Empire State Building shooting leaves several wounded, two dead, including suspect

posted at 10:31 am on August 24, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

A man described provisionally as a “disgruntled employee” killed one other person at the Empire State Building this morning and shot several others, before being killed himself. The news broke over an hour ago, but as is usual in cases like these, the details are shifting and contradictory:

Police say two people, including the gunman, are dead after at least four people were shot outside the Empire State Building Friday morning — and as many as 10 taken to area hospitals.

A law-enforcement official said the shooting did not appear to be terror-related, and may have been the actions of a disgruntled employee who may work inside the building.

It wasn’t immediately clear if the gunman’s wound was self-inflicted or if the suspect was shot by police.

So far, it looks like police killed the suspect, but no one’s quite sure if that’s the case or he killed himself. As happened in 1997, there are indications that some of the injured may have been hurt in a stampede created by panic from the gunshots.

NBC’s local affiliate has a live stream covering the story as it unfolds:

View more videos at: http://nbcnewyork.com.

We’ll have updates as the details firm up. Mayor Michael Bloomberg has arrived on scene.

Update: Fox reports that the FBI has been called to the scene, but that’s probably SOP to determine whether terrorism played a part in the shooting.  They’ll coordinate with the NYPD until they can confirm that this does or does not involve terrorism or interstate crime; if the latter, the FBI will drop it.


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stereotypical mass murder rampage= one male, revenge based objective, suicide by cop.( most mass murderers die at the scene either by killing themselves or by, usually, engaging the police to fire on them.)

the incidents of mass murder with the highest body counts DO NOT involve fire arms. so it has nothing to do with the constitution. in a free society where the citizens are assured certain rights like the right to bear arms and have freedom of conscience, human behavior dictates that unfortunate and tragic incidents happen even with the most judicious , rights respecting safe guards. laws and restrictions on the law abiding will never change human behavior. this is planet earth not some utopia or a perfect heaven where everything can be controlled by one’s supposed good intentions.

far more homicide deaths are caused by those-criminals- who obtained their guns illegally than by the statistical randomness of one lone sociopath with a legally obtained gun going on a mass murder rampage. it in an anomaly. the main problem has always been and will always be criminals obtaining weapons illegally to engage in violent crime. more people died in some inner city chaotic hell hole today at the hands of criminals with illegally obtained guns than died in this one incident.

mittens on August 25, 2012 at 3:32 AM

The officers approached, and the gunman pointed the pistol at them. The officers then fired a total of 16 rounds, striking the subject 7 times from a distance of 8 feet. Afterward the police secured his weapon, ejecting 1 round and leaving 1 round in the magazine.

In other words there was no gun battle or crossfire. Except for the murder victim the casualties were all due to police fire.

claudius on August 25, 2012 at 1:46 AM

Sigh, Annie Oakley the NYPD ain’t. Hmm, what are the odds again for a person being shot by whom now? At least in NYC. :)

Bloomers to blame the evil fashion industry in five, four…

oryguncon on August 25, 2012 at 2:52 AM

Well, now I’m curious. If a man, who had just committed murder, had pointed a .45 cal semi-automatic pistol at claduis and oryguncon (who are armed) from eight feet away, what would have been their response?

Yoop on August 25, 2012 at 4:11 AM

What appears on other graphic videos:

The “perp” was trying to leave the area on foot.

Perp got rushed by 2 of NYCs finest.

Perp pulls out revolver (but apparently never fired it). A Huge Crowd of people was behind perp.

NYC finest pulls revolvers and blasted away emptying guns.

ALL of the wounded appear to be on behind perp, cops did it.

Great shootin’ NYC finest !!
—————————————
Meanwhile immediate kneejerk reactions by libs:

EX GOV ED RENDELL (D-PA), on Riveras radio show, upon hearing of the shooting went bonkers nutzoid…..Rendell blamed assault weapons, said police should only have these guns, he squealed his liberal anti gun bilge nonstop…a complete buffoon..Rendell was a anti-gun maniac trying to use this “crisis” to kneejerk promote his anti gun agenda.

Well ED Rendell, you clown, now we find the cops shot everyone!!.. except the perp shot only the boss he was pissed at, and the weapon he had was a 7-shot clip model 1911 45 pistol.

BigSven on August 25, 2012 at 9:05 AM

Well, now I’m curious. If a man, who had just committed murder, had pointed a .45 cal semi-automatic pistol at claduis and oryguncon (who are armed) from eight feet away, what would have been their response?

Yoop on August 25, 2012 at 4:11 AM

At 8 feet away, none of the police shots should miss. These are supposedly trained professionals who have to pass marksmanship tests. The cops fired 16 times, and missed with 9 shots, wounding several people unnecessarily.

AngusMc on August 25, 2012 at 9:51 AM

Well, now I’m curious. If a man, who had just committed murder, had pointed a .45 cal semi-automatic pistol at claduis and oryguncon (who are armed) from eight feet away, what would have been their response?

Yoop on August 25, 2012 at 4:11 AM

Sorry, but at EIGHT (8) FEET!! there is simply NO excuse for a)firing 16 shots and b)MISSING with nine of those shots.
The cops in question should either be re-’trained’ in firearms usage and marksmanship or be assigned to some duty which does not require them to handle mechanical devices which they are obviously not able to operate.

Solaratov on August 25, 2012 at 10:38 AM

Well, now I’m curious. If a man, who had just committed murder, had pointed a .45 cal semi-automatic pistol at claduis and oryguncon (who are armed) from eight feet away, what would have been their response?

Yoop on August 25, 2012 at 4:11 AM

Three shots center mass. I know I can’t miss with three shots at 8 feet, because I can’t miss center mass at 21 feet emptying a 15 round 357 SIG mag, firing as quickly as I can. I practice firing repeated 3 round burst at least every 2 weeks, except during hunting season. I am not a very good pistol shot, but I am confident in my ability to do that much. As for stress and adrenaline, I go cold, experience tunnel vision and things go slow motion. Afterwards I shake uncontrollably like a little girl for up to an hour. I can’t overcome adrenaline effects, so I train with 3 quick rounds, pause, look, 3 more if necessary. I do this over and over. I suppose there’s always the danger that I’ll empty my weapon 3 rounds at a time!

I was a soldier for 12 years, and prefer a heavy bolt action rifle to any other weapon. For me handguns are just a very seldom necessary pain in the butt. Doping the wind and dialing in ranges are where it’s at.

claudius on August 25, 2012 at 12:47 PM

It’s almost comical that NY’s finest have become the gang that can’t shoot straight! This is the same bunch that wants to expand their reach to undercover work in other states and monitor gun shows to interdict weapons heading to N.Y. City! No wonder they want to disarm everyone because they may end up in a gun battle and they can’t shoot ! They need some lessons from the good ole boys at the gun shows! Ha!

Marco on August 25, 2012 at 6:43 PM

A big factor is police confidence in the weapons that they are carrying. The NYPD issues Glock 19s with a New York trigger, with a pull weight of something like 8-12 pounds vs the normal Glock trigger with a pull weight of 5.5 pounds. The heavy triggers are an extra measure against accidental discharge, but are not conducive to accurate fire. The ammo, Speer Gold Dot is very effective, but I suspect that there is a lack of confidence in the in the issued firearms, ammo and training, that is at the bottom of the spray and pray scenario that we are seeing so much of. The ammo is excellent. The Glock 19 is a great weapon —with a standard trigger. Training is the key. Confidence comes from competence.

The officers need to come out of training with supreme confidence in their abilities and their weapons, and they need to be stress trained every 6 months to operate in that crowded environment. Even so, certain officers will be considerably better under stress than others. Identify and recruit them.

16 rounds discharged in a crowded environment with 9 misses and 9 civilian casualties is totally unacceptable. At 8 feet! First thing, fire this Kelly. NYC doesn’t need a police commissioner covering for and promoting incompetence.

claudius on August 25, 2012 at 7:33 PM

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