Oh, by the way: New York forgot to exempt cops from its new ban on high-capacity magazines

posted at 8:01 pm on January 17, 2013 by Allahpundit

Via Mark Levin, here’s what happens when Doing Something is more important than knowing what you’re doing. You’ve got a governor here who’s facing reelection in 2014 and may well end up being the national frontrunner for his party’s nomination in 2016 if Hillary doesn’t run. He’s feeling political pressure not just from above, in the form of a president who’s vowed to drum up Do Something fever among Democrats nationally, but from below in the form of a rich, high-profile nanny-state mayor for whom this is a pet issue. One of his top national rivals is also scrambling to put together a gun-control package to impress progressives, and the bigmouth from the state next door was inevitably going to start sucking up the local media oxygen by chiming in on this subject too. Action had to be taken, and it had to be taken quickly to impress a left that’s grown suspicious of him lately. Result: For the moment, it’s illegal for cops to carry magazines with more than seven bullets in New York State. You wanted Cuomo and the state legislature to Do Something, New York. They did it.

They did a lot, actually:

Mental health experts say a new tougher New York state gun control law might interfere with treatment of potentially dangerous people and even discourage them from seeking help.

The law would require therapists, doctors, nurses and social workers to tell government authorities if they believe a patient is likely to harm himself or others. That could lead to revoking the patient’s gun permit and seizing any guns…

“The people who arguably most need to be in treatment and most need to feel free to talk about these disturbing impulses, may be the ones we make least likely to do so,” said the director of law, ethics and psychiatry at Columbia. “They will either simply not come, or not report the thoughts that they have.”

“If people with suicidal or homicidal impulses avoid treatment for fear of being reported in this way, they may be more likely to act on those impulses,” he said.

That’s a solid result for gun control. The police are momentarily in limbo legally and the threat to the public might actually increase as would-be spree killers decide it’s now too risky to seek therapy. Get Cuomo’s office a video camera and a group of kids reading letters about gun control, stat.

Update: High-capacity magazines may not be the only loophole that’s snared New York police. According to one lawmaker, cops might be technically be banned from carrying on school grounds too.


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Given the proclivity of NYPD officers to put 70-90 rounds into an UNARMED subject on several past occasions, maybe limiting them to 7 round magazines is a GOOD idea.

Exit suggestion to gun manufacturers. DO NOT DO BUSINESS WITH NEW YORK PD’s.

GarandFan on January 17, 2013 at 11:51 PM

So, to recap:

Police and other relevant authorities are never to ask a person any question about their citizenship status (even with substantial probable cause) because this will scare and stigmatize immigrants and people of color into the shadows of society…

…but doctors should now be probing their patients in interviews to know if any of them ever owned a gun they forgot to tell the government about and to report/be suspicious of any gun owner.

Sacramento on January 17, 2013 at 11:58 PM

Always interesting to see how quick so-called conservatives are to defend progressives and their foreign policy, and to do so without question while at the same time being critical of their domestic policies.

Dante on January 17, 2013 at 11:39 PM/

Nonsense.

Pointing out that FDR needed war because his economic policies sucked hardly constitutes endorsement.

That hardly precludes acceptance that FDR had an obligation to protect and defend the Constitution and the People from all enemies foreign and domestic whence Pearl Harbor was attacked.

Something which your tiny mind fails to differentiate.

viking01 on January 18, 2013 at 12:10 AM

The special forces have M4′s and M16′s that can do full auto like the original and the M1A1.

But full auto isn’t that useful. 3 round bursts modulated by a marksman is more effective.

wildcat72 on January 17, 2013 at 11:07 PM

Yeah, that’s what I thought. I did my 3 years when the Army was transitioning from the M16A1 (full auto) to the M16A2 (burst). In Basic, the drill sergeants beat it into our heads (sometimes literally ) that when you’re firing full auto, you only want to fire 3-4 rounds at a time. Full auto (sorry, can’t remember rate of fire) empties out a 30 round magazine awfully fast.

malclave on January 18, 2013 at 12:14 AM

To paraphrase nitwit Cuomo Jr.:

NO COP NEEDS MORE THAN 7 BULLETS TO KILL A CRIMINAL!!!!!!!

profitsbeard on January 18, 2013 at 12:33 AM

If one life can be saved by limiting cops to 7 bullets, it’s worth it.

xblade on January 18, 2013 at 12:37 AM

Glad I don’t live in the People’s Republic of New York. You made this bed of crap, now wallow in it, you morons.

Myron Falwell on January 18, 2013 at 12:47 AM

According to one lawmaker, cops might be technically be banned from carrying on school grounds too.

Doesn’t that just sum up the whole sham of the “debate” on gun control confiscation?

**blows raspberry**

Myron Falwell on January 18, 2013 at 12:51 AM

During the National Rifle Association’s meeting with Vice President Joe Biden and the White House gun violence task force, the vice president said that the administration did not have the time to prosecute existing gun laws.

Jim Baker, the NRA representative present at the meeting, recalled the vice president’s words to The Daily Caller: “And to your point, Mr. Baker, regarding the lack of prosecutions on lying on Form 4473s, we simply don’t have the time or manpower to prosecute everybody who lies on a form, that checks a wrong box, that answers a question inaccurately.”

Submitting false information on an ATF Form 4473 — required for the necessary background check to obtain a firearm — is a felony punishable by up to ten years in prison, depending on prior convictions and the judge, according to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

J_Crater on January 18, 2013 at 2:12 AM

I just asked some liberals if we should ban unprotected sex to stop the spread of AIDS. Oh man…they did not like that one bit.

Sharke on January 18, 2013 at 2:23 AM

So, what happens when NY cops armed with 7 round magazines try to stop a drug dealer armed with a high capacity 18 or 19 round Glock (or better yet, a 30 round Glock)? Last time I checked, laws do not apply to criminals. Anyone know if NY gansta crowd celebrated on Monday night?

This should be interesting.

riddick on January 18, 2013 at 2:40 AM

I heard that archeologists digging in some ancient roman ruins discovered an inscription on a wall in a prehistoric latin dialect that read ” Kuuomou hasst craniumus ein rectumius.” after deciphering this it appears even the ancient romans knew Cuomo has his head up his a z z .

stormridercx4 on January 18, 2013 at 2:53 AM

Well they certainly should have sent you to Tokyo to explain that whole Non-aggression principles to Tojo. It’s sad that you weren’t around then to stop Hitler, Stalin and Tojo from doing all those mean and nasty things. If a war might break out, they could just parachute you in and all would be right with the world.

sharrukin on January 17, 2013 at 11:09 PM

FDR sought and desired war, and he provoked the Japanese into attacking. America is not the world’s policeman. Hitler was Europe’s problem, not ours.

Dante on January 17, 2013 at 11:14 PM

Thank you for reminding us how clueless isolationists are.

Coming up next: “I’m not an isolationist. I’m a non-interventionist.”

So what if that’s what all isolationists have ever said….

tom on January 18, 2013 at 4:02 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarasoff_v._Regents_of_the_University_of_California

The law would require therapists, doctors, nurses and social workers to tell government authorities if they believe a patient is likely to harm himself or others.

Current law already requires mental health professionals to intervene if they believe a patient is likely to harm someone. Tarasoff was ajudicated back in the 70′s.

talkingpoints on January 18, 2013 at 6:24 AM

Excellent post on the subject here

Especially this part;

“One of the harbingers of tyranny and oppression are when public servants, who see themselves as rulers, begin to cloak and subvert democratic processes. They subjugate the openness, transparency, debate and reasoning of democracy and supplant it with whimsical, contra-intellectual, fallacious and utopian musings. Such rogues arrive at what they and other like-minded individuals believe should be our collective vision without the consent of the governed. Their lack of transparency, due to the rushed manner in which such misdeeds are accomplished, reminds us of the most oppressive and anti-democratic moments throughout history. Are such acts relics of the past? Are these merely contemporary musings from a disgruntled partisan? Hardly, it is what we have just witnessed in the New York Legislature.”

Marcus Traianus on January 18, 2013 at 6:33 AM

Mental health experts say a new tougher New York state gun control law might interfere with treatment of potentially dangerous people and even discourage them from seeking help.

Stupid liberals … always making a problem worse. But hey, as long as they can pat themselves on the back and feel morally superior it’s a-ok if mentally disturbed people now feel reluctant to seek help.

Plus, liberals have now created a black market for magazines. Nothing like a liberal to create a profit making enterprise for criminals.

darwin on January 18, 2013 at 7:39 AM

Idiots on parade

cmsinaz on January 18, 2013 at 7:40 AM

So, what happens when NY cops armed with 7 round magazines try to stop a drug dealer armed with a high capacity 18 or 19 round Glock (or better yet, a 30 round Glock)? Last time I checked, laws do not apply to criminals. Anyone know if NY gansta crowd celebrated on Monday night?

This should be interesting.

riddick on January 18, 2013 at 2:40 AM

Actually that was an event that woke up the PD’s across the country. I believe it was in L.A. where a shootout occurred with he LAPD, and they were out gunned. It was almost a massacre, the thugs had the firepower of the “AR” type weapons, the police had their 9mm Glocks.

After that a whole revision on the type of firearms issued to SWAT and others was initiated, upping the firepower, the rounds, and training.

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 7:56 AM

Sucks that to better represent Democrat voters, Democrats themselves are now illiterate, and can’t read what they vote on.

MNHawk on January 18, 2013 at 8:27 AM

Actually that was an event that woke up the PD’s across the country. I believe it was in L.A. where a shootout occurred with he LAPD, and they were out gunned. It was almost a massacre, the thugs had the firepower of the “AR” type weapons, the police had their 9mm Glocks.

After that a whole revision on the type of firearms issued to SWAT and others was initiated, upping the firepower, the rounds, and training.

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 7:56 AM

It was the North Hollywood shootout.

Local patrol officers at the time were typically armed with their personal 9 mm or .38 Special pistols, with some having a 12-gauge shotgun available in their cars. Phillips and Mătăsăreanu carried illegally modified fully automatic AKMs and an AR-15 rifle with high capacity drum magazines and ammunition capable of penetrating police body armor. They also wore body armor of their own. Since the police handguns could not penetrate the bank robbers’ body armor, the patrol officers’ bullets were ineffective. SWAT eventually arrived with rifles powerful enough to penetrate the body armor. Several officers also appropriated AR-15 rifles from a nearby firearms dealer. The incident sparked debate on the need for patrol officers to upgrade their capabilities in similar situations in the future.[4]

I have k’s rds of armor piercing ammo in every caliber of rifle I own. It is important to be prepared.

tom daschle concerned on January 18, 2013 at 8:33 AM

Sucks that to better represent Democrat voters, Democrats themselves are now illiterate, and can’t read what they vote on.

MNHawk on January 18, 2013 at 8:27 AM

We all know the new standard…you have to pass it to see what’s in it…

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 8:34 AM

Several officers also appropriated AR-15 rifles from a nearby firearms dealer. The incident sparked debate on the need for patrol officers to upgrade their capabilities in similar situations in the future.

tom daschle concerned on January 18, 2013 at 8:33 AM

Thanks, that was exactly that…I watched unfold live on TV, amazing.

And I remember now that the policemen had to literally go to gun shops and confiscate weapons and bullets to combat the thugs…apparently when you are under fire, you don’t have time for the “background check”. A lesson to remember, when a thief breaks into your house, he’s already done his “background” check.

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 8:38 AM

Given the proclivity of NYPD officers to put 70-90 rounds into an UNARMED subject on several past occasions, maybe limiting them to 7 round magazines is a GOOD idea.

Wrong!

NYPD may FIRE 70 – 90 rounds, but you will not find 70 – 90 in the target.

‘Spray & Pray’

I know of one NYPD who shot at a fleeing car and hit the driver in the testicle. He was cited for wreckless shooting. I think they were wrong – do you know how hard it is to hit one of those things?

Policy changed because of that incident. No more shooting at cars like in the movies.

Wander on January 18, 2013 at 8:43 AM

What I forgot about was this gem in the Wiki article, a most important detail:
(Phillips being the main leader)

 However, it was not possible for Phillips to legally purchase a firearm due to him being a convicted felon.

Yet he had AK-47, 100 round magazines, etc…but, but, but, how could he, they had a law preventing him…

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 8:46 AM

Policy changed because of that incident. No more shooting at cars like in the movies.

Wander on January 18, 2013 at 8:43 AM

The facts are, with talking with just a few guys who spend time on the streets, of inner city and the middle east…

The first few times (and most officers only once maybe in their career) you are in a firefight, it’s chaos, adrenalin, and you are lucky to hit your target, if it’s smaller than an car.

On police officer said his saving grace is that the thugs were worse shots than him…he had training they didn’t, and out of 5 or 6 shots, only one of his hit the target, none of the two suspect, after emptying their guns came close to him and his partner.

It, apparently, isn’t as easy to hit a target that is shooting back as one would think…never been their, just listened.

But, my nephew stated, after just one or two exchanges, you get into a groove and hit like you are on the range…

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 8:51 AM

Haste makes waste. Actually, a waste made the haste. Cuomo sounded like he hangs further out on the limb of that Pecan tree than Howard Dean. Is Mr. C really the dem front runner if Shrillary has another blood clot? OMG!

Kissmygrits on January 18, 2013 at 8:53 AM

Liberals have to pass a bill before they know what’s in it!

cajunpatriot on January 18, 2013 at 8:55 AM

Hey you Northeasterners or refugees from crazy states on the Left coast……..STAY WHERE YOU ARE.

…..do NOT come to Possum Holler or anywhere in the South. We don’t want your idiot politics. You made your bed, lay in it. We’ve already lost Florida twice.

http://www.myfoxny.com/story/20621844/nj-town-proposes-flag-ban

The Hudson County town of West New York is considering a widespread sign regulation that could include banning American flags from being flown.

The Board of Commissioners have a draft ordinance for “General Sign Regulations”.

Among the prohibited signs under the proposal would be “Flags, banners and pennants.”

This has opponents upset.

“What if I want to hang the American Flag? I can’t,” Frank Ferriero told politickerNJ. “Man, that’s un-American.”

The proposed ordinance was first read at a meeting on Wednesday. The final vote on the proposal will be held on Feb. 20 at a 7 p.m. meeting at the municipal building.

The ordinance would also ban signs affixed to the exterior of a window or glass, neon signs framing windows, and window and door signs that exceed 15% of the glass area.

PappyD61 on January 18, 2013 at 9:06 AM

“The Makers”

Bmore on January 18, 2013 at 9:24 AM

Whatever makes you sleep well at night buddy.

HotAirLib on January 17, 2013 at 8:55 PM

Actually, your mom does that pretty well for some of us.

Nutstuyu on January 18, 2013 at 9:37 AM

NY Cops had better hope NY criminals obey the law.

The Rogue Tomato on January 18, 2013 at 9:39 AM

And yet it is only fair if there is a ban, and weapons are available to be STOLEN which are more “powerful” than what a law abiding citizen can have…well, it’s a problem.

Fleuries on January 18, 2013 at 9:49 AM

It’s Bush’s fault. Just elect Coumo as President in 2016, and just shut up!!!

patch on January 18, 2013 at 10:10 AM

and may well end up being the national frontrunner for his party’s nomination in 2016 if Hillary doesn’t run.

I believe Cuomo essentially went radioactive with 2nd Amendment voters this week as did the fat oaf from NJ with his histrionics.

roy_batty on January 18, 2013 at 10:20 AM

Sorry. Not good enough. If cops are exempt from restrictions on the second amendment, while the little people are not, they will lose respect for the second amendment. They become more beholden to the state apparatus that grants them special privileges.

There are already prohibited “military style” weapons; adding further to the asymmetry in what civilians have vs. government authorities is not consistent with the purpose of the 2A.

Firefly_76 on January 17, 2013 at 9:49 PM

Rise of the Praetorian Class..?

affenhauer on January 18, 2013 at 10:30 AM

I know of one NYPD who shot at a fleeing car and hit the driver in the testicle. He was cited for wreckless shooting. I think they were wrong – do you know how hard it is to hit one of those things?

Hahahahaha! That’s awesome. I’m a gun owner up here in Western New York, and after the crap sandwich we’re being forced to eat, I needed a laugh. I appreciate it man.

Pope Linus on January 18, 2013 at 10:49 AM

katy the mean old lady on January 17, 2013 at 9:01 PM

Yes Katy, most are. And most occur between 1 and 12 feet separation. It’s tough to miss at that distance.

Mr. Grump on January 18, 2013 at 10:58 AM

The last time I went to the doctor (6 months ago), they said they were required to ask me several questions. They were all about mental health such as, did I ever have suicidal thoughts, take medication for depression, have I ever been depressed or have problems managing anger, etc. I answered no to all the questions, however, I’m sure this is information that could be used in a background check. Personally, I would be hesitant to seek medical help if I were experiencing any of those problems because of the lack of confidentiality.

lea on January 18, 2013 at 11:00 AM

The armament point of the Second Amendment is that the well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, consisting of the whole body of the people, is never at an armament disadvantage to government forces. The people must maintain armament parity with government forces in order to maintain the balance of power and be able to field a worthy opponent in the event of a confrontation with government forces.

Tripwhipper on January 18, 2013 at 11:17 AM

This is a great step forward for Progressives to treat police just like ordinary citizens!

Really, after all the calling for more police powers and such, this is refreshing to see that there is a great belief that the police will be just as safe as the general citizenry when trying to apprehend criminals. There should be more of this ‘treat the police as citizens with just a few extra powers but with the same restrictions as everyone else’ sort of mindset. Now the police will be JUST AS SAFE as an ORDINARY CITIZEN when faced with violent criminals!

FORWARD!

ajacksonian on January 18, 2013 at 11:28 AM

.. checking the ‘military style’ lists to find your M1911 — because, well ..
What? You’ve never heard of “Patton” ??

/” Read The Bill ”
/.

CaveatEmpty on January 18, 2013 at 11:42 AM

Actually that was an event that woke up the PD’s across the country. I believe it was in L.A. where a shootout occurred with he LAPD, and they were out gunned. It was almost a massacre, the thugs had the firepower of the “AR” type weapons, the police had their 9mm Glocks.

Yes, and this happened when the Feinstein’s federal “assault weapon” ban AND the California Roberti-Roos “assault weapon” ban were both in force. Worked good, didn’t it?

Fortunately, though several cops were hurt, only the bank robbers were killed. I often think that just one civilian in a 2nd story apartment where this happened with a scoped deer rifle could have ended the whole thing.

Socratease on January 18, 2013 at 11:48 AM

Given the proclivity of NYPD officers to put 70-90 rounds into an UNARMED subject on several past occasions, maybe limiting them to 7 round magazines is a GOOD idea.

Exit suggestion to gun manufacturers. DO NOT DO BUSINESS WITH NEW YORK PD’s.

GarandFan on January 17, 2013 at 11:51 PM

Naw, they’ll just by them from the Feds–through their Mexican discount outlet.

Don L on January 18, 2013 at 11:53 AM

If one life can be saved by limiting cops to 7 bullets, it’s worth it.

xblade on January 18, 2013 at 12:37 AM

I think everything will work out just fine if they also pass a law limiting seven criminals per cop!

Don L on January 18, 2013 at 12:04 PM

to see a Ron Kuby type try to citizen arrest a cop for carrying a “hi-cap” mag

Iblis on January 18, 2013 at 12:41 PM

7 rounds should be enough for a NY cop to drop a fatty with a super big gulp….

dentarthurdent on January 18, 2013 at 12:54 PM

to see a Ron Kuby type try to citizen arrest a cop for carrying a “hi-cap” mag

Iblis on January 18, 2013 at 12:41 PM

Don’t you mean a high mag assault clip?

dentarthurdent on January 18, 2013 at 12:55 PM

Don’t you mean a high mag assault clip?

dentarthurdent on January 18, 2013 at 12:55 PM

//

dentarthurdent on January 18, 2013 at 12:56 PM

http://twitpic.com/bw9in6

davidk on January 18, 2013 at 1:32 PM

Actually that was an event that woke up the PD’s across the country. I believe it was in L.A. where a shootout occurred with he LAPD, and they were out gunned. It was almost a massacre, the thugs had the firepower of the “AR” type weapons, the police had their 9mm Glocks.

After that a whole revision on the type of firearms issued to SWAT and others was initiated, upping the firepower, the rounds, and training.

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 7:56 AM

You are referring (inacccurately) to the NoHo Bank Robbery, where two felons armed with illegally modified full-auto firearms fired hundreds of rounds and failed to kill anybody. Except themselves.

LAPD response was to put AR15 rifles in patrol supervisors’ trunks. The LAPD at the shootout had great difficulty with only 9mm pistols and 00 buckshot against the improvised kevlar armor suits the robbers were wearing. When they finally nicked the getaway driver (who was on foot after their shitbox car was disabled) he put his own pistol under his chin and suicided. The other robber went down a sidestreet and carjacked a passing pickup and while transferring arms and loot to it 4 late-responding LAPD tactical unit officers (some still in streetclothes) accidentally pulled right up to him and engaged in a very short range firefight, during which they shot his feet out from under him. They then disarmed him and let him bleed to death in the street, before finally declaring the scene ‘safe’ enough for paramedics. Took about 35mins after the last shot before they did so.

During the shootout, some officers had rushed to an (in)famous gunstore very near the NoHo polic station, to get / take Ar-15s. They didn’t get to the robbery scene before it was all over.
That gunstore was later raided and shuttered because one of the two brother owners was selling guns out te back, off the books.

rayra on January 18, 2013 at 3:59 PM

Rise of the Praetorian Class..?

affenhauer on January 18, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Informative piece; thanks for sharing.

Firefly_76 on January 18, 2013 at 9:00 PM

rayra on January 18, 2013 at 3:59 PM

I understand your desire to be accurate…but you are not “complete”.

What you didn’t address is that for weeks after the news/journalists across the country analysed what happened, and came to the conclusion that the department was out gunned, it heavily impacted the way policemen were armed…it was litteral weeks of constand badgering and blabbering, of how ill prepared (whether they were was not the issue, the journalists determined they were not)the police were, it resonated across the country.

A perfect example of you being correct in details, and inaccurate of what was reported, how it was reported and the outcome of the reporting.

And a perfect example of how being “right” is meaningless in our society…it only is important if you are on the “right side”.

right2bright on January 18, 2013 at 9:56 PM

How about full autos?

Mimzey on January 17, 2013 at 10:18 PM

I’ll take my selector switch from semi to 3 round burst… much more accurate…

American Patriot1980 on January 19, 2013 at 12:48 AM

NY has the leaders it deserves –
now it is up to the people of NY to change their leadership.
Start with your local hacks and work up the food-chain.
Take names, and kick ass.
The life you save may be your own.

Another Drew on January 19, 2013 at 8:11 AM

The special forces have M4′s and M16′s that can do full auto like the original and the M1A1.

But full auto isn’t that useful. 3 round bursts modulated by a marksman is more effective.

wildcat72 on January 17, 2013 at 11:07 PM

Yeah, that’s what I thought. I did my 3 years when the Army was transitioning from the M16A1 (full auto) to the M16A2 (burst). In Basic, the drill sergeants beat it into our heads (sometimes literally ) that when you’re firing full auto, you only want to fire 3-4 rounds at a time. Full auto (sorry, can’t remember rate of fire) empties out a 30 round magazine awfully fast.

malclave on January 18, 2013 at 12:14 AM

Its been a while but as I recall the M16 would fire 800 rounds / minute, or 30 rounds in 2.25 seconds. I remember the first time we fired them everyone fired off 20 rounds (1.5s) just to see what it was like. It was pretty cool.

Dasher on January 19, 2013 at 12:37 PM

I have to say I think this situation is fantastic on multiple levels.

I do want to preface this with the message that I certainly do not wish nor want the NY police to be put into any danger because of their inability to carry enough ammunition to protect themselves. I’m pretty sure that the police of NY will continue to carry and utilize high capacity LEO magazines despite the law. After all like civilians, they will balance the law with the need to stay safe and alive.

It’s been said by others but it bears repeating that gun rights supporters need to incorporate the discussion of the role of police in their debates with anti-gun advocates. The purpose of the police carrying firearms isn’t that different from a civilian. Police carry guns because they may need to defend themselves or someone else from harm. Their job is not to execute or kill criminals. Only the military could begin to claim such a responsibility.

So if police are using guns for self defense, then the logic applied to civilians (“you don’t need 10 bullets to kill a deer”) should apply to law enforcement.

The argument that LEO’s are much better trained than your average CCW permit holder is also bogus. Not saying LEO’s are incompetent, but rather proper and quality firearms training is hard to come by. There is a reason why police are the group of firearm owners most likely to shoot themselves with their own weapon. They lack the proper training resources to ensure such incidents are nearly unheard of. It is doubtful that this situation will change since it would require expanding budgets for states and cities that are already stretched thin.

We need to demand our legislature include law enforcement in any assault weapons bans, magazine size restrictions or ammo restrictions. Certainly not because we want to put their safety in jeopardy, but because if having such things makes them safer then it will make civilians safer as well.

Flashwing on January 21, 2013 at 7:37 AM

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