VP debate: An epic non-event?

posted at 12:41 pm on October 10, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

Tomorrow night, the American electorate will watch another in a series of four debates intended to help voters decide who should be the next President.  In this event, however, neither presidential candidate will be present.  Instead, the two running mates will discuss and debate policies and issues on national television for 90 minutes.  While that will no doubt provide much entertainment for the pundit class, will it move the needle for the election?

Politico’s Jonathan Martin thinks it might:

Vice presidential debates typically matter as much as vice presidential picks — which is to say not a lot — but a convergence of factors is raising the stakes on this week’s faceoff between Paul Ryan and Vice President Joe Biden.

Looming most heavy over the clash in Kentucky is President Barack Obama’s remarkably weak debate performance last week, a showing that has given Republicans their first sense of hope in weeks and increased the pressure on Biden to get Democrats back on course. …

If “Gentleman Joe” took the stage four years ago, determined not to come off as patronizing or bullying Sarah Palin, it seems almost certain that Thursday will bring the appearance of “Scranton Joe,” the scrappy pol who’s never been afraid to throw a punch.

That’s probably true, although we’re a lot more likely to see Gaffemaster Joe, too — the one who helpfully explained that the middle class had been “buried the last four years,” while he and his boss occupied the White House.  Ramesh Ponnuru notes that while mainly discounting its impact, but predicts a walkover for Paul Ryan anyway:

The Democratic reaction to Obama’s debate loss may also point Biden in the wrong direction. Among liberals — and among some Democratic strategists, too — the prevailing view is that Obama lost because he didn’t call Romney on his outrageous lies, and especially because he didn’t draw a stark contrast on Medicare and Social Security. Obama even said the two candidates had a “similar position” on the second program. Democrats will be urging Biden to be more combative.

The vice president isn’t above demagogic attacks: In his convention speech, for example, he claimed “experts” had said that one of Romney’s tax proposals would create 800,000 jobs, “all of them overseas, all of them.” In fact, Biden was referring to a study by one expert, and it didn’t say what he claimed: It estimated 800,000 jobs would be created overseas, but it didn’t examine the impact domestically. Yet Biden also likes to be liked, and has tended to take his hardest shots before partisan audiences rather than in front of the Republicans he is criticizing.

And the consensus Democratic view that Obama was too passive and disengaged probably misunderstands why he lost the debate. The real problem was that he was less up to speed on the arguments and counterarguments than Romney was. If Biden internalizes the Democratic conventional wisdom, he will be more engaged than Obama was — but it won’t help unless he is also better informed. An amped-up yet inadequate response can come across as bluster.

Yes, but will it matter either way?  In my column today for The Week, I argue that running-mate debates are not game-changers in any sense:

In the end, though, this is merely an academic exercise. Voters don’t choose presidents on the basis of the bottom of the ticket. That point was made quite clearly in 1984, when Walter Mondale chose Geraldine Ferraro as the first woman on a major-party ticket, a move that generated mountains of praise — while Mondale went on to win only Minnesota in Ronald Reagan’s re-election landslide. Four years later, Lloyd Bentsen humiliated Dan Quayle in a debate, while George H. W. Bush went on to thump Bentsen’s running mate Michael Dukakis by 315 electoral votes.  Sarah Palin briefly re-energized John McCain’s campaign in 2008 and held her own against Biden in the debate, but Obama sailed to victory nonetheless.

That means Team Obama may get an opportunity to finally stop talking about the last debate, but they almost certainly won’t win much from Thursday’s, either. Nor do the next two debates look promising for Obama. The next presidential debate will take place in a town-hall format, in which candidates normally pay more attention to the voters than each other. The final debate will focus on foreign policy, which has become a trap for Obama…

Even if Obama does well in these debates, though, the first impression has already been fixed from last week’s contest. Team Obama has made it stick all the more by constantly reminding everyone about how badly he did. Obama’s best chance to reverse the slide will be to make the case for his second term outside of the debate halls, rather than focus entirely on Romney as his campaign has done since May in an attempt to disqualify him in the mind of voters. That strategy evaporated in the thin air of Denver, and there won’t be any time left to revive it.

The point on foreign policy may be worth emphasizing.  Biden doesn’t have much expertise on budgetary matters, but was considered a Democratic eminence grise on foreign policy in 2008, and was chosen by Obama to shore up his credentials in that arena.  As recently as the Democratic convention, Biden and Obama made it clear that they intended to hit Romney and Ryan hard on this topic — until the Benghazi terrorist attack and the unbelievably clumsy and foolish attempt to cover it up.  Any discussion of this topic will allow Ryan to demand answers for the White House’s deceptions on the attack and their refusal to provide a proper level of security to a dangerous mission, as well as challenge the Obama/Biden claim that al-Qaeda is “on its heels.”

Making that more likely is the choice of moderator in this debate: Martha Raddatz, the chief foreign correspondent for ABC News.  However, Raddatz’ scholastic and personal connection to Barack Obama has raised questions about her impartiality in this debate already:

President Barack Obama was a guest at the 1991 wedding of ABC senior foreign correspondent and vice presidential debate moderator Martha Raddatz, The Daily Caller has learned. Obama and groom Julius Genachowski, whom Obama would later tap to head the Federal Communications Commission, were Harvard Law School classmates at the time and members of the Harvard Law Review. …

On Monday evening ABC spokesman David Ford grudgingly confirmed Obama’s attendance at the wedding, after shielding Raddatz in August by declining to comment when The Daily Caller first reported the story.

“This is absurd,” Ford said, in the same statement now circulated by ABC’s media allies on the left.

Obama, Ford wrote, “attended their wedding over two decades ago along with nearly the entire Law Review, many of whom went onto successful careers, including some in the Bush administration,” he said without providing a specific number of Harvard Law Review employees to verify the statement.

When pressed further on Tuesday for a specific number of Harvard Law Review employees in attendance at the wedding, Ford could offer none, despite circulating the same unverified approximation through sympathetic media outlets earlier that day in order to discredit The Daily Caller’s reporting.

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate?  I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be.  In the end, though, it probably won’t matter much in the presidential election.  However, a tough exchange on Benghazi might make a difference in getting the rest of the media to start pressing harder for answers on the White House cover-up.

Breaking on Hot Air

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Comment pages: 1 2

Pelosi thinks Biden should focus on women.

Smart women s/b indignant, alas.

Schadenfreude on October 10, 2012 at 12:45 PM

It will only be important if Biden wins.

brewcrew67 on October 10, 2012 at 12:45 PM

Will Joe ‘Trillion Dollar Tax Increase’ Biden flip us the Big Bird?

Chip on October 10, 2012 at 12:45 PM

Moderator: benghazi? What’s that

Will still play gotcha with Ryan….guaranteed

cmsinaz on October 10, 2012 at 12:46 PM

It will be important, in that the narrative of an administration out of control can be cemented.

A feckless incompetent at the helm, supported by a senile old geezer, is not a team independents can feel good about.

Rebar on October 10, 2012 at 12:47 PM

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate? I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be

Doesn’t matter now. She wears the stink,..it’ll be hard to rub off, regardless of how she handles it.

a capella on October 10, 2012 at 12:47 PM

So now we learn that not only do all the moderators lean far left, but that they may have been selected because they are personal friends of the Democratic candidates. I guess the next line of inquiry is to ascertain if the questions are being leaked to the Obama camp, or perhaps the other way around. both Biden and Obama can then expound upon what color or super power they prefer.

pat on October 10, 2012 at 12:48 PM

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate? I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be.

Ed, have you learned nothing about the MSM?

Cicero43 on October 10, 2012 at 12:48 PM

Come on Ed, they had Gwen Ifill moderate a debate and she was writing a book about “The Age of Obama” at the time.

The idea the “moderator” will be anything but a paid partisan hack for the Democrats is laughable.

BKennedy on October 10, 2012 at 12:49 PM

I sure plan to watch. I hope this is going to be as entertaining as I think it will be? The vp is important, just think of dear joe as president is something was to happen to bho? Not a nice vision in my mind!

Paul would do a great job is Mitt was unable to finish as president.
L

letget on October 10, 2012 at 12:49 PM

The last VP moderator wrote a book on how awesome Barackabama’s presidency would be…before he was elected.

Also, Pennsylvania officially a “Toss-up” on RealClearPolitics.com now!!

SouthernGent on October 10, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Ryan would need to get biden on the ropes, that is, when he relies on his adlibbing skills for quick bombastic comebacks. It is here where Ryan can nail the guy on the eventual gaffe. But he needs to get bozo to break, so to speak.

jake49 on October 10, 2012 at 12:50 PM

Not for nothing, but that list of HLR folks would be a hell of a lot to follow-up with. No ?

Ain’t no way this guy will name names.

Jabberwock on October 10, 2012 at 12:50 PM

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate? I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be

Did you forget your sarc tag, Ed? There is no such thing as fair when it comes to Liberal moonbats.

JPeterman on October 10, 2012 at 12:50 PM

Floating on e-mail

Clinton was suspended from practicing law in Arkansas.
He also paid a $25,000.00 fine there.
He also paid an $850,000.00 settlement.

He was also disbarred from practicing law in front of the Supreme Court.
So Bill Clinton, a disbarred lawyer, a President
who was impeached for lying under oath,
Asks the American people to believe
him when he says the best thing for the
Country is 4 more years of Obama.

Schadenfreude on October 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Like Reagan’s “There you go again.” Ryan should use the catch phrase “Sorry Joe, but that just ain’t so.” Every time the VP says something wrong or stupid. That will be the talking point the next day as every pundit plays a barrage of the phrase.

Snake307 on October 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM

The pre-emptive (and justified) strike on the moderator’s impartiality will be useful.

Biden is a motor mouth and I predict his main contribution will be to make Ryan look even better.

Drained Brain on October 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM

This article and the comments are incredibly good.

Schadenfreude on October 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Ugh. That is ” a hell of a lot of fun to follow-up with”

Jabberwock on October 10, 2012 at 12:52 PM

I have faith that Paul Ryan will go into the debate prepared. I wouldn’t put it past the moderator to give Biden the questions ahead of time. Good thing for us he can’t read. ;)

magicbeans on October 10, 2012 at 12:52 PM

I don’t like the way this is being set up. The only way the Media will claim Ryan won is if he is absolutely perfect. Anything less will be “Joe did much better than we had expected”. I think the best we can hope for is a draw.

reddevil on October 10, 2012 at 12:53 PM

It will be important, in that the narrative of an administration out of control can be cemented.

A feckless incompetent at the helm, supported by a senile old geezer, is not a team independents can feel good about.

Rebar on October 10, 2012 at 12:47 PM

Yup, if Ryan exposes the bumbling fool it will be hard for Obama to save it whatever he does.

the_nile on October 10, 2012 at 12:53 PM

2008……when the media told us Biden was the skilled politician with the stunning retail politics skills.

…..and Palin was the idiot Klondike Barbie Trailer trash that didn’t know how to pour piss out of her mountain boots.

I expect no less spin this time.

PappyD61 on October 10, 2012 at 12:53 PM

Ordinarily VP debates aren’t that important. This time it will be if Joe can get some zingers and silence Ryan. The media will tell us this is the end of Romney now, because this was the most important debate EVAH! If Joe does as he usually does.. meh, not so much…

sandee on October 10, 2012 at 12:54 PM

The best outcome for Biden will be if people walk away from the debate thinking “Gee, he’s not as big a moron as I thought, but he’s still a moron.”

natasha333 on October 10, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Paul Ryan needs to be really, really prepared for the stupid war on women and abortion and contrception questions. He needs to throw it back in their face. Remind them that Barack Obama voted to let babies born from botched abortions die in a garbage can.

djl130 on October 10, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Also – I think all the rules are out the window. These debates DO matter and I am tired of pundits telling me they don’t.

djl130 on October 10, 2012 at 12:56 PM

I must have read that wrong, does this:

groom Julius Genachowski, whom Obama would later tap to head the Federal Communications Commission

Mean the husband of the moderator heads the FCC or that he was just “tap[ped]” to head it whatever the heck that means?

WitchDoctor on October 10, 2012 at 12:56 PM

OT BREAKING NEWS, from Nikki Haley’s FB page:

..South Carolina just won the Voter ID case! Lawsuit by unions….WON! lawsuit by NLRB against Boeing….. WON! Protecting the integrity of the voting process by showing picture ID….WON! The Feds keep throwing punches but in South Carolina heels and boxing gloves prevail! This is another win for our state and country!

pambi on October 10, 2012 at 12:56 PM

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate? I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be.

Exactly the motive behind DC’s waiting until the last minute to drop this. Little time for ABC or the WH to spin.

Wethal on October 10, 2012 at 12:57 PM

It will be a case of the rambling, caustic old guy who has nothing to run on but jealousy and snark against the young, well informed guy who has ideas and numbers to back them up, while he makes a case for freedom for all Americans.

I said this the other day, but what Biden had going for him in the debate with Palin is that she never called him out when he stretched the truth. Ryan has all of the facts at his fingertips. This should be fun to watch.

cep on October 10, 2012 at 12:57 PM

I don’t like the way this is being set up. The only way the Media will claim Ryan won is if he is absolutely perfect. Anything less will be “Joe did much better than we had expected”. I think the best we can hope for is a draw.

reddevil on October 10, 2012 at 12:53 PM

Ditto. And there isn’t a snowball’s chance in hell that the moderator will set herself up for the same criticism Lehrer received meaning she will do all she can to help old Joe out.

natasha333 on October 10, 2012 at 12:57 PM

This article and the comments are incredibly good.

Schadenfreude on October 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Indeed it is. “The motel bill, unpaid these many long months and ages, at long last came due.”

Heh…

Drained Brain on October 10, 2012 at 12:58 PM

I’m a little more concerned about this debate than I am the town hall one next week (the latter due to the types of questions that might be posed), simply because expectations for Ryan are pretty high.

But, Biden hasn’t done a formal interview in months. He doesn’t take questions from the press, and even when he did they didn’t challenge him the way Ryan is likely to. So, even “scrappy” Joe will find it tough being challenged on their record in that environment.

changer1701 on October 10, 2012 at 12:58 PM

Is she married to Genachowski ??? No way!!! So how is this a ‘little’ conflict of interest??? Obama’ appointed head of FCC??? You got to be kdding me….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

In my column today for The Week, I argue that running-mate debates are not game-changers in any sense:

I think you may be wrong in this sense. Paul Ryan is smart and likeable. Joe Biden is neither. Those who began feeling better about voting for Romney but were not ready to seal the deal may do so if they discover that Paul Ryan is not the guy the left portrays as wheeling the elderly off of cliffs.

In most elections, I don’t know why they even arrange VP debates but to have Paul Ryan with all his youth and passion on the same stage as the corrupt old gaffemaster should be interesting.

Happy Nomad on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

This article and the comments are incredibly good.

Schadenfreude on October 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM

“I divide people into people who talk like us and people who don’t talk like us,” said David Brooks, speaking for all of them. “You could see him as a New Republic writer … he’s more talented than anyone in my lifetime … he IS pretty dazzling when he walks into a room.”

Heh.

the_nile on October 10, 2012 at 1:00 PM

I’m betting that Raddatz asks Ryan something really personal, like whether he and his wife use artificial contraception, or whether he would want his daughter to have an abortion if she got pregnant at age 14.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:01 PM

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate? I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be.

???????

JournoList? Cabalist? Why in the world do you think she’ll be fair?

The media has been out in the open obviously shilling for Obama. It’s been clearly demonstrated they have no shame. They see themselves as the ones who are qualified to pass judgment and frame reality.

INC on October 10, 2012 at 1:01 PM

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

They are divorced.

pambi on October 10, 2012 at 1:02 PM

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:01 PM

I agree.

INC on October 10, 2012 at 1:02 PM

Obama and Genochowski were Harvard Law School Classmates. Nope. No bias here. None at all. Nothing to see here. Move along.

kingsjester on October 10, 2012 at 1:02 PM

Paul Ryan should ask Sheriff Joe how many investigations he has conducted, and how many arrests he has made.

meci on October 10, 2012 at 1:02 PM

Is she married to Genachowski ??? No way!!! So how is this a ‘little’ conflict of interest??? Obama’ appointed head of FCC??? You got to be kdding me….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

She is not. They got divorced in 1997 per another article I read this morning. She remarried, not sure about him.

JPeterman on October 10, 2012 at 1:02 PM

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

They were divorced in 1997 and both have since remarried. They have a child together. Not saying she is not part of the Democratic Media complex, but this is more of a coincidence than a scandal.

Ted Torgerson on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

Ryan wins if he can keep the focus of the debate on the future of the country and not on the past. Voters under the age of 50 will gravitate to Ryan if he can present a positive vision of the future. Biden wins if he can filibuster about how horrible America was before there was Medicare and Medicaid and the Civil Rights Act.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

All Ryan needs to do is display some policy wonk lite numbers and Joe will be lost.
He cannot get too deep into policy, but just deep enough to get sloJoe talking policy and numbers. I believe Biden’s evasion in this area will be visable and make him VERY defensive.

Jabberwock on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

Wait. Forget the wedding.

She’s had a personal relationship with Obama from his mystery college days?

budfox on October 10, 2012 at 1:04 PM

I have faith that Paul Ryan will go into the debate prepared. I wouldn’t put it past the moderator to give Biden the questions ahead of time. Good thing for us he can’t read. ;)

magicbeans on October 10, 2012 at 12:52 PM

I’ve seen Paul Ryan in Congressional hearings. If Joe Biden thinks he’ll be able to get away with some generalizations and few “come on man! comments” Well, good entertainment if nothing else.

Happy Nomad on October 10, 2012 at 1:04 PM

Is she married to Genachowski ??? No way!!! So how is this a ‘little’ conflict of interest??? Obama’ appointed head of FCC??? You got to be kdding me….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

They later divorced in 1997 and are now married to other people.

Wethal on October 10, 2012 at 1:04 PM

2008……when the media told us Biden was the skilled politician with the stunning retail politics skills.

…..and Palin was the idiot Klondike Barbie Trailer trash that didn’t know how to pour piss out of her mountain boots.

I expect no less spin this time.

PappyD61 on October 10, 2012 at 12:53 PM

But this time Mitt took out Obama , Ryan has a chance to mop up the last doubt.

the_nile on October 10, 2012 at 1:05 PM

Mean the husband of the moderator heads the FCC or that he was just “tap[ped]” to head it whatever the heck that means?

Yes, Genachowki currently heads the FCC. However, Raddatz divorced him 15 years ago, so it’s conceivable that she wants him to lose his job.

Fabozz on October 10, 2012 at 1:05 PM

I expect this moderator will be much more involved and controlling.

I’m hoping that Ryan doesn’t remain seated.

tomg51 on October 10, 2012 at 1:06 PM

Ryan will follow the same game plan Mitt did. Challenge Joe with the truth and actual facts and figures. He will also probably challenge the moderater, like Mitt did, if she tries to pull something. Americans long for the truth.

kingsjester on October 10, 2012 at 1:06 PM

They were divorced in 1997 and both have since remarried. They have a child together. Not saying she is not part of the Democratic Media complex, but this is more of a coincidence than a scandal.

Ted Torgerson on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

I disagree. Raddatz had a responsibility to disclose this to the Commission on Debates as a potential conflict of interest. I doubt they would have chosen her had they known. Of course, they did stick with Gwen Ifill even though she was writing a book about Obama, so maybe they actually did know. But I doubt that, given the way ABC has tried to spike the story.

Drudge has this story on his banner now. If it circulates widely enough today and tomorrow, it will unquestionably taint the entire debate.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:06 PM

She’s been friends with the guy for 20 years?

How many people can honestly make that claim?

Usually, his friends are broken into life sections.

So Raddatz is one of his oldest friends, because she was in the Harvard circle.

That’s the Samantha Power/Cass Sunstein clique.

Holy crap. She’s in deep.

budfox on October 10, 2012 at 1:07 PM

to have Paul Ryan with all his youth and passion on the same stage as the corrupt old gaffemaster should be interesting VISUALLY DEVESTATING.

Happy Nomad on October 10, 2012 at 12:59 PM

;-)

pambi on October 10, 2012 at 1:07 PM

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:06 PM

You are correct, ma’am. Nice timing on The Daily Caller’s part.

kingsjester on October 10, 2012 at 1:08 PM

Will Raddatz be fair in tomorrow night’s debate? I’d guess that with this out the open, she’ll have to be.

Perhaps you graciously assume too much, Ed. I don’t know. This is like Gwen Ifill redux. She was working on a book about Barack Obama and moderating the VP debate at the same time.

Right Mover on October 10, 2012 at 1:08 PM

They later divorced in 1997 and are now married to other people.

Wethal on October 10, 2012 at 1:04 PM

Thanks, had no idea. I hope she hates him enough :)..though they probably have liberalism still in common…

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:08 PM

Non-event? What happens if the Friday morning headline reads: “Ryan follows up by destroying Biden in debate”?

gengwall on October 10, 2012 at 1:08 PM

Here’s how Joe Biden wins the debate:

“Paul Ryan voted for TARP, the bailouts, raising the debt ceiling, Medicare Part D, presidential appointments without Senate confirmation, and making the Patriot Act permanent. These are all things the president and I voted for and/or supported. Thank you, good night.”

Dante on October 10, 2012 at 1:10 PM

..economy, foreign policy. How many here are getting the feeling that this is beginning to resemble an end-game in a chess match? It’s starting to look like, no matter where the Obama campaign moves their pieces, they will end up in check?

I ain’t sayin’ it’s over; just getting close to the bottom of the ninth, to mix metaphors.

The War Planner on October 10, 2012 at 1:10 PM

They were divorced in 1997 and both have since remarried. They have a child together. Not saying she is not part of the Democratic Media complex, but this is more of a coincidence than a scandal.

Ted Torgerson on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

Coincidence? How about just how much incest there is between Democrats and the media? David Axlerod- former journalist now political strategist. George Stephanophlus (or however you spell it)- political strategist turned journalist. Jay Carney’s wife- in the media (ABC I think). Susan Rice’s hubby- in the media. Etc.

But here’s the real point. It is less important that Barry Obama was at a wedding in 1991 but there is the concept of full disclosure when vetting debate emcees. And I would argue that this is a conflict of interest only because she apparently tried to hide it.

Happy Nomad on October 10, 2012 at 1:10 PM

As “seasoned” as he is, O’Biden will be rattled into sticking his foot in his mouth, by Ryan. Ryan is quick and he knows the facts, forward and backwards. I can’t wait :) (Cheshire Cat grin)

kcd on October 10, 2012 at 1:10 PM

Consider

Julius didn’t meet Martha one day and marry her the next. They dated.

Julius has been tight with Barry since those days.

Obama got married the next year.

Was she at his wedding?

budfox on October 10, 2012 at 1:11 PM

What I do know is that Raddatz and Genachowski were definitely a couple while Obama and Genachowski were together on the Harvard Law Review, where they were friends. And the Raddatz-Genachowski relationship was quite public — public enough that I knew about it, despite being a year below both men on the Review and not close personal friends with either of them.

My recollection is hearing that Raddatz visited Boston frequently. I would be shocked if she hadn’t met Obama at some point.

Update: I believe that Raddatz actually lived in Boston, rather than visiting, in the early ’90′s.

kingsjester on October 10, 2012 at 1:11 PM

It’s good the moderator’s long association with Obama came out ahead of time, calling her into question early rather than the MSM saying it’s merely a case of Republican sour grapes. Not that I expect Raddatz will be any more ‘fair’ in the way most people understand the term. I can easily foresee her concept of ‘fair’ would be to give Obama’s campaign a chance to make up for that thin Colorado air that surely made him only appear less than his best.

It’s likely neither side will gain much in a national poll, but it will illustrate further the differences between the two sides. I don’t expect Uncle Ho Joe to pull out a big win though the MSM will be singing his praises insufferably.

At best, for our side, we as individuals will have more ammo to prove to any waverers in our personal lives who will make the better president.

Liam on October 10, 2012 at 1:11 PM

The moderator flap is much ado about nothing. The wedding was 20 years ago.

joejm65 on October 10, 2012 at 1:11 PM

I don’t like the way this is being set up. The only way the Media will claim Ryan won is if he is absolutely perfect.

That’s true of all these debates. They had to claim Mitt won the first debate because, well, he was absolutely perfect in that debate.

Right Mover on October 10, 2012 at 1:11 PM

VP debate: An epic non-event?

Any time a Republican can rub a Democrat’s nose in the dirt is an epic event….well, at least to me it is.

timberline on October 10, 2012 at 1:12 PM

The VP debate is a lose lose for the President, If Ryan shames Biden (I hope so) then Obama’s got a dummy VP, if Biden wins, Obama’s shamed even more for his awful performance.

Somehow its hard to feel sorry for them.

Speakup on October 10, 2012 at 1:13 PM

Here’s how Joe Biden wins the debate:

“Paul Ryan voted for TARP, the bailouts, raising the debt ceiling, Medicare Part D, presidential appointments without Senate confirmation, and making the Patriot Act permanent. These are all things the president and I voted for and/or supported. Thank you, good night.”

Dante on October 10, 2012 at 1:10 PM

If you think that anybody would be able to keep Biden to one very long sentence and a thank you then you are even more of an idiot than I thought. If you think that these are the defining issues that should be the focus of discussion then you’re truly beyond redemption.

Happy Nomad on October 10, 2012 at 1:13 PM

Here hoping that Ryan goats Biden into saying something so monumentally stupid that it becomes Joe’s new neck tie and one that drags the coming tidal wave to unprecedented heights. “Chains” Joe…
-
Not that Joe needs the prodding… But it will bring a smile if Ryan gets partial credit for a total public meltdown by Joe.

RalphyBoy on October 10, 2012 at 1:13 PM

It will be a case of the rambling, caustic old guy who has nothing to run on but jealousy and snark against the young, well informed guy who has ideas and numbers to back them up, while he makes a case for freedom for all Americans.
cep on October 10, 2012 at 12:57 PM

That’s if “Cranky Old Man Joe” shows up. The problem is that Biden can appear to be genial. If “Genial Joe” shows up and if Ryan comes off as “The Excitable Wonk Kid”, the story could come out as “Punk attacks Old Guy”.
It’s always best to over-estimate the enemy – even a moronic clod like Biden, ignoring possible dangers could be a fatal mistake.

whatcat on October 10, 2012 at 1:13 PM

Non Event???

Only if Ryan doesn’t show. He will destroy Biden and it will increase the Romney momentum…consequential you wonder…I’d say so.

winston on October 10, 2012 at 1:13 PM

Drudge has this story on his banner now. If it circulates widely enough today and tomorrow, it will unquestionably taint the entire debate.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:06 PM

Just saw that…I think it is a serious serious conflict of interest, even though they are divorced now, but obama attending her wedding??? I mean seriously?? There wasn’t a single other moderator out there whose wedding obama didn’t attend?? This is effin ridiculous….same story with the black woman 4 years ago, who was having a book about obama up and coming…

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:14 PM

It will only be important if Biden wins.

brewcrew67 on October 10, 2012 at 12:45 PM

..and, if he loses, then it will still be a seven-game series and they will now be tied two-two.

The War Planner on October 10, 2012 at 1:14 PM

I dont think the VP debates will move the neddle much but I do plan on watching them. As far as Obama vs Romney, I think Romneys showing did him a great deal of good, I do think he out performed Obama in the debate but I also dont think that debate will be a lasting first impression of Obama. Obama has been President for four years and those on the left and left leaning know him, independents have seen him before and I believe he can win them back with strong performances in the next two debates. I do think that Romney got a bounce out of the debates because not a lot of people seen him on that size of a stage before and I predict the next debate will be as well televised/watched as the first simply to see if Obama can come back or not and if he does then we will see the needle move the other away.

On the debate being widely viewed, heres why I think it will be so. When the last debate came out every person on facebook, twitter and instagram was talking about it, regardless of what side they were on. They were talking about it, and I dont see that changing with the upcoming debates if anything in my timelines Ive seen people who missed the first one saying how they cant wait for the second. Ive seen a lot of people comparing it to the long awaited Mayweather vs Paquiao fight.

Should be good times.

Politricks on October 10, 2012 at 1:14 PM

Ryan should lock up the women’s vote. He’s…. ummmmm….. extremely appealing for a variety of reasons.

Biden may demean him attempting to treat him as some young pup, a whippersnapper lacking the gravitas of someone who has warmed a Senate seat for nearly as many years as Ryan has been alive – but he will come across as a grouchy old man, clinging bitterly to his career – something Senators are known for doing.

If Biden appears to be picking on Ryan, women, especially moms, may react negatively.

As for the younger and older women, all Ryan has to do is walk on stage without a shirt, flex his muscles and bat those baby blues – and leave.

Yes, yes, that is so deplorably cheap. A 90 minute, dull debate would be over in seconds. Ryan would never do that, but trust me, there will be a lot of us wimminses watching the debate imagining Ryan without a shirt and paying absolutely no attention to the gaffe master, Biden. ;))

Cody1991 on October 10, 2012 at 1:15 PM

This is like Gwen Ifill redux. She was working on a book about Barack Obama and moderating the VP debate at the same time.

Right Mover on October 10, 2012 at 1:08 PM

And did the moderating with all the objectivity that is implied by that “coincidence.”

Happy Nomad on October 10, 2012 at 1:15 PM

Here’s how Joe Biden wins the debate:

“Paul Ryan voted for TARP, the bailouts, raising the debt ceiling, Medicare Part D, presidential appointments without Senate confirmation, and making the Patriot Act permanent. These are all things the president and I voted for and/or supported. Thank you, good night.”

Dante on October 10, 2012 at 1:10 PM

And thank you, good bye, dante! You just missed an opportunity to shut up. BUt then what’s new….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:16 PM

I’m betting that Raddatz asks Ryan something really personal, like whether he and his wife use artificial contraception, or whether he would want his daughter to have an abortion if she got pregnant at age 14.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:01 PM

I’d be shocked if she asked anything of the sort. I think they’ll stick largely to the economy for the domestic part.

changer1701 on October 10, 2012 at 1:16 PM

Non-event? What happens if the Friday morning headline reads: “Ryan follows up by destroying Biden in debate”?

gengwall on October 10, 2012 at 1:08 PM

Meh….it’ll never happen. The MSM will not print it.

timberline on October 10, 2012 at 1:16 PM

Ryan will follow the same game plan Mitt did. Challenge Joe with the truth and actual facts and figures. He will also probably challenge the moderater, like Mitt did, if she tries to pull something. Americans long for the truth.

kingsjester on October 10, 2012 at 1:06 PM

Ryan can be much more aggressive against Biden than Mitt could be against Obama if he needs to.
Biden also needs to keep his stupid in check so Ryan could distract him by provoking him to do his bravado.

the_nile on October 10, 2012 at 1:17 PM

Ryan wins if he can keep the focus of the debate on the future of the country and not on the past. Voters under the age of 50 will gravitate to Ryan if he can present a positive vision of the future. Biden wins if he can filibuster about how horrible America was before there was Medicare and Medicaid and the Civil Rights Act.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

I Biden is really stupid enough to go there, then he’s going to lose. That gives Ryan the perfect opportunity to explain the Obamacare/Medicare stuff. I don’t think Biden wants to go there.

MobileVideoEngineer on October 10, 2012 at 1:18 PM

Not saying she is not part of the Democratic Media complex, but this is more of a coincidence than a scandal.

Ted Torgerson on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

Rule #39: There is no such thing as coincidence. – Agent Leroy Jethro Gibbs, NCIS

The woman could have fessed up front about this association.

More muck from the DNC fraternity.

Typicalwhitewoman on October 10, 2012 at 1:18 PM

Of all the lies and gaffes that Biden has told the public in his life, this is perhaps the sleaziest and most egregious.

The guy is either insane, a total prick…. or both.

UltimateBob on October 10, 2012 at 1:18 PM

As for the younger and older women, all Ryan has to do is walk on stage without a shirt, flex his muscles and bat those baby blues – and leave.

Cody1991 on October 10, 2012 at 1:15 PM

*chuckle*

timberline on October 10, 2012 at 1:18 PM

And thank you, good bye, dante! You just missed an opportunity to shut up. BUt then what’s new….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:16 PM

What does he care? He’s writing in himself and his own mascara-streaked reflection.

Dainte/His Reflection 2012!!!!

CurtZHP on October 10, 2012 at 1:19 PM

if Ryan comes off as “The Excitable Wonk Kid”, the story could come out as “Punk attacks Old Guy”.

I don’t see that happening. No worries at all about how Ryan will handle himself, Biden or the questions he’ll be hit with.

Right Mover on October 10, 2012 at 1:20 PM

Ryan wins if he can keep the focus of the debate on the future of the country and not on the past. Voters under the age of 50 will gravitate to Ryan if he can present a positive vision of the future. Biden wins if he can filibuster about how horrible America was before there was Medicare and Medicaid and the Civil Rights Act.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

If Biden is really stupid enough to go there, then he’s going to lose. That gives Ryan the perfect opportunity to explain the Obamacare/Medicare stuff. I don’t think Biden wants to go there.

MobileVideoEngineer on October 10, 2012 at 1:18 PM

Everyone knows this as well, that’s why Pelosi said they should focus on women. They have absolutely nothing else that they can talk about right now without getting beat down with the truth.

MobileVideoEngineer on October 10, 2012 at 1:20 PM

It’s good the moderator’s long association with Obama came out ahead of time, calling her into question early rather than the MSM saying it’s merely a case of Republican sour grapes. Not that I expect Raddatz will be any more ‘fair’ in the way most people understand the term. I can easily foresee her concept of ‘fair’ would be to give Obama’s campaign a chance to make up for that thin Colorado air that surely made him only appear less than his best.

Liam on October 10, 2012 at 1:11 PM

Well, it’s not that much ‘ahead of time’, is it, the day before the debate…how many people are reading about this, the drudge readers, where else is this story reported and how amply?

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:20 PM

And thank you, good bye, dante! You just missed an opportunity to shut up. BUt then what’s new….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:16 PM

What does he care? He’s writing in himself and his own mascara-streaked reflection.

Dainte/His Reflection 2012!!!!

CurtZHP on October 10, 2012 at 1:19 PM

Lool :).

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:21 PM

I don’t like the way this is being set up. The only way the Media will claim Ryan won is if he is absolutely perfect. Anything less will be “Joe did much better than we had expected”. I think the best we can hope for is a draw.

reddevil on October 10, 2012 at 12:53 PM

Maybe, but I’m hoping what also might happen is that the MSM’s pathetic spin for Slow Joe will blow up in their faces, whichever way it turns out. Look at the continued lame attempts to prop up Obama for his performance in the first debate. It’s not working and many people beyond our forum here are seeing it as the sham that it is.

I also bet that someone like John Sununu will make it a point to mention that Martha Raddatz is/was married to FCC Chairman Julius Genachowski, and thus illustrating the extreme incestuousness between the MSM and the Dems.

That’s what I’d do — just as a point of information, mind you … [diabolical laugh].

PatriotGal2257 on October 10, 2012 at 1:21 PM

Of all the lies that Joe Biden has told the public in his life, this is perhaps the sleaziest and most egregious.

The guy is either insane or a total pr!ck…. or both.

UltimateBob on October 10, 2012 at 1:22 PM

What does he care? He’s writing in himself and his own mascara-streaked reflection.

Dainte/His Reflection 2012!!!!

CurtZHP on October 10, 2012 at 1:19 PM

Get over here and clean up my monitor LOL!

JPeterman on October 10, 2012 at 1:23 PM

I think this debate will have good ratings because everyone I know is throwing a debate party based simply on the fact that the anticipated Biden Gaffe-a-palooza will provide hours of entertainment. They’ve been cramming this guys head full of stuff for the past 6 days. He’s glinting to freak out or meltdown or something….

Anyone come across a Biden drinking game yet?

catalan on October 10, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Debate THIS.

MontanaMmmm on October 10, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Ryan wins if he can keep the focus of the debate on the future of the country and not on the past. Voters under the age of 50 will gravitate to Ryan if he can present a positive vision of the future. Biden wins if he can filibuster about how horrible America was before there was Medicare and Medicaid and the Civil Rights Act.

rockmom on October 10, 2012 at 1:03 PM

Watch out how many times Ole Joe will throw ‘womenz’ and ‘abortion’ at him…the only think that I am afraid of is that this would be Ryan’s first public debate of this magnitude and with these high stakes….

jimver on October 10, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Comment pages: 1 2