NC appeals on “Choose Life” license plate

posted at 10:01 am on January 5, 2013 by Jazz Shaw

As you may recall, back in early December a US District Court Judge ruled North Carolina’s new “Choose Life” license plate unconstitutional. The basis for the ruling was that the plate constituted viewpoint discrimination under the First Amendment “in the absence of a pro-choice alternative.” But if you think that particular story is over, think again.

The state of North Carolina filed an appeal Friday to a judge’s ruling that license plates with the words “Choose Life” on them are unconstitutional because the state does not offer an alternative for supporters of abortion rights.

The state filed its appeal without comment through the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit, according to court documents.

The original suit was brought by the ACLU, who called the news of the appeal, “unfortunate.” Given that license plates like these are already available in 29 states – widely supported by Choose Life America Inc. – it would certainly seem as if there’s room for an appeal. But as with any new law, a lot depends on the circumstances and the specifics of how it was implemented.

Personally, I find the idea of using license plates for anything other than identifying the owner of the vehicle a rather poor one to begin with. I suppose I don’t have any problem when it’s just a logo to promote the state, but when the government decides to designate that space for pushing an opinion on one side of a controversial subject, it looks even more dubious. It’s simply asking or trouble for no good reason. Do they honestly think hearts and minds are going to be changing on any hotly debated issue of the day based on what people see on a car bumper?

But if we are to have plates like these, it seems that two points would need to be kept in mind while implementing the program. First of all, the plate should be optional, and North Carolina’s passes this test. I happen to support responsible, legal gun ownership, and if my state offered a plate with a slogan along the lines of, “An Armed Society is a Polite Society” I’d probably look into getting one. But by the same token, if my neighbor chooses not to exercise his Second Amendment rights, I wouldn’t wish to force him to have such a plate on his car.

The second point is a bit trickier, but since the courts will apparently be forced to take up the question, it’s an important one. This type of move turns the state produced and controlled license plates into what is, essentially, a government endorsed bulletin board for public debate. By not offering an alternative, I can see where the courts might argue that the government is effectively telling drivers they have a choice of advertising the opinion of the legislative majority or remaining silent in this particular forum. On that basis alone I could see this getting struck down again further up the line. And that could lead to a torrent of lawsuits in the other 29 states offering them, depending on how they implemented their own laws.


Related Posts:

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Comment pages: 1 2

Saw a lot of these on my recent road trip.

Bmore on January 5, 2013 at 10:05 AM

Do they honestly think hearts and minds are going to be changing on any hotly debated issue of the day based on what people see on a car bumper?

Considering people reelected the worst president in history to a second term based on bumpersticker slogans – yes.

Rebar on January 5, 2013 at 10:06 AM

It is a voluntary money enhancer for the state. I do not see why you would argue against it. Like you said, you like the identification purpose it serves, so the state is going to be plating vehicles, why not enhance their income through a voluntary purchase?

I am not sure, but I think I even have to pay for my veteran plates initially.

astonerii on January 5, 2013 at 10:08 AM

Why is the ACLU arguing against giving people the right to express their opinion?

Count to 10 on January 5, 2013 at 10:10 AM

There’s an easy fix. The state can just offer plates that say: “I Support Killing Babies in the Womb.”

If libs really like it, why not say it?

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:12 AM

There’s an easy fix. The state can just offer plates that say: “I Support Killing Babies in the Womb.”

If libs really like it, why not say it?

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:12 AM

Beat me to it. Thanks for stealing my thunder. :).

Timin203 on January 5, 2013 at 10:14 AM

The logical conclusion to the court’s holding is that none of these kinds of license plates would be constitutional. By logical extension, if the state allows any opinion to be stated on a license plate, it must permit every opinion to be printed on a license plate. Therefore, the number of required license plates would be infinite.

Perhaps the result is that the states get out of the license plate business. Although the state may require every car to have a license plate, the state may have regulations for what that plate must conform to, and the state may run a central database to ensure that duplicate markings are not issued, anyone can produce one. Therefore, if you want to support Choose Life America, you can buy a CL plate; if you want to support NAMBLA, you can buy their plate; if no one makes a plate that contains what you want, make your own.

Selkirk on January 5, 2013 at 10:20 AM

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I don’t see how the license plate violates any of that.

SoulGlo on January 5, 2013 at 10:20 AM

As AZCoyote will attest, Arizona already offers that same plate plus a host of others from animal adoption to veterans, heck we even have an “In God we Trust” option. http://www.azdot.gov/mvd/vehicle/mvdplate.asp
The American Commie Lovers Union (ACLU) goes after states where they think they can prevail, and since NC was blue during this time, well…
With the left it’s always the first amendment for me and not for thee, and recentlythey’ve been trying to do the same thing with the 2nd amendment too.

skanter on January 5, 2013 at 10:21 AM

BTW, these plates are typically $25 per annum, think the governments want to lose this revenue stream? ROFLMAO

skanter on January 5, 2013 at 10:23 AM

The basis for the ruling was that the plate constituted viewpoint discrimination under the First Amendment “in the absence of a pro-choice alternative.”

The state didn’t initiate this plate out of thin air, pro-lifers did. The lack of an alternative speaks only to the gumption of the “choose death” constituency.

Akzed on January 5, 2013 at 10:23 AM

In Massachusetts any group that can put together enough signatures can petition the Registry of Motor Vehicles for a series of vanity plates. A proportion of the proceeds from the registration fee goes to the particular charity that is designated.

Vanity plates of this sort run from Red Sox plates that support the Jimmy Fund (childhood cancer research) to firefighter plates (I don’t know the charity involved there) to our own version of Choose Life.

Having the plates is completely voluntary – if you don’t want one then you get a regular old boring prison inmate manufactured license plate.

Assuming that the Choose LIfe plate in NC is similar in its structure of being voluntary I have no problem with it. I do have a problem if the state is issuing them against the will of the vehicle owner. I don’t have any tolerance for government telling me to advance a political argument even if I agree with it.

Rule of thumb, though: if the ACLU is for it, you’ll usually find me against it.

turfmann on January 5, 2013 at 10:24 AM

It’s simply asking or trouble for no good reason.

They have these kinds of plates to make money. And to be honest, I’d rather the state fund itself through voluntary fees than mandatory taxes (nobody is asking you to pay taxes, despite Obama’s claims to the contrary).

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 10:25 AM

By logical extension, if the state allows any opinion to be stated on a license plate, it must permit every opinion to be printed on a license plate.
Selkirk on January 5, 2013 at 10:20 AM

Yep. My AZ license plate is a “pet” plate. It has a pet-friendly slogan: “Pets Enrich Our Lives.” (The $25 extra yearly fee goes into a fund to finance spaying/neutering of strays, a big problem here).

But surely there are AZ citizens who don’t share my opinion that pets are good things. So isn’t the state obligated to offer an “anti pet” tag? Something like: “Pets Suck — I Aim My Vehicle at Strays” — or some such sentiment?

AZ also offers an anti-child abuse plate. It says “It Shouldn’t Hurt to be a Child.” Judging by the number of child abuse cases in AZ courts, that is clearly not an opinion shared by all Arizonans. Is the state obligated to offer a plate that says: “Punch a Kid Today”?

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:32 AM

The state didn’t initiate this plate out of thin air, pro-lifers did. The lack of an alternative speaks only to the gumption of the “choose death” constituency.

Akzed on January 5, 2013 at 10:23 AM

The state legislature rejected a pro-choice license plate. Six times, in fact.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Liberals don’t want the pro-life message out there. What would a counter-view plate say?

Is there a counter-view for a veteran’s plate, like “Make Love Not War”? If not, then, the veteran’s plates have to go, too, according to this judge’s fallacious reasoning.

That’s the problem with liberals–if they can’t be the only ones to have an opinion, no one opposing them should be allowed, either. Then, when they get the soapbox they demand, they still want the other side barred from speaking.

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 10:34 AM

AZ also offers an anti-child abuse plate. It says “It Shouldn’t Hurt to be a Child.” Judging by the number of child abuse cases in AZ courts, that is clearly not an opinion shared by all Arizonans. Is the state obligated to offer a plate that says: “Punch a Kid Today”?

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:32 AM

There you go trying to rebut leftist irrationality and stupidity with logic. A pointless and futile endeavor if there ever was one.

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 10:34 AM

But surely there are AZ citizens who don’t share my opinion that pets are good things. So isn’t the state obligated to offer an “anti pet” tag? Something like: “Pets Suck — I Aim My Vehicle at Strays” — or some such sentiment?

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:32 AM

I think that if a state allows someone to express an opinion via their license plate, they should allow any opinion so long as it does not advocate illegal activity. A much more simple solution is to make the state-issued license plate look professional with no messages on it at all. If people want to put on a bumper sticker next to it, fine. But the state should not be in the business of choosing which speech should be allowed on license plates and which should not.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:36 AM

The state legislature rejected a pro-choice license plate. Six times, in fact.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:32 AM

What do you mean by pro-choice? A plate that says “Choose Life” explicitly acknowledges the existence of a choice. The opposing 1st Amendment position is “Choose death” or “Choose Abortion.” Was that requested? Even Pro-Choice people claim that they want people to choose life – keeping abortion rare and legal.

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 10:39 AM

But the state should not be in the business of choosing which speech should be allowed on license plates and which should not.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:36 AM

And NC is going to spend time and money and other court resources to litigate the ever-loving crap out of that opinion. Great job, North Carolina!/

gryphon202 on January 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM

They could offer the other choice… “Choose Death” and have the Grim Reaper as the license plate logo.

Dasher on January 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM

The basis for the ruling was that the plate constituted viewpoint discrimination under the First Amendment “in the absence of a pro-choice alternative.”

Alternatives:
‘Scrape away that one night stand’
‘Remove your fetus, why burden yourself by that mistake’

socalcon on January 5, 2013 at 10:41 AM

The state legislature rejected a pro-choiceabortion license plate. Six times, in fact.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:32 AM

I’d vote against it too, given the rank dishonesty of the pro-abort contingency.

gryphon202 on January 5, 2013 at 10:41 AM

But the state should not be in the business of choosing which speech should be allowed on license plates and which should not.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:36 AM

I’d agree if not for the fact that the state will have to replace the revenues from voluntary fees with mandatory taxes.

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 10:42 AM

the state should not be in the business of choosing which speech should be allowed on license plates and which should not.

AngusMc on January 5, 2013 at 10:36 AM

I agree.

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:44 AM

Another:

“D & C regularly”

socalcon on January 5, 2013 at 10:45 AM

The state of North Carolina filed an appeal Friday to a judge’s ruling that license plates with the words “Choose Life” on them are unconstitutional because the state does not offer an alternative for supporters of abortion rights.

This is a lie. NC offers an alternative through state-funded abortions.

If that doesn’t qualify as “an alternative for supporters of abortion rights”, I don’t know what is.

BobMbx on January 5, 2013 at 10:46 AM

There are states where money from a specialized plate goes to support a fund like protecting wildlife…Pennsylvania has one. There should be no exceptions to these requsted plates unless they advocate something illegal. And what is the difference bewtween those and the personalized letters and numbers that spell out something?

OT But please remember today is Support Hobby Lobby Day . If you don’t have one nearby you can order online. We supported CFA so we can do the same for HL. They’re a great store with stuff for everyone. I’m getting some man cave stuff for gifts.

Deanna on January 5, 2013 at 10:47 AM

I’m pro choice and still think that NC is completely FUBAR on this. Of course people should be allowed to buy a pro life plate if they want. The good news is that Gov Bev, is out Gov Mcrory is in, and the state gov is going to be GOP so maybe so some changes for the better will be on the way for my state.

MJBrutus on January 5, 2013 at 10:47 AM

And NC is going to spend time and money and other court resources to litigate the ever-loving crap out of that opinion. Great job, North Carolina!/

gryphon202 on January 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM

The ACLU brought this case, not NC. Direct your ire for the waste of resources accordingly.

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 10:47 AM

I say to let NC issue a pro-abortion plate, too. Then after a year, release the stats on how many of which plate was issued.

Or are the pro-killing crowd afraid of that?

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 10:48 AM

And NC is going to spend time and money and other court resources to litigate the ever-loving crap out of that opinion. Great job, North Carolina!/

gryphon202 on January 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM

The ACLU brought this case, not NC. Direct your ire for the waste of resources accordingly.

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 10:47 AM

Let me rephrase that.

…NC is going to have to spend time and money and other court resources to litigate the ever-loving crap out of that opinion.

The rest of my sentiment stands.

gryphon202 on January 5, 2013 at 10:50 AM

Can we outlaw liberals?

Rush has a parody on John Lennon’s song “Imagine.” It’s “Imagine there are no liberals. No Feninazi’s too.’

Seriously, the song brings tears to your eyes. it is so beautiful Same song as before, just different words.

JellyToast on January 5, 2013 at 10:50 AM

Personally, I find the idea of using license plates for anything other than identifying the owner of the vehicle a rather poor one to begin with.

I think its bad taste like vanity tag numbers but whatever – it is was a free country.

CorporatePiggy on January 5, 2013 at 10:51 AM

I say to let NC issue a pro-abortion plate, too. Then after a year, release the stats on how many of which plate was issued.

Or are the pro-killing crowd afraid of that?

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 10:48 AM

.
Thread winner ! (my opinion, anyway)

I like it … : )

listens2glenn on January 5, 2013 at 10:55 AM

I think its bad taste like vanity tag numbers but whatever – it is was a free country.

CorporatePiggy on January 5, 2013 at 10:51 AM

The only “bumper sticker” I ever had on any of my cars was a “2A” sticker on the top right side of my rear window.

VegasRick on January 5, 2013 at 10:57 AM

The plate says CHOOSE . Choice is already respected on the plate. Life is the problem.

CW on January 5, 2013 at 11:03 AM

The logical conclusion to the court’s holding is that none of these kinds of license plates would be constitutional. By logical extension, if the state allows any opinion to be stated on a license plate, it must permit every opinion to be printed on a license plate. Therefore, the number of required license plates would be infinite.

Perhaps the result is that the states get out of the license plate business. Although the state may require every car to have a license plate, the state may have regulations for what that plate must conform to, and the state may run a central database to ensure that duplicate markings are not issued, anyone can produce one. Therefore, if you want to support Choose Life America, you can buy a CL plate; if you want to support NAMBLA, you can buy their plate; if no one makes a plate that contains what you want, make your own.

Selkirk on January 5, 2013 at 10:20 AM

Good thought, Selkirk, but don’t we already have this option?

I think they’re called “bumper stickers” …

RedPepper on January 5, 2013 at 11:03 AM

New Steyn…

Fiscal Cliff Mirage

M2RB: Prince Slave O{+> Whatever & Paul Shanklin’s ‘Party Like It’s 1929′

Resist We Much on January 5, 2013 at 11:03 AM

Suggestions for NC pro-abortion plates: Choose Death; 3,500 Dead Babies Isn’t Enough Blood For Me; Don’t Be “Burdened” With a Baby — Kill It; If It’s an Inconvenient Truth Abort It; I’ve Killed (enter number here) of My Own Children.

Like any of those, libs?

Lizzy on January 5, 2013 at 11:04 AM

I don’t see how the license plate violates any of that.

SoulGlo on January 5, 2013 at 10:20 AM

Lawyers can find anything they want.

CW on January 5, 2013 at 11:04 AM

Like any of those, libs?

Lizzy on January 5, 2013 at 11:04 AM

Ask the puke MJBrutus.

CW on January 5, 2013 at 11:05 AM

A look at the mind (and visage) of one of our oh-so-tolerant betters on the left:

A Face Only Richard Trumka Could Love…

M2RB: Def Leppard

Resist We Much on January 5, 2013 at 11:06 AM

Suggestions for NC pro-abortion plates: Choose Death; 3,500 Dead Babies Isn’t Enough Blood For Me; Don’t Be “Burdened” With a Baby — Kill It; If It’s an Inconvenient Truth Abort It; I’ve Killed (enter number here) of My Own Children.

Like any of those, libs?

Lizzy on January 5, 2013 at 11:04 AM

The most tame thing baby killers could have would be “Pro-Choice.”

Which would then invite people to ask, “Do you feel the same about guns?” and other such kinds of questions. Liberals don’t want that. They just want us all to shut up and go away. Or die, as some lib pundits have already publicly stated.

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 11:08 AM

Why is the ACLU arguing against giving people the right to express their opinion?

Count to 10 on January 5, 2013 at 10:10 AM

Because according to the ACLU, the people aren’t expressing the correct opinion…

JAZZ, you missed the entire point: these plates are offensive and insensitive to the millions of babies aborted since Roe v. Wade… its the law of the land now, as ajudicated by a 5-4 vote by the Supremes… move along…

Khun Joe on January 5, 2013 at 11:10 AM

They could offer the other choice… “Choose Death” and have the Grim Reaper as the license plate logo.

Dasher on January 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM

….should be a big seller!

KOOLAID2 on January 5, 2013 at 11:11 AM

I would rather give up my Carolina Panthers license plate than to see an NC plate with the Steelers logo on it.

mike_NC9 on January 5, 2013 at 11:15 AM

The most tame thing baby killers could have would be “Pro-Choice.”

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 11:08 AM

Yes, the abortion supporters would certainly want a slogan that hides the horror of what they’re supporting. But what would the graphic be? The “Choose Life” plates have the faces of children on them. My AZ pet plate has a dog and cat.

How about a “Pro Choice” or “Support Abortion Rights” plate that features a drawing of a baby half-emerged from a woman’s vagina, with a doctor stabbing a pair of scissors into the base of its skull (i.e., “partial-birth” abortion)? If I were a legislator in NC, I think I’d offer something like that. If people want to declare their support for something, let’s be real about what it is they’re supporting.

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 11:17 AM

What if the state wanted to put up a billboard about the evils of smoking? What if the state wanted to air a TV commercial about eating healthy? How about if a state put “eat healthy” on license plates? Isn’t the government allowed to push its own messages? Granted we might not like a particular message the government is pushing but that doesn’t make it a violation of our rights. The fact that the plates are optional means the people are not compelled to carry the state’s legitimate message.

What is wrong with giving people the “choice of advertising the opinion of the legislative majority”? Nobody is compelled to “[remain] silent in this particular forum.” If the “forum” is the back of the car – the solution is bumper stickers. Nobody is prevented from communicating messages on the back of their car. And being permitted to not carry the state’s message – whether on the most benign of issues or otherwise – doesn’t imply anything about the car owner.

I think the state can have “eat healthy” license plates without also having “get fat” license plates. And NH can have “Live Free or Die” without also having “Socialism is Good for the Soul.”

Crispian on January 5, 2013 at 11:17 AM

The state of NC is making a little money off some plates. Why should they not be able to choose which plates will sell? People can express their opinions regardless. Ever hear of bumper stickers?

If everything has to have a counter message, shouldn’t it apply to all messages? There is a trust God plate. Must there be a don’t believe plate? There are pro NC plates. Should there be a NC stinks plate?

Seems like common sense and being reasonable are not requirements to be a judge.

AnotherJones on January 5, 2013 at 11:20 AM

I would rather give up my Carolina Panthers license plate than to see an NC plate with the Steelers logo on it.

mike_NC9 on January 5, 2013 at 11:15 AM

You guys have an NFL team?

CW on January 5, 2013 at 11:21 AM

They could offer the other choice… “Choose Death” and have the Grim Reaper as the license plate logo.

Dasher on January 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM

….should be a big seller!

KOOLAID2 on January 5, 2013 at 11:11 AM

Death is the opposite of Life so it is logical.

The Pro-Choice movement does not really mean there is a choice unless that choice is an abortion.

Dasher on January 5, 2013 at 11:22 AM

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 11:17 AM

That’s easy: The graphic could be Obama’s composite and imaginary Julia, smiling in the knowledge she’s free of the burden of children. Or maybe Sandra Fluke with a big toothy grin. Surely she’s all for abortion on demand paid for by taxpayers too.

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 11:24 AM

The only “bumper sticker” I ever had on any of my cars was a “2A” sticker on the top right side of my rear window.

VegasRick on January 5, 2013 at 10:57 AM

From a personal security standpoint even that isn’t advised.

You’ll see cars going round town with bumper stickers like “My son is an Honor Student, Okifinokie Middle School”, and “Go Tigers”, and “HopenChange”.

On a minivan or SUV I can reasonably assume:

You have a child of middle school age
I know where it goes to school
You are likely female
You are likely out of the house at the beginning and end of the school day.
You are likely out of the house on game nights

That’s before you start profiling the car choice, condition, and visible contents.

TMI in its truest sense.

CorporatePiggy on January 5, 2013 at 11:29 AM

No one is forced to by an affinity plate…

I’m thinking a “Pro Death Penalty” plate would be an appropriate alternative?

2nd Ammendment Mother on January 5, 2013 at 11:30 AM

My preference would be for every state to have plain black plates with the name of the state and license # (or vanity statement) in vivid white–or black on white, or white on red, etc. Isn’t the point to be able to quickly identify the vehicle (and for some of us, remember what our plates say)?

DrMagnolias on January 5, 2013 at 11:34 AM

Yep. My AZ license plate is a “pet” plate. It has a pet-friendly slogan: “Pets Enrich Our Lives.” (The $25 extra yearly fee goes into a fund to finance spaying/neutering of strays, a big problem here).

Yep. My AZ license plate is a “Veteran” plate and OMG it has an American Flag on it, I gladly pay the $25 extra yearly fee becuase it goes a fund to veteran’s issues. I agree with the folks on the whole “vanity” plate issue, the look at me sayings are sad. But the ’cause’ plates allow you to direct money to issues that you support and I see them as anti-vanity plates.

skanter on January 5, 2013 at 11:35 AM

“…but when the government decides to designate that space for pushing an opinion on one side of a controversial subject, it looks even more dubious.”

Who are you to determine what’s controversial? Pro-life people support a child’s right to life. That may be controversial in your view, but not to those who disagree with you. Why do we have to defer to your omnipotent judgement on these decisions?

Intrepid767 on January 5, 2013 at 11:38 AM

An alternative for supporters of abortion: CHOOSE DEATH.

Problem solved.

locomotivebreath1901 on January 5, 2013 at 11:41 AM

skanter on January 5, 2013 at 11:35 AM

Maybe you shouldn’t be allowed to have that plate. The American flag might be offensive to some Mexicans. /sarc

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 11:45 AM

CW on January 5, 2013 at 11:21 AM

Get all the sarcastic shots in while you can brother.

mike_NC9 on January 5, 2013 at 11:51 AM

OT But please remember today is Support Hobby Lobby Day . If you don’t have one nearby you can order online. We supported CFA so we can do the same for HL. They’re a great store with stuff for everyone. I’m getting some man cave stuff for gifts.

Deanna on January 5, 2013 at 10:47 AM

oh no, i didn’t know about that. thanks for spreading the word, i hope people do this if they can! (although sadly i am unable to do it today)

Sachiko on January 5, 2013 at 11:53 AM

BTW, these plates are typically $25 per annum, think the governments want to lose this revenue stream?

Exactly. Political messages have no place on license plates and shouldn’t be allowed.

bobs1196 on January 5, 2013 at 12:13 PM

Let’s post the names and addresses of card carrying ACLU member on the internet…….. then listen to them squall like a mashed cat (no offense to my kitties).

ultracon on January 5, 2013 at 12:16 PM

The idea that the slogan “Choose Life” is promoted by people who are doing everything they can to make sure that childbirth is compulsory and that women are given NO choice is rather ironic.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:22 PM

I guess that means we can sue the government for forcing cigarette companies to print all those anti-smoking messages on their packages and advertisements. Where’s the balance? Where’s the government equal treatment for the pro-smoking argument? It’s unconstitutional, man!

Socratease on January 5, 2013 at 12:23 PM

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:22 PM

Pro-choice about joining a union?

Resist We Much on January 5, 2013 at 12:24 PM

Format fail!

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:22 PM

Pro-choice about joining a union?

Resist We Much on January 5, 2013 at 12:24 PM

Keep politics off of license plates. Period.

Alas, it’s too late now. Yet another innocuous thing taken over by hyper-partisan hacks.

Moesart on January 5, 2013 at 12:24 PM

Pro-choice about joining a union?

Resist We Much on January 5, 2013 at 12:24 PM

Yes.

However, if you decide not to join a union, you’re not entitled to the benefits that unions negotiate on behalf of union memembers.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:27 PM

There’s an easy fix. The state can just offer plates that say: “I Support Killing Babies in the Womb.”

If libs really like it, why not say it?

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 10:12 AM

HEY! I REALLY like that idea!

oldleprechaun on January 5, 2013 at 12:28 PM

Keep politics off of license plates. Period.

Alas, it’s too late now. Yet another innocuous thing taken over by hyper-partisan hacks.

Moesart on January 5, 2013 at 12:24 PM

It’s not politics. It’s morality.

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 12:28 PM

I suppose I don’t have any problem when it’s just a logo to promote the state, but when the government decides to designate that space for pushing an opinion on one side of a controversial subject, it looks even more dubious.

It’s a form of free speech that someone ASKED FOR AND PAID FOR. It’s in the same vein as vanity plates. The government isn’t pushing anything in this case in my opinion as it’s a matter of choice not a requirement.

HotAirian on January 5, 2013 at 12:29 PM

The idea that the slogan “Choose Life” is promoted by people who are doing everything they can to make sure that childbirth is compulsory and that women are given NO choice is rather ironic.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:22 PM

“childbirth is compulsory”? I am truly sorry, but apparently I missed whatever it is that forces women to bear children. I know of nothing which makes childbirth “compulsory” any more than I’m familiar with anything that makes prostitution “compulsory”. Women have choices. If their choice is to engage in numerous, random, indiscriminate sexual acts, with total disregard for the potential consequences it would seem that they have made choices, albeit, bad ones. Sometimes we make bad decisions. Murdering babies doesn’t suddenly make those decisions good.

oldleprechaun on January 5, 2013 at 12:37 PM

Good Lord chump, stupid statement, even coming from you. Flail!

Bmore on January 5, 2013 at 12:45 PM

“childbirth is compulsory”? I am truly sorry, but apparently I missed whatever it is that forces women to bear children.

Denial of access to abortion. If a woman is prevented from ending her pregnancy by laws or regulations, she will have no choice but to give birth.

I know of nothing which makes childbirth “compulsory” any more than I’m familiar with anything that makes prostitution “compulsory”.

False analogy.

Women have choices. If their choice is to engage in numerous, random, indiscriminate sexual acts, with total disregard for the potential consequences it would seem that they have made choices, albeit, bad ones. Sometimes we make bad decisions. Murdering babies doesn’t suddenly make those decisions good.

oldleprechaun on January 5, 2013 at 12:37 PM

I see. Women have choices, but only the choices you want them to have.

If their choice is to engage in numerous, random, indiscriminate sexual acts, with total disregard for the potential consequences…

And how long have you been a member of the sex police morality committee? Even using the most prejudicial language you could think up, if a woman decides to do as you’ve described, it’s still none of your business. She doesn’t give up her reproductive right just because you don’t like the way she lives her life.

A woman can’t “choose life” if she has no alternatives.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:48 PM

How about “pro-birth, not pro life”

Pablo Honey on January 5, 2013 at 12:50 PM

Choose death. Pro abortion plate coming soon.

Bmore on January 5, 2013 at 12:52 PM

I see. Women have choices, but only the choices you want them to have.

Apparently only the choices you want them to have.

Bmore on January 5, 2013 at 12:54 PM

Boob wrote

Exactly. Political messages have no place on license plates and shouldn’t be allowed.

Err, how exactly is publicizing my status as a veteran a political message? Does this offend the draft dodgers of my day? Seriously, just say what you mean, you only like the first amendment when you agree with what is being said. Typical Leftist

skanter on January 5, 2013 at 12:56 PM

Denial of access to abortion. If a woman is prevented from ending her pregnancy by laws or regulations, she will have no choice but to give birth.

If she does not want to give birth, she still has the choice not to get pregnant in the first place. Condoms, spermicide, IUDs, birth-control pills/patches, tubal ligation, abstinence, etc. The ways to avoid unwanted pregnancies are many and varied.

But yes, if a woman has an unwanted pregnancy despite the many, many ways she could have avoided it, there is a point at which her rights give way to the rights of the other person she has brought into being through her sexual choices: the baby.

AZCoyote on January 5, 2013 at 1:07 PM

The Richmond Tea Party in VA petitioned to create a license plate based on the Gadsen flag. It’s awesome. I don’t do bumper stickers, esp not of politicians, but this allows me to, for $10 a year, proclaim “don’t tread on me” w my license plate, to counter the many, many obama stickers all over town.

kshoosh on January 5, 2013 at 1:08 PM

However, if you decide not to join a union, you’re not entitled to the benefits that unions negotiate on behalf of union memembers.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:27 PM

Fine. Tell the Left that.

Resist We Much on January 5, 2013 at 1:15 PM

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013

…Hi!…GFY!
…multiple times!

KOOLAID2 on January 5, 2013 at 1:20 PM

And how long have you been a member of the sex police morality committee? Even using the most prejudicial language you could think up, if a woman decides to do as you’ve described, it’s still none of your business. She doesn’t give up her reproductive [consequence-free sexual hedonism] right just because you don’t like the way she lives her life.

A woman can’t “choose life” if she has no alternatives.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:48 PM

.
She also can’t choose abortion murder, either.
.
For instance, right now I’d like to murder you, chump’. But the (expletive) law denies me that right, dammit !

THAT’S DENYING ME MY FREEDOM OF CHOICE . . . . . . . . . . . . .

listens2glenn on January 5, 2013 at 1:28 PM

A woman can’t “choose life” if she has no alternatives.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:48 PM

What are you talking about? People choose to break God’s laws all the time. The fact that there are consequences does not eliminate the existence of the choice.

Ronnie on January 5, 2013 at 2:20 PM

These plates are always optional. Just like my son the firefighter has a firefighter plate on his car.
These plates absolutely identify the car with a specific person and they are not forced on anyone.
I have a Choose Life tag here in Florida.
if the ACLU doesn’t like it they can have a plate stating they Like Abortion
To Heck with the ACLU and Go NC Go

Delsa on January 5, 2013 at 2:24 PM

These plates are always optional. Just like my son the firefighter has a firefighter plate on his car.
These plates absolutely identify the car with a specific person and they are not forced on anyone.
I have a Choose Life tag here in Florida.
if the ACLU doesn’t like it they can have a plate stating they Like Abortion
To Heck with the ACLU and Go NC Go

Delsa on January 5, 2013 at 2:24 PM

Liberal counter-point to the Firefighter’s plate: “Let It Burn”.

Liam on January 5, 2013 at 2:34 PM

So Jazz, you believe in a woman’s ‘right’ to kill her unborn child. There is really no other reason to believe there is a problem with these plates.

wayno on January 5, 2013 at 3:03 PM

Choosing Life is not religious. It’s moral.

John the Libertarian on January 5, 2013 at 3:16 PM

Personally, I find the idea of using license plates for anything other than identifying the owner of the vehicle a rather poor one to begin with.

This. Let’s go back to the day when you had to put a bumper sticker on your car if you wanted to express affinity with … anything. It should be one license plate style per state (per type of vehicle), without any fancy graphics to muck up reading the numbers/letters. Period.

but when the government decides to designate that space for pushing an opinion on one side of a controversial subject, it looks even more dubious.

But, the state isn’t expressing an opinion. It’s merely selling license plate space to let someone else express their opinion.

Here’s the real weird bit: in VA (as elsewhere) you can get a plate for a college that is a state college – in another state. So, the state is actively promoting an out-of-state university, while sending a good portion of the proceeds to that out-of-state college. Huh???

Please, let’s get governments out of the frickin’ bumper sticker business, and restricting them to simply isuing a plate that shows your registration number, the issuing state and the expiration (and the type of tag it is). If you want to promote Home Schooling, or Duke University, or VA Tech, or Choosing Life, or Lighthouses, or any of over 200 different plates (in VA), join a group, donate your money, and buy a freakin’ bumper sticker.

GWB on January 5, 2013 at 3:19 PM

Err, how exactly is publicizing my status as a veteran a political message?

skanter on January 5, 2013 at 12:56 PM

You want to advertise your status as a veteran? Fine, buy a bumper sticker (or a license plate holder). Plenty of folks around here do. As far as your license plate, it should visibly identify your vehicle to the state authorities and nothing more.

GWB on January 5, 2013 at 3:22 PM

She doesn’t give up her reproductive right just because you don’t like the way she lives her life.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:48 PM

She didn’t give up her reproductive right at all: she exercised that choice… and got pregnant. Now it’s no longer a reproductive choice – it’s the choice of whether to murder a defenseless human being.

What you really want, is the ability to have sex without any consequences, regardless of whether you have to kill someone to make that happen. Well, I choose to defend those you want to kill.

GWB on January 5, 2013 at 3:27 PM

However, if you decide not to join a union, you’re not entitled to the benefits that unions negotiate on behalf of union memembers.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:27 PM

Why not?

BobMbx on January 5, 2013 at 4:33 PM

Time for states to ignore the lawless Feds and abide by their own laws.

Sherman1864 on January 5, 2013 at 4:45 PM

However, if you decide not to join a union, you’re not entitled to the benefits that unions negotiate on behalf of union memembers.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:27 PM

I am if the union prevents me from negotiating on my own behalf, which would be preferable since I have actual marketable skills.

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 5:39 PM

A woman can’t “choose life” if she has no alternatives.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:48 PM

She has choices under the law. The plate promotes choosing life, which you leftists generally say that you also support (the whole “rare” canard). So, why all of the squealing like a stuck pig?

besser tot als rot on January 5, 2013 at 5:46 PM

Choose Death – would be the alternate to Choose Life.

Maybe “Choose Skull Crushing”? “Choose Brain Stem Severing”?

I’m not a pro-lifer, but I find the nonsensical hypocrisy and disregarding of what is or will be, a baby, to be infuriating. They idiocy makes me lean toward pro-life. Most of them as well are against the death penalty. When a child is a commodity that tends to “inconvenience” would-be parents, or society (in their words), and therefore should be removed, humanity ceases to exist.

ego-centricism, leads to decline of culture and society. This is why I cannot be a full libertarian. Some so-con is advisable.

John Kettlewell on January 5, 2013 at 7:19 PM

Why on earth should the state offer a pro-choice alternative?

A plate that says “choose life” is not in the least an anti-choice plate. To the contary, it acknowledges that pro-choice is the law of the land. It merely urges a particular choice.

Being pro-life is not believing simply that people should choose life. It’s believing that abortion should be illegal. The plate doesn’t advocate that, and thus it’s not contrary to a pro-choice point of view at all.

What many pro-choice people seem to believe is that being pro-choice obliges them to be indifferent to what choice a person makes. That’s a non sequitur. It would be possible to always favor live birth and still be in favor of legal abortion. That wouldn’t make a person “pro-life” in a legal sense, but what’s remarkable is the number of people — on both sides of the issue — who don’t realize this distinction.

“But you shouldn’t interfere with a woman’s right to choose by trying to persuade her.” Why not? It’s not in the least contrary to “pro-choice” to attempt to persuade a woman to “choose life.” People constantly advise their friends. The government imposes sin taxes in part to discourage behaviors that raise health care costs — in short, to coerce choices. That doesn’t mean those choices are in threat of becoming illegal.

There’s a lot of muddled thinking in this world. The moment something becomes politically charged, folks seem to exempt a matter from normal canons of reason. It’s weird.

rasqual on January 5, 2013 at 10:51 PM

C’MON ‘CHUMP … are you going to get back here and respond, or what?
.

She doesn’t give up her reproductive [consequence-free sexual hedonism] right just because you don’t like the way she lives her life.
A woman can’t “choose life” if she has no alternatives.

chumpThreads on January 5, 2013 at 12:48 PM

.
She also can’t choose abortion murder, either.
.
For instance, right now I’d like to murder you, chump’. But the (expletive) law denies me that right, dammit !

THAT’S DENYING ME MY FREEDOM OF CHOICE . . . . . . . . . . . . .

listens2glenn on January 5, 2013 at 1:28 PM

listens2glenn on January 5, 2013 at 11:42 PM

Comment pages: 1 2