Time to cut a deal on immigration

posted at 9:41 am on November 13, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

Has the time come to cut our losses on immigration reform and try to get what we can in a deal? In my column today at The Week, I argue that the prospect of another four years of divided governance in Washington means another four years of unsecured borders and a broken visa system without agreeing to compromise, which should be unacceptable to everyone.  Nearly a decade of waiting for total control and an insistence on a hard-line solution hasn’t brought us any closer to political victory, either:

Republicans have expressed considerable interest in moving forward now as a way to address their credibility deficit with Latino voters.  Sen. Lindsay Graham (R-S.C.) has already announced new bipartisan talks with New York Democrat Chuck Schumer. That has the GOP base worried that Republicans will cave on amnesty, especially without any enforcement at all. However, even those proposals that did come forward over the last few years had staged rollouts, which required  enforcement milestones before any kind of normalization started. The Schumer-Graham talks appear to be following the same pattern, at least according to National Journal report, which describes a four-part process: border security, revamping Social Security identification and verification along with employer penalties, starting a temporary worker program, with normalization left to the end.

That may still be anathema to the GOP base, but it’s becoming clear that the base’s approach won’t work. The insistence on demanding nothing but the hardline approach creates big problems for the nation and the GOP itself. First, the issue of border security has been left in limbo for more than 11 years after 9/11, and more than seven years after the 9/11 Commission rightly demanded better security on both borders, and the broken visa program that offers no follow-up on expired entries. If we continue to punt rather than compromise, we will be left waiting for at least four more years to get any kind of solution.

Plus, continued obstruction means that immigration reform will continue to hang around the GOP’s neck like an albatross. Hardliners argue that a Republican compromise won’t convince Latinos to shift to the Republican Party, and they’re correct in the short run. However, it’s difficult to make the kind of free-market and family values pitches that might make some serious inroads with Latino voters when Republican candidates and activists talk about deportations — self-initiated or otherwise — of family, friends, and others within their communities. That conversation has lasted far too long, and it has caused significant damage.

Frankly, I’m more concerned about the border issue than winning Hispanic voters at this point.  We’ve been fortunate so far that we haven’t had more infiltration than we’ve seen across either border, but that good fortune won’t last forever.  We need to address both that and the visa system that doesn’t produce any follow-up on violators.  We have waited since 2007 to win back control of Washington to win a solution on our terms rather than a compromise that would both pass more quickly and spread the political risk.

Now that we’ve lost the presidential election, we won’t have that opportunity for another four years.  We still have the House, though, and that gives us leverage to insist on prioritizing border security and visa reform ahead of normalization for those illegal aliens in the US.  In two years, on the current trajectory, we may not even have that much, and there is no guarantee that a Republican will win the presidency in 2016, either.  If we continue to punt on border security over an insistence that 11 million people will have to leave the country in order to stay here, we risk losing any influence over the solution with another bad electoral cycle.

Will that win Hispanic voters?  Not in the short run, as I note in my column.  Ramesh Ponnuru makes a good point in his column today at Bloomberg:

Republican views on immigration, and the way they express those views, must play a role in how poorly Republicans do with Hispanics. Republicans haven’t found a way to reassure conservative voters that the country will respect the rule of law without also making Hispanics think that the party is hostile to them. A way out of this predicament doesn’t immediately suggest itself.

Even if a solution were found, though, the growing number of Hispanic voters would continue to mean trouble for Republicans. Hispanics are disproportionately poor and uninsured. And like people of other races in similar situations, they tend to have views on economic policy that align with the Democrats. In California, for example, Hispanics helped get Democratic GovernorJerry Brown’s tax increases approved on Election Day. A Republican Party that is associated with repealing Obama’s health-care legislation — and not with any alternative plan to get people health insurance — is going to get trounced among these voters.

Public support for same-sex marriage has risen a lot, among young people especially, and the Republican Party will have to soften its opposition to it. Again, though, there is an economic dimension to the party’s trouble. Young people are also less economically secure than the middle-aged and the retired who vote Republican more frequently. That has to play a role in the way they vote. What have Republicans up and down the ticket offered to address the concerns of economically stressed young people? A vague promise to create more jobs; an entitlement reform that, even viewed charitably, would do nothing for them here and now.

The long-term solution to winning Hispanic voters is economics, without a doubt.  But as one Hispanic Republican from Arizona wrote yesterday, these voters won’t listen to the economic pitch while the party insists on hard-line solutions that will negatively impact their communities by deportation, self-initiated or otherwise:

Growing up my father (a Mexican national) taught me the importance of having three basic priorities that should govern my life. These priorities were to always place God first, family second, and work/school third above everything else. After the spanking the Republicans  received this last election day, it seems as if we as a party could benefit from considering these priorities, especially when it comes to the family.  I understand that not every Hispanic person is the same, nor is every Mexican American for that matter. But I do believe that these priorities are important and relatable to the Hispanic and Latino community. While the GOP tends to do a great job at defending religious liberty and is the most active in the defense of the unborn, it seems to neglect one of the most important priorities – family and fails miserably at communicating the third – work/education.

If Republicans wish to gain back the support of the Latino vote, especially that of the Mexican Americans in many southwestern states, then we need to end the rhetorical attacks on their families. Hispanics are not going to vote for any candidate whom they  think is going to deport their abuelita or go after their parents, husbands or wives.  They also will not support candidates of a party who want to end birthright citizenship. If we are to be the party of family values which I believe we are, then we must let go of our rhetoric and reach out in good faith to work towards some form of immigration reform just as George W. Bush tried to do. Conservatives seem to think and fear that Hispanics are inherently liberal. I disagree. The Democratic party does not hold our values; but neither do they pander to the immigration enforcement only crowd as republicans tend to do. I am not calling for open borders or lax enforcement. I am suggesting that we use our enforcement resources on the border and go after the criminals and the cartels, meanwhile, finding a humane way to keep families united and help build a better future for America and the Republican Party. When the Republicans finally embrace pro-family policies and cease the rhetoric that has been perceived as anti-Hispanic, then the door will be opened for further dialogue.

We have a limited window for an immigration reform package that addresses the most pressing conservative concerns of national security and regulatory reform.  Waiting another four years and hoping that Democrats disappear from power is not a strategy that is likely to bring us closer to success on those issues.  While we still have a seat at the table, we need to get immigration reform resolved and off the table so that we can start addressing economic policies — and give voters an opening to listen.

Addendum: Bear in mind that while we’ve waited for years to impose our own solution to this issue, all of the attendant problems of a porous border and failed visa program continue to accrue.  Shall we wait through four more years of that?

Update: I’m seeing various forms of comments like this: “I think a lot of this emanates from the unspoken fear of an Obama second term and its ramifications for conservative blogs…”  Like I responded in the comments, that can only come from an ignorance of practically everything I’ve ever written on this issue.  I have always had a borders-and-visas-first, all-else-is-negotiable position on immigration reform.  The reason I’m writing this now … again … is that our window for even getting that much is closing.


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is it time to eat my peas again?/

ted c on November 13, 2012 at 9:43 AM

Border security will never happen, even with a deal.

Wethal on November 13, 2012 at 9:43 AM

If a deal is struck to gain voters, that’s one thing. But why would one believe that a deal would lead to actual enforcement of the border?

rlyle on November 13, 2012 at 9:44 AM

There is a failed narco-state on our southern border, and neither Bush nor Obama wanted to do anything about it.

Wethal on November 13, 2012 at 9:45 AM

Obama won’t hold up his end of the bargain.

RightKlik on November 13, 2012 at 9:46 AM

Legalize 12 million illegals and you can say goodbye to the Republican Party for generations to come.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:47 AM

I dunno, do you think Medicaid can handle it?

DaydreamBeliever on November 13, 2012 at 9:48 AM

Even if the GOP struck a deal, the Dems would get the credit, according to the MSM, for dragging the raaaacist GOP to the bargaining table.

The Dems would be lining up to register each new citizen as a Dem, handing them a voter registration card (party checked off), and a handout on all the nice government benefits that are available, all of which were brought about by Dems.

The GOP will gain nothing.

Wethal on November 13, 2012 at 9:48 AM

Act in haste! Now!

the_nile on November 13, 2012 at 9:48 AM

Legalize 12 million illegals and you can say goodbye to the Republican Party for generations to come.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:47 AM

tie it to voting restrictions x 25 years and border security and we might have a deal.

ted c on November 13, 2012 at 9:49 AM

Border security is a national security issue. Being held hostage by the Hispanic activists and Democrat party who demand that the illegals in this nation be rewarded for ignoring the law (while many others have immigrated the right way) is nothing but divisive partisan politics. Put another way, why do Mexicans who snuck into the country get head-of-line privileges when there are thousands of others who are doing it the legitimate way.

And for that matter, not every illegal is in this nation of benign purposes. Why would we want to give legal status to those who distribute for the Mexican drug cartels. Sorry but caving in to the left on the issue is just wrong. There will be no substantive change in border security but they will roll out the amnesty as if there is. You only end up with more people competing for jobs without making the nation any safer.

Happy Nomad on November 13, 2012 at 9:49 AM

Agree wethal

We are fooling ourselves if we think it will happen

cmsinaz on November 13, 2012 at 9:49 AM

And if you give them their tax increases they’ll give you your spending cuts.

Jeezus, how naive can you get?

The only way this would work is if we started turning all those Catholic hispanics into values voters.

That way either they’ll vote GOP to stop gay marriage and abortion or the Dems will wall-up the border themselves.

Mr Snuggle Bunny on November 13, 2012 at 9:49 AM

Illegals who become legal citizens aren’t going to vote Republican. Get that thought out of your head. Once you do, you will realize how foolish compromise on this point is.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:50 AM

They also will not support candidates of a party who want to end birthright citizenship.

If that is the case, then we will have another 12 million in 10 more years.

Patriot Vet on November 13, 2012 at 9:50 AM

Let everybody in, let it all burn, we the prepped are prepared. Good luck liberals

royzer on November 13, 2012 at 9:51 AM

Time to cut a deal on immigration? Yeah, amnesty, but those here illegally won’t get to vote for 25 years. — H/T El Rushbo

petefrt on November 13, 2012 at 9:51 AM

Obama won’t hold up his end of the bargain.

RightKlik on November 13, 2012 at 9:46 AM

.
Dittos. That’s all that need be said.

listens2glenn on November 13, 2012 at 9:51 AM

That’s one and only thing I would like the GOP to go scorched-earth over. It’s the singularly most existential matter for the country. Without laws establishing English as the only official language, the South will promptly turn into North Mexico.

The GOP must pound day and night on the threat that unskilled Mexican labor poses to the union jobs in Rust Belt. Better yet, tie amnesty to Right-to-Work (we want to protect new citizens’ sacred right to steal *all* jobs, capiche?) and see it die in diapers.

Archivarix on November 13, 2012 at 9:52 AM

Man from reading this and some other Republicans that have “evolved” on this issue.

It seems to me, that we are screwed.
Because it seems they have the control and power on their issue and if the Republican party does what they want, and does their bidding, and get their votes.
Then the Reps. have to get in line and do what they want.

Great….that is how you want to lead.

I think this is what Obama called “leading from behind”.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 9:52 AM

Great, time for the Country to be a one party system, Like Chicago LA & New York. It’s working great for them.

cmptrnerd on November 13, 2012 at 9:52 AM

LOL. Anybody who believes the enforcement measures of any comprehensive immigration law will ever be implemented has their head firmly shoved up their ass.

Mark1971 on November 13, 2012 at 9:52 AM

Deals will be broken

We’ve been down this road already

cmsinaz on November 13, 2012 at 9:52 AM

I’ve got a great idea. Let’s incentivize millions of latin Americans to come to the U.S. by offering amnesty to millions of latin Americans. Yes!

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:53 AM

Let’s ignore laws then expect people to behave rationally and legally.

Or we can shove it right back into their faces with our FIREARMS.

tom daschle concerned on November 13, 2012 at 9:53 AM

lets just fill a few binders with illegal aliens and give them jobs as tsars. We’ll have those wEtB*CkS voting for us for the next 200 years

Slade73 on November 13, 2012 at 9:53 AM

So disappointed right now. Don’t have time to write more. This is totally unacceptable.

Absolutely no talk of amnesty until the border is secured. Period.

bluegill on November 13, 2012 at 9:53 AM

In 20 more years which group will we have to cut a deal on then? It’s endless. The more people are elevated from the poorer classes, the more the left will need poor people to stay in power. The world has an endless supply. Host them at your home, Ed.

rhombus on November 13, 2012 at 9:53 AM

Amnesty for all here now.

BUT – No benefits for 12 years and no voting in any election for 25.

AND BUILD THAT DAMNED FENCE AND ELECTRIFY IT.

Rixon on November 13, 2012 at 9:54 AM

Yep… amnesty which will create 12 million more Dem voters.. just what the doctor ordered.

davek70 on November 13, 2012 at 9:54 AM

Funny how a Republican (Ron Reagan) can grant amnesty to millions of illegals….and then they now vote Democrat.

Love it.

Kinda like Lincoln and the 1860′s
And the Republicans during the Civil Rights movement.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 9:54 AM

We still have the House, though, and that gives us leverage to insist on prioritizing border security and visa reform ahead of normalization for those illegal aliens in the US.

How does the House GOP have leverage if the GOP is publicly running scared about the Latino vote and eager to cut a deal?

Mark1971 on November 13, 2012 at 9:54 AM

That’s one and only thing I would like the GOP to go scorched-earth over. It’s the singularly most existential matter for the country. Without laws establishing English as the only official language, the South will promptly turn into North Mexico.

The GOP must pound day and night on the threat that unskilled Mexican labor poses to the union jobs in Rust Belt. Better yet, tie amnesty to Right-to-Work (we want to protect new citizens’ sacred right to steal *all* jobs, capiche?) and see it die in diapers

You can’t be serious, right? What good is the GOP’s “pounding” on this topic going to do if they lose all political power whatsoever because Hispanics, young people, women, and liberals unite against them to form a permanent governing majority?

I mean, how retarded can you get?

Esoteric on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Is it me or is this web site turning into Little Green Footballs lite more and more every day?

Rixon on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

“Let’s compromise our values and principles so that we can gain power, so that once we have power, we can continue to compromise our values and principles in order to hang onto power.” Yeah, that works.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Latino Obsession – Victor Davis Hanson

CoffeeLover on November 13, 2012 at 9:56 AM

Why should Conservatives have to ‘evolve”?

I’m with Rush. Here’s the offer: Amnesty. However, they can not vote for 25 years.
Stick that up your evolving pipe and smoke it.

kingsjester on November 13, 2012 at 9:56 AM

Texas is going to become the next California sooner than we thought.

bluegill on November 13, 2012 at 9:56 AM

I’m sure they’ll keep their promise to secure the border and enact employment verification/enforcement this time…

Fool me once…

If anyone missed them Heather Mac Donald (part 2) and CIS both came to the same conclusion: Hispanics were welfare state Democrats long before amnesty came up. So what makes anyone think that will change?

batter on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Ok:

1. Time to Raise Taxes (on promisee of spending cuts to be named later – or to be reinstated later)

2. Time for Amnesty (on promises of enforcement actions to be named later – or to be watered down later)

What other principals are we to jettison in order to be “liked” by the electorate?

Hey, instead of giving up, how about we work on educating people about economics and about why liberty and freedom is to be valued and protected? Such an old-fashioned notion, yes?

LilyBart on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Frankly, I’m more concerned about the border issue than winning Hispanic voters at this point.

I seem to recall solving the border issue was part of the last round of amnesty compromise back in 1986. That didn’t happen.

What makes you think it will happen this time? The GOP has less control now than they did then.

Steve Eggleston on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Massive illegal alien amnesty is the equivalent of national suicide.

No way in hell we should ever support this. Secure the border now.

bluegill on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

@Esoteric on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

So then why do we need a two party system?

Seems like to me that if you cave on this issue and abortion and gay marriage….

Then what is left?

The voting public already want a bigger government, with more entitlements…
This election proved that….so the economy and spending is no longer a Republican issue.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Amnesty for all here now.

BUT – No benefits for 12 years and no voting in any election for 25.

AND BUILD THAT DAMNED FENCE AND ELECTRIFY IT.

Rixon on November 13, 2012 at 9:54 AM

Dude…a mine field is far more secure than a fence. :)

royzer on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Rixon on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

it’s not you

Slade73 on November 13, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Spineless “pundits” like Mr. Morrissey and Charles Krauthammer arguing for amnesty (no mistake – that’s exactly what this is) are sounding the death knell of conservative governance in America.

This will not work as a security issue.

It will not work as an economic issue.

Illegals and their progeny will NEVER vote GOP.

Get it?

Got it?

Good.

IndustrialGypsy on November 13, 2012 at 9:58 AM

Every two illegals that are granted amnesty should get to replace 3 unionized employees, not be forced to join the union and not pay union dues.

They should also be required to reside in only rust belt states and cities.

Rixon on November 13, 2012 at 9:58 AM

Legalize 12 million illegal aliens when there are at least 23 million unemployed American citizens at the moment?

Are you effin’ crazy?

sentinelrules on November 13, 2012 at 9:58 AM

Legalize 12 million illegals and you can say goodbye to the Republican Party for generations to come.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:47 AM

This. And why do we assume the number has remained 12 million for the last 20 years? Once Republicans grant amnesty, watch that number turn into 40 million. And 95% of those are low-skilled people who will instantly balloon the 47% into 51% and a permanent majority.

Amnesty would be the most idiotic thing that Republicans can do. No wonder all liberals who are pretending to care about Republicans are advising Republicans to work with Obama on “immigration reform.”

milcus on November 13, 2012 at 9:58 AM

Over and over again, the Democrats offer us “bargains” that never pan out. Tax increases now for spending cuts later. Amnesty now for border security later. And so on.

We tried the amnesty once. We were promised it wouldn’t happen again.

Republicans aren’t going to win the Latino vote, amnesty or no. Why would anyone think this is a good idea?

PetecminMd on November 13, 2012 at 9:59 AM

Yes. We build a fence and they agree not to try and climb it.

Bishop on November 13, 2012 at 9:59 AM

Call me hard-hearted. I prefer to consider myself a patriot and law-abiding citizen of these United States. I believe in securing our border by any and all means necessary – NOW! I also believe that any person of any age who is in the United States and is not a citizen or otherwise permitted to be here legally should be identified and deported. If they want to become U.S. citizens they can apply for it legally and wait their turn. That is the law – enforce it! Also, with e-verify there is little question of identifying persons legally able to procure employment. If any employer is found to be employing illegal aliens, that employer should face a substantial fine – to be used for enforcing our borders and immigration laws.

Elric on November 13, 2012 at 9:59 AM

You can’t be serious, right? What good is the GOP’s “pounding” on this topic going to do if they lose all political power whatsoever because Hispanics, young people, women, and liberals unite against them to form a permanent governing majority?
Esoteric on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

When the inmates take over the asylum, are you joining up?

rhombus on November 13, 2012 at 10:00 AM

Want to change the electoral map?

Limit immigration and Whites need to start having more babies.

sentinelrules on November 13, 2012 at 10:00 AM

Lindsey Graham: Enemy of the conservative movement.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 10:00 AM

Legalize them, but don’t allow them to vote, ever.

The broke the law to come here….right?

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 10:00 AM

We lost an election and now we have to force ourselves to change our values and go along with a possible amnesty. Cratering on illegal immigration gains nothing.

Doester on November 13, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Why would anyone think this is a good idea?

PetecminMd on November 13, 2012 at 9:59 AM

Power trumps principle and even common sense?

rhombus on November 13, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Legalize 12 million illegals and you can say goodbye to the Republican Party for generations to come.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 9:47 AM

Yep.

Sorry Ed, but this column is a huge disappointment and is a good exhibit of the ideological rot that’s devouring the GOP from the inside.

We still have the House, though, and that gives us leverage to insist on prioritizing border security and visa reform ahead of normalization for those illegal aliens in the US.

We have no leverage. Any border enforcement depends entirely on the goodwill of the Obama administration, and you know it. We couldn’t even get the REPUBLICANS to enforce border security, and now you expect the Democrats to do it for us? Do you actually think Boehner will have the stones to make Obama live up to his end of the bargain? Give me a break.

If we continue to punt on border security over an insistence that 11 million people will have to leave the country in order to stay here, we risk losing any influence over the solution with another bad electoral cycle.

So your solution to our electoral problems is to give the Democrats twelve million new voters.

The only thing I can think is that you’ve been panicked and stampeded by the people shouting “SOMETHING MUST BE DONE!” without stopping to consider what that something is.

Doomberg on November 13, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Reagan granted amnesty with no increased Hispanic support. It’s a losing prop. I do not expect the GOP to understand this though.

Mr. Arrogant on November 13, 2012 at 10:02 AM

Keep in mind everyone, since you’ve been living in a COCOON of LIES, your values can’t possible be the truth. Therefore you need to evolve by surrendering your false conservative values.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 10:02 AM

So Ed says he’s in favor of the free market (sure he is). He wants to make the free market pitch.

Ok, Ed, put your money where your mouth is:

Advocate for the free market: support open borders that would allow for the free exchange of labor and goods. You do not have to grant citizenship to anyone who comes over to work, nor do you have to have the attendant welfare state. Let businesses hire and grow; let workers, businesses, and consumers benefit. That’s the free market, not your government interventionism that you usually support.

Dante on November 13, 2012 at 10:02 AM

No deals. My great-grandparent and grandfather came to this country LEGALLY. Why should they have had to follow the rues when this new crop gets rewarded for border jumping?
Nevermind…I forgot…rules only apply to those with white skin. Yeah-I said it.

annoyinglittletwerp on November 13, 2012 at 10:03 AM

This could be the best possible time to compromise on amnesty if we have to be forced into it. The terrible US economy over the last four years has likely resulted in the lowest level of recent illegal immigrants currently in the country.

If we can close the gate at the low water mark, it will make amnesty a palatable compromise.

thuljunior on November 13, 2012 at 10:03 AM

Mitymaxx @10

Libs will cry they have constitutional rights

cmsinaz on November 13, 2012 at 10:03 AM

How can you trust border security when the organization that performs this duty also runs guns to the cartels?

Isn’t this just a teensy bit of a problem, this spreading arms to international criminals deal?

If we can’t trust them to NOT supply the cartels with arms, then how can they be trusted with ANYTHING?

ajacksonian on November 13, 2012 at 10:04 AM

HorAir.com’s founder on amnesty:

http://michellemalkin.com/2012/11/12/assimilation-not-amnesty/

bluegill on November 13, 2012 at 10:04 AM

This whole debate studiously avoids discussing what illegals want.

Illegals want to work, they do NOT want to become US citizens.

Most illegals from MX simply want to come here to work and if it were possible they would come and go as work availability dictated. As it is they come to stay because after risking everything to get in, they date not leave. And since they can’t leave they bring their families with them.

What we need to do is implement a liberal work permit program that allows seasonal and other low skilled laborers to come and go at will. They will then not set up permanent residency, they will not bring in their families, and they will not seek to have anchor babies. Many illegals would leave if they were confident that they could come back to work.

It is the Democrats and Hispanic ethnic groups that seek to grant amnesty to illegals so they can grow the Democrat party.

It would be foolish to play this suckers’ game. I’m talking to you Lindsey Graham.

Charlemagne on November 13, 2012 at 10:04 AM

@Dante on November 13, 2012 at 10:02 AM

Laws have to be repealed first though.

As it stands now, you cannot just enter this country as you wish.

So the two issues are not entirely the same thing.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Oh, is John McCain still looking for his “damn fence?”

Mr. Arrogant on November 13, 2012 at 10:04 AM

We tried that whole amnesty, reform and secure the border thing back in the 80s. Didn’t work then, won’t work now. Why do we continue to support ideas that will attract illegals from around the world and then have to work almost 6 months of the year to pay for their goodies? They don’t call the repubs the party of stupid for nothin’.

Kissmygrits on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

If you want to know why some (including me)are hardliners against legalization of 12 million illegals look at the history of the hispanic organizations in the SouthWest and Western States.

Not the cities, where the liberals always want to take care of people, but the small towns and agricultural areas.

They came to the area, cut the rate for work (since they lived 5 or more to a house, it didn’t matter to them.), got government to create new laws restricting work by young people (they used to let school out for 2 weeks to harvest apples), and now the farmers and ranchers cry about not being able to find workers. (Truncated for ranting.)

Their hispanic organizations are all about taking back what was “stolen” from them.

There was a war. Mexico lost. It was over 100 years ago and we won.

Do we surrender because their atacks take a long time and are more subtle then the usual type of war?

DarrelsJoy on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

How exactly was Romney anatgonistic to Hispanics? He explicitly rejected rounding up 11 million people and deporting them. He mostly talked about border security and enforcing the law.

SAZMD on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

Nice to see that most of the HA commentariat still refuses to acknowledge the existence of reality. We lost. We lost big. If we decide to pick indefensible hills to do die on, like forfeiting any chance at the Hispanic vote in the long term because we allow conservatism to get defined forever as anti- Latino over immigration the way it got defined as anti- black in the ’60′s over the opposition to the Civil Rights Act, then that’s exactly what our movement will do: Die on those hills.

Dukeboy01 on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

Laws have to be repealed first though.

As it stands now, you cannot just enter this country as you wish.

So the two issues are not entirely the same thing.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Of course they would have to be repealed.

Dante on November 13, 2012 at 10:06 AM

You can’t be serious, right? What good is the GOP’s “pounding” on this topic going to do if they lose all political power whatsoever because Hispanics, young people, women, and liberals unite against them to form a permanent governing majority?

I mean, how retarded can you get?

Esoteric on November 13, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Please provide your evidence that these groups won’t do this anyway.

Let’s face it, the Good Old Days of the Grand Old Party are over. Well, unless we become just like the Democrats.

Get this straight, everyone: this election has shown, in crystal clarity, one thing: the US has taken a dramatic leftward-shift, from which there is no return. I grieve for what the US has become. But that’s the reality. Get used to it.

psrch on November 13, 2012 at 10:06 AM

Now this is just a bridge too far. If the Republicans do this, there will be hell to pay.

bluegill on November 13, 2012 at 10:07 AM

The Repubs. are playing right into the Dems. It’s a trap to further marginalize the Repubs. and many of them haven’t quite figured it out yet. The Republican Party isn’t called The Party of Stupid for nuthin’.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 10:07 AM

@Dukeboy01 on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

Point noted.

But you honestly think that legalizing them, will mean they will vote for the right??

Reagan tried it.
And they went over 70% for Obama in this election.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 10:07 AM

I am not calling for open borders or lax enforcement. I am suggesting that we use our enforcement resources on the border and go after the criminals and the cartels, meanwhile, finding a humane way to keep families united and help build a better future for America and the Republican Party.

The Mexicans that cross the border illegally and enter the US are criminals. That is the point that almost anyone who is in support of amnesty misses.

The bigger point is, is this going to be a redux of the 1980′s. Reagan did amnesty with the assurance that it wouldn’t happen again. Well, it did. What did the act do:

-required employers to attest to their employees’ immigration status.
-made it illegal to knowingly hire or recruit unauthorized immigrants.
-granted amnesty to certain seasonal agricultural illegal immigrants.
-granted amnesty to illegal immigrants who entered the United States before January 1, 1982 and had resided there continuously. About three million illegal immigrants were granted amnesty.

Like one other poster wrote, it will mean the end of the Republican party, and maybe the extreme shifting of the US to something similar to Greece.

As one of the articles points out, most the illegals are low-wage earners, so they utelize social programs disporportionally to their make-up of the US. Now, what will that do to the cost of Obamacare and the costs associated with it with 12 million more on the doles? I think you can safely double that if this goes through since that is the amount they see covering.

Patriot Vet on November 13, 2012 at 10:07 AM

I don’t trust dems to keep any deal on boarder security. they will agree and then their part of the deal will be all but forgotten. I’t like President HW Bush making a deal with democrats to raise taxed in exchange for spending cuts.

Dollayo on November 13, 2012 at 10:08 AM

If we decide to pick indefensible hills to do die on, like forfeiting any chance at the Hispanic vote in the long term because we allow conservatism to get defined forever as anti- Latino over immigration the way it got defined as anti- black in the ’60′s over the opposition to the Civil Rights Act, then that’s exactly what our movement will do: Die on those hills.

Dukeboy01 on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

So your solution is total or partial amnesty then? We ALREADY gave them amnesty during the Reagan years and we got nothing. Your statements are conterfactual to both history and common sense.

Doomberg on November 13, 2012 at 10:08 AM

So, the value of these wage slaves.

1. D.R. Horton Homes LLC the largest user of illegal immigrants in the U.S., $100,000,000.00 profit for the last qt..

So, the value of these vote slaves.

1. B. Obama re-elected with voters who vote for the total unlimited immigration overrunning of the U.S.A..

So, how does a country have any honor that uses humans in this way.

So, without borders what need of a constitution, freedom and justice for all.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on November 13, 2012 at 10:08 AM

Grant amnesty with the condition that all of them must agree to be U.S. ambassadors to the mideast and north Africa.

“We changed our minds.”

Bishop on November 13, 2012 at 10:08 AM

@psrch on November 13, 2012 at 10:06 AM

Agreed.

ANd republicans should let the country enjoy all the taxes and the fiscal cliff.
I say let all Bush tax cuts expire, don’t do anything to fix Obamacare.

Let the Dems get what they voted for.

It will hurt more Blue states than the others.

MityMaxx on November 13, 2012 at 10:09 AM

Dukeboy01 on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

Do note that it was Republicans who signed up to the civil rights bills, and the Democratic party had its problems with its own Jim Crow people on the inside.

Yet the MFM would make you believe that it was the Republicans against the civil rights movement, not white Democrats.

Shame that Republicans let the MFM slander their reputation like that.

Someday they should have to stand on their backing of such things just to remind people that they did so and why.

ajacksonian on November 13, 2012 at 10:09 AM

Ed, why do you give kudos to Sen. Graham, who has been pushing Amnesty for years? Were you asleep in the aftermath of the “Onetime Amnesty” of 1986?
The idea for the GOP to bite the bullet on Amnesty is counter-intuitive to what the results will be for our contry! Do you not understand the relationship of no border protection policies, of damn near all Administrations following 1986, and the sovereignty of the USA?I thought you were smarter than that!

tomshup on November 13, 2012 at 10:09 AM

I want a bumper sticker for my car that says

“AS A CITIZEN, WHICH LAWS MAY I BREAK AND BE REWARDED?”

Cindy Munford on November 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM

If we decide to pick indefensible hills to do die on, like forfeiting any chance at the Hispanic vote in the long term because we allow conservatism to get defined forever as anti- Latino over immigration the way it got defined as anti- black in the ’60′s over the opposition to the Civil Rights Act, then that’s exactly what our movement will do: Die on those hills.

Dukeboy01 on November 13, 2012 at 10:05 AM

It was the right opposing the civil rights act? Huh.

Blacks were already citizens, they didn’t break any laws being in the nation unlike all these people who have flooded over our borders. Either we are a nation of laws or we aren’t.

Bishop on November 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM

I will never, ever vote for any Republican who supports amnesty. Any Republican who supports amnesty must be thrown the hell out.

bluegill on November 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM

DEAL?!?

Join the other washed-up RINOs on the has-been shelf, Mr. Morrissey.

Czar of Defenestration on November 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM

Ed, Ed, Ed, you are obviously on some good drugs and having a difficult time with the loss in the election. Mittins was never and let me say again NEVER going to go after the one like every CONSEVATIVE thought he should have in order to win. Now here we are all the pundits are running around saying how we need to compromise our values on things like immigration ect in order to win next time, this my friend is wrong. We need to nominate a real conservative who can actually talk easily about what that means to be a CONSERVATIVE and how it is a good thing. No more Doles, McCains, or Romneys, I think even Sarah Palin could have givin a better fight for the party that what all you know it alls forced us to vote for. I’m sure Michelle your dear leader is rolling her eyes over your article and I hope she takes you aside and has a little pep talk. Grow a pair dude and never compromise your values!!!!!!!!!!!!

2eagles on November 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM

People who try to win friends by forfeiting security end up with neither.

HotAirian on November 13, 2012 at 10:12 AM

When the bloggers become the trolls… reminds me of HA after the Giffords Tuscon shooting.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 10:13 AM

If you want to get rid of the cartels, if you want to get rid of the murder and violence that goes along with the “illegal trade,” then end the prohibition on drugs.

Dante on November 13, 2012 at 10:13 AM

This is ridiculous. My father came here from a Soviet Bloc country and it took him years to become a citizen. And even back then the paperwork was huge.

Before he bcame a citizen he was a registered alien. What happened to that? Every year he had to renew his status in order to work. Somehow before computers the government managed to keep up. How do I now? When he and my mother(an American born here) wanted to get married he had to jump through hoops to do so. Now I grant you there weren’t as many people but as I said this was before computers. He had to have letters from employers, birth certificate (do you know how hard that was to get from a Soviet controlled country?), and proof of residence, among other things. All that just so they could get married!

Why did he have to do that and these people have been allowed to just do whatever they want?

He lived to see the day when Spanish started appearing on everything. He never understood the reason behind that. He was proud that he had learned English on his own.

I say we need to enforce the borders and the requirements to work first. Then let’s see what is going to happen. For my father’s memory and all the others who did it the right way through a whole lot more hardship than the Hispanics.

Do it the wrong way with Hispanics and it will set a precedent. Actually it already has. The influx of people from Muslim countries grows every day. Just saying..

Deanna on November 13, 2012 at 10:13 AM

The country in fact is shifting to the right.

The vote turn out shows clear that a huge part of the U.S. did not vote, will not vote, as they see the D’s and R’s as the same crime family with the same goals.

Under all this gun sales higher, higher, the underground grows.

The F.B.I. reads the gun blogs, they read and infiltrate the anti illegal immigrations groups.

The elite know that the American base is pissed, but they are like the Gen.’s of the Army, they think they are above the law, morals and normal human honor.

APACHEWHOKNOWS on November 13, 2012 at 10:13 AM

When 23 million people are out of work, is it the right time to add 12 million new people with work permits.

How much will this add to the bottom line of Obamacare, will these 12 million be able to sign up for services?

Will “immigration reform” fix our economy/debts/unemployment/etc. If not (and especially if it has a negative impact), we are stupid for even talking about the idea.

deuce on November 13, 2012 at 10:14 AM

Unlike Sally Fields, once illegals are made legal, they won’t “LIKE” us, they won’t “REALLY LIKE” us.

WordsMatter on November 13, 2012 at 10:14 AM

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