

It is a really important point that I believe gun owners are not considering seriously enough – that, at some point, someone is going to have to actually kill someone else. Someone is going to have to die. Actually, a LOT of someones. And those someones are going to have to be Law Enforcement Officers.

I don’t think we have considered this enough.

At some point we either give up our weapons and our last defense against total submission to an oligarchy or a line must be crossed that most of us have never crossed before.

It’s fine to talk about resistance but let’s get serious here. Who actually has the stones to do such a thing? Because that’s what is going to have to be done.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:18 AM

Yay, more warrantless searches! Chipping away at the Fourth Amendment is fun, fun, fun!!

NorthernCross on February 23, 2013 at 9:19 AM

The White House is creating these pieces of gun legislation for states – democrats in California, New York and now Oregon have proposed such bills, but, these states are not doing this independently. The White House and DOJ are providing the framework, and state democrats are filling in the details. This is a coordinated effort by obama to destroy the 2nd Amendment.

Pork-Chop on February 23, 2013 at 9:21 AM

In a rare case of absurdity, in Oregon not shooting someone will have a harsher penalty than shooting someone.

Sgt Steve on February 23, 2013 at 9:22 AM

What if they wrote a law and no one complied?

Turning perfectly honest citizens into felons—one new law at a time. It’s what liberal thug-acracies do.

Rovin on February 23, 2013 at 9:23 AM

Regulation, Confiscation, Subjugation, Extermination

Philly on February 23, 2013 at 9:23 AM

Moonbat legislation has consequences…

“A growing number of firearm and firearm-related companies have stated they will no longer sell items to states, counties, cities and municipalities that restrict their citizens’ rights to own them.

According to The Police Loophole, 34 companies have joined in publicly stating that governments who seek to restrict 2nd Amendment rights will themselves be restricted from purchasing the items they seek to limit or ban…”

http://cnsnews.com/blog/gregory-gwyn-williams-jr/firearms-companies-restricting-sales-government-agencies-areas

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 9:23 AM

Resist we must. Democrats need to purge the fascists from their party. Otherwise, there is nothing to talk about.

rbj on February 23, 2013 at 8:39 AM

yeah that would be nice. the entire democrat party would vanish in a flash. think the rapture but for a-holes and would be tyrants.

bannor on February 23, 2013 at 9:25 AM

The White House and DOJ are providing the framework, and state democrats are filling in the details. This is a coordinated effort by obama to destroy the 2nd Amendment.

Pork-Chop on February 23, 2013 at 9:21 AM

They’re shifting the Overton Window, which puts us in a losing defensive position. Somehow we need to counterattack with an Overton Window shifter of our own.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:26 AM

Wow… One of those home inspections is likely to go bad pretty fast. Police departments don’t even do the drugs raids well.

myrenovations on February 23, 2013 at 9:10 AM

Uh huh…
Much is going bad..and pretty fast.
By design.

Man, what others felonies can get a person a 10 year prison stretch in Oregon?

cozmo on February 23, 2013 at 8:38 AM

heh..murderer’s,pedophiles,and more get lesser sentences.

As certain as the sun rising in the east:

Universal background checks –> gun registration –> gun taxation/restrictions/confiscation

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 8:39 AM

Si Senor.

bazil9 on February 23, 2013 at 9:27 AM

The other big lie from the gun grabbing Democrat pigs is that they don’t want to grab our guns. No. To such a “smart” Democrat like Biden, we’re to commit a criminal act with them.

Jerks.

Steve Tsouloufis on February 23, 2013 at 9:28 AM

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:26 AM

Any ideas?

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:30 AM

If this monstrosity passes I see two things happening. 1) The state of Oregon will have to put on their big boy litigation pants, because all their other trousers will be sued off and 2) Lots of terrible boating accidents where firearms are “accidentally” lost in a deep lake, river or the Pacific. Such a sad, but frequent occurrence when Big Brother demands compliance with registration and eventual confiscation.

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:31 AM

In a rare case of absurdity, in Oregon not shooting someone will have a harsher penalty than shooting someone.

Sgt Steve on February 23, 2013 at 9:22 AM

This

Turning perfectly honest citizens into felons—one new law at a time. It’s what liberal thug-acracies do.

Rovin on February 23, 2013 at 9:23 AM

And This.

bazil9 on February 23, 2013 at 9:33 AM

It’s fine to talk about resistance but let’s get serious here. Who actually has the stones to do such a thing? Because that’s what is going to have to be done.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:18 AM

Doesn’t need to be that way. I think the easiest way to work this out is probably to visit with the representatives who write these bills. Explain to them that their policies are endangering your family and therefore are endangering their own.

Certainly shooting up officers at your own front door is not a winning strategy, tactically, strategically or politically.

ROCnPhilly on February 23, 2013 at 9:33 AM

Again… notice how the libs operate. It was just about 2 years ago or so that the Supreme Court re-affirmed the 2nd Amendment. Justice Scalia wrote the majority opinion and did it in a big bold way.

But to the libs.. it never happened because it was a ruling they didn’t like. Even when they lose, they push on like they didn’t.
But the Republicans? Even when they win.. they concede. This is why we lose.

We don’t lose because the left is better, brighter or smarter. We lose because our leaders are cowards and appeasers. They have no vision. No fire. No passion. Nothing.

The Barbarians are not winning because they have more numbers. Or because they have better funding. Or because they have a better message. They win because they are barbarians and they are fighting against sheep. The Republican leadership does not want to get into the embarrassing business of the truth. The truth on social issues. The truth on who the left is. They want to keep the argument “reasonable.” The barbarians want world domination. The sheep want to talk about jobs.

Because the GOP has avoided the fight of the fundamentals of self government and liberty… we now are threatened with the loss of self government and our liberty as well as jobs. Why? Because there has been no national clear united message about liberty coming from the GOP. The barbarians have been in control, more or less, of the message since Reagan.

I did not watch the video of Ann Coulter and John Stousell debating. The thought of that public debate made me sick! We are at a war for the survival of our nation and Republicans are arguing with each other.

If the GOP ever got itself united around a clear message of liberty and freedom and how that creates a great nation, a great economy and more for everyone.. while exposing the lies of the left… we would win. We would win in places like California and New York!

Tyranny has been around in various forms from the beginning of time! People risked their lives fleeing it to come here! People immigrated here from all over the world for the past 250 years for freedom! Freedom to worship! Freedom to work! Freedom to own property! Freedom to be left alone! Not for government benefits. They had those benefits in the countries they left!

When people fled the soviet block they were fleeing all that the leftists want to give us! Free health care, free housing, the right to a job, the right to a vacation, free everything… except the freedom to live, worship and the freedom of self government.

You cannot accurately say that the nation has abandoned the American dream when the American dream has not been on the menu the past 20 years!

I’ll end with this. There is another reason the GOP elite wants to fight like sheep. If they start exposing the truth, start using the truth, start defending the core principles of self government and liberty and how that creates true happiness, freedom, jobs and a strong economy.. if they fought with passion and lit a fire .. well.. fires can spread and get out of control. Passion awakes souls. The people of this nation are like a sleeping giant. If you wake that sleeping giant and light a fire.. you never know where it might lead (thus their hatred of the TEA party). Too many fires might get lit and too many people might realize they should have a say in government. The elites don’t want that. They might lose their positions of power. Better to fight like sheep, keep things “reasonable” and work with the barbarians. Maybe you’re just a sheep.. but at least your at the the top of the sheep.

JellyToast on February 23, 2013 at 9:34 AM

Any ideas?

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:30 AM

None that seem workable. What comes to mind is introducing legislation requiring people to train, qualify, buy and keep guns or pay into an insurance pool (like Obamacare?). But I’m sure, with a little thought, we can do better than that.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:36 AM

Why bother with laws? They’ll say that guns negatively impact health, and therefore they can just let Sec. Sibelius make the edict as part of a “the Secretary shall determine” Obamacare fiat. No need for this messy “voting” stuff.

bofh on February 23, 2013 at 8:53 AM

I’m in healthcare. Don’t think for one second this is a route they haven’t been exploring for some time now.

Aviator on February 23, 2013 at 9:36 AM

ROCnPhilly on February 23, 2013 at 9:33 AM

I like it.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:38 AM

We all know where this is headed. We all know what will eventually happen. Just be prepared.

bgibbs1000 on February 23, 2013 at 9:39 AM

Incredible……of course the program was kept secret…

“The University of Iowa may have broken federal guidelines by sharing with the local sheriff’s department private information about students who apply for campus gun permits.

Under the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act, public universities are required to keep secret personal information on students, such as their grades and addresses. But Iowa has been sending personal information regarding students who apply for campus gun permits to the sheriff’s office.

That information includes whether students received bad grades, or were exhibiting signs of depression or anger…

The policy dates back to a campus shooting in 1991, when a mentally disturbed graduate student killed himself and five others.

But the policy probably violates FERPA, according to the Des Moines Register.

“This is incredibly alarming,” said Justin Dedecker, a graduate student who sought a gun permit in 2011, in statement. “How does my performance in class become an indicator of my mental stability?”

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/02/22/university-discloses-students-grades-disciplinary-history-when-they-apply-for-gun-permits/#ixzz2LjW8NbFO

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 9:39 AM

None that seem workable. What comes to mind is introducing legislation requiring people to train, qualify, buy and keep guns or pay into an insurance pool (like Obamacare?). But I’m sure, with a little thought, we can do better than that.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:36 AM

No. That is simply accepting their premise.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:40 AM

This is primarily to appease the freaks in Portlandistan. The rest of OR is pretty damn conservative AND, everyone owns at least one gun. This will not end well.

Mr. Arrogant on February 23, 2013 at 9:40 AM

Doesn’t need to be that way. I think the easiest way to work this out is probably to visit with the representatives who write these bills. Explain to them that their policies are endangering your family and therefore are endangering their own.

If you mean that legislators will suffer with the rest of us should this kind on nonsense pass, think again. Tyrants always find a way to exempt themselves. If you are threatening them, well, you are on your own there.

And, please study history and find a time when pointing out the idiocy of pending actions stopped a tyrant. If you find it, please share it with the rest of us. That just does not happen.

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:41 AM

What if they wrote a law and no one complied?

Liam on February 23, 2013 at 9:08 AM

They did…it is called illegal immigration.

trs on February 23, 2013 at 9:42 AM

Because the GOP has avoided the fight of the fundamentals of self government and liberty… we now are threatened with the loss of self government and our liberty as well as jobs. Why? Because there has been no national clear united message about liberty coming from the GOP. The barbarians have been in control, more or less, of the message since Reagan.

JellyToast on February 23, 2013 at 9:34 AM

I could not agree more. We could have won the last election, had we made it about the big issues. Instead we played small-ball… and got beat by the master of that game.

Either the GOP doesn’t understand what we’re up against, or they’re afraid to admit it because of the bold measures it would require.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:44 AM

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:41 AM

One of the reasons these kinds of measures are being proposed is that those who come up with them are not considering the consequences. And one of the reasons they feel that way is that there never ARE any consequences.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:46 AM

If this monstrosity passes I see two things happening. 1) The state of Oregon will have to put on their big boy litigation pants, because all their other trousers will be sued off and 2) Lots of terrible boating accidents where firearms are “accidentally” lost in a deep lake, river or the Pacific. Such a sad, but frequent occurrence when Big Brother demands compliance with registration and eventual confiscation.

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:31 AM

Oh it’ll pass and in less than 10 years the second amendment will be overturned by the Supreme Court in some convoluted ruling similar to Roberts ruling on Marxist Care.

bgibbs1000 on February 23, 2013 at 9:46 AM

I don’t think we can win any more debates with the people who voted for dear leader the first and second time. We are outnumbered and they are in charge. Reason, logic, and sanity are somehow missing in the genes of these people and I want what I want from the govt and it’s free for me has replaced any thought of how all this ‘stuff’ is going to be paid for. The people of Greece have to know their country is near the bottom of the funnel, but they still resist any austerity measures that could save their country. If we claim that they will have to pry our guns from our cold dead fingers, they claim that we will have to pry free govt stuff from their cold dead fingers. We will never win this argument.

Kissmygrits on February 23, 2013 at 9:48 AM

cold dead hands come to mind…

unseen on February 23, 2013 at 9:48 AM

Remember the republicans in Oregon who support this bill:

Representatives BAILEY, BUCKLEY, DEMBROW, FREDERICK, READ, REARDON, TOMEI, Senators , DINGFELDER, HASS, MONNES- ANDERSON, MONROE, SHIELDS, STEINER- HAYWARD.

Amjean on February 23, 2013 at 9:48 AM

If you mean that legislators will suffer with the rest of us should this kind on nonsense pass, think again. Tyrants always find a way to exempt themselves. If you are threatening them, well, you are on your own there.

And, please study history and find a time when pointing out the idiocy of pending actions stopped a tyrant. If you find it, please share it with the rest of us. That just does not happen.

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:41 AM

Though they might try, they would never be able to completely protect themselves and their families from the retribution of a vengeful citizenry. They need to realize that people will not blame the police, though they have some responsibility, but the leaders.

That is not a threat, but the truth. They should take heed.

ROCnPhilly on February 23, 2013 at 9:50 AM

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 8:49 AM

It is a really important point that I believe gun owners are not considering seriously enough – that, at some point, someone is going to have to actually kill someone else. Someone is going to have to die. Actually, a LOT of someones. And those someones are going to have to be Law Enforcement Officers.

I don’t think we have considered this enough.

At some point we either give up our weapons and our last defense against total submission to an oligarchy or a line must be crossed that most of us have never crossed before.

It’s fine to talk about resistance but let’s get serious here. Who actually has the stones to do such a thing? Because that’s what is going to have to be done.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:18 AM

FOWG1 on February 23, 2013 at 9:50 AM

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:46 AM

Agreed. How about free guns to people who qualify? Like Obamaphones. :)

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:52 AM

Democrats need to purge the fascists from their party

I guess you haven’t been paying attention. Democrats ARE fascists.

single stack on February 23, 2013 at 9:52 AM

This isn’t just about a hellacious jail term for merely owning a particular firearm, this is literally about treating law abiding citizens who’ve not been convicted of anything, like parolees.

Who else gets random searches without a warrant?

GeeWhiz on February 23, 2013 at 9:52 AM

Kissmygrits on February 23, 2013 at 9:48 AM

bullcrap.

We are outnumbered and they are in charge. Reason, logic, and sanity are somehow missing in the genes of these people

bullcrap.

the correct term is we are leaderless. We are not out numbered we are fractured. reason logic and sanity have not been taught in schools for an entire generation why would you expect to find it in that generation. Reason logic and sanity are not inherieted from “genes” it is taught much like civilization is not a “normal state” but one that must be taught, grown and expanded.

What we have here is the “leaders” of the government has made a systematic effort over the last at least 40 years to destroy our country and rebuild it in their image. while this effort was ongoing most people ignored it or tactfully agreed with it. Not the effort is bearing fruit wioth ignorant youth, and a society that has not the ability to use logic to reason. they have turned the wovles into the sheep. To change that we must educate the sheep to the fact that they are really the wovles. It isn’t easy and I think more pain will be needed before the sheep wake up. But it is starting to happen and remember it is always darkest before the dawn.

unseen on February 23, 2013 at 9:54 AM

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:52 AM

You spoke of the Overton Window, a political concept that entails moving the dialog to a point where an idea has sufficient public acceptance in order to be viable, right?

Well, as long as the public thinks along the lines of no consequences for eliminating a Constitutional right, we are in the defensive position.

What needs to be moved is public perception and nothing moves public perception quite like fear does. Just the discussion of the …um…consequences, might be useful right about now.

Remember, Martin Luther King’s role in the civil rights movement was important but those pictures of H. Rap Brown and his buddies on court house steps with loaded shotguns had a very powerful visceral affect on public perception as well.

As long as they think that gun rights advocates will keep their resistance to a few blogs and internet message boards, they will continue to go forward with their plans.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:00 AM

F&*king communists.

I hope they start off the “campaign for safety” and the cleansing of the impure and weak in your state.

Enjoy your serfdom. Don’t worry, no one was killed in your conquest. You just gave yourself up like the cowardly wankers you are.

acyl72 on February 23, 2013 at 10:01 AM

Why bother with laws? They’ll say that guns negatively impact health, and therefore they can just let Sec. Sibelius make the edict as part of a “the Secretary shall determine” Obamacare fiat. No need for this messy “voting” stuff.

bofh on February 23, 2013 at 8:53 AM

I’m in healthcare. Don’t think for one second this is a route they haven’t been exploring for some time now.

Aviator on February 23, 2013 at 9:36 AM

Amen. And since it’s involved with health, your Doctor (well, regular folks aren’t going to actually get to see real Doctor Doctors, but your “health care provider”, a TSA-caliber government drone armed with a terminal logged into the expert-system that will dictate all medical practice…) damn well better ask you if you have a gun at home, or he’ll risk his payment, or perhaps his freedom from some sort of prosecution. They’ll have to comply, one way or the other, eventually. And don’t even think of lying to a federal officer…

bofh on February 23, 2013 at 10:01 AM

That seems to be the attitude gun owners are going to have to start adopting. You want our guns? Come get them. Just let me know which sacrificial lambs you want to send to get them. May not get all of you, but we will get some of you.

Or better yet, make these Democratic lawmakers go door to door trying to confiscate weapons.

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 8:49 AM

Well, you see, the problem is, that the Marxists who have stolen our government right out from under our noses, are might damned good at indoctrination and brain washing. I absolutely guarantee you that they have hundreds of thousands of well trained, highly motivated Police Officers, Sheriffs and Marshall’s (not even counting all of the various State National Guard Members) who will proudly step up to be the “Sacrificial Lamps” you speak of.

This you need to be 100 percent perfectly crystal clear on, when the time does come, and those Marxist self anointed Aristocrats in Mordor on the Potomac finally do send the Ring Gun Wraiths out to confiscate your firearms, it absolutely positively will be your local Police Officer, Sheriff, or Marshal, backed up by your States National Guard members who physically knocks at your door and physically confiscate your firearms. It absolutely will not be some nameless faceless bureaucrat from Washington who shows up to do it.

And those Police Officers, Sheriffs and Marshals, yea, they have been indoctrinated their entire lives to sacrifice themselves without a single thought on the alter of preserving the authority of the Law Enforcement Community and the State.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:02 AM

You spoke of the Overton Window, a political concept that entails moving the dialog to a point where an idea has sufficient public acceptance in order to be viable, right?

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:00 AM

I think it’s more the idea of shifting the norms of public perception and acceptance, so a previously “out-there” policy now slides through as being mainstream.

bofh on February 23, 2013 at 10:05 AM

InTheBellyoftheBeast on February 23, 2013 at 9:41 AM

One of the reasons these kinds of measures are being proposed is that those who come up with them are not considering the consequences. And one of the reasons they feel that way is that there never ARE any consequences.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:46 AM

The liberal plan is to disarm american citizens within a generation?

“Now, the Chief of Police in my hometown of San Diego has unwittingly unveiled the real goal behind this movement: The complete disarming of Americans.

The details are offered by Breitbart writer Awr Hawkins:

San Diego Police Chief William Lansdowne is fully supportive of the Obama/Feinstein gun grab, and says if lawmakers play it right Americans can be completely disarmed within “a generation.”

Lansdowne has gone on record saying: “I could not be more supportive of the president for taking the position he has. I think it’s courageous with the politics involved in this process. [And] I think it’s going to eventually make the country safer.”

He made it clear that it may take “a generation,” but new laws could eventually take all guns off the streets…”

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/01/san-diegos-top-cop-we-can-disarm-americans-within-a-generation/

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 10:05 AM

This isn’t just about a hellacious jail term for merely owning a particular firearm, this is literally about treating law abiding citizens who’ve not been convicted of anything, like parolees.

Who else gets random searches without a warrant?

GeeWhiz on February 23, 2013 at 9:52 AM

Happens at airports across the nation everyday?

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 10:08 AM

Phoenix7 on February 23, 2013 at 8:49 AM

It is a really important point that I believe gun owners are not considering seriously enough – that, at some point, someone is going to have to actually kill someone else. Someone is going to have to die. Actually, a LOT of someones. And those someones are going to have to be Law Enforcement Officers.

I don’t think we have considered this enough.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 9:18 AM

Oh, I assure you, some of us have considered it. Not only have some of us considered it, but in the wake of the Christopher Dorner tragedy, and the staggeringly massive near mindless support by the vast majority of supposed conservatives here, of the Police in that case, some of us have gone from thinking America had a fighting chance, to believing that our very own so called fellow Conservatives will be the very first one to call the police and report on their neighbors for having illegal scary assault weapons.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:10 AM

Favorite Movie Quote from “Last Stand at Saber River with Tom Selleck.

Rustler: “Look, he can’t get us all.”

Cable to Head Rustler: “You’re first, your son’s next, do you really care what happens after that?”

Bulletchaser on February 23, 2013 at 10:11 AM

Well, as long as the public thinks along the lines of no consequences for eliminating a Constitutional right, we are in the defensive position.

What needs to be moved is public perception and nothing moves public perception quite like fear does. Just the discussion of the …um…consequences, might be useful right about now.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:00 AM

Yes, legal and extralegal consequences, and propel that message over the heads of the gatekeeper media.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 10:13 AM

Why can’t the gunowners in Oregon, NY, and any other state band together and all find representation?

Find some good lawyers and everyone chips in for the cost. Find a lawyer who believes in the Constitution and fight this law/sue these Commie pigs for flushing the 2nd Amendment down the toilet!!

Seriously why wouldn’t this work? Couldn’t cases like this get elevated all the way to the Supreme Court?

The right to bear arms is pretty clear. It gives us the right own guns, it doesn’t give the gov’t the right to declare which guns we can have and which ones to take away.

Even worse, these commie pigs are violating the unreasonable search and seizure part of the Constitution.

If these laws are allowed to stand then the Constitution should be tossed in the shredder.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:14 AM

He made it clear that it may take “a generation,” but new laws could eventually take all guns off the streets…”

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/01/san-diegos-top-cop-we-can-disarm-americans-within-a-generation/

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 10:05 AM

And yet the so called conservative majority here at Hot Air are utterly unable to understand why so many Californians voiced support for Christopher Dorner. It wasn’t because they approved of Dorner’s murdering innocent people. It was because they know how corrupt and untrustworthy the cops here in California are.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:15 AM

Jury nullification. Just try getting a group of twelve to send somebody to prison for violating an unjust law. And don’t think that the government can stack the jury, either. Those are grounds for an appeal, not to mention voter backlash. You would be surprised at how many conservative-minded people there are on the west coast.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:16 AM

Even worse, these commie pigs are violating the unreasonable search and seizure part of the Constitution.

If these laws are allowed to stand then the Constitution should be tossed in the shredder.
it’s time for civil war.
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Fixed.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:19 AM

Jury nullification. Just try getting a group of twelve to send somebody to prison for violating an unjust law. And don’t think that the government can stack the jury, either. Those are grounds for an appeal, not to mention voter backlash. You would be surprised at how many conservative-minded people there are on the west coast.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:16 AM

Put your crack pipe down and back slowly away from it. No matter what happens, the Fifth Column Treasonous Media will frame every single incident as a repeat of the Christopher Dorner tragedy, and 99% of all the supposed good patriotic conservatives will drink the Kool-aid and believe whatever they are told to believe, and they will surrender even faster than their liberal neighbors.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:21 AM

Why can’t the gunowners conservatives in Oregon, NY, and any other state band together and all find representation?

Find some good lawyers and everyone chips in for the cost. Find a lawyer who believes in the Constitution and fight…

If these laws are allowed to stand then the Constitution should be tossed in the shredder.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Well, there it is, LF. That’s the elephant in the room.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:21 AM

This isn’t just about a hellacious jail term for merely owning a particular firearm, this is literally about treating law abiding citizens who’ve not been convicted of anything, like parolees.

Who else gets random searches without a warrant?

GeeWhiz on February 23, 2013 at 9:52 AM

Happens at airports across the nation everyday?

workingclass artist on February 23, 2013 at 10:08 AM

Yeah, like stopping potential hijackers is the same as violating a person’s home and property. Great argument there, sport.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:22 AM

I wonder how many of the supporters of this crap think there will be little resistance, by a handful of ‘troublemakers’ that can easily be handled by police. Cynically, it’s easy to say the people will roll over and comply. But what if they don’t, what if resistance is widespread and cops get killed in large numbers?

Surely these Democrats don’t have a Plan B because they can’t conceive their law would be fought. Maybe the ‘emergency’ nature of the bill is because they expect a high rate turn-in before the matter reaches the courts. But if that doesn’t pan out, and if cops get hurt en masse, what do these gun-grabbers do next?

I like to think a lot of people are going to be very surprised.

Liam on February 23, 2013 at 10:23 AM

If these laws are allowed to stand then the Constitution should be tossed in the shredder.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Well, there it is, LF. That’s the elephant in the room.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:21 AM

News Flash to the not quiet so bright. These laws ARE the US Constitution being thrown into the shredder.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:24 AM

Even worse, these commie pigs are violating the unreasonable search and seizure part of the Constitution.

If these laws are allowed to stand then the Constitution should be tossed in the shredder.
it’s time for civil war.
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Fixed.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:19 AM

Wrong answer. Taking up arms to fight the gov’t will only result in the army killing us.

We need to fight this legally, not on the battlefield.

Your suggestion is a suicide mission.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:24 AM

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:10 AM

You have to admit that if Donner’s argument had been more along the lines of what we are discussing here, and if his methods hadn’t involved first killing two innocents, he might have had more defenders here, no?

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:26 AM

News Flash to the not quiet so bright. These laws ARE the US Constitution being thrown into the shredder.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:24 AM

So why not say enough is enough and find some lawyers to fight this on constitutional grounds?

Are you saying I’m not that bright??

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:26 AM

I like to think a lot of people are going to be very surprised.

Liam on February 23, 2013 at 10:23 AM

They will indeed be surprised, but not be the right putting up any resistance, but by who it was that turned them in to the new Gestapo.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:26 AM

Well, there it is, LF. That’s the elephant in the room.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:21 AM

I hear ya, but maybe enough of these dems and liberals in these states will finally get the message and stand up against tyranny for a change.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:27 AM

Either the GOP doesn’t understand what we’re up against, or they’re afraid to admit it because of the bold measures it would require.

petefrt on February 23, 2013 at 9:44 AM

OR, the GOP is in it up to their necks and is distracting the rest of us from forming a real solution. Nah, that would be conspiratorial.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:27 AM

They will indeed be surprised, but not be the right putting up any resistance, but by who it was that turned them in to the new Gestapo.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:26 AM

Well, that comes later if things like this unconstitutional law are allowed to stand and be expanded in other areas. We saw that with some on the Left when their taxes went up on January 1, that ‘this wasn’t supposed to happen to me‘ realization kicked them in the head.

Liam on February 23, 2013 at 10:29 AM

We need to fight this legally, not on the battlefield.

Your suggestion is a suicide mission.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:24 AM

And when the political process has been so far corrupted that legal procedures are useless? What then?

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:29 AM

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:24 AM

So why not say enough is enough and find some lawyers to fight this on constitutional grounds?

Are you saying I’m not that bright??

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:26 AM

What I am saying is, I do not believe3 you have any idea what we are up against, or how far it has already gone.

SWalker on February 23, 2013 at 10:30 AM

I hear ya, but maybe enough of these dems and liberals in these states will finally get the message and stand up against tyranny for a change.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:27 AM

Never gonna happen,LF. Those people are the ones who have brought us to this point.

Cleombrotus on February 23, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Tom, George, Ben, John, et al….

Thanks guys. I know you tried. It was a brilliant and unprecedented effort, but 200 years is about all you got out of it. Human beings are too stupid to truly understand freedom. All it takes is one generation and the whole thing goes to sh!t.

Maybe in another life…

somewhatconcerned on February 23, 2013 at 10:31 AM

Even worse, these commie pigs are violating the unreasonable search and seizure part of the Constitution.

If these laws are allowed to stand then the Constitution should be tossed in the shredder.
it’s time for civil war.
LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:14 AM

Fixed.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:19 AM

Wrong answer. Taking up arms to fight the gov’t will only result in the army killing us.

We need to fight this legally, not on the battlefield.

Your suggestion is a suicide mission.

LevinFan on February 23, 2013 at 10:24 AM

It is not a suggestion, but an observation of all the talk out there about what may very well happen if they start grabbing guns. It’s all over the place. Besides, you don’t think the many in the services will revolt and refuse to attack their own people? Really? This is not just some other country who has no idea or history of what liberty and freedom means. The army, marines, navy and air force aren’t big enough to take away over a hundred million guns.

HiJack on February 23, 2013 at 10:32 AM

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