Question for the State Dep’t: Can the feds invite a U.S. citizen to the local embassy for the purpose of killing him?

posted at 9:21 pm on November 28, 2012 by Allahpundit

Via Politico. The reporter asking the question isn’t shown, but surely you recognize the voice. Sure you do.

Consider this of a piece with my Greenroom post earlier about strange, dark questions raised by long years at war. The impetus for this one is the news that the State Department tried to reach out somehow to Anwar al-Awlaki in March 2011 and invite him to the embassy in Yemen to formally notify him that his passport had been revoked. Minor problem: The New York Times had reported 11 months earlier that Obama had marked him for death. Go figure that he politely declined State’s invite to appear in person before them. As Politico notes, this was probably some sort of half-assed gesture at due process from the White House, to give him the option of surrendering peacefully and coming home to face (unspecified) charges instead of facing a rendezvous with a Predator. The fact that he was already very publicly known to be targeted for assassination, however, tends to … complicate the surrender process.

Actually, I’m not so sure the notification about his passport was a due process gesture at all. I think it may have been State’s way of symbolically casting him out of the United States, which isn’t equivalent to revoking his citizenship but makes the optics of targeting him for terrorism theoretically less squirm-inducing. He’s still technically an American, but he’s barred from entering America and therefore something of an outlaw. And you know what happens to outlaws.


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This is a somewhat fuzzy area. The outlaws in the west often had “Dead or Alive” wanted posters; had they been subject to due process?

AZfederalist on November 28, 2012 at 9:27 PM

A government that is big enough to do anything for you is big enough to do anything to you.

TheAudacityofNOPE on November 28, 2012 at 9:29 PM

As Politico notes, this was probably some sort of half-assed gesture at due process from the White House

So that explains why the White House had all the toilets at the State Department sawn in half.

Knott Buyinit on November 28, 2012 at 9:32 PM

Hmmmm…Deepthroat may be getting a dinner invite soon.

Glenn Jericho on November 28, 2012 at 9:32 PM

Pharaoh Obammesses has the power of life and death over all humankind which individually and collectively continue to exist only at his please.

VorDaj on November 28, 2012 at 9:32 PM

And you know what happens to outlaws.

They become President and AG and things like that.

VorDaj on November 28, 2012 at 9:36 PM

We still use wanted posters. We dropped the dead or alive part quite a while ago. This is the USA where, as inconvenient and irksome as it might be, we are not supposed to just kill anyone we believe deserves it. And the rules don’t only apply to those citizens whom we deem worthy. Sort of comes with the whole Constitution thing.

IndieDogg on November 28, 2012 at 9:36 PM

When a govt can kill anyone without any regard to justice

Then let it be so

We have a ‘lawless’ govt living by it’s own rules that are different from the ones they set for us

Who’s gonna stop that?

Scrumpy on November 28, 2012 at 9:36 PM

That State spokeswoman is a joke. She found the premise of the question inappropriate? Why? It’s not like they’re above killing US citizens abroad, so why would they above inviting someone to an embassy for that purpose?

changer1701 on November 28, 2012 at 9:38 PM

Question for the State Dep’t: Can the feds invite a U.S. citizen to the local embassy for the purpose of killing him?

Would they at least give him lunch? I always thought it was kind of chickenshit how the mafia would usually gun the guy down outside the restaurant before he even got to eat.

arnold ziffel on November 28, 2012 at 9:42 PM

That State spokeswoman is a joke.

changer1701 on November 28, 2012 at 9:38 PM

I think that pretty much sums up the whole thing right there.

AZfederalist on November 28, 2012 at 9:47 PM

The most destructive “American Citizen” would have you jailed if you ever imagined doing to him what he does to other citizens.

astonerii on November 28, 2012 at 9:49 PM

Would they at least give him lunch? I always thought it was kind of chickenshit how the mafia would usually gun the guy down outside the restaurant before he even got to eat.

arnold ziffel on November 28, 2012 at 9:42 PM

LOL

I doubt this branch of the Mafia is any different.

Dr. ZhivBlago on November 28, 2012 at 9:50 PM

No love for al-Awlaki, none at all. He got a lot less than he deserved.

But…if any other President other than Obama had murdered a US citizen overseas in such a public way, terrorist or not, and had that terrorist on a kill list long long before said terrorist saw that Hellfire missile real close up…seriously, any other President and there’d be thousands still camped out all around the White House demanding impeachment, or a lot of other things.

But, not even a squeak from Code Pink.

And one of al-Awlaki’s favorite disciples is still considered to have committed merely some sort of workplace violence…stress of the workplace and all that out at Fort Hood.

And if this Administration actually thought that an invite to al-Awlaki to stop in and discuss his citizenship with a consular officer in Sana was going to work?

One of my favorite foreign friends overseas is right…we have truly fallen.

coldwarrior on November 28, 2012 at 9:52 PM

Perhaps they just wanted to make sure he was registered as a Democrat voter.

ghostwalker1 on November 28, 2012 at 9:55 PM

Is the premise more inappropriate when you actually off somebody?

reddevil on November 28, 2012 at 9:58 PM

Can someone clone Matt Lee and get him in front of Carney too?

lynncgb on November 28, 2012 at 10:03 PM

As an international terrorist I am sure a stern letter from the US embassy had less force than a parking ticket and had no bearing on the decision to execute him with a drone.

There isn’t a process here, so why look for one?

virgo on November 28, 2012 at 10:04 PM

This is a somewhat fuzzy area. The outlaws in the west often had “Dead or Alive” wanted posters; had they been subject to due process?

AZfederalist on November 28, 2012 at 9:27 PM

Not at all. Prior to Miranda vs Arizona (1966) cops could do what they wanted, or felt they needed, to get confessions. Subtract a century of “Swivilization” and you get Dead or Alive.

Come on. You live in Arizona. History is fun, study up.

deadite on November 28, 2012 at 10:07 PM

Actually, I’m not so sure the notification about his passport was a due process gesture at all. I think it may have been State’s way of symbolically casting him out of the United States, which isn’t equivalent to revoking his citizenship but makes the optics of targeting him for terrorism theoretically less squirm-inducing. He’s still technically an American, but he’s barred from entering America and therefore something of an outlaw. And you know what happens to outlaws.

You know the most likely explanation is just that his passport had expired and some bureaucrat sent out the required renewal notice. There’s no reason to believe the U.S. was being clever.

I mean, it could happen. But it’s not the way to bet.

tom on November 28, 2012 at 10:13 PM

Can the State Dept put a US Ambassador out in the hinterland of Libya and leave him for dead??

ted c on November 28, 2012 at 10:14 PM

Well, they could invite him to the embassy to make sure he was current on all his taxes and then plug him full of holes….at least they should make sure he has the change in his pockets to cover the bullets used.

/economics.

ted c on November 28, 2012 at 10:16 PM

Can they? Sure
Should they????

better questions.

ted c on November 28, 2012 at 10:16 PM

oh hey, Allah. I still can’t watch the quintuple freaky deak from last night. I made it until they closed the elevator doors and the lights went out. Then, I tapped out yo.

ted c on November 28, 2012 at 10:25 PM

Well are we talking a nice civilized poisoning or chain saws and the wood chipper?

LincolntheHun on November 28, 2012 at 10:32 PM

Question for the State Dep’t: Can the feds invite a U.S. citizen to the local embassy for the purpose of killing him?

Meh… Why not, if the Fed can kill the economy with impunity, why not a few citizens?

SWalker on November 28, 2012 at 10:36 PM

And you know what happens to outlaws.

We get pressured into trying to find a pathway to citizenship for them?

DrAllecon on November 28, 2012 at 10:41 PM

Practical on the State’s part? Not hardly!

If I show up with a blue passport at the embassy and not posing a threat they ARE required to permit me to enter. Which then poses the problem for State that I am now on US soil. Sure they could arrest me but if I have my lawyer in tow, the fun begins.

Dr. Dog on November 28, 2012 at 10:47 PM

Not sure. But apparently the locals in another country can kill a ambassador at the U.S. embassy with impunity, so these State Dept. geniuses are probably studying the optics.

locomotivebreath1901 on November 28, 2012 at 11:16 PM

Not sure. But apparently the locals in another country can kill a ambassador at the U.S. embassy with impunity, so these State Dept. geniuses are probably studying the optics.

locomotivebreath1901 on November 28, 2012 at 11:16 PM

Those locals had some accomplices in the White House for that.

/just sayin’

AZfederalist on November 28, 2012 at 11:25 PM

well, i’m sure that her snotty little answer was reassuring

/not

r keller on November 28, 2012 at 11:27 PM

The passport revocation prevents this citizen from traveling on said passport to other countries — and may well result in his eviction from the country he’s in if they require valid travel documents.

If a citizen has his passport revoked while in a foriegn country, he or she may apply at the American Embassy for a restricted passport good only for return to the United States.

http://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/22CFR/HTML/22CFR/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-2898/0-0-0-3335.html#0-0-0-707

unclesmrgol on November 29, 2012 at 1:22 AM

…is Carney married?…I got a girl for him!

KOOLAID2 on November 29, 2012 at 1:56 AM

Inappropriate? Not considering the possibility of an EMP attack on the US is inappropriate. Neglecting to harden the network against an EMP pulse is inappropriate. Declining to integrate a ballistic missle shield system is inappropriate. Arming the DHS with 750 million rounds of hollow point to deal witht he turmoil is inappropriate.

Asking whether the Obama administration is willng to trick an American on a US kill list into coming into the embassy to be assassinated is quite appropriate.

flicker on November 29, 2012 at 2:03 AM

Seriously thought this was going to be about Stevens.
Am I jaded, or what?

LtGenRob on November 29, 2012 at 7:19 AM

Things sure do get strange
When you’re down the rabbit hole
Of the Rule of Men

Haiku Guy on November 29, 2012 at 7:41 AM

In the dark world of the Cheneyites they would be summoned then whisked away for ‘extraordinary rendition’.

LizardLips on November 29, 2012 at 8:10 AM

The fact that he was already very publicly known to be targeted for assassination, however, tends to … complicate the surrender process.

Almost as awkward as Thanksgiving with my family after the last election.

Happy Nomad on November 29, 2012 at 8:18 AM

al-Awlaki might have figured that the top charge he would get after stepping on US soil at an Embassy would be that other ‘t’ word: Treason. Easy enough to get someone from the Circuit in, hear two Americans testify to his advocacy of and work performing war against the US. Done deal, and all necessary rights and privileges upheld with a court appointed attorney.

He was at war with the US but under no banner of any nation, wearing no uniform, adhering to no accountable power structure and in an organization that avowedly does not adhere to any standards of warfare except what they make up on a daily basis.

The ‘outlaw’ concept is an ancient one and has a real meaning: outside the protection of the law. Which is why the Wanted: Dead or Alive posters put up in territories could be done… they were unincorporated territories and thus lawless. Not everyone who lived in lawless territories were outlaws, but some were cast off from protection of the law which meant that they were fleeing from accountability to the law. In the Good Old Days way back when with the Vikings and Anglo-Saxons, that meant that no one would protect you and you had no appeal to the law of your land as you had been made outcast from it.

al-Awlaki could still get legal due process if he but showed up at the Embassy. Mind you, I don’t think he would last long and I think that he made that exact, same calculation.

Now if we had branded him a Pirate, and he did fit that in the US Code as do all members of al Qaeda and any other ‘terrorist’ outfit that declares war as just a bunch of people under no flag, then he might have been able to talk down from Treason to Piracy and get life imprisonment. Mind you that makes all others working with him to go against the US as Pirates as well, which has a whole new and lovely venue of civil powers that can be brought against all members of that organization and any who help them. Of course that means we have to stop saying that ‘terrorism’ is something on its own and that it is only a sub-part of Piracy (which is what Pirates did, they terrorized people to their own ends and it wasn’t always for cash, slaves or goods).

That requires we act as a civilized Nation and give warning to all of our brother Nations that these waging war without flag, without accountability and to their own ends are Pirates and get no safe haven from us, anywhere. Being civilized has an overhead cost to it, you know. Something the Left hates as they want all the goodies of being civilized with none of the overhead, which is what we call tyranny.

ajacksonian on November 29, 2012 at 8:19 AM

This is a somewhat fuzzy area. The outlaws in the west often had “Dead or Alive” wanted posters; had they been subject to due process?

AZfederalist on November 28, 2012 at 9:27 PM

There is nothing fuzzy about it. The president has claimed the power to murder American citizens without due process, and so-called conservatives defend it.

Dante on November 29, 2012 at 8:42 AM

I thought you meant Amb. Stevens.

Cindy Munford on November 29, 2012 at 9:17 AM

The most destructive “American Citizen” would have you jailed if you ever imagined doing to him what he does to other citizens.

astonerii on November 28, 2012 at 9:49 PM

Are you referring to Barack Obama?

Steve Z on November 29, 2012 at 9:23 AM

oh hey, Allah. I still can’t watch the quintuple freaky deak from last night. I made it until they closed the elevator doors and the lights went out. Then, I tapped out yo.

ted c on November 28, 2012 at 10:25 PM

It’s not scary.
If you want scary, look at the current administration.

Sterling Holobyte on November 29, 2012 at 9:38 AM

The fact that she can’t answer the question means yes. They would kill that person if they felt like it.

This is so freaking crazy. I’m living in a dream. Never though I’d see what I’m seeing today.

She’s not going to entertain what “lists” a person might be on. That would include the kill list.

An American shows up at the embassy. They walk in. They get a one way ticket to somewhere. No questions are asked ever again cuz nobody will ever see or hear about that person ever again.

Hey folks.. when a corrupt government has a kill list out there on American citizens… it’s only going grow and how they use that list is only going to get a lot more flexible now that the election is over… and possibly all future elections are over too. . Especially one headed up by a guy who wishes he could impose his will more.

JellyToast on November 29, 2012 at 10:13 AM

I think we all know Obama only shoots people in the back.

So no, you can’t shoot them when they come to the embassy. You can only shoot them after they leave.

TexasDan on November 29, 2012 at 11:45 AM

This didn’t start with obama. It has been a long time coming. The Branch Davidians were tortured for 51 days and then murdered by the federal government. Randy Weavers wife and son were murdered by the federal government after Weaver was set up. That butchery was under Clinton, but it began even before him.

Welcome to the fascist police state of Amerika.

woodNfish on November 29, 2012 at 1:48 PM