Fiscal cliff: Does Boehner have the votes? Update: Boehner vs. Cantor? Update: Boehner to vote yes? Report: House has majority for Senate bill; Update: Bill passes, 257-167

posted at 1:23 pm on January 1, 2013 by Allahpundit

I can’t believe this is what we’re doing on our holiday.

Well said, but don’t forget the punchline: Because the Bush tax cuts will be extended for most earners with next to nothing in offsetting spending cuts, the “deficit reduction deal” technically increases the deficit by nearly $4 trillion over the next decade. Bill Kristol, urging the House to vote yes in the interest of avoiding sequester defense cuts, aptly describes it as a “mess”:

The fiscal cliff deal that the Senate passed early this morning is ridiculous in too many ways to count. There seem to be no figures from the Congressional Budget Office and only “very preliminary” figures from the Joint Tax Committee about the real spending and revenue implications. The two month delay of the sequester will make actual governance even more difficult (how is the Pentagon supposed to plan for the rest of the year?). The sequester delay is funded by a gimmick with retirement savings tax rules that is a caricature of what has become of Washington legislation and policy making. Working Americans making less than $400,000 will be shocked when they find that, contrary to promises from both parties, their taxes are in fact going up (the payroll tax). And we will face another cliff when we hit the debt ceiling and the sequester again in two months.

The deal is a sad commentary on our politics today.

Actually, we face two more cliffs, first the sequester/debt ceiling standoff and then another over the next budget continuing resolution. If you’re serious about fiscal sustainability, the stakes couldn’t be lower. To the extent today’s House vote is interesting, it’s interesting as a type of bread-and-circus: Whether they pass the Senate bill today or pass a marginally less dismal deal in a week or two, the only thing that’s interesting about any of this is the facile political suspense of whether Boehner can muster enough Republican votes, whether Biden can keep Pelosi and House Democrats in line, and what it all means for the next zero-stakes confrontation between Obama and the GOP a few months from now. Ultimately, I think The One is the only player here who had appropriate contempt for the process. He knew nothing important would be achieved so he focused on tax hikes to try to diminish the opposition by driving a wedge in their caucus. In the end, he gave a little on the income threshold in exchange for fracturing House Republicans. Not a bad trade short-term.

Anyway. Does Boehner have the votes? Quite possibly, says the Hill:

To assess party loyalty, The Hill analyzed five controversial bills on fiscal matters that sparked outcry from factions on the right and significant defections from House GOP members: a March 15, 2011 stopgap funding bill; an April 14, 2011 bill that averted a government shutdown; an Aug. 1 roll call on the Budget Control Act; a Nov. 17, 2011 “minibus” appropriations measure; and a Feb. 17, 2012 vote to extend the payroll tax holiday. Republican defections ranged from 54 to 101 on these bills.

Despite the GOP infighting, 92 House Republicans didn’t buck leadership on any on of those measures. This group includes leadership lawmakers, committee and subcommittee chairmen and a surprising number of freshman members. Some of Boehner’s loyal legislators include GOP Reps. Cole, Steven LaTourette (Ohio), Pete King (N.Y.), Darrell Issa (Calif.), Gary Miller (Calif.), Tom Marino (Pa.), Jon Runyan (N.J.) and Steve Stivers (Ohio)…

There are an additional 51 House Republicans who broke ranks on only one of the five votes reviewed by The Hill, including GOP Reps. Bob Goodlatte (Va.), Jeb Hensarling (Texas), Tom Latham (Iowa), Steve Scalise (La.) and Frank Wolf (Va.).

That’s 143 gettable votes. Even if he lost 22 of those, he’d still have enough left over to keep his promise not to bring something to the floor that isn’t supported by a majority of House Republicans. The intrigue will come if he’s close to the magic number but not quite there. In that case, he’ll have to choose: Does he bring the bill to the floor anyway, risking a revolt in Thursday’s Speaker election, or does he torpedo the bill even though it likely will have majority support among the entire House? The GOP caucus is meeting as I write this to sound out its members, but reportedly they’re planning to have at least one more meeting today before making a decision on whether to vote. Are you not entertained?

Here’s Tom Cole, a Boehner loyalist, telling MSNBC he’ll definitely vote for the bill. He predicted this morning that a majority of House Republicans will vote yes as well. One other subplot to watch out for: How will Paul Ryan vote? He backed Boehner on Plan B, but with Rubio having voted no last night, the anti-tax ante for 2016 contenders has been upped. Ryan’s dilemma is that he wields much more influence over his caucus colleagues than Rubio does over his, so if he peels off, he could take enough with him to jeopardize the bill. Exit question: Democrats are crowing this morning that, having forced the GOP to accept new tax hikes now, it’ll be easier to make them do so again during the debt-ceiling negotiations. Is that true or will it actually be harder next time after Republicans face a backlash from their base and insist that they already checked the tax box back during the fiscal-cliff compromise?

Visit NBCNews.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy

Update: Hmmmmmmmmmm.

Update: Sure sounds like we’re not going to have a vote today.

Update: More from Politico:

An overwhelming number of House Republicans in a party meeting Tuesday are calling on their leadership to amend the Senate’s bill to avert the fiscal cliff and send it back to the upper chamber, according to several sources in the meeting…

There is also some regret among Republicans about the party defeating Speaker John Boehner’s “Plan B” before the holidays, which would have raised taxes on millionaires, whereas the bill the Senate passed around 2 a.m. New Year’s Day raises taxes on households making more than $450,000…

Emerging as a stick point among House Republicans is how McConnell and Biden delayed the sequester — automatic spending cuts. The two-month delay is being viewed by House Republicans as inadequate in that it doesn’t reduce spending immediately.

Hope they’re ready for the backlash tomorrow when markets open way down and our fair and balanced press corps gets back to work.

Update: At least we’re getting our money’s worth of political suspense from this ridiculous charade.

If Boehner brings the bill to the floor over Cantor’s opposition, does that guarantee a “Boehner vs. Cantor” election for Speaker on Thursday?

Update: A few commenters are grumbling about my backlash point above. Fact: There will be a backlash tomorrow if this doesn’t pass. It is what it is. And that’s fine — it’s worth driving a hard bargain to get something important done, even at the price of a backlash. Just remind me again what “important” goal will be achieved by forcing a new round of negotiations. What sort of spending cuts do you expect to see here? A trillion dollars over 10 years when we’re running trillion-dollar deficits annually? Even if they got Obama to agree to that, why would you believe that future Congresses would allow those cuts to happen down the line? This entire process is an elaborate charade designed to postpone the ultimate reckoning on entitlement reform, and you’re simply not going to wring serious entitlement reform out of the Democrats given the two parties’ current postures. Obama just won reelection; the Democrats expanded their numbers in the House and Senate; entitlement reform remains depressingly unpopular among the public despite attempts to educate them about the role mandatory spending plays in driving the national debt. House Republicans aren’t going to hold out for weeks on end in the futile hope of revamping Medicare against that backdrop while middle-class voters stew over their new, higher tax brackets. Why risk some of the GOP’s small reserve of political capital on a deal that’s only negligibly less terrible than this one? I understand the “let it burn” strategy, to force the public to fully absorb the cost of big government. I don’t understand this one.

A quote from Philip Klein: “There’s a lot to hate in this deal, no doubt. But any honest assessment of it must grapple with the reality of Obama as president, Harry Reid as Senate Majority Leader and $4.5 trillion in automatic tax hikes hitting in the new year. With this in mind, I’d rate the deal as objectively bad, but relatively good.”

Update: House Republicans weigh the backlash factor.

Update: If this is true, Boehner’s goal of 120+ Republican votes seems impossible:

Update: And now some pressure on Boehner from the left as a Democratic aide warns that the Senate bill is a take-it-or-leave-it proposition:

“The House Republicans have two choices: cut their losses and pass the deal now, or else put up a fight they cannot win and pass the same deal a few days now after being further humiliated,” said a Senate Democratic leadership aide.

Another senior Democratic aide said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) will not reconsider the bill, which passed by a vote of 89 to 8.

“We’re done,” said the aide.

Update: The word on Twitter is that the GOP caucus will huddle at 5:15 ET. Possible outcomes: Boehner has the votes for the Senate plan and brings it to the floor to try to pass it; Boehner *doesn’t* have the votes but brings it to the floor so that House Republicans can add amendments related to spending cuts; Boehner refuses to bring it to the floor. The first outcome seems unlikely and the third would suffer from terrible optics, so expect JB to choose what’s behind door number two.

Update: Good question.

Update: Sounds like Boehner’s going to give the Senate bill a shot — maybe.

In other words, for the Senate bill to come to the floor, something like 15 Republicans have to oppose amending the bill to include spending cuts. Are there 15 in the entire caucus willing to go on record and do that, even if they’re doing it in the interest of trying to pass the Senate bill now and avert fiscal-cliff aftershocks tomorrow?

Update: The strategy here, I assume, is to use the prospective failure of the amended bill to prove to Republicans that nothing except the Senate bill can pass the House. If they can’t get 218 among their own caucus to support extending the negotiations by demanding cuts, then maybe some GOPers who dislike the Senate bill will hold their noses and vote for it.

Update: Yep, sure sounds like that’s what Boehner has in mind. He’s trying to get the Senate bill through:

Update: A Senate Democratic leadership aide reiterates that a vote to amend the bill in the House is effectively a vote to kill the Senate bill. There’ll be no more fiscal cliff action until the new Congress is seated on Thursday. Quote: “The aide added that House Republicans should not have stepped away from White House negotiations if they needed spending reductions to get the deal.”

Update: DrewM wonders if the spending-cuts amendment might fail simply because some critical mass of conservatives refuses to vote for any bill that doesn’t extend the Bush tax cuts for everyone. In other words, they’ll vote no even on an amended bill because it lets taxes go up on earners who make $450K. The amount of spending cuts attached will be irrelevant. If that’s what they end up doing, it’ll be an awfully dangerous gamble. Once the amended bill fails, you’ll see 100+ Democratic votes flood in for the unamended Senate bill; conceivably you could see nearly the entire Dem caucus vote yes, which means it would take only 40-50 Republicans to vote with them to pass the Biden/McConnell bill with zero cuts. (One of the earlier updates above suggested that that might be feasible.) What that would mean for Boehner’s Speakership, given that he’ll have violated the “majority of the majority” rule to pass it, I don’t know.

Another possibility: What if the amended bill fails and then the up-or-down vote on the Senate bill fails too? After the failure of Plan B and then the failure of two compromise bills, the narrative tomorrow will be that virtually nothing can pass the House.

Update: Sounds like an up-or-down vote might be coming:

Update: Wow. First time I’ve heard this all day:

Update: Just to underscore my point earlier about what a farce this all is, here’s what the House is mulling as their big counteroffer to the Senate on spending:

If there are enough GOP votes to pass the first approach, the House would amend the fiscal cliff bill and send it back to the Senate, the aide said. A second senior GOP leadership aide said that leaders were mulling adding $300 billion in spending cuts to the bill. Details of those cuts weren’t yet available.

That’s $300 billion over 10 years, I take it, or $30 billion annually. Now, go look at this graphic at Zero Hedge and see for yourself how much $30 billion is relative to the annual deficits we’re running these days. This “spending cuts” proposal is a face-saving gesture by the GOP, nothing more. And it still might not pass their own caucus.

Update: Robert Costa says the spending-cuts amendment is in deep trouble:

Can Pelosi deliver 150-170 Democrats? That’s a tall order even for her.

Update: According to GOP Rep. Tim Murphy, the House will vote on the Senate bill sometime tonight. Apparently they couldn’t find 218 Republicans willing to vote for the bill even with a few hundred billion in spending cuts tacked on as an amendment.

Update: I’m honestly shocked:

Remember, the Speaker typically doesn’t vote on bills. He’ll get enough flak from conservative groups if this thing passes with less than a Republican majority that you’d think he wouldn’t want to double down by lending his own vote to the compromise, especially with Cantor publicly opposed to the bill. Either he’s supremely confident that there aren’t 17 Republicans in the caucus willing to block his election as Speaker on Thursday or he’s reached the point where he doesn’t care if they do.

Update: Robert Costa says Boehner’s confident he has 218 from the full House for the Senate bill:

Chuck Todd hears that the vote may come at around 9:30 ET.

Update: Hmmmm:

Update: A footnote from Robert Costa: Allegedly, Boehner will vote only if his vote is needed to get to 218.

Update: The word on Twitter is that the final vote will come at around 11:15 p.m. ET. If you’re sticking around for the end of this charade, you’re a more diligent political junkie than me.

Update: At 11 p.m. ET, it’s a done deal. 257-167, with Democrats providing most of the votes. The Dems split 172-16, Republicans split 85-151. Boehner didn’t come close to satisfying the “majority of the majority” rule, which leaves him on thin ice for Thursday’s Speaker vote. At least he didn’t hide, though: He voted yes tonight, as did Paul Ryan, much to Team Rubio’s delight. Meanwhile, the rest of the leadership team — i.e. Eric Cantor and Kevin McCarthy — voted no, although Cantor waited until the bill had 218 votes to register his meaningless disapproval.

Hard to believe we might have the same leadership in the next Congress as we did for this process, but then not long ago it was also hard to believe we’d have the same leadership in the White House and the Senate in 2013 as we had in 2012. And yet here we are.


Related Posts:

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Comment pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 13

This whole thread (and indeed all of Hot Air lately ) reminds me of Macbeth……

……..it is a tale,
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

LegendHasIt on January 1, 2013 at 4:13 PM

Why you are The Wise One.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:15 PM

If the Tea Party scuttles this, they need to go third party.

The GOP doesn’t need these perpetual losers dragging them down and they are not dependable votes. Hard core tea party activists sat home for the last three elections. Tea Party candidates blew a chance to twice take back the Senate

The Tea Party is full of people who fantasize about living out “Red Dawn”. Sane individuals would rather than country continue on and are not hording ammunition and MREs in their basement in gleeful anticipation of the collapse of the country.

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

Stockton/CA declared bankruptcy.

Leftist countermeasures:

1. Cut services
2. Increase fees and tickets
3. Continue paying politicians and high pensions for union goons and sheeple

The can was kicked down the road, then shredded and it’s still ‘kicking’, for now.

How long do you think producers hang out in such a hellhole?

How do you think it ends for the US?

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:20 PM

If you can type it out into something resembling coherent sentences, we would all love to see that piece of work.

PolAgnostic on January 1, 2013 at 4:15 PM

.
Nothing wrong with disagreeing with Allah’, but was the condescension really necessary?

listens2glenn on January 1, 2013 at 4:21 PM

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

Someone should introduce you to President McCain, and Pres Elect Romney.

MontanaMmmm on January 1, 2013 at 4:21 PM

So if the House doesn’t pass the Senate bill, then everybody’s taxes go up, because the Senate won’t budge.

I don’t think that hurts the GOP any more than it hurts Congressional Democrats.

hawksruleva on January 1, 2013 at 4:22 PM

Another senior Democratic aide said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) will not reconsider the bill, which passed by a vote of 89 to 8.

“We’re done,” said the aide

dingy needs a mob style beat dowm.

BallisticBob on January 1, 2013 at 4:22 PM

Look if you limit my deductions at 250k and above and raise
the rate ……that’s a tax hike .
No one is talking about this and even Heritage does not have #’s
on this !
This is a small business killer and it will be a huge drag on real estate .
Issa just said he will NOT vote for this !
Yippi !
Lucano on January 1, 2013 at 4:09 PM

I did some clicking around last night because I could find very little details as well. Disappointing there is more discussion of politics than details.

From what I can tell it’s for over $400k, and this bill keeps it better, the fiscal cliff would let it become worse like the tax cuts, but I’m not sure. Google Pease Exemption and PEP, Personal Exception Phaseout. Tell me what you come up with. :P

rose-of-sharon on January 1, 2013 at 4:23 PM

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

Either you forgot your sarc tag, or your an idiot.

D-fusit on January 1, 2013 at 4:23 PM

The Democrat Party is full of people who fantasize about living out “Red America”. Sane individuals would rather than country go back to liberty and are not attempting to outlaw firearms in gleeful anticipation of the collapse of the country.

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

FTFY, liberal trolltard.

We are far past the point where any kind of political solution is forthcoming. Especially not from the party of death and ruinous taxes whose shoes you shine with your tongue.

And for your information (if you can actually be educated) it will be a lot less like Red Dawn and a lot more like Mad Max, if we have it that good.

MelonCollie on January 1, 2013 at 4:23 PM

Assuming “the trains” are supposed to be taking us to Auschwitz, I’d invoke Godwin’s Law here.

Raising marginal tax rates on the highest earners is not exactly Kristallnacht.

Perspective, people!

sauropod on January 1, 2013 at 3:31 PM

In the 90s I was part of a small Christian fellowship.

The leaders drifted off into serious heresy. I sensed that the direction long before I spoke out, then departed. The consequences for many of my dearest friends were devastating.

I second guess myself. Should I have spoken earlier? Would it have made a difference?

Over the years in other churches I’d hear a leader say something that if allowed its logical progression could and would lead to at least erroneous doctrine. I wonder. Should I say something? How long do I let it go?

In our country, only the willfully ignorant or the willingly complicit cannot/will not see the direction we are headed. History provides too many examples for us to dismiss that what is happening is merely minor differences between two parties.

So. The questions are, when do we sound the alarm? Is it too late to simply sound alarms? When does hyperbole cease to be hyperbole and becomes reasonable and sane?

We are in a situation where people will lose freedom. What do we do about it? When do we do it?

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 4:24 PM

Either you forgot your sarc tag, or your an idiot.

D-fusit on January 1, 2013 at 4:23 PM

He didn’t forget any tags. He’s a liberal idiot who in past times would be in stocks in the village square getting rotten vegetables thrown at his piss-ugly face.

MelonCollie on January 1, 2013 at 4:24 PM

“The House Republicans have two choices: cut their losses and pass the deal now, or else put up a fight they cannot win and pass the same deal a few days now after being further humiliated,” said a Senate Democratic leadership aide.

Another senior Democratic aide said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) will not reconsider the bill, which passed by a vote of 89 to 8.

“We’re done,” said the aide.

The GOP House should respond if they had any balls:

“Nuts”

William Eaton on January 1, 2013 at 4:24 PM

So the Senate bill makes most of the Bush tax cuts permanent, and permanently fixes the AMT issue? That’s pretty good for a crappy bill.

hawksruleva on January 1, 2013 at 4:24 PM

…Call it Godwin’s Law if you like. I’m wondering what other people throughout history criticized people for invoking when they said “Hey, that could never happen here.”

Bishop on January 1, 2013 at 3:39 PM

Yup, right again Bishop. As the saying goes:
First they came for ________, and I did nothing.
Then they came for _________, and I did nothing.
Fill in the blanks….

sicoit on January 1, 2013 at 4:24 PM

The Tea Party is full of people who fantasize about living out “Red Dawn”. Sane individuals would rather than country continue on and are not hording ammunition and MREs in their basement in gleeful anticipation of the collapse of the country.

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

Yeah, we would – nothing happening in DC vaguely resembles what ‘sane individuals’ would undertake if the goal is to see “that the country continue on” – which is why so many ‘sane individuals’ are preparing as necessary for the inevitable collapse that the DC actions are steering us towards.

No ‘glee’ in it, just pragmatic assessment of reality. Try some.

Midas on January 1, 2013 at 4:25 PM

Just do the right thing and that, for Repub. conservative House members, means “Hell, no!”
Obama won the Presidency but he is not Emperor. He has less than 50% of the people who support his policies, and Republican conservatives need to be as far away as possible from the fiscal diarrhea that will surely come raining down when some version of this crap sandwich is passed.
Boehner may get the House to swallow, and there may be momentary relief, but the real effects of ingesting poison will soon block and shut down the economy. Then the American people will be angry and in pain. They will look for s remedy. Think 2014.

Randy

williars on January 1, 2013 at 4:26 PM

“The House Republicans have two choices: cut their losses and pass the deal now, or else put up a fight they cannot win and pass the same deal a few days now after being further humiliated,” said a Senate Democratic leadership aide.

Another senior Democratic aide said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) will not reconsider the bill, which passed by a vote of 89 to 8.

“We’re done,” said the aide.

They got what they wanted. GOP senators votring to raise taxes and Boehner proposing Plan B, which would have raised taxes over a million. They got the GOP to sell out its last principle, if you could even call it that.

The numbers don’t mean that much to them. It’s the win with the ultimate GOP cave.

Wethal on January 1, 2013 at 4:27 PM

Cantor no ! Issa no !
Popcorn !

Lucano on January 1, 2013 at 4:27 PM

The GOP will forever be known as the party that let the middle class see their taxes raised.

mrscullen on January 1, 2013 at 4:28 PM

Sane individuals would rather than country continue on and are not hording ammunition and MREs in their basement in gleeful anticipation of the collapse of the country.

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

If you want to find sane individuals, don’t look into the mirror. Simple math (I mean, simple for those who didn’t fluke it in 8th grade) says that a collapse is inevitable regardless of cliffs, ceilings, and other serious-sounding political shit. You can no more grow out of the country’s current debt than pick up a turd by a clean end. It can be debated whether gold coins, MREs, or bullets will be most valuable during the collapse, and whether we’ll be able to kick the can down the road into 20-ies, but hoping to avoid SHTF altogether is an exercise in sheer futility.

Archivarix on January 1, 2013 at 4:30 PM

The Tea Party is full of people who fantasize about living out “Red Dawn”. Sane individuals would rather than country continue on and are not hording ammunition and MREs in their basement in gleeful anticipation of the collapse of the country.

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

I read that three times and am now ready for the psychiatric hospital.

CW on January 1, 2013 at 4:30 PM

Obama wanted tax rates increased on individuals earning $200K and up. The bill raises rates on individuals making $400K and up.

Obama wanted the estate tax to kick in at $3.5 mil. The bill sets the threshold at $5 mil.

Obama did not get everything he wanted.

How is this possible? I thought Republicans were powerless because they lost the election? If they have no power, why did he cave on these things?

Meanwhile, the reality is there should be NO estate tax, and no one should have seen their taxes go up. Obama wanted higher taxes on the rich, while Republicans wanted higher taxes on no one. After a decade of lying about the Bush tax cuts, Obama got his higher taxes on the rich, and even got Republicans to vote for it. This is without a doubt a democrat victory if it gets through the House.

xblade on January 1, 2013 at 4:31 PM

“The House Republicans have two choices: cut their losses and pass the deal now, or else put up a fight they cannot win and pass the same deal a few days now after being further humiliated,” said a Senate Democratic leadership aide.

Another senior Democratic aide said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) will not reconsider the bill, which passed by a vote of 89 to 8.

“We’re done,” said the aide.

Is that the sound of a gauntlet being thrown?

Yeah, they really want the House to vote on this.

NO!

You will get Nothing!

Should be the answer!

D-fusit on January 1, 2013 at 4:31 PM

“If the Tea Party scuttles this, they need to go third party.”

“The GOP doesn’t need these perpetual losers dragging them down…”

NoDonkey on January 1, 2013 at 4:16 PM

Oh no – we certainly wouldn’t want anyone to “scuttle” this fabulous bill …

CBO: “The “fiscal cliff” deal that was designed to save money actually includes $330.3 billion in new spending over the next decade …”

“…all told, the bill deepens the deficit by nearly $4 trillion over the next decade …”

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2013/jan/1/deficit-fiscal-cliff-bill-actually-spends-330-bill/

Pork-Chop on January 1, 2013 at 4:31 PM

Update: And now some pressure on Boehner from the left as a Democratic aide warns that the Senate bill is a take-it-or-leave-it proposition:

Exactly what Obama and Reid wanted.

They hate the Middle Class. I will tell you this many more times. Internalize it. The charlatans just lie to you if they claim otherwise.

Obama wants the cliff. Only fools can’t see.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:32 PM

David Burge ‏@iowahawkblog

You know who thinks the crazy cat lady is sane? Her cats. #Congress

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 4:33 PM

They’ll wait until after the 3rd and then they’ll scroom you royally.

It’s incredibly schadenfreudig to watch the circus.

Parasites go to Hell, at all levels.

Starve the Looters, always.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:34 PM

If the house Republicans are trying to drive this into full pre-Bush tax hikes and sequestration then they are hopelessly stupid. I couldn’t give a rat’s ass less about Cantor’s “power” position and punishing hard working, low and middle income citizens to soothe his fragile ego is blatantly irresponsible. They’re on a suicide mission that will bear no fruit and their future credibility and influence will be totally lost. If they want to conduct the last great act of defiance then let them drive on because it will in fact be their last act.

rplat on January 1, 2013 at 4:34 PM

I’ve been saying for months, the Republicans need to force the Senate to deal with all of this through the budget process. Refuse to sign ANY continuing resolutions, refuse to go through any bills that come at the last minute, refuse to deal with anything that doesn’t offer a solution.

The House of Representatives is where spending bills have to originate, orignate a bill and tell the Senate you will not deal with anything that doesn’t go through the normal legislation process. The press can’t argue with this one, in fact it may be the only card the Republicans have because the Senate hasn’t passed a budget in 4 years and Obama can’t get a vote for his, yet the Democrats get EVERYTHING they want with continuing resolutions. How stupid can these Republicans be?

bflat879 on January 1, 2013 at 4:35 PM

David Burge ‏@iowahawkblog

You know who thinks the crazy cat lady is sane? Her cats. #Congress

National treasure, along with Ramirez

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:35 PM

This entire process is an elaborate charade designed to postpone the ultimate reckoning on entitlement reform

Bingo.

scalleywag on January 1, 2013 at 4:38 PM

Guys the issue isn’t the tax cut portion it is the spending/ sequester portion. It includes new revenue. I won’t be able to transfer the 5K I have in my 401K from an old job to an IRA without paying taxes. I just switched jobs and my craptastic former employer never gave me what they were supposed to. Also gap in health coverage which is so awesome… Thanks Obamacare. Had to threaten them over COBRA.

Illinidiva on January 1, 2013 at 4:38 PM

National treasure, along with Ramirez

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:35 PM

Agreed.

D-fusit on January 1, 2013 at 4:38 PM

Winners and Losers

Krasting–a democrat?–doesn’t offer up a very pretty picture of what Obama just shoved in our mouths.

http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2012-12-31/cliff-deal-winners-and-losers

mountainaires on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

Exactly what Obama and Reid wanted.

They hate the Middle Class. I will tell you this many more times. Internalize it. The charlatans just lie to you if they claim otherwise.

Obama wants the cliff. Only fools can’t see.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:32 PM

You’re of course 100% right, but Obama’s stuck. If you took a drink every time he called for tax cuts below 200k, you’d wipe out half of Ireland. He has to do it now.

Worse case scenario for the GOP is to pass the Senate bill from last summer. This deal is even better.

Chuck Schick on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

“I hope a tax will be preferred [to a loan which threatens to saddle us with a perpetual debt], because it will awaken the attention of the people and make reformation and economy the principle of the next election. The frequent recurrence of this chastening operation can alone restrain the propensity of governments to enlarge expense beyond income.”

- Thomas Jefferson to Albert Gallatin, 1820

“I place economy among the first and most important virtues, and public debt as the greatest of dangers to be feared. To preserve our independence, we must not let our rulers load us with perpetual debt. If we run into such debts, we must be taxed in our meat and drink, in our necessities and in our comforts, in our labor and in our amusements. If we can prevent the government from wasting the labor of the people, under the pretense of caring for them, they will be happy.”

- Thomas Jefferson

“The principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale.”

- Thomas Jefferson

“I think we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious.”

- Thomas Jefferson, Letter to William Ludlow, 6 September 1824

“To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, “the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry, & the fruits acquired by it.’”

- Thomas Jefferson

Resist We Much on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

There are NO SPENDING CUTS in this bill. The Republicans need to STOP compromising their/our principles and VOTE NO! The only thing this bill will do is bring this country to it’s knees and it won’t be pretty for us little people (obama and his peeps will still live like royalty). The Tea Party Conservatives are the only folks who stick to principles and believe in this country. VOTE NO to the nonsense, suck it up, and tighten your belts.

cpasherry on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

The GOP will forever be known as the party that let the middle class see their taxes raised.

mrscullen on January 1, 2013 at 4:28 PM

Translation: In America forever means at most six months.

William Eaton on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

William Eaton on January 1, 2013 at 4:24 PM

How stupid can these Republicans be?

bflat879 on January 1, 2013 at 4:35 PM

They can be pretty stupid. Bonehead encouraged the Senate to come up with the current measure despite the fact that process is illegitimate. Reid has answered, saying, that they are done.

Well, ok.

dogsoldier on January 1, 2013 at 4:44 PM

National treasure, along with Ramirez

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:35 PM

Agreed.

D-fusit on January 1, 2013 at 4:38 PM

Yepper…..I second that… :)

sicoit on January 1, 2013 at 4:45 PM

The House should adjourn right now. Close the books on this Congress. Tell the Senate to shove it. Then, on Thursday, when the new Congress is sworn in, immediately adjourn again. Not recess. Adjourn. Call it closed. There is absolutely no value in working with the Democrats on anything, and there is nothing Republicans can accomplish on their own. Go home, and let it burn. Our taxes go up, we hit the debt ceiling, government shuts down, whatever. Just let it be.

Shump on January 1, 2013 at 4:45 PM

So basically it’s a big fat mess.

Good football games today.

gophergirl on January 1, 2013 at 4:45 PM

Sham-a-lam-a-ding-dong!

All a sham on the American taxpayers to raise taxes and increase spending.

albill on January 1, 2013 at 4:47 PM

Where is all of this heading?

You wake up one morning, and decide that you really need to hit the open road with the family. You, they, need a break.

You talk to your spouse over breakfast, and are informed that the kids need a letter from the primary parent and at least two approved psychologists in order to be removed from school. You also have to pay a small fee to the school district for each student and each day missed, since their funding is based on attendance figures. About $1500 per child per day, give or take.

Then, you have to inform the local administrative office that since you will be out of town, you have to forfeit a portion of your state and local welfare payments covering the period you will not be at home. Unemployment still hasn’t gone below 16% since the last time the president got re-elected. But, fear not, he says that were are turning the corner and employment is something he is focused on like a laser or something. Anyway, it is a top priority of his. has been since 2009.

Then, you will need to apply for a permit to purchase gasoline, and since you refused to purchase one of those Government Motors all-electric solar-powered vehicles, and insist on keeping your ancient relic gas burner, you will need to pay a tax in advance on the gasoline you wish to purchase, non-refundable should the permit be denied or you find insufficient supplies of gasoline.

Then you have to decide on which particular national park or national recreation area you wish to visit. Some are more popular than others. Those which are most [popular have lotteries annually to see who gets to visit and who does not. Only a small fee of $25 per entry, and you need one for each family member. No guarantees of winning, one or any, but the money is going to good use. The government needs to pay the lottery workers and needs to subsidize the unions which manage the park system.

If you want to fly, forget it. Only official approved government business allows the use of aircraft. The carbon footprint just got too large. Ordinary people have to use ancient gasoline vehicles, or expensive new electrics or depend on high-speed rail…to get close to places they once could visit with ease.

So, this vacation stuff is for the elites only, like the President, who in his sixth term, has taken vacations for all of us. It is an onerous task, he tells us, but were it not for all of us living vicariously through our President and His family, we’d be a terribly unhappy lot, wouldn’t we? After all, it is for the children. His.

Well, then, no vacation, no getting out of the hood, no chance to see new horizons…you do the next best thing.

Turn on the television. Watch some reality program. Pour yourself a drink (if you can find legal alcohol anywhere) and wish you had done more to prevent the wholesale round up of guns, guns of all types, because you really really really truly want to blow your brains out.

But…none of this will ever come to pass, right?

The politicians have our best interests at heart, first and foremost and always.

Right?

coldwarrior on January 1, 2013 at 4:48 PM

David Burge ‏@iowahawkblog

You know who thinks the crazy cat lady is sane? Her cats. #Congress

National treasure, along with Ramirez

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 4:35 PM

That’s an apt analogy of the progs that post here.

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 4:50 PM

The assumption that those who think the House GOP should approve this bill do not want to fight for balanced budgets is not true (at least for the most part). I want that fight but I want it when I can win. That is when the debt ceiling and continuing resolution are reached and new authorizations are needed for more spending. Much of the public will support lower spending at least in general if not for each specific reduction. Two months is not long to wait. Make a budget with 4 trillion in deficit reduction which Obama himself called for; but make it mostly spending cuts. Make this a fight over who is willing to cut spending not whether the GOP is willing to keep tax rates on the middle class higher in order to be the tax collector for the welfare state as Ronald Reagan might have put it.

I would say that a ceiling cap that limits spending to whatever revenue is coming in may encourage Obama to let the economy grow so he gets more money. If Obama will not cut spending via legislation, let him deal with it by living within the debt cap. The world will not end at a 2.7 trillion dollar spending level and by Nov. 2014 if Obama has not reached a lower spending agreement, the public may have learned they can live without some of the things that the government party said were indispensible. But if we vote this bill done, the public will turn completely on the GOP and there will be a split between the Tea Party and the GOP that will entrench Progressive Left policies for at least a generation as the Dems will win elections split with the conservative vote split.

KW64 on January 1, 2013 at 4:52 PM

In Chicago this new year, it will cost to more to park at the meter than to drive: $6.50/hour.

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 4:54 PM

The politicians have our best interests at heart, first and foremost and always.

Right?

coldwarrior on January 1, 2013 at 4:48 PM

You’re on target.

On a related topic, I read an article today with pictures of poor people living in the storm drains under Las Vegas and it’s not the first such article I’ve seen. Other large cities have similar underground societies.

dogsoldier on January 1, 2013 at 4:55 PM

The wife and I are headed out to toast the Age of Treason with a steak at Texas Roadhouse. If they want my money they will have to take it out of my leftovers.

Happy New Year, HotAirHeads! Don’t let ANYONE on the Hill off the hook. Keep the lies, the scams, and the crap dibbling down their chins pointed out for the cameras.

Limerick on January 1, 2013 at 4:56 PM

…or else put up a fight they cannot win and pass the same deal a few days now after being further humiliated,” said a Senate Democratic leadership aide.

Being pretty honest about what this is all about. They don’t even need to pretend anymore.

forest on January 1, 2013 at 4:56 PM

You can thank the idiots in the Tea Party caucus for destroying any opportunity for real negotiation. They are the worst.

rubberneck on January 1, 2013 at 4:58 PM

In Chicago this new year, it will cost to more to park at the meter than to drive: $6.50/hour.

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 4:54 PM

In a Green Utopia…
They will pay you to park…

I guess we aren’t there yet…

Electrongod on January 1, 2013 at 4:58 PM

coldwarrior on January 1, 2013 at 4:48 PM

Not too long ago that would have been laughed at. Today, not so much.

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 4:59 PM

You can thank the idiots in the Tea Party caucus for destroying any opportunity for real negotiation. They are the worst.

rubberneck on January 1, 2013 at 4:58 PM

Yeah! Because we should all just shut up and do whatever dear leader tells us. If he says higher taxes will fix the economy, then by all means lets raise taxes!

Timin203 on January 1, 2013 at 5:00 PM

Why are we posting that D-bag Matt Lewis’s tweets?

F him, and F the Daily Caller.

Treach is still cool, though.

stefanite on January 1, 2013 at 5:01 PM

The House should adjourn right now. Close the books on this Congress. Tell the Senate to shove it. Then, on Thursday, when the new Congress is sworn in, immediately adjourn again. Not recess. Adjourn. Call it closed. There is absolutely no value in working with the Democrats on anything, and there is nothing Republicans can accomplish on their own. Go home, and let it burn. Our taxes go up, we hit the debt ceiling, government shuts down, whatever. Just let it be.

Shump on January 1, 2013 at 4:45 PM

Because it’s always better to cut off your nose to spite your face.

The public elected the President and added to the Senate. Only craven Republican gerrymandering kept them in control of the House. The Democrats are not going to get everything they want and neither will the Republicans.

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Update: The word on Twitter is that the GOP caucus will huddle at 5:15 ET. Possible outcomes:

Boehner has the votes for the Senate plan and brings it to the floor to try to pass it;

Boehner *doesn’t* have the votes but brings it to the floor so that House Republicans can add amendments related to spending cuts;

Boehner refuses to bring it to the floor.

The first outcome seems unlikely and the third would suffer from terrible optics, so expect JB to choose what’s behind door number two.

Agreed.

Boner has that typical RINO infatuation with “optics”.

cuz if you comprimise with a sh!tty deal…the MSM will Like you.

You know…just like every other time.

Tim_CA on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Here’s a fun idea. Have the House put in a rider reaffirming the sanctity and importance of the 2nd Amendment and forbidding any kind of gun control legislation for the next 4 years.

Then, when it goes back to the Senate, I want to see Feinstein and eventually Obama vote yes on it.

kurtzz3 on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Displays my matchbook.

Limerick on January 1, 2013 at 5:03 PM

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

That’s hilarious coming from a supporter of the Loser Party that burns through tax dollars at a near-unbelievable rate.

You’re the one playing with matches, little boy. We’re just unable to stop you anymore and about ready to let you experience the consequences firsthand.

MelonCollie on January 1, 2013 at 5:04 PM

Our system of government – our country – is broken beyond repair. Exactly what the Marxist-in-Chief wanted.

TarheelBen on January 1, 2013 at 5:04 PM

Rut-roh, the boss says she is getting in the car. Later folks.

Limerick on January 1, 2013 at 5:05 PM

Obama wants and will go for:

1. Guns
2. Distruction of the dollar
3. VAT, in addition to all the other taxes
4. Carbon tax
5. Amnesty across the board
6. Global reparations (troops in all Africa, as a ploy for such)
7. No more electoral college
8. Destruction of general aviation
9. Obamacare to control all masses (databases, e-records of all kinds, who owns guns – always say “NO” if any hospital/clinic asks you)
10…etc

You just go like a sheep for all of them, just because he ‘won’.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 3:18 PM

One more he wants – Financial Transaction Taxes are upon you.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 5:07 PM

The public elected the President and added to the Senate. Only craven Republican gerrymandering kept them in control of the House. The Democrats are not going to get everything they want and neither will the Republicans.

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Yes, well, gerrymandering or not, the republicans control the house now. The house of representatives is the peoples house, meant to represent the people.

The Democrats want total economic destruction, the republicans say they want to return the country to a sane fiscal and monetary policy that won’t result in all of us being poor and hungry in the medium / long term.

How do you reconcile those two positions to compromise? Maybe the House should be using their checks on the senate and the executive to stop legislation that is clearly terrible for the american public.

But no, Obama won, so we should roll over. Funny how the dems never do that when they’re the minority party, though…

Timin203 on January 1, 2013 at 5:07 PM

One more, Wealth Tax, like the euro-dummies have.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 5:07 PM

On a related topic, I read an article today with pictures of poor people living in the storm drains under Las Vegas and it’s not the first such article I’ve seen. Other large cities have similar underground societies.

dogsoldier on January 1, 2013 at 4:55 PM

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2488/are-there-really-mole-people-living-under-the-streets-of-new-york-city

Mole people: https://www.google.com/search?q=mole+people&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 5:08 PM

We can rant and rave till our face turns blue, but those slugs in dc(r’s/d’s) will do what they do best, fatten their wallet and crater our nation!

I am so tired of this, gonna watch the weather channel for 10 hours!
L

letget on January 1, 2013 at 5:08 PM

chimpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Always one who likes ‘democracy’, so long as his side wins.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 5:09 PM

I will never vote for a religious zealot republican. They are the most dangerous of politicians.
rubberneck on February 17, 2012

You can thank the idiots in the Tea Party caucus for destroying any opportunity for real negotiation. They are the worst.

rubberneck on January 1, 2013 at 4:58 PM

Yawn

You would think RINO trolls would get some new material once in a while, but no.

Norwegian on January 1, 2013 at 5:10 PM

study up on free capital markets and the role creative destruction provides in maintaining a healthy market and economy.

Then reconcile why there should be another DAY spent in this fantasyland created by Bernanke and exploited by the SCOAMF and the liberals where we keep moving farther and farther into a centrally planned economy which runs ENDLESS defecits.
If you can type it out into something resembling coherent sentences, we would all love to see that piece of work.

PolAgnostic on January 1, 2013 at 4:15 PM

.
Nothing wrong with disagreeing with Allah’, but was the condescension really necessary?

listens2glenn on January 1, 2013 at 4:21 PM

.
The part in bold cannot be easily reconciled with the part in italics, wouldn’t you agree?

If he can reconcile the two diametrically opposed poles on economic thought, in something comprehensible to the Hot Air readers – AP will have pulled a rabbit out of the hat.

Otherwise, he is just another member of the “Kick the Can” club, isn’t he?

PolAgnostic on January 1, 2013 at 5:10 PM

On a related topic, I read an article today with pictures of poor people living in the storm drains under Las Vegas and it’s not the first such article I’ve seen. Other large cities have similar underground societies.

dogsoldier on January 1, 2013 at 4:55 PM

Also see “going galt’s gulch”: https://www.google.com/search?q=going+galt%27s+gulch&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 5:12 PM

Resist We Much on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

Good quotes.

SparkPlug on January 1, 2013 at 5:15 PM

Update: House GOP to meet at 5:15

Royal scrooming to commence.

——-

They are the worst.

rubberneck on January 1, 2013 at 4:58 PM

Pass this idiocy and you ain’t seen nothin’ yet.

Schadenfreude on January 1, 2013 at 5:15 PM

chumpthreads is a Trig Troofer, seriously.

SparkPlug on January 1, 2013 at 5:16 PM

warns that the Senate bill is a take-it-or-leave-it proposition

Then leave it.

They won’t negotiate? Screw ‘em. We won’t either. We’ve had quite enough of negotiating against ourselves.

petefrt on January 1, 2013 at 5:17 PM

The assumption that those who think the House GOP should approve this bill do not want to fight for balanced budgets is not true (at least for the most part). I want that fight but I want it when I can win. That is when the debt ceiling and continuing resolution are reached and new authorizations are needed for more spending.

KW64 on January 1, 2013 at 4:52 PM

Your point would be more convincing if it were possible to name one (1) time in this century when the Institutional Republicans have actually, you know, stood and fought against the Democrats. And if for the last four years every increase in spending and the debt ceiling had not been “justified” by another false promise to really, really, REALLY fight “next time”.

Right now, the Democrats are telling the truth, being blatant about their desire to turn us into a collectivist dictatorship. The Institutional Republicans are continuing to lie about how they are trying to prevent it.

The credibility of the Institutional Republicans on that subject is non-existent.

Subotai Bahadur on January 1, 2013 at 5:17 PM

Let it burn, then n March don’t raise the debt ceiling. The fact is, our government is a huge and utter failure. It’s going to collapse one way or the other. The issue isn’t revenue,it’s our spending – spending on defense and in entitlements. 98% of the elected politicians in Washington are criminals.

MoreLiberty on January 1, 2013 at 5:18 PM

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Really? I suggest that you look up the definition of arson in a Black’s law dictionary. There is a great difference between starting a fire and not extinguishing it. Under your definition, when fire departments fail to go to a fire because the property owner KNOWINGLY ELECTED NOT TO PAY THE ANNUAL FEE, they are arsonists even if the owner started the blaze.

Resist We Much on January 1, 2013 at 5:19 PM

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Limerick has the matches and I got the gas cans.

Lets do this thing….

BallisticBob on January 1, 2013 at 5:19 PM

The same hard right lunatics that said we should stick to our principles and pick candidates like Akin, Angle, O’Donnell, etc., are now whining about how we couldn’t get a better deal.

Yes, because of crazy right-wingers like you people!

Now, before you completely destroy what’s left of the Republican Party, SHUT THE FUCK UP!

blue13326 on January 1, 2013 at 5:21 PM

Good thing we didn’t let the Tea Party get involved. Otherwise we would be in trouble as opposed to merely running head long into an oncoming freight train on fire on the edge of a cliff that is full of mustard gas, flesh eating viruses and zombies.

SparkPlug on January 1, 2013 at 5:21 PM

Resist We Much on January 1, 2013 at 4:39 PM

Good quotes.

SparkPlug on January 1, 2013 at 5:15 PM

Some from Baroness Thatcher:

“Socialists cry “Power to the people”, and raise the clenched fist as they say it. We all know what they really mean—power over people, power to the State.”

- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, speech to Conservative Central Council, 15 March 1986

“I came to office with one deliberate intent: to change Britain from a dependent to a self-reliant society — from a give-it-to-me, to a do-it-yourself nation. A get-up-and-go, instead of a sit-back-and-wait-for-it Britain.”

- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, speech to Small Business Bureau Conference, 8 February 1984

“The choice facing the nation is between two totally different ways of life. And what a prize we have to fight for: no less than the chance to banish from our land the dark, divisive clouds of Marxist socialism and bring together men and women from all walks of life who share a belief in freedom.”

- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, speech in Perth, Scotland,
13 May 1983

“No one would remember the Good Samaritan if he only had good intentions. He had money as well.”

- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, London Weekend Television Weekend World, 6 January 1980

“Pennies don’t fall from Heaven, they have to be earned here on earth.”

- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, Speech at Lord Mayor’s Banquet,
12 November 1979

“Imagine a Labour canvasser talking on the doorstep to those East German families when they settle in, on freedom’s side of the wall. “You want to keep more of the money you earn? I’m afraid that’s very selfish. We shall want to tax that away. You want to own shares in your firm? We can’t have that. The state has to own your firm. You want to choose where to send your children to school? That’s very divisive. You’ll send your child where we tell you.”

- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, speech to Conservative Party Conference, 13 October 1989

“Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They always run out of other people’s money. It’s quite a characteristic of them.”

- Margaret Thatcher, Thames TV This Week, 5 February 1976

“If a Tory does not believe that private property is one of the main bulwarks of individual freedom, then he had better become a socialist and have done with it.”

- Margaret Thatcher, “My Kind of Tory Party,” Daily Telegraph,
30 January 1975

“And I will go on criticising Socialism, and opposing Socialism because it is bad for Britain — and Britain and Socialism is not the same thing. (…) It’s the Labour Government that has brought us record peace-time taxation. They’ve got the usual Socialist disease — they’ve run out of other people’s money.”

- Margaret Thatcher, speech to the Conservative Party Conference,
10 October 1975

“No theory of government was ever given a fairer test or a more prolonged experiment in a democratic country than democratic socialism received in Britain. Yet it was a miserable failure in every respect. Far from reversing the slow relative decline of Britain vis-à-vis its main industrial competitors, it accelerated it. We fell further behind them, until by 1979 we were widely dismissed as ‘the sick man of Europe’…To cure the British disease with socialism was like trying to cure leukaemia with leeches.”

- Baroness Margaret Thatcher, The Downing Street Years, 1993

Resist We Much on January 1, 2013 at 5:22 PM

Why not allow amendments? That’s how this process is supposed to work. Instead, people seem to think the House should rubber stamp everything. The White House, in fact, has already declared victory (amazing how raising taxes while doing nothing to address the deficit is a “victory”). Fluke that. Either the Dems help put something together that will pass the House, or they stick every American with a higher tax bill.

changer1701 on January 1, 2013 at 5:22 PM

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.
chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Actually, no.
“Let it burn” is the philosophy of those who would let you leftists finally realize the inevitable outcome of your policies.

LegendHasIt on January 1, 2013 at 5:22 PM

This is like the first TARP vote. It was initially voted down, only to have several GOP’ers change their votes and it passed. Grrrrrrr

SouthernGent on January 1, 2013 at 5:23 PM

SparkPlug on January 1, 2013 at 5:21 PM

Darn right.

Got any New Year’s Resolutions, Sparky?

novaculus on January 1, 2013 at 5:24 PM

Because it’s always better to cut off your nose to spite your face.

The public elected the President and added to the Senate. Only craven Republican gerrymandering kept them in control of the House. The Democrats are not going to get everything they want and neither will the Republicans.

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Hey Chimpy – Obama signed the Bush warrantless wiretap bill, just like I told you he would.

Where’s your messiah now?

Chuck Schick on January 1, 2013 at 5:24 PM

I’ve got some seeds for sale if anyone is interested…

… toilet paper, too.

Of course the whiskey and bullets fetch a slightly higher price…

Seven Percent Solution on January 1, 2013 at 5:25 PM

The House should adjourn right now. Close the books on this Congress. Tell the Senate to shove it. Then, on Thursday, when the new Congress is sworn in, immediately adjourn again. Not recess. Adjourn. Call it closed. There is absolutely no value in working with the Democrats on anything, and there is nothing Republicans can accomplish on their own. Go home, and let it burn. Our taxes go up, we hit the debt ceiling, government shuts down, whatever. Just let it be.

Shump on January 1, 2013 at 4:45 PM

Because it’s always better to cut off your nose to spite your face.

The public elected the President and added to the Senate. Only craven Republican gerrymandering kept them in control of the House. The Democrats are not going to get everything they want and neither will the Republicans.

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Yes see how you do that you ignore the fact that they also elected a Republican House and gave Republicans a lot of power in the States.

The House just needs to stand strong and force the Democrats to accept the scraps the House will allow them to get. All spending originates in the House. It does have the most power when that power is used. The power of the purse is everything that is important in DC. They need but use it.

John if he had any desire to do the right thing would shut house and make it clear that there would be nothing done till the entire Bush Tax cuts were made permanent and real spending cuts were made and a Budget was passed by the Senate. He should demand that the old Budgeting method of increasing all spending automatically was done away with so in the future all spending is based on what was budged for the previous year period no inflation adjustments allowed.

But no John is in the pocket of Obama.

Steveangell on January 1, 2013 at 5:27 PM

Resist We Much on January 1, 2013 at 5:22 PM

If the Baroness was a citizen of the USoS, she’d be Borked, Thomased, and Palinned.

davidk on January 1, 2013 at 5:27 PM

Plan B included tax raises on those earning more than 1 million, Obama wanted raises on those who earn more than 250,000 and the Senate deal was more than 450,000, considering the number of households involved that’s a darn good compromise. And the House GOP is really going to shoot itself in the face by opposing the Senate GOP and letting us go over the cliff. Way to ensure your party’s permanent minority status. By 2016 even gerrymandering won’t help the GOP in the House. Wow…

libfreeordie on January 1, 2013 at 5:28 PM

Because it’s always better to cut off your nose to spite your face.

The public elected the President and added to the Senate. Only craven Republican gerrymandering kept them in control of the House. The Democrats are not going to get everything they want and neither will the Republicans.

“Let it burn” is the philosophy of an arsonist.

chumpThreads on January 1, 2013 at 5:02 PM

Hey troll, when the Democrats gerrymander, is it ok?

fossten on January 1, 2013 at 5:28 PM

rose-of-sharon on January 1, 2013 at 4:23 PM

We googled that and couldn’t make much out of it relating
to our new tax stuff either . Maybe more on ” Heritage
Morning Bell ” tomorrow .
Happy New Year ? ( I’m not sure about much today ! )

Lucano on January 1, 2013 at 5:28 PM

GOP lose the election in Nov, and lost seats in the senate and the house. Where is the leverage it can bargain from?

The Senate proposed bill
1. made permanent the Bush tax cut for individual making less than 400k a year
2. made permanent AMT fix indexed to inflation
3. made permanent an estate tax exemption of 10 millions for a family indexed to inflation.

Instead of taking some victories now, and continue to fight the war, the house scuttled the proposed bill : taxes go up for everyone, the stock market tanks, the economy runs the risk of double dip recession. Results: people get mad, the GOP takes the blame, loses big in 2014, including losing the house. You can then bend over and really get lubed up for the big screwing to come when the Dems control everything.

galtani on January 1, 2013 at 5:28 PM

listens2glenn on January 1, 2013 at 4:21 PM

.
The part in bold cannot be easily reconciled with the part in italics, wouldn’t you agree?

If he can reconcile the two diametrically opposed poles on economic thought, in something comprehensible to the Hot Air readers – AP will have pulled a rabbit out of the hat.

Otherwise, he is just another member of the “Kick the Can” club, isn’t he?

PolAgnostic on January 1, 2013 at 5:10 PM

.
Ok … I guess condescension is justified ( s i g h ).

Carry on . . . . . . . (shaking head sadly)

listens2glenn on January 1, 2013 at 5:28 PM

Plan B included tax raises on those earning more than 1 million, Obama wanted raises on those who earn more than 250,000 and the Senate deal was more than 450,000, considering the number of households involved that’s a darn good compromise.

libfreeordie on January 1, 2013 at 5:28 PM

Plan B pays for 3 days..
Plan Obama pays for 8..
Plan Senate pays for 4.5 days..

Winning….

Electrongod on January 1, 2013 at 5:31 PM

Midas on January 1, 2013 at 4:01 PM

I’ve said it before and I will say it again. I’m for going over the cliff. But that is going to cause a lot of people a lot of pain. Because of that, I am willing to question whether I am right about this or not.

Once we go over the cliff, Cantor and the rest of the conservative budget hawks had better have big balls and strong stomachs, because they are going to have to go in for the long haul, and the Republicans are going to have to take a lot of heat and cause a lot of pain before things possibly start to turn to their advantage.

Possibly.

Republicans are not going to get a better deal than this one. Period.

They are not going to get a better deal two or three days after going over the cliff.

Or a week.

I’m talking a year or two here of tax increases, recession, and a weak national defense, a period in which the House Republican caucus holds together under Cantor’s extraordinary leadership (sarc) and refuses to compromise with Democrats, with the press and the public screaming for blood.

Because we all know that is going to happen.

This deal puts the Bush tax rates in place permenantly, fixes the AMT problem, closes some tax loopholes, and keeps the estate tax threshold at 5 mil, although the rate goes up 5 percent.

The doc fix and the extension of unemployment benefits are window dressing, hardly Democrat victories. They would happen anyway, as a matter of regular business.

Spending cuts are not off the table, they are postponed. No caving on the debt ceiling. Sure, we still have to fight those battles, but that is like saying that Iwo Jima didn’t matter because we still had to take Okinawa.

Given all that I heard since the election about how weak a hand the Republicans held in this negotiation, I am shocked at what we got out of the Dems.

The Republicans will take exactly zero damage from letting rates go up on those making over 400k, and get a big chunk of the credit for locking in the Bush tax rates for the rest.

Mr. Arkadin on January 1, 2013 at 5:32 PM

Comment pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 13