Report: Boy Scouts may drop ban on gay scouts, scout leaders

posted at 5:44 pm on January 28, 2013 by Allahpundit

A case study in why (most) gay-marriage supporters won’t despair even if SCOTUS ends up upholding Prop 8 this year: Over time, cultural change will help them achieve what courts can’t or won’t. The Scouts won an epic Supreme Court discrimination case in 2000 protecting their right as a private organization to exclude members based on orientation. A little more than a decade later, they may be ready to jettison the ban and let the local sponsors and parents involved with individual Scout units decide whether gays should be admitted. (Call it the “federalist approach.”) How come? Pressure, from both within and without. But mostly without:

Two corporate CEOs on BSA’s national board, Randall Stephenson of AT&T and James Turley of Ernst & Young, have also said they would work to end the ban. Stephenson is next in line to be the BSA’s national chairman. During the 2012 presidential campaign, both Barack Obama and Mitt Romney said the BSA should admit gay scouts and scout leaders.

About 50 local United Way groups and several corporations and charities have concluded that the ban violates their non-discrimination requirements and have ceased providing financial aid to the Boy Scouts. An official of The Human Rights Campaign, an advocate for gay rights, said HRC planned to downgrade its non-discrimination ratings for corporations that continue to give the BSA financial support.

“It’s an extremely complex issue,” said one Boy Scouts of America official, who explained that other organizations have threatened to withdraw their financial support if the BSA drops the ban.

Curious that the Scouts aren’t worried about counter-boycotts by more socially conservative organizations. Maybe they should be:

The Southern Baptist Convention views homosexuality as sinful based on scripture and not acceptable as normal behavior, Mohler said. Ending a national policy on gays would raise a question in the mind of every Scout’s parent and require families to research the policy of each Scout troop and sponsoring organization before joining, he said.

“This is going to raise a fundamental question for the Southern Baptist Convention at national level and in the churches” about whether to reconsider a decades-old relationship with the Boy Scouts, Mohler said.

While that decision would be up to individual Southern Baptist churches, Mohler said: “I’m quite assured that those churches will be reconsidering that relationship if this policy goes into effect.”

Yeah, the key question here obviously is whether the “federalist approach” can satisfy either side or whether individual units’ decision to admit/deny gay Scouts will trigger a national ban of the BSA by some groups. Mohler seems to be hinting that it will in that excerpt (“at the national level”); a GLAAD spokesman who talked to USA Today called the new Boy Scout proposal a good “first step,” so presumably they’re hoping for further action (like, say, an order from the national board requiring individual Scout units to admit gays?) too. According to CNN, 70 percent of Boy Scout troops are affiliated with a church or religious group, but “some Scouts and Scout parents say that passing the decision to the local level will have little effect on the ground, because many troops have been ignoring the national policy anyway.” How that shakes out under the new policy, I don’t know. Does it actually end up being counterproductive by re-energizing a divisive issue at which most troops were already looking the other way?

Exit quotation from the GOP’s last presidential nominee: “‘I feel that all people should be allowed to participate in the Boy Scouts, regardless of their sexual orientation,’ Romney said in the video from 1994 recently re-surfaced by the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation. He added at the time that he supports ‘the right of the Boy Scouts of America to decide what it wants to do on that issue.’”

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Report: Boy Scouts may drop ban on gay scouts, scout leaders

…will this affect the sale of Girl Scout cookies?

KOOLAID2 on January 28, 2013 at 6:38 PM

Kids need all the help they can get fighting the propaganda of the godless left.

As long as the BSA stay committed to their values I don’t see a problem.

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:03 PM

So — sex between men is no longer a transgression of the law of God? I mean, that whole thing’s settled, and adhering to the bits in scout literature about deference to God is no longer incompatible with acceptance of homosexual behavior?

Aren’t those things, at best, still points of contention? Until either homosexual behavior stops being sin, or the scout’s values no longer presuppose God’s law, I’m not sure the BSA can stay committed to their values while embracing homosexuality.

Something has to give. I mean formally, clearly. Something like ‘Vatican VI: The Undiscovered Country. Chapter 1. “It’s not sin anymore.”‘ Or, press release: Boy Scouts 2.0: Scratch the God bit.

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 6:40 PM

I have nothing against gays and the scouts can do what they want and have the right to deny membership in their private club, but now that they may change this criteria it just means those that can’t abide by gays in scouts will have to start their own organization and carry on…until the liberal fascists comes for them over some social cause…cycle and repeat. What I find interesting is that before long there are going to be a lot of secret societies in this country. If I was starting some kind of organization like the scouts I would keep it in my community and as low-key as possible. Like I said, secret societies. That’s our future.

Jim-Rose on January 28, 2013 at 6:41 PM

Didn’t they just have a huge scandal with pedophilia? Gays already are in the BSA.

p0s3r on January 28, 2013 at 6:43 PM

Wow. NAMBLA rejoices.

John the Libertarian on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

So — sex between men is no longer a transgression of the law of God? I mean, that whole thing’s settled, and adhering to the bits in scout literature about deference to God is no longer incompatible with acceptance of homosexual behavior?

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 6:40 PM

Adultery is also a transgression. Should we ban anyone who has ever committed adultery?

I also don’t think the kids are having sex.

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

That’s the end of a great American organization.

MCGIRV on January 28, 2013 at 6:46 PM

they may be ready to jettison the ban… How come? Pressure Evil, from both within and without. But mostly without:

Fixed.

itsnotaboutme on January 28, 2013 at 6:46 PM

Adultery is also a transgression. Should we ban anyone who has ever committed adultery?

If the continue to actively condone adultery and are non-repentent, then yes.

I also don’t think the kids are having sex.
darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

Why would you think that? I don’t think middle schoolers are using those condoms they hand out at school for water ballons.

tommyboy on January 28, 2013 at 6:49 PM

This is about pederasty. Nothing more. The next frontier in the sexual revolution will be full adoption rights, after that recognition by the DSM of pedophilia as a normal sexual proclivity.

Add another fresh turd to the cultural sewer.

SAMinVA on January 28, 2013 at 6:51 PM

The moth flies into the flame.

unclesmrgol on January 28, 2013 at 6:51 PM

If the continue to actively condone adultery and are non-repentent, then yes.

My point is there are few among us, if any, who haven’t transgressed God’s laws.

Why would you think that? I don’t think middle schoolers are using those condoms they hand out at school for water ballons.

tommyboy on January 28, 2013 at 6:49 PM

I dunno … I’m sure some are.

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM

Looks like ill be mailing my medal and badge to the BSA.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Adultery is also a transgression. Should we ban anyone who has ever committed adultery?

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

A transgression in the eyes of God is one thing. An abomination in the eyes of God is another. There is a HUGE difference from a religious standpoint. You are not just comparing apples and oranges from a biblical point of view. You are comparing apples and SMOD.

HotAirian on January 28, 2013 at 6:57 PM

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Don’t you dare. They don’t deserve it, you earned that.

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 6:57 PM

And another one bites the dust.

tommy71 on January 28, 2013 at 6:59 PM

All the institutions of your once great nation are being field dressed, wrapped in freezer paper, put into the freezer. Not a damn thing you can do about it either./

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 7:04 PM

Adultery is also a transgression. Should we ban anyone who has ever committed adultery?

I also don’t think the kids are having sex.

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

But, no one is asking them to look past adultery as though it weren’t sin, as though there’s nothing to see there. Doing it that way builds in a fundamental hypocrisy.

kids

The scouts aren’t just cub scouts. :) But all religious kids are read all ten commandments at some point or other.

I think their problem is that they are an anachronism is a way. Structurally. It’s oversimplified and a little silly, but imagine some black and white movie with some engineers in short sleeve shirts and horned glasses, some soldiers maybe, throw in a flying saucer. All of them (not the evil aliens) take for granted duty to God (and a Christian one at that), duty to country, duty to family, even physical fitness — all of them assume all these are part of health, or of “manly hygiene.” The scouts are structured with an attitude that works from that place in history back. From there forward . . . things are very different.

I hope whatever they do in adapting to modernity, they are true to themselves and clear about it. I hope they don’t try to float out in the middle, whistling Dixie on one side and the Battle Hymn on the other. If homosexuality is health in their view, say it. If God accepts homosexual behavior in their view, say it. If they are actually a secular organization, on second thought — be that.

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 7:04 PM

Looks like ill be mailing my medal and badge to the BSA.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Weird. I’ve never felt more posessive about mine. I was a scribe, you know. :)

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 7:06 PM

My point is there are few among us, if any, who haven’t transgressed God’s laws.

There are none who have not sinned. That’s no reason to condone and wallow in it.

tommyboy on January 28, 2013 at 7:06 PM

I call BS on the BSA folding to the Gaystapo. Those two CEOs sitting on the board for the BSA need to be giving their walking papers TODAY!

Robert Jensen on January 28, 2013 at 7:06 PM

Boy Scouts may drop ban on gay scouts, scout leaders

…does this mean we don’t have to worry about them sneaking into the Girl Scout Camps anymore?

KOOLAID2 on January 28, 2013 at 7:09 PM

I wonder what the merit badge will look like?

unclesmrgol on January 28, 2013 at 7:10 PM

Adultery is also a transgression. Should we ban anyone who has ever committed adultery?

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

They should ban anyone who is openly continuing to commit adultery. Yes.

besser tot als rot on January 28, 2013 at 7:12 PM

It’s just frustrating.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 7:13 PM

That’s no reason to use condonems and wallow in it.

tommyboy on January 28, 2013 at 7:06 PM

(:->)

KOOLAID2 on January 28, 2013 at 7:13 PM

My understanding on the ban on ghey Scout leaders has more to to with the battle cry of the Cold-Busted Pedo:

“I’m gay, and the people bringing these BS charges are homophobes conspiring against me!”

Which is an insult to the overwhelming majority of gays who stick with consenting adults, thankyouverymuch. Not to mention the kids who are trying to get someone to believe them.

Sekhmet on January 28, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, thrifty, clean, reverent, and gay.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 7:17 PM

Well, I guess homosexuals all over are excited over the prospect of access to new victims.

When the LATimes did their hit piece on the BSA, exposing the molestation cases. the BSA should have said, ‘that’s exactly why we’re trying to root them out! Who else do you think is hurting these boys?!!’

but nah. that’s more thought than most of us conservatives can muster, sadly.

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 7:18 PM

Oh, and I love the Romney quote at the end.

What he thinks matters, of course.

How could we argue with a guy with political instincts like his?

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 7:19 PM

My understanding on the ban on ghey Scout leaders has more to to with the battle cry of the Cold-Busted Pedo:

“I’m gay, and the people bringing these BS charges are homophobes conspiring against me!”

Which is an insult to the overwhelming majority of gays who stick with consenting adults, thankyouverymuch. Not to mention the kids who are trying to get someone to believe them.

Sekhmet on January 28, 2013 at 7:15 PM

Exactly where are getting your “understanding”?

It’s a bit condescending to say “…the overwhelming majority of gays who stick with consenting adults” as if gays are predisposed to pedophilia and somehow “stick” to someone their age.

JetBoy on January 28, 2013 at 7:24 PM

No organization is safe from homosexual activists..if you don’t admit them, you are bigot..if you don’t marry them you are bigot..this country is in a world of hurt..God can’t be happy with this decision by the boy scouts..a group that has(or had) Godly principles…

sadsushi on January 28, 2013 at 7:25 PM

It’s just frustrating.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 7:13 PM

OT/Rude, because unsolicited, advice? :) From one bubbling cauldron to another? Let go trying to control the things that aren’t under your control. It requires some distance from things you wanted to identify with, which will be sad, but the frustration will stop. Money back guarantee. Seriously — this is not my usual crap.

Trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, thrifty, clean, reverent, and gay.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 7:17 PM

lol — Life get’s better. Promise. Worried about you now.

Cheeto?

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 7:26 PM

I really, really hate how we’re all just supposed to pretend that homosexuality doesn’t destroy men physically. And I really, really hate how the people who are seeking to encourage this dangerous lifestyle are seen as “compassionate” even though they are essentially condemning the victims of their “compassion” to terrible physical problems and, in many cases, horrible deaths. Oh–and I really, really hate that millions (billions?) of dollars are poured into normalizing an inherently destructive behavior instead of being poured into helping those who want out of the lifestyle to find a way out.

butterflies and puppies on January 28, 2013 at 7:28 PM

Yes to the Cheeto. And you’re right.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 7:28 PM

sadsushi

That’s why they should be marginalized.

first by ignoring them. if they up the ante, at least in conservative areas, prosecute their antics of slander, vandalism and intimidation to the fullest extent of the law.

next, by removing special protections for them, like ‘hate crimes’ protections. Certainly, they are entitled to the same protections any other citizen is, but there is no reason for the government to value their lives anymore than yours or mine.

third, by a federalist approach to homosexuality. let the states decide about sodomy laws, etc. tell the Supreme Court to keep its Constitution-raping paws off states’ rights.

But all that requires more courage than could ever be found in the current bunch of dolts that are ‘conservative’ leaders.

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 7:30 PM

It’s just frustrating.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 7:13 PM

Yep. Many challenges of magnitude can be. Perseverance my friend.

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 7:36 PM

That’s why they should be marginalized.

first by ignoring them. if they up the ante, at least in conservative areas, prosecute their antics of slander, vandalism and intimidation to the fullest extent of the law.

next, by removing special protections for them, like ‘hate crimes’ protections. Certainly, they are entitled to the same protections any other citizen is, but there is no reason for the government to value their lives anymore than yours or mine.

third, by a federalist approach to homosexuality. let the states decide about sodomy laws, etc. tell the Supreme Court to keep its Constitution-raping paws off states’ rights.

But all that requires more courage than could ever be found in the current bunch of dolts that are ‘conservative’ leaders.

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 7:30 PM

Yep I agree 100% with what you said

sadsushi on January 28, 2013 at 7:44 PM

Exit quotation from the GOP’s last presidential nominee: “‘I feel that all people should be allowed to participate in the Boy Scouts, regardless of their sexual orientation,’ Romney said in the video from 1994 recently re-surfaced by the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation. He added at the time that he supports ‘the right of the Boy Scouts of America to decide what it wants to do on that issue.’”

“Most electable,” my [rear].

Myron Falwell on January 28, 2013 at 7:51 PM

This is a perfect example of winning the battle but losing the war.

The BSA’s image has been badly tarnished by discriminating against gays and atheists. They, like most of the retrogrades commenting here, don’t understand that gay rights is the civil rights movement of this generation.

You don’t have to agree with it and you don’t have to like it, but it’s a fact.

Discriminating against gays today holds the same cachet as discriminating against blacks back in the 60s.

Rightists gonna wail, Bible thumpers gonna thump.

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 7:53 PM

I wonder what the merit badge will look like?

unclesmrgol on January 28, 2013 at 7:10 PM

10 to 1 it coordinates with that season’s uniform, perfectly. :)

All right. I apologize to The Gay for that stereotype right there.

butterflies and puppies on January 28, 2013 at 7:28 PM

Yeah, but look at you squaring into the wind and shouting against what you thinks needs shouting against. :) By the way, your nick is just a tad aggressive. Might want to look into it.

About 50 local United Way groups and several corporations and charities have concluded that the ban violates their non-discrimination requirements and have ceased providing financial aid to the Boy Scouts. An official of The Human Rights Campaign, an advocate for gay rights, said HRC planned to downgrade its non-discrimination ratings for corporations that continue to give the BSA financial support.

Huh. This is sort of it’s own story . . .

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 7:53 PM

I’m disgusted, Ain’t boy scouts, it’s more like “pedophile scouts”

royzer on January 28, 2013 at 7:54 PM

Boy scouts changing to….. Scouting for boys?

BSA DEAD!

PappyD61 on January 28, 2013 at 7:55 PM

Looks like ill be mailing my medal and badge to the BSA.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Why? You earned them when they had meaning.

Solaratov on January 28, 2013 at 8:02 PM

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 7:53 PM

Reprobates gonna engage in and champion perversion.

tom daschle concerned on January 28, 2013 at 8:07 PM

Pre-marital intercourse is sinful, right? How many of you anti-gay types have ever railed against “shacking up?” How many of you have committed the sin of premarital-sex? How many of you make outright sexual remarks about attractive women? You’re like a bunch of sailors troop leaders hypocrites.

Capitalist Hog on January 28, 2013 at 8:10 PM

chump still a chump

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 8:11 PM

Looks like ill be mailing my medal and badge to the BSA.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 6:56 PM

Why? You earned them when they had meaning.

Solaratov on January 28, 2013 at 8:02 PM

I’m not sending my medals back because of what obama is doing to the Army now.

What counts is that you earned yours. That has meaning and value. What it may become in the future doesn’t effect that.

Solaratov on January 28, 2013 at 8:11 PM

PappyD61 on January 28, 2013 at 7:55 PM

I bet the Boy Scouts stay around longer than you, Pappy.

I’d be interested to know how many of the anti-gay bigots were racial-bigots back when they didn’t need cover for those prejudices.

Capitalist Hog on January 28, 2013 at 8:11 PM

Rightists gonna wail, Bible thumpers gonna thump.

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 7:53 PM

And azzholes like chimp gonna keep their head up theirs.

1% of the population does not make a “civil rights” movement. They’re just loud and pushy.

Solaratov on January 28, 2013 at 8:14 PM

Looks like ill be mailing my medal and badge to the BSA.

Rusty Allen on January 28, 2013 at 6:56 PM

You’re the type to rescind his membership at a country club for admitting Jews, Blacks and/or women.

How old are you? Please video tape the entire charade and post to YouTube. The world could use some post-Gangnam Style laughs. Please post.

Capitalist Hog on January 28, 2013 at 8:15 PM

Capitalist Hog

Ya know, I’ve had this suspicion that people defending homosexuals must have a similar agenda…

either they are closet homosexuals
or, like many homosexuals, they have more deviated, perhaps illegal predilections.

That’s why they hide behind b.s. language like ‘bigot’ and make false comparisons with racism.

Doesn’t change those pesky facts, though…

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:20 PM

Aw.

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 8:20 PM

Doesn’t change those pesky facts, though…

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:20 PM

Indeed.

Solaratov on January 28, 2013 at 8:21 PM

The Pederasts lining up to beome pack leaders are going to give new meaning to WEBELOWS.

OxyCon on January 28, 2013 at 8:21 PM

You’re the type to rescind his membership at a country club for admitting Jews, Blacks and/or women.

Capitalist Hog on January 28, 2013 at 8:15 PM

And you’re the type to make really ignorant strawman arguments…no matter how stupid they are.

Solaratov on January 28, 2013 at 8:24 PM

Doesn’t change those pesky facts, though…

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:20 PM

Since when do your “suspicions” equate to facts?

Your comment was entirely fact free.

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 8:26 PM

chumpThreads 8:26

Anyone smell that…?

Fart in the wind, I suppose.

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:26 PM

Exactly where are getting your “understanding”?

It’s a bit condescending to say “…the overwhelming majority of gays who stick with consenting adults” as if gays are predisposed to pedophilia and somehow “stick” to someone their age.

JetBoy on January 28, 2013 at 7:24 PM

I was trying to say that the overwhelming majority of gays seek other consenting adult gay people, just like the overwhelming majority of straight people seek other consenting straight people. A predilection for children of any gender is not some extra sexual orientation. It is a dangerous paraphilia, like a fetish for non-consenting adult partners.

Sekhmet on January 28, 2013 at 8:27 PM

JetBoy 7:24

Actually, how do we know? Do you honestly think that with the left controlling most academic institutions, that we’d be told if it were true? I do know that before the POLITICAL decision of the APa to remove homosexuality from its list of mental disorders, there was a lot of argument for the idea that homosexuals are much more likely to be involved in pedophilia (proportionally) than heterosexuals.

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:32 PM

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:26 PM

And yet you cannot refute my comments.

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 8:33 PM

Your comment was entirely fact free.

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 8:26 PM

Now that right there is funny!!! Thanks chump, needed the laugh. There is a thread up you may want to comment on. Here.

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 8:36 PM

chumpThreads 8:33

There’s that smell again…

Actually, I really could care less what you say or think. You’re here shilling for giving homosexual predators access to young victims, I’m sorry, for letting ‘gays’ be Scout leaders.

I don’t need to defend my argument. I think it’s fairly obvious. Why else would people who have no skin in the game put so much emotional energy into defending deviancy?

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:36 PM

What kind of mush brained parent would entrust their son to an organization that condones sodomy? And comparing it to racism is a ridiculous canard……. Normal people of every race condemn sodomy.

bluesdoc70 on January 28, 2013 at 8:39 PM

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:36 PM

Just in case you may not have realized this, chump hates Christianity. Loves anything that runs counter to it. Or course you probably know this. Just wanted to make sure. He/she/it is good for an occasional laugh though. So there is a redeeming feature to he/she/it.

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 8:40 PM

I was trying to say that the overwhelming majority of gays seek other consenting adult gay people, just like the overwhelming majority of straight people seek other consenting straight people. A predilection for children of any gender is not some extra sexual orientation. It is a dangerous paraphilia, like a fetish for non-consenting adult partners.

Sekhmet on January 28, 2013 at 8:27 PM

“There is such a thing as a homosexual pedophile, though not all homosexuals are pedophiles, and the Scouts and others have had homosexual pedophiles attempt to defend themselves by appealing to defenses of their homosexuality, an action which has painted the overwhelming number of homosexuals who are not pedophiles — as pedophiles.”

Something like that? :)

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 8:41 PM

As a Scouting volunteer who has a retired Scoutmaster husband and two Eagle Scout sons, I am definitely opposed to this change. This is another assault on religion and on moral culture in this country. Many troops are sponsored by churches that oppose homosexuality. I cheered when the Supreme Court affirmed the right of the BSA to choose its own leaders and make its own rules. This step will destroy Scouting, as I see many organizations dropping their charters. The boys who might have been helped by the country’s best leadership development program will be the real losers.

mathgal60 on January 28, 2013 at 8:46 PM

There is such a thing as a homosexual pedophile, though not all homosexuals are pedophiles, and the Scouts and others have had homosexual pedophiles attempt to defend themselves by appealing to defenses of their homosexuality, an action which has painted the overwhelming number of homosexuals who are not pedophiles — as pedophiles.”

Something like that? :)

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 8:41 PM

Pretty much, but written with much fewer pain pills than my missive. Thanks.

Sekhmet on January 28, 2013 at 8:46 PM

Bmore 8:40. Thanks I actually did not know. Not surprising. I’ve had it so much with these people I’ve just started lashing out. Good night.

avgjo on January 28, 2013 at 8:50 PM

Pretty much, but written with much fewer pain pills than my missive. Thanks.

Sekhmet on January 28, 2013 at 8:46 PM

I liked yours. Just worried some people interested in it would stumble over that “paraphilia” bit and not know if they agreed with you or not. :)

Axe on January 28, 2013 at 8:56 PM

Good Night avgjo, Sleep Well?

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 8:57 PM

Why don’t the gays just make they own
organization? Gay Scouts. Imagine the
marketing potential.

redguy on January 28, 2013 at 6:02 PM

My comment in the Headlines:

There is nothing stopping the gay activists from starting their own scouting program. Call it Gay Scouts if you wish. Let them compete in the marketplace. Those who are gay, or who want to support the concept of gay membership, are free to join.

This issue isn’t about denying homosexuals the “right” to join Boy Scouts. This issue is about denying Boy Scouts the right to remain who they have always been. As HotAirian commented, a Boy Scout promises to do their duty to God and to be morally straight. Those words have meaning. Homosexuals will never be able to reconcile their behavior with what the Bible says about homosexuality. The two are incompatible.

Any organization that takes a Biblical worldview is now under attack from homosexual activists… activists who believe that they are right and the Holy Bible is wrong. “Acceptance” or “tolerance” is not enough for them. They must actively attack any Biblically-based organization in this country.

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 2:16 PM

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 9:01 PM

Until we muster the energy to have a voice and organize. Or not. For me, I am looking at changing my silence into action.

Bmore on January 28, 2013 at 6:30 PM

Then take action and organize your own Rainbow Scouts troop. Compete in the marketplace and stop telling free people (the Boy Scouts) that they can’t be what they want to be and have always been.

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 9:23 PM

I suppose they will get rid of Beaver Patrol then?

BL@KBIRD on January 28, 2013 at 9:28 PM

One by one they all fall to the pressure of a debased culture. Well, all but one, and it won’t be long until Holy Mother Church is the last bastion standing alone in defense of morality. But have no fear; the gates of hell shall not prevail against her.

Deo Gratias.

pannw on January 28, 2013 at 9:29 PM

Adultery is also a transgression. Should we ban anyone who has ever committed adultery?

darwin on January 28, 2013 at 6:45 PM

I can’t say this any better than besser tot als rot did in the headline comments:

Put simply, all sins are forgiven when they are repented and renounced. Being openly gay does not qualify. Just as being an open and continual child abuser, adulterer, neglector, etc. would/should not be forgiven. So, tell me, how is being gay being held to a different standard than other sins? It is not.

What you are arguing for is that being gay not be considered a sin. Which is your right. But don’t lie about your intentions. Or do. Whatever. I don’t care.

besser tot als rot on January 28, 2013 at 3:22 PM

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 9:40 PM

This is a threat to not only the Boy Scouts of America but also the United States of America.

Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, Religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim the tribute of Patriotism, who should labour to subvert these great Pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of Men & citizens. The mere Politican, equally with the pious man ought to respect & to cherish them. A volume could not trace all their connections with private & public felicity. Let it simply be asked where is the security for property, for reputation, for life, if the sense of religious obligation desert the Oaths, which are the instruments of investigation in Courts of Justice?

And let us with caution indulge the supposition, that morality can be maintained without religion. Whatever may be conceded to the influence of refined education on minds of peculiar structure–reason & experience both forbid us to expect that National morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.

‘Tis substantially true, that virtue or morality is a necessary spring of popular government. The rule indeed extends with more or less force to every species of Free Government. Who that is a sincere friend to it, can look with indifference upon attempts to shake the foundation of the fabric.

- President George Washington

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 9:45 PM

A lot of you people against lifting the ban are talking about how you are worried about pedophiles being allowed to work as scoutmasters. You are focused on the scoutmasters or scout leaders. What about the Boy Scouts themselves? Don’t you think that a teenager who is gay ought to be able to join the scouts if they want to? Who really cares? I don’t really see the point in getting upset about this. As for the scout leaders, don’t we allow heterosexual men to be teachers in classrooms where there are girls?

Some of you have said that lifting the ban would give same-sex molesters the ability to claim, “you are discriminating against my sexual orientation” when caught, and presumably get away with it, or intimidate people into not investigating further. Has such a thing really been a problem with similar cases in schools?

Were same-sex molesters previously deciding not to join the organization because of the ban, and now think to themselves, “wow, now that the ban has been lifted, I am free to join.” I don’t think so. The sex offenders would not have been stopped by some symbolic ban.

Has failing to ban openly gay public school teachers put students at greater risk?

Most of the opposition to lifting the ban really has little to do with protecting children from sexual abuse. Maybe for some of you it does, but I don’t think that is the main issue. I think it is just the principle involved. It is related to wanting to prevent people from openly admitting they are gay and officially accepting the idea that homosexuality is normal. Just like with the military, there have always been a gay scouts and gay service members, but now the exclusionary principle of keeping it quiet is no longer being upheld. I really don’t see things changing all that much for most people in the organization if the ban is lifted.

bluegill on January 28, 2013 at 9:52 PM

This decision will hasten the demise, but the simple fact of the matter is that the BSA is on it’s last legs anyway. All of our civic institutions and organizations, from the Freemasons to the Lions Clubs to local bowling leagues are in decline as more and more people becomed cocooned by the Internet. In a generation the BSA will sadly be no more.

Dukeboy01 on January 28, 2013 at 10:00 PM

You’re the type to rescind his membership at a country club for admitting Jews, Blacks and/or women.
Capitalist Hog on January 28, 2013 at 8:15 PM

Nonsense. Being an active Jew, Black or woman is not a biblical mortal sin nor does the bible prohibit fellowship with them. Better luck next try.

tommyboy on January 28, 2013 at 10:09 PM

Apparently the Boy Scouts have been admitting gays for some time. Years ago, my nephew was molested by his Big Brother (BBBS Organization), who had been an Eagle Scout.

maryo on January 28, 2013 at 10:17 PM

I wonder how many mothers will simple refuse to allow their children to go to meetings promoting gay sex and featuring live demonstrations by NAMBLA?

Do not make the mistake of laughing at this comment. This IS exactly what the gay lobby is desperate to normalize!

Freddy on January 28, 2013 at 10:21 PM

bluegill on January 28, 2013 at 9:52 PM

Teachers do not necessarily camp overnight with children, and I would object to any hetero male teacher being the overnight supervision for girls.. And the rash of teacher molestations has to do with the unauthorized access to children via the internet, facebook and twitter.

And most of us, like myself that this decision is akin to letting men camp with girl scouts which I object to vehemently. It isn’t that homosexuals molest more; it is why take the extra chance with you child. If you are asking me to risk my child so someone can feel good about their life; I am going to take my business elsewhere. I would venture most parents feel the way I do.

And as far as homosexual children going to boyscouts. If the boyscouts want to admit them -fine, but they shouldn’t be pressured to admit ANYONE to their private club. You want to feel good and make your homosexual child feel totally inclusive; start some clubs that deal directly with that issue.

melle1228 on January 28, 2013 at 10:24 PM

These are the kinds of things a culture in its death throes wrestles with.

Men who sodomize other men as Scout Masters? Only a perverse mind and soul would not see anything wrong with that.

Cleombrotus on January 28, 2013 at 10:26 PM

Well, my granddaughter left the Girl Scouts after reading/exploring their Planned Parenthood affiliation, so methinks that grandSon will soon abandon the Boy Scouts, soon, too.
What a frigging shame.
:-(

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 10:27 PM

Don’t you think that a teenager who is gay ought to be able to join the scouts if they want to? Who really cares?

bluegill on January 28, 2013 at 9:52 PM

A Boy Scout promises to do their duty to God and to be morally straight. Those words have meaning. Homosexuals will never be able to reconcile their behavior with what the Bible says about homosexuality. The two are incompatible.

Start your own scouting organization and compete in the marketplace. Don’t try to remove the foundation from a 100+ year-old organization.

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 10:30 PM

I’m curious as to why someone would want to be a Scout leader. It isn’t a responsibility to be taken lightly, there is a lot more involved then many posters here imagine. I was a den mother and then ended up as a Pack leader for a year because the man who had the position became ill and no one else came forward. My brother was a scout as were my sons, who are now leaders.
It involves a lot of time and effort. It is nothing like it is portrayed in the movies, you may have boys who have nothing else they can join or no one else who cares about them. I don’t care about Gays or Blacks or Purples or whatever, but I do care that someone takes this seriously. I doubt some of the people posting could last through one den meeting, one badge project, or one camping trip.
I wonder if these people who are so eager to be leaders are ready to plan meetings, attend to injuries, illness, shyness, bullies, arguments, homesickness, etc. Are they ready to clean up vomit when some cub scout gets sea sick in a canoe or cries because he’s never been away from home, or knows what to do when a boy is stung by a bee? What about dealing with parents, the sponsoring organization, collecting dues, ordering supplies, etc.
I don’t want to see someone join or be a leader just to make some political statement. I want them to want to be part of an organization that has helped and encouraged boys for many many years, and is something to be proud of.

Deanna on January 28, 2013 at 10:34 PM

ITguy on January 28, 2013 at 9:40 PM

Yups, but a lot of us care, besser.
(and homosexuality IS forgiven in the NT, btw)
Sigh.

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 10:34 PM

(and homosexuality IS forgiven in the NT, btw)
Sigh.

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 10:34 PM

So is everything else, or do you mean that it is no longer considered a sin…cause I don’t recall that?

sharrukin on January 28, 2013 at 10:37 PM

chumpThreads on January 28, 2013 at 7:53 PM

The pedophile rights movement will be the next great cause of your time. And you’ll have zero grounds to deny what they want based on your anything goes morality. Who knows, maybe you already support it.

smoothsailing on January 28, 2013 at 10:39 PM

A lot of you people against lifting the ban are talking about how you are worried about pedophiles being allowed to work as scoutmasters. You are focused on the scoutmasters or scout leaders. What about the Boy Scouts themselves? Don’t you think that a teenager who is gay ought to be able to join the scouts if they want to? Who really cares? I don’t really see the point in getting upset about this. As for the scout leaders, don’t we allow heterosexual men to be teachers in classrooms where there are girls?

bluegill on January 28, 2013 at 9:52 PM

In both cases, Scout or Scout leader, I have a similar response:

I’d never allow my daughter to go on a camping trip headed by a male nor would I allow her to share a tent with a male of the same age (unless, of course, they were both 2, as she is now.)

Now, apply that to a male that may be attracted to my son, whether adult leader or tent-mate. Such concerns should not be a part of Scouting. And, if this report is true, they will be.

And, sad to say as an Eagle Scout, if this concerns are a part of Scouting, none of my children will be involved.

makattak on January 28, 2013 at 10:40 PM

These concerns, not this.

makattak on January 28, 2013 at 10:42 PM

As for the scout leaders, don’t we allow heterosexual men to be teachers in classrooms where there are girls?

bluegill on January 28, 2013 at 9:52 PM

You must not be familiar with Scouting. Leaders often spend time alone with boys. Even a den leader is alone with the boys, probably in their home. They also spend time over-night and on trips. Now when male teachers start camping out alone with their fremale students or having them to their home alone you might have a more apt comparison. As both a former teacher and scout leader I can say you have to do some reading of the Scout manuals and look to the requirements and how troops and packs and dens are run.

Deanna on January 28, 2013 at 10:50 PM

The pedophile rights movement will be the next great cause of your time. And you’ll have zero grounds to deny what they want based on your anything goes morality. Who knows, maybe you already support it.

smoothsailing on January 28, 2013 at 10:39 PM

Tough call, pedophelia of polygamy? The oxygen network was going to get in front of the polygamy movement before they pulled their show. For now anyway.

Freddy on January 28, 2013 at 10:50 PM

Oh dear, the godless are throwing around the H word.

Somebody get the salts!

tom daschle concerned on January 28, 2013 at 10:59 PM

sharrukin on January 28, 2013 at 10:37 PM

My Bible app is not cooperating, atm ( on iPad ), or I’d link the reference ……
Yes, it’s a sin (not choice) in the NT and one can tell by it’s (Paul’s ?) inclusion in the ways others have walked, but now can be cleansed (by repentance) … Must find reference.. LOL

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 11:01 PM

Ah hah.. 1 Corinthians 6. :-)

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 11:07 PM

Ah hah.. 1 Corinthians 6. :-)

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 11:07 PM

Thanks.

sharrukin on January 28, 2013 at 11:09 PM

Yes, it’s a sin (not choice) in the NT and one can tell by it’s (Paul’s ?) inclusion in the ways others have walked, but now can be cleansed (by repentance) … Must find reference..
pambi on January 28, 2013 at 11:01 PM

Try 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

tommyboy on January 28, 2013 at 11:11 PM

IMHO, Scouts are an organization that HAVE been free to discriminate on their own, and rightly so.
This would merely be a cave to political pressure, and nothing more.
Sad … very sad.

pambi on January 28, 2013 at 11:11 PM

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