Projection: Nearly eight million white voters who were expected to vote, didn’t; Update: Or did they?

posted at 6:59 pm on November 8, 2012 by Allahpundit

Essential reading from Sean Trende about the new demographic reality at the polls. Based on his back-of-the-envelope math, there are actually two reasons why there were more minority voters as a share of the electorate this time. One, the reason everyone knows: There were more minority voters, period. Two, the reason no one guessed: If current projections hold, there were many, many fewer white voters at the polls this year than in 2008.

Had the same number of white voters cast ballots in 2012 as did in 2008, the 2012 electorate would have been about 74 percent white, 12 percent black, and 9 percent Latino (the same result occurs if you build in expectations for population growth among all these groups). In other words, the reason this electorate looked so different from the 2008 electorate is almost entirely attributable to white voters staying home. The other groups increased their vote, but by less than we would have expected simply from population growth.

Who were they? He looked at his home state of Ohio to try to guess:

Where things drop off are in the rural portions of Ohio, especially in the southeast. These represent areas still hard-hit by the recession. Unemployment is high there, and the area has seen almost no growth in recent years.

My sense is these voters were unhappy with Obama. But his negative ad campaign relentlessly emphasizing Romney’s wealth and tenure at Bain Capital may have turned them off to the Republican nominee as well. The Romney campaign exacerbated this through the challenger’s failure to articulate a clear, positive agenda to address these voters’ fears, and self-inflicted wounds like the “47 percent” gaffe. Given a choice between two unpalatable options, these voters simply stayed home.

Yeah, I always thought the goal of Team O’s multifaceted class demagoguery of Romney wasn’t so much to win white working-class votes for Obama, which may have been unwinnable, as to keep potential Romney voters home. (Ross Douthat wrote about that in August too.) If Trende’s math is right, looks like it worked like gangbusters. Another bonbon from the national exit poll:

When voters were asked the same question about Obama, 10% said he’d favor the rich versus 44% who said the middle class. That was one of Romney’s meta-problems in trying to sell himself as the “recovery” candidate, of course. He was easily cast as a stereotypical rich country club Republican, and inexplicably he never did obvious things that he could have done to fight that image. He didn’t run positive ads early, while Obama was busy tearing him down every day with attack ads. He refused to run biographical ads until the very end showing off what a warm, kindhearted guy he is. He never went after Obama systematically on the basic point that preserving the liberal dream of a ballooning welfare state will require taxes on the middle class, not just “the one percent.” And he never pushed an agenda that was aimed overtly at breaks for the middle class. His task this year was to usher in a “new” Republican Party, partly in the spirit of the 2010 tea party takeover and partly in the spirit of flushing out all the stuff under Bush that soured the country on the GOP. But apart from choosing Paul Ryan, who didn’t get nearly as much time as I thought he would to push fiscal reform, there wasn’t a lot that felt new. Essentially, voters could keep O or give the guy who sounded like the guy whom O replaced a shot. Not surprising that a lot of people shrugged and stayed home.

This didn’t help Romney either:

The economic numbers are ugly but the trends were all the right way for O, and his final job approval ended up being several points higher than Bush’s was when he won reelection in 2004. How can that be? Well, here’s something I wrote in June of last year that I’ve been thinking about since Tuesday. There was an AP poll at the time that asked voters whether it was realistic to expect significant improvement in the economy in Obama’s first two years in office or whether it would take longer than that. To my surprise, the data showed that not only did the public not expect quick improvement, the number who said they didn’t remained basically constant month after month after month. Even though we were getting further and further into O’s term, the public wasn’t getting impatient. Here was my attempt to explain why at the time:

I think it could go two ways if he doesn’t turn things around by next year. One: The public will continue to cut him lots of slack well into 2012, but as the election approaches and they realize that this will be their last chance until 2016 to change course, they’ll bail and we’ll see a rapid snowball effect among those blaming him for not fixing the economy. Or two: The public will decide that the current recession is so uniquely horrible, unlike anything since the Great Depression, that it’s unfair to expect any president to make major strides in just one term, which will have the ironic effect of partly neutralizing the economy as an electoral issue. That’s completely counterintuitive given its singular importance right now (fully 93 percent in this poll say the economy is extremely or very important to them, an all-time high), but paradoxically the worse things get, the easier it is for Obama to frame slow growth and chronically high unemployment as some sort of mega-quake or force majeure for which no one could reasonably be expected to have been prepared.

Boldface added. How’s that prediction looking today? Here’s Joel Benenson, the Obama campaign’s pollster, explaining the keys to victory in the Times this morning:

Such conventional [economic] indicators failed to capture the mind-set of the American people who always had a broader view of the nation’s economic situation and what had happened to their lives. A national survey of 800 voters conducted by our firm — not for the Obama campaign — during the final weekend before Tuesday’s vote, confirmed that a clear majority of Americans viewed this election in the context of the scale of the economic crisis we faced and the deep recession that ensued.

Two key data points illustrate why Americans were always far more open to President Obama’s message and accomplishments than commentators assumed. By a three to one margin (74 percent to 23 percent), voters said that what the country faced since 2008 was an “extraordinary crisis more severe than we’ve seen in decades” as opposed to “a typical recession that the country has every several years.” At the same time, a clear majority, 57 percent, believed that the problems we faced after the crisis were “too severe for anyone to fix in a single term,” while only 4 in 10 voters believed another president would have been able to do more than Mr. Obama to get the economy moving in the past four years.

Bill Clinton famously pushed that message at the convention too, that this economic hurricane was actually Katrina/Sandy and therefore no one could reasonably be expected to have cleaned up all the debris yet. The voters bought it, and Romney’s only real countermove — hammering O on how housing policies championed by Democrats contributed to the fiscal crisis in 2008 — never really happened.

Anyway, this is all a way to try to explain why middle-class whites might have stayed home. As further validation of Trende’s theory, a quick comparison between the 2012 and 2008 exit polls shows that, among the six income classes used to measure voters, turnout as a percentage of the total electorate increased in five of them. The only one that dropped, by a whopping five percent (36% four years ago to 31% now): Voters who earn between $50,000 and $99,999 per year, i.e. the middle class. Obama and McCain basically split that vote, but Romney had a six-point advantage this time among those who showed up. Not enough did.

Needless to say, though, none of this should be taken as reassurance that the GOP’s majority is still out there and that they only need to concentrate on turning out working-class whites next time. If you assume that the exit poll’s 59/39 R/O split among whites who voted would have also held for whites who didn’t, then Romney lost a net 1.3 million votes from those who stayed home based on Trende’s projections. That’s an awful lot, but based on the current popular vote totals, it’s still not enough to erase Obama’s popular vote advantage. In fact, the GOP has won the popular vote in a presidential election just once since 1988, and arguably that one — Bush’s victory in 2004 — was sui generis, a product of unusual dynamics after 9/11 and the invasion of Iraq. You know how Democrats regularly outnumber Republicans in polls of adults and registered voters? Well, the lesson of this election is that Obama’s organization was good enough at turning people out to make election day results look like a poll of registered voters. That’s a scary prospect for the GOP, and turning out more rural whites in Ohio won’t be enough to solve it.

Update: Pollster Bill McInturff fires back hard at Trende’s theory by insisting that, while turnout may be down a little this year, the “missing” voters can be explained very simply: They just haven’t been counted yet. In 2008, fully 9.5 million votes weren’t counted until after election day. This year, it could be as high as 9.9 million based on projection. In fact, he says, turnout in swing states was up. It’s the Sandy states, not surprisingly, where the vote went down:

Two things, though. One: Trende’s piece attempted to account for ballots that hadn’t been counted yet. He estimated that seven million were still outstanding. Even if he lowballed the number, there are still a lot of “missing” voters. Two: The exit poll data about reduced turnout among middle-class voters is what it is, no matter how many ballots are still out. I’m not sure why Sandy would have affected the middle class disproportionately, which means something else was keeping people in that bracket from the polls.

Update: Trende e-mails with a third objection to McInturff. Turnout in Ohio, the swingiest state of all, evidently was not up this year:

Ohio vote is in, less provisional ballots. That’s why I used Ohio for my article. Absentees here were counted first this year.

200K provisional ballots were cast in 2008. If as many were cast this year, it would yield about 3.35M votes in OH (since about a fifth to a quarter are typically tossed).

In 2008, 3.62M were cast. So contra McInturff’s post, turnout was down in at least one swing state not on the Atlantic coast, and by about 8% at that. Of course, Ohio’s population has also grown since 2008, if only slightly.


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Keep kicking, you classless buffoon.

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 8:30 PM

Poor baby. You lost loser! You failed to win by attacking conservatives. Your moderate progressive (r) savior left you for dead! YOU MAN! left you for DEAD, lying on the side of the road bleeding! He did not deliver as promised. Blame everyone else, sycophants like you always do!

Romney was dead on day one after the primary apparently. Glad you all had a grand time attacking me for the last 9 months. Good bit it did for you!

Hope you lose your job or if you run a business it goes under. I do not like you. Me, I will be fine, if nothing else, I can go 100% disability and move to a third world nation and live better than you.

I told you so. I told you so. I told you so.

The only joy I get out of Obama winning though is your misery. Just yours. Not the other SEIU thugs around here. Just the OWS you!

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 8:38 PM

You are a demented POS, absolutely mental case, and everybody here knows it. Gumbey was a class act by comparison to you. But then knowing that you are mentally challenged (and probably the disability that you mentioned there has something to do with it) – I feel only pity for you.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 8:50 PM

tHIS thread has gotten lively.

Bishop on November 8, 2012 at 8:51 PM

Romney, Ryan and the GOP are talking nickels and dimes and the problem is in the trillions of dollars. Ryan’s plan which Romney wasn’t on board with wouldn’t even balance the budget until 2040. Thats 6 or 7 presidencies and Congresses. Its a fantasy not a plan.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 8:43 PM

But Ryan is a rock star, didn’t hear? His budget would cut an amazing $400 Billion per year out of that niggly $1.4 TRILLION deficit. Eleventy! Ryan was more than OK with a TRILLION DOLLAR deficit, obviously, as judged by his budget proposal.

Amazing, isn’t it, that he is considered the one in Congress who understands numbers. No wonder we’re so deep in chit these days. What’s a TRILLION DOLLARS deficit among friends? Piddly chump change…

riddick on November 8, 2012 at 8:52 PM

Let’s Review

Romney had been running for president the last 4 years. He took control of the RNC, cornered all the big donors, closed out competitors with huge monies advantage.

Then he coordinated with Karl Rove (american crossroads- $100
million) and Roves partner Ed Gillespie (Romneys chief advisor) to plot strategy. No other GOP candidate had a chance.

Now if your hispanic or a single woman how do you relate to romney. You don’t. Next question, who does the GOP have that can relate to the middle class, down on their luck person.

How about, a housewife, middle class, working family, husband a union worker for 25 years, rose to become her state’s govenor and then get nominated as VP candidate. Yes Palin.

To this day her debate again biden was the second most viewed in history. So how does is this possible asset treated.

She wasn’t invited to the GOP convention or on the campaign trail. You can make a case Obama was treated better than her.

Then you wonder why grassroots stay home.

Romney, if your honest, never could win. He had;

Romneycare, The rich image, bain capital, no core beliefs etc. hanging over his head. Unfortunately, The GOP esblishment know better than us and that’s who they gave us. They are real good at picking losers.

Romney is a nice man. But against Obama you need a fighter. The mullahs at the GOP gave us a wimp. Now notice they are already picking our 2016 candidate; Ryan, christie, rubio etc. They never learn and we get stuck with libs who are transforming out country.

Danielvito on November 8, 2012 at 8:53 PM

For those who ‘stayed home’. You’ve got NOTHING to say for the next 4 years.

Without a doubt. I still think anyone who chose not to vote…wasn’t really all that dissatisfied with the status quo. The implementation of Obamacare must have been fine with them. Adding trillions to the debt? Not a big concern. No second term agenda…guess that didn’t bother them either. And the list goes on…. Just what did they think that Romney would do that would make his presidency even more unbearable than what we have now?

lynncgb on November 8, 2012 at 8:53 PM

Whoa…..its getting nativist as heck up in here…..

libfreeordie on November 8, 2012 at 8:20 PM

Says the guy whose party only wins by Balkanizing the electorate and promoting racial and class-based hatred.

Aka “Mitt Romney: Not One Of Us.”

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 8:53 PM

How is the Republican party being disrespectful to blacks? Can you give some examples?

It’s just not blacks that feel that way, latino and Asian do too. That’s how they feel and the main reason the vote democrats…

Like I said, it’s easily fixable because it’s mostly how liberals are selling it to them. Ignoring it will just make it worse. It’s time to address it.

jules on November 8, 2012 at 8:53 PM

I would rather have someone who is at least attempting to cut the deficit, no matter how small, to someone who is doubling and tripling it.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 8:46 PM

So would I. Did you anyone in mind?

*Ryan voted for TARP and the auto bailouts and Romney supported both as well.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

Your not very up on politics are you? This is politics junior high level.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 8:31 PM

lol ok. My point was that other factors contribute to a loss, not simply ideology. I phrased that poorly.

Just to get this straight: with the others it’s external factors, but Romney it’s his ideology? Nothing else could have contributed to his loss but the GOP running a moderate candidate? Who else in the field would have been better?

Bee on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 7:59 PM

Wino first of all thank you for your service. I apologize for the delay in responding but I was cooking supper and my connection here is extremely slow.

Let me see if I can put this in real terms with as much melodrama as I can insert.

Hypothetical situation: You’re a young guy with a new family driving an old wore out Buick make it a skylark just for the hell of it. You depend on that car for work, grocery shopping etc. You blow the engine up (fiscal cliff, high unemployment, etc.) and now you need to replace it. You really want a Cadillac but the only thing available is a Pontiac or worse yet a Chrysler. What you gonna do? Let your family starve or buy what’s available and save up for that Cadillac.

Bottom line VOTE. You and 8 million others let the country down because you couldn’t drive to work in a cadillac!
Fred

jrsrigmvr on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

When the stock market crashes and unemployment shoots back up to 9%, I wonder if people will start begging for a do-over?

tkyang99 on November 8, 2012 at 8:48 PM

Not really. 50.3% of them will be begging for even more free stuff.

cool breeze on November 8, 2012 at 8:55 PM

For those who ‘stayed home’. You’ve got NOTHING to say for the next 4 years.

And for those who did vote, but whose vote WAS NOT COUNTED?

Ask Allen West, he’ll tell you a story. Stop pointing fingers where there is no reason to, cut election fraud and GOP can win elections. Not before eliminating fraud.

riddick on November 8, 2012 at 8:55 PM

Says the guy whose party only wins by Balkanizing the electorate and promoting racial and class-based hatred.

Aka “Mitt Romney: Not One Of Us.”

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 8:53 PM

Biden “He gonna put y’all back in chains”

tom daschle concerned on November 8, 2012 at 8:55 PM

The begging will be door to door, usually after nightfall and without a knock.

Bishop on November 8, 2012 at 8:56 PM

Bee on November 8, 2012 at 8:00 PM

Didn’t you know… that the trucons which infest the board are the only true keepers of the flame of pure conservatism. They’re here to instruct us on right-think and walking in lockstep with them.
They aren’t here to “discuss”. They’re here to demand.

Solaratov on November 8, 2012 at 8:56 PM

There’s so much about the GOP/conservative response to these election results that *screams* about the power of feeling like you’re in the majority, about the emotional wage of believing the nation is oriented to serve your interests. So many white Americans have never felt that way before. I think the next 4 years are going to be extremely interesting.

libfreeordie on November 8, 2012 at 8:16 PM

There’s no “feel” about it. Whites are in the majority. Whether or not that matters is another story.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 8:56 PM

terryannonline Do you always call your opponents racist or is it just people who point out that Rubio wouldn’t be the frontrunner if he wasn’t Latino. Please name me one accomplishment that he has to his name in the last two years.. There are none. However, I hear all this perky optimism that Rubio will save us!! And as a kicker, his main accomplishment is that he gives pretty speeches.. Um like Obama. He also gives a variation on the same speech. Seriously, I’ve heard him give his Senate victory speech a gazillion times. He gave that same speech at the convention.. But yes.. let’s affirmative action vote.

Also, just because I don’t buy Pollyanna junk, doesn’t mean I’m a liberal troll. Seriously.. in 2008, McCain was going to win. In 2012 Romney was going to win. And now two days after a devastating election all I hear about is how Rubio’s going to win in a landslide in 2016. No.. more likely lightweight will lose to Clinton. Which means that they’ll probanly never be a R President again. But let’s just pretend that we’re going to win.

Illinidiva on November 8, 2012 at 8:37 PM

First of all, we have no “frontrunners” right now. We are days away from 2012 election….we have LOTS of time till 2016. Second, I think it is demeaning to already call Rubio an affirmative action vote when no one is voting yet! Plus, Rubio is a good politician on his merits….not because of his skin color. If Rubio does a good job these next couple years would I like him to throw his hat in the ring? Sure! And it is not because he is Hispanic but it certainly doesn’t hurt. I think he has apt political instincts.

terryannonline on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

*Ryan voted for TARP and the auto bailouts and Romney supported both as well.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

Didn’t Romney support auto bankruptcy, not bail out, with bond holders being paid first?

Otherwise, yes.

riddick on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

You are a demented POS, absolutely mental case, and everybody here knows it. Gumbey was a class act by comparison to you. But then knowing that you are mentally challenged (and probably the disability that you mentioned there has something to do with it) – I feel only pity for you.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 8:50 PM

The dude is mentally ill or something. Imagine having to live with someone as hateful as him?

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

Like I said earlier. This sentiment is only going to grow as white people become increasingly familiar with what it feels like to believe that your country doesn’t have your best interests at heart. Perhaps you’ll understand, at last, why minorities “cling” to their racial identities so much. Its going to be interesting. I only pray that someone like Kungfoochimp doesn’t choose to express this resentment with violence.

libfreeordie on November 8, 2012 at 8:36 PM

You mean like the black populace does, disproportionately? You seem to think that the behavior of this particular ethnic group is understandable and that whites will be increasingly familiar with the resentment that causes it. So, you’ll nod understandingly if whites decide to adopt the ‘express this resentment’ in similar fashion? No, wait – you said you pray they don’t. Now why would that be, when you find it understandable on the one hand?

You’re a racist piece of crap, aren’t ya? /rhetorical question off

Midas on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

All the theories, all the blame, all the it’s your faults.

It’s not that complicated. More people voted in the 2008 election than this one. More people cared and felt engaged and needed in their contributions and voices.

People didn’t care as much this go round because Obama didn’t manage much at all, and because it didnt matter to them who won and who lost. Politics is gonna be the same bs game of theater it’s been forever, the last 4 years have shown that.

In 2008 people didn’t feel that way, they thought it might actually matter(Obama voters), or they were so scared of the hated Barack Obama that they believed the sky was gonna fall and the devil was gonna return to earth if Obama won(Republican voters).

This time, people lost the hope that Obama was gonna be able to be “that President” the JFK guy, he’s just another dude, but not the black eyed demon spawn you’d think from listening to conservatives. And republicans had to EARN the votes this time around of people who might be persuadable this time who bought into the theme last time.

They did a terrible job, a 30 year old platform, a boring candidate who had to bust his ass just to beat the really crazy candidates who would have lost worse, and a hurricane hit. (October surprise!!)

=Less votes than 2008.

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

astonerii is a bit out of whack but he is right….Romney was unelectable. And yes, We TOLD YOU SO.

tkyang99 on November 8, 2012 at 8:58 PM

People are going to have to wrap their minds around reaching out to and embracing the Hispanic community. Especially since after amnesty happens ( by executive order if nothing else) you will have 30-40 million more here legally and voting.

Rubio, Martinez or Sandavol will be on the ticket in 2016.

Rockshine on November 8, 2012 at 9:00 PM

terryannonline Do you always call your opponents racist or is it just people who point out that Rubio wouldn’t be the frontrunner if he wasn’t Latino. Please name me one accomplishment that he has to his name in the last two years.. There are none. However, I hear all this perky optimism that Rubio will save us!! And as a kicker, his main accomplishment is that he gives pretty speeches.. Um like Obama. He also gives a variation on the same speech. Seriously, I’ve heard him give his Senate victory speech a gazillion times. He gave that same speech at the convention.. But yes.. let’s affirmative action vote.

Also, just because I don’t buy Pollyanna junk, doesn’t mean I’m a liberal troll. Seriously.. in 2008, McCain was going to win. In 2012 Romney was going to win. And now two days after a devastating election all I hear about is how Rubio’s going to win in a landslide in 2016. No.. more likely lightweight will lose to Clinton. Which means that they’ll probanly never be a R President again. But let’s just pretend that we’re going to win.

Illinidiva on November 8, 2012 at 8:37 PM

Oh and I’m not a Barack Obama supporter but I always found it insulting when people try to call him a affirmative action politician too. I think Obama has gotten where he’s at on his merits.

terryannonline on November 8, 2012 at 9:01 PM

It’s all my fault.

I should have kicked more asses.

hillbillyjim on November 8, 2012 at 9:01 PM

I can go 100% disability
astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 8:38 PM

That is an interesting comment. As someone who is actually on permanent disability, I think our local disability office would be very interested in the way that you phrased that. I just didn’t decide to go on disability, my physical limitations decided that for me.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:01 PM

lol ok. My point was that other factors contribute to a loss, not simply ideology. I phrased that poorly.

Just to get this straight: with the others it’s external factors, but Romney it’s his ideology? Nothing else could have contributed to his loss but the GOP running a moderate candidate? Who else in the field would have been better?

Bee on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

I can go with that.

There were many things going on.

But Romney was not the best choice, though Newt may not have been able to win either I think he would have buttressed other Republican congressmen much better than Romney did.

Romney was all about talking about the end of his actions. He never filled in the blanks on how to get there. It could have made some difference if he told the American people he needed congress as well. Instead, he said he would work with Democrats. Of course, if there are 10 million more votes out there, and 6 million of them are for Romney, then I kind of sort of will have to eat many of the words here in the last three days.

Bleh, I guess I will stand down for a week and wait for more details before going back to my told you so routine!!!

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:03 PM

So would I. Did you anyone in mind?

*Ryan voted for TARP and the auto bailouts and Romney supported both as well.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

You got your wish, sharrukin. You, ddrintn and all the other purity voters got the 4 more years of Obama that you’ve been hankering for.

Better get started on nominating a REAL* conservative for 2016, or else you just doomed us to four more years of economic depression for no good reason.

*(Definition of a real conservative: Someone who wins national elections and perfectly mirrors my ideology. Also see: Yeti, Bigfoot, Chupacabra)

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:03 PM

I believe Christie wanted Romney to lose. Had Romney been successful, Paul Ryan would have been “on deck” after a Romney Presidency.

If the “Fatman” wins re-election, watch him start building a Presidential campaign. Christie is a snake.

bw222 on November 8, 2012 at 7:44 PM

WBAP says the NJ Donut is already under GOP 2016 consideration.

That’s it….GOP is crazy.

I think Texas needs to secede…and we can secure the border ourselves and it won’t be with federal wussifyin’

We’ll let productive Latino immigrants stay and if here illegally they pay a punitive tax for those years called the I cheated and snuck into Texas tax, Do community service for the state on weekends with their kids and pay a % of renumeration for social services received when illegal or forfeit some property, renounce Mexico and swear an oath…Purge the illegal Bordertowns…yada yada yada. That’s Texas immigration reform.

We were a nation before we joined the Union but ya’ll outside of us are gettin dangerously stupid with this GOP leadership and these Unions.

I feel bad about it but I’d rather swim & even if Texas could help the nation beyond our 25% GDP contribution…Ya’ll were busy bashin’ us, our record, and our governor during the primaries…We got our own Grid and we’ll do fine…we’ll keep growin’ but we’ll keep our God, Guns & Freedom.

Ya’ll want to starve that Federal beast…Let Texas secede peacefully and the Federales will go down quick cause Hollywood won’t pay to save their own state let alone the nation.

GOP doesn’t want conservatives and frankly I don’t want to wait for a Palinessiah so many of ya’ll think will fix things…We’ve already got Gov. Perry and Atty. General Abbott and they’ve been at this fight longer.

By 2014 Come and Take It (Gonzalez,1835)

workingclass artist on November 8, 2012 at 9:04 PM

That is an interesting comment. As someone who is actually on permanent disability, I think our local disability office would be very interested in the way that you phrased that. I just didn’t decide to go on disability, my physical limitations decided that for me.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:01 PM

It is a fact that I can do it. The guys down at the VA hospital said so. I refuse to do so. I would rather work and earn my way through life. But, if the economy becomes so bad that I cannot do so, then I am entitled to the disability, just ask JPeterman who is entitled to my daughter’s payments for social security.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:04 PM

*Ryan voted for TARP and the auto bailouts and Romney supported both as well.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

Didn’t Romney support auto bankruptcy, not bail out, with bond holders being paid first?

Otherwise, yes.

riddick on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

“[Romney's] position on the bailout was exactly what President Obama followed. I know it infuriates them to hear that,” Fehrnstrom said.

“ My own view, by the way, was that the auto companies needed to go through bankruptcy before government help. And frankly, that’s finally what the president did. He finally took them through bankruptcy. That was the right course I argued for from the very beginning. It was the UAW and the president that delayed the idea of bankruptcy. I pushed the idea of a managed bankruptcy and finally when that was done, and help was given, the companies got back on their feet. So I’ll take a lot of credit for the fact that this industry’s come back.”

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michelinemaynard/2012/05/08/mitt-romney-takes-credit-for-the-auto-bailout-say-what/

The difference between Romney and Obama on this is hard to see here.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 9:04 PM

I have a different theory …

Pelt potential voters with ads 24/7 and then they will either crawl under a rock or merely revert to voting strictly by the party which they were registered to.

J_Crater on November 8, 2012 at 9:05 PM

*Ryan voted for TARP and the auto bailouts and Romney supported both as well.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 8:54 PM

Romney supported the auto bailout???? Seriously, on what planet??? Wasn’t he villified by the left for the piece that he penned for WSJ in which he was arguing for an orderly chapter 11 bankruptcy for GM??

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:05 PM

So if there are 9 million votes still to be accounted for, and the gap between O and Mitt is pretty small- what would happen if, theoretically, those votes pushed Mitt over the top and swung the electoral college his way?

Jay Mac on November 8, 2012 at 9:05 PM

I think Obama has gotten where he’s at on his merits.

terryannonline on November 8, 2012 at 9:01 PM

The definition of “merits” just got about 400 miles wide.

Bishop on November 8, 2012 at 9:06 PM

He didn’t run positive ads early, while Obama was busy tearing him down every day with attack ads. He refused to run biographical ads until the very end showing off what a warm, kindhearted guy he is. He never went after Obama systematically on the basic point that preserving the liberal dream of a ballooning welfare state will require taxes on the middle class, not just “the one percent.”

In other words, he ran a crappy campaign. The GOP just lost for us the Mother Of All Gimmees.

And they want to lecture us about what we gotta do next?

sartana on November 8, 2012 at 9:06 PM

Like I said earlier. This sentiment is only going to grow as white people become increasingly familiar with what it feels like to believe that your country doesn’t have your best interests at heart. Perhaps you’ll understand, at last, why minorities “cling” to their racial identities so much. Its going to be interesting. I only pray that someone like Kungfoochimp doesn’t choose to express this resentment with violence.

libfreeordie on November 8, 2012 at 8:36 PM

So if whites become a minority in this country, do we get free reign to assault people at State Fairs and have the bien pensants like you be media apologists for us? Just wondering.

Hell, I’m already a bigger minority than you, lib. As a Jew, if I feel that the country doesn’t have my “best interests” in mind, can I start getting a little “street justice” in exchange for being marginalized?

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:07 PM

Is this what Hot Air is going to be from now on? A bunch of people pointing fingers and blaming everyone but the real culprits? Admit it. No one could have convinced Obama supporters to leave him. And many so-called Repubs and even Conservatives don’t want to give up their entitlements…whether it’s TANF or Social Security or SSI. When push comes to shove they will vote for whoever gives them their comfort.
Does anyone really think those so-called Repubs chose not to vote at all? I don’t. I think they voted for Obama. It was the Dems who stayed home. The ones for whom Obama wasn’t Liberal enough, hard to believe I know. And the ones who just didn’t get motivated enough to vote this time, the ‘hey I’m busy watching TV pass me the chips and go the store for more with my Access card’ crowd.
And you know what else? People lie to pollsters. Who wanted to admit they voted for Obama if they were a registered Repub? Who wanted to admit they voted because they were afraid because Romney was a Mormon…yeah it happened. Who wanted to admit they are really selfish little people who wnat their entitlements and are really no better than the Libs they hear other Repubs make fun of?
We lost because we can’t have a candidate that appeals to the 84% of Phillie types. For now we’re stuck with 70 years of socialism and no one candidate will change that. I suggest working at the state and local level and hope the IRS screws up Obamacare and gets so over-loaded they cry. But trying to blame the candidates is a waste of time.
Yeah, it is the voters, stupid.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:07 PM

I wish I could find one my old posts from 8 months ago…when I was warning people that we were about nominate a guy who can barely beat RICK frickin SANTORUM…a guy who only won the primaries because he spent millions on negative attack ads…

One debate doesn’t make up for the fact that the rest of his campaign was a disaster. And let’s face it, anyone here on HotAir probably could have wiped Obama on that first debate.

tkyang99 on November 8, 2012 at 9:08 PM

You got your wish, sharrukin. You, ddrintn and all the other purity voters got the 4 more years of Obama that you’ve been hankering for.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:03 PM

No, YOU DID. You got Romney and he failed as his sort always fail because failure is what they are good at. He’s lost just about every political race he was ever in and he lost this one as well.

You got what you wanted and as usual you screwed it up…AGAIN.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 9:09 PM

I think Obama has gotten where he’s at on his merits.

terryannonline on November 8, 2012 at 9:01 PM

The definition of “merits” just got about 400 miles wide.

Bishop on November 8, 2012 at 9:06 PM

I think she meant “while smoking Merit cigarettes.” I think they were either Kools or Newports. You know, ’cause he’s black (when it serves him to be black).

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM

if the economy becomes so bad that I cannot do so, then I am entitled to the disability
astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:04 PM

No, you are not “entitled”. You have to have some type of physical change to go on disability. You just can’t wake up one day and decide that you are disabled. Take it from someone who has been through the process. I’ve had a lot of dealings with the VA, and I wouldn’t trust anything they say.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM

They freed them from slavery and then gave them same voting rights as everyone else. While Democrats killed, hanged and torched them during KKK rallies.What Republicans did is called “disrespect”, after all, who wants to be free and not hanged by a noose?
Too bad so many blacks know nothing about history and still insist that MLK was a D. Clueless is as clueless does. Only when they were receiving free stuff from the government in the 1970s did blacks, all of a sudden, found they are “democrats”.
History. Right in front of their faces. Unable to face it.
riddick on November 8, 2012 at 8:48 PM

It’s really mind boggling to have some one make the schpeel you just do and end it with a frustration that people don’t know their history. You can talk about D’s and R’s in the context you just do all you want, but there was a very significant, real, documented, and undeniable realignment that occurred from the 40′s through its final big settle in the 60′s. Before this time? Yeah CONSERVATIVES made up the DEMOCRATIC PARTY which absolutely OWNED the south, segragation, slavery, the whole ball of wax brother.

As fdr began to alter the democratic party and JFK and Johnson finished it off, CONSERVATIVES began moving to the REPUBLICAN PARTY with Barry Goldwater, anti-communist, and social conservative policies that took hold during the same span of time.

It’s documented. It’s fact. It’s real.

So when you go on about all the terrible things the democratic party did at the turn of last century and 50 years before, remember, those WERE the conservatives. The democrats WERE the south. The CONFEDERACY were democrats. They were also the “conservative party”, they were YOUR predecessors.

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:04 PM

Or to put it another way, the VA doctors would prescribe aspirin for a brain tumor.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:12 PM

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:07 PM

The voice of reason on this thread. 101% agree with you.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:12 PM

I think I know where the McCain voters went.

1. Mormon haters stayed home

2. Republicans now on welfare/unemployment who don’t want to lose it stayed home

3. Older Republicans went to Heaven

4. Some Republicans went to the polls, but weren’t allowed to vote because they left their IDs home (only the white ones).

DeathtotheSwiss on November 8, 2012 at 9:13 PM

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM

Oh dear, propagating the dixiecrat lie.

B-S I thought you were honest and sincere, but now I know you are just a horrible godless reprobate poisoning the well.

tom daschle concerned on November 8, 2012 at 9:15 PM

So if there are 9 million votes still to be accounted for, and the gap between O and Mitt is pretty small- what would happen if, theoretically, those votes pushed Mitt over the top and swung the electoral college his way?

Jay Mac on November 8, 2012 at 9:05 PM

Romney would be elected President. It’s the certified vote count that matters, not what was reported on election night. Just look at Florida in 2000.

Rocks on November 8, 2012 at 9:15 PM

People are going to have to wrap their minds around reaching out to and embracing the Hispanic community. Especially since after amnesty happens ( by executive order if nothing else) you will have 30-40 million more here legally and voting.

Rockshine on November 8, 2012 at 9:00 PM

If amnesty results in 30-40 million more Hispanic voters, the GOP will never win another national election again.

Sure, there are conservative Hispanics. But there are a lot more liberal hispanics, as has been documented in numerous threads over the last two days. Hispanics are still going to vote 70-30 against Republicans, just as they did in 2008 and 2012, even if Marco Rubio personally delivers their amnesty to them on an engraved silver platter. Identity politics has never worked for the GOP.

cool breeze on November 8, 2012 at 9:15 PM

You got what you wanted and as usual you screwed it up…AGAIN.

sharrukin on November 8, 2012 at 9:09 PM

Yes, we should have run an Allen West/Rick Santorum ticket. We’d have won 400 electorals!

This is why we’re going to keep losing. We get trounced, and then the TRUCON wing tells us that we lost because of our darn RINO nominee. Again, definition of a RINO: someone who loses elections.

When squishy Dubya was winning elections, no one cared that he was a “RINO.” Because winners automatically get a pass from the TRUCON wing, until they leave office, and then they again become horrible RINOs.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:16 PM

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:07 PM

Where to begin?

The only government checks I’ve ever gotten are paychecks while I was in the military and tax refunds. I don’t count either of those as handouts. Even when I qualified for unemployment, I didn’t take it because I don’t believe in receiving charity. I guess I was brought up wrong.

I despise the entitlement attitude that has become the US electorate.

HOWEVER, putting forth an “entitlements for my side” guy against their “entitlements for my side” guy won’t get my vote ever again. This entire GOP decline started the minute Geo HW Bush broke his “no new taxes” pledge. Although I’ll concede that it may have been when Reagan trusted the democrat Congress for $1 in tax increases today for $2 in tax increases later.

I’m still waiting for that promise to be kept.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:16 PM

think I know where the McCain voters went.

1. Mormon haters stayed home

2. Republicans now on welfare/unemployment who don’t want to lose it stayed home

3. Older Republicans went to Heaven

4. Some Republicans went to the polls, but weren’t allowed to vote because they left their IDs home (only the white ones).

DeathtotheSwiss on November 8, 2012 at 9:13 PM

I don’t think they stayed home, except for the dead ones. I think they voted for Obama.(Maybe even the dead ones too.) I think some Obama supporters from 2008 stayed home.
As for 4, I do think there was some fruad, if the Dems are involved there always is.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:17 PM

It’s just not blacks that feel that way, latino and Asian do too. That’s how they feel and the main reason the vote democrats…

Like I said, it’s easily fixable because it’s mostly how liberals are selling it to them. Ignoring it will just make it worse. It’s time to address it.

You still haven’t given any concrete examples. If all it is just a vague feeling that “Republicans are racist”, then it’s a result of brainwashing by the left and the media and they need to snap out of it. There’s nothing much we can do for them.

tkyang99 on November 8, 2012 at 9:18 PM

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:16 PM

So, how’s your moderate-electable candidate plan working out for you? Keep doin’ what you’re doin’ and you’ll keep gettin’ what you’re gettin’.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:19 PM

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:16 PM

Good for you. But that still doesn’t change my point. I firmly believe many so-called and even registered Repubs voted for Obama this time. Not because Romney was a RINO or too squishy or whatever, but because they were afraid he’d take away what they have.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:20 PM

Or to put it another way, the VA doctors would prescribe aspirin for a brain tumor.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:12 PM

Your VA disabled too?

Sorry about the evil thoughts I had five minutes ago.

They are hard to work with.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:21 PM

Is this what Hot Air is going to be from now on? A bunch of people pointing fingers and blaming everyone but the real culprits?

This is it. Four more years of finger pointing and arguing who’s the bestest pure conservative out there.

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 9:22 PM

We lost because we can’t have a candidate that appeals to the 84% of Phillie types. For now we’re stuck with 70 years of socialism and no one candidate will change that. I suggest working at the state and local level and hope the IRS screws up Obamacare and gets so over-loaded they cry. But trying to blame the candidates is a waste of time.

Yeah, it is the voters, stupid.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:07 PM

And may I ad something, it is actually human nature, look around at other countries and you will see how sadly universal this is. folks want free stuff, and are happy to take it, period and they will betray the most accomplished and able of leaders and go with the scumbag who promises (and give them) free stuff. and nothing will change that. This is humanity for you. But you know what, in the end it’s a self defeating exercise, they are just digging a deeper hole for themselves. Actually and unfortunately for all of us.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:22 PM

Says the guy whose party only wins by Balkanizing the electorate and promoting racial and class-based hatred.
Aka “Mitt Romney: Not One Of Us.”
Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 8:53 PM

You’ve got to be kidding me! This from the party that won in 2010 solely and completely on framing the other guy as a un-American foreign subversive who was out to intentionally dismantle America so that he could rebuild it after it had been destroyed, starting before the guy was even president? Calling half the country stupid mooching communists for voting for him?

How do you look at yourself with a straight face and accuse HIM of “balkanizing” American politics and act victimized that he played your game better than you this time around, and people ended up believing HIM in large enough numbers to win. It’s you, the republicans who “Balkanized” America and threw a 4 year temper tantrum demanding that you be able to control everything that goes through our government or else you would bring it to a grinding halt even though you had lost and remained in a minority. The whole republican mindset is “were the REAL Americans, this our country, so we win even when we lose, or else” and THAT one? Yeah he’s an unamerican foreigner who is out to destroy this nation literally, “it’s purposeful”.

You’re so full of it, that I almost can’t take it anymore with conservatives and your constant victim cards while you lash out, demonize, and attempt to destroy and defame anyone, even republicans, if they don’t tow the line.

You’re like the bully who runs to the principles office, tells on the skinny kind who punched him back at lunch, and demands punishment for him and that his mother also be called, even though you’d been harassing, attempting to embarrass, trip up, and demean to the rest of the class for the whole semester.

You’re disingenuous, fake, and apparently incapable of being honest with yourself if you can say things like that with a straight face. That or you were f*cking asleep.

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 9:22 PM

The voice of reason on this thread. 101% agree with you.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:12 PM

Thanks. It’s the 800 pound gorilla in the room. No one wants to admit Repubs may have voted for Obama. Or that Repubs can be just like the Liberals when it comes to entitlements or even Social Security and Medicare. We scare them. I heard it over and over. It’s been too many years and I don’t think we can change it. They have to experience the end results.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:23 PM

So, how’s your moderate-electable candidate plan working out for you? Keep doin’ what you’re doin’ and you’ll keep gettin’ what you’re gettin’.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:19 PM

How did the “Teanami” work out for us?

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:24 PM

GOP considering the NJ Donut after he slobbered over Obama is nuts and shows how truly clueless they are.

Texas needs to secede…It’ll starve that federal beast of our 25% GDP and we can survive..When ya’ll figure out how to win back the US we’ll be your ally & trading partner but this GOP Rhino central planning is a disaster and can’t stop the Free Stuff fascism that’s coming.

We’ll make the illegals in Texas pay a steep “I cheated and snuck into Texas to feeload” Tax, do community service with their kids, pay a punitive renumeration for past social services received,renounce Mexico and swear loyalty to Texas and they can stay or they are deported and their property seized, and the whole family goes with them.

We’ll secure our own border our own way.

We want to keep our God, Guns and Freedom.

workingclass artist on November 8, 2012 at 9:24 PM

No one could have convinced Obama supporters to leave him.

Obama earned around ten million votes less this year than he got in 2008. So your premise couldn’t be more wrong. Obama actually convinced many people who voted for him in ’08 to not vote for him this time.

If the numbers are to be believed, then it’s Romney who failed to bring out more Republicans to the polls. Romeny got three million less than McCain- if indeed massive fraud did not take place.

This is an epic fail for Romney and the GOP who anointed him as the most electable.

sartana on November 8, 2012 at 9:25 PM

The dude is mentally ill or something. Imagine having to live with someone as hateful as him?

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

Actually, I can’t imagine and I’m grateful that I don’t have to…

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:26 PM

But you know what, in the end it’s a self defeating exercise, they are just digging a deeper hole for themselves. Actually and unfortunately for all of us.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:22 PM

True. There is one other thing that has always seemed ironic to me. Pro-abortion on demand people…they are killing off their future supporters. Like the entitlements demanders they too will come to the end.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

I firmly believe many so-called and even registered Repubs voted for Obama this time. Not because Romney was a RINO or too squishy or whatever, but because they were afraid he’d take away what they have.

And you have ample evidence to back that up, I’m sure. I’ll wait while you post some URL’s.

While you’re doing the research, I’ll continute to (anecdotally) state why I stayed home. You know, the 50 year old middle class white guy they’re all wondering about. Yeah. I’m that guy, and I know why I didn’t bother to vote. Give me something to vote FOR, and I’ll man the phones, walk the blocks, and talk to my neighbors, as well as vote. Give me another Dem-lite, and I’ll sit home again.

Also, while you’re doing the research for those URLs to back up your statement, you might want to look up the psychological meaning of the word “projection.”

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

Yeah, it is the voters, stupid.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:07 PM

interesting… I like the cut of your jib… Lol, so JPeterman and Lanceman are actually Obama voters. LOL, they certainly do not want to give up their freebies.

Sorry JPeterman, she seems to have found you out.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

Yes, we should have run an Allen West/Rick Santorum ticket. We’d have won 400 electorals!

This is why we’re going to keep losing. We get trounced, and then the TRUCON wing tells us that we lost because of our darn RINO nominee. Again, definition of a RINO: someone who loses elections.

When squishy Dubya was winning elections, no one cared that he was a “RINO.” Because winners automatically get a pass from the TRUCON wing, until they leave office, and then they again become horrible RINOs.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:16 PM

This “purity” garbage is a strawman. I don’t expect purity; I expect a candidate who’s a little more identifiable as a conservative in something more than hastily-learned election year rhetoric. Dubya was such a one. Not perfect, but close enough. The last conservative to get trounced in a national election was Goldwater. In 1964. Since then a progression of allegedly electable moderates bit the dust: Dole, McCain and now Romney.

YOU GOT WHAT YOU WANTED. You got that ultra-electable guy who was going to bring in all those precious indies. And he did. And HE LOST to the most beatable Dem moonbat hopeless joke excuse of a president EVAH.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

They are hard to work with.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:21 PM

I think we finally found something we can agree on.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:29 PM

Been here since day 1, but post only occasionally. So, I’ll repeat what I said 4 years ago. Far left universities produce journalism, poli sci (et al) grads who control the major media. And make no mistake, the major media is the primary source of information to millions of low information viewers.
I have spoken to a number of folks who voted Obama or didn’t vote because of faulty/biased information – or lack of pertinent information.
The strategy has to be to either effectively counter or negate both situations or we could clone Reagan and lose an election. Economic pressure has to be placed on universities, media, and entertainment. It is the only way they will change.

maninthemiddle on November 8, 2012 at 9:30 PM

^ And, for the record, I voted for Romney. Just as I voted for Dole, just as I voted for McCain.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:31 PM

The dude is mentally ill or something. Imagine having to live with someone as hateful as him?

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 8:57 PM

My Wife and daughter are quite grateful to live with someone like me. A person who provides not just for himself, but her family, some of my family who I do not even socialize with, some friends when they are in need, and still able to balance the budget even when I lose my job and provide luxuries when we like, such as month long vacations out of the country and digital toys to play with. About her only complaint seems to be that when I have a migraine I grin and bare it and do not inform her until it gets so bad that I cannot go to work. She feels bad because she knows she was doing things that aggravated the pain for me for that duration.

Imagine living with someone like you who thinks other people OWE THEM MONEY instead of manning up and earning it himself. Now that would be depressing.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:33 PM

So, how’s your moderate-electable candidate plan working out for you? Keep doin’ what you’re doin’ and you’ll keep gettin’ what you’re gettin’.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:19 PM

How did the “Teanami” work out for us?

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:24 PM

In 2010, it worked magnificently. But then the squish wing couldn’t take the threat and spent the next two years pissing on the group that had brought their party BACK to power in the first place.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:34 PM

But you know what, in the end it’s a self defeating exercise, they are just digging a deeper hole for themselves. Actually and unfortunately for all of us.

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:22 PM

True. There is one other thing that has always seemed ironic to me. Pro-abortion on demand people…they are killing off their future supporters. Like the entitlements demanders they too will come to the end.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

Yep, case in point: Europe; look at their birth rates, among the lowest in the world, their population decline is eir doom and their future is bleak as a result. At least we have a healthy natality rate (still) and ironically enough that’s due to the minorities….

jimver on November 8, 2012 at 9:35 PM

^ And, for the record, I voted for Romney. Just as I voted for Dole, just as I voted for McCain.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:31 PM

Let me know when you get to number 5. Romney WOULD have been my sixth “hold my nose” vote.

we could clone Reagan and lose an election.

maninthemiddle on November 8, 2012 at 9:30 PM

1984 525 electoral votes for Reagan. 13 for Mondale.

Perhaps you might want to rethink that projection.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:35 PM

interesting… I like the cut of your jib… Lol, so JPeterman and Lanceman are actually Obama voters. LOL, they certainly do not want to give up their freebies.

Sorry JPeterman, she seems to have found you out.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

I came to this country with only the shirt on my back, a change of clothes and a few books in my backpack in 1997 and never took one dime from this Government. Good luck in your quest for that VA disability, you should get it easily for being mentally unstable with your hatred of your fellow citizens.

Something seriously wrong with you dude.

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 9:35 PM

I talked to a stay-at-homer today. I was angry with him, but he didn’t seem moved. He simply said to me:

“I think this country needs to crater sooner rather than later. I think Republicans are too scared to touch the things that need to be fixed, because they want the media to like them. I know Obama is gonna make things worse. It’s inevitable, so let’s get on with it.”

Most people who don’t follow this stuff closely really feel like they are getting nothing from either party. They want to see a major correction happen. The sentiment is that Republicans can probably stave it off much longer, but ultimately will spend their way to the end as well.

BTW, the last 48 hours have sucked worse than I thought it would.

goflyers on November 8, 2012 at 9:36 PM

You’ve got to be kidding me! This from the party that won in 2010 solely and completely on framing the other guy as a un-American foreign subversive who was out to intentionally dismantle America so that he could rebuild it after it had been destroyed, starting before the guy was even president? Calling half the country stupid mooching communists for voting for him?

Really? What national ads called him a “foreign subversive”? Show me a nationally run TV ad accusing Obama of being a Moooslim terrorist, or a Kenyan, or a Maoist. You can’t. Because the actual campaign line was always “Gosh, that Obama is an awful nice guy, but he’s in over his head.” Meanwhile, you guys call Romney, in official campaign spots, in sound bites from actual members of the Obama team, a cultist, a murderer (he gave that woman cancer!!!), an animal abuser, a misogynist (binders of wimmenzez!!), a liar, and a tax cheat.

The official GOP campaign never touched Michelle Obama, whereas the official Democratic campaign made sure to stress that Ann Romney was a horrid woman who never worked a day in her life and couldn’t possibly relate to the people because she has…a HORSE! Oh noez!

How do you look at yourself with a straight face and accuse HIM of “balkanizing” American politics and act victimized that he played your game better than you this time around, and people ended up believing HIM in large enough numbers to win. It’s you, the republicans who “Balkanized” America and threw a 4 year temper tantrum demanding that you be able to control everything that goes through our government or else you would bring it to a grinding halt even though you had lost and remained in a minority. The whole republican mindset is “were the REAL Americans, this our country, so we win even when we lose, or else” and THAT one? Yeah he’s an unamerican foreigner who is out to destroy this nation literally, “it’s purposeful”.

What game does the GOP play? That’s the point: we don’t play hardball. Mitt Romney ran a respectful, issues-based campaign. Obama went full-on negative, and he conservatively allocated about 5 ads trying to paint Romney as “not one of us” for every ad that touted his own accomplishments.

You’re so full of it, that I almost can’t take it anymore with conservatives and your constant victim cards while you lash out, demonize, and attempt to destroy and defame anyone, even republicans, if they don’t tow the line.

Yeah, because the Democrat apparatus never tries to destroy people who don’t toe the party line (it’s toe, btw, not tow, you ****ing illiterate). Oh, wait, they actually destroy all of their opponents, don’t they? Maybe you should ask Jack Ryan, Clarence Thomas, and Herman Cain about that.

You’re like the bully who runs to the principles office, tells on the skinny kind who punched him back at lunch, and demands punishment for him and that his mother also be called, even though you’d been harassing, attempting to embarrass, trip up, and demean to the rest of the class for the whole semester.

Sounds like you were bullied a lot in school, Boomer. You should go have a nice cry with Dan Savage.

You’re disingenuous, fake, and apparently incapable of being honest with yourself if you can say things like that with a straight face. That or you were f*cking asleep.

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 9:22 PM

If you can’t deal with the fact that your party can only win by stirring up class hatred, that’s not my problem. Your entire ****ing campaign is breaking down your base into their constituent minority groups (single women, blakcs, Hispanics) and then pandering to them and accusing the other candidate of hating that group. You only win by fear-mongering. Romney will “put [blacks] back in chains.” He’ll take away women’s “reproductive rights” (whatever the **** that even means). He wants Hispanics to be arrested on sight just for looking “illegal.” And if you’re poor? Well, Mitt Romney wants you to die. He wants to lay you off (“I like firing people”), and he wants you to drop dead.

That’s the official line from the Obama campaign. It’s not from talk radio hosts. It’s not from far-left bloggers. It’s right from the horse’s ****ing mouth. And if you can’t deal with it and you need to project all of those sins on the GOP, then maybe you should find a new party, because you’re currently affiliated with a group of liars, snakes and thieves.

Have fun with it, bro. But I’m not going to let you get away with ridiculous lies about which party actually tries to paint their opposition as being the “Other.”

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:37 PM

I think we finally found something we can agree on.

bandutski on November 8, 2012 at 9:29 PM

The thing that pisses me off most is they think I should show up every time I get a migraine. As if they can do anything about it other than aggravate me by leaving me sitting with nothing to take my mind off the pain…

http://www.indystar.com/videonetwork000040009095/1926646591001/Video-Games-More-Effective-Than-Morphine-Say-Doctors

I do not believe it, I play games, it helps get my mind off the pain, but that pain is still there. It is one reason I work. When i stay home, and i go to the bedroom and turn the lights down and cover my ears, the pain seems far more harsh. But going to the VA is much like that isolation, but with all the aggravations such as noise and moving bright lights. At work, I can dim my cube lights, the people are mostly quiet, and when I am focused on my work, the pain becomes secondary.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:37 PM

This is an epic fail for Romney and the GOP who anointed him as the most electable.

sartana on November 8, 2012 at 9:25 PM

Nope. It doesn’t matter how many fewer votes Obama got. The turn-out was lower across the board. All that matters is he got more votes than Romney. As I said, there were probably all kinds of Dems who didn’t bother to vote. But Obama may have gotten those Repub votes in 2008 too. The people who voted for Obama this time were the truly dedicated ones. We just can’t admit that there are Repub voters who would do that. But come on, these people voted for Arlen Specter for years.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:37 PM

I think I know where the McCain voters went.

1. Mormon haters stayed home

2. Republicans now on welfare/unemployment who don’t want to lose it stayed home

3. Older Republicans went to Heaven

4. Some Republicans went to the polls, but weren’t allowed to vote because they left their IDs home (only the white ones).

DeathtotheSwiss on November 8, 2012 at 9:13 PM

.
I vote in a rural/suburban precinct. When it came my to sign-in, I said: “I don’t have any ID. But it’s okay, because I’m an illegal alien.”

They got a chuckle out of that.

listens2glenn on November 8, 2012 at 9:37 PM

we could clone Reagan and lose an election.

maninthemiddle on November 8, 2012 at 9:30 PM

You could clone Reagan and half of the worthless GOP would be sitting back b1tching and moaning about what a polarizing, idiotic, Neanderthalish, far-right unelectable loon he is and how we should really run that much groovier newly-cloned Gerald Ford since he can pick up more indies.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:38 PM

Oh dear, propagating the dixiecrat lie.
B-S I thought you were honest and sincere, but now I know you are just a horrible godless reprobate poisoning the well.
tom daschle concerned on November 8, 2012 at 9:15 PM

Really? The “Dixiecrat lie”?

What, you saying the predeccesors of modern day conservatives used to live in the north, but all just moved to the south and ran those dirty democrat rascists back up north as the republican party took hold in the south? The south WAS the democrat party. Fact brother. FACT. The Confedracy, was the democrat party. The SOUTH which has ALWAYS been the “conservative” region of the country, switched parties AFTER fighting against every one of those great republican achievements you so arrogantly and callously try to take credit for when it was southern conservatives(again, take notes, democrats at the time)who fought against them every step of the way, screaming epithets and red hot angry in photos of desegregation and civil rights protests. Forming the KKK IN THE SOUTH were none “conservatives” had been run out of office after the failure of reconstruction.

The “Dixiecrat lie”. How hollow and lacking in intellectual honesty are you?

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 9:39 PM

Might I suggest that all commenter’s take a day off to cool down. Just a thought. As to the campaign, I wonder how long it will take Obama to realize that he has won a Pyrrhic victory. Given what’s coming, call him a “lame duck” is being very kind.

flackcatcher on November 8, 2012 at 9:39 PM

1984 525 electoral votes for Reagan. 13 for Mondale.

Perhaps you might want to rethink that projection.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:35 PM

Yes, that’s how you win elections, by pretending the electorate hasn’t changed in 28 years.

Reagan won both California and New York. Please, please, please tell me what kind of candidate and platform you’d like the GOP to run in an attempt to win those two states. Or, you know, you could just admit the game has changed in the last quarter-century.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:40 PM

I came to this country with only the shirt on my back, a change of clothes and a few books in my backpack in 1997 and never took one dime from this Government. Good luck in your quest for that VA disability, you should get it easily for being mentally unstable with your hatred of your fellow citizens.

Something seriously wrong with you dude.

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 9:35 PM

I know your back story JPeterman, you never miss an opportunity to tell us about it. It would be admirable if you were not a social security loving sponge. You kept arguing that you are OWED social security payments. You argued with me on this subject quite a bit. You are wedded to the entitlement state. You are owed money from other people you have never provided anything for in any way whatsoever. That is your philosophy. Whether you took anything up to this point in time or not, your soul says you are owed. Mine says, if I have any other way, I will refuse to.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:41 PM

There’s so much about the GOP/conservative response to these election results that *screams* about the power of feeling like you’re in the majority, about the emotional wage of believing the nation is oriented to serve your interests. So many white Americans have never felt that way before. I think the next 4 years are going to be extremely interesting.

libfreeordie on November 8, 2012 at 8:16 PM

Well, white people are still the overwhelming majority in this country. Sorry, but that’s a fact. I’m sorry, but it gives me so sense of power or emotion or neurosis. I leave all of that psychobabble crap to you minorities, oops!, “oppressed peoples.” Oppressed by whom and how and why? I do not know, but then I pretty much think that it is mostly a figment of your grievance-mongering imagination. Nevertheless, I don’t spend one nanosecond of the day worrying about demographics other than for the fact that the US, like my homeland and the rest of the EU, is committing suicide by demographics.

The next 4 years will not be anymore interesting than the last. Are you going to repeal the 13th Amendment and force me to work? I doubt it since, as a black man, I don’t think that you want to spearhead a movement to make slavery de rigeur again. Are you going to repeal the 16th Amendment that allows for only the taxation of realised income following a liquidity event legal and seek a new amendment that would allow the government to tax wealth? Well, at that point, I pay my $450 at my nearest consulate’s office and hand in my passport. But, what about all of the elderly people? They have lost of capital gains in their homes, but because there hasn’t been a liquidity event, they don’t pay taxes on that wealth while they are alive. What about Mr Buffett’s secretary? Shall we tax her unrealised stock wealth? What about the small business owner, whose main asset is goodwill? How do we tax that?

The nation will continue to serve my interests until I decide otherwise…and then I can do what you can’t. I can leave. How do you like my view of your Fascistic “economic patriotism”?

Resist We Much on November 8, 2012 at 9:41 PM

Reagan won both California and New York. Please, please, please tell me what kind of candidate and platform you’d like the GOP to run in an attempt to win those two states. Or, you know, you could just admit the game has changed in the last quarter-century.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:40 PM

One who loves America and tells the American people to be proud of the country again, and to stand up for our beliefs.

You know, all those things that the democrat party is NOT.

The only thing that has changed in the “electorate” is that we keep getting establishment candidates who care more for the party than the people. Clinton – although I despised the thought of him – was able to project this nicely.

Reagan, were he alive, could win as easily in 2016 as he did in 1984, because he believed in America.

Mitt and Barack believe in their warchests and sycophants.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:43 PM

Yes, that’s how you win elections, by pretending the electorate hasn’t changed in 28 years.

Reagan won both California and New York. Please, please, please tell me what kind of candidate and platform you’d like the GOP to run in an attempt to win those two states.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:40 PM

You know, your point would have more weight if the GOP had run something other than a “problematic conservative” since, oh, 1984.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:44 PM

You kept arguing that you are OWED social security payments. You argued with me on this subject quite a bit. You are wedded to the entitlement state. You are owed money from other people you have never provided anything for in any way whatsoever. That is your philosophy. Whether you took anything up to this point in time or not, your soul says you are owed. Mine says, if I have any other way, I will refuse to.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:41 PM

That is an absolute lie, you never had that conversation with me, you are confused once again. You go back and find that conversation.

Go, find where I ever said that. Do a google search. I dare you to find it.

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 9:46 PM

There’s so much about the GOP/conservative response to these election results that *screams* about the power of feeling like you’re in the majority…

libfreeordie on November 8, 2012 at 8:16 PM

The plain fact is that conservatives in this country ARE the majority. You libs are well aware of that fact. It’s just hidden behind the foliage of lib media-complex control. That’s the reason libs absolutely fear someone like Sarah Palin, and why Palin has to be destroyed. If someone with her charisma catches fire, all those conservative rubes will set your cardboard ideology goes up in the flames.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:49 PM

One who loves America and tells the American people to be proud of the country again, and to stand up for our beliefs.

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:43 PM

Were you asleep during this election? Romney did that. A lot. Probably too much, actually. He continually trumpeted American exceptionalism, for all the good it did him.

You know, your point would have more weight if the GOP had run something other than a “problematic conservative” since, oh, 1984.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:44 PM

Why should we believe that people who can’t even win a primary would suddenly win national elections?

Not to mention, Bush 1 won in 1988, got screwed by Perot in 1992, and then Dubya won in 2000 (with a narrow loss in the popular vote) and 2004. So post-Reagan, that’s 3 victories for “squishes,” whereas no TRUCON has even been able to win the primary.

Good Solid B-Plus on November 8, 2012 at 9:50 PM

Minorities will be more receptive to conservatism when they realize that Republicans care about them as much as they care about their own people…

jules on November 8, 2012 at 8:32 PM

Are Republicans handing out free stuff only to white people?

The point is not to have a party that “cares” about any “people” but to have a party that wants the federal government to shrink to a reasonable size. Also, let’s get a federal government that is so lean that it can’t afford to get in the “care” game every time it pleases.

Caring = big expensive corrupt bureaucracies.

F* white people and F* the minorities. My money is mine. I don’t want to pay other “peoples” in order to live in America.

BoxHead1 on November 8, 2012 at 9:50 PM

*er…all those conservative rubes set your cardboard ideology to the flames.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:52 PM

The Republican Party has two problems.

1. It’s priorities are simply out of whack. Abortion. Family values. Etc. Small potatoes when we are looking at insolvent government in the near future. Such issues are distractions and give ammunition to the Left.

2. It has a messaging problem. People on the Right go on and on about how the Left is a bankrupt ideology. But I’ve yet to see a Republican politician actually take time to explain that to the Voters. It is time to take a page from the Left and build a campaign based on a simple and easy hostility to the Left’s ideology, it’s socialist/redistibutionist/controlling agenda. Voters need to learn the Left’s way “Forward” can only lead to The End of the World as We Know It. The Right needs to stop trying to sell it’s own agenda, boring and outdated crap about growing the economy or whatever. The voters aren’t going to buy it when the Left has them either afraid of it or hostile to it.

To put it simply, the Republicans needs to make voters more afraid of the Democrats than they are of the Republicans.

Scopper on November 8, 2012 at 9:52 PM

Also, while you’re doing the research for those URLs to back up your statement, you might want to look up the psychological meaning of the word “projection.”

Wino on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

Nice try. But why should I post URLs when you only give personal stories? I can do that too. Been voting, campaigning, volunteering for over 40 years. I hear a lot of conversations and comments. I heard many people who claimed to be Repubs say they were voting for Obama, for the reasons I stated.

Now I don’t care if you feel guilty for staying home or whatever reason you feel the need to defend yourself. I guess I hit a nerve. But I’m not projecting at all. Seems to me you are the one doing that. Vote or don’t vote that’s your choice. Not faulting you for that, just stating the same personal evidence as you. See, it’s what everyone on this thread is doing.

Oh, I voted for Romney, for me it was ABO. But that’s just me. Have a nice night.

Deanna on November 8, 2012 at 9:52 PM

Furthermore! You know why the conservatives in the south left the democratic party and began to find their new home in the republican party?! You’ll never guess!

Because the democrats stopped running candidates who were conservative enough! Haha! Can you imagine? The entire conservative south was suddenly ripe for the political taking by the republican party after JFK and Johnson. It was just waiting there in the streets for Goldwater to pick up. And thus, civil rights ended the democrats reign over the conservative south, and the republican party swooped right in and now, funny that, that whole southern part of the electoral map graphics on every channel on election night, yep, they’re red now!

Good thing you northerner, Union army Republican conservatives finally managed to run all those liberals out of the south and take it over for yourselves!

Jesus.

Boomer_Sooner on November 8, 2012 at 9:52 PM

sorry. I’ll try not swear anymore. It’s just all over the internets these past few days and osmosis….

BoxHead1 on November 8, 2012 at 9:53 PM

JPeterman on November 8, 2012 at 9:46 PM

I think I made this error in the past.
I am sorry.

astonerii on November 8, 2012 at 9:53 PM

YOU GOT WHAT YOU WANTED. You got that ultra-electable guy who was going to bring in all those precious indies. And he did. And HE LOST to the most beatable Dem moonbat hopeless joke excuse of a president EVAH.

ddrintn on November 8, 2012 at 9:27 PM

Who is “you”? There are many of us here who wanted someone, anyone else. It didn’t happen. So, in the attempt to be rational, practical adults we tried to do the best thing possible – live to fight another day.

It didn’t happen.

Now we have to go to plan B, which is either purging the GOP and finding someone who is conservative and insane enough to put themselves through the circus called an “election” or to build a viable third party. None of them are foolproof or guaranteed success.

So. All you people unhappy what is YOUR solution? What would YOU suggest? And please don’t bother with the vague “we need someone conservative” and that’s it. We know that. *****HOW***** does this happen and with some detail, please.

Thanks in advance.

kim roy on November 8, 2012 at 9:54 PM

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