About that “Romney-Ryan” chanting on MSNBC – Updated

posted at 8:31 am on September 29, 2012 by Jazz Shaw

(See updates below – Jazz)

There was yet another story this week making the rounds regarding a Romney-Ryan stop on the campaign trail, alleging some dirty tricks by the media in their coverage. But this one really serves more to highlight what happens when politicos wind up with too much time on their hands during the silly season. In it, we find charges of media skullduggery in their attempts to get Barack Obama elected to a second term. (Nothing new there, I’m sure.) But this one seems to have problems.

Here’s the clip in question, where MSNBC host Joe Scarborough reacts to a clip of Paul Ryan introducing Mitt Romney during the event in question, and Mitt responding to the chants of the crowd.

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After Ryan finishes the intro, Mitt grabs the mic and says, “Wow! That’s quite a guy, isn’t it? Paul Ryan! Isn’t that something?” At this point the crowd breaks out into a chant. This is where the “controversy” begins.

If you listen closely, it’s obvious the audio in the clip has been adjusted. However, that’s not uncommon — and that doesn‘t necessarily mean it’s MSNBC who did it. Sound technicians usually cut out the audience to ensure speakers aren’t drowned out (which you can do by simply turning the mics up and down — or you can do after the fact). However, where the controversy comes in is in the caption on the screen quoting the audience as chanting “Ryan!” Why is that controversial? Because people who attended the event say that’s not what happened, and that the MSNBC video grossly misrepresents what actually occurred.

Yes, the caption on the screen reads, “Ryan! Ryan!” And when Mitt jumps in to urge the crowd to say, “Romney Ryan” it comes off looking kind of awkward. But that’s the entire point that Scarborough seems to be reacting to… that it was a brief, forgettable moment which wound up coming off poorly on video and simply opened the door to another event “gaffe.”

But more to the point, it’s a bit of a leap to try to assume some sort of conspiracy on the part of MSNBC here, no matter what your normal inclinations are. I pulled the audio line of the clip out using Audacity and played it several times at high volume with some background noise dampening. (And without.) A lot of people were chanting “Ryan.” Why wouldn’t they? The guy is very popular and had not only just finished speaking, but was also complimented by the candidate. And without a doubt, some other people were chanting “Romney.”

But the way it played on video was… awkward. Was it a campaign ending – or even influencing – flub? No.. it’s a nothingburger. But was it a conspiracy by MSNBC? As the original article admits, it’s pretty much standard editing. How each person interprets it is up to them. But… a MSM conspiracy? Sorry… I’m just not seeing it. I believe Romney heard some of the people yelling “Romney!” and wanted to spread the credit around, but did so at a moment which left the reaction open to any interpretation partisans might like.

So what was this in the end? It’s us having way too much time on our hands while we wait for the first debate. You can find more than enough incidents of media bias all around the dial to keep things clicking along, but in this case, there simply wasn’t any “there there” on either side. Scarborough is one of the few conservatives given time on MSNBC (though you should also check out S.E. Cupp on “The Cycle” in the afternoon) and it’s kind of self defeating to tear down one of the reasonable voices on the network. If you really think Scarborough is trying to get Obama reelected, I honestly don’t know what to say to you. This was really a case of nothing to see here… move along.

UPDATE 9/30: Jazz

Given the, shall we say, “energetic” response to this piece which I’ve received through multiple channels, a fair portion of the weekend was spent digging further into this story. (A fact I am still gobsmacked by, given the completely trivial nature of the original clip.) Yet a few more interesting twists and turns to the tale have emerged.

First of all, as was previously reported, MSNBC picked up on the story via Politico. Here is their original video, still available on line, where they ran the fifteen seconds of film from the event with the headline, “Romney changes crowd’s chant to include his name.” Even if they backed off on the story later, this was the source MSNBC originally picked up. I’ve run that video against the one shown on Morning Joe, including the audio tracks, and they are identical. But there’s another twist to come.

In an effort to verify the story, I contacted MSNBC. In the process of preparing to air the clip, they sought out confirmation and located an article from the New York Times, which many readers referenced as proof that Politico’s line about what the crowd was chanting was incorrect. (Leading to the suggestion that Morning Joe must have cooked the books on it.) That article in its current form ends as follows:

The other is that the PowerPoint slides and wonky talk work powerfully well with many people who leave feeling that they have not been lectured to, but empowered.

“He speaks the truth, and he gives us facts,” Jackie Sullivan said after a rally in Orlando, Fla., last weekend that drew more than 2,000 people.

But avoiding missteps is now critical for the both of them, as they fight together to chip into Mr. Obama’s lead.

After Mr. Ryan whooped up the crowd in Vandalia on Tuesday, Mr. Romney moved to the front of the stage. As the crowd began chanting “Romney! Romney!” he cut them off.“Wait a second,” Mr. Romney said, instructing the audience to cheer for “Romney-Ryan! Romney-Ryan!” They did.

“There we go,” he said, pleased.

Michael Barbaro contributed reporting from New York.

But early in the news cycle, when MSNBC was checking into it, there was something else there. A correction was posted on the story, which has since disappeared. Here’s how the end of the article looked that morning, as captured by another site’s RSS feed.

The other is that the PowerPoint slides and wonky talk work powerfully well with many people who leave feeling that they have not been lectured to, but empowered.

“He speaks the truth, and he gives us facts,” Jackie Sullivan said after a rally in Orlando, Fla., last weekend that drew more than 2,000 people.

Michael Barbaro contributed reporting from New York.

This article has been revised to reflect the following correction:

Correction: September 25, 2012

An earlier version of this article referred to the crowd at a rally in Vandalia, Ohio, chanting “Romney! Romney!” as Mr. Romney took the stage. Upon closer review of the audio, it was unclear if the crowd was chanting for Mr. Romney, his running mate, Paul Ryan, or for both men.

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So, when MSNBC went to check on the story, the Gray Lady had included a correction saying that the crowd reaction may have been the same as that reported in Politico. While the correction has since disappeared, I reached out to a source familiar with the processing of the story who confirmed that the retraction had been been there, but was no longer present.

The bottom line to this entire sad tale is that the original story – involving fifteen seconds of a crowd chanting at a campaign rally – has now morphed beyond what was at first nothing more than a potentially amusing moment on the campaign trail and become a meta-story in a pair of campaigns which frequently remain about nothing. But in this case, too many people who are ostensibly fighting for the conservative cause have chosen to concoct a conspiracy theory in which one of the conservative voices in the mainstream media is secretly trying to undermine the Romney campaign and facilitate President Obama’s reelection. And for suggesting that we might be jumping the gun on this, I received a near record number of responses suggesting that I’m all too willing to buy into this media narrative and lend a hand. Morning Joe took a fast moving story from a frequently cited source – Politico – and checked with the New York Times and ran it.

Was the story flawed? Almost certainly. Did it hold any great importance for voters considering their choices in November? No. But vilifying one of our own during the silly season near the end of the election isn’t helping anyone. Let’s close the book on this one, folks.


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You can go ahead and clap.

fitzfong on September 29, 2012 at 4:06 PM

the skewers are the new birthers! at least this new denial syndrome will have a quick end soon.

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 3:01 PM

There isn’t a single self-respecting pollster that would use a D+11 sample. Not one. Do you understand that fact? Do you?

And here’s the really nasty bit: if they’re willing to do that, willing to use a completely unrealistic sample to further their agenda, then it’s but a short step to simply lying, which is what I expect in the next several weeks.

The polls will become increasingly unreliable for the rest of this campaign. In the meantime, you’ll see the reality: the Obama campaign making stops in Wisconsin of all places, moving events to smaller venues, and the media consistently caught lying about Mitt Romney. And Obama will continue to pander for votes by handing out taxpayer money left and right.

The only problem for the Left is that the voters aren’t fooled anymore. Just watch Twitter blow up every time the administration does something completely idiotic, whether it’s something laughable like “yard sales for Obama” or something treasonous like lying about the terrorist attacks on our embassies. Or read the comments in left-leaning publications like the Times or the Trib; you see more and more people just plain sick of this crap.

38 days. It’s going to be a beautiful thing.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 4:15 PM

It does not say Soros is planing for a Mitt Presidency now. It says Soros decided to kick in another million to make sure Obama wins. That he is less sure of an Obama win than he was in May.

So what?

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 3:50 PM

SIGH. So much stupid in one spot.

“he is less sure of an Obama win…”

Which means *******IT IS NOT OVER******** and all the garment rending and crying and whining and ranting and raving does not change this fact.

That all of the LSM propaganda and BS is just that, BS. It is interesting, however, to see people that should be smarter falling for it and ALLOWING themselves to be swayed, to be discouraged.

That’s all I was saying. That’s the last I’m saying to you. You can try to hump my leg as you did with this issue, but you will be ignored.

kim roy on September 29, 2012 at 4:18 PM

I suspected that it wouldn’t be too many comments deep before Jazz was called out as having a lack of conscience – I was right.

ericdijon on September 29, 2012 at 4:38 PM

In 2010 it was the Tea Party that gined up support for the Republicans.

Now in 2012 the Tea Party has been silienced and put down.

Americans are not stupid. They see this. They say to themselves hey I thought maybe the Republicans were OK because I liked what the Tea Party was saying. But I guess not no one is saying that anymore. 6% go back to the Democratic Party.

Why on earth is that so hard for Romney People to understand?

There are ramifications to shutting down the Tea Party.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 3:55 PM

THIS.

PappyD61 on September 29, 2012 at 4:46 PM

In 2010 it was the Tea Party that gined up support for the Republicans.

Now in 2012 the Tea Party has been silienced and put down.

Americans are not stupid. They see this. They say to themselves hey I thought maybe the Republicans were OK because I liked what the Tea Party was saying. But I guess not no one is saying that anymore. 6% go back to the Democratic Party.

Why on earth is that so hard for Romney People to understand?

There are ramifications to shutting down the Tea Party.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 3:55 PM

Obama accuses Romney of murdering a man’s wife without evidence; you accuse him of murdering the Tea Party without evidence.

In both cases, the accusation was made, not based on facts, but on personal hatred and self-aggradizement.

northdallasthirty on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

northdallasthirty on September 29, 2012 at 3:49 PM

This bears repeating in case you missed it….

The S&P 500 is up 79% since the day Obama took office.

It’s an economic miracle after the Bush collapse. 8 years of Republican policies under W drove the economy into a ditch. Once you acknowledge Bush was a disaster, then the healing can begin. Stop blaming the media for all of the problems in the world.

ZippyZ on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

There are ramifications to shutting down the Tea Party.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 3:55 PM

This really to me proves the point.

The Tea Party to you was all about hijacking power.

It was never about principles. It was never about cutting government spending. It was never about getting government out of the way and allowing businesses to succeed and kick-start our economy.

It was your way back to power.

Yours, Newt’s, Santorum’s, and the like.

You did not care one whit about the Tea Party, its values, or for what it stood.

You just wanted to be in charge, and now that you’re not, you’re taking your ball and going home — and calling everyone else names in the process.

Those are the “ramifications”. Since you don’t get to tell us what to do, you’re going to scream at us and sabotage us until you get your way — or your revenge.

No sale.

northdallasthirty on September 29, 2012 at 4:50 PM

The S&P 500 is up 79% since the day Obama took office.

It’s an economic miracle after the Bush collapse. 8 years of Republican policies under W drove the economy into a ditch. Once you acknowledge Bush was a disaster, then the healing can begin. Stop blaming the media for all of the problems in the world.

ZippyZ on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

I love it when the Obama phone recipients show that the only economic education they’ve ever had are the daily texts from Organizing for America.

You know how to magically make the stock market go up and outperform, ZippyZ?

Let Obama’s fellow racists show you.

And the problem with that? People are being forced to make riskier investments and put more of their retirement savings at higher risk.

Thus, it’s not an “economic miracle”. It’s a shell game of deliberately inflating an equity bubble by devaluing the currency and forcing people into riskier investments.

You supposedly shrieked and screamed that that was a bad thing before, ZippyZ. Now here you are out doing it AGAIN?

Your lies simply implode so easily. Obama’s welfare-addict trolls are getting of lower quality every day.

northdallasthirty on September 29, 2012 at 5:01 PM

If you listen to CSPAN’s video of the same event which has the crowd audio at regular volume, it is absolutely clear that they are chanting “Romney” until he encourages them to chant Romney-Ryan. Ace has the clip at his site if you doubt.

Book on September 29, 2012 at 5:04 PM

After listening to this tape, I am concerned with Jazz’s hearing. It is pretty obvioius that the vast majority of the crowd was yelling Romney.

aigle on September 29, 2012 at 5:11 PM

But more to the point, it’s a bit of a leap to try to assume some sort of conspiracy on the part of MSNBC here, no matter what your normal inclinations are.

Jazz,

I think you are missing an important point.

The MSNBC reports did not reflect what the people that were actually there witnessed. That’s not the handiwork of idle conservatives, it is bad reporting!

What this really points out is how much Americans are coming to distrust any sort of media outlet. You can’t tell me the motives behind the way that clip was edited. Taken one way Mitt Romney is a complete douchebag. Taken another way he is a humble candidate. That this is not clear shows me how much some people question what they are being told by the media.

This is not entirely a bad development.

Happy Nomad on September 29, 2012 at 5:14 PM

I don’t think anyone’s calling a landslide.

urbane effetist on September 29, 2012 at 2:27 PM

Believe all the “polling” at your own peril. And here’s why.

9.9 out of every 10 of the “polls” showing Romney losing are being conducted by people who have at least one of the following two characteristics:

1. They want O’bamna to Win. In this first group, you have ABC, C-BS, CNN, al-Associated Press, and al-Rooters. None of them bothered to vet Dear Leader in 2008, which means that they all wanted him to win then. And since he’s been in office, absolutely none of them have lifted a finger to investigate any of his or his Party’s scandalous behavior as sitting Government Officials. Because they simply do not care.

2. They have already endorsed O’bamna for President and will do so again this year. This group includes the NY Times and the Washington Compost.

Can you tell us, with a straight face, why you have absolutely no problem believing “polling” coming from groups of Democrats that are in the tank for one of the candidates, and have in fact been in the tank for him for 5 years now?

Del Dolemonte on September 29, 2012 at 5:20 PM

In both cases, the accusation was made, not based on facts, but on personal hatred and self-aggradizement.

northdallasthirty on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

You can’t handle the proof.

All the complaining here more than proves my point.

Where is the Tea Party? Show me one tape of Mitt thanking them for their support.

Show me one mention of them at the RNC Convention. Even one.

The one poster said it best here.

The Tea Party to you was all about hijacking power.

That is what Mitt/Priebus believes about the Tea Party and he is not about to let them “hijack” power from him.

He has no clue that they were more than willing to share power from the weaker position.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:21 PM

Adding to today’s theme over at YAHOO NEWS.

http://omg.yahoo.com/photos/what-were-they-thinking-09-28-slideshow/

“Ann Romney in odd fashion faux paus” blares the headline. Oh, they swoon over Michelle and her fasion sense but “ODD” is a purposeful word.

And yet, this is where low information voters get their news.

Conservatives must take over the media, academia, entertainment industry and the government at every level. To stop this slide.

PappyD61 on September 29, 2012 at 5:31 PM

There isn’t a single self-respecting pollster that would use a D+11 sample. Not one. Do you understand that fact? Do you?

as the voters turn more blue, the identification with dems grows.

And here’s the really nasty bit: if they’re willing to do that, willing to use a completely unrealistic sample to further their agenda, then it’s but a short step to simply lying, which is what I expect in the next several weeks.

most pollsters are independant and some can be biased like the fox poll or ppp. what is amazing is that fox poll shows the same results, whats up?

The polls will become increasingly unreliable for the rest of this campaign. In the meantime, you’ll see the reality: the Obama campaign making stops in Wisconsin of all places, moving events to smaller venues, and the media consistently caught lying about Mitt Romney. And Obama will continue to pander for votes by handing out taxpayer money left and right.

look, this wont convince most ppl. or romney makes some change or this trend will continue.

The only problem for the Left is that the voters aren’t fooled anymore. Just watch Twitter blow up every time the administration does something completely idiotic, whether it’s something laughable like “yard sales for Obama” or something treasonous like lying about the terrorist attacks on our embassies. Or read the comments in left-leaning publications like the Times or the Trib; you see more and more people just plain sick of this crap.

38 days. It’s going to be a beautiful thing.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 4:15 PM

no, i dont see this. actually, what i see is many “eutral” comment boards dominated by dem commenters.
politico, buzzfeed and mediaite are mostly dem at commenter level.
facebook comments are also dominated by dems.

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM

as the voters turn more blue, the identification with dems grows.
nathor on September 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM

Wow, the first sentence in your plainly ‘well thought out’ post mad e me laugh out loud throw up.

Ed needs to come up with a ‘LeftSpaz Di#*head of the Day’ post to go along with the QOTD…

You win!!

BigWyo on September 29, 2012 at 5:46 PM

no, i dont see this. actually, what i see is many “eutral” comment boards dominated by dem commenters.
politico, buzzfeed and mediaite are mostly dem at commenter level.
facebook comments are also dominated by dems.

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM

You are right.

Mittbots delude themselves thinking the bias is real. The neglect that eliminating the Tea Party and it’s ability to attract voters in recond numbers could well be causing this.

I agree the bias is unbelievable this cycle but that does not explain the mood in the country. It is most definately not pro Romney. It is anti Obama. But few are seeing Romney as any kind of savior.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:47 PM

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM
Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:47 PM

Wow, dueling potato heads.

I’m votin’ fer Obama..y’all done opened my eyes!!

BigWyo on September 29, 2012 at 5:50 PM

The TEA Party has NOT been shut down

The Tea Party is regularly ridiculed and declared “dead” by the mainstream press and their elitist allies in Washington and Hollywood. Not surprisingly, when Tea Partiers show up and rally by the thousands, they get all but ignored, while 30 Occupy Wall Street crazies in masks will always get wall-to-wall coverage and admiration. TV shows and movies take cheap shots at Tea Party conservatives, often linking them to murder-of-the-week cases on insipid crime procedurals or dismissing them as “birthers.” But a new Associated Press poll shows tea party supporters may have the last laugh in November.
The AP/GFK poll shows that 31% of likely voters consider themselves Tea Party supporters. With 131 million votes cast in the 2008 elections, that translates into an incredible voting bloc of 41 million Tea Party supporters waiting to cast ballots. These voters have already made their voices heard in Wisconsin earlier this year, as well as in Republican primaries in Texas and Nebraska.
That 31% of likely voters figure is greater than the 19% who described themselves as either strongly or somewhat liberal. Surprisingly, liberals have escaped media characterization as being a small, fringe-like group with little power or influence. At 19% of likely voters, self-described liberals would have a turnout of 25 million voters, some 16 million fewer voters than the Tea Party.

Anybody who says the TEA Party is dead is either an uninformed jackass or a lying POS…but I suspect a couple here are a bit if both.

Back to the thread topic, Jazz has made himself look foolish with this poorly researched article. SMDH….

JannyMae on September 29, 2012 at 5:50 PM

as the voters turn more blue, the identification with dems grows.
nathor on September 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM

Wow, the first sentence in your plainly ‘well thought out’ post mad e me laugh out loud throw up.

Ed needs to come up with a ‘LeftSpaz Di#*head of the Day’ post to go along with the QOTD…

You win!!

BigWyo on September 29, 2012 at 5:46 PM

Yes in a way.

Democrats are losing to independents in registration. But the independents are more blue. The self identification numbers more Democratic. It hurts not helps Romney.

So stated poorly but mostly true.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:51 PM

Wow, dueling potato heads.

I’m votin’ fer Obama..y’all done opened my eyes!!

BigWyo on September 29, 2012 at 5:50 PM

You took the words right out my mouth! lol!

JannyMae on September 29, 2012 at 5:52 PM

Anybody who says the TEA Party is dead is either an uninformed jackass or a lying POS…but I suspect a couple here are a bit if both.

Back to the thread topic, Jazz has made himself look foolish with this poorly researched article. SMDH….

JannyMae on September 29, 2012 at 5:50 PM

Very true the Tea Party however has been driven underground by Priebus/Romney.

The problem is with then not seen as a force by the independents the independents have drifted back to the Democrats.

Romney could fix this in the debate of course. But he is afraid they will “hijack” his power. So he has completely muzzeled the Tea Party.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:54 PM

Obviously, if Scarborough doesn’t correct his report using NYT and other news sources account of the event, then he is complicit in media malpractice.

hepcat on September 29, 2012 at 5:56 PM

northdallasthirty on September 29, 2012 at 5:01 PM

Excellent post!!!

jimver on September 29, 2012 at 5:59 PM

BigWyo on September 29, 2012 at 5:50 PM

You took the words right out my mouth! lol!

JannyMae on September 29, 2012 at 5:52 PM

Sometimes I wonder if you actually want Mitt to win.

I try to tell you how he can fix this for a few days you just ignore reality.

The conservative have actually been on Mitts case since he won the nomination. He can listen and smarten up or he can lose. His choice. So far he has chosen to lose.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:59 PM

Stop it Jazz. Stop trying to minimize this.

It’s actually a major issue–and I’m not into WHINING ABOUT MEDIA BIAS:

But, My God. When NBC edits a tape of George Zimmerman deliberately to make him look racist, and when MSNBC deliberately misrepresents an audio of a rally to make Romney look self-absorbed, it is time to CALL THEM OUT.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/another-msnbc-scandal-blaze-readers-at-campaign-event-claim-network-misled-in-video-of-rally-chant/

mountainaires on September 29, 2012 at 6:05 PM

You are right.

Mittbots delude themselves thinking the bias is real. The neglect that eliminating the Tea Party and it’s ability to attract voters in recond numbers could well be causing this.

I agree the bias is unbelievable this cycle but that does not explain the mood in the country. It is most definately not pro Romney. It is anti Obama. But few are seeing Romney as any kind of savior.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:47 PM

romney is becoming the butt of jokes and even anti-romney memes have appeared:
http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/the-internets-strange-obbession-with-greasy-face

and yes, you are right, some commenters rail against obama but few defend romney and when they do, is mostly using tu quoques.

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 6:05 PM

romney is becoming the butt of jokes and even anti-romney memes

and yes, you are right, some commenters rail against obama but few defend romney and when they do, is mostly using tu quoques.

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 6:05 PM

Actually thank you for that link. The Mittbots will hate it but it made me wonder if the MSNBC hit on Romney was part of something larger. A larger attack on him.

Tip: the square link box click on it and learn how to use it. Preview will help you.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM

“At one point, the crowd started to enthusiastically chant, ‘Romney, Romney, Romney.’ We were NOT saying, ‘Ryan’ as MSNBC’s video and closed captioning suggests,” Craycraft told TheBlaze in an email.

“Being the humble man that he is, Romney stopped the crowd, then suggested that we add Ryan’s name. The crowd then began chanting, ‘Romney/Ryan,’” Craycraft adds.

One more attendee told TheBlaze the exact same thing.

“There was a lot of energy at the Rally, especially when Paul Ryan was introducing Mitt Romney. The crowd spontaneously began chanting… ‘Romney,‘ ’Romney,‘ ’Romney.’ However, when Governor Romney took the stand he immediately said, ‘Romney/Ryan,‘ ’Romney/Ryan,‘ ’Romney/Ryan!’” Ohioan Sarah Holden also told TheBlaze in an email.

“The crowd quickly joined in on the ‘Romney/Ryan’ chant,” Holden adds.

From the Blaze

Mormontheman on September 29, 2012 at 6:18 PM

Democrats would have preferred automatic tax increases as a penalty constitutional amendment.

urban elitist on September 29, 2012 at 1:50 PM

FIFY, using my “truthiness disgronifier filter”.

Difficultas_Est_Imperium on September 29, 2012 at 6:19 PM

New poll is out from Gallup/USA Today with the following “enthusiasm” numbers:

The poll of 1,446 adults, taken Monday through Thursday, has a margin of error of +/- 3 percentage points.

Republicans have opened a big enthusiasm gap: 64% say they are more enthusiastic than usual about voting, compared to 48% of Democrats. In general, though, the results show an electorate that is less excited and less engaged than in recent presidential elections.

Democrats are less enthusiastic about voting than in 2008, although Republicans are a bit more enthusiastic. Fewer Democrats and Republicans say they have given a lot of thought to the election than they did in the falls of 2008 and 2004.

Tell me again about all these polls using 2008 turnout models?

TarheelBen on September 29, 2012 at 6:22 PM

From the Blaze

Mormontheman on September 29, 2012 at 6:18 PM

I played with him for a while this morning then shut him down with proof. The actual link to CSpan. This was in the middle. The crowd quited down to listen to Mitt talk. Normal behaviour in the middle of something.

The NY Times no friend of Romney said Romney was pleased with the response. That completely derails the MSNBC narative.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 6:28 PM

Actually thank you for that link. The Mittbots will hate it but it made me wonder if the MSNBC hit on Romney was part of something larger. A larger attack on him.

the media favors obama, I agree with that, and that probably helps him. but another thing is to actively conspire in favor of obama.

Tip: the square link box click on it and learn how to use it. Preview will help you.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM

like this?

I am an IT consultant, I know this stuff. :P

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 6:33 PM

Tell me again about all these polls using 2008 turnout models?

TarheelBen on September 29, 2012 at 6:22 PM

Crowder gave a lot of reasons for the young kids to be excited about Obama’s last four years
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/09/28/selfish-millennial-guide-to-election/

Expensive required health insurance, expensive banking, expensive college and no action on social security.

Mormontheman on September 29, 2012 at 6:41 PM

The S&P 500 is up 79% since the day Obama took office.

ZippyZ on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

This may be the funniest thing I see. Leftists screaming about how the fat cat capitalists must pay their fair share, but then pointing to the stock market as a reason to celebrate.

They of course can’t point to one thing Obama did to facilitate this growth. Nor do they mention the fact that it was the entirely Democrat controlled 110th Congress that oversaw the loss of nearly EIGHT THOUSAND POINTS, and from which despite the “79% gain” it has yet to fully recover.

Yeah, so, sure, tell us how well we’ve done under Democrat rule. I guess anything is better than our foreign policy, eh?

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 6:47 PM

Tell me again about all these polls using 2008 turnout models?

TarheelBen on September 29, 2012 at 6:22 PM

Yup. And voter registration is DOWN 490,000 in Ohio. Of that, over 2/3 (350,000) is in three counties: Cuyahoga, Hamilton and Franklin, which are the counties that contain Cleveland, Cincinnati and Columbus. Why is this important? Well, because together those three counties provided a surplus of 320,000 votes for President Obama in 2008.

He won by only 200,000 statewide.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 6:56 PM

To be fair to Jaz I had no idea what the actual video would prove. It could have proven him right. I just knew that it would more than likely settle the debate. I did try to get him to go there first.

I always attempt to get to as close as possible to original information. I hate stories that link to stories that link to stories that link back sometimes. If you are a journalist you should follow the links then post your story from the original link. If some insight is in the other stories link to them as well. But follow to original information whenever possible.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 7:03 PM

There isn’t a single self-respecting pollster that would use a D+11 sample. Not one. Do you understand that fact? Do you?

as the voters turn more blue, the identification with dems grows.

See? Now you’re back to be silly and amusing! To say that the turnout will be more Democrat-leaning than 2008, it’s simply priceless!

no, i dont see this. actually, what i see is many “eutral” comment boards dominated by dem commenters.
politico, buzzfeed and mediaite are mostly dem at commenter level.
facebook comments are also dominated by dems.

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM

I’m glad you put “neutral” in scare quotes, since none of those sites is anything close to neutral. But if you read them, you’ll find that more and more often the Left is being hammered down by the Conservatives. It’s actually kind of fun.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 7:05 PM

Yup. And voter registration is DOWN 490,000 in Ohio. Of that, over 2/3 (350,000) is in three counties: Cuyahoga, Hamilton and Franklin, which are the counties that contain Cleveland, Cincinnati and Columbus. Why is this important? Well, because together those three counties provided a surplus of 320,000 votes for President Obama in 2008.

He won by only 200,000 statewide.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 6:56 PM

One thing for sure the Tea Party had nothing to do with this. If they did then the Democrats would really be in trouble.

I am still in the tinking process on this one. I almost wonder if it is a Democratic trick to fool Republicans. Another possibility it is the rooting out of Democratic fraud. I do not live there so far those that do just speculate which is what I am doing. More information needed from other similar data elsewhere to draw any real meaning from this.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 7:10 PM

There isn’t a single self-respecting pollster that would use a D+11 sample. Not one. Do you understand that fact? Do you?

Yes because all polls are D+11. /sarc

This is meaningless no one believes or is arguing it is correct. No one but one stupid pollster in one poll they should have thrown out.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 7:13 PM

But if you read them, you’ll find that more and more often the Left is being hammered down by the Conservatives. It’s actually kind of fun.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 7:05 PM

Perhaps a bit but you will also find conservative voices are quickly banned.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 7:16 PM

If you listen to CSPAN’s video of the same event which has the crowd audio at regular volume, it is absolutely clear that they are chanting “Romney” until he encourages them to chant Romney-Ryan. Ace has the clip at his site if you doubt.

Book on September 29, 2012 at 5:04 PM

After listening to this tape, I am concerned with Jazz’s hearing. It is pretty obvioius that the vast majority of the crowd was yelling Romney.

aigle on September 29, 2012 at 5:11 PM

I happened to be watching Fox News when they cut away from their regular schedule to cover this rally. It was very plain, even as I was just casually paying attention, that Mitt was trying to change the chant to include “Ryan” after the crowd was already chanting “Romney”.
I don’t know if anyone else has mentioned that the people there also spontaneously started chanting “Romney” at one point in Paul Ryan’s speech. It’s a little before the 8 minute mark here.
This MSDNC version is an obvious attempt to manipulate the video to help them push the narrative that Mitt doesn’t generate excitement among Republicans…when nothing could be further from the truth.
And those two “newscasters” at that network are a perfect fit for that 3 ring circus…nothing more than clowns.

lynncgb on September 29, 2012 at 7:37 PM

The S&P 500 is up 79% since the day Obama took office.

It’s an economic miracle after the Bush collapse. 8 years of Republican policies under W drove the economy into a ditch. Once you acknowledge Bush was a disaster, then the healing can begin. Stop blaming the media for all of the problems in the world.

ZippyZ

So, do you get paid by the lie, or by the hour? Or maybe you just run around lying for free.

xblade on September 29, 2012 at 7:40 PM

urbane effetist on September 29, 2012 at 2:27 PM

urbane effetist, the urban elitist from the alternate universe?

Priceless.

petefrt on September 29, 2012 at 7:46 PM

Yes because all polls are D+11. /sarc

This is meaningless no one believes or is arguing it is correct. No one but one stupid pollster in one poll they should have thrown out.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 7:13 PM

Any poll above D+4 should be viewed with a critical eye. Anything over D+6 should be laughed at. And yet we’re consistently seeing D+7 and even more. And it’s not just the unfathomable D+11 Franklin and Marshall poll.

Quinnipiac FL: D+8
Quinnipiac OH: D+9
Quinnipiac PA: D+8
WAPO OH: D+7
Reason/Rupe General: D+8
NBC/WSJ General: D+7

Seriously.

AJsDaddie on September 29, 2012 at 8:03 PM

It’s not that Scarborough reacted the way he did to the tape that bothers me, it’s his crazy thin-skinned shrieking on Friday when he faced a little bit of criticism. From his Twitter feed:

First:

The fake controversy over the Ryan chants is a joke. Romney said “What a guy!” The crowd chanted “Ryan!” and then Mitt jokes “Romney/Ryan!”

Then immediately thereafter:

I won’t even dignify the site that is fanning this false controversy but I will take note of those who link to the lie.

Oh no! Joe is taking names.

After all this drama, a BuzzFeed writer disputed Scarborough’s version, claiming that “BuzzFeed” (without reference to a specific reporter) attended the event:

But the subtitle in the clip misrepresented what actually took place. BuzzFeed was present at the event, and took note that the crowd was actually chanting Romney’s name, before he encouraged them to add his running mate to the chant.

And you just know Joe is going to turn this into another one of his “I’m the last true conservative so everyone else shut up” rants a la Andrew Sullivan circa 2005. But the issue isn’t the degree of his conservatism — it’s that he is an egomaniacal douche.

NealK on September 29, 2012 at 8:06 PM

uh, yes, I _do_ think Scarborough is trying to get Obama reelected and he’s not a conservative. Anyone who’s ever watched him for more than five minutes knows this. He’s one of those faux-conservatives the MSM loves to use to bash real conservatives. He wouldn’t be on MSNBC if he weren’t.

babygiraffe on September 29, 2012 at 9:02 PM

The article is a really poor analysis of the MSNBC episode. There is something to see here.

bluesdoc70 on September 29, 2012 at 9:14 PM

Did you say, Scarborough is a conservative? Is a reasonable voice? Just about choked. Scarborough is a complete joke and absolutely has gone off the deep end since joining MSNBC.

scorpio0679 on September 29, 2012 at 10:08 PM

The S&P 500 is up 79% since the day Obama took office.

It’s an economic miracle after the Bush collapse. 8 years of Republican policies under W drove the economy into a ditch. Once you acknowledge Bush was a disaster, then the healing can begin. Stop blaming the media for all of the problems in the world.

ZippyZ on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

Sorry just had to tell you why it’s up 79% along with corn, oil and a lot of other commodities…

It’s because Bernanke by having a zero interest rate policy has forced investors into riskier assets such as stock and commodities…

With a zero interest rate policy you get no return for a savings account or a CD at a bank, so money flows into riskier assets…

When the bubble unwinds it might be bigger than 2008…

MGardner on September 30, 2012 at 1:24 AM

This bears repeating in case you missed it….

The S&P 500 is up 79% since the day Obama took office.

It’s an economic miracle after the Bush collapse. 8 years of Republican policies under W drove the economy into a ditch. Once you acknowledge Bush was a disaster, then the healing can begin. Stop blaming the media for all of the problems in the world.

ZippyZ on September 29, 2012 at 4:47 PM

You really are utterly clueless. I can see why the S&P being up 89 percent could seem miraculous to somebody with no discernible understanding of the economy.

ghostwriter on September 30, 2012 at 3:36 AM

nathor on September 29, 2012 at 1

:26 PM

Aj.. Now, I see what your problem is: You get your news coverage from a comedian. That explains a lot.

ghostwriter on September 29, 2012 at 1:59 PM

Huge difference ignoring actual reporters at an event and pushing a false narative off a doctored video. Than accidently using the wrong background video. Fox showed the correct video when the error was reported.

There are numerous reports from this rally every one says the same thing even the NY Times (you really saying they are biased for Romney?)

I am well known for saying Romney will lose. This here is a false story that destroys Joe’s credibility for life. It is a big deal. I believe in the truth. Truth here is MSNBC doctored this and ignored the truth.

By the way John Stewart while into comedy does a perty good job of making sure his basic facts are correct. He will and does correct himself. He is a valid source as as long as you take his bias into account. Not primary becuase you have to figure out what is comedy and what is reporting.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 2:39 PM

I ridiculed nathor’s response, because it didn’t deserve to be taken seriously. And I don’t need any lectures on what constitutes a “valid source” for news.

As for Stewart, he is a hipster doofus comedian, who is more interested in getting a cheap laugh than getting his facts straight. And there is nothing wrong with that, as long as you don’t take him too seriously. Moreover, if Stewart were truly willing to acknowledge when he is wrong, then he probably would have issued a retraction or at least acknowledged that Fox had corrected itself on the video, instead of leaving intact his insinuation that Fox was trying to pull a fast one. Did Stewart ever follow-up, acknowledging that Fox corrected itself on this story?

ghostwriter on September 30, 2012 at 3:54 AM

Wow, Joe sure was an A class dbag on Twitter over this. He actually taunted on Twitter that he’d be airing the clip again on Monday just to rub it in-and ridiculed those who contested MSNBC’s take on the video, even calling those who were disputing it liars.

Very interesting to see what he’ll say now that so many have come forward to debunk his mocking take on it…Politico, Ap and WaPO, to name a few.

kit9 on September 30, 2012 at 5:06 PM

To those who continue to say (on this thread) that the TEA Party is dead—did you not see the news THIS WEEK, where the TEA Party are 41,000,000-strong??? (That’s FORTY-ONE MILLION!)

DixT on September 30, 2012 at 7:21 PM

Jazz doesn’t get this. OF COURSE it was ’15 secs of chanting at a rally’ morphed into ‘sad tale’.

THIS IS WHAT THE F**KING MSM DOES. Take innocent moments & blow it up into a ‘gaffe’ and call and spend all f**king day laughing about it.

We’re calling them out on their gaffe inventions & we got people on our side going “Meh. Non-story. Yawn!”

NO WONDER the MSM managed to float so much BS against McCain/Palin in 2008.

We are answering them and exposing their attempts at narrative setting gaffes now and we got people on our side who think this is a waste of time.

manofaiki on September 30, 2012 at 7:55 PM

“Let’s close the book on this one, folks.”

So says the squishy one.

geckomon on September 30, 2012 at 9:01 PM

Congrats to Jazz Shaw for giving Scarby the cover he needed!

After shooting his mouth off Friday, Scarby dropped it like it was radioactive because he knew he was F’d!

Then some old dude who dl’s a free audio program steps in and pronounces everyone else wrong.

Hey Jazzy – I deal with media everydamnday. It’s called a job. Not a hobby. I’ve got several K’s worth invested in equipment and a life’s work put into it.

You’re not a damn expert.

Scarby was DOA tomorrow. Now, he’s tweeting your f’ing column as his proof to being right.

So Thanks Old Man!

Stick to random blogging. If I want detective work, I’ll go to Breitbart.

budfox on September 30, 2012 at 9:30 PM

Scarbs is not pro-Obama or anti-Romney.

Joe is for NBC first and foremost.

So whowhichever way NBC blows, Joe will lean forward.

budfox on September 30, 2012 at 9:33 PM

Not sure who Jazz is but I know who Little Joey isn’t and “One of ours” he ain’t. Jazz is also a big Peggy Noonan fan I suppose. Letting him post here is a good reason to avoid the place.

bluesdoc70 on October 1, 2012 at 12:11 AM

The point of this whole thing is that Joe Scarborough wants to TRASH Romney any chance he can get. I used to like Joe Scarborough. I now despise him and his lap/table dancer eye candy, Mika. She should, by the way, be horrified that she agreed to participate in that picture kicking her leg out provocatively on that table. Liberal women SCREAM ALL DAY LONG that men treat them like sex objects and then she just fulfills their own prophecy… I guess this was her contribution to slut walk.

djl130 on October 1, 2012 at 5:56 AM

“But vilifying one of our own during the silly season near the end of the election isn’t helping anyone. Let’s close the book on this one, folks.”

Two sentences two mistakes. If, by “one of our own” you mean Joe Scarborough, well, you’ve got to be kidding. He may be one “yours”. He’s not one of “mine”. And, two, you don’t get to determine when it’s time to “close the book on this one…”, Jazz. Sounds a lot like “move on, nothing to see here.”

Anyone who thinks Joe Scarborough is one of “ours” tells me that you’re not “one of ours” either. Sorry.

ncjetsfan on October 1, 2012 at 7:17 AM

It’s a good thing Mitt didn’t appear on TV on a turkey farm in November. That would have made him unelectable.

CrustyB on October 1, 2012 at 8:09 AM

Let’s close the book on this one, folks.

If by that you mean “Now I’ve gone and totally beclowned myself bigtime for MSNBC but…but..but…SQUIRREL!!!”, then the book is indeed “closed”.

whatcat on October 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

I agree the bias is unbelievable this cycle but that does not explain the mood in the country. It is most definately not pro Romney. It is anti Obama. But few are seeing Romney as any kind of savior.

Steveangell on September 29, 2012 at 5:47 PM

Only an unintelligent, ignorant and bigoted person such as yourself thinks of presidential candidates as ‘saviors’ (most normal people don’t though), this type of ignorance brought us the SCOAMF currently in the WH…presidents are not and should not be ‘saviors’…well, except for in deranged people’s minds….

jimver on October 1, 2012 at 9:32 AM

Scarby was DOA tomorrow. Now, he’s tweeting your f’ing column as his proof to being right.

So Thanks Old Man!

Stick to random blogging. If I want detective work, I’ll go to Breitbart.

budfox on September 30, 2012 at 9:30 PM

Yeah, stick to blogging as long as you don’t pretend to be a voice for conservatives, Jazz. You’re now officially a mouthpiece for the Left. Congrats!

AJsDaddie on October 1, 2012 at 9:54 AM

Let’s close the book on this one, folks.

If by that you mean “Now I’ve gone and totally beclowned myself bigtime for MSNBC but…but..but…SQUIRREL!!!”, then the book is indeed “closed”.

whatcat on October 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

With so many opportunities for a mea culpa Jazz instead insists on a narcissistic “not my fault” worthy of Obama himself.

Real Conservatives own up to their mistakes.

Jazz, you’re no conservative. To KOS with you!

AJsDaddie on October 1, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Jazz, you hurt HA’s credibility. Congrats.

When your own sister site proved you wrong, Dumass.

budfox on October 1, 2012 at 10:18 AM

Jazz – are you going to acknowledge the Townhall piece?

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/greghengler/2012/09/28/msnbc_caught_doctoring_clip_from_romneyryan_rally

budfox on October 1, 2012 at 10:49 AM

It seems like lately — during this last year and a half or so — HotAir™ has actually really gone Soft & Squishy™.

Hanging around on HotAir™ — which used to be obligatory for me and the bookmark stationed at the very apex of my bookmarks indicated the level of importance and my desire to visit HotAir.com™ before doing anything else — has become a frustrating endeavor and nowadays is mostly motivated by morbid curiosity. In fact, HotAir.com™ has been moved down the ladder to the 3rd or 4th from bottom. The only sites below HotAir™ are the very few Left leaning sites I sometimes peruse just to stay more or less abreast of the Left’s lunacy.

I’m just waiting for the other shoe to drop on HotAir™ now.

In my morbid curiosity — I’m just waiting for HotAir™ to go all LittleGreenFootballs™ and the way of Politico™ — because that is exactly what I am seeing happening. It’s just not as sudden and pronounced. It is a slow process on HotAir.com™ — and it is very interesting to observe the procession.

You know what I mean, right? Ostensibly a Conservative website that morphs into a Left leaning website after some level and/or type of epiphany — and the subsequent self-loathing Leftist guilt forces their hand. In this case — though — the epiphany is not so much rapture as it is a slow and agonizing process unfolding before our very eyes on HotAir™.

I really miss the days Michelle Malkin owned and operated this site. No HotAir — Guaranteed Soft & Squishy Or You Money Back™ pundits back then. No collusion. No simpering apologist testaments when every other important Conservative site out there contradicts the apologist testimony of some HotAir™ pundits by using cold hard facts instead of Left leaning tendencies

Those were the days.

FlatFoot on October 1, 2012 at 3:34 PM

MSNBC is guilty as charged. Too bad readers had to rely on the comments to get to some truth.

Even the update is disappointing. Sigh…

lynncgb on October 1, 2012 at 4:09 PM

Jazz, Scarborough is a RINO and you are a RINO. Get over it.

Theophile on October 1, 2012 at 5:14 PM

The Tea Party has not been silenced. We are very busy working behind the scenes. The Dems and the press just wish we had been silenced.

californiacitizen on October 2, 2012 at 7:15 PM

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