Jay Carney: Gun control is part of the solution but far from all of it

posted at 4:11 pm on December 17, 2012 by Allahpundit

Via Mediaite. Carney usually looks uncomfortable to the point of constipation but I’m still surprised to see him so ill at ease and noncommittal in talking about this. Obama has the political wind at his back. Per ABC, 54 percent of adults now say they favor stricter gun-control laws, which is a bit higher (but only a bit) than polls have shown over the past five years. Longtime pro-gun Democrats like Harry Reid, Joe Manchin, and Mark Warner are chattering about a change of heart, no doubt in part because they’re afraid to cross a guy who just won 330+ electoral votes at a moment of high national emotion. If ever there was a time to pound the podium, this is it.

So why the conspicuous hedge? Probably because the White House knows that the public backlash to guns after mass shootings, at least until now, has been fleeting. O’s afraid to dive headfirst into the gun-control pool until he’s sure there’s some water in there. (That’s what all the “tipping point”/”this time is different” rhetoric from liberals was about this weekend.) But if even pro-gun Dems are giving him political cover, what does he have to lose by pushing the issue as hard as he can and daring Senate Republicans to filibuster whatever emerges? All that’s left of the Hopenchange brand is the idea that the GOP is scary and evil and loves rich people and dead children. That message got this guy re-elected; no sense to give up on it now. At the very least, if he can force a party-line vote in which Republicans filibuster a Democratic gun-control bill banning, say, high-capacity magazines, he might make enough GOP senators uncomfortable about being boxed in on that issue that they’ll try to compromise on other issues that are more important to him. If he’s lucky, depending upon how restrained the eventual Democratic bill is, he might even attract enough Republicans to get to 60. Murkowski can usually be counted on to cross the GOP in a pinch; Collins is a perennial wild card too. Those two, plus the increased number of Democrats in the next Congress will get him close if he can hold the Democratic caucus together. A new assault-weapons ban like Feinstein is proposing may be a bridge too far for Reid, Manchin, et al., but something more modest might be viable. Then, if it gets through, the House will torpedo it and Obama can get back to his scary-evil-Republican messaging, which might earn him an extra concession or two on immigration or the budget or whatever.

Incidentally, a data point from that ABC poll linked above:

You see now why the Journal thinks high-capacity magazines are a likely starting point for a new gun-control bill. Look at the other two results, though. Adults overwhelmingly oppose a total ban on guns but they marginally support a ban on semiautomatics, even though semiautomatics make up the vast, vast majority of guns. Per Tim Carney’s post this morning, talking about “semiautomatic weapons” is like talking about “gasoline cars.” That’s how common they are. If the public opposes those and yet also opposes a blanket prohibition on guns, it’s likely because some chunk of them is confused about what a “semiautomatic” actually is and does. Which is another way of saying that when you read opinion polls on this topic, take the results with a grain or two of salt.

Exit question: Jeff Greenfield argues that the immediate aftermath of a horrendous attack is precisely the right time to start a policy debate over solutions. Okay, but does that logic apply to acts of terrorism too? I know people on both the left and right who think that creating TSA and passing the Patriot Act in a flurry of Do-Something concern after 9/11 proved to be a panicky, ill-considered response to the attack that hasn’t done much to improve safety. Second look at the Do-Something approach, then?


Related Posts:

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Comment pages: 1 2 3 4

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

We’ve had school shootings before in this country, and Obama said absolutely nothing about new gun control measures to stop them from happening when he was running for re-election. Tell us again about your absolute moral authority.

Socratease on December 17, 2012 at 5:03 PM

Actually not.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:00 PM

The story here is depressing. Blacks die from assault at more than three times the U.S. average, and between ten and twenty times OECD rates. In the 2000s the average rate of death from assault in the U.S. was about 5.7 per 100,000 but for whites it was 3.6 and for blacks it was over 20

Yeah, it does.

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:03 PM

Democrat, liberal clowns don’t even know what an assault rifle is….. or that there has been restrictions on them for years…… How many stupid people are there in this country?

ultracon on December 17, 2012 at 5:04 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

And how is this any more vile then the deaths of over 300 Mexicans and at least one US border agent with guns from “Fast and Furious”?

By the way, as far as I know, neither Eric Holder nor the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooter are Republicans.

mechkiller_k on December 17, 2012 at 5:04 PM

How many guns do you need?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:57 PM

Enough to stop your political leader from doing whatever he pleases.

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:04 PM

I can’t. There are more Muslims than ever after 9/11. Expect more death and destruction.

Funny, Lanza, Roberts, Engeldinger, Page, Holmes, Stawicki, England, Watts, Lane, Dekraai, Dantzler, Loughner, Thornton etc., don’t sound like Muslim names. Seems we’d be better served as a nation profiling angry white gun nuts like you.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

Throwing up our hands that nothing can be done?

No. We think this massacre would have been much less tragic if someone on the premises other than the killer were armed.

Your preferred policy is that a behemoth and distant bureaucracy and legal framework reach into a school and stop an evil man from killing innocent children. Our preferred policy is for the courageous teachers that were there and died trying to protect the children had the tools (firearms) they needed to defend innocent life.

gwelf on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

I live in rural Iowa. On a very good night, a sheriffs deputy is 10 or 15 minutes away from my 911 call. I possess several handguns, (retired law enforcement) several shotguns, several rifles, and an M4. Many of my weapons are semi autos. I use the M4 for coyote hunting, and I keep a couple of 30 rounders in the safe for the possibility of human varmints. I hope I never need them. I usually carry a 1911 when I’m out and about. I hope I never need it also. My question, who is the mayor of New York to tell me how to live my life? What business does a Congress woman from California have trying to remove my rights as an American citizen, without a repeal of the 2nd amendment? Can someone help me understand this?

kam582 on December 17, 2012 at 4:46 PM

Another way to pose the question is, with all the mass murders, killing innocents like 6 year olds, why are they taking away our ability to defend ourselves and our neighbors? If the politicians give up their body guards and secret service, I will give up my weapons.

lea on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

Actually not.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:00 PM

Actually it is… The graph mentions states but off course they avoid mentioning the cities where the gun crimes are occuring… In these cities is where the democrat voters live… In fact the last graph in your link proves what I am saying but you are too stupid to know how to read…

mnjg on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 4:57 PM

The system deleted most of my post. Try again.

I really wish people understood the difference. Especially the media. All guns are semiautomatic – ALL! Congressmen need to point out the difference between automatic and semiautomatic weapons when they are interviewed. The poll just shows you how the populace has no idea about firearms, except what they hear from the biased media.

Patriot Vet on December 17, 2012 at 4:49 PM

Sorry but you are also wrong.
ALL guns are NOT semi auto. Semi auto has an automatic action that rechambers and cocks the gun so that only another trigger pull is required for the next round.
Bolt action, lever action, and pump guns are NOT semi auto.

I personally believe NONE of them should be banned – even full auto. Have you shot a full auto? It’s very hard to hit what you’re aiming at. There’s a reason they call it “spray and pray” in the military.

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

This is what can be done.

And it works.

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

Like I said in my previous comment. I really don’t like guns. However, I don’t how anyone can truly believe that a deranged man who killed 20 children and his OWN mother would have been stopped by some gun law. Do you really think he would have not murdered people because his gun was illegal? That doesn’t make sense.

terryannonline on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

courageous teachers

I thought you lot hated teachers?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

We are fighting the misinformed and the don’t want to be informed. Heard it myself today in a store while standing in line. A lively discussion about how you can go to any gun shop and buy automatic weapons. I wanted to puke.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

Funny, Lanza, Roberts, Engeldinger, Page, Holmes, Stawicki, England, Watts, Lane, Dekraai, Dantzler, Loughner, Thornton etc., don’t sound like Muslim names. Seems we’d be better served as a nation profiling angry white gun nuts like you.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

You’re right. Mohammed Atta sounds like a White Christian name.

Damn these White Christians for what they did on 9/11!

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

You know, your commie buddies the ACLU blocked a law that would have allowed involuntary admittance for observation in the case of people with mental problems that seemed a danger to themselves and others.

Good work.

darwin on December 17, 2012 at 5:07 PM

Jay Carney: Gun control is part of the solution but far from all of it

And yet watching this adminsitration the past 4 years I’m gonna make a wild guess that after gun control there is really no interest in the other parts of the solution.

DaveDief on December 17, 2012 at 5:08 PM

No. We think this massacre would have been much less tragic if someone on the premises other than the killer were armed.

Guns in school. You obviously don’t work in the insurance industry. LOL.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:08 PM

Actually not.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:00 PM
The story here is depressing. Blacks die from assault at more than three times the U.S. average, and between ten and twenty times OECD rates. In the 2000s the average rate of death from assault in the U.S. was about 5.7 per 100,000 but for whites it was 3.6 and for blacks it was over 20

Yeah, it does.

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:03 PM

The low IQ communist scum “lostmotherland” posted the link because he saw the first few graphs that showed crime rate per state but they did not mention that the crime rate in these states is mostly in the cities where democrat lives… However the last graph of his link, that either he did not read or is too stupid to understand, proves exactly what I am saying that the culture of violence is among democrat voters…

mnjg on December 17, 2012 at 5:08 PM

You’re right. Mohammed Atta sounds like a White Christian name.

Damn these White Christians for what they did on 9/11!

what do Muslims have to do with school shootings you freak?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:09 PM

I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

More libtard intelligence on display.
Weapons of Mass Destruction – which are defined as chemical, biological, nuclear, radiological weapons – all illegal.

Well hey we have dead kids, so we need to make sure nobody can buy a nuke warhead… duhhhh

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:09 PM

The low IQ communist scum “lostmotherland” posted the link because he saw the first few graphs that showed crime rate per state but they did not mention that the crime rate in these states is mostly in the cities where democrat lives… However the last graph of his link, that either he did not read or is too stupid to understand, proves exactly what I am saying that the culture of violence is among democrat voters…

mnjg on December 17, 2012 at 5:08 PM

Yup, a libtard like lostmotherland also doesn’t realize that most blacks in America (59%) live in the South.

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Do you really think he would have not murdered people because his gun was illegal?

Do you really think he could have murdered 26 in minutes with a knife?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

what do Muslims have to do with school shootings you freak?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:09 P

Don’t you know, lostmotherland, that Muslims invented firearms! Guess you didn’t.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Oh I think Allahpundit had a post of all the gun laws this monster violated and it didn’t stop him.

terryannonline on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

what do Muslims have to do with school shootings you freak?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:09 PM

3,000 > school shooting deaths

Both are destruction, so get rid of guns and Muslims. Hooray!

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:11 PM

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Talk to China, and Japan and the Brits about that.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:11 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

Allahpundit had a post of all the gun laws this monster violated and it didn’t stop him.

terryannonline on December 17, 2012 at 5:11 PM

I thought you lot hated teachers?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

Guns in school. You obviously don’t work in the insurance industry. LOL.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:08 PM

Squirrel!!!!!

You really don’t have a reply do you.

Tell me again how a distant federal bureaucracy and legal structure is going to reach into a class room and stop a killer in a school.

Recently a man in China knifed a bunch of kids. We’ve had mass shootings in Norway and Germany and Britain – all countries with very strict gun laws.

gwelf on December 17, 2012 at 5:12 PM

Allahpundit had a post of all the gun laws this monster violated and it didn’t stop him.

terryannonline on December 17, 2012 at 5:11 PM

30,000 current US gun laws. lostmotherland land says # 30,001 will do the trick.

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:13 PM

Like I said in my previous comment. I really don

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:13 PM

Actually not.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:00 PM

Wow, that’s got to be the worst graphic presentation of numeric data I’ve ever seen. It must have been made for people who know what ‘puce’, ‘coquelicot’, and ‘aureolin’ are.

Socratease on December 17, 2012 at 5:14 PM

Here is the real story, lostmoutherhead, when the Gov’t can’t stop it the Gov’t is afraid the citizens will stop it. That would be pie on Uncle Sugar’s face. Can’t have pie on Uncle Sugar.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:14 PM

Do you really think he could have murdered 26 in minutes with a knife?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Oh, so making them illegal will mean criminals and killers can’t get them?

And what are women supposed to do to defend themselves against larger and stronger male attackers? Guns are the great equalizers for women.

gwelf on December 17, 2012 at 5:14 PM

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:57 PM

I find it extremely ironic that the same stupid liberals who try to convince people that not all Muslims are terrorists are now trying to convince people that all gun owners are criminals.

Washington Nearsider on December 17, 2012 at 5:15 PM

what do Muslims have to do with school shootings you freak?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:09 PM

Well, Atta and his cohorts weren’t able to kill nearly as many people with just box cutters (which is all they used), now were they?

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:16 PM

Democrat, liberal clowns don’t even know what an assault rifle is….. or that there has been restrictions on them for years…… How many stupid people are there in this country?

ultracon on December 17, 2012 at 5:04 PM

Do not assume Republicans know either.

My old representative, Dempsey, I think. Can’t remember now. He retired long ago. Anyway, I called him years back when they were considering the first semi-auto ban. He was a good man.. but I spoke with him and decided to ask him “Do you know the difference between semi-auto and full auto?” He admitted he didn’t. So I told him.

Here’s a representative.. a conservative one. voted the right way and all.. but he was ignorant about the basics. He didn’t know.

So don’t assume the GOP knows the basics either.

JellyToast on December 17, 2012 at 5:16 PM

I find it extremely ironic that the same stupid liberals who try to convince people that not all Muslims are terrorists are now trying to convince people that all gun owners are criminals.

Washington Nearsider on December 17, 2012 at 5:15 PM

^This

Of course, there’s a difference. Most Muslims have brown skin color while most US gun owners are White.

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:17 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

Absolute lie. But, generally statist solutions that your ilk propose would do nothing other than make you feel better about yourself. I guess that’s all that matters, right?

besser tot als rot on December 17, 2012 at 5:17 PM

Democrat, liberal clowns don’t even know what an assault rifle is….. or that there has been restrictions on them for years…… How many stupid people are there in this country?

ultracon on December 17, 2012 at 5:04 PM

Last measure, 51% Including the stupid troll lostmotherland.

AZfederalist on December 17, 2012 at 5:19 PM

Gun control is part of the problem, eliminating gun-free zones is part of the solution.

FloatingRock on December 17, 2012 at 5:19 PM

Most Muslims have brown skin color while most US gun owners are White.

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 5:17 PM

Bwahgahahahahahahahahahahahahha…that frog is green.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:20 PM

Oh, so making them illegal will mean criminals and killers can’t get them?

And what are women supposed to do to defend themselves against larger and stronger male attackers? Guns are the great equalizers for women.

gwelf on December 17, 2012 at 5:14 PM

Bingo. Women, minorities, and the poor will be hit the hardest with a gun ban. Violent crime will go up. Mass shootings will continue.

Women, for the reasons you mentioned. Minorities, specifically blacks and latinos, because they tend to be disproportionate victims of violent crime already. And the poor, because they tend to live in less secure environments to begin with.

It’s a sad twist of liberal policy ever time that ends up hurting the very people who put them in office.

rightmind on December 17, 2012 at 5:20 PM

I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

I guess people of all ages are the price we pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Give up your car, NOW.

Bishop on December 17, 2012 at 5:20 PM

KNEEEEEEL BEFORE ZOD LOSTMOTHERLAND !!!

CurtZHP on December 17, 2012 at 5:21 PM

I just pulled out my 60 year plus gun owners diary. Speed reading at my age is a bit slow but I’ve still yet to find one scorecard for kindergartners.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:22 PM

We are hearing now from the Left that someone with a gun in the school couldn’t have done anything. I say BS! Hear is what a 15 year old girl does with a semiautomatic pistol. If someone there had one, I KNOW that lives would have been saved. Even just one. Isn’t that what the president said he wanted – laws that would save just one. Let trained people carry guns in schools.

Patriot Vet on December 17, 2012 at 5:22 PM

Guns in school. You obviously don’t work in the insurance industry. LOL.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:08 PM

So the current laws that made all schools into “gun free zones” must be working so well, aren’t they? Apparently because the law says it’s illegal, nobody has brought any guns into any schools – like, say Sandy Hook, Columbine, and many others. How exactly did all those innocent people get shot in those schools if guns are not allowed in them?

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:22 PM

Do you really think he could have murdered 26 in minutes with a knife?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

I knife can be way more deadly than a gun. Depending upon the knife, blade length, sharpness, skill of user… oh yeah. In a crowd of woman and children. Yeah. You could kill that many.

You do realize people have been killing each other with knives far longer than they have with guns, right? You do realize that before gun powder, nations actually went to war with each other armed with long knives right?

At 20 feet, a knife is more deadly than a concealed weapon, by the way. You can conceal a knife far easier than you can conceal a gun.
Steel is much stronger than flesh. Lots of knife victims have slashes on their hands where they tried to grab the blade. It doesn’t work, though.

JellyToast on December 17, 2012 at 5:23 PM

the culture of violence is among democrat voters

SparkPlug on December 17, 2012 at 5:24 PM

Do you really think he could have murdered 26 in minutes with a knife?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Do a search for “japan school stabbing”:

It took just 10 minutes for a man armed with a kitchen knife to unleash terror in a Japanese elementary school in a stabbing spree that left eight school children dead and injured 21 other people.

Eight dead in 10 minutes. Given the response time in this instance and the fact that this was not only a gun-free zone, but a weapon free school, meaning anything bigger than a pen knife — yeah, given the size difference, the fact that only women and very small children were present, the evil madman could have chosen other tools and done equivalent or worse mayhem.

Hey you stupid troll! This was a gun-free zone! Yet mayhem happened. You think that expanding that “gun free zone” to a city, county, state, or federal region you are going to be any safer? No, you will only be more dependent upon a government that won’t come in time when it is you who is being attacked.

AZfederalist on December 17, 2012 at 5:24 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

.
The ACLU led the charge in emptying the asylums. Not a conservative organization.
.
The Feminists led the charge for “no fault divorce.” NOW is not a conservative organization.
The left glorified violence (Scarface, Natural Born Killers, etc) Hollywood is not a conservative organization.
.
So a crazy kid from a broken home bathed in the glory that is violence as per Thug Culture and Hollywood, and you blame conservatives because we want to be able to protect ourselves from the monsters you created?
.
Go eat dog droppings

LincolntheHun on December 17, 2012 at 5:25 PM

Liam on December 17, 2012 at 4:39 PM

The most interesting part of the LA shootout was that the perps didn’t know how to clear their AK jams. They ended up leaving them behind after they jammed and were back to handguns. If memory serves one of the perps got badly wounded and took himself out, the other finally got taken out by a police officer on a sidestreet. With a handgun and a few well placed shots.

It is very hard to get a FA weapon in the US, which usually includes a waiting period and tax stamp for the transfer of such a weapon. I can’t imagine getting out to use one more than a couple of times a year. Outside of a few organizations sanctioned for such weapons (police departments come to mind) their availability is limited to what was made before ’76 when the ban on production went through as an amendment to another bill.

All of this regulation was supposed to stop criminals from shooting up places. Hasn’t happened… just the type of criminal and where the crime takes place have changed and we no longer are in horror of criminals just shooting each other and the innocent in drive-bys. That used to be a problem in the ’20s, apparently no longer. And the St. Valentine’s massacre that featured criminal on criminal killing was a major shock to the Nation… got us the NFA…are these sorts of events even reported on any more? I know they still happen. If we are so used to the violence, then why do we need the regulations? If it has to get down to children being killed and we no longer care about the criminals and gangs doing that and worse to each other, then just what has all this regulation gotten us beyond more and more officious bureaucracies? For all this government power, the people seem to have lost liberty and freedom with no gain and indeed a loss in security and compassion… yet it is those with so much ‘compassion’ that wish to extend the bureaucracies and encroach more on your liberty and freedom.

ajacksonian on December 17, 2012 at 5:27 PM

lost, You don’t like the law. lost, I know a way to kill every living creature inside a school or any other building. Should it be banned? Think before you answer for a change.

Bmore on December 17, 2012 at 5:28 PM

It is always the gun and not the perp. Always. The perp was possessed, see. He was brainwashed. He had no choice but to follow those inner (chemical signals). He wasn’t evil, he was confused. Yep, that is how the ball bounces, for the cattle among us.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:28 PM

ajacksonian on December 17, 2012 at 5:27 PM

Mostly correct.

The police went into sporting goods stores (Dicks, Bass Pro) and acquired rifles to put down the second shooter.

Washington Nearsider on December 17, 2012 at 5:28 PM

Longtime pro-gun Democrats like Harry Reid, Joe Manchin, and Mark Warner are chattering about a change of heart, no doubt in part because they’re afraid to cross a guy who just won 330+ electoral votes at a moment of high national emotion.

Oh come on…Obama won with 50.86% of the popular vote…some of those electoral votes were won in states with a skinny margin. He is not as popular as this sentence implies…maybe that is why people are nervous about getting behind this.

Terrye on December 17, 2012 at 5:29 PM

I’ll be concerned when the godless lovers of death outlaw vacuums and forceps.

tom daschle concerned on December 17, 2012 at 5:30 PM

Same tired arguments being used her to dismiss even the idea of some sensible regulation of guns.
But it’s crickets at the NRA for a reason.
Assault weapons ban is coming back…and likely with a lot less loopholes this time.
Also gun show loopholes are done.
Say bye bye to high capacity clips…and bulk ammo buying/storing.
Majority of gun owners will have no issue with any of this…many will welcome it.
There’s always gonna be the ‘proud of my arsenal!’ fantasists jumping into this debate, but they will remain on the fringe.
Also, you will no longer be able have your own hellfire missile equipped remote drone..to, you know, protect you from tyranny and stuff.
(But paintball is safe. So no need to change your weekend plans.)

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:30 PM

darwin on December 17, 2012 at 4:59 PM

sentinelrules on December 17, 2012 at 4:59 PM

Socratease on December 17, 2012 at 5:03 PM

gwelf on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

terryannonline on December 17, 2012 at 5:06 PM

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:09 PM

LincolntheHun on December 17, 2012 at 5:25 PM

Could all of you folks stop quoting the troll?

That’s what she wants you to do Re-post her BS over and over again.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 PM

When it comes to guns and violence, the right throws up its hands and says nothing can be done. I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

More useless liberal histrionics. Can I get you a hankie or is the garment you are rending enough?

If you want to be technical about it, aren’t these just missed abortions? Would it have been more acceptable to you and yours had the kook been wearing a white coat and stethoscope?

Do you sleep at night knowing so many were killed in the womb?

Do you sleep at night when people (usually black) are being killed routinely in places like Chicago?

kim roy on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:30 PM

What exactly is an Assault weapon?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

I have an idea. If gun control is only part of the solution, how about we implement it last? Let’s put all the other solutions in place first and see how they work. If they do, we might not have any more need for the hysterical hand-wringing that guns need to be more regulated.

Liam on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

Same tired arguments being used her to dismiss even the idea of some sensible regulation of guns.

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:30 PM

Same tired strawmen. Don’t you folk ever get tired of being liars?

besser tot als rot on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

Could all of you folks stop quoting the troll?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 PM

If they are left to keep repeating their garbage, they will win the debate by default.

Thats how the left has convinced people that “semi-automatic” weapons are really scary.

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:35 PM

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:30 PM

Wrong again:

Connecticut School Shooting Doesn’t Deter Crowd At Gun Show In Montgomery County
http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2012/12/16/connecticut-school-shooting-doesnt-deter-crowd-at-gun-show-in-montgomery-county/

OAKS, Pa. (CBS) — A gun show in Montgomery County drew a huge crowd on Sunday, despite calls for stricter gun control after a shooting rampage at an elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:35 PM

Funny, Lanza, Roberts, Engeldinger, Page, Holmes, Stawicki, England, Watts, Lane, Dekraai, Dantzler, Loughner, Thornton etc., don’t sound like Muslim names. Seems we’d be better served as a nation profiling angry white gun nuts like you.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

They are just less efficient than the jihadists.

You really are a dull knife, aren’t you?

kim roy on December 17, 2012 at 5:35 PM

What exactly is an Assault weapon?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

My wife’s heavy tone when she is p***ed.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:36 PM

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 PM

.
But her stupid makes me laugh, and the other posters often have great points that I hadn’t thought of yet.
.
Why do you hate learning and making fun of stupid people?

/s

LincolntheHun on December 17, 2012 at 5:36 PM

both the left and right who think that creating TSA and passing the Patriot Act in a flurry of Do-Something concern after 9/11 proved to be a panicky, ill-considered response to the attack that hasn’t done much to improve safety.

Exactly. They’ve collected plenty of shampoo and nail clippers, though!

scalleywag on December 17, 2012 at 5:36 PM

Do you really think he could have murdered 26 in minutes with a knife?

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Probably. But who would have stopped him after a minute anyway?

besser tot als rot on December 17, 2012 at 5:36 PM

What exactly is an Assault weapon?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

Yea..I know that game – and I get your point.
And what’s a mid-size car?
This stuff can be sorted out.
The idea is to try and reduce this kind of violence and this level or carnage. The labeling/categorization of ‘assault weapons’ may be imperfect, but it is not illogical.

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:38 PM

You know, your commie buddies the ACLU blocked a law that would have allowed involuntary admittance for observation in the case of people with mental problems that seemed a danger to themselves and others.

Good work.

darwin on December 17, 2012 at 5:07 PM

Some places (if not all – not sure on this but do know a few places in Canada) have laws where there is involuntary admittance if they are deemed to be a danger to themselves or others.

Canada, a socialist country has found this to be necessary. How come this isn’t adequate for the ACLU and liberals?

kim roy on December 17, 2012 at 5:38 PM

Mosty likely as complex and unstable as the lie based foundations of the house’s of cards known as Fast and Furious and the Bengazie gun running operations.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on December 17, 2012 at 5:39 PM

Only part of the solution. The other part is to ban portrayals of gun violence on TV, movies, and video games. Watch the liberals in Hollywood and Silicon Valley squeal, “But I never meant you to regulate ME!”

xuyee on December 17, 2012 at 5:39 PM

Could all of you folks stop quoting the troll?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 PM

If they are left to keep repeating their garbage, they will win the debate by default.

Thats how the left has convinced people that “semi-automatic” weapons are really scary.

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:35 PM

I’m not saying to not engage the oppressives, I’m just saying to not re-quote them 50 times per thread.

They want their Prime Bull Sprew spread all over – Don’t give them the opportunity.

It’s fun to destroy their silly little oppressive talking point without repeating them ad nauseam.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:39 PM

Since it is mostly males that do all the mass shootings I expect first a ban on men owning guns…

albill on December 17, 2012 at 5:39 PM

I guess dead kindergartners are the price we all pay for your freedom to own a weapon of mass destruction. Hope you can sleep at night.

lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:55 PM

I read lefty sites frequently so y’all don’t have to.

FYI, This WMD bs is their brainless new term for semi-auto guns.

juliesa on December 17, 2012 at 5:40 PM

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:35 PM

I suppose you view NASCAR attendance as indicative of how Americans feel about cars?

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:40 PM

What exactly is an Assault weapon?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:33 PM

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:38 PM

You used the term – now you define it.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:40 PM

You know, an … assault weapon! As opposed to the kind of weapon that … isn’t used for assaulting someone.

rightmind on December 17, 2012 at 5:42 PM

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:38 PM

So we just need to be OK with the blunderbuss even if the bad guys have Mac9s. Why? Because some atom sized percent of the population is stone cold crazy or nutz? No. It is because when we can’t resist we must follow. Plain, pure, simple.

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:42 PM

It is possible that a tanker load of gasoline is an Assault weapon, or a 747 with a islamic one of terror flying it, or a big old long pointey stick with “bungie juice” on the end of it.

My guess is not many first grade students would be a match for a nut case 20 year old with say a long pointey stick.

And if all the first graders have for protection is two or three 20 something ladies with Education Degrees and unarmed also as a first line of defense..

Liberals are such total loons,.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on December 17, 2012 at 5:43 PM

That’s what she wants you to do Re-post her BS over and over again.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 PM

Thank you!

Has the government ever been competent at controlling anything? Look at the war on drugs. Or the war on terror. What makes them think a war on guns will turn out any different?

scalleywag on December 17, 2012 at 5:44 PM

I suppose you view NASCAR attendance as indicative of how Americans feel about cars?

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:40 PM

254 millions cars in America.

270 million firearms in America.

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:44 PM

No. He was reloading.

ButterflyDragon on December 17, 2012 at 4:48 PM

Link 1

Link 2

Link 3

The gun jammed when he tried to fire it after loading his next magazine. So reloading had nothing to do with why he was tackled and brought down, it was the gun jamming that caused the window for the guys to tackle him. If the gun hadn’t jammed there’s no reason to think he wouldn’t have kept firing and had more victims.

nextgen_repub on December 17, 2012 at 5:45 PM

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:05 PM

First, you are correct that not allnweapons are semiautomatic, but the ones in question are. What the media and the left are doing is conflating fully automatic weapons with semiautomatic. It is meant to decieve the public.

Second, I have shot just about every fully automatic weapon the military has. I have never found a need for that function, except at first contact as point man or at an out we were taking. I used to carry the old M-60 in my first platoon. I thought that “Patriot Vet” would imply my prior service.

Third, I think that fully automatic weapons should be legal, too. If someone wants to waste rounds, that is their right.

Patriot Vet on December 17, 2012 at 5:45 PM

verbsoutofbalance,

Just what did you hit your head on when you where 12?

I would sue if I were you, as you see, your brain and ability to reason ended some where near 12 years old.

“Get a Law-yer”

APACHEWHOKNOWS on December 17, 2012 at 5:46 PM

I read lefty sites frequently so y’all don’t have to.

FYI, This WMD bs is their brainless new term for semi-auto guns.

juliesa on December 17, 2012 at 5:40 PM

That is pretty brainless.

Handgun = WMD

Nuclear weapon = ??

darwin on December 17, 2012 at 5:46 PM

Sorry, but the threat to public safety of widespread access to “semi autos” is too great. Maybe you can make do with an old fashioned 22. How many guns do you need?lostmotherland on December 17, 2012 at 4:57 PM

And who are you sir, to tell me how many guns I may own? Do I tell you what to invest in? Do I have a right to tell you how to live your life? The killing of innocent children makes me sick to my stomach, particularly since I have worked child homicides, but to infringe upon the rights of millions of law abiding Americans with feel good laws that would have done nothing to stop this horrendous act is not what this country is about.

Oh, and you obviously have never though about defending your life, or the life of a loved one. A. 22? That shows your ignorance on the subject.

kam582 on December 17, 2012 at 5:47 PM

Same as an earlier question I posed that went unanswered by any of HA’s trolls. How will you protect your rights?

Bmore on December 17, 2012 at 5:47 PM

The idea is to try and reduce this kind of violence and this level or carnage. The labeling/categorization of ‘assault weapons’ may be imperfect, but it is not illogical.

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:38 PM

I know logic is not your strong suit, but doing so will not get the results you claim.
Gun control doesn’t work (Chicago, DC, UK, Norway, Germany, and many other places), and gun free zones (Sandy Hook, Columbine, Aurora Theater, VA Tech, and on and on) do not protect people.
The proof of that is overwhelming to anyone with the slightest ability to apply logic instead of your utopian dreamworld emotion.
The problem is not the guns. If you want to reduce the violence, look at the perpetrators of the violence – not the tool they use.

dentarthurdent on December 17, 2012 at 5:48 PM

You used the term – now you define it.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:40 PM

Like I said, not playing.
It’s an imperfect term…sensible idea.
But why don’t you pause for a minute and consider the CT kid leaving the house with his Mom’s hunting rifle instead.
With your firearms knowledge, care to to suppose the day playing out at all differently?

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:49 PM

The idea is to try and reduce this kind of violence and this level or carnage. The labeling/categorization of ‘assault weapons’ may be imperfect, but it is not illogical.

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:38

PM

A semi-auto handgun inflicts as much damage at close range as a semi-auto “assault weapon”.

It’s illogical.

darwin on December 17, 2012 at 5:50 PM

That’s what she wants you to do Re-post her BS over and over again.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 PM

Thank you!

Has the government ever been competent at controlling anything? Look at the war on drugs. Or the war on terror. What makes them think a war on guns will turn out any different?

scalleywag on December 17, 2012 at 5:44 PM

The oppressives know their little scams will only serve to disarm those who obey the law and leave weapons (that can be used for assaulting someone) alone.

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:50 PM

Firecrackers! That’s it. Let us keep the right to protect ourselves with firecrackers. The perps will run for the hills at the sound of a string of firecrackers!

Limerick on December 17, 2012 at 5:50 PM

Same tired arguments being used her to dismiss even the idea of some sensible regulation of guns.

See, that’s what we were told after the NFA, the 1968 GCA, and scores of other laws passed. So, we already have sensible regulation of guns.

What you really mean is, “… used here to dismiss even the idea of the next round of gun regulations on the way to banning civilian ownership of firearms.”

At least be honest, we really do understand incrementalism and the objectives of those statists that you support.

But it’s crickets at the NRA for a reason.

Or maybe the NRA is not seeking to politicize a tragic event unlike the people on the other side. Seems that the ghouls and vultures come from the side who were calling for banning firearms before the crime scene had even been secured.

Assault weapons ban is coming back…and likely with a lot less loopholes this time.
Also gun show loopholes are done.
Say bye bye to high capacity clips…and bulk ammo buying/storing.

… and those would have stopped this evil from happening, how? Oh, that’s right, it’s not your intent that this would have stopped this from happening. This event is just a great opportunity to play on the emotions of stupid people to get them to give up yet more liberty and freedom in exchange for …. nothing.

Majority of gun owners will have no issue with any of this…many will welcome it.
There’s always gonna be the ‘proud of my arsenal!’ fantasists jumping into this debate, but they will remain on the fringe.

… are you really this ignorant, or do you just play an ignoramus on HA?

Also, you will no longer be able have your own hellfire missile equipped remote drone..to, you know, protect you from tyranny and stuff.

Dang! … and I had just picked out the perfect launcher emplacement for mine.

(But paintball is safe. So no need to change your weekend plans.)

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:30 PM

This is why we no longer trust those who come out from under their rocks the moment one of these evil acts is committed. You always come out wanting “a conversation on rational gun control”, but it’s never “an honest conversation on rational gun control” because you point only to occurrences like the one in Newtown, an act that occurred, I will point out, in a gun-free zone. A rational honest discussion might actually engage the question as to whether “gun-free” zones might not be contributors to the high body counts that occur in these acts since the evil perpetrators are assured of an unarmed victim area and many minutes before the police will arrive. Given current police engagement tactics, the perp also knows he will have even longer because SWAT secures perimeters and rounds up people in the woods before even thinking about entering what might be a hot zone. If you want to trust your safety and security to people who are only required to prevent future crimes from occurring after they investigate and write up what happened during the crime in which you were the victim, then by all means, go ahead. Don’t count on the rest of us to feel the same way.

AZfederalist on December 17, 2012 at 5:50 PM

It’s an imperfect term…sensible idea.

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:49 PM

You can’t even state clearly what it is you are asking to be done, but you think it makes sense?

Yeah, you’re a liberal.

sharrukin on December 17, 2012 at 5:52 PM

verbaluce on December 17, 2012 at 5:49 PM

So you’re using a meaningless term and expect to take you seriously?

Galt2009 on December 17, 2012 at 5:52 PM

Just pass the bill guys so we can find out what’s in it.

rightmind on December 17, 2012 at 5:53 PM

Comment pages: 1 2 3 4